Clan Protectorate

[WONC]

Furthermore, the Clan Protectorate may have gotten samples from Nova Cat enclaves in the Republic right on the border.  And if Kisho ever makes his way to the Protectorate, I would not be surprised if Khan Jacali had loaded up his jumpship with the entire Genetic Repository storage of the Clan.  To have done anything less would have been to perpetuate the genocide of her people.

The Cats were under the idea that, when they began their revolt, they would ultimately have the support to finish it. Kisho's little band of wandering whatevers were just those few warriors and civilians who managed to look at each other, scream "yikes," and get the hell out of Dodge. The Genetic Repository is a big complex, and until told otherwise, I personally consider it a complete loss.

[False Son]

Yeah, it might be getting hopes up too high to expect Kisho to make it to the Clan Protectorate with the repository.  More civilians, sure.  Maybe even some of them scientists and trueborn washouts.

[Captain of C-21]

The Cats were under the idea that, when they began their revolt, they would ultimately have the support to finish it. Kisho's little band of wandering whatevers were just those few warriors and civilians who managed to look at each other, scream "yikes," and get the hell out of Dodge. The Genetic Repository is a big complex, and until told otherwise, I personally consider it a complete loss.

Given the importance of Kisho in Nova Cat society (as essentially the only Mystic left of the next generation other than Oathmaster Kanaye), his departure could not just be some random fleeing.  Even with Jacali Nostra's disdain of visions (and Mystics, surely), she convened a kurultai to decide what Clan Nova Cat would do once the rebellion was seen as failing.  They had enough time to take out the giftakes, surely.

Perhaps this is just exposing my ignorance of how a genetic repository works, but how hard would it be for scientists to load up all the giftakes into little vials and ship them out?  The Nova Cats had little time, but surely enough to organize a small exodus in case their last defense of Irece failed.

[Kitsune413]

Furthermore, the Clan Protectorate may have gotten samples from Nova Cat enclaves in the Republic right on the border.  And if Kisho ever makes his way to the Protectorate, I would not be surprised if Khan Jacali had loaded up his jumpship with the entire Genetic Repository storage of the Clan.  To have done anything less would have been to perpetuate the genocide of her people.

She didnt have any illusions of victory. She told her warriors she had led them wrong. No way that they didnt send kisho equipped with the best chance of success.

Rikkard was expecting another cluster of spirit cats that didnt come. So whether they got things from the republic enclaves is up in the air.

[Captain of C-21]

She didnt have any illusions of victory. She told her warriors she had led them wrong. No way that they didnt send kisho equipped with the best chance of success.

Exactly.  :)

Rikkard was expecting another cluster of spirit cats that didnt come. So whether they got things from the republic enclaves is up in the air.

That was during the Battle of Marik, when he expected reinforcements directly from Kev Rosse's direction.  Following the Conquest of Marik, CNC Enclaves might be a bit more receptive to relocating to a Spirit Cat world when before it was up in the air whether or not the battle would be won.

[Pa Weasley]

She didnt have any illusions of victory. She told her warriors she had led them wrong. No way that they didnt send kisho equipped with the best chance of success.

I'm going to be honest, I don't recall much of that being presented in being given in the summary of events in ER: 3145. Do we have any indication that Kisho was sent forth by Jacali? (Serious question.)

[WONC]

I'm going to be honest, I don't recall much of that being presented in being given in the summary of events in ER: 3145. Do we have any indication that Kisho was sent forth by Jacali? (Serious question.)

If I recall it right, Kisho's flight from the Cats read more like a last minute idea, but until the Annihilation gets more than a cursory summation, it's hard to speculate. Besides, if Khan Nostra had attempted to organize an exodus, I honestly feel like it would've been aimed more at getting civilians out of the Combine than on saving the Repository. The Cats have a long history of dying nobly for their civvies, after all.  [blank]

[Dragon Cat]

A long history being one occasion?

No if it was a choice between the repository's knowledge and the scientists to run it or a thousand or even a million civilians any Clanner would take the first option

It's simple math 10 years after the repository was online you would have as many civilians (if not more) from washouts of the warrior program plus retreating with that many civilians would put a heavy burden on your people straight away which no small group could survive

A small group has better chances in the short term a larger group is required for growth

If you think of Kishos group as the opposite to any colony effort you've ever heard of.  They want to start small to stay hidden they want enough resources to build a new repository and sustain there people that's it they don't need sprawling facilities and massive growth straight away the iron wombs will sustain them.

 If they survived and had iron womb tech with them Kishos people could become the closest thing to a pure Clan sustained as the original ones were with the iron wombs

[Captain of C-21]

If I recall it right, Kisho's flight from the Cats read more like a last minute idea, but until the Annihilation gets more than a cursory summation, it's hard to speculate. Besides, if Khan Nostra had attempted to organize an exodus, I honestly feel like it would've been aimed more at getting civilians out of the Combine than on saving the Repository. The Cats have a long history of dying nobly for their civvies, after all.  [blank]

How much room would it take to transport a genetic heritage though?  In the intro story for "Wars of Reaving", Nicholas and Andery's heritages fit into a hand-sized box.  Of course, moving an entire Repository's worth of blood heritages will mean lots of boxes, but maybe enough to fill in a single room on a dropship?  There is still plenty of room for civilians beyond that.

I'm going to be honest, I don't recall much of that being presented in being given in the summary of events in ER: 3145. Do we have any indication that Kisho was sent forth by Jacali? (Serious question.)

No explicit indication, but given that Clan warriors are not prone to just up and running, and that Kisho was an important enough Nova Cat warrior to warrant inclusion in meetings between Khan and Warlord, I feel like Kisho's departure would be more than "some warriors and civvies going 'splitsville'.  Don't forget that Era Report is written from the Remnant perspective; they know just about everything that happened, but only on the surface level.  Who knows if Jacali didn't have a secretive meeting with Kisho and Kanaye, admitted the Kesari faction was disastrously wrong, and entrusted Kisho with the future of the Nova Cats?

[WONC]

A long history being one occasion?

In the Abjuration, Cat units cut off from each other, and with no idea they had been Abjured, chose to sacrifice themselves to buy their civilian populations time to either be assimilated by a stronger ally (Cobras, Ravens, or Sharks) or to outright flee. There's a reason that less than a Galaxy of troops made it to the Inner Sphere, beyond simply saying that the other Clans were that outright ruthless. I count each of those fights in the Homeworlds as separate incidents, personally. They didn't turn and fight for their giftakes and control of the repository, either. I think that sets a standard, to be honest. Of course, Kisho may have had the wherewithal to make such a play, but in the face of extinction I'd more expect him to save everyone and anyone he could, Founders' legacies be damned.

[Captain of C-21]

How did Clan NovaCat rebuild their repository then on Irece?  Were the blood heritages present there from 3060-3143 made up of warriors from the CLan invasion onward?  Where did the heritages come from?

[Tai Dai Cultist]

How did Clan NovaCat rebuild their repository then on Irece?  Were the blood heritages present there from 3060-3143 made up of warriors from the CLan invasion onward?  Where did the heritages come from?

All the invading clans likely established copies of their breeding programs inside their respective OZs.. prior to the Great Refusal there was much operational security on the so-called 'Exodus Road'.. keeping 'production' of new generations of Trueborn warriors local to their conquests was not only safer, but likely cheaper than shipping all those sibbies in from the Homeworlds.

That there were entire generations of Clanners who were raised in the Inner Sphere and never set foot in the Homeworlds was one of the cultural factors that ultimately led to the Wars of Reaving.

[Kitsune413]

I think alot of the genetic repository buildings are more  chapel/cathedral. Warriors keep their genetic legacies on a tiny bracelet. I dont think moving copies is a monumental task.

[WONC]

I think alot of the genetic repository buildings are more  chapel/cathedral. Warriors keep their genetic legacies on a tiny bracelet. I dont think moving copies is a monumental task.

Ah, now that isn't something I'd initially considered, and a very interesting point. A warrior's codex contains a copy of their DNA and genetic information, and can act as a giftake in the case of that warrior's death and inclusion in the breeding programs. I'd think it fair to say that any giftakes and data stored in the chapels would be lost, but now that I consider it, those codices would be a living record that a skilled Clan geneticist could probably work backwards from. If not that, then they'd probably be a good basis for new lines based directly on those surviving Trueborns.

Good catch, Kitsune! My mind isn't with me today, it seems.  :D

[snewsom2997]

I think alot of the genetic repository buildings are more  chapel/cathedral. Warriors keep their genetic legacies on a tiny bracelet. I dont think moving copies is a monumental task.

Should all fit in a Cargo Dropship, assuming they had time to pack it up. The Clans were known for keeping Backup repositories, at least in the HW. I would be think they did the same thing in the IS. Distributing the locations, would be a sound idea anyway, considering not everyone was friends.

[Kitsune413]

Good catch, Kitsune! My mind isn't with me today, it seems.  :D

Thank you wonc!  :)

[Kamose]

Given the importance of Kisho in Nova Cat society (as essentially the only Mystic left of the next generation other than Oathmaster Kanaye), his departure could not just be some random fleeing.  Even with Jacali Nostra's disdain of visions (and Mystics, surely), she convened a kurultai to decide what Clan Nova Cat would do once the rebellion was seen as failing.  They had enough time to take out the giftakes, surely.

Perhaps this is just exposing my ignorance of how a genetic repository works, but how hard would it be for scientists to load up all the giftakes into little vials and ship them out?  The Nova Cats had little time, but surely enough to organize a small exodus in case their last defense of Irece failed.

Why not?  The Khan surely did not see failure as an option, did she?  That would be anti-Clan thinking.  Especially with her disdain of visions.  As far as how much room it would take - a freezer about the size of a small car would do it (I'm a geneticist, so I know what I'm talking about).  I don't remember if Kisho was the idiot who led some refugees to the Bears (never finished ER:3145) or if that was someone else; either way, that fact that he is a Kurita just doesn't make me think he's going to win over the Clan Nekakami.
Kamose

[Rncavenger]

you forget about the republican genetic repository.  If NC genetic heritage has been destroyed on Irise, Spirit Cats can take RoTS  cat legacy. Whith aid of Sea Fox in constraction of genetic repository.

[Pa Weasley]

By the time the Cats proper when belly up I don't think the Spirit Cats would be in a position to raid Republic worlds to access any repositories. Assuming it's not behind the wall or (still) exists. Who knows, that might have been what Kisho and the Gang (8:00pm EST or check local listings) were up to when they went off the radar.

[Kitsune413]

Why not?  The Khan surely did not see failure as an option, did she?  That would be anti-Clan thinking.  Especially with her disdain of visions.  As far as how much room it would take - a freezer about the size of a small car would do it (I'm a geneticist, so I know what I'm talking about).  I don't remember of Kisho was the idiot who led some refugees to the Bears (never finished ER:3145) or if that was someone else; either way, that fact that he is a Kurita just doesn't make me think he's going to win over the Clan Nekakami.
Kamose

He wasn't. He left way before they decided to retreat into Ghost Bear territory.

The Nova Cats liked Minoru Kurita. Or Minoru Nova Cat I suppose.

Minoru's genes won't poison the Nova Cats blood lines. If a few drops of the ocean become dirty, the ocean does not become dirty. He is only half kurita, and its a good kuritan half.

[roosterboy]

He wasn't. He left way before they decided to retreat into Ghost Bear territory.

Kisho left just before the final battle on Irece.

We weren't given a specific date in ER3145 for the Cats that were killed by the Bears in the Rubigen system but it's a good bet that happened well in advance of the final battle on Irece given what we are told about the distribution of their remaining forces in December '42.

[Kitsune413]

Kisho left just before the final battle on Irece.

Haha. I guess 'Way Before' being relative. You are correct. As usual.  ;D

[Kamose]

Kisho left just before the final battle on Irece.

We weren't given a specific date in ER3145 for the Cats that were killed by the Bears in the Rubigen system but it's a good bet that happened well in advance of the final battle on Irece given what we are told about the distribution of their remaining forces in December '42.

Thanks for the correction.  It will be interesting to see where he turns up.  As far as Kisho being part Kurita, I think that will be an interesting part of the storyline if/when he DOES make a return appearance.
Thanks,
Kamose

[Rncavenger]

 Another funny fact from DA sourse . Spirit Cats have their own Remembrance

In the darkness, a thousand un-trod paths
 Beckon our blindness, sirens for stopped eyes.
With courage unshaken, grasp Ways of Seeing,
Sniffing paths for truth, claws unsheathed; questing the light.
 Liz Nostra through a dozen battles, a true Nova Cat warrior,
Victory – steps closer down the path . . . refuge!
 Her victory on the shoulders of warriors great and small,
He from Blood House Drummond,
Who reminded the Cats of their Dragon heritage.
Enemies abound, Allies stretch their hands across the darkness.
—The Remembrance (Spirit Cats), Passage 2, Verse 3, Lines 1–10


 http://bg.battletech.com/download/MWDA_Sneak_Peeks.pdf   ( Arnis Drummond )

[Captain of C-21]

I wouldn't say that they have their own Remembrance, just that they added some passages that Clan Nova Cat may not have sanctioned. :)

I have been wondering about Arnis Drummond lately.  If he indeed lives in the Clan Protectorate, I wonder how he may have changed since the Dragon that he so admired has attempted to annihilate his Clan.  It was very enjoyable to see named Spirit Cats from the clix game appear in the official novel series, wish they would have included more though.

[Kamose]

Another funny fact from DA sourse . Spirit Cats have their own Remembrance

*snip*

—The Remembrance (Spirit Cats), Passage 2, Verse 3, Lines 1–10

 http://bg.battletech.com/download/MWDA_Sneak_Peeks.pdf   ( Arnis Drummond )

One step closer to Clan Nekakami...

[Kitsune413]

For you personally or for the spirit cats?

[Kamose]

For you personally or for the spirit cats?

Hadn't really thought of it in those terms, but I'd have to say probably both.  Anarchy that, I mean more accepting of the Spirit Cats as a replacement for my much - beloved Nova Cats, and to the increasing mysticism of the Spirit Cats, while hoping TPTB don't turn them into "Clan Ninja."  I am slowly coming around to the idea of them being the literal and spiritual heirs of the Nova Cats, while having a real chance of a recovery as a new member of the Free Worlds League.  Thanks for asking, Kitsune.
Regards,
Kamose

[Kitsune413]

I think the naming conventions are more of a coincidence

[Kamose]

I think the naming conventions are more of a coincidence

Oh, I agree... that just started out as my way of "protesting" the Nova Cat Annihilation by TPTB.  Purely pettiness, nothing more - I figured since we already had Spirit Cats (Nekakami), I'd make sure they were "Properly" Re-named to suit the new, updated world of 3145 in which the (Nova)Spirit Cats are run by a Kurita (Kisho), something that, to me as a Nova Cat fan, is an absolute anathema.  I would probably have given their current product more credit, but some much of it was so insulting to me as a fan, especially the Annihilation, that I never finished ER:3145 and still, when I find an opening and am having a bad day, I sometimes re-state my own semi-insult and MY lack of respect for that specific decision (and overall, in general).  So, no pure motive behind this one, only pettiness and whining, which I probably shouldn't have posted, but since I did, I will stand up and take responsibility for.
Thanks,
Kamose