clan logistical doctrine

[Emcha]

so i'm trying to work out some things, like shipping and the logistics of transferring cargo between orbiting vessels and planetary space ports.

I can kind of see small craft filling this role for dropships, with the big daddies who are dummy thicc and can't handle planetary gravity using the space equivalent of a tipper wagon to move stuff.

but then there's the logistics of transferring cargo between big jump-capable ships and planets.

an example might be the carrack class; with a 98,806t capacity and only four small craft bays, it seems the obvious solution is to pair it with a couple dropships which take on cargo from the carrack then move in system to deliver it.

I know the Argo had a sort of internal cargo conveyor system that could efficiently move stuff from her cargo bays to her dropship collars, but do larger ships have this capability? if so, could the carrack do this, and if that's the case, what sort of dropships would a clan's merchant caste use for the purpose?

a union-C with its mech cubicles ripped out, for example could carry 2,770t of cargo, which, I would assume, goes a long way to meet the supply needs of a deployed cluster.

[AlphaMirage]

While not much is written except by fan efforts about logistics in the Battletech universe there are some things that must have been figured out for the SLDF to do as well as it did in canon.  All Space Stations, Warships, Jumpships, and Dropships can internally transfer cargo to their carried Dropships and Dropships can transfer cargo to each other through their docking collars so that is easy.

Cargo Space Stations could be built relatively easily by the clans if needed.  Dropships can shuttle cargo between them and Warships at a Jump Point, then other dropships can take that material to the planets themselves rather than making the Warship move out of jump position and use up its internal fuel.  IMHO Units like the Carrack, SovSoys, and Potemkins are effectively armed underway replenishment vessels for their respective fleets more used to fuel, arm, and resupply other Warships and Dropships at Jump Points.

Dropships are more for ground-side logistics as it would better to use things that can land on the ground for that.  A Carrack could be used to support a truly massive ground assault by shortening transit times for smaller cargo dropships but not for normal operations, far to valuable to risk.  The most popular Merchant Dropships might be the original Union Cargo (not a re-purposed Union-C but an old SLDF era Union) with its 1500 ton capacity or a Danais with its 1700 ton capacity, 2 Small Craft, and passenger quarters. Lions might also be used as well as Mules and Mammoths most of those probably dating back to the Exodus Fleet with maybe some new construction.  A Behemoth or Aqueduct type dropship might be used as a sort of temporary space station carrying fuel and other basic supplies for normal Jumpships along the safer parts of the Exodus Road.

Now a Warship or big dropship (Mammoth, +1) in planetary orbit (terrible place to be for a Warship, only slightly better for droppers) or orbiting a moon of a planet (much better place to be for all) should use small craft to transfer cargo to units on world.  Now it is possible that either of those cargo droppers could carry additional Small Craft in cargo and only load/unload the number of bays at one time.

You want some distance so the dropship carrying all your supplies can have enough time to boost away if a major Aerospace fighter force tries to make a run on it as long legs beat long arms any day in space.  Their small craft (a criminally low 4 for the Mammoth but 2 for a Trojan) would be the only thing that could be intercepted by enemy aerospace but that's much better than losing thousands of tons of materiel.

[Emcha]

ok so what i thought, in that dropships are the primary cargo movers between ship and shore.

so it stands to reason that most developed planets would have a sort of space dock at their jump points to receive cargo moving in and out of system.

given this, i'm guessing they're given the same protected status as jumpships, and I would assume the clanners simply took over ownership of the commercial assets of a system, using the existing civilian dropships and facilities.

so any clan merchantmen will happily sit at a jump point while dropships transfer their cargo to and from space docks. this is good.

[Jellico]

Why the double handling?

In a simple JumpShip/DropShip operation the cargo doesn't leave the DropShip between planet to planet. DropShips are effectively big self propelled cargo containers.

WarShips (and some DropShips) are an exception because of their size. What makes a Warship different to a JumpShip is that 95% of its mass isn't taken up by jump core so it has some useful cargo space. Because of their size that can be a lot of cargo space.

So space dockyards aren't really a thing beyond "truck stops" unless you are somewhere with major space based industries.

[2ndAcr]

 Once the planet is secure, why not just bring the warship into orbit and unload any cargo at a much closer distance.

[AlphaMirage]

Why the double handling?

So space dockyards aren't really a thing beyond "truck stops" unless you are somewhere with major space based industries.

I've always thought that there must be some system bound dropships that don't ever jump.  They just shuttle cargo from a jump point to a planet and back to a cargo station or a waiting dropship.  This keeps the Jumpships moving as they can jump after 5-6 days of recharging while a dropship needs potentially more than two weeks to make the transit to the planet and back.  While dropships could just alternate it would be simpler to route them through a common hub especially for major worlds with lots of diverse industries. 

On a smaller world yes a small cargo dropper would be there for a while.  So it can catch a jumpship berth later after it has dropped off its goods and taken on another cargo.

Once the planet is secure, why not just bring the warship into orbit and unload any cargo at a much closer distance.

I guess it depends on whether all the cargo on that ship is for that planet.  Why bother using a Warship for cargo in a secure system when you can just use Jumpships?

[Emcha]

Why the double handling?

In a simple JumpShip/DropShip operation the cargo doesn't leave the DropShip between planet to planet. DropShips are effectively big self propelled cargo containers.

So space dockyards aren't really a thing beyond "truck stops" unless you are somewhere with major space based industries.

what if you have, say, a carrack-class or some other cargo transporting warship that is on a resupply circuit?

it has a number of stops to make, and has a certain amount of cargo to deliver at each stop? like clan Ferro-fibrous armor, spare parts, ammunition, replacement warriors, etc.

i'm guessing warships don't really need to sit still to charge their jump drives, but moving in-system with your sail deployed might prove inconvenient. i mean, you can't really maneuver with 60-tons of wafer-thin mylar(?) trailing behind you.

so perhaps the carrack just sits at the jump point charging its drive as a pair of dropships deliver the cargo? then the drive is recharged by the time they get back and in the next system they transfer cargo from the carrack to the dropships and repeat the process?

edit: i did the numbers, and, assuming that a cargo tonnage equivalent to two union-Cs configured as previously mentioned is sufficient to meet the quarterly operations needs of a deployed garrison with access to local sources of food and water, a single congress class is sufficient to resupply 18 planets, assuming it reserved ~72,000 tons of cargo space for its own needs, 19 if you added in a pair of fully-laden cargo hauler Union-Cs.

which just so happens to be the number of worlds Clan Ghost bear occupied as of december 3050.

assuming the circuit runs from Sandtander V to Jezersko, with Last Frontier being a staging point for supplies bound for Vipaava, and Pinnacle and Vipaava both being supply hubs for at least four other worlds, the Congress can complete its run in about 45 days, assuming an average of 7.5 days to charge her drive and the cargo is transferred to a freight facility or system-bound dropships.

[2ndAcr]

 They can recharge off their reactor. Using a warship just depends, I could see the Clan using a Carrack to do major resupply and pick up bulk resources etc. But mainly during the initial invasion.

 After that it would be more standard jumpships IMO.

 I would not have a warship sit at the jump point for supply runs. Not me anyway. I would run it closer to possibly a La Grange point or pirate point, the dropships move to planet with warship escorting, it's recharging while on way, the dropships land, unload cargo, return to warship for next load, return to planet and repeat until down. Then they dock with warship and zoom, on to next destination.

 

[Emcha]

They can recharge off their reactor. Using a warship just depends, I could see the Clan using a Carrack to do major resupply and pick up bulk resources etc. But mainly during the initial invasion.

 After that it would be more standard jumpships IMO.

 I would not have a warship sit at the jump point for supply runs. Not me anyway. I would run it closer to possibly a La Grange point or pirate point, the dropships move to planet with warship escorting, it's recharging while on way, the dropships land, unload cargo, return to warship for next load, return to planet and repeat until down. Then they dock with warship and zoom, on to next destination.

while not a bad plan by any means, this assumes the ship is only hauling cargo to one planet.

to put it into perspective a typical supply pool of a trinary might look like this:
150t of Ferro fibrous armor stock(raw material to be formed into armor panels according to the needs of the individual mech)
20t of autocannon ammunition(all types)
20t of LRM ammunition
20t of SRM ammunition
300t of replacement laser weapons(all types)
200t of replacement Autocannons(all types)
200t of replacement missile weapons(all types)

that's 910 tons of equipment right there. and can easily sustain three trinaries of battlemechs for three months of non-combat duty.

assuming we allocate 5,540 tons to each planet in the occupied zone, a single resupply to a planet should be more than enough to see it through a year of garrison duty with limited combat.

this leaves much of the cargo hauled to fall into the categories of medicine(probably second largest portion), food(largest portion), and replacement personnel(minuscule, assuming little combat).

[Jellico]

I've always thought that there must be some system bound dropships that don't ever jump.  They just shuttle cargo from a jump point to a planet and back to a cargo station or a waiting dropship.  This keeps the Jumpships moving as they can jump after 5-6 days of recharging while a dropship needs potentially more than two weeks to make the transit to the planet and back.  While dropships could just alternate it would be simpler to route them through a common hub especially for major worlds with lots of diverse industries. 

You have it backwards. The JumpShips are the ones relatively rare to the DropShips. They can keep a regular schedule like a train or a ship. The DropShips have to work around them.

[AlphaMirage]

You have it backwards. The JumpShips are the ones relatively rare to the DropShips. They can keep a regular schedule like a train or a ship. The DropShips have to work around them.

I think you read me wrong.  Jumpers are rare which means that they need to keep moving and their collars full. 

A Mule can carry almost 4 Bucanners worth of cargo.  The Jumpship hops in and detaches a large freighter to waiting vessels or station.

They transfer their cargo to a small freighter or larger hub and receive a new cargo to replace what was lost.  These small dropships then return to their planet and the Mule or larger returns to their Jumpship and moves on with the next leg. 

4 or more dropships can be involved but not t still only takes 1 collar which is really the only finite resource in Battle tech