So, I'm trying to figure out some ER versions of existing long Range IS weapons, just for the sake of it, and maybe to outfit troops with it in a sort of AU I am 100% guaranteed to never, ever use.
tldr's have been scattered through the post. If you're not knowing all stats by heart, the tables will probably also be useful.
To take a few example weapons, and the conundrums with those, let's start with the
ER Large Laser.
Edit: Neat Table!
Comparison of ER weapon Systems (Energy) These Tables were added AFTER the original text!Large Laser:| Weapon | Heat | Damage | Range | Tonnage | Crits |
| Large Laser | 8 | 8 | 5 / 10 / 15 | 5 | 2 |
| ER LL | 12 | 8 | 7 / 14 / 19 | 5 | 2 |
| Increase: | 50% | 0% | 40%/40%/26.7% | 0% | 0% |
Large Pulse Laser:| Weapon | Heat | Damage | Range | Tonnage | Crits |
| Large Pulse Laser | 10 | 9 | 3 / 7 / 10 | 7 | 2 |
| Large X-PL | 14 | 9 | 5 / 10 / 15 | 7 | 2 |
| Increase: | 40% | 0% | 66%/43%/50% | 0% | 0% |
| Large VSPL | 10 | 11/9/7 | 4 / 8 / 15 | 9 | 4 |
| Increase: | 0% | 28%/0%/-28% | 33%/14%/50% | 28% | 100% |
I figured I'd take the same modifier that X-Pulse Lasers use, and slap it on there as well.
That would be +40% heat, for the benefit of +50% range.
However, the result looks both cheap and pretty useless:
| Weapon | Range | Heat | Damage | Tons |
| ER LL | 0/7/14/19 | 12 | 8 | 5 |
| XR LL | 0/10/20/28 | 17 | 8 | 5 |
| C/ERLL | 0/8/15/25 | 12 | 10 | 4 |
Yes, it would be pretty light and take few crits, but 17 heat? Even in Dual Heatsinks, thats 8 tons, I might as well take a Light Gauss Rifle for this.
On the other hand, it would allow an IS weapon to outrange the entire Clan Arsenal, at no penalty in weight or Crits or minimum range, like ELRMs do. (+ some really wonky weight ratios)
Then it struck me: I'll use the VSPL as a base; this gives more interesting range brackets and incurs a weight penalty.
Let's compare:
| Weapon | Range | Heat | Damage | Tons | Crits |
| XR LL(X-ER) | 0/10/20/28 | 17 | 8 | 5 | 2 |
| XR LL(V-ER) | 0/8/16/28 | 12 | 10/8/6 | 7 | 4 |
That certainly looks better. It does, however, also look slightly like a no-Brainer, because it's effectively 2 Tons for 50% more range, and other than with Pulse Lasers, that range bonus is pretty significant. While also offering a significant damage boost at close in brawls.
So I figured I'd blunt the edges a bit. For example, the damage might look better as 9/8/7.
Further possibilities would include:
- The to hit effect of the LVSPL could be turned around, starting at a 1 penalty, resulting in ranged to hit rolls of +1/+2/+3/+4; or the like;
This would have the disadvantage of making the Laser as accurate at extreme range as others are on long range, resulting in a way larger effect than intended; This effect alone would probably justify the two tons already if one plays with those rules.
~Of course, I could also give it 2/1/0/-1, so it would only function normally/better on long range and above. This might actually make it a bit weak. Would the damage decrease further at extreme ranges?
- The Laser could have a minimum range, akin to PPCs and LRMs;
This would be a good balancing factor - There could be a charge up time, reducing firerate;
I'm not actually a fan of this on a non-projectile weapon. PPCs sort of shoot a projectile.
What do you think, how could I improve upon the concept, making it balanced and an actual choice whether to take it or not?
Tl;dr:What do you think about the weapon below, balance wise, and how do you think one could tweak it without making it a carbon copy of Clantech in heavier, or a Bombast Laser?
XR-LL Range: 0/8/16/27 Heat: 12 Damage: 9/8/7 Weight: 7 Tons, 4 Crits, (+X Th short, -X TH long?) ~Minimum Range, weird TH modifiers, failure chances? Cake?
As a second idea, I'll take on the
Gauss Rifle.
A brutish weapon with already long range, but if there's an HVAC/2, there can be a longer ranged Gauss Rifle as well.
As the base, I took a normal, IS Gauss Rifle and planned the following modifications:
+20% Weight, -20% Damage, +X Range.
Which turns out to be exactly +50% of both from the Light Gauss Rifle. Which, in turn, looks pretty darn shitty in comparison.
That said, how much range bonus would such an item have?
Also 20%?
It's nice and tidy, easily memorized if one knows the base Gauss Rifle Stats, but that's not how it'll be balanced. In addition, I'd be pretty bland.
Know what, I originally had a text comparison, but lets make a more easily comprehensible list of tables instead!Original Text:As a base for Range, I take the ELRM (Anyone got any better suggestions on how to keep Universe-Internal Balance?), which based on the usable Launchers, the 10 and 15 tube versions, probably trades 70% extra mass for between 65% and 80% better range, the bonus increasing for the longer range bands.
That does actually make an equal conversion pretty likely, though such a conversion would neglect the fact that the minimum range on ELRMs is significant for the combat use, and one does give up the option to use Artemis or a variety of special munitions. Especially Semi-Guided.
Furthermore, the ELRMs also reduce Ammo by 25%, which I planned anyways, so I like that, and increase heat by roughly the same amount as mass. The latter might be a tad bit impractical for a Gauss Rifle.Comparison of ER weapon Systems (Ammo) | Balistic Weapon: | Heat | Damage | Min Range | Range | Ammo | Tonnage | Crits |
| AC/5 | 1 | 5 | 3 | 6 / 12 / 18 | 20 | 8 | 4 |
| HVAC/5 | 3 | 5 | 3 | 8 / 16 / 28 | 15 | 12 | 4 |
| Increase | 200% | 0% | 0% | +33%/+33%/+55% | -25% | 50% | 0% |
| AC/2 | 1 | 2 | 4 | 8/16/24 | 45 | 6 | 1 |
| Increase | 0% | -66% | +33% | +33%/+33%/+33% | +125% | -25% | -75% |
I thought having the AC2 as a direct comparison would be fitting.
The HVAC increases mass by 50% while keeping damage, which would be the same ratio as -20% damage and +20% mass; As such, I rather like the status quo.
200% more heat is number that would actually have an effect when transfered to a Gauss Rifle, also a
+.
In comparison to that, the AC2 offers a slightly less pronounced range advantage, but the ratio of weight to damage is way worse than with the HVAP; Of course, no critical failure chance, and ample ammunition supply.
| Missile Launcher: | Heat | Min Range | Range | Ammo | Tonnage | Crits |
| LRM Launcher 15 | 5 | 6 | 7 / 14 / 21 | 8 | 7 | 3 |
| ELRM Launcher 15 | 8 | 10 | 12 / 22 / 38 | 6 | 12 | 6 |
| Increase | 60% | +66% | 71% | -25% | 71% | 100% |
ELRMs are notable heavier, but in exchange have pretty massive range bonuses that are all the more valuable as they are completely without competition.
Tl;dr (Weapon stats)All ER-Weapons, if applicable, seem to reduce ammunition count per ton by 25%.
They also all increase heat, by roughly the same percentage (+/- 1) as the actual range increase on energy weapons and missiles, more on Ballistics. Obviously, the sample size is darn small with a base value of 1 being ignorable for % increases. HVACs always cause the heat of the next higher sized regular AC, so the increases are regularly higher.
So what does that mean for our Extreme Range Gauss Rifle?
In line with the HVAC increases, though with a more fitting ratio, it would weight in at 18 tons, while dealing 12 damage on a hit. It's long range is necessarily going to exceed 22, though by how much I haven't yet determined.
It'll draw from specialized munition, either always or to fulfil it's duty of higher range, weighting at one ton for six shots.
Also, given the already high range and fearsome reputation of Gauss Rifles, either the bonuses will be pretty small, which makes it an absolute niche weapon, or the weapon will have some "interesting" quirks that make large scale deployment impractical or undesirable.
Now, aside not being a Head Capper anymore, what quirks and/or penalties would be associated with a Longer Ranged Gauss Rifle?
A few Options:
I'm not all done, but this is as elaborate as it'll get for now ::) [blank]
- It could go the HVAC route, with a chance to fail on a two. It would produce pretty noticeable heat for a Gauss weapon, but get good range bonuses.
It goes more in the direction of Light Gauss/AC2 type weapons, which means a tiny bonus; This is what I'm trying to avoid- It could lend itself a mechanic from the PPC; Capacitors; This Rifle will necessarily need stronger capacitors, one could fluff it as them needing some time to charge, so only on a turn of no fire would the weapon receive it's significant range bonus
- The way of the ERML, aka, the weapon has a horrific minimum range that makes it impractical in close in fights, this would certainly balance, but it's not the epitome of creativity, either.
- In the same way as the proposed XRLL, just turned around, it could deal more damage at longer range; For example by means of a rocket propelled Gauss slug, which would also explain the reduced damage.
- It may have a quite atypical heat radiation, though that really doesn't fit Gauss Rifles at all.
- It could have additional restrictions, like a Heavy Gauss Rifle, f.Ex requiring a fusion generator and a stable platform; Maybe needs to be fired in clear fields; or with a firing delay that doubles the firers movement penalty... Getting too creative doesn't make a suggestion a success, either.
Tl;dr: Gauss Rifle (ER)What Quirks could an ER Gauss Rifle have to balance the significant asset of Extreme Range High-point damage? Suggestions above. Reasons... well why didn't you just read it? ;)
And now, to a matter of utter Importance :D:
What would I name it?
HVG - Like the AC series; Has a definite coolness advantage
ERG - Like Lasers; People might be inclined to pronounce it as one word.
iGR - Reminicent of the improved long Range Performance of the iHGR
EGR - Sort of like option 2, but not as easy to roll of the tongue, which is a plus, in this case
X-GR - Taking the short also taken by X-Pulse Lasers and the hypothetical XRLL; Has a nice experimental ring to it. However, once XPLs become tourney, it might not....
Now, if you dug through all those explanations and suggestions, and you still got some breath; Or if you didn't and search for something you can still answer so no one notices :P:
What's your experience with long range weapons, as in, LGR, ELRMs, HVACs....
Are they worth their risks, are they worth the weight, the price.... and do you think more of those would add options, or damage the game in some way?
PS:
I have some inconsistent formatting and at least one faulty calculation I'll hunt down over the week. Please remind me if you find the latter.So, looking forward to your opinions, suggestions, and constructive criticism! O0
Regards :)
