Artillery in 3025

[Marwynn]

Suggesting these for our 3rd SW to 3039 campaign:

Arrow III Launchers: Can fire non-homing rounds like a standard piece of artillery, as well as some of the special ammunition below. 8 mapsheet range.

All artillery systems will be able to fire these munitions, with the radius of effect in hexes:

Illumination: Long Tom Radius 3, Sniper Radius 2, Thumper Radius 1, Arrow III Radius 3
Smoke: Long Tom 5 turns Radius 1, Sniper 4 turns Radius 1, Thumper 3 turns Radius 1, Arrow III 4 turns Radius 1
Cluster (Flak capable): Long Tom 15/10/5 Radius 2, Sniper 10/5 Radius 1, Thumper 5/1 Radius 1, Arrow III 10/5 Radius 1
Inferno: None
Flechette: Sniper only, per standard rules
Thunder: Arrow III (FASCAM) 10 Radius 1
Flak: Thumper only, as per standard flak rules but applies only a +1 Modifier (instead of +3) and deals 15 to target hex. 
Anti-Air: Arrow III only, as per standard flak rules but applies no modifiers (instead of +3) and deals 10/5 to target hex/adjacent hexes.


Does this seem fair to you guys? It'll be up for the other players (we're rotating GM roles) in the end, but I wanted to have you guys take a look at it first.

I may have gone slightly overboard, so I need your thoughts on the matter.

[imperator]

Isn't Arrow 4 a helm core recovered technology? I believe so is Cluster and Thunder.

[Marwynn]

Indeed, in standard rules only the high-explosive shells are even allowed. And that's why I'm calling it the Arrow III not IV, can only fire the non-homing round and some of the other ones.

[imperator]

Ah. I understand. Well that  does seem about right. Carry on then Master Sergeant. [rockon]

[Dave Talley]

looks good so far
I would consider allowing
illumination, smoke and AA for cannon versions
ie the non arty sniper/thumpers

[David CGB]

I like it!!!!!!!

[Fallen_Raven]

It seems reasonable to me.

[Fireangel]

Interestingly, in our games we developed the Arrow II launcher; same tonnage as IV, but 2 missiles per ton. No guided missiles and needed an extra turn to set up.

It simply couldn't compete with the Thumper; the range was still too short and it would get overrun OR it would be outranged in artillery duels.

[Paladin1]

The only thing that I'd complain about would be the use of Missile artillery before the Helm core was discovered and the use of Thunder rounds.  Other than that, it looks good.

For the record, I agree with Fireangel.  Missile artillery is really limited due to it's range and ammo load.  It's only the ability to home in on it's target that makes it viable, so in my mind it's pointless.  Go with either a Thumper or LRM carrier.

[Marwynn]

looks good so far
I would consider allowing
illumination, smoke and AA for cannon versions
ie the non arty sniper/thumpers

Ahh good idea, I'll note that down.


As for the Arrow III, you fellas are forgetting one thing: VTOLs. Tube artillery is nice and all, but they'll be on 3/5 or 4/6 tracked or wheeled vehicles. But a few VTOLs packing Arrow IIIs is a mean and mobile deterrent.

Add in Anti-Air and Thunder and you have a nice support vehicle. We'll see how it plays out.

Thanks all.

[A. Lurker]

If the Arrow III is supposed to have the same weight and space needs as the Arrow IV, then unless you let your VTOLs use the optional bombing rules for them to carry up to one full artillery missile as external ordnance I'm not sure I see the difference. Anything I can stick an actual Arrow IV launcher on (well, other than fighters) can just as easily carry a Thumper.

Frankly, in 3025 I'd just stick to tube artillery, firing primarily HE and the occasional smoke or illumination round as the occasion demands. If that doesn't sound quite high-tech enough, well, that's kind of the point. :)

[Marwynn]

My group and I were under the impression that VTOLs couldn't carry the tube pieces. Don't know if that was an older rule or just an assumption our part, there's no limitation in TacOps at the moment.

[A. Lurker]

My group and I were under the impression that VTOLs couldn't carry the tube pieces. Don't know if that was an older rule or just an assumption our part, there's no limitation in TacOps at the moment.

Actually, now that I thought to check: while there's no construction limitation, non-Arrow IV artillery pieces can't be fired while airborne (TacOps p. 180, the "Airborne Targeting" section near the end and continuing onto p. 181). So it would appear that while a VTOL could indeed carry a Thumper, it would have to land to actually use it.

Not that that's necessarily a big issue given the Thumper's better range profile and the fact that artillery just plain tends to work better when allowed to simply sit and shoot anyway, but you would basically end up more with a ground artillery piece that happens to have a rotor attached to help it relocate than with a cool attack helicopter firing big badass (if still by and large woefully inaccurate) missiles. Given the tech level of the era, I'd be okay with that, but your mileage may vary.

[Hellraiser]

The only thing that I'd complain about would be the use of Missile artillery before the Helm core was discovered and the use of Thunder rounds.  Other than that, it looks good.

For the record, I agree with Fireangel.  Missile artillery is really limited due to it's range and ammo load.  It's only the ability to home in on it's target that makes it viable, so in my mind it's pointless.  Go with either a Thumper or LRM carrier.

Ditto

[doulos05]

Actually, now that I thought to check: while there's no construction limitation, non-Arrow IV artillery pieces can't be fired while airborne (TacOps p. 180, the "Airborne Targeting" section near the end and continuing onto p. 181). So it would appear that while a VTOL could indeed carry a Thumper, it would have to land to actually use it.

Not that that's necessarily a big issue given the Thumper's better range profile and the fact that artillery just plain tends to work better when allowed to simply sit and shoot anyway, but you would basically end up more with a ground artillery piece that happens to have a rotor attached to help it relocate than with a cool attack helicopter firing big badass (if still by and large woefully inaccurate) missiles. Given the tech level of the era, I'd be okay with that, but your mileage may vary.

Still, an airmobile Thumper wouldn't be entirely useless, even if it has to land to fire. Hrm, tempting to design that now....

[Marwynn]

Yes, an AirThumper would be kinda cool to use.

As to the Arrow IIIs here, keep in mind that it's the only one capable of creating sudden minefields at range (not counting LRMs or minelayer infantry). There's a specialized niche for it here beyond the homing rounds.

We've played a few games already with the above munitions. As expected, the tube artillery works best but the Arrow III is doing its job as a specialized weapon. Overall, the arty is satisfactory. It's not dominating the games (due to consensus mostly) and when it's used, there's a direct impact.

It does require using far larger maps than what we had planned though, and we're using a pretty large room for it. Aside from a sneak attack by a (nova) kitty, our game room's more or less organized. Will post pics once I figure out how from my cellphone.