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Off Topic and Technical Support => Off Topic => Topic started by: YingJanshi on 09 November 2013, 09:23:04

Title: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 09 November 2013, 09:23:04
So fellow Whovians I have a couple of trailers to share with you:

The 50th Anniversary Trailer (http://youtu.be/loGm3vT8EAQ)

The Day of the Doctor Trailer (http://youtu.be/Mkq8pnvsnQg)

That's not possible (http://youtu.be/9LnMfKjswhY) One word: Scarf
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Deadborder on 09 November 2013, 17:32:51
By simply having Rose Tyler in the trailer, my interest drops by about 75%
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: I am Belch II on 09 November 2013, 20:01:44
A movie plex by my place is showing it on the big screen. It will be after the date but should be fun.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Darth Nichos on 09 November 2013, 20:05:20
Dang it, just linked it on the other thread thinking that I was the first to post- sorry

Finally get to see the Time War; I wonder if it will open with the war or we get a series of flashbacks?

Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Khymerion on 09 November 2013, 20:35:50
By simply having Rose Tyler in the trailer, my interest drops by about 75%

I have to completely agree there.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: YingJanshi on 09 November 2013, 20:46:55
By simply having Rose Tyler in the trailer, my interest drops by about 75%

I know!!! :P
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 09 November 2013, 20:56:04
I have no problems with Rose, but I'm weird like that.  Having said that, the only thing I'll add is the fact that The Moment is at hand.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: YingJanshi on 09 November 2013, 20:59:24
I have no problems with Rose, but I'm weird like that.  Having said that, the only thing I'll add is the fact that The Moment is at hand.

Grooooan!!!

I don't have any problem with Rose either, its just that they've brought her back too many times IMHO.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 09 November 2013, 21:27:42
Too each his own.  I'll say no more.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Deadborder on 10 November 2013, 06:35:32
I'm going to be honest here. I never liked her to begin with in her original run. That the series then spent the entirety of Martha and Donna's run as companions basically talking them down while pointing out that she was a far more wonderful human being than they could ever be was maddening, and going out of their way to bring her back at every opportunity was even worse. She's one of the reasons i gave up on New Who.

Just saying
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 10 November 2013, 07:06:23
I have to work that night :-(  :'(   

Anyone know if this will be OnDemand later?
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Sharpnel on 10 November 2013, 07:49:59
Probably a day or two after, if past performance dictates future events.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: YingJanshi on 10 November 2013, 09:26:24
I'm going to be honest here. I never liked her to begin with in her original run. That the series then spent the entirety of Martha and Donna's run as companions basically talking them down while pointing out that she was a far more wonderful human being than they could ever be was maddening, and going out of their way to bring her back at every opportunity was even worse. She's one of the reasons i gave up on New Who.

Just saying

I totally get where you coming from. I think Rose is cool and pretty BA. BUT I just have a problem with the Doctor falling in love with anyone. I grew up watching stories from the classic Who and I can't see any of those Doctors falling in love with a human (or anyone else for that matter). The Eighth Doctor...maybe but then again he was written by committee, so...
Also the way the Doctor treated Martha was actually pretty horrible. "Yes I know you are falling for me, but I'm just going to ignore that and continue to pine away for the last girl."
What is it with the companion always has to fall in love with the Doctor now anyway? Rose, Martha (Donna thankfully escaped this), Amy, Clara seems to have escaped this as well. I certainly hope that the next one won't.  :P
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Mecha82 on 10 November 2013, 09:46:10
I would rather see Donna back than Rose.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: monbvol on 10 November 2013, 14:00:24
Rose did outstay her welcome but I'm not as up in arms about her return as others.  Donna wasn't bad but the writers did tend to treat her as baggage a little too often.  And yeah I'd love to see a trend towards people who work together of appropriate sexual disposition not fall in love.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: ANS Kamas P81 on 10 November 2013, 14:30:04
And yeah I'd love to see a trend towards people who work together of appropriate sexual disposition not fall in love.
Comrades, not lovers.  Hear hear, I think the MUST HAVE ROMANCE PLOT that's in everything cheapens a lot of shows.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 10 November 2013, 14:45:14
Agreed.  And that is why River Song must die in fire.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: YingJanshi on 10 November 2013, 18:23:31
Agreed.  And that is why River Song must die in fire.

But she already died in the library...
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Mecha82 on 10 November 2013, 19:03:59
To be fair I liked River for her attitude and way she interacted with The Doctor. Like Donna she was not intiminated by him while actually doing well whole love intrest part unlike Rose and Martha. And before anyone asks yes, I did also like Amy and Clara. But River was special since she was partial Time Lord. 
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Darth Nichos on 10 November 2013, 20:59:55
Here is an updated and longer version of the trailer

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7z6FMCqYrBo

Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: YingJanshi on 10 November 2013, 21:09:42
Oh cool! Thanks. (Had seen that one but couldn't find it on YouTube.  >:()


Sooo I've heard it said both ways, but do you think the 10th is a "past" Doctor or is it the Half-Doctor left with Rose?
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: monbvol on 10 November 2013, 22:10:37
My money is on the Doctor that left with Rose.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: ANS Kamas P81 on 10 November 2013, 22:37:28
Wouldn't that be a world without Turn Left in it?  And everything that came about since?  Or am I thinking backwards...
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: YingJanshi on 10 November 2013, 23:15:55
Wouldn't that be a world without Turn Left in it?  And everything that came about since?  Or am I thinking backwards...

Considering all the differences of that world, I don't think "Turn Left" matters all that much.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 11 November 2013, 06:38:22
Ok, watched the new trailer (I thought it was the other one I'd seen before), and saw it starts at 2:50

I don,t have to leave for work till quarter after 5

Me happy now :-D
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Darth Nichos on 11 November 2013, 22:32:54
Oh cool! Thanks. (Had seen that one but couldn't find it on YouTube.  >:()


Sooo I've heard it said both ways, but do you think the 10th is a "past" Doctor or is it the Half-Doctor left with Rose?

I don't think so; I believe that it just takes place during an event that grabs Doctors from different points in Time. This has happened before with "The Five Doctors" and the brief 5th and 10th Doctor mini episode.

Now I am curious to how much of the Time War we will see as well as the "Moment" that ended the war.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Atlas3060 on 11 November 2013, 23:45:47
*chants*
Please bring up the fall of Arcadia.
Please bring up the fall of Arcadia.
Please bring up the fall of Arcadia.
Arcadia!

I'll still watch, and possibly enjoy, the episode even if it isn't brought up.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Pa Weasley on 12 November 2013, 09:39:23
The 3D theatrical simulcast is on my littl' Whovian daughter's tenth birthday. Add the fact that we cut cable about two-ish months ago and no longer have BBC America it made this year's present a no-brainer.

The trick will be avoiding the internet for two days.  #P
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: bytor on 12 November 2013, 19:15:10
The 3D theatrical simulcast is on my littl' Whovian daughter's tenth birthday. Add the fact that we cut cable about two-ish months ago and no longer have BBC America it made this year's present a no-brainer.

The trick will be avoiding the internet for two days.  #P

You are a good dad  O0

The kids and I saw the trailer yesterday on BBCA while watching Top Gear, the kids have been asking about this since the season finale, and they were bouncing off the couch after seeing the trailer. 
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Stormlion1 on 12 November 2013, 23:58:19
You all understand if there is a 'Forgotten' Doctor then our good Doctor Who has used up all his regenerations now. A hidden Doctor would give us Twelve known Doctors and as we all know Gallifriens only have twelve regenerations, well except the Master who somehow got a thirteenth.
Title: The Night Has Passed; The Day is Near
Post by: YingJanshi on 13 November 2013, 02:34:57
You all understand if there is a 'Forgotten' Doctor then our good Doctor Who has used up all his regenerations now. A hidden Doctor would give us Twelve known Doctors and as we all know Gallifriens only have twelve regenerations, well except the Master who somehow got a thirteenth.

Well, actually the Master doesn't even count. I mean he went through all his regenerations, and then got several new (non-Timelord) bodies to boot. And then it appears he got a new (Timelord) body during the Time Wars.

Also Moffet has said he's pretty much tossed the limit out the window. Hasn't said how, just that the Doctor will find a way. Which my be the over arching theme for Capaldi's year (as that is all he's signed on for).
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 14 November 2013, 07:30:20
The Night of the Doctor, a mini-episode:

http://youtu.be/-U3jrS-uhuo

I would watch the hell out of a TV movie or two with McGann's doctor written and performed like that
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Øystein on 14 November 2013, 08:02:17
SQQQUEEAAAALLLLLL!!!!!!!!!

*goes to change his undies*
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Pa Weasley on 14 November 2013, 09:28:50
Well that improved my day.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Khymerion on 14 November 2013, 09:38:37
Finally!
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 14 November 2013, 10:07:05
also:

http://theconsultingdetectivesblog.files.wordpress.com/2013/11/5111507-low-doctor-who1.jpg

big pic of McGann in costume.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 14 November 2013, 10:25:54
The Night of the Doctor, a mini-episode:

http://youtu.be/-U3jrS-uhuo

I would watch the hell out of a TV movie or two with McGann's doctor written and performed like that

Me too!
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Atlas3060 on 14 November 2013, 11:43:26
The Night of the Doctor, a mini-episode:

http://youtu.be/-U3jrS-uhuo

I would watch the hell out of a TV movie or two with McGann's doctor written and performed like that
You provided nearly 7 minutes of awesome.
For that I thank you.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Darth Nichos on 14 November 2013, 22:16:41
Well that explains things

I thought there were 13 Regenerations? Also, how are they going to explain the regeneration from Matt to Peter during the Christmas Special if it is 12?
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: monbvol on 14 November 2013, 23:57:56
12 regenerations=13 incarnations of the Doctor.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: GreenDragon on 15 November 2013, 00:00:08
Inquiry.  Should we merge these threads?  Or, since Season Seven is done, and this is discussing the anniversary year, should the old thread be locked - replaced by this one?
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Stormlion1 on 15 November 2013, 00:49:32
This is more about a single episode than the show itself so I don't think so.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 15 November 2013, 03:10:49
Well that explains things

I thought there were 13 Regenerations? Also, how are they going to explain the regeneration from Matt to Peter during the Christmas Special if it is 12?

I have every confidence that they either won't mention the old 12 regeneration limit, or there'll be some Wibbly Wobbly Timey Wimey technobabble explanation as to why it doesn't effect the Doctor any more.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Øystein on 15 November 2013, 03:33:10
Several easy ways to do so. Just grant the War Doctor additional regenerations. Maybe that is his reward/price for finally joining the Time War. The Master was offered more regenerations as a reward in "The Five Doctors", so I don't see why it can't be granted to the Doctor.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 15 November 2013, 05:33:01
They need to do more with McGann's doctor.

Hell, I still think they should have skipped Eccleston and used him for the relaunch.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Stormlion1 on 15 November 2013, 08:59:54
When the Doctor gets more regenerations he becomes someone else. He becomes the Master.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: GreenDragon on 15 November 2013, 20:16:00
They need to do more with McGann's doctor.

Hell, I still think they should have skipped Eccleston and used him for the relaunch.
I've heard his first four Big Finnish Audio Dramas (by Moffatt and Gatiss - the team behind Sherlock).  His companion is still a twenty something Earth girl - but from the 1920s.  The episode, the Stones of Venice was almost certainly the basis for the Smith era Vampires of Venice.  And, a minor character throughout, flying around in the TARDIS, is one of the reality monsters we saw when Rose saved her dad.
Better than the visual adventures of Matt Smith, and overall I liked the Smith era.  Almost a hybrid of the modern Who aesthetic and classic.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Darth Nichos on 15 November 2013, 20:38:32
There were a long series of novels on the 8th Doctor that were canon before the revamped series; I heard they were quite good
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Wrangler on 15 November 2013, 22:18:15
So do you guys think there will be more mini-episodes of young War Doctor?
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 15 November 2013, 22:21:50
Only if they can get John Hurt to the Fountain of Youth :p
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: omega2010 on 16 November 2013, 05:34:03
The Night of the Doctor, a mini-episode:

http://youtu.be/-U3jrS-uhuo

I would watch the hell out of a TV movie or two with McGann's doctor written and performed like that
Yep, he's not the Doctor I was expecting... and now I want more.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: gyedid on 16 November 2013, 06:59:37
So do you guys think there will be more mini-episodes of young War Doctor?


Was the Doctor actually using a different epithet during his time as the "War Doctor"--his character had changed so radically that he actually couldn't/wouldn't be known as the Doctor anymore?  (question prompted by the "Doctor no more" comment right at the end.)  And how is it that the War Doctor now seems to have his own separate physical existence?  It's possible he could be some kind of "bonus" regeneration created by the Sisterhood of Karn's elixir, and when the need for him is over, he's somehow extracted from the Doctor, who then resumes his "normal" sequence of regenerations--albeit with all of the War Doctor's memories and knowledge of what he did during that time.

Also, didn't the whole thing smack just a bit of blackmail by the Sisterhood?  "You can drink this potion and become somebody who would do things you would never do, or you can die now and the rest of the universe will soon follow you."  Could they not have kept him alive with the Elixir they gave him after extracting him from the crash?

Still, Cass' attitude towards the Doctor shows just how bad the Time War was--not only did "lesser races" know about the Time Lords, but both sides had apparently done sufficiently horrible things that the Doctor was tarred with that brush as soon as Cass realized he was a Time Lord.

Besides "The Brain of Morbius", what other stories have the Sisterhood of Karn appeared in?  In the credits, the leader of the Sisterhood is named Ohila.  There was an Ohica in "The Brain of Morbius".


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Wrangler on 16 November 2013, 08:21:10
So its unclear they'll show the early days of the War Doctor and just goto the special with older actor playing himself in the last bits of the Time War with Matt and David running around with him?
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Stormlion1 on 16 November 2013, 17:49:21
Its funny the Time War was so incredibly destructive that Cass wouldn't even except help to save her self from dying in the crash but exclusive enough that the war was confined to a few species. I don't think the Sontaran's were invited to play for example.
Title: Re: The Night Has Passed; the Day is Near
Post by: YingJanshi on 18 November 2013, 17:27:28
Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaiiiittttttt!!!!!!
I just had an idea. I know how they can get around the limit on regenerations!!!!

The Doctor died in the crash in "The Night of the Doctor". The Sisterhood's brew allowed him to regenerate into the War Doctor. What if it also gave him a new set of regenerations? So Matt Smith is the 11th Doctor but he is the 4th one of this set of regenerations?

Does it make sense to anyone else?
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: jimdigris on 18 November 2013, 18:13:59
Sure, why not?
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Atlas3060 on 18 November 2013, 19:59:23
I'm going to support the idea that they've never really had a hard limit, but the limit was placed on Time Lord culture.
It stops folks from living forever.
With the Time War going, there's no Time Lord Culture, no culture, no regeneration limit.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: omega2010 on 18 November 2013, 20:35:19
I'm going to support the idea that they've never really had a hard limit, but the limit was placed on Time Lord culture.
It stops folks from living forever.
With the Time War going, there's no Time Lord Culture, no culture, no regeneration limit.
Moffat hasn't brought the Doctor's regeneration limit up yet but Davies included a line in Death of the Doctor (from the Sarah Jane Adventures) that he can regenerate 507 times... which is a definitely a joke since the individual numbers add up to 12....
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: YingJanshi on 20 November 2013, 17:37:35
New mini episode: "The Last Day" (http://nerdreactor.com/2013/11/20/dw-50th-doctor-mini-episode-last-day/)

This one is...intriguing...
Title: Re: The Night Has Passed; the Day is Near
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 21 November 2013, 00:10:27
Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaiiiittttttt!!!!!!
I just had an idea. I know how they can get around the limit on regenerations!!!!

The Doctor died in the crash in "The Night of the Doctor". The Sisterhood's brew allowed him to regenerate into the War Doctor. What if it also gave him a new set of regenerations? So Matt Smith is the 11th Doctor but he is the 4th one of this set of regenerations?

Does it make sense to anyone else?

Works well with me.  Let's go with that. :)
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 21 November 2013, 06:40:53
New mini episode: "The Last Day" (http://nerdreactor.com/2013/11/20/dw-50th-doctor-mini-episode-last-day/)

This one is...intriguing...

Said video removed
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Atlas3060 on 21 November 2013, 10:01:18
New mini episode: "The Last Day" (http://nerdreactor.com/2013/11/20/dw-50th-doctor-mini-episode-last-day/)

This one is...intriguing...

It features soldiers from Gallifrey during the Last Time War. It does not show the Doctor. Instead, it shows Gallifreyan soldiers on Arcadia, a stronghold city in Gallifrey...


High pitched geek squeal will commence in 3...2...1...
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Øystein on 21 November 2013, 10:27:13
I got tickets to it being shown in theaters here in Norway. Yayski! Squeeal, etc!
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 21 November 2013, 12:24:19
A cinema about 5 minutes walk from my house is showing it, but my eyes can't process 3D properly, so I'll be watching at home.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 21 November 2013, 17:47:12
Nearest theater for me is Pflugerville, and I'm hopin they ain't sold out.  Which reminds me, while I'm not a cosplayer, and while I don't have the proper clothing to do it, I at least hope that the one piece of "clothing" I plan on wearing gets by the ticket people.

(Hint:  It's a celery.  Duh.  ;) ^-^ )




EDIT:  Well, shoot, after looking at my schedule, looks like I won't be able to make the showing.  :(  Oh well, I can watch it on the TV.  :)
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 21 November 2013, 17:55:53
Anyone watch An Adventure in Space and Time yet?  it was pretty much all fluff, but I enjoyed it.  Great performances, the reconstruction of the sets and props and scenes from various episodes was a real labour of love, and it all showed on the screen.

And now the BBC are showing all of An Unearthly Child back to back...
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: YingJanshi on 21 November 2013, 18:47:43
Said video removed

Well rats...  :-\
Supposedly its up on iTunes now, but haven't been able to find it.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Wrangler on 21 November 2013, 18:49:09
Why did they pull it? Was it posted to somewhere it shouldn't have?
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: YingJanshi on 21 November 2013, 18:55:11
Why did they pull it? Was it posted to somewhere it shouldn't have?

I honestly don't know. It's been pulled from every site I saw it on. Which is rather odd because as far as I know "The Night of the Doctor" hasn't pulled from any site.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: YingJanshi on 21 November 2013, 18:56:16
Ahha!
Finally found it on YouTube:

"The Last Day" (http://youtu.be/Eem2Ehq_xBI)
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Maskerade on 21 November 2013, 19:42:04
*singing*

tomorrow, tomorrow, So you got to hang on till' tomorrow, come what may!

Alright, now that I'm over that...

But I may just annoy the hell out of my filthy degenerate friend who isn't that into the show.

But you can bet your bottom dollar I'll be glued to the screen [watch]
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Stormlion1 on 22 November 2013, 00:18:11
You know I remember the good old days when Daleks couldn't even manage a set of stairs and the Fourth Doctor was making fun of one because they couldn't manage a vertical passage.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Hammerpilot IIC on 22 November 2013, 00:24:25
The Night of the Doctor, a mini-episode:

http://youtu.be/-U3jrS-uhuo (http://youtu.be/-U3jrS-uhuo)

I would watch the hell out of a TV movie or two with McGann's doctor written and performed like that

Oh, me too. I scared a couple of cats when I saw McGann's Doctor. "I'm a doctor, but probably not the one you're expecting."
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 23 November 2013, 00:34:56
Hey, guys, check out Google.  While you're at it, check out Yahoo.  OK, the Yahoo one isn't as cool as the Google one, but it's subtle.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Wrangler on 23 November 2013, 08:33:40
Hey, guys, check out Google.  While you're at it, check out Yahoo.  OK, the Yahoo one isn't as cool as the Google one, but it's subtle.

That last level is a ball buster.  God.
Title: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: DEZOAT on 23 November 2013, 16:26:49
 :o 8) ;D I just got done watching the start of the new season . WOW!! I'll say this I like the end of it.  :-X
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Maskerade on 23 November 2013, 16:31:22
Well, the day was upon us, and all I can say is...

Wow. I really liked the episode. Certainly, it's not Moffat's best, but then again, after episodes like The Empty Child, it was never going to be. That said, it was still a great episode, and the opportunity that the extra time afforded him looks to have been siezed with both hands.

Overall verdict for the episode: {>{>

As I said on facebook though, dear goodness that Christmas Teaser  :o
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: YingJanshi on 23 November 2013, 16:41:30
That last level is a ball buster.  God.

Good grief! You weren't kidding!  :o
Title: Re: Doctor Who Season 8
Post by: DoctorMonkey on 23 November 2013, 17:11:25
Yep
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: GreenDragon on 23 November 2013, 17:48:32
Has anyone found/seen the Five(ish) Doctors Reboot?
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 23 November 2013, 18:14:26
It's on the BBC website: http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p01m3kfy
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Fatebringer on 23 November 2013, 18:19:52
Great show! GFNM~ {>{>
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: mathesont on 23 November 2013, 18:22:42
A good episode but rather underwhelming for multiple doctors and the 50th anniversary.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Atlas3060 on 23 November 2013, 18:49:20
Fun episode.
"It means I'll have to get a new horse!"
The Time War really was confusing, but one thing is clear.
I love those Gallifrey armor designs!
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Wrangler on 23 November 2013, 19:49:15
I wasn't able to see it....darn region blocks. *sniffles*  Maybe in year or so..
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: YingJanshi on 23 November 2013, 21:05:36
A good episode but rather underwhelming for multiple doctors and the 50th anniversary.

What he said....

And...did Moffet completely forget "The End of Time"? Because...I know Doctor Who and continuity aren't really on speaking terms but still...that's pretty huge...
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Khymerion on 23 November 2013, 21:20:54
What he said....

And...did Moffet completely forget "The End of Time"? Because...I know Doctor Who and continuity aren't really on speaking terms but still...that's pretty huge...

Actually You can still actually have 'The End of Time' happen because the central high command that the doctors were addressing in that episode were cut off from the Council...  our lord president Tim... who had clearly gone nuts.   So, to the council, the doctor was indeed going to end Gallifrey...  which in a way, he did.  It does end in fire.    The planet is still in a form of time lock, as was demonstrated in the episode by using the paintings.   And still leaves the room for the beating drums that drove the Master mad.   It's not perfect but it still works.  All it required was Lord President Timothy and the insane time lords on his side from not realizing what was going on... which is easily understandable if you consider the devastation of Arcadia and the planetary bombardment and then use that as a standard measure on which to base what was happening across the planet.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Stormlion1 on 23 November 2013, 21:24:29
Me? I just like it when the Curator shows up.  :)
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: GreenDragon on 23 November 2013, 22:06:48
It's on the BBC website: http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p01m3kfy
Argghh!  Video and Audio not synching, video not buffering.  All kinds of messed up.  At least on my end.  Anyone else having troubles?
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Darth Nichos on 23 November 2013, 23:34:24
I loved it; every bit of it

This also sets up the overall plot for series 8 which should be interesting
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: monbvol on 24 November 2013, 00:06:36
Overall it wasn't bad but I too was a bit disappointed that more Doctors were not involved in more meaningful ways so as a 50th anniversary special it just kind of felt a bit of a let down.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Darth Nichos on 24 November 2013, 00:19:55
It is understandable though given the ages of the actors; I will say though that Eccleston should taken part in the special. It would have seemed more right with him in it

Its cool that we saw the Fall of Arcadia even though it was brief
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: monbvol on 24 November 2013, 00:54:07
*nod*

Still could have given them a few more substantial lines at least but yeah it wasn't a bad episode.

I chalk up the inconsistency of The Doctor saying he caused the end of the Time War and turning around to say he put Gallifrey in a time lock and burned it(and I'm pretty sure going back and forth more then once before even The End of Time) to the time line sorting itself out from his changing of his own personal history and the indecision shown in the 50th Anniversary.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: omega2010 on 24 November 2013, 03:22:00
Me? I just like it when the Curator shows up.  :)
The Curator stole what was left of the show.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 24 November 2013, 03:58:54
To hell with continuity.  I still liked it!  Now let's see if he finds Gallifrey.

(And for that matter, if his regeneration limit is still tossed out the window.


EDIT:  I'll add that I had to record it off of BBC America, but it was worth it, even if I couldn't see it in 3D like I wanted. :)
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: GreenDragon on 24 November 2013, 06:37:16
Overall it wasn't bad but I too was a bit disappointed that more Doctors were not involved in more meaningful ways so as a 50th anniversary special it just kind of felt a bit of a let down.
I would have liked to see more.  But the fewer, the more they got to do.  If they had added Eccleston, for instance, the show would have needed to be an extra half hour long - in order to fit in more story.  Would have been nice to see him clearly in the Regeneration scene.
As for Eccleston: two things based on this episode.
1) The Zygons invasion was due to fallout from the Time War.  I suspect that the many times the Ninth Doctor shows up in human history - as Rose finds in her first episode - was a continuation of that.  The Doctor was fighting off alien invasions, and setting right the chaos.  He was still doing this when he met Rose.  The Autons were here (in that episode, and the first Pertwee ep) because of the need for a new homeworld weren't they?
2) The Shadow Proclamation may well also be a part of the aftermath, created by Eccleston and the member races, to fill the vacuum caused by the Council's absence.

Also, when the Doctor succeeds, Rassilon is going back into the tomb we first saw him in in the Five Doctors.  His part in creating Gallifrey's greatest criminal ensures that. 
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: gyedid on 24 November 2013, 07:55:11
It seems to me Christopher Eccleston really hasn't wanted anything to do with Doctor Who since leaving after the first season of the reboot.  Anyone else have this impression?  Has he said anything about why?  Looking at the previous actors who have played the Doctor, and how they can never really get away from it, does he feel it's a bit of career suicide?

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 24 November 2013, 08:06:39
Apparently he had a supremely bad experience working on the first filming block of his year.  He made the decision to quit at the end of those few weeks, and notably the director for those episodes hasn't worked on Who since.  IIRC there was one interview where he said this, but there's been a lot of confliting stories from Eccleston and Russel Davies.

There was some level of discussion with Eccleston about coming back, but they couldn't work it out.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Atlas3060 on 24 November 2013, 08:15:17
Based on what I've heard it pretty much went the way Lorcan Nagle said.
Christopher has been noted saying something like "I don't bathe twice in the same river".
The culture around the show didn't mesh with him and so with those conflicts he left.

I don't think we'll ever get the full picture, but I did love his performance as the 9th.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: I am Belch II on 24 November 2013, 09:13:02
The episode was the largestc simulcast ever of a tv show. They got in the Guinness Book of World Records for it.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: jimdigris on 24 November 2013, 09:56:31
This was a truly fun episode.  I wish they could do more like it.
There were obvious conflicts with the "End of Time" episode.  In EoT, Gallifrey is locked inside a parallel dimension with Daleks and several other scary bad guys.  In this episode, Gallifrey is all by itself.  Additionally, David Tennant's doctor knew in previous episodes that he locked Gallifrey away, but the two older doctors said that Gallifrey was "burned".  Why would they say that?

Also, when the Doctor succeeds, Rassilon is going back into the tomb we first saw him in in the Five Doctors. 
I missed that episode.  Could you elaborate?

Title: Re: Doctor Who Season 8
Post by: jimdigris on 24 November 2013, 09:58:31
We're not in the new season yet.  This was the pre-season appetizer. :P
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: monbvol on 24 November 2013, 10:50:56
Well there was one line that was certainly a problem.  When 13 Doctors showed up.  Tennent got 2 regenerations so there should have only been 12.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Stormlion1 on 24 November 2013, 11:07:49
Not sure if the War Doctor can be considered a regeneration. The cause of his becoming the War Doctor was an outside influence, a potion that changed him. It could be considered a makeover and resuscitation more than a regeneration. Then again coming back as a old man might not be the best choice to fight a war in.
I really like it when the younger Doctors got called on the 'waving the arms' about. I thought that was hilarious, and making fun of 'Timey-Wimey' cracked me up.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Fatebringer on 24 November 2013, 11:30:29
What he said....

And...did Moffet completely forget "The End of Time"? Because...I know Doctor Who and continuity aren't really on speaking terms but still...that's pretty huge...

My called it! She said, you know there are going to be people who bring this up :P
Title: Re: Doctor Who Season 8
Post by: YingJanshi on 24 November 2013, 11:54:31
Still have the Christmas special left to go and then the new season with Peter Capaldi will start sometime next year. Spring most likely. Anyone know if it is going to be another split season? I really hope not...  :(
Title: Re: Doctor Who Season 8
Post by: Darth Nichos on 24 November 2013, 12:29:05
Probably; its what they have done in the past

I like that they set up the plot of the new series as well as the possible return of the Time Lords. I am just curious to how Peter will play the Doctor since every actor has had his own unique way of doing it.
Title: Re: Doctor Who Season 8
Post by: YingJanshi on 24 November 2013, 13:35:25
The only way I can see them bringing back the Time Lords is if they completely ignore "The End of Time". And it appears Moffet is already doing so...
Title: Re: Doctor Who Season 8
Post by: Øystein on 24 November 2013, 13:39:29
I think Peter will have a little more serious Doctor, a doctor now with a clearly defined goal (find Gallifrey) and no longer saddled with the baggage of thinking he was the worst war criminal in the universe.
They pretty much said so in the 50th, the Doctor had lost himself after the Time War and what he though he had done, and it is just now that he has managed to unravel/sort himself out.
Title: Re: Doctor Who Season 8
Post by: Øystein on 24 November 2013, 13:43:35
The only way I can see them bringing back the Time Lords is if they completely ignore "The End of Time". And it appears Moffet is already doing so...
I think Moffet is a lot smarter than you give him credit for, and has that sorted out long ago.
We never saw what the High Council did during all of this, we only saw the High Command (the military leaders). I'm fairly sure the whole reason the Doctors dealt with the High Command was due to the actions the High Council tried to make (and the High Council had locked themselves away as mentioned at the very start).
Title: Re: Doctor Who Season 8
Post by: YingJanshi on 24 November 2013, 13:44:19
I think Peter will have a little more serious Doctor, a doctor now with a clearly defined goal (find Gallifrey) and no longer saddled with the baggage of thinking he was the worst war criminal in the universe.
They pretty much said so in the 50th, the Doctor had lost himself after the Time War and what he though he had done, and it is just now that he has managed to unravel/sort himself out.

I'm actually rather excited (Moffet aside) about having an older Doctor. Maybe we can get back to the original Doctor/Companion dynamic of Professor/Pupil. Its why my favorite sets are Doctor-Barbara-Ian-Susan, Doctor-Jamie-Zoe and Doctor-Ace. Instead of the Doctor/Companion Love story.... :P
Title: Re: Doctor Who Season 8
Post by: YingJanshi on 24 November 2013, 13:49:05
I think Moffet is a lot smarter than you give him credit for, and has that sorted out long ago.
We never saw what the High Council did during all of this, we only saw the High Command (the military leaders). I'm fairly sure the whole reason the Doctors dealt with the High Command was due to the actions the High Council tried to make (and the High Council had locked themselves away as mentioned at the very start).

Um, actually we did see the High Council in "The End of Time". And they did know what the Doctor was planning to do with the Moment. That's the whole reason the Lord President/Rassilon did what he did to the Master. They specifically talk about the Doctor possessing the Moment and his planning on using it to lock the Time War.

Also was that the High Command in "Day of the Doctor" or only the command in charge of defending Arcadia?
Title: Re: Doctor Who Season 8
Post by: Øystein on 24 November 2013, 13:54:04
Um, actually we did see the High Council in "The End of Time". And they did know what the Doctor was planning to do with the Moment. That's the whole reason the Lord President/Rassilon did what he did to the Master. They specifically talk about the Doctor possessing the Moment and his planning on using it to lock the Time War.

Also was that the High Command in "Day of the Doctor" or only the command in charge of defending Arcadia?

No, that was the High Command. Go rewatch it and pay attention to what they say during their first appearance. It's very clear that the High Council (the civilian leadership) has "gone mad and locked itself away". Which left the General in charge. Arcadia is falling when we enter the episode (which is why the soldier radios in "Arcadia has fallen"), and the military leaders we see are in the capital.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: YingJanshi on 24 November 2013, 13:54:36
Actually You can still actually have 'The End of Time' happen because the central high command that the doctors were addressing in that episode were cut off from the Council...  our lord president Tim... who had clearly gone nuts.   So, to the council, the doctor was indeed going to end Gallifrey...  which in a way, he did.  It does end in fire.    The planet is still in a form of time lock, as was demonstrated in the episode by using the paintings.   And still leaves the room for the beating drums that drove the Master mad.   It's not perfect but it still works.  All it required was Lord President Timothy and the insane time lords on his side from not realizing what was going on... which is easily understandable if you consider the devastation of Arcadia and the planetary bombardment and then use that as a standard measure on which to base what was happening across the planet.

Okay, fair enough. But to me the biggest problem with the two now is that up till this point it been specifically stated that the entire war was time locked (see "The Stolen Planet/Journey's End"). So the biggest threat in "The End of Time" was not just the return of the crazy Time Lords, but of everything in the Time War spilling back into the universe.
So if the new "quest" is the return of Gallifrey, how are they going to reconcile that?
Title: Re: Doctor Who Season 8
Post by: YingJanshi on 24 November 2013, 13:59:31

No, that was the High Command. Go rewatch it and pay attention to what they say during their first appearance. It's very clear that the High Council (the civilian leadership) has "gone mad and locked itself away". Which left the General in charge. Arcadia is falling when we enter the episode (which is why the soldier radios in "Arcadia has fallen"), and the military leaders we see are in the capital.


Okay I missed that. Thank you.
So it would appear that the scenes with the High Command are concurrent with the scenes with the High Council from "The End of Time". Okay makes since.
One last question for you. From references in "The Stolen Planet/Journey's End" and "The End of Time" it wasn't just Gallifrey that was locked away but the entirety of the Time War. So indeed the biggest threat in "The End of Time" wasn't just the return of the crazy Time Lords but that all of the horrors of the Time War would spill back into the universe? How do you think they'll reconcile that?
Title: Re: Doctor Who Season 8
Post by: Øystein on 24 November 2013, 14:29:56
No clue, but I am giving Moffat the benefit of the doubt. He started planning the 50th at least 3 years ago (it's mentioned in an interview with Tennant about coming back for the 50th), so I'll believe he has some kind of idea sketched out about it.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Wrangler on 24 November 2013, 14:31:22
Not sure if the War Doctor can be considered a regeneration. The cause of his becoming the War Doctor was an outside influence, a potion that changed him. It could be considered a makeover and resuscitation more than a regeneration. Then again coming back as a old man might not be the best choice to fight a war in.
I really like it when the younger Doctors got called on the 'waving the arms' about. I thought that was hilarious, and making fun of 'Timey-Wimey' cracked me up.

If you watch the prequel to the Day of the Doctor (Night of the Doctor) on Youtube, you'll find that That the War Doctor was young when the things got started in the time war.
Title: Re: Doctor Who Season 8
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 24 November 2013, 14:38:57
Was it the Moment that locked the Time War?  or some other effect?  I thought it was something else and the use of the Moment was part of what was locked.

But yeah, the way Moffat ended it it's like he's trying to veto the whole of the show's history set down by the Davies era.  one of the reasons I don't like his stories, he's too much of a fan and is trying to hard to make the Doctor the pure hero he thinks of him as.

though, this could work for more adventure later.  Like when the Doctor finds and rescues Gallifrey, and oops, that releases Rassilon again to and end Time again
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Ruger on 24 November 2013, 15:15:17
It is understandable though given the ages of the actors; I will say though that Eccleston should taken part in the special. It would have seemed more right with him in it

They offered Eccleston a chance to appear, but he declined from what I understand...maybe he'll come to regret it as much as Tom Baker did missing out on "The Five Doctors"...

If you watch the prequel to the Day of the Doctor (Night of the Doctor) on Youtube, you'll find that That the War Doctor was young when the things got started in the time war.

Which is one of the reasons why his line at the end about his body is "wearing a bit thin" is so great...not only pays homage to Hartnell's end, but gives us two Doctors who actually made it to the end of their natural life in a particular body

This was a GREAT episode to me...so many things honoring previous works, from the opening being taken directly from "An Unearthly Child", to the surprise cameo at the end (and, I have to say...my first thing on hearing the voice, before even seeing the face was uttering in an unbelieving tone "TOM?!?!?!?!?!?!?"....truly a great thing...he may have missed the 20th anniversary, but he made sure he didn't miss the 50th...)...If I had been falling asleep, I would have watched it the third time it came on last night too, and not just the first two times...

Loved the interaction between all three Doctors...

Ruger
Title: Re: Doctor Who Season 8
Post by: Drewbacca on 24 November 2013, 15:27:29

Well, nothing says the time loch is not still there, in fact they point out that the moment allowed 11 and 12 to get to 9 in the first place. So....
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Drewbacca on 24 November 2013, 15:31:53
Based on what I've heard it pretty much went the way Lorcan Nagle said.
Christopher has been noted saying something like "I don't bathe twice in the same river".
The culture around the show didn't mesh with him and so with those conflicts he left.

I don't think we'll ever get the full picture, but I did love his performance as the 9th.
Os he still the ninth. After this special I think he should be 10, which leaves us moving on to the last.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Drewbacca on 24 November 2013, 15:34:29

 Yes, the creation of the War Doctor was due to outside events, but look at the end of the episode, with 12 Doctors standing there.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Khymerion on 24 November 2013, 15:53:07
Okay, fair enough. But to me the biggest problem with the two now is that up till this point it been specifically stated that the entire war was time locked (see "The Stolen Planet/Journey's End"). So the biggest threat in "The End of Time" was not just the return of the crazy Time Lords, but of everything in the Time War spilling back into the universe.
So if the new "quest" is the return of Gallifrey, how are they going to reconcile that?


Thank you for point that out.   I had forgotten that.  Well, I guess we get to wait till christmas and next year...  which is nice.  Right now thought, I am going to sit back and enjoy the warm afterglow/fall out till the next local club meeting to really get to theorycrafting this...  and perhaps the show runners can pull a rabbit out of their hat for their next trick.   Either way, they have me hooked for another season (or 50).
Title: Re: Doctor Who Season 8
Post by: Khymerion on 24 November 2013, 16:00:34
I have a feeling that by re-writing history like he did in this episode, we are going to actually get to see some of these terrors that were mentioned but never shown.   So we might be seeing the Could've Been King and his Army of Meanwhiles and Neverweres show since the lock may or may not be in place amongst other things.   This means new monsters, new villains that he knows without having to constantly dip into the same well.
Title: Re: Doctor Who Season 8
Post by: DoctorMonkey on 24 November 2013, 16:03:25
I though the time-lock was broken by The Moment and that was, to some extent, her/its WMD-power
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: GreenDragon on 24 November 2013, 16:31:30
I missed that episode.  Could you elaborate?
To sum up:
Rassilon was a peer of Omega.  The pair were involved in creating the means by which time travel was possible.  As a consequence, Omega was trapped in an antimatter universe at the bottom of the black hole that powers the TARDISs.  And for whatever reason Rassilon was entombed, alive, inside what was later called the "death zone."  During the Five Doctors, the Lord President of Gallifrey summons the first five incarnations of the Doctor (though #4 and Romana #2 get stuck in the time vortex) to free Rassilon so he can have immortality.  The others, along with various companions (retiring Brigadier Leftbridge-Stewart, Sarah-Jane, the current companions of #5) are deposited in the zone, face cybermen, daleks, and other threats.  And the Master is also captured to help - and is offered a new regeneration cycle for it.
Interesting that the Master would be summoned to free Rassilon.
Sidenote: The episode also features what appears to be Zoe and Jamie, post trial, but who remember their travels with the Doctor - a fact that allows #2 to figure out they are imposters.  Except that this #2 was visiting the Brigadier at his retirement in 1988 (also seen during the McCoy era), and thus should not remember events that have not yet happened for him.  (Immediately after their memory wipe and return home, he was forced to regenerate into #3).

For some reason, that others here have mentioned, during the time of McGann, the Council released Rassilon, and impeached President Romana.  This is why he is President during the Time War.

btw, did anyone else have trouble with that link.  I need to know if the problem is on my end or not.  I was having similar problems a week ago, and reinstalled Flash.  If it is on my end, that was the first sign.
Title: Re: Doctor Who Season 8
Post by: GreenDragon on 24 November 2013, 16:41:57
There never was a Time Lock.  Gallifrey vanished, and the Daleks that were supposed to be in the Time Lock with it were mostly destroyed.  The ones we see in Stolen Planet were supposed to have been in the Time Lock.  But if that were really true, wouldn't their release have released Gallifrey?  Or wouldn't they have still been in there when Gallifrey returned in End of Time?
Clearly they were simply removed from the timestream - perhaps they did an emergency temporal shift right in the middle of Gallifrey's departure and were trapped by the chronal waves.  This made everyone assume they were Time Locked.
It is not as if there were a great number of people specifically trying to time travel into moments specifically affected by the War.  The Doctor was avoiding it.  And everyone else with time travel capability accepted his word for it.
Title: Re: Doctor Who Season 8
Post by: YingJanshi on 24 November 2013, 17:11:48
There never was a Time Lock.  Gallifrey vanished, and the Daleks that were supposed to be in the Time Lock with it were mostly destroyed.  The ones we see in Stolen Planet were supposed to have been in the Time Lock.  But if that were really true, wouldn't their release have released Gallifrey?  Or wouldn't they have still been in there when Gallifrey returned in End of Time?
Clearly they were simply removed from the timestream - perhaps they did an emergency temporal shift right in the middle of Gallifrey's departure and were trapped by the chronal waves.  This made everyone assume they were Time Locked.
It is not as if there were a great number of people specifically trying to time travel into moments specifically affected by the War.  The Doctor was avoiding it.  And everyone else with time travel capability accepted his word for it.

Eh...except for Dalek Caan. "The Stolen Planet/Journey's End" specifically states that that it was Time Locked. As does "The End of Time"...
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: omega2010 on 24 November 2013, 18:28:48
It seems to me that the regeneration limit is pretty much dead and buried with what we see at the end of the episode.  The Curator subtly reveals he is a retired future incarnation of the Doctor who has taken on the face of the Fourth.
Title: And So the Adventure Began
Post by: YingJanshi on 24 November 2013, 19:22:25
Just finished watching "An Adventure in Space and Time", and all I can say is... :'( ;D Wow.
I loved it. I really did. (Was actually more impressed by this than I was by "The Day of the Doctor".) Especially all of the cameos spread throughout it (But be sure to pay attention to the women in the crowd during Ms. Lambert's farewell party. Among others.)
The entire cast did an amazing job on this production. Especially David Bradley. He really did a fine job of capturing Mr. Hartnell.

It really is amazing how well all of the 1st Doctor's stories still stand up. There is a magic contained in them that cannot be diminished by flubbed lines or shaky cameras. They still grab your imagination and draw you in.

And Mr. Hartnell as the Doctor...well, without his talent the show would never have lasted long enough to become what it is (plus Daleks of course :D). Its amazing how well his characterization foreshadows all of the Doctors to follow. Every subsequent Doctor can be found in him. So he will always be one of my favorites.

After watching this, I would really love to see William Russell and Carole Ann Ford come back for an episode.  :'(
Title: Re: Doctor Who Season 8
Post by: GreenDragon on 24 November 2013, 19:49:23
Beings trapped between one moment and the next.  How would they know the difference?
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: YingJanshi on 24 November 2013, 19:58:36
It seems to me that the regeneration limit is pretty much dead and buried with what we see at the end of the episode.  The Curator subtly reveals he is a retired future incarnation of the Doctor who has taken on the face of the Fourth.

Um, I think you are ready to much into that. Personally I think it was just them being a bit playful with Time and the Doctor.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: YingJanshi on 24 November 2013, 20:01:18
May I present the real 50th special:

The Five(ish) Doctors Reboot (http://youtu.be/yI5Py96KJ54)

This feels like a good celebration of the show. The actual episode was really good, but it just felt like they tacked on the 50th stuff at the end...
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: omega2010 on 24 November 2013, 20:15:20
Um, I think you are ready to much into that. Personally I think it was just them being a bit playful with Time and the Doctor.
Not really.  While the Curator doesn't confirm he's the Doctor, his lines to the 11th Doctor about never forgetting a face and revisiting an old face heavily hint that he is the Doctor.  At least I hope I'm not reading too much into it.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Wombat on 24 November 2013, 21:45:16
Like any Doctor Who, it just felt...fun! (and thats the point - continuity doesn't have to be perfect, and the story lines can't always match up in perfect Trekkie-symmetry, but my goodness it MUST be fun).
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: bytor on 24 November 2013, 21:54:54
Like any Doctor Who, it just felt...fun! (and thats the point - continuity doesn't have to be perfect, and the story lines can't always match up in perfect Trekkie-symmetry, but my goodness it MUST be fun).

Agree with this 100%  O0
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 24 November 2013, 22:24:59
Agree with this 100%  O0

I'll second that! :)
Title: Re: And So the Adventure Began
Post by: Darth Nichos on 25 November 2013, 00:19:53
It was good; a nice docudrama to show how things went behind the scenes.

btw, Hartnell was pretty sick by the time of "The Five Doctors" and his wife had to use cue cards so he could say his lines.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Pat Payne on 25 November 2013, 00:30:46
Well there was one line that was certainly a problem.  When 13 Doctors showed up.  Tennent got 2 regenerations so there should have only been 12.

The thirteenth was Peter Capaldi (due to take over as The Doctor during this year's Christmas special), who is seen in an extreme-close-up cameo during the sequence.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: monbvol on 25 November 2013, 00:43:49
I know he's the 13th incarnation of the Doctor.  But Tennant got 2.  It goes Hartnell, Troughton, Pertwee, T.Baker, Davison, C.Baker, McCoy, McGann, Eccleston, Tennant, Tennant, Smith, and Capaldi.  So unless the two Tennant Doctors got split up there should have only been 12.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: JoeJones on 25 November 2013, 01:19:22
I know he's the 13th incarnation of the Doctor.  But Tennant got 2.  It goes Hartnell, Troughton, Pertwee, T.Baker, Davison, C.Baker, McCoy, McGann, Eccleston, Tennant, Tennant, Smith, and Capaldi.  So unless the two Tennant Doctors got split up there should have only been 12.

Don't forget the War Doctor, John Hurt, who falls between 8 & 9 in in-series continuity (for now, at least).
Title: Re: And So the Adventure Began
Post by: JoeJones on 25 November 2013, 01:23:50
btw, Hartnell was pretty sick by the time of "The Five Doctors" and his wife had to use cue cards so he could say his lines.

Actually, it was "The Three Doctors" where he was very ill & needed the cue cards. He had passed away some time before "The Five Doctors" was filmed, so the BBC used another actor, Richard Hurndall,  to play the part of the First Doctor for that episode.
Title: Re: And So the Adventure Began
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 25 November 2013, 06:05:28
I enjoyed An Adventure in Space and Time for the most part, it was very slight - there's not a huge amount of tension to be mined from the series' production.  But the cast and crew really made the show into a love letter to Doctor Who, and that makes up for the straightforwardness of the story.  Reese Shearsmith was a bit crap as Patrick Troughton though.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Khymerion on 25 November 2013, 07:31:54
I know he's the 13th incarnation of the Doctor.  But Tennant got 2.  It goes Hartnell, Troughton, Pertwee, T.Baker, Davison, C.Baker, McCoy, McGann, Eccleston, Tennant, Tennant, Smith, and Capaldi.  So unless the two Tennant Doctors got split up there should have only been 12.

Moffet stated that Tennant counts as two and Smith is actually number 13 but the regeneration issue is going to figure prominently in the Christmas Special... so we only got a month till we get our answers.
Title: Re: And So the Adventure Began
Post by: Darth Nichos on 25 November 2013, 12:44:16
Actually, it was "The Three Doctors" where he was very ill & needed the cue cards. He had passed away some time before "The Five Doctors" was filmed, so the BBC used another actor, Richard Hurndall,  to play the part of the First Doctor for that episode.

Yeah, thats right- my bad
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: GreenDragon on 25 November 2013, 15:55:26
But Tennant never went to Trenzalore.  You know the "fall of the 11th"?
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 25 November 2013, 16:13:22
May I present the real 50th special:

The Five(ish) Doctors Reboot (http://youtu.be/yI5Py96KJ54)

This feels like a good celebration of the show.

They should have shown this on tv right after the show.  This was great. 
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Drewbacca on 25 November 2013, 16:19:28
But Tennant never went to Trenzalore.  You know the "fall of the 11th"?
Exactly. Not to mention when the high command said all 13 doctors where there, they showed Capaldi.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 25 November 2013, 20:15:38
Not really.  While the Curator doesn't confirm he's the Doctor, his lines to the 11th Doctor about never forgetting a face and revisiting an old face heavily hint that he is the Doctor.  At least I hope I'm not reading too much into it.

I actually thought about this earlier, and while it's possible I may be reading too much into a lot of stuff(or for that matter forgetting a lot of things that I need to play catch up), what if the Curator is Susan?  I mean, isn't she suppose to be a Time Lord as well?  We never know what happened to her, and I'm sure after not seeing his granddaughter for years, he's probably unaware that she survived the Time War.  I mean, Time Lords can regenerate into an opposite gender, right?  Just my theory.


EDIT to add:  Feel free to disagree and/or correct me.  I promise I won't be offended. :)
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: monbvol on 25 November 2013, 21:03:09
That's actually a good theory.  I think I like it more then the more "obvious" theory.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Stormlion1 on 25 November 2013, 22:54:30
Susan was left in the future right? Without a Tardis of her own, so her being a regenerated Curator I think might be a little out there. And I do believe that yes they can change Genders, a Timelord named the Corsair is mentioned who has done so.

http://tardis.wikia.com/wiki/The_Corsair
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Wrangler on 25 November 2013, 22:55:55
Susan was left in the future right? Without a Tardis of her own, so her being a regenerated Curator I think might be a little out there. And I do believe that yes they can change Genders, a Timelord named the Corsair is mentioned who has done so.

http://tardis.wikia.com/wiki/The_Corsair

Only problem with that, is that in the The Night of the Doctor. The sisters offered the Doctor change of gender.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Stormlion1 on 25 November 2013, 23:23:56
True, the Sister did do that. But I think that was a option of the potion they wanted him to drink more than a regenerations normal options.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Pa Weasley on 25 November 2013, 23:25:45
Got back a little while ago from the 3D showing. It was my daughter's birthday present. Totally just for her. Yep.

Holy crap that was awesome! Plus the little extras like Commander Strax discussing movie etiquette and Smith and Tennant "activating" the 3D as well as the Zygon detection system (to find the Zygons hiding in the theater of course) were a fantastic touch.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: I am Belch II on 26 November 2013, 00:27:34
I just saw it one the big screen, it's was a awesome show. 3d didn't make it better.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: WONC on 26 November 2013, 03:10:14
I actually had a date for this one, and I don't know which was more entertaining: the show itself, or her reactions to it (she's a superfan). Definitely a recommend for anyone who (for whatever reason) hasn't watched it yet.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: gyedid on 26 November 2013, 05:26:37
When did the 10th Doctor waste a regeneration on himself?


I do hope we get to find out more about this War Doctor at some point--like how he got to be so old.  He's only the second Doctor who has actually lived out a body (after the First).  For a "warrior", that doesn't strike me as the type who'll often put himself in harm's way, like the "normal" Doctors have often done--more a behind-the-scenes manipulator.  Just how long did he spend in the Time War then?  Did he have some experience that made him age faster?

And if he *really* wanted to be ruthless about things, he could have stopped the war before it started--by going back to the genesis of the Daleks and succeeding where the Fourth Doctor failed.  >:D  O0

Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 26 November 2013, 05:33:41
When did the 10th Doctor waste a regeneration on himself?

The Stolen Earth/Journey's End - he's shot by a Dalek, begins to regenerate, weird stuff happens and his severed hand becomes a clone, and he claims he didn't want to change just yet.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: GreenDragon on 26 November 2013, 05:45:54
So where does the Valeyard fit in now?
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 26 November 2013, 07:54:01
I quite like the use of old footage (and a John Culshaw impression) to explain Tom Baker's absence from the Five(ish) Doctors - a nice little in-joke.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: gyedid on 26 November 2013, 09:24:12
So where does the Valeyard fit in now?

Well, hopefully the Christmas special will address that.  If the upcoming Doctor really is the "last" one of the Doctor's (initial?) set of regenerations, then the Valeyard should come into being before Matt Smith regenerates into Peter Capaldi.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: GreenDragon on 26 November 2013, 15:31:23
Well, hopefully the Christmas special will address that.  If the upcoming Doctor really is the "last" one of the Doctor's (initial?) set of regenerations, then the Valeyard should come into being before Matt Smith regenerates into Peter Capaldi.

cheers,

Gabe
According to Moffatt, Matt is the last regeneration.  Capaldi's existence requires the Doctor to break the rules somehow - presumably not in the same way the Master did.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Drewbacca on 26 November 2013, 15:34:39
According to Moffatt, Matt is the last regeneration.  Capaldi's existence requires the Doctor to break the rules somehow - presumably not in the same way the Master did.


?!?!?!
Still does not fit with the "All 13!" Cue Capaldi-sequence.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Wrangler on 26 November 2013, 20:30:49
I have a side question:  Is the Tardas unique?  Master had one obviously, but did all the Time Lord at one point have a Tardas?
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: YingJanshi on 26 November 2013, 20:55:24
I have a side question:  Is the Tardas unique?  Master had one obviously, but did all the Time Lord at one point have a Tardas?

Well, unique after the Time War. But yes, the Time Lords had whole fleets of TARDISes. In fact the one the Doctor stole is an early model that was scheduled to be dismantled.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 26 November 2013, 21:17:59
Heck, how many TARDIS's do you know that had a malfing chameleon circuit?  ;)
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: I am Belch II on 26 November 2013, 21:44:59
The part of the episode when the 3 doctors were in the cellar and couldn't figure out how to get out of the unlocked door was pretty good.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Stormlion1 on 26 November 2013, 23:23:26
I always figured there were a few hundred Tardis's floating about but use of them was well regulated. And I mean extremely well regulated. When the Fourth Doctor went to Gallifray at one point there was a comment that there were only two 'Probes' away from Gallifray at the time. Of course they weren't counting stolen 'probes' like the Doctors and the two the Master had.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 27 November 2013, 01:31:14
The part of the episode when the 3 doctors were in the cellar and couldn't figure out how to get out of the unlocked door was pretty good.

Well, what do you expect from someone who can't distinguish between the Queen of England and a Zygon?   :D

Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: I am Belch II on 27 November 2013, 01:33:40
I guess the showing of Dr Who earned over 4 million dollars and was 2nd place behind the Hunger Games at the box office.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: GreenDragon on 27 November 2013, 04:07:51
?!?!?!
Still does not fit with the "All 13!" Cue Capaldi-sequence.
1)Hartnell
2)Troughton (first regeneration)
3)Pertwee (2nd regeneration - forced by Council)
4)T.Baker (3rd regen)
5)Davison (4th - had some peculiarities, as 5th Doctor was running about before 4th died)
6)C.Baker (5th)
7)McCoy (6th)
8)McGann (7th)
9)Hurt (8th)
10)Eccleston (9th - previously believed to be the 8th regeneration and 9th Doctor)
11)Tennant (tenth and eleventh regenerations)
12)Smith (12th and final regeneration)
13)Capaldi

Tennant Mk.2 counts as a regeneration (now apparently - but not when they were making the Trenzalore prophecy).  Therefore, although there are a total of 13 different Doctors when counting Capaldi, Matt Smith is the 12th Regeneration.  Capaldi's existence is in violation of the 12 Regeneration limit rule.  A fact that will be explained (so we are promised) in the Christmas episode in a month.  Since the Doctor also goes to Trenzalore at that time, it will hopefully reconcile the "fall of the eleventh" prophecy.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: gyedid on 27 November 2013, 05:08:54
OK, I cheated and looked over the list of episodes on Wikipedia.

I think I now have an idea where the Doctor has gotten some extra regenerations from...

cheers,

Gabe

Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Drewbacca on 27 November 2013, 05:21:03
1)Hartnell
2)Troughton (first regeneration)
3)Pertwee (2nd regeneration - forced by Council)
4)T.Baker (3rd regen)
5)Davison (4th - had some peculiarities, as 5th Doctor was running about before 4th died)
6)C.Baker (5th)
7)McCoy (6th)
8)McGann (7th)
9)Hurt (8th)
10)Eccleston (9th - previously believed to be the 8th regeneration and 9th Doctor)
11)Tennant (tenth and eleventh regenerations)
12)Smith (12th and final regeneration)
13)Capaldi

Tennant Mk.2 counts as a regeneration (now apparently - but not when they were making the Trenzalore prophecy).  Therefore, although there are a total of 13 different Doctors when counting Capaldi, Matt Smith is the 12th Regeneration.  Capaldi's existence is in violation of the 12 Regeneration limit rule.  A fact that will be explained (so we are promised) in the Christmas episode in a month.  Since the Doctor also goes to Trenzalore at that time, it will hopefully reconcile the "fall of the eleventh" prophecy.
Seems like a bit of effort, when they simply could have said the second Tennant did not count.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Stormlion1 on 27 November 2013, 12:01:29
Here is a question, how long was Hurt a Doctor? If the time frame was short enough the Doctor could have undergone a regeneration soon again without consequences. If he drank the drink, went to Gallifray and wrote "No More" and then did everything he did in the Day of the Doctor in a short enough span of time and then regenerated after those events it might not count as a full regeneration but a short time trying out a few options. When Romana I regenerated into Romana II she did try out several bodys right after the other after all.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Øystein on 27 November 2013, 12:26:25
Decades, if not longer. He regenerated into a adult man, and he is old and weary when he finally shows up. His expiration is that after a natural lifespan, not of a violent death (which is an feat considering how most other doctors have regenerated).

You see his initial age in Night of the Doctor.



Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 27 November 2013, 12:32:08
It's strongly suggested that his regeneration wore out like the first Doctor, who was upwards of 400 when he regenerated.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: GreenDragon on 27 November 2013, 15:40:59
When Romana I regenerated into Romana II she did try out several bodys right after the other after all.
That would probably be the basis for Tennant mk.1 regenerating his severed hand in his first appearance.
Seems like a bit of effort, when they simply could have said the second Tennant did not count.
Except that now, Moffatt wants it to count.  He wants Matt Smith to be the last legal regeneration.  That makes the method of his next regeneration a "BIG DEAL"tm, and may do the same for every subsequent regeneration for the entire continued existence of the show.  The Doctor is now essentially mortal.  Any serious threat could kill him, just like everyone else.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Atlas3060 on 27 November 2013, 20:59:26
Well, what do you expect from someone who can't distinguish between the Queen of England and a Zygon?   :D
Or a plain ol' rabbit.  :D
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 27 November 2013, 21:02:25
Or a plain ol' rabbit.  :D

Too true.   ;D
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: YingJanshi on 27 November 2013, 21:03:55
Speaking of which...what does happen to the Zygons?
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Wrangler on 27 November 2013, 22:33:09
Yay, I finally got to see Day of the Doctor, the day has arriverd at last.

Wow. That was smashing one, which i got watch with my father.  I have no complaints with the special. It felt like a movie.  My brother had actually went to the movie theater and watched it there with some Zygons demostrating why you should be breaking the rules of the theater.   

Anyways It was wicked cool they allowed all the doctors to appear in the special.  I was amused about the Custodian was abe to make his appearance and David finally got married to an unexpected bride.  How that marrage got going is bit beyond me.  8) The Queen reminded me of Catherine Tate (David's former companion, the runaway bride.)
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Stormlion1 on 28 November 2013, 00:05:31
The marriage got going, got started and then the Doc took a trip so I don't think he finished.
Title: Re: And So the Adventure Began
Post by: DEZOAT on 28 November 2013, 09:32:18
 I watch it last friday BBC America. I enjoy it alot. I can't wait for it to come out on DVD . I have to get it  for a friend.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Wrangler on 28 November 2013, 09:38:54
The marriage got going, got started and then the Doc took a trip so I don't think he finished.

Only problem with that, there was painting with Queen and him in it with formal royal wears.  He didn't have time during their courting to stand for hours for painter to get jest of what he was painting.
Title: Re: And So the Adventure Began
Post by: Wrangler on 28 November 2013, 09:42:48
Its amazing.  I wish they'd bring David Bradley for a seperate season to create / recreate the lost episodes of Dr. Who.
Title: Re: And So the Adventure Began
Post by: Klep on 28 November 2013, 12:14:47
Its amazing.  I wish they'd bring David Bradley for a seperate season to create / recreate the lost episodes of Dr. Who.
Hear hear. He was extremely good slipping into Hartnell's shoes.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Stormlion1 on 28 November 2013, 12:49:06
Probably had a painting done beforehand at some point and the Queen used that to have a royal portrait done. But there is little evidence he returned to Elizabethan England.
The interesting thing is that in the episode The Shakespeare Code she orders her guards to kill the Doctor (same one) and calls him her "Sworn Enemy". This happened something like thirty years afterwords from the Day of the Doctor.
Title: Re: And So the Adventure Began
Post by: Stormlion1 on 28 November 2013, 12:53:43
Saw it years back and honestly I barely remember it. Its kind of sad, I first started with the Fourth Doctor and I think saw every episode of that and then worked my way backwards and only ever saw one or two episodes of the First Doctor. And except for the Five Doctors never saw one episode of the Second! I did see most of the Thirds though.
Only Doctor I couldn't stand was the Seventh. He turned me off the show so bad I didn't start watching again until halfway through the tenth!
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 28 November 2013, 13:17:35
Now we know why! :)
Title: Re: And So the Adventure Began
Post by: YingJanshi on 28 November 2013, 13:23:34
Saw it years back and honestly I barely remember it. Its kind of sad, I first started with the Fourth Doctor and I think saw every episode of that and then worked my way backwards and only ever saw one or two episodes of the First Doctor. And except for the Five Doctors never saw one episode of the Second! I did see most of the Thirds though.
Only Doctor I couldn't stand was the Seventh. He turned me off the show so bad I didn't start watching again until halfway through the tenth!

Really? Why? The Seventh was my favorite of the classic.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Øystein on 28 November 2013, 13:26:40
Now we know why! :)

Yeah, don't skip your honeymoon when you're married to a absolute monarch.
Title: Re: And So the Adventure Began
Post by: Øystein on 28 November 2013, 13:27:56
Really? Why? The Seventh was my favorite of the classic.

The great thing about Doctor Who - everyone has their favorite :D

Title: Re: And So the Adventure Began
Post by: YingJanshi on 28 November 2013, 13:38:07
The great thing about Doctor Who - everyone has their favorite :D

Hahaha. True...though, sometimes your favorite changes depending on which one you're watching at the moment!  :D ;D
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Stormlion1 on 28 November 2013, 14:57:55
That or the Zygons finally replaced Elizabeth and were still keeping an eye out for the Doctor. He beat them in the present, but they were still running around in the past. So its possible Queen Elizabeth might have ended up in a stasis painting herself and a Zygon Queen ended up ruling England...
Title: Re: And So the Adventure Began
Post by: Stormlion1 on 28 November 2013, 15:00:51
Just something about the Seventh Doctor that rubbed me the wrong way. Early episodes weren't to bad (except for the spoon playing) but as the show went on I think it got worse and worse. Sorry, me and my twelve foot scarf root for the Fourth Doctor and maybe even a bit for the fifth.
Title: Re: And So the Adventure Began
Post by: YingJanshi on 28 November 2013, 16:04:48
I get. Not everyone likes the darkness in McCoy's doctor.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Darth Nichos on 29 November 2013, 00:13:36
I am kind of curious to why went with another Older Doctor instead of continuing the trend of younger Regenerations; Matt Smith is only 31 and I would have went with someone with the same age group.

Don't mean to change the subject but I just find it funny that they are doing that. Also will Clara be Peter's Companion for a while or will we see her only for part of Series 8?

It was nice seeing the Time War but I wish they revealed a bit more on the various battles that lead up to the Siege of Gallifrey; did the Time Lords and Daleks fight it out on other planets thus those "forbidden weapons" were used?
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: GreenDragon on 29 November 2013, 02:20:26
Currently they are saying she will be his Companion.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Wrangler on 29 November 2013, 07:51:17
I remember hearing that actress who plays Clara said she sort-of felt was like cheating on Matt when she meet Peter, who was filming the special.

I wonder how the Christmas special is going to go down.  Clara such a cool character, I'd hate see her take off after Matt transforms his youthful for Mumra the ever living... err i mean Peter's character.  :D
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: YingJanshi on 29 November 2013, 10:48:54
Huh, I guess I'm one of the few fans actually excited with getting an older Doctor again?
Of course, I grew up watching stuff from the classic series, so it doesn't weird me out.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Wrangler on 29 November 2013, 11:20:55
I don't mind older Doctors, specially after the Special.  Only real problem I think going be problem which is minor, is they won't be able come on to the show later on since they got bit too old be that version of the Doctor. 
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 29 November 2013, 11:52:30
I am kind of curious to why went with another Older Doctor instead of continuing the trend of younger Regenerations; Matt Smith is only 31 and I would have went with someone with the same age group.

Moffat's original plan was for an older Doctor, but was so impressed by Matt Smith that he cast a younger actor.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Stormlion1 on 29 November 2013, 12:10:14
It was nice seeing the Time War but I wish they revealed a bit more on the various battles that lead up to the Siege of Gallifrey; did the Time Lords and Daleks fight it out on other planets thus those "forbidden weapons" were used?

I think the Time War was fought all over the Galaxy and affected worlds everywhere. My money is on that the Daleks pushed the Time Lords back to Gallifray and placed that planet under siege, which the time lords used Sky Trenches to repel. The Time Lords could still strike out with Tardis's of there own though as they could just go around them while the Daleks had to fight more conventionally. Some race's were not invited to the war though like the Sontarans who would have loved to have been invited while othere races were wiped out in the crossfire.
Title: Re: And So the Adventure Began
Post by: Stormlion1 on 29 November 2013, 12:11:43
I get. Not everyone likes the darkness in McCoy's doctor.

Yeah that's it, I didn't like Machevelli in my Doctor.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Wrangler on 29 November 2013, 12:13:11
So all the remaining Time Lords bunkered up while the Gallifrey military fought off the Daleks?   What heck were they doing? They must have some rather bad Time Lords if Doctor has swoop in and fix the problems.  Renegade Time Lord or not.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Stormlion1 on 29 November 2013, 12:33:14
I figure the Time Lords were playing with precision strikes against the Daleks while the Daleks were in a general offensive. You know send a Time Lord back in time and destroy a shipyard and in the future that shipyard doesn't build Dalek warships. Or send the 4th Doctor back in time to destroy the Daleks and he doesn't do so because he has issues with destroying an entire species.
Yes, the Time Lords sent the Fourth Doctor to destroy the Daleks in the past at one point. Would have been better to send someone back to strangle Davros in the cradle instead.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: YingJanshi on 29 November 2013, 13:27:47
The thing to remember though is that the Daleks also had time travel. By the time the Doctor stepped in, the Dalek's technology matched (or in some cases exceeded) the Time Lords.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Wrangler on 29 November 2013, 13:33:31
The Doctor must have been very distraught by the time the Daleks (having been wiped out...) returned from the non-existing void while his own people were dead by his own hands (he thought).
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: GreenDragon on 29 November 2013, 17:16:33
I figure the Time Lords were playing with precision strikes against the Daleks while the Daleks were in a general offensive. You know send a Time Lord back in time and destroy a shipyard and in the future that shipyard doesn't build Dalek warships. Or send the 4th Doctor back in time to destroy the Daleks and he doesn't do so because he has issues with destroying an entire species.
Yes, the Time Lords sent the Fourth Doctor to destroy the Daleks in the past at one point. Would have been better to send someone back to strangle Davros in the cradle instead.
And oddly, in the JNT era, the 7th does wipe them all out.  Except for all the ones who somehow didn't register as Daleks when the Hand of Omega wiped them all out - those were the ones to fight the Time War.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Ruger on 29 November 2013, 17:20:15
Except that now, Moffatt wants it to count.  He wants Matt Smith to be the last legal regeneration.  That makes the method of his next regeneration a "BIG DEAL"tm, and may do the same for every subsequent regeneration for the entire continued existence of the show.  The Doctor is now essentially mortal.  Any serious threat could kill him, just like everyone else.

Of course, he also saw him (Matt Smith's Doctor) start to regenerate after River-in-an-astronaut-suit shoots him, but I suppose the excuse will be that this is what everyone was shown as this is what they were expecting to see...

Ruger
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: monbvol on 29 November 2013, 18:06:04
Well you have to remember that wasn't actually the Doctor in that scene and he probably did arrange that effect for the precise reason of that was what everyone expected, especially since no one really seems to know for sure how many regenerations a Time Lord actually has or how many the Doctor had actually gone through by then.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: ANS Kamas P81 on 29 November 2013, 20:08:03
So is anyone disappointed that we didn't get a female Doctor this time, and...if you were to have one, who would you cast?  Don't go big-name, pick someone from British TV who could put gravity in the role as well as the level of magician's-patter playfulness, that could reasonably be expected to actually be able to fill the role.  (this is my Don't Pick Dame Judi Dench rule)
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Wrangler on 29 November 2013, 20:13:13
I am not disappointed.  Though i think it would be interesting, but i think it be weird at the same time. 

If it was his daughter, then i could dig it.  Not man himself, he's been associated as male since the character's creation.  It may not jive with some fans for him some how completely changing his personality that drastically.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: monbvol on 29 November 2013, 20:13:32
With my limited knowledge of UK actresses I'd have to go with the actress who played Tennant's partner from Broadchurch.  Can't remember her name now and been called to dinner so I can't even look it up.  :P
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Gleep on 29 November 2013, 20:39:44
Well you have to remember that wasn't actually the Doctor in that scene and he probably did arrange that effect for the precise reason of that was what everyone expected, especially since no one really seems to know for sure how many regenerations a Time Lord actually has or how many the Doctor had actually gone through by then.

As I remember it, time lords are supposed to only have 12 regens (I know, already stated, repetitive, and broken by the Master).
The thing that I wondered about was, if Gallyfrey is sealed away in the time war, and the regens are caused by timelord-tech, and the regens came from Gallifrey, that meant that the Eccleston doctor shouldn't have happened.
The "Night of the Doctor" mini ep seems to have resolved that, since the sisters of kaan had "perfected" regeneration.
So the 12 regen limit was more a bureaucratic limit, than an actual physical one, and we now have...

DOCTORS FOREVER!!!

(yeayh!).
Title: The Day is Done
Post by: Wrangler on 29 November 2013, 20:41:15
Question comes to.  Was this change in the timeline, or was this something that had happen and no one know how it really came down?
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Stormlion1 on 29 November 2013, 21:21:45
Timelords have life expectancy too, and nothing lives forever. I have a feeling that in comparison to the Doctor most Gallifrians live long, long lives maxing out each life before regenerating. In comparison the Doctor has lived a short but eventful life.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 29 November 2013, 22:36:34
Good.  Long uneventful lives are boring.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: GreenDragon on 29 November 2013, 23:07:32
So is anyone disappointed that we didn't get a female Doctor this time, and...if you were to have one, who would you cast?  Don't go big-name, pick someone from British TV who could put gravity in the role as well as the level of magician's-patter playfulness, that could reasonably be expected to actually be able to fill the role.  (this is my Don't Pick Dame Judi Dench rule)
Joanna Lumley played the Doctor in Curse of Fatal Death.  At the end, she was going to learn why he calls himself "the Master".
Title: Re: Doctor Who Season 8
Post by: Lore on 29 November 2013, 23:44:41
I think Peter will have a little more serious Doctor, a doctor now with a clearly defined goal (find Gallifrey) and no longer saddled with the baggage of thinking he was the worst war criminal in the universe.
They pretty much said so in the 50th, the Doctor had lost himself after the Time War and what he though he had done, and it is just now that he has managed to unravel/sort himself out.

Moffat confirmed in a interview earlier today that the Capaldi-Doctor will be a "snarling beast." We won't be seeing the pleasant, playfully young Doctor we've all been used to for the last two incarnations, I suspect.

My personal hope... we'll return to something of a Doctor who channels the haughty superiority of the First, while combining it with the assumed arrogance of the Sixth. Mixed up with whatever delightful little eccentricities Capaldi brings to the role.
Title: Re: The Day is Done
Post by: Lore on 29 November 2013, 23:49:26
Question comes to.  Was this change in the timeline, or was this something that had happen and no one know how it really came down?

I don't think it's going to be as complicated as all of that.

Really, I see Moffat still playing the history of the Doctor as it was... with just a freer hand as to what can be explored as we head into the new adventures with the Capaldi-Doctor. The Doctor's history remains intact. It's just more open to exploitation and re-evaluation, now, than it was in the past and pre-The Day of the Doctor period.
Title: Re: Doctor Who Season 8
Post by: DoctorMonkey on 30 November 2013, 03:55:33
Has anyone bp caught any of the mini-episodes on YouTube and things?


So far I've only found one (Clara and the TARDIS) and its great... If a little adult at moments for a "kids show"
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: YingJanshi on 30 November 2013, 09:03:54
I have a question: how do we know the events of "The Day of the Doctor" actually happened, that it wasn't just The Moment/Bad Wolf messing with the War Doctor's head?

I mean its supposed to be the most advanced weapon in the Time Lords arsenal. One that even develops a consience. One that can also see both past and future (re: picking the form of Rose). Maybe it/she was simply trying to convince the War Doctor not to use it.
I mean we don't get any resolution to the Zygons...
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lore on 30 November 2013, 09:17:21
I have a question: how do we know the events of "The Day of the Doctor" actually happened, that it wasn't just The Moment/Bad Wolf messing with the War Doctor's head?

I mean its supposed to be the most advanced weapon in the Time Lords arsenal. One that even develops a consience. One that can also see both past and future (re: picking the form of Rose). Maybe it/she was simply trying to convince the War Doctor not to use it.
I mean we don't get any resolution to the Zygons...

Well, Moffat has repeatedly said that "The Day of the Doctor" was a game-changer for Doctor Who.

I don't see anything being considered so important to the future of the show also then being something that didn't actually happen. Besides, the Doctors "know" about the events after the Moment has been left behind. And we have the Curator's take on what happened as well. "Gallifrey Falls No More" is now part of the Doctor's history. It happened.

The Moment selecting the form of Bad Wolf Rose, I think, was just another way of providing the War Doctor with a glimpse of his post-Time War future.
Title: The Day is Done
Post by: Wrangler on 30 November 2013, 10:52:17
I wonder if they'll ever get into the events the War Doctor got into.  I think its interesting, that he was a young man when he regenerated.  He had many decades of stories to go through.   The actor playing young version of the 8th Doctor/War Doctor.
Title: Re: The Day is Done
Post by: GreenDragon on 30 November 2013, 18:38:12
I wonder if they'll ever get into the events the War Doctor got into.  I think its interesting, that he was a young man when he regenerated.  He had many decades of stories to go through.   The actor playing young version of the 9th Doctor/War Doctor.
War Doctor/Hurt was the Ninth.  McGann was 8.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: I am Belch II on 30 November 2013, 18:53:51
So War Doctor was in between 8 and 9, and was depressed because the homeworld fell. The 9th Doctor was depressed and sad for a good reason. Kinda explains something's.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lore on 30 November 2013, 21:16:49
So War Doctor was in between 8 and 9, and was depressed because the homeworld fell. The 9th Doctor was depressed and sad for a good reason. Kinda explains something's.

It's been regularly affirmed by both showrunners [Davies and Moffat] that the Doctors "after" the Time War -- especially Eccleston's Doctor -- suffered from PTSD, and, most especially, a kind of survivor's guilt.

Which was particularly poignant in "The Day of the Doctor" since we now know that Tennant's Doctor was the Doctor Who Regrets and Smith's Doctor was/is the Doctor Who Forgets. Also notable psychological facets for survivors of terrible conflicts.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Øystein on 01 December 2013, 01:33:43
It's been regularly affirmed by both showrunners [Davies and Moffat] that the Doctors "after" the Time War -- especially Eccleston's Doctor -- suffered from PTSD, and, most especially, a kind of survivor's guilt.

Which was particularly poignant in "The Day of the Doctor" since we now know that Tennant's Doctor was the Doctor Who Regrets and Smith's Doctor was/is the Doctor Who Forgets. Also notable psychological facets for survivors of terrible conflicts.
Makes you wonder what Eccleston's doctor was.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: GreenDragon on 01 December 2013, 04:08:05
The one that hated. 

Dalek: You would have made a good Dalek.

That was the moment he realized what he was becoming.  Hence when he next confronts the Daleks, he chooses the "mouse" option rather than the "man" option.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lore on 01 December 2013, 04:34:35
Makes you wonder what Eccleston's doctor was.

I think GreenDragon's pretty close to the mark here. Eccleston's Doctor was carrying a great deal of hatred toward the Daleks. And hatred at himself, perhaps, too, for what both the Daleks and the Time Lords "made" him do.

It wasn't until Tennant's Doctor that the regret of his actions in the Time War started setting in.

That's how I see it... at least.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: GreenDragon on 01 December 2013, 09:33:29
Rose Tyler can not be discounted in this either.  Eccleston had traveled throughout our history for a considerable period of time - based on images of him Rose found in her research.  As I noted earlier, I suspect this was about cleaning up the aftermath of the Time War - things like the Zygons and the Autons.

But in all that time, and perhaps throughout the entire Time War, the Doctor had been alone.  Rose was his first Companion in centuries.  Having her along to share his adventures, and to give him a reason to visit more pleasant places, allowed him to set aside the pain, guilt, and sorrow, and live again.

Tennant, "her Doctor", was shaped by her influence during his previous life.  Much like Smith was shaped by his encounter with young Amelia.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: mikecj on 01 December 2013, 15:32:54
Makes you wonder what Eccleston's doctor was.

The scarred survivor.  The only survivor (or so he thought until he met that Dalek)
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Stormlion1 on 01 December 2013, 22:30:13
Makes you wonder how much hatred for himself the Doctor is carrying around. He did once have the opportunity to strangle the Daleks in the cradle and decided not to. Opting instead to burying them for a thousand years.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Maskerade on 02 December 2013, 12:22:16
Makes you wonder how much hatred for himself the Doctor is carrying around. He did once have the opportunity to strangle the Daleks in the cradle and decided not to. Opting instead to burying them for a thousand years.

Well, to be fair a) it is a TV show, and it'd be like Batman bumping off the joker- suddenly no more iconic bad guy to play foil to the hero, and the series falters and b) the doctor is very, very old- there may be reasons as yet unexplored that he doesn't jsut destroy them once and for all (though given their history, they'd likely find a way around that minor inconvenience).

I've just had a thought: If the doctor goes back in time and changes his own history (as may or may not have happened in the special), does that not automatically mean that the new history is canon because all of the stuff the Doctor did since had to happen anyway to get to where he is now. Basically what I'm saying is does it matter if the doctor changes the past because nothing in the present will change.

Off-topic for a second, a rather interesting thought occured the other day: If someone went back in time and changed the past, at the point that they did so the future (to them) would be changed too, but someone alive in that future (such as us) wouldn't notice a change, because at the moment the past changes, so does our memory of it.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Atlas3060 on 02 December 2013, 12:45:25
Makes you wonder what Eccleston's doctor was.
Eccleston Doctor: The one who laments
Tennant Doctor: The one who regrets
Smith Doctor: The one who forgets

At least that's how I'll refer to them in my mind.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 02 December 2013, 15:45:41
Eccleston Doctor: The one who laments
Tennant Doctor: The one who regrets
Smith Doctor: The one who forgets

At least that's how I'll refer to them in my mind.

Sounds about right. 


I've just had a thought: If the doctor goes back in time and changes his own history (as may or may not have happened in the special), does that not automatically mean that the new history is canon because all of the stuff the Doctor did since had to happen anyway to get to where he is now. Basically what I'm saying is does it matter if the doctor changes the past because nothing in the present will change.

Not sure.  Way I figure it, though, even after changing his own history and pulling the plan off the way he did, he's still going to see himself as the one that killed the Time Lords and the Daleks simply because he doesn't know if his plan is going to work or not.  Even if he did send Gallifrey into a pocket universe and used the ensuing confusion to let the Daleks wipe themselves off into oblivion, it was still a risky plan because if his calculations were off, he could've wiped Gallifrey and/or the Time Lords out of existence accidently.

(And that would be reason enough to regret ever activating the Moment.  Just my 2 cents, feel free to correct me.)

EDIT:  And I totally forgot that 10 and War basically wouldn't remember a lot of the incident anyways, so it might or might not be a moot point. :p
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: mikecj on 02 December 2013, 21:53:27
So where is the Moment now?  Its not on Gallifrey...
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Wrangler on 02 December 2013, 22:04:02
So where is the Moment now?  Its not on Gallifrey...
If I were the Doctor.  I'd either have forgotten it on the world he left it. Or was smart brought with him on the Tardis.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lore on 02 December 2013, 22:11:42
So where is the Moment now?  Its not on Gallifrey...

Recalling that the Moment is in fact sentient, then I'd probably hazard a guess and say that it's wherever it "wants/needs" to be.

Considering how well it manipulated the Doctor/s, it shouldn't be a problem for the Moment to orchestrate itself to some hidden or unknown location.

...

Until it's needed again.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: mikecj on 02 December 2013, 22:17:30
The Room of Requirement?
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lore on 02 December 2013, 23:23:19
If I'm remembering my classic DW-lore correctly, I think the TARDIS already has a room like that. At least according to the old Target novels.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Wrangler on 02 December 2013, 23:26:01
Are the novels and the radio programs (starring recently Tom Baker) considered canon?
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 03 December 2013, 01:06:29
Doctor Who doesn't exactly have a canon.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: YingJanshi on 03 December 2013, 01:32:08
Not really no. The best way to think of it is to see the show as primary canon and all of the novels/radio plays/comics as the EU. (Like Star Wars.)
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lore on 03 December 2013, 02:07:46
Are the novels and the radio programs (starring recently Tom Baker) considered canon?

I think YingJanshi is on to something with his definition.

...

As for the original Target novels, well, they were mostly just printed mass trade-paperbacks of the scripts for the television episodes of the classic series. If some curious little tidbit of DW lore was mentioned or referenced in the televised series, then it was almost always likely to be mentioned or referenced in the novels produced from those episodes.

I'm not really sure about all the more recent novels -- like, predominantly those featuring the Eighth Doctor -- that were published between 1996 and 2005.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 03 December 2013, 02:59:43
Not really no. The best way to think of it is to see the show as primary canon and all of the novels/radio plays/comics as the EU. (Like Star Wars.)

And even then, there's a lot of conflicting information in the TV show as well - how many times has the Doctor been on Titanic, or visited Atlantis (and it been entirely different each time).  Hell, the show never decided on when the Third Doctor's earthbound stories were set, to the point that they've made fun of it repeatedly since the return!
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Stormlion1 on 03 December 2013, 22:07:18
And even then, there's a lot of conflicting information in the TV show as well - how many times has the Doctor been on Titanic, or visited Atlantis..
OK, I'll bite, how many times has he been on Titanic or Atlantis?
Then again I do remember the Fourth Doctor telling another Time Lord in one Episode when he was looking at a newspaper about the sinking of the Titanic that he had nothing to do with that.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Wrangler on 03 December 2013, 22:12:41
OK, I'll bite, how many times has he been on Titanic or Atlantis?
Then again I do remember the Fourth Doctor telling another Time Lord in one Episode when he was looking at a newspaper about the sinking of the Titanic that he had nothing to do with that.
I'm not sure, i do THINK I  remember seeing photoshopped picture of Nineth Doctor being placed on Titanic.  10th doctor simply ran into the Space version of the Titanic after the christmas special he did with the 5th Doctor.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Stormlion1 on 03 December 2013, 22:48:10
Well by looking it up we get an answer. The Titanic has been visited by the Doctor exactly once.
http://tardis.wikia.com/wiki/RMS_Titanic
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: I am Belch II on 04 December 2013, 02:37:02
There was 400 years between War Doctor and 11th doctor. So a lot could of happen in that time, the 9th Doctor could of done a lot in the amount of time since the TV show.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: gyedid on 04 December 2013, 10:48:23
There was 400 years between War Doctor and 11th doctor. So a lot could of happen in that time, the 9th Doctor could of done a lot in the amount of time since the TV show.

Could be, but the initial impression we got when the reboot started in 2005 was that the Doctor had just regenerated--his looking himself over in the mirror and quipping "could've been worse".  Do we know for sure whether the 9th/10th Doctor had any adventures prior to that appearance?  I'm confused with the numbering now; does the War Doctor now count as the 9th, or is he a "bonus" regeneration outside of the normal sequence?

I also think we shouldn't overthink this...clearly they want the series to go on, so however they get around the regeneration limit, it's quite unlikely Peter Capaldi's Doctor will be the last one.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Stormlion1 on 04 December 2013, 12:01:03
Well he still has a Valeyard phase to go through I think.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Øystein on 04 December 2013, 12:10:08
Well he still has a Valeyard phase to go through I think.
From what I gather, not really, no.

http://tardis.wikia.com/wiki/The_Valeyard

Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: gyedid on 04 December 2013, 22:52:37
From what I gather, not really, no.

http://tardis.wikia.com/wiki/The_Valeyard


I haven't actually seen the episode yet, but wasn't his becoming the Valeyard already prophesied in "The Name of the Doctor" ?

From what I understand, the Doctor himself won't actually become the Valeyard; the Valeyard is more like a distillation of all the dark aspects of his character, with a somewhat tenuous existence.  Perhaps he's some kind of corporealized psychic projection, like the Watcher was for the Fourth Doctor, or like that Time Lord-turned-Tibetan monk had at the end of the Third Doctor's run?

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 05 December 2013, 01:41:01
I haven't actually seen the episode yet, but wasn't his becoming the Valeyard already prophesied in "The Name of the Doctor" ?

Yes, yes it was, from what I recall.

Quote
From what I understand, the Doctor himself won't actually become the Valeyard; the Valeyard is more like a distillation of all the dark aspects of his character, with a somewhat tenuous existence.  Perhaps he's some kind of corporealized psychic projection, like the Watcher was for the Fourth Doctor, or like that Time Lord-turned-Tibetan monk had at the end of the Third Doctor's run?

cheers,

Gabe

Rule 1:  The Doctor lies.   The Master, more so.  :P (Only kidding.)

On a more serious note, I wonder if the Valeyard, on top of being a dark distillation, might've wanted to change the Doctor's history in order to a)avert the (potential) "destruction" of Gallifrey, or b) go ahead and destroy Gallifrey with the Moment.

(OK, tonight's not a good night to drink vodka.  :P  Still, though, before I saw the 50th anniversary episode, I actually wondered if the Valeyard might've been trying to manipulate things so that he could keep himself from destroying Gallifrey.  Course, after watching the 50th, I see that that might not have been the case, but meh.   Like I said, don't ever get me posting when I've had a wee bit too much to drink.)
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: gyedid on 08 December 2013, 09:48:08
What exactly is the relationship between the Moment and the Bad Wolf entity?

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: qc mech3 on 08 December 2013, 12:59:47
Thé Moment took thé image of Bas Wolf from thé Doctor's mine, mot knowing - or caring - it was from thé future.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Lore on 08 December 2013, 22:08:42
What exactly is the relationship between the Moment and the Bad Wolf entity?

cheers,

Gabe

Well, I think that was more about including Rose in the 50th Anniversary Episode, to help celebrate the occasion.

In terms of the story, though, we know The Moment's sentience can "look" into various points of the time/space continuum. So, from the perspective of the War Doctor, The Moment/Rose hybrid was an image for "his" future. Which would facilitate the further glimpses into "his" future later -- when he meets the Tenth and Eleventh Doctors.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Stormlion1 on 08 December 2013, 22:25:30
The moment was confused by using Rose. It picked a form from his history and used that. It even says "I always get confused about that" when trying to explain it. It could have used the form from any of his companions if it had so desired. Which would have been hilarious if it brought one out that was from the first or second Doctor era and had to have people think just who that was.
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: Wrangler on 08 December 2013, 22:39:03
Reading the Tardis.wiki if its to be believed.  Version of Rose the Moment picked was Bad Wolf version of her (http://tardis.wikia.com/wiki/Bad_Wolf_(entity)).  The War Doctor actually says this to the Tenth doctor who is visually surprised by this.

Question is why does the Moment have mind of its own, doesn't it want to be free?   I guess it helping the Doctor(s), the moment doesn't get destroyed.

FYI Becare of the link, wiki one those super-filled ad wikis.
Title: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 10 December 2013, 23:58:17
While waiting for the upcoming Christmas special just thought I'd share some 50th Ann. videos with everyone.

Opening Sequences (1963-2013) (http://youtu.be/XZ1kRxgKft4)

Every Episode of Doctor Who in 15 Minutes (1963-2013) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y1wcfCtqa8Q&feature=youtu.be)

Enjoy! O0
Title: Re: For the 50th
Post by: Lore on 11 December 2013, 02:07:19
I've had that "Opening Sequence" video playing non-stop for the last several hours.

I can't help myself. :D
Title: 'Doctor Who' Christmas Special 2013 Trailer: The Time Of The Doctor
Post by: Lore on 11 December 2013, 21:12:51
It's up on a couple of popular sites, now, so here's one of the links (http://www.geeksofdoom.com/2013/12/11/doctor-who-christmas-special-2013-trailer-the-time-of-the-doctor).

Granted, you can't pick up on too much beside the usual building-hype for Smith's exit, but I found it interesting that the Daleks are noting the Doctor's regeneration either beginning or in progress.

Perhaps he's attacked during his regeneration [kind like what we saw in "The Impossible Astronaut"] and this triggers some kind of strange backlash effect that gives birth to the Capaldi-Doctor? [Assuming, of course, that Moffat still isn't yanking our chains re: his confirmation earlier in the week that Smith's-Doctor is the final incarnation.]
Title: Re: For the 50th
Post by: Stormlion1 on 12 December 2013, 00:50:00
The cool part is i can watch this and remember watching quite a few of those episodes over the years.
Title: Re: 'Doctor Who' Christmas Special 2013 Trailer: The Time Of The Doctor
Post by: Dragon Cat on 12 December 2013, 07:17:20
All I can say is roll on
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 12 December 2013, 10:48:13
(http://static3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110722094236/tardis/images/5/58/Cybermen-series-6.jpg)

The Doctor who threads have been assimilated.  Ignore all other cybernetic lifeforms who use that catchphrase.  Cybermen are superior.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Atlas3060 on 12 December 2013, 11:46:20
They have been upgraded to this thread. This is the superior thread, all others are (robotic voice) "DELETED"  >:D
Title: Re: For the 50th
Post by: Wrangler on 12 December 2013, 18:41:09
I've had that "Opening Sequence" video playing non-stop for the last several hours.

I can't help myself. :D

I actually ended up doing that too when i was waiting for the Day of the Doctor to Come out.  I'm more convince that first 5 doctors' themes are particulary Awesome and compelling visually.  I loved it when 50th episode started with the original doctor's theme.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 12 December 2013, 18:58:29
The Christmas trailers (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njNnTDiLOd4) for the special are rolling out now.   Looks dramatic, I'm baffled why there all after him again.  Not part of the fan club i guess.  :D
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 12 December 2013, 22:05:48
The Christmas trailers (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njNnTDiLOd4) for the special are rolling out now.   Looks dramatic, I'm baffled why there all after him again.  Not part of the fan club i guess.  :D

I'm thinking they might be remnants of the Alliance that tried to take down the Doctor the first time during the whole Pandorica saga.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 12 December 2013, 22:18:53
Personally, i wish they had made an offical animation of the Doctor Who.  Someone made fan one (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kt3qZYUPi2Y) that might well be real thing! 

I can't wait til the offical christmas special does comes out!
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 12 December 2013, 23:24:51
Okay that fan film was entirely too well done.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 13 December 2013, 00:26:54
Personally, i wish they had made an offical animation of the Doctor Who.  Someone made fan one (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kt3qZYUPi2Y) that might well be real thing! 

I can't wait til the offical christmas special does comes out!

Um...actually there have been several animated Doctor Who stories:
Real Time (6th Doctor) (http://www.bbc.co.uk/doctorwho/classic/webcasts/realtime/)
Shada (8th Doctor) (http://www.bbc.co.uk/doctorwho/classic/webcasts/shada/)
The Infinite Quest (10th Doctor) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Infinite_Quest)
Dreamland (10th Doctor) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dreamland_(Doctor_Who))

As well as an unofficial Doctor (well, it was produced before the series returned to the air in 2005).
Scream of the Shalka (http://www.bbc.co.uk/doctorwho/classic/webcasts/shalka/)
Its actually a really good story. The Doctor is voiced by Richard E. Grant. I rather like this Doctor actually. Sad he's been tossed into the void of unofficialdom. :'(
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 13 December 2013, 02:30:53
As well as an unofficial Doctor (well, it was produced before the series returned to the air in 2005).
Scream of the Shalka (http://www.bbc.co.uk/doctorwho/classic/webcasts/shalka/)
Its actually a really good story. The Doctor is voiced by Richard E. Grant. I rather like this Doctor actually. Sad he's been tossed into the void of unofficialdom. :'(

It is indeed sad. But it would also be difficult to explain, now, given that Dr. Walter Simeon (https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ8v5AEdEwlH0Aurh8H3WgEsllG6tDut40oPb5Mu8SposIES9pQT3LgZoQ) bears his likeness.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 13 December 2013, 02:44:03
Doctor Who has a long history of recycling actors though, including two Doctors now.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 13 December 2013, 10:05:41
Doctor Who has a long history of recycling actors though, including two Doctors now.

True.

But I think Simeon's a special case in this regard -- since he seems to have such a prominent place in both the events of Trenzalore and the death of the Doctor.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 21 December 2013, 12:29:00
Mind totally, completely, fully blown...shattered...  :o :o :o :o :o :o

(https://scontent-b-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/q71/1509699_716284998404406_1840268655_n.jpg)

[notworthy][notworthy][notworthy][notworthy][notworthy][notworthy]
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 21 December 2013, 21:13:55
She really would've have made a great incarnation of the Doctor.

Regardless, Donna Noble was one of my all-time favourite companions.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 22 December 2013, 05:28:04
Yeah, I was pleasantly surprised by Donna.  Catherine Tate is best known for an awful (and inexplicably popular) comedy show, so Who fans over here were up in arms when she showed up at the end of series 2.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 22 December 2013, 10:09:22
IMHO she's the best companion of the new series. Certainly the most fun.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 22 December 2013, 14:20:31
So, BBC America are showing a Matt Smith farewell special prior to The Time of the Doctor.  It looks to be their own production rather than a central BBC thing, no word on whether it's going to air in the UK/Ireland yet.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Deadborder on 22 December 2013, 17:00:54
I liked Donna; certainly she was my favourtie of the companions in the amount of New Who I watched before I gave up. She was a fun character and being ful of sass and the like made for a pleasant enough change form the more 'traditional' companion.

Unfortunately, Donna had one draw back. She wasn't Blessed St. Rose of Tyler, whom sunshine shon out of the arse of. As such, her entire run consisted of a) being unfavorably compared to Rose b) playing second fiddle to rose and c) being overlooked until right at the end of the season.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 22 December 2013, 18:22:34
So, BBC America are showing a Matt Smith farewell special prior to The Time of the Doctor.  It looks to be their own production rather than a central BBC thing, no word on whether it's going to air in the UK/Ireland yet.

Which annoys me somewhat.  None of the other Doctors got such a production for their farewells as far as I can find.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 22 December 2013, 18:23:34
Well, it was during Matt Smith's run that the show really broke through in the US.  I can understand why they'd do it.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ANS Kamas P81 on 22 December 2013, 18:51:16
On the topic of the Doctors regenerating...did anyone else catch that little "I don't want to go" again from Tennant as he's leaving in the end of Day of the Doctor?  Talk about a heartstring puller.

Can't wait for Christmas.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Stormlion1 on 22 December 2013, 19:23:06
Well, it was during Matt Smith's run that the show really broke through in the US.  I can understand why they'd do it.

I'm guessing you weren't here for the early run back in the 80's? Plenty of us did watch that you know, even if it was before Cable. I still enjoy the Tom Baker Years and consider him the best Doctor of them all.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 22 December 2013, 19:32:49
I live in Ireland, but I'm fully aware of the popularity of Doctor Who on PBS in the 70s and 80s.  From what I understand, the show's gone from cult hit to minor phenomenon in the last couple of years though.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 22 December 2013, 20:21:12
Quite possible but I know I watched Doctor Who on Sci Fi with Eccleston and Tennant before Smith came along.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Stormlion1 on 22 December 2013, 20:40:15
Someone once told me that a persons first Doctor is usually there favorite Doctor.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 22 December 2013, 21:04:42
Someone once told me that a persons first Doctor is usually there favorite Doctor.

He was certainly unique, the actor certainly put his energy into the scripts they came up for him.  Its too bad his health didn't last.  I wish the bio pic they did about him would had inspired have those actors possibly make lost episodes were missing.  I know they tried, but it wasn't in the cards.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 22 December 2013, 21:11:30
On the topic of the Doctors regenerating...did anyone else catch that little "I don't want to go" again from Tennant as he's leaving in the end of Day of the Doctor?  Talk about a heartstring puller.

Yes. And Matt Smith's "He always says that" reply. O0
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ANS Kamas P81 on 23 December 2013, 00:29:09
Someone once told me that a persons first Doctor is usually there favorite Doctor.
Tom Baker.  Reruns on the Sci Fi Channel, waaaaaay the hell back in the day.  Back when there were only seven Doctors...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: DoctorMonkey on 23 December 2013, 01:54:58
Someone once told me that a persons first Doctor is usually there favorite Doctor.


My first was, I suppose, Sylvester McCoy but my favourite is David Tennant (even if I can't stand Donna)


That my Mum got asked out by another (and said no) before either he was The Doctor or I was around is a different story...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: StCptMara on 23 December 2013, 04:24:05
I am really hoping that Capaldi a) is a great Doctor and b) lasts more then just one season. I have heard it mentioned
that he is only signed up for one season now, and I hope that is just that Moffat is handing it off to another person,
and the contracts for more have not been signed. I just don't like the Doctor being a short run...It makes the Regenerations
seem trivial, you know?

Then again, I kind of feel like Smith's run is too short. However, I am looking forward to seeing what Capaldi's Doctor is
going to be like.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 23 December 2013, 04:33:59
It's likely Capaldi's signed for one year to test the waters, and will be offered a longer contract (and pay negotiations) depending on how well his first one does.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Øystein on 23 December 2013, 05:19:52
The problem with Capaldi is that he is relatively well known, and as such it will be limited how long he'll stick with Dr Who I think.

I would love to have a new 7 year run as a doctor, but I think that is a thing of the past unfortunately.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 23 December 2013, 06:26:49
Well, it was during Matt Smith's run that the show really broke through in the US.  I can understand why they'd do it.

Nah, show hit cult status here back in the Tennant era.   Matt Smaith basically picked up where David left off.

Heck, ask someone to picture Doctor who anymor, they'll either pjcture spikey haired guy in suit (the Tennant look)  or guy in long coat, wide hat and long multicolored scarf ( Tom Baker look). 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 23 December 2013, 08:03:54
Someone once told me that a persons first Doctor is usually there favorite Doctor.
I don't recall which Doctor I started with, but shortly after I started watching PBS started running all the episodes they had starting from Unearthly Child.  A couple months of Hartnell, a few weeks of Troughton, and a lot of Pertwee.  I loved Pertwee.  More so than Tom and Davison.  Hated Colin, and while I liked McCoy, I hated everything else about his era of the show - starting with JNT.
I particularly loved how the earlier shows would have to work to make up for the lack of budget.  I made for better stories in many cases.  Cheap CGI has spoiled the new show.  I enjoy it, and its frequently good.  But actors running from green screens don't emote like actors running from the Shakey's Chicken Man.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: StCptMara on 23 December 2013, 08:37:27
You know..thanks to the lead-up to the 50th, I finally got to see Hartnell. Though it was only
the Aztec Storyline, I came away....wishing for more Doctors like him, and less of the running,
 etc we see in the modern era. Too bad Moffat wouldn't be able to write that :(
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 23 December 2013, 16:55:56
So, BBC America are showing a Matt Smith farewell special prior to The Time of the Doctor.  It looks to be their own production rather than a central BBC thing, no word on whether it's going to air in the UK/Ireland yet.

It will be included in the DVD for "The Time of the Doctor" from what I read on the 50th anniversary website...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 24 December 2013, 21:14:16
A Timelord Christmas (http://tennantnews.blogspot.com/2013/12/video-doctor-puppet-time-lord-christmas.html)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 24 December 2013, 22:12:15
"Rudolph the Red Nose Reindeer had a very shiny nose.  It proved to be a tactical disadvantage, but enabled me to punch him in the dark!"

(Sorry, now thinking of Strax and his "Christmas Carols." :D )
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 24 December 2013, 23:24:54
"I wants it! I wants it! My precious..."

So, just discovered that you can buy a BBC licensed, full scale replica (with working lights) of a Dalek. Over ₤3000 but still....
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 25 December 2013, 00:23:12
Mwuahahahahahaha.

Sorry.  Just thinking about what I could do with such a thing for Halloween.

Kids: Trick or treat!

Dalek: EXTERMINATE!
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 25 December 2013, 08:40:26
Less than 12.5 hours to go to "The Time of the Doctor"...gives me some time review my new Whoology and Treasures from the First 50 Years: The Vault books...could watch my new DVD's ("The Movie" (with Paul McGann), "The Snowmen" and "The Day of the Doctor", but I watched "The Snowmen" last night, and TDotD back on Sunday or Monday, and will see it again tonight before the special comes on)...and if nothing else, I can relieve stress with my new Adipose Stress Toy while watching the hours count down on my new Doctor Who clock...

If only I had thought to bring my new TARDIS coffee mug back home with me instead of leaving it at work after some co-workers gave it to me...

 8)

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 25 December 2013, 09:13:23
Less than 12.5 hours to go to "The Time of the Doctor"...gives me some time review my new Whoology and Treasures from the First 50 Years: The Vault books...could watch my new DVD's ("The Movie" (with Paul McGann), "The Snowmen" and "The Day of the Doctor", but I watched "The Snowmen" last night, and TDotD back on Sunday or Monday, and will see it again tonight before the special comes on)...and if nothing else, I can relieve stress with my new Adipose Stress Toy while watching the hours count down on my new Doctor Who clock...

I got a copy of The Vault as well today.

It's an awesome tome full of curious tidbits about the development of the Whoverse over the last 50 years. Definitely a worthwhile purchase... even for the casual DW fan.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 25 December 2013, 16:32:14
SPOILERS below!

I enjoyed it overall, there were a few things that rankled a bit - like having this epic battle happen mainly off-screen (but like the Time War, you can't show it without it being a disappointment somehow), but yeah, a good send-off and a great way to show Matt Smith's range as The Doctor. Loved how they worked his hair into the episode too.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 25 December 2013, 18:13:32
I got a copy of The Vault as well today.

It's an awesome tome full of curious tidbits about the development of the Whoverse over the last 50 years. Definitely a worthwhile purchase... even for the casual DW fan.

I think I'm actually enjoying Whoology more though...lots of tidbits in this too, and information about various incarnations of the Doctor, his companions, etc....

And loving the fact that BBCAmerica played "The Night of the Doctor" prior to "The Day of the Doctor" just now...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 25 December 2013, 22:29:30
I've still got to pick up a copy of that one.

It's been hard to find here.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 25 December 2013, 22:29:55
SPOILERS below!

I enjoyed it overall, there were a few things that rankled a bit - like having this epic battle happen mainly off-screen (but like the Time War, you can't show it without it being a disappointment somehow), but yeah, a good send-off and a great way to show Matt Smith's range as The Doctor. Loved how they worked his hair into the episode too.

Mostly agreed...I actually liked the amount of the battle that they included though...and the switch to Capaldi was a bit sudden at the end, wasn't it?


Also kind of liked the fact that Matt's final words held everything that it would mean for an actor who had truly enjoyed being the Doctor for a time...although I believe Tennant's "I don't want to go!" said as much in far fewer words...

Oh and...he's complaining about the color of his kidneys? Interesting choice, eh?

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 25 December 2013, 22:32:18
I've still got to pick up a copy of that one.

It's been hard to find here.

It's a quick read though...I'm almost 300 pages into now...and that's with my attention going elsewhere during much of the day while reviewing it...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: StCptMara on 25 December 2013, 22:42:41
There is a good question, mind you.

"A new regeneration cycle": was that just that he was regenerating, or that he has a new set
of Regenerations?


Also...

Capaldi's first words as the Doctor, asking Oswin if she knew how to fly the TARDIS...Is that
just his brain still cooking, or does it mean that he has actually forgotten?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 25 December 2013, 22:48:44
There is a good question, mind you.

"A new regeneration cycle": was that just that he was regenerating, or that he has a new set
of Regenerations?


Also...

Capaldi's first words as the Doctor, asking Oswin if she knew how to fly the TARDIS...Is that
just his brain still cooking, or does it mean that he has actually forgotten?


As to the first:

Would be far easier for the producers and such if it is a complete set of regenerations...that way they do not have to worry about the possibility of a sudden decision of a particular actor (or, heaven forbid, accidental injury or death) mean they have no way to change the character


As to the last:

Good question...I'm assuming the former, but it would almost be funnier if it was the latter...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: bytor on 25 December 2013, 23:05:56
As to the first:

Would be far easier for the producers and such if it is a complete set of regenerations...that way they do not have to worry about the possibility of a sudden decision of a particular actor (or, heaven forbid, accidental injury or death) mean they have no way to change the character


As to the last:

Good question...I'm assuming the former, but it would almost be funnier if it was the latter...

Ruger

My take on that: each regeneration seems to be a bit different with regards to aftereffects, the 10th pretty much went into a coma, the 8th had no idea who he was, the 11th couldn't figure out what kind of food he liked.......most likely a temporary condition for the 12th

I enjoyed the Special, though I need to watch it again at some point as watching TV on Christmas is a challenge with excited children running about lol
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wombat on 25 December 2013, 23:10:46
The one question is did the Time Lords on the other side of the crack simply give him one-more regeneration or did they reboot his entire life?

And yes, Capoldi was a bit sudden.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 25 December 2013, 23:32:47
Capaldi may have been sudden, but Matt Smith seemed like he dragged rhe scene out a bit much
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ANS Kamas P81 on 25 December 2013, 23:46:13
Capaldi may have been sudden, but Matt Smith seemed like he dragged rhe scene out a bit much
Using Matrix: Revolutions as a basis point, how many Trinities are we talking here?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 26 December 2013, 00:08:34
There is a good question, mind you.

"A new regeneration cycle": was that just that he was regenerating, or that he has a new set
of Regenerations?


Also...

Capaldi's first words as the Doctor, asking Oswin if she knew how to fly the TARDIS...Is that
just his brain still cooking, or does it mean that he has actually forgotten?


[River]Spoilers[/River]
From my understanding of the first question, I think I saw somewhere that it was a completely new set of regenerations, but I could be mistaken.  As for the second one, well, the Doctor has been known to act a little wonky when he regenerates, and since he got at least one new regeneration out of it, if not a complete cycle reboot, it wouldn't be completely out of character for him to have a massive brain fart for a couple of hours.  Oh, we saw the glow, the camera cut to Clara, then 12 showed up(at least that's what I saw).  That was a very quick regeneration.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Scotty on 26 December 2013, 00:17:41
There was a throwaway line in the 50th Anniversary Special by the Curator that could shed some light on this.  He mentions, in sequence, that when the Doctor speaks on retiring to be the Curator, "You might", and when speaking about never forgetting faces, "You may find yourself revisiting some of them again."

That speaks to me of a new set of regenerations, where the Doctor chooses to go back to the looks of previous regenerations.  Quite a nice way to give former Doctors who want to return some more screen time.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: bytor on 26 December 2013, 00:18:09
[River]Spoilers[/River]
From my understanding of the first question, I think I saw somewhere that it was a completely new set of regenerations, but I could be mistaken.  As for the second one, well, the Doctor has been known to act a little wonky when he regenerates, and since he got at least one new regeneration out of it, if not a complete cycle reboot, it wouldn't be completely out of character for him to have a massive brain fart for a couple of hours.  Oh, we saw the glow, the camera cut to Clara, then 12 showed up(at least that's what I saw).  That was a very quick regeneration.

I thought it was actually a pretty long regeneration.  He went from very old 11, to young 11, to 12 over the course of a few scenes. Then again, I never thought of the process as something that was consistent in the first place, so I wasn't surprised that it was changed up.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Scotty on 26 December 2013, 00:29:55
Also, did anyone else catch the Dalek tank?  http://i1.cdnds.net/13/50/618x411/uktv-doctor-who-time-of-the-doctor-xmas-special-16.jpg
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 26 December 2013, 05:19:50
As much as I was ready to see her leave - long before she did - I loved Amy's cameo.  Nice way to recap Matt's tenure.

The Council of Gallifrey granted the Master a second Regeneration Cycle for his efforts on their behalf.  since his madness, and all his crimes were Rassilon's fault, it was the least they could do for the man who they gave the task of saving them.  Since the Doctor worked his entire life to save Gallifrey, and succeeded, they owed him.

The origin of the rip in time that lead to the destruction of the TARDIS is revealed.  Finally.

Clara didn't know anything about computers.  And apparently she has never seen the Moon Landing.  Being as how she didn't have the memory of the Silence recommending that they be exterminated.

Anyone feel that Clara's Grandmother met the Doctor as a young woman?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ANS Kamas P81 on 26 December 2013, 06:18:50
As much as I was ready to see her leave - long before she did - I loved Amy's cameo.  Nice way to recap Matt's tenure.


Clara didn't know anything about computers.  And apparently she has never seen the Moon Landing.  Being as how she didn't have the memory of the Silence recommending that they be exterminated.
Agreed re: cameo.  Really a heartstringer.  As for the Silence, I imagine the Papal Database had something to do with that - you notice they're now the perfect Confessor and fighting alongside the Doctor.  Ah well...there goes my one horrible thought.  "How do you know the genocide of the Silence is real?  Wouldn't all the bodies be lying everywhere as they're killed off?"  "Absolutely.  Haven't you ever stumbled over something, looked back, and then didn't see anything there?"
Quote
Anyone feel that Clara's Grandmother met the Doctor as a young woman?
Nah, that would be pushing things too far - she was a woman smitten in love, and her description of that beautiful man of Clara's grandfather was simply something that resonated in Clara's heart.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 26 December 2013, 07:40:06
There is a good question, mind you.

"A new regeneration cycle": was that just that he was regenerating, or that he has a new set
of Regenerations?


Also...

Capaldi's first words as the Doctor, asking Oswin if she knew how to fly the TARDIS...Is that
just his brain still cooking, or does it mean that he has actually forgotten?


I agree with Ruger. This is more than likely an example of the Doctor's body still "cooking" after his regeneration. We know memory-lapses are a temporary condition after a regeneration. So this could simply be another instance of that.

Interestingly enough, it could also be a hook -- and an unexpected consequence of being granted a new regeneration cycle. Permanent memory lapses means he'll have to relearn some crucial stuff.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 26 December 2013, 07:44:35
The one question is did the Time Lords on the other side of the crack simply give him one-more regeneration or did they reboot his entire life?

And yes, Capoldi was a bit sudden.

I'm thinking that the Time Lords granted the Doctor a complete new cycle of regenerations. Similar to that granted to the Master.

My reason for thinking this is due to the fact that Moffat loves dropping hints about future events in the dialogues of certain characters. Did anyone else hear the reference to the plot of "The Five Doctors?" Matt's Doctor specifically mentions he has the Great Seal of Gallifrey 'taken from the Master in the Death Zone.'

I don't think it's a coincidence that Moffat directly referenced either the Master nor the events of "The Five Doctors." He's laying the groundwork for something focusing on a new regeneration cycle for the Doctor, I'd wager.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: StCptMara on 26 December 2013, 09:11:33
So, I was thinking....

Matt Smith's Doctor does get a sort of special distinction. Only his, the War Doctor, and Hartnell's Doctors
have gotten to die of old age. Do we know if this is common among other Time Lords? And...should we see this
as something special? Or a rare instance for The Doctor of him getting to do what Time Lords normally do?


Also, was it ever explained how Regenerations work? As in: why Time Lords can Regenerate? Is it their mastery of
time? Is it a racial thing? What?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Drop Bear on 26 December 2013, 09:44:54
Anyone feel that Clara's Grandmother met the Doctor as a young woman?

Well there is always a Clara Oswin Oswald around for the Doctor, perhaps she was the one for mid 20th century earth?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 26 December 2013, 10:08:11
So, I was thinking....

Matt Smith's Doctor does get a sort of special distinction. Only his, the War Doctor, and Hartnell's Doctors
have gotten to die of old age. Do we know if this is common among other Time Lords? And...should we see this
as something special? Or a rare instance for The Doctor of him getting to do what Time Lords normally do?


Also, was it ever explained how Regenerations work? As in: why Time Lords can Regenerate? Is it their mastery of
time? Is it a racial thing? What?

It was explained as part of the River Song story arc that regeneration was a consequence of living near the Time Vortex.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 26 December 2013, 10:12:09
So, I was thinking....

Matt Smith's Doctor does get a sort of special distinction. Only his, the War Doctor, and Hartnell's Doctors
have gotten to die of old age. Do we know if this is common among other Time Lords? And...should we see this
as something special? Or a rare instance for The Doctor of him getting to do what Time Lords normally do?


Also, was it ever explained how Regenerations work? As in: why Time Lords can Regenerate? Is it their mastery of
time? Is it a racial thing? What?

To answer your last question first, it was exposure to the Time Vortex over many centuries...this is what gave River Song the ability to regenerate, as she was conceived inside the TARDIS while she was in the Time Vortex...

As to your other questions: I think this is what most normal Time Lords get to do...use a regeneration up to its natural lifespan, barring accident or other action...however, it does appear to me that Matt Smith's Doctor lived far longer than all the other Doctors, even those who lived to their body's old age...the first Doctor would have been only a few hundred years old (450 or less), as the Second Doctor tells Victoria that he is around 450 years old in "The Tomb of the Cybermen"...of course, maybe the First Doctor started counting his "age as the Doctor" separate from his actual age, so let's give him another couple centuries on top of that, so around 650 years total maybe?...this can still work with the ages given during his time as the 4th Doctor (749 in "The Brain of Morbius", 750 in "The Robots of Death" and 756 or 759 in "The Ribos Operation"), as he would have spent basically the time shown on the show as the Third Doctor (he was exiled to Earth, and was a member of Unit during most of this time, so a decade or less in that body...this would also give him a few extra years to age visibly as the Second Doctor (reference "The Two Doctors") during his time working with Gallifrey's CIA during the seasons 6b period... (of course, this may be actually a later incarnation Doctor revisiting this old favorite form, and picking Jamie back up for some fun even later in life, eh?  ;) )...the Colin Baker Doctor indicates he is 900 years old during "The Revelation of the Daleks", which can also be ok to the above, and Sylvestor McCoy's Doctor is supposed to be 953 during "The Time and the Rani"...he also visibly aged between "Survival" and "The Doctor Who Movie", so he was likely in this body for at least 3 or 4 centuries before losing it...

We do not know how long the War Doctor lived in that incarnation, only that it went from young (almost teenaged?) to old in his time in that incarnation, so likely several hundred years (I still think the Doctor re-started counting his age when this change was made, so let's say that he also lived another 650 or so years in this incarnation, with Eccleston's Doctor known to have had many adventures before meeting Rose, so that would give him 200 years or so in that body to get to the 900 he claimed in "Aliens of London")...then Tennant's Doctor basically aged a year for each of his seasons...then we know that Matt Smith's Doctor aged from 906 (when he was "born" to 1200+ years old by the time of "A Town Called Mercy" (approximately 300 years with no apparent aging of the body)...and then another 300 years  on Trenzalore before Clara rejoins him for the first time, and we see visible lines on his face, greying of his hair, and he has to walk with a cane...this is followed by another unstated amount of time that ages him to near death before he gets the regeneration...maybe it was only a few decades (which would "match" the above), or it could have been even more centuries...

Still, at the time he finally regenerated, I'm betting the Doctor was actually on the order of 2500 years old or more, not just the 1500+ that might be claimed otherwise...

Of course, thinking about this, this means we have the following:

First Doctor: died of old age at 400 to 600 or so years old
Second Doctor: forcibly regenerated by the Time Lords, likely after spending a few decades in the body, or maybe centuries...
Third Doctor: Only a few years in this body before having to regenerate
Fourth Doctor: At least a century or three in this body
Fifth Doctor: Likely only a decade or so at most in this body, due to the lack of aging of his nearly constant companions during this body's tenure...then again, there was Time Crash?!?!?!?!?
Sixth Doctor: Same issues here as in the Fifth Doctor's
Seventh Doctor: Unknown, but long enough to visibly age, so at least 350 years?
Eighth Doctor: Unknown, but again, long enough to visibly age, so at least 350 years?
War Doctor: died of old age, so 400 to 600 years old or so
Ninth Doctor: Unknown, but possibly 200 or 300 years old at regeneration?
Tenth Doctor, version A: 3 years or so
Tenth Doctor, version B: 1 year, maybe a little more
Eleventh Doctor: 600+ years old at the time of his regeneration

So, out of all of them, the 1st, War and 11th Doctors lived the longest, with possibly the 2nd and 9th, and (more likely) the 4th, 7th and 8th having spent a few centuries in these bodies, and the 3rd, 5th, 6th and 10a and 10b bodies likely having only a few years to them...

Of course, if a Time Lord can live 600 years minimum per body, that means their total normal lifespan would be 7800 years!!!


Thoughts?

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ColonelCody on 26 December 2013, 10:45:58
I'm thinking this is a whole new set of Regenerations. They needed an 'Out' to do this sort of thing. But we will not really see the results of it until the next Doctor is chosen will we? :). Hopefully not for a few years at least.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 26 December 2013, 11:43:22
I'm thinking this is a whole new set of Regenerations.

The Doctor does say "A whole new regeneration cycle" takes a bit of breaking in, which is why he reset to the younger version of 11 first...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 26 December 2013, 12:59:42
Clara's gran did meet the Doctor before, sort of - the actress was in The Ribos Operation.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Pat Payne on 26 December 2013, 13:14:18
There is a good question, mind you.

Capaldi's first words as the Doctor, asking Oswin if she knew how to fly the TARDIS...Is that
just his brain still cooking, or does it mean that he has actually forgotten?


Over on TV tropes the theory is that 11 had been away from the TARDIS console so long that he forgot how to fly it.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: qc mech3 on 26 December 2013, 20:25:39
I did like the recall of the Pond's theme "Silence will fall when the question is asked"
 :)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: MrJake on 26 December 2013, 21:49:08
So, technically, The Doctor's longest "serving" companion was a robot head!  ;D
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ColonelCody on 26 December 2013, 22:13:16
So, technically, The Doctor's longest "serving" companion was a robot head!  ;D
I think K9 still stands as his longest serving self-mobile, (at least) semi-sentient companion. And his Granddaughter would be his oldest, possibly Romana since they were both Time Lords.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 26 December 2013, 22:25:44
the Colin Baker Doctor indicates he is 900 years old during "The Revelation of the Daleks", which can also be ok to the above, and Sylvestor McCoy's Doctor is supposed to be 953 during "The Time and the Rani"...he also visibly aged between "Survival" and "The Doctor Who Movie", so he was likely in this body for at least 3 or 4 centuries before losing it...






Ruger

Ok, this brings up a problem, because Matt Smith's Doctor said he was 900 in the Impossible Astronaut.  So somehow he lost years.

Or Moffat just doesn't know what the word 'continuity' means
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ColonelCody on 26 December 2013, 22:28:52
Ok, this brings up a problem, because Matt Smith's Doctor said he was 900 in the Impossible Astronaut.  So somehow he lost years.

Or Moffat just doesn't know what the word 'continuity means'
This isn't CONTINUITY!!!! THIS IS THE DOCTOR!!!!!! <<kicks you into the Vortex of Time>>
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 26 December 2013, 22:36:19
First Doctor: died of old age at 400 to 600 or so years old
Second Doctor: forcibly regenerated by the Time Lords, likely after spending a few decades in the body, or maybe centuries...
Third Doctor: Only a few years in this body before having to regenerate
Fourth Doctor: At least a century or three in this body
Fifth Doctor: Likely only a decade or so at most in this body, due to the lack of aging of his nearly constant companions during this body's tenure...then again, there was Time Crash?!?!?!?!?
Sixth Doctor: Same issues here as in the Fifth Doctor's
Seventh Doctor: Unknown, but long enough to visibly age, so at least 350 years?
Eighth Doctor: Unknown, but again, long enough to visibly age, so at least 350 years?
War Doctor: died of old age, so 400 to 600 years old or so
Ninth Doctor: Unknown, but possibly 200 or 300 years old at regeneration?
Tenth Doctor, version A: 3 years or so
Tenth Doctor, version B: 1 year, maybe a little more
Eleventh Doctor: 600+ years old at the time of his regeneration

So, out of all of them, the 1st, War and 11th Doctors lived the longest, with possibly the 2nd and 9th, and (more likely) the 4th, 7th and 8th having spent a few centuries in these bodies, and the 3rd, 5th, 6th and 10a and 10b bodies likely having only a few years to them...

Of course, if a Time Lord can live 600 years minimum per body, that means their total normal lifespan would be 7800 years!!!


Looking at it like this, it's become easier to see how the Doctor has lost track of his actual age over all his incarnations over the years. Living centuries in each incarnation can take it's toll on the mind -- even one as expansive as a Time Lord's.

And we really still don't know the full extent of his experiences in the Time War upon his "collective" mind. We know only a little about his PTSD in the form of the Ninth Doctor. So I don't think we can discount the centuries [or, possibly, even millennia] he might have lived in different time periods throughout the Time War. Who can say what cumulative effect this may have had on his aging?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: mathesont on 26 December 2013, 23:38:29
And we cannot forget the Doctor lies.  Him stating his age maybe canon but it need not be the truth.

Was unimpressed by the Christmas Special, good send off for Smith (finally) and got the regeneration issue resolved for the next dozen doctors but otherwise I found it quite blah.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 27 December 2013, 00:16:07
The only complaint I have with "The Time of the Doctor" was the suddenness of Matt's Doctor regeneration.

We're all used to seeing the explosion of yellow regeneration energy from the Doctor's body -- and then seeing the Doctor's face change slowly into the new visage. That didn't happen this time around.

Though, I can understand why Moffat probably scripted the rapid change instead. Switching from Matt's youthful face to that of Capaldi's aged look might not have sat well with the DW fans who aren't all that familiar or used to seeing a young Doctor's face suddenly becoming old again -- like the Sixth's transition to the Seventh, for example, in the classic series.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ColonelCody on 27 December 2013, 00:24:08
And we cannot forget the Doctor lies.  Him stating his age maybe canon but it need not be the truth.

Was unimpressed by the Christmas Special, good send off for Smith (finally) and got the regeneration issue resolved for the next dozen doctors but otherwise I found it quite blah.
My grandmother was 39 for 58 years....
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ANS Kamas P81 on 27 December 2013, 00:26:48
We're all used to seeing the explosion of yellow regeneration energy from the Doctor's body -- and then seeing the Doctor's face change slowly into the new visage. That didn't happen this time around.
Uh...what do you think was happening at the bell tower?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 27 December 2013, 01:21:41
Okay a few things:

Personally I found this one a much better story than the 50th. Maybe because it was one story, not two (or three) trying to be one.

As for the regeneration, its was actually a rather long one as has been said before. It started on the bell tower (when he blasted the Daleks), then de-aged him, before finally jumping to the new body. And yes, it is most likely just post-regeneration "teething" problems. And honestly I found the way he got his regenerations rather cheap. But whatever. At least we get more Who.

I do have one question still: How does this all square with "The End of Time"? I mean according to that, the Moment locked the Time War with Gallifrey at the heart of it (because the Time Lords were going to destroy all of creation). Then in "The Day of the Doctor" it states that the Moment blew up Gallifrey. Except it doesn't because the Doctor puts Gallifrey in a pocket universe. Sooo...did the Master pull Gallifrey out of the pocket universe? How did Rassilon send back the drumbeats to the Master if he was in another universe? Are the Time Lords still planning to destroy the universe even after the Doctor put them in the pocket universe? (Suppose not, since they did give him a new set.) I did notice that when the Doctor finds out that Gallifrey is on the other side of the crack he does make a small reference to the Time Lords and the Master.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 27 December 2013, 01:34:01
Uh...what do you think was happening at the bell tower?

Just to clarify... I'm referring to the actual scene where you see the Doctor's face change -- between the current incarnation and that of the new. We didn't see that this time around. Matt's Doctor just flipped his head backwards and when he came back up, he was the Capaldi Doctor.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 27 December 2013, 01:40:26
I do have one question still: How does this all square with "The End of Time"? I mean according to that, the Moment locked the Time War with Gallifrey at the heart of it (because the Time Lords were going to destroy all of creation). Then in "The Day of the Doctor" it states that the Moment blew up Gallifrey. Except it doesn't because the Doctor puts Gallifrey in a pocket universe. Sooo...did the Master pull Gallifrey out of the pocket universe? How did Rassilon send back the drumbeats to the Master if he was in another universe? Are the Time Lords still planning to destroy the universe even after the Doctor put them in the pocket universe? (Suppose not, since they did give him a new set.) I did notice that when the Doctor finds out that Gallifrey is on the other side of the crack he does make a small reference to the Time Lords and the Master.

I don't think there's an easier answer for this. It's something Moffat obviously intends to work out in the Capaldi-era. At least according to his more recent interviews.

A lot about the fate of the Time Lords, the location of Gallifrey, and the curious status of the Daleks, now, remains to be revealed. [Re: the Daleks... I'm wondering where the 'pure' Daleks are in all of this? We've seen them several times since "Victory of the Daleks" but I'm a little disappointed that they haven't had much play from that story onwards. We seem to keep falling back to the "Time War"-era Dalek forms.]
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 27 December 2013, 02:01:01
I don't think there's an easier answer for this. It's something Moffat obviously intends to work out in the Capaldi-era. At least according to his more recent interviews.

A lot about the fate of the Time Lords, the location of Gallifrey, and the curious status of the Daleks, now, remains to be revealed. [Re: the Daleks... I'm wondering where the 'pure' Daleks are in all of this? We've seen them several times since "Victory of the Daleks" but I'm a little disappointed that they haven't had much play from that story onwards. We seem to keep falling back to the "Time War"-era Dalek forms.]

Now probably completely off base here, but as far as those Daleks are concerned, it may be due to fan backlash. Personally I really loved that redesign. Wasn't sure of the colors at first, but the design itself is pretty imposing. But seem to be in the minority of the fandom.
Then again, it could be money. Those may be significantly more expensive to make.
But I do agree it would be cool to see those again.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 27 December 2013, 05:02:55


We're all used to seeing the explosion of yellow regeneration energy from the Doctor's body -- and then seeing the Doctor's face change slowly into the new visage. That didn't happen this time around.

I'm not, though that's probably because I've seen Tom, Peter, and Colin* regenerate.  But I understand what you're getting at.(To clarify, I've seen the face changes and the energy, but not in the yellow form.  More like a white light.  But I understand what Lore's getting at.  We're use to seeing the change blatantly.)






*OK, technically it was Sylvester regenerating into himself, but you know what I mean.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 27 December 2013, 07:46:54
Well, i finally saw the new XMas special.  I noticed as the Doctor got older, his wardrobe began to look like older Doctors.  Namely when Clara showed up the 1st time in Christmas town, he looked like he was waring very wornout Doctor #3's purple outfit, though it has bit rinestones on it.  In the end when Matt was really old, he sort reminded me of Doctor #1.  As for the story goes, it was nice.  I did like #50th anniversity for the story, not necessary because any one character. (I did like David Tennent doctor, he bit more daff and pulls off better.  I'll admit i have watch much of Matt Smith's doctor since he came on to the scene.  I have to say he acting is impressive.  Xmas special did show things off his abilities as a actor.  I'm bit surprised he leaving so soo since he pretty darn young.  I guess you get restless after awhile.  Question:  Head of the Church, jabbers like she was a companion to the Doctor at one point. My Doctor's lore is bit rusty, was she #4's doctor since she was timelord and could regenerate like her?  She said she died several times before Dalerks implanted her with that mini-Darlek in her.  She dead now offically?

Is there chance River is going make another appearance or is her story arch done?  Least the doctor doesn't look too young to be married to her now.  #P
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Pa Weasley on 27 December 2013, 09:01:38
Honestly? Tasha seemed awfully River-ish to both my wife and I. Her ... lets say playfulness toward the Doctor. The slap. Eleven's comment about spending a lifetime fighting the psychopath inside. And lets face it, River would totally make herself the head of a religion. ;D I've been playing with some ideas on how it would work. None of them perfect of course. Even if that's not the case, I don't think we're done with River.

Edit: And that's ignoring the fact that Tasha FLEW THE FREAKING TARDIS! And indicated that it was not the first time.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 27 December 2013, 09:19:57
I'm not, though that's probably because I've seen Tom, Peter, and Colin* regenerate.  But I understand what you're getting at.(To clarify, I've seen the face changes and the energy, but not in the yellow form.  More like a white light.  But I understand what Lore's getting at.  We're use to seeing the change blatantly.)

Yeah. Funny thing about the Doctor's regenerations in the classic series... is that the actual transformations were often a little different each time.

I think the Fourth and Fifth Doctor's changes were the best. The First and Third were kind of sudden and rapid like what we've seen with Matt's Doctor's change into the Capaldi Doctor. The Second Doctor's regeneration we didn't actually see fully. The Sixth's was something like the Fifth's change. The Seventh Doctor's change was a nod back to the old regenerations of the earlier Doctors. The Eighth Doctor seems to have started the process of the yellow-energy regeneration explosion/change. [Though I'm inclined to wonder whether this might have been a result of Karn science and the concoction the Eighth Doctor consumed to bring about his change. Mayhap it altered his biology/physiology somewhat?] And, finally, we now know the War Doctor's change was very much like that of the Eighth's, Ninth's, Tenth's, and Eleventh's. [Though, again, I'm forced to wonder why the Tenth's regeneration was so explosively damaging to the surrounding environment. Personal theory... I think the Tenth Doctor tried his utmost to hold back his regeneration until it forcibly exploded in retaliation against his attempts to delay it.]
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Pa Weasley on 27 December 2013, 11:28:10
I always took the destructiveness of Ten's regeneration as being caused by him expelling the massive amount of radiation his body absorbed.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ColonelCody on 27 December 2013, 11:40:26
Honestly? Tasha seemed awfully River-ish to both my wife and I. Her ... lets say playfulness toward the Doctor. The slap. Eleven's comment about spending a lifetime fighting the psychopath inside. And lets face it, River would totally make herself the head of a religion. ;D I've been playing with some ideas on how it would work. None of them perfect of course. Even if that's not the case, I don't think we're done with River.

Edit: And that's ignoring the fact that Tasha FLEW THE FREAKING TARDIS! And indicated that it was not the first time.
I just notch it up to the fact the Doctor's taste in romantic women tends to drift towards the Dangerous, Psychotic and Fatal Destiny inclined.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: StCptMara on 27 December 2013, 12:47:52
So...

Was anyone else slightly disappointed that with the Doctor's Cyberman head being called Handles,
that Handel's Messiah did not get used in the sound track for the episode somewhere?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Pa Weasley on 27 December 2013, 12:51:15
Nah, that just made me want ice cream (http://www.handelsicecream.com/).  O:-)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 27 December 2013, 13:54:36
Honestly? Tasha seemed awfully River-ish to both my wife and I. Her ... lets say playfulness toward the Doctor. The slap. Eleven's comment about spending a lifetime fighting the psychopath inside. And lets face it, River would totally make herself the head of a religion. ;D I've been playing with some ideas on how it would work. None of them perfect of course. Even if that's not the case, I don't think we're done with River.

Edit: And that's ignoring the fact that Tasha FLEW THE FREAKING TARDIS! And indicated that it was not the first time.
Well, it can't be river since Tasha technically died and was close to being cyberzombie-Darlek.  From the dialog between the two and what Doctor told Clara, she was someone he dealt with during earlier doctor days.  I almost want to say its Romana
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Col.Hengist on 27 December 2013, 14:02:44
I doubt Mother Superious is Romana... Not the way she was trying to have sexy time with him. Romana would have known he didn't like that blue drink too.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: MrJake on 27 December 2013, 17:28:26
The second time he (apparently) ditched Clara brought a tear to my eye. "The Doctor lies," I said to myself. "What a magnificent bastard!"
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 27 December 2013, 17:49:03
Hm, as far as Tasha's history with the Doctor, it's probably something like Madame Vastra and Jenny. They just showed up at Demon's Run because the Doctor called in a favor. I really wouldn't read to much in to it at the moment. It may just be the writers trying to show that the Doctor does a lot more off screen too.

And as for the regeneration style: that started because Ecceclston was releasing the energy from the Time Vortex as he was regenerating. But Davies liked the effect so much he decided to use it for the subsequent regenerations of 10 and 11 as well.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 27 December 2013, 17:57:16
And who knows, there could still be some of that energy left clinging on in there too.  Would explain why it has a tendency to be more destructive then his previous regenerations as well.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 27 December 2013, 18:12:52
Blame it on Highlander.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 27 December 2013, 22:20:06
Only reason why i suggested Romana was because Tasha mentioned she died several times in that room. SEVEN TIMES and not many beings can retain their physical appearance. She like looking like a humanish person and really like the Doctor.  Romana was a timelord her fate wasn't quite made clear.  Anyways, gives the writers something to play with and you don't having worry about the actress getting too old for the part. River stuck with her own form because she died with that face but younger.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 27 December 2013, 22:20:55
Not only is this (http://www.geeksaresexy.net/2013/12/27/batman-is-a-time-lord-comic/) a brilliant mash-up of the "Doctor Who" and "Batman" character mythologies... but it also serves as something of a fitting epilogue of sorts for DC's Final Crisis.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Scotty on 27 December 2013, 22:21:07
"Several" does not mean "seven" it's roughly synonymous with "a few" and I'd put the upper cap at four.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ANS Kamas P81 on 27 December 2013, 23:17:08
For all we know, theDaleks killed her, brought her back, tortured her to death for information, brought her back, tortured her to death again...I took it to mean the Daleks were simply that brutal with Tasha than anything that she could do on her own.  You'll note she didn't realize her repeat deaths until she thought about the Dalek intrusion into the room; she was blocking it out for some reason.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 27 December 2013, 23:17:41
Tasha Lem can NOT be Romana.  Romana was a Time Lord.  (President even between the Doctor and Rassilon).  And all the Time Lords are gone.  The Doctor is the only one left.

And no.  Jenny does not count.  She is Gallifreyan, but she is not a Time Lord
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 27 December 2013, 23:28:08
Not only is this (http://www.geeksaresexy.net/2013/12/27/batman-is-a-time-lord-comic/) a brilliant mash-up of the "Doctor Who" and "Batman" character mythologies... but it also serves as something of a fitting epilogue of sorts for DC's Final Crisis.

That makes entirely too much sense...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 27 December 2013, 23:43:15
For all we know, theDaleks killed her, brought her back, tortured her to death for information, brought her back, tortured her to death again...I took it to mean the Daleks were simply that brutal with Tasha than anything that she could do on her own.  You'll note she didn't realize her repeat deaths until she thought about the Dalek intrusion into the room; she was blocking it out for some reason.

That's what I took it to mean.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 28 December 2013, 00:05:08
For all we know, theDaleks killed her, brought her back, tortured her to death for information, brought her back, tortured her to death again...I took it to mean the Daleks were simply that brutal with Tasha than anything that she could do on her own.  You'll note she didn't realize her repeat deaths until she thought about the Dalek intrusion into the room; she was blocking it out for some reason.

My memories of that scene are fading fast... but didn't Lem [or even the Doctor for that matter] allude to that anyway?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 28 December 2013, 05:40:35
That's how I took it as well.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 28 December 2013, 09:05:28
Tasha Lem can NOT be Romana.  Romana was a Time Lord.  (President even between the Doctor and Rassilon).  And all the Time Lords are gone.  The Doctor is the only one left.

And no.  Jenny does not count.  She is Gallifreyan, but she is not a Time Lord

I don't remember who Jenny was.  Was she the clone/daughter of the Doctor or her 1st Doctor's granddaughter who is missing/not accounted for.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 28 December 2013, 09:49:54
Jenny is the Clone/Daughter.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ColonelCody on 28 December 2013, 10:51:18
I don't remember who Jenny was.  Was she the clone/daughter of the Doctor or her 1st Doctor's granddaughter who is missing/not accounted for.
Susan is the granddaughter from 1st Doctor.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Col.Hengist on 28 December 2013, 11:59:30
I've been waiting to see what they'll do with Jenny. She is, after all , another time lord.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 28 December 2013, 12:24:02
I've been waiting to see what they'll do with Jenny. She is, after all , another time lord.

Is she even acting anymore? I thought I had read she has quit for awhile.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: DoctorMonkey on 28 December 2013, 17:04:14
Is she even acting anymore? I thought I had read she has quit for awhile.


She is making small people with David Tennant - I think there is a real Doctor's granddaughter but probably not called Susan
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ColonelCody on 28 December 2013, 17:43:57

She is making small people with David Tennant - I think there is a real Doctor's granddaughter but probably not called Susan

The Doctor is a mysterious character and little is known about him except that he has a granddaughter, Susan Foreman, and that they come from another time and place. He has a ship that travels through time and space, the TARDIS, which is currently disguised as a police box (Susan notes that it used to be able to change to blend in with its surroundings), and is bigger on the inside. The Doctor describes himself and Susan as "exiles" without specifying why or even whether their exile is self-imposed. It would not be until the last adventure of the Doctor's second incarnation that the name of the Doctor's people (the Time Lords) would be revealed, and the third incarnation before the name of his home planet (Gallifrey) was first spoken.

From the 1st Doctor's Wiki entry.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 28 December 2013, 18:13:53
I've been waiting to see what they'll do with Jenny. She is, after all , another time lord.
Actually, that is exactly the opposite of my point.  She is not a Time Lord.  She is Gallifreyan, but she is not a Time Lord.  Not all Gallifreyans are Time Lords.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 28 December 2013, 18:16:15
The Doctor is a mysterious character and little is known about him except that he has a granddaughter, Susan Foreman, and that they come from another time and place. He has a ship that travels through time and space, the TARDIS, which is currently disguised as a police box (Susan notes that it used to be able to change to blend in with its surroundings), and is bigger on the inside. The Doctor describes himself and Susan as "exiles" without specifying why or even whether their exile is self-imposed. It would not be until the last adventure of the Doctor's second incarnation that the name of the Doctor's people (the Time Lords) would be revealed, and the third incarnation before the name of his home planet (Gallifrey) was first spoken.

From the 1st Doctor's Wiki entry.

Um...he's referencing the fact that the woman who played Jenny (Georgia Moffett) is married to David Tennant. (And interestingly she's the daughter of Peter Moffett, better known as Peter Davison: who played the 5th Doctor.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: DoctorMonkey on 28 December 2013, 18:17:32
She had their second within about the last year (her third)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 28 December 2013, 18:18:19
Actually, that is exactly the opposite of my point.  She is not a Time Lord.  She is Gallifreyan, but she is not a Time Lord.  Not all Gallifreyans are Time Lords.

We actually don't know she isn't. The difference has never been explained. Is it simply that the Time Lords are Gallifreyan noblility? If so then she is a Time Lady (being the Doctor's daughter). Or is there more too it than that?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 28 December 2013, 18:55:35
It was stated in the episode where she was created that she could not regenerate and as such I think that may be the important distinction between regular Gallifreyan and Time Lord.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 28 December 2013, 19:09:01
It was stated in the episode where she was created that she could not regenerate and as such I think that may be the important distinction between regular Gallifreyan and Time Lord.

Except she did. Or enough to heal herself. The Doctor said that yes, but what if he had stuck around and saw her come back? What would he have said?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Scotty on 28 December 2013, 19:13:02
"That's impossible."

You know, kinda like he does every other time something happens. ;)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 28 December 2013, 19:40:26
Except it clearly wasn't a Time Lord regeneration that brought her back.

Doctor Who has established that there is more then one way to cheat death.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ColonelCody on 29 December 2013, 04:27:19
Except it clearly wasn't a Time Lord regeneration that brought her back.

Doctor Who has established that there is more then one way to cheat death.
What is 'Clearly' a Time Lord Regeneration? Because we know that it does not have to be  a nuclear reactor level high energy event when it happens, indeed I'd be surprised to find out that it was the norm, not the odd-ball. I think those high-energy reactions come for someone like the Doctor who were in special circumstances. Most Gallifreyans were probably much less...showy...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 29 December 2013, 04:38:07
She has not undergone the training.  She didn't look into the Vortex - as the Master did when he first heard the Drums - she has not been granted the title.  Nor did she, at the time we last saw her, have any access to time travel.  Certainly, she does not have access to Gallifrey, or any of the resources thereof.
Ergo, she is not a Time Lord.  The Doctor remains alone in that regard.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 29 December 2013, 09:30:30
What is 'Clearly' a Time Lord Regeneration? Because we know that it does not have to be  a nuclear reactor level high energy event when it happens, indeed I'd be surprised to find out that it was the norm, not the odd-ball. I think those high-energy reactions come for someone like the Doctor who were in special circumstances. Most Gallifreyans were probably much less...showy...

Changing physical appearance is mandatory unless there is an available receptacle to absorb excess regeneration energy like the Doctor's severed hand when the tenth regenerated but didn't change.  There was no available receptacle for Jenny to dump any excess off into.

Plus as noted she had never been exposed to the time vortex and being a Time Lord and having their particular method of cheating death is a matter of being exposed to the time vortex and not genetics.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Arvanna on 29 December 2013, 21:18:12
Side question  did they ever explain how Romana escaped from E-Space?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 29 December 2013, 21:24:44
Side question  did they ever explain how Romana escaped from E-Space?

Well, quick answer: She didn't.

Basically her becoming Lord President happens in the New Adventure novels (which are part of Doctor Who's EU) and therefore non-canon.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 29 December 2013, 21:28:13
Clara meets the new Doctor:


(https://scontent-b-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/q71/1536423_720997897933116_1711740364_n.jpg)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 29 December 2013, 22:38:58
Side question  did they ever explain how Romana escaped from E-Space?

In terms of television show canon, no, and she supposedly remains there. Just as Ying notes above.

But Romana has reportedly returned from E-Space in both novels and comics [some with K-9, others without] -- which are often not usually considered reliable accounts of DW canon.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 29 December 2013, 22:44:32
How about the other time lords we saw in the course of the series?  The ones not on Gallifrey.  The Monk and the Rani for example?  what ever became of them?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 30 December 2013, 07:09:24
They were all involved in the Time War.  The entire universe was on fire.  All of them were involved.  The Master hid at the End of the Universe - by rendering himself no longer a Time Lord.  The Doctor was on the outside when he ended the war.  So far as the entire universe - from the dawn of time to the end - knows, there are no others.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 30 December 2013, 09:27:09
The episode where the TARDIS's personality is made manifest suggests some did stay outside the Time War but still met their end in other ways.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 30 December 2013, 17:36:38
Like trying to save people, and getting killed because they were Time Lords, and just as bad as the Daleks?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 30 December 2013, 18:59:49
Quite possible.

Any possible survivors are rare if any still exist.  To the point that two meeting is such a small chance that each individual could be certain they were the last of their race.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 30 December 2013, 19:25:53
Is K-9 still allowed to be used in Doctor Who? I heard that the creator of the made a kids show in Austrialia and K-9 is considered no longer being able to be shown anymore.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 30 December 2013, 19:53:47
Is K-9 still allowed to be used in Doctor Who? I heard that the creator of the made a kids show in Austrialia and K-9 is considered no longer being able to be shown anymore.

Um. well...Sarah Jane Adventures were on for how many years?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 30 December 2013, 20:59:35
Quite possible.

Any possible survivors are rare if any still exist.  To the point that two meeting is such a small chance that each individual could be certain they were the last of their race.

Well, remember, if they were still around, the Doctor would be able to "feel" them.  He couldn't feel the Master because the Master had fled to the end of the universe, and hidden his Time Lord essence away.  Unless any other rogue Time Lords did the same, or had some other way of concealing themselves, we should assume they're dead.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 30 December 2013, 21:31:20
She has not undergone the training.  She didn't look into the Vortex - as the Master did when he first heard the Drums - she has not been granted the title.  Nor did she, at the time we last saw her, have any access to time travel.  Certainly, she does not have access to Gallifrey, or any of the resources thereof.
Ergo, she is not a Time Lord.  The Doctor remains alone in that regard.

The sound of drums in the Master's head wasn't a part of the previous canon.  I have mixed feelings about that addition because now it seems like the Master went (badly) rogue due to Rassilon's machinations during the Time War, when before his criminal behaviour was because he was just...inherently evil. 

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 30 December 2013, 23:35:16
Well, remember, if they were still around, the Doctor would be able to "feel" them.  He couldn't feel the Master because the Master had fled to the end of the universe, and hidden his Time Lord essence away.  Unless any other rogue Time Lords did the same, or had some other way of concealing themselves, we should assume they're dead.

cheers,

Gabe

There is a bit of a problem there as well.  It was even brought up in the episode I mentioned a couple posts ago.  The Doctor got a distress beacon. from "The Corsair", another Time Lord and didn't even think anything of supposedly not feeling any other Time Lords and immediately sprung into action to save "The Corsair".

So even if he does have some sort of sense to detect others of his race it appears limited.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 31 December 2013, 02:44:26
The distress signal wasn't coming from inside his universe.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: StCptMara on 31 December 2013, 03:41:12
The distress signal wasn't coming from inside his universe.

And, given how the Doctor lept into action, it seems like jumping between universes is something that it is
just assumed a TARDIS can do, as well as traveling through time. Which means that there COULD be
Time Lords hiding out in other universes...in theory.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ColonelCody on 31 December 2013, 06:27:56
Um. well...Sarah Jane Adventures were on for how many years?
2 or 3 seasons I believe as there was some 30+ episodes.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Marveryn on 31 December 2013, 14:46:09
just finish the time of the Doctor and day of the doctor.   A couple of things.. Doctor lies so we don't know if he was lying about being the last or he really thought that he was the last regeneration but clearly he had help from the time lords stuck in the alternate universe who pass a long the right stuff to activate his next cycle.  What left unsaid if these was another 12 generations if he was reset all the way back to the beginning.  This ending also help with the story of the silence and why the church splitter.  The reason I think doctor never let the time lord return YET.. is cause they were way to many enemies seeking the there destruction.   I would think that will be the arc of the coming doctor on how to bring the time lord back without having every species in the universe trying to destroy them.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 31 December 2013, 17:32:20
just finish the time of the Doctor and day of the doctor.   A couple of things.. Doctor lies so we don't know if he was lying about being the last or he really thought that he was the last regeneration but clearly he had help from the time lords stuck in the alternate universe who pass a long the right stuff to activate his next cycle.  What left unsaid if these was another 12 generations if he was reset all the way back to the beginning.  This ending also help with the story of the silence and why the church splitter.  The reason I think doctor never let the time lord return YET.. is cause they were way to many enemies seeking the there destruction.   I would think that will be the arc of the coming doctor on how to bring the time lord back without having every species in the universe trying to destroy them.

Well...he also has to figure out how to bring back Gallifrey without the Time Lords destroying the universe. Because pre-"Day" the reason the Doctor used the moment was because Rassilon and the rest of the TL wanted to destroy the universe and become creatures of pure thought. So it's going to be interesting to see how Moffet will iron that out.

And here's an interesting question: if Gallifrey comes back...does that mean the Master will be back as well?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Marveryn on 31 December 2013, 18:59:36
Yes to the master question, as he also stuck with the council, not sure if he an a time lock aka repeated the same event over and over again.  or if the planet citizen are free to live a normal life just in a strange new universe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 31 December 2013, 20:11:28
And here's an interesting question: if Gallifrey comes back...does that mean the Master will be back as well?

It's hard to say. Moffat's previously said he's not really keen on the idea of bringing the Master back any time soon.

[That was back when he first became DW Showrunner in late 2010/early 2011, though.]
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 31 December 2013, 20:40:45
I hope the Master comes back.  He is a much  ore intriguing villain than the usual suspects (Daleks, Cybermen....).  Though, would be fun if he came back a friend rather than enemy now that the drumbeat shoukd have stopped.

I had this idea back when he first came back.  At the end of "The Last of the Time Lords" when the Doctor wanted to take the Master with him, I thought that woukd be the most awsome pairing ever.  The Master is one of the few characters who can stand as the doctor's intellectual equal.  While many companions have had qualties or skills that made them able to lookout for themselves, they've never really been an equal.  It usually like a reacher student/ or guardian/ward kind of relationship.  But travelling with someone on his level would be a new dynamic and something I'd like to see.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 31 December 2013, 21:45:24
As long as it is more like the Classic Master, not The Manic from the new series'.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 31 December 2013, 21:58:18
Yeah, would never work with John Sims.  He'd need to regenerate.

Edit:  know what, let's crank up the awesome.  Let's have the Doctor and the Master teamed up out to save everthing from the Valeyard
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 31 December 2013, 23:11:47
As long as it is more like the Classic Master, not The Manic from the new series'.

Eh. I liked that the Master of the NewWho was Professor Yana, initially, and ably portrayed by Derek Jacobi. He should have remained in the role of the Master in the new series, I think.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ANS Kamas P81 on 01 January 2014, 11:39:34
Yeah, would never work with John Sims.  He'd need to regenerate.

Edit:  know what, let's crank up the awesome.  Let's have the Doctor and the Master teamed up out to save everthing from the Valeyard
This sounds like Moriarty and Sherlock team up to take on Jack the Ripper.

As in, awesome.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 01 January 2014, 11:45:05
This sounds like Moriarty and Sherlock team up to take on Jack the Ripper.

As in, awesome.

Funnily enough in the classic series, the Doctor and the Master usually ended up working together (at least during the 3rd Doctor's run). Usually because the Master's plan backfired horribly.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 01 January 2014, 12:14:20
Ironically, Derek Jacobi played the Master to Richard E Grant's Doctor in Scream of the Shalka, an abortive attempt to relaunch Doctor Who via web animation a couple of years before the TV relaunch.  In that incarnation, the Master's consciousness was in an android body and was a companion of the Doctor.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Luciora on 01 January 2014, 13:34:04
He couldn't lie.   Truth field on trenzalore.

juest finish the time of the Doctor and day of the doctor.   A couple of things.. Doctor lies so we don't know if he was lying about being the last or he really thought that he was the last regeneration but clearly he had help from the time lords stuck in the alternate universe who pass a long the right stuff to activate his next cycle.  What left unsaid if these was another 12 generations if he was reset all the way back to the beginning.  This ending also help with the story of the silence and why the church splitter.  The reason I think doctor never let the time lord return YET.. is cause they were way to many enemies seeking the there destruction.   I would think that will be the arc of the coming doctor on how to bring the time lord back without having every species in the universe trying to destroy them.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Darth Nichos on 01 January 2014, 20:22:43
I want to know where they go from this; do they continue with the return of the Time Lords or go with something new?  I am also really curious to what kind of Doctor the 12th is- I almost picture him a re-imagined 3rd for some reason.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 01 January 2014, 21:45:15
Question:  The outfit Matt Smith was wearing when he was 300 years old. Isn't that similar to the one that 3rd Doctor used to wear?  Purple one?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 02 January 2014, 04:22:23
I thought it had more of a 1st Doctor vibe.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 02 January 2014, 10:58:46
I want to know where they go from this; do they continue with the return of the Time Lords or go with something new?  I am also really curious to what kind of Doctor the 12th is- I almost picture him a re-imagined 3rd for some reason.

Re: the Time Lords ... I don't see Moffat playing up that angle too much. At least not within the first year of Capaldi's Doctor. Maybe in Season Nine... provided Capaldi continues in the role.

As for what Capaldi's Doctor might be like ... I'm thinking he'll be a little more like the First Doctor -- an abrasive attitude... with a pinch of the Sixth's arrogance mixed in.

Interestingly enough, Moffat recently said that we can expect Capaldi's Doctor to be "fiercer" than what we've seen previously for the role.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Darth Nichos on 02 January 2014, 21:44:05
But wasn't that what the Third Doctor was? He was a pretty fierce and hardly cracked a smile.

Right now, I am going with the idea of this personality wise:

10th-1st
11th-2nd
12th-3rd
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 02 January 2014, 22:42:16
But wasn't that what the Third Doctor was? He was a pretty fierce and hardly cracked a smile.

I always characterised the Third Doctor as "jovially fierce." Because he often had a tendency to daringly smile right before he was about to launch some crazy plan to save the planet.

Quote
Right now, I am going with the idea of this personality wise:

10th-1st
11th-2nd
12th-3rd

I thought the Ninth was kind of more like the First Doctor in terms of personality and mindset. The Tenth was a mix of the Fourth and Fifth. While I've often seen the Eleventh as largely an expansion of the Second Doctor's characteristic antics.

The Twelfth I do believe will bring back some of the First's abrasiveness. And he seems like a highly arrogant sort -- but this is based partly on Capaldi's acting style in previous roles. Which brings to my mind... a little of what the Sixth was like just after his regeneration.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 02 January 2014, 22:45:34
As an aside to all of this personality discussion of the Twelfth Doctor, though...

What do you folk think of the recent announcement regarding Capaldi being allowed to use his Scottish accent for the role of the Doctor?

Apparently, unlike the Tennant-era, the Doctor will now be encouraged to have something of a Scots accent, rather than the traditional "North English."

Perhaps it's a step back to what we saw with Sylvester's McCoy's Seventh Doctor accent?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 02 January 2014, 23:01:23
I think it is a step in the right direction to let the Doctor have some diversity.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 03 January 2014, 00:54:37
As an aside to all of this personality discussion of the Twelfth Doctor, though...

What do you folk think of the recent announcement regarding Capaldi being allowed to use his Scottish accent for the role of the Doctor?

Apparently, unlike the Tennant-era, the Doctor will now be encouraged to have something of a Scots accent, rather than the traditional "North English."

Perhaps it's a step back to what we saw with Sylvester's McCoy's Seventh Doctor accent?


I honestly don't see what the big deal is.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Øystein on 03 January 2014, 02:14:55
Isn't Capaldi the 13th doctor actor? John Hurt should count :)

(Or 18th if you count "Doctor Who and the Curse of Final Death" :D, which had Rowan Atkinson, Richard E. Grant, Jim Broadbent, Hugh Grant and  Joanna Lumley as Doctors.)

Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 03 January 2014, 03:00:52
I honestly don't see what the big deal is.

Neither do I. I've been championing the notion of the Doctor having a different accent after each regeneration from the Colin Baker-era.

It makes biological and physiological sense -- that, along with everything else that changes during regeneration, the Doctor's new vocal cords might also produce a slightly different inflection and/or accent.

Isn't Capaldi the 13th doctor actor? John Hurt should count :)

He is the thirteenth actor, in terms of canon, yes. Matt's line in "The Time of the Doctor" cleared all that up.

Quote
(Or 18th if you count "Doctor Who and the Curse of Final Death" :D, which had Rowan Atkinson, Richard E. Grant, Jim Broadbent, Hugh Grant and  Joanna Lumley as Doctors.)

It's 19... if you also include another non-canonical Doctor -- in the form of Peter Cushing.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 03 January 2014, 03:27:10
Plus, Richard E. Grant would count twice then:  His character in Curse of Fatal Death is different to the animated version.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 03 January 2014, 10:26:51
Hartnell, Troughton, Pertwee, T.Baker, Davison, C.Baker, McCoy, McGann, Hurt, Eccleston, Tennantx2, Smith, Capaldi.

13 official actors for 14 official incarnations.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 06 January 2014, 21:34:16
So, I finally got around to watching "Time of the Doctor"....and...no Valeyard?

As for the episode itself...kind of a mess trying to tie up all those plot threads in one hour.  But still totally worth it for Matt Smith's last performance as the Doctor.  Blew both Tennant and Eccleston out of the water IMO.  Having spent some time catching up on the series after a 4-year hiatus, I can't help but feel that Smith understood the Doctor's non-human nature better than his predecessors, as opposed to their more "touchy-feely" approach--but that may be as much due to the different approaches of Steven Moffat and Russell T. Davies.  Either way, Peter Capaldi has a very tough act to follow.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Dr. Banzai on 06 January 2014, 22:52:28
So, I finally got around to watching "Time of the Doctor"....and...no Valeyard?

As for the episode itself...kind of a mess trying to tie up all those plot threads in one hour.  But still totally worth it for Matt Smith's last performance as the Doctor.  Blew both Tennant and Eccleston out of the water IMO.  Having spent some time catching up on the series after a 4-year hiatus, I can't help but feel that Smith understood the Doctor's non-human nature better than his predecessors, as opposed to their more "touchy-feely" approach--but that may be as much due to the different approaches of Steven Moffat and Russell T. Davies.  Either way, Peter Capaldi has a very tough act to follow.

cheers,

Gabe
From a couple of great articles (and Neil Gaiman's tumblr post on Peter Capaldi's casting), I've pieced together why each was perfect in their way.

Christopher Eccleston - Remember, he came in with no budget, they had no idea if they had a hit and it had been 9 years since the TV-Movie and 16 years since the original series left the air. To bring the Doctor back to a new generation, they needed to show him as easily relatable to. If they had made him too alien or strange, people would have more than likely just flipped the channel, thinking it was more 70's nostalgia campy-ness. So his wardrobe, attitude, and overall style was more subdued than any other Doctor. And Eccleston still managed to play him to the hilt, showing all the stuff that was going on in his head with just a glance or a half-smile. He set it the foundation for people to trust the Doctor.

David Tennant - (warning, I'm a bit biased) The 10th Doctor revealed the Intelligence of the Doctor. He's the one that showed he was the smartest one in the room, and brought in a bit of distance by showing that he was alien and didn't really "belong" to or on Earth. But that he did care about the planet and its denizens and always wanted to bring out their best (although he often brought out their worst as well). Whereas Eccleston was the guy with the box showing you the universe, Tennant brought home the title of Doctor to the role.

Matt Smith - The 11th Doctor brought the weird back to the character. Of the three modern Doctors, his was the most obviously alien. He had the foundations of Eccleston's "runner" and Tennant's "smart-guy" and took off to show how the alien was a part of both of those. Although I think they went too far some times with the manic five-year-old act, they did balance it nicely when he was forced to be serious. Not too mention, where Eccleston and Tennant got you to trust the Doctor (both as a companion and as a viewer), Smith's Doctor firmly proclaimed "Rule #1 - the Doctor lies." Which means that everything we knew of 9 & 10 now had to be take with a grain of salt (and brings up a lot of other fun nuances when rewatching the older episodes knowing that fact).

Peter Capaldi - To paraphrase Neil Gaiman, the Doctor after Smith had to be older, gruffy and wiser to counterbalance everything that happened in Smith's era. In following with my view, Eccleston invited us to travel with him; Tennant showed us how smart the Doctor really was; Smith reminded us that the Doctor is an alien first and always; and now Capaldi will show us the Doctor's age (which is greater than 1500 years by a large margin by the end of Time of the Doctor). He might be more like a mix between McCoy and Hartnell's Doctor and letting his companions do the heavy lifting.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 07 January 2014, 00:56:19
So, I finally got around to watching "Time of the Doctor"....and...no Valeyard?

You know, now that I think about it, while we do see Matt glowing, we don't see the full transition from Matt to Peter...

Nah, I'm reading too much into it.   :D
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 07 January 2014, 10:26:21
From a couple of great articles (and Neil Gaiman's tumblr post on Peter Capaldi's casting), I've pieced together why each was perfect in their way.

Matt Smith - The 11th Doctor brought the weird back to the character. Of the three modern Doctors, his was the most obviously alien. He had the foundations of Eccleston's "runner" and Tennant's "smart-guy" and took off to show how the alien was a part of both of those. Although I think they went too far some times with the manic five-year-old act, they did balance it nicely when he was forced to be serious. Not too mention, where Eccleston and Tennant got you to trust the Doctor (both as a companion and as a viewer), Smith's Doctor firmly proclaimed "Rule #1 - the Doctor lies." Which means that everything we knew of 9 & 10 now had to be take with a grain of salt (and brings up a lot of other fun nuances when rewatching the older episodes knowing that fact).


Well, there were some of us raised on the old series who were hoping to get a new Doctor who was more reminiscent of some of the classic ones.  Matt Smith was it.  (Though there were some times that he skated uncomfortably close to Seventh Doctor territory...)

EDIT:  then again, who am I to disagree with the likes of Tom Baker?


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 07 January 2014, 18:29:39
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BdYUd1RCMAAreKo.jpg)

Set photo released by the BBC.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Scotty on 07 January 2014, 19:22:18
Snazzy duds, there.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 07 January 2014, 20:17:09
As impressive as that first set photo is... I think we're all really waiting for the first glimpse of what will be Capaldi's actual Doctor-costume.

Personally, I'm eager to see the "dress-up" scene -- where the new Doctor first chooses his "new dress look." It'll be interesting to see how Capaldi's dress-up sequence will go.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: worktroll on 07 January 2014, 20:45:05
Ecclestone represented the Doctor from shortly after the Time War. Angry, dark, tormented, stressed. He had a sharp edge which suited the role perfectly. The episode "Dalek" highlighted this - Ecclestone's reaction to the Dalek's comment summed up him realising where he'd gone.

(In retrospect, one could speak of traces of the "War Doctor" still there, except that concept didn't exist at the time.)

Tennant was, if you'll allow me, the PSTD Doctor. I've always maintained that the Doctors regarded their companions as particularly valued pets. This doctor developed romantic (and biological) urges for another species, and there's strong words describing someone who does that. ("The Doctor Dances" - dancing has been explicitly linked to other moving activities by the writers.) I still think the best episode under Tennant was "Blink", in part because he was sauce, not main course.

Smith - sorry, couldn't warm to him. If Ecclestone was "angry Doc", and Tennant was "needy Doc", this one seemed to be "frivolous Doc".

W.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 07 January 2014, 22:16:27
Ecclestone represented the Doctor from shortly after the Time War. Angry, dark, tormented, stressed. He had a sharp edge which suited the role perfectly. The episode "Dalek" highlighted this - Ecclestone's reaction to the Dalek's comment summed up him realising where he'd gone.

(In retrospect, one could speak of traces of the "War Doctor" still there, except that concept didn't exist at the time.)

Tennant was, if you'll allow me, the PSTD Doctor. I've always maintained that the Doctors regarded their companions as particularly valued pets. This doctor developed romantic (and biological) urges for another species, and there's strong words describing someone who does that. ("The Doctor Dances" - dancing has been explicitly linked to other moving activities by the writers.) I still think the best episode under Tennant was "Blink", in part because he was sauce, not main course.

Smith - sorry, couldn't warm to him. If Ecclestone was "angry Doc", and Tennant was "needy Doc", this one seemed to be "frivolous Doc".

W.

Do you think the writers for Doctor Who since Ecclestone planned thos whole behavior pattern to begin with?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 07 January 2014, 22:17:41
Ecclestone represented the Doctor from shortly after the Time War. Angry, dark, tormented, stressed. He had a sharp edge which suited the role perfectly. The episode "Dalek" highlighted this - Ecclestone's reaction to the Dalek's comment summed up him realising where he'd gone.

(In retrospect, one could speak of traces of the "War Doctor" still there, except that concept didn't exist at the time.)

Tennant was, if you'll allow me, the PSTD Doctor. I've always maintained that the Doctors regarded their companions as particularly valued pets. This doctor developed romantic (and biological) urges for another species, and there's strong words describing someone who does that. ("The Doctor Dances" - dancing has been explicitly linked to other moving activities by the writers.) I still think the best episode under Tennant was "Blink", in part because he was sauce, not main course.

Smith - sorry, couldn't warm to him. If Ecclestone was "angry Doc", and Tennant was "needy Doc", this one seemed to be "frivolous Doc".

W.
I think "Midnight" is pretty close contender though. I mean how many other shows make such an intense, edge-of-your-seat thriller...purely with dialogue?

As to Smith...I like him, but I think he's hobbled by a lack of good stories. Honestly, at least for me, most of his stories with Amy/Rory are quite forgettable (and I do, they all seem to mush together). Yes, there are some good moments, and a few interesting ideas. But there aren't any episodes that stand out like there are for Ecclestone and Tennant. The ones with Clara were a little better, but not by much.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 07 January 2014, 22:29:23
Tennant for me was able to do more with less, which really resonated with me for what it meant for someone to be Doctor Who.  He was doing with facial expressions what Smith needed several lines of dialogue to do.

Now don't get me wrong Smith isn't my least favorite Doctor either and isn't the worst actor I've seen either.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 07 January 2014, 23:18:59
As to Smith...I like him, but I think he's hobbled by a lack of good stories. Honestly, at least for me, most of his stories with Amy/Rory are quite forgettable (and I do, they all seem to mush together).

In terms of the Doctor/Amy story-arc, I really think Matt's first year was the better period. Back when we weren't really sure what the relationship between the two of them was like.

And while I can and do appreciate the whole "River Song" plotline, I think it was stretched entirely too far. It really should have been just a one season story-arc, I think.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: worktroll on 07 January 2014, 23:46:18
Do you think the writers for Doctor Who since Ecclestone planned thos whole behavior pattern to begin with?

Not even a little bit. They had no idea whether the series would survive or not on the first "new era" series. I do think they deliberately had Ecclestone as post-war stressed. But, like BT authors, all the Who writers scatter idiosyncracies like rice, in the likelyhood of being able to revisit them later.

(Leaving aside deliberate arcs like "Bad Wolf". Case in point - I doubt the labelling of the McGuffin in "Day of the Doctor" was planned back in the Tennant series. They just ran with it years later.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 08 January 2014, 00:50:06
Is that actually a new outfit?  Not just Capaldi in Matt's threads, or the threads he was wearing at the end of the episode?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 08 January 2014, 03:09:34
Is that actually a new outfit?  Not just Capaldi in Matt's threads, or the threads he was wearing at the end of the episode?

I don't think it's a new outfit. It's Matt's threads from the end of "The Time of the Doctor." He's missing the bow-tie, which Matt's Doctor removed before he regenerated, and he's wearing the same waistcoat with the pocket-watch chain that Matt wore as part of his outfit.

Plus, Clara's still wearing her same clothes as well. This scene looks like it's a direct follow-up from just after the Eleventh/Thirteenth regenerated.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 08 January 2014, 22:19:46
As to Smith...I like him, but I think he's hobbled by a lack of good stories. Honestly, at least for me, most of his stories with Amy/Rory are quite forgettable (and I do, they all seem to mush together). Yes, there are some good moments, and a few interesting ideas. But there aren't any episodes that stand out like there are for Ecclestone and Tennant. The ones with Clara were a little better, but not by much.

Well, you could think of it this way:  Matt Smith's entire run was basically one long arc, or several tied together.  So in that respect it's no surprise that all the stories are kind of run-on.  The fault--if you want to call it that--must be laid squarely at Steven Moffat's feet; it seemed to me that he exercised much more creative control than Davies did.  On the other hand, while the stories may not have been as strong, I feel the presentation was overall more mature than during the Davies era.  I was a bit put off by the repeated use of and references to popular culture (especially in episodes Davies himself wrote), which make the episodes seem dated after a few years.

cheers,

Gabe 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 08 January 2014, 22:24:21
I liked the chemistry that Matt Smith with Amy/Rory's actors/actresses.  The farewell showed that off, frankly make me appreciate Smith's run bit more.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 10 January 2014, 03:43:28
According to Moffat [in the latest Doctor Who Magazine]... we can expect Capaldi to play the role as more of a "Kick up the a**e" Doctor, rather than the Tennant/Smith "Boyfriend Doctor."

So Capaldi's sounding like he'll be a little more than Eccleston's Doctor.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ColonelCody on 10 January 2014, 16:18:31
According to Moffat [in the latest Doctor Who Magazine]... we can expect Capaldi to play the role as more of a "Kick up the a**e" Doctor, rather than the Tennant/Smith "Boyfriend Doctor."

So Capaldi's sounding like he'll be a little more than Eccleston's Doctor.
Funny when you said that, I thought more like 'Pertwee's Doctor'.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 10 January 2014, 16:35:10
I have no problem with a Pertwee-esque Doctor.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 10 January 2014, 18:53:43
What exactly is a pertwee?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 10 January 2014, 18:57:36
The Third Doctor...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 10 January 2014, 20:02:09
What exactly is a pertwee?

Akin to the Third Doctor in form, function, and attitude.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 10 January 2014, 20:46:07
Okay.  I really haven't been hardcore into Doctor Who in a while.  I already remember the Third Doctor making fun of the Second, calling him a clown.  I didn't recall what he was becalled.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 10 January 2014, 20:55:02
The 3rd was played by Jon Pertwee.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 10 January 2014, 20:57:22
The 3rd was played by Jon Pertwee.
LOL.  I forgot what his name was, that egg on my face.  :-[
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 10 January 2014, 21:53:39
I already remember the Third Doctor making fun of the Second, calling him a clown.

He was kind of jovial in the first season of his role as the Doctor. But he switched to a more aggressive and abrasive kind of Doctor during the Jo Grant/Sarah Jane companion phase of his incarnation.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Crunch on 11 January 2014, 02:29:38
Okay.  I really haven't been hardcore into Doctor Who in a while.  I already remember the Third Doctor making fun of the Second, calling him a clown.  I didn't recall what he was becalled.

That's from the Three Doctors. It was actually Hartnell, the first doctor calling Troughton (2) a clown and Pertwee (3) a dandy.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 12 January 2014, 16:41:23
Matt Smith - The 11th Doctor brought the weird back to the character. Of the three modern Doctors, his was the most obviously alien. He had the foundations of Eccleston's "runner" and Tennant's "smart-guy" and took off to show how the alien was a part of both of those. Although I think they went too far some times with the manic five-year-old act, they did balance it nicely when he was forced to be serious. Not too mention, where Eccleston and Tennant got you to trust the Doctor (both as a companion and as a viewer), Smith's Doctor firmly proclaimed "Rule #1 - the Doctor lies." Which means that everything we knew of 9 & 10 now had to be take with a grain of salt (and brings up a lot of other fun nuances when rewatching the older episodes knowing that fact).

Matt's Doctor really brought back the zaniness that both the second Doctor and the fourth Doctor where famous for, while also showing Matt's acting chops by really getting you to believe that although this Doctor had a young body, he was a VERY old being...If nothing else, Matt did this WELL...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: StCptMara on 12 January 2014, 19:59:25
Matt's Doctor really brought back the zaniness that both the second Doctor and the fourth Doctor where famous for, while also showing Matt's acting chops by really getting you to believe that although this Doctor had a young body, he was a VERY old being...If nothing else, Matt did this WELL...

Ruger

One thing I will say that I liked was when Matt's Doctor would actually DROP the zany Mad Man with a Blue Box routine
and get deadly serious. Like he did with the alines looking for Prisoner Zero, like he did in the caves filled with the Weeping
Angels, and a few other instances. While I understand that was a Moffat thing(see Silence in the Library/Forest of the Dead),
it came across much better, much more jarring and scary when Smith did it then when Tennant did it.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 12 January 2014, 20:10:30
One thing I will say that I liked was when Matt's Doctor would actually DROP the zany Mad Man with a Blue Box routine
and get deadly serious. Like he did with the alines looking for Prisoner Zero, like he did in the caves filled with the Weeping
Angels, and a few other instances. While I understand that was a Moffat thing(see Silence in the Library/Forest of the Dead),
it came across much better, much more jarring and scary when Smith did it then when Tennant did it.

Yeah, I know what you mean. I kind of wish they would have done that a bit more often. Oh well. I think the reason it seemed to work better for Matt was because he was normally more zany, so it was more jarring. Though Tennant had his moments to: the Racnoss, The Family of Blood, Time Lord Victorious.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 12 January 2014, 20:33:20
When is the new series suppose to start airing anyways?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 12 January 2014, 20:34:23
Word is the new series will air starting in August, running for a full 12 episodes.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 12 January 2014, 22:04:54
Word is the new series will air starting in August, running for a full 12 episodes.

Aye. Moffat recently confirmed that all of the episodes for Season Eight will show fully in the one year [2014], rather than being split over two years like last season.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 12 January 2014, 22:10:33
Wow.  Thats a long wait. Hopefuly they'll have alot interesting things to watch in it.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ColonelCody on 12 January 2014, 23:35:40
That's from the Three Doctors. It was actually Hartnell, the first doctor calling Troughton (2) a clown and Pertwee (3) a dandy.
the 3 doctors is on Netflix on demand as the Classic Doctor Who
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Darth Nichos on 12 January 2014, 23:47:37
Aye. Moffat recently confirmed that all of the episodes for Season Eight will show fully in the one year [2014], rather than being split over two years like last season.


I was so happy to hear that; those split seasons were really starting to annoy me
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 13 January 2014, 21:28:55
Yeah, I know what you mean. I kind of wish they would have done that a bit more often. Oh well. I think the reason it seemed to work better for Matt was because he was normally more zany, so it was more jarring. Though Tennant had his moments to: the Racnoss, The Family of Blood, Time Lord Victorious.

Also, "No second chances. I'm that sort of man."

Or words to that effect...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 21 January 2014, 11:19:56
So...anyone care to discuss the revival-era companions?  As I said up-thread, I'm catching up after a long hiatus, watching things out of order.  I'm trying to decide who was the better companion for the 11th Doctor--Amy or Clara.  I can't quite put my finger on it but there's something I like more...not about Clara herself, but about her interaction with the Doctor.  It seems more, I don't know, mature somehow.  More brother/sister, less boyfriend/girlfriend.  Have to wonder how that will change with a Doctor who is now visibly physically older.

One thing I have noticed is that the Davies-era companions were all normal women who were changed by their time with the Doctor, while the Moffat-era ones have been otherwise normal girls to whom extraordinary things had already happened, both tied to the Doctor before they had even met him.

Brief rundown of some random thoughts about them:
Donna--easily the most tragic of them, given that she'll die if she ever remembers her time with him.
Amy--the most abused, in that her entire first season was an object lesson in how dangerous traveling with the Doctor can be.  Also, a redhead who was used as breeding stock by an alien faction...where have we seen this before...?
Martha--he didn't do right by her, hung up as he was on Rose.  (Current one is always the best one, dude!)  She should've been the toughest and most kick-ass.  But, when she actually got a second chance with him, she realized she couldn't take it.  (So why and how did she end up with Mickey ?!?!?)
Clara--hmmm...more of a younger sister than girlfriend type?  Also perhaps the one with the greatest capacity for self-sacrifice, and the only one who's actually seen why the Doctor can never get too close to, or form lasting relationships with, any of his human companions.
River Song--not really a companion, but you could say she's the ultimate star-crossed lover.
Then again, I feel she's a bit like Martha, in that the Doctor doesn't quite seem capable of understanding her feelings for him or returning them (she seems to genuinely love him).

and not to forget...
Rose--the most fortunate.  She got everything she wanted, including a version of the Doctor with whom she could actually realize her feelings (in all aspects).  None of the other companions can say that.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 21 January 2014, 11:22:53
Amy's probably my favourite, with Donna coming second.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: worktroll on 21 January 2014, 21:55:46
Quote
Clara--hmmm...more of a younger sister than girlfriend type?  Also perhaps the one with the greatest capacity for self-sacrifice, and the only one who's actually seen why the Doctor can never get too close to, or form lasting relationships with, any of his human companions.

I'm interested in your take on the "why", Gyedid. I confess I never really warmed to Matt Smith and therefore missed basically all of Clara except the first (Asylum of the Daleks) and last (Night of the Doctor) appearances.

To be honest, I thought "because humans aren't his species, and because they're at best like particularly smart dogs to a Gallifreyan" was reason enough (whether intentional or not, I feel that describes the 4th Doctor's relationship with Leela exactly). I therefore saw the Tennant Doctor's enhanced interest in "dancing" as a post-traumatic stress thing, like a sole survivor
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ANS Kamas P81 on 21 January 2014, 22:45:50
To be honest, I thought "because humans aren't his species, and because they're at best like particularly smart dogs to a Gallifreyan" was reason enough (whether intentional or not, I feel that describes the 4th Doctor's relationship with Leela exactly). I therefore saw the Tennant Doctor's enhanced interest in "dancing" as a post-traumatic stress thing, like a sole survivor
Lose yourself in another culture, pretend to be anything but who you were - the Destroyer of Gallifrey and Grand Reaper of the Time Lords.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: worktroll on 21 January 2014, 22:48:47
with a side order of technical bestiality at worst, or rishthathra (sp?) at best.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ANS Kamas P81 on 22 January 2014, 01:44:36
with a side order of technical bestiality at worst, or rishthathra (sp?) at best.
Rishathra.  For which there is an actual advertisement for in the background of one of the scenes of Independence Day.  It's over the shoulder of one of the kids complaining about uncle Dennis Quaid inside the RV.  I saw it in the theater and fell out of my chair laughing to the point that one of the employees nearly threw me out of the movie.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ColonelCody on 22 January 2014, 01:53:32
with a side order of technical bestiality at worst, or rishthathra (sp?) at best.
Rishathra
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rishathra
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 23 January 2014, 10:12:14
I'm interested in your take on the "why", Gyedid. I confess I never really warmed to Matt Smith and therefore missed basically all of Clara except the first (Asylum of the Daleks) and last (Night of the Doctor) appearances.

Watch "The Time of the Doctor" again, from 33:30 to 35:33, and I hope you'll understand my thinking.  (And it becomes only more evident when Clara sees the Doctor again at the conclusion of the siege of Trenzalore).

Quote
To be honest, I thought "because humans aren't his species, and because they're at best like particularly smart dogs to a Gallifreyan" was reason enough (whether intentional or not, I feel that describes the 4th Doctor's relationship with Leela exactly). I therefore saw the Tennant Doctor's enhanced interest in "dancing" as a post-traumatic stress thing, like a sole survivor

I think this must be a very personal view of the Doctor's relationship with his companions (though it is true that not all of his companions were anywhere near a good fit, with Leela probably being the strongest example). But anyway, the 10th Doctor's dalliances are not the only examples of "rish" we've seen in the new series.  What about Vastra and Jenny***?  Or need I mention Captain Jack...?

***Well, the Silurians were supposed to have evolved on Earth at least...

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ANS Kamas P81 on 23 January 2014, 20:24:24
Or need I mention Captain Jack...?
Hey-o Captain Jack, take me back to the railroad track!
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 23 January 2014, 20:41:04
Hey-o Captain Jack, take me back to the railroad track!

So much I could say about that.... :-X
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 27 January 2014, 18:27:43
So yeah, Pertwee-esque in costume at least:

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BfAZ7I9CUAA_8ba.jpg)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 27 January 2014, 19:28:37
So yeah, Pertwee-esque in costume at least:

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BfAZ7I9CUAA_8ba.jpg)

Official??

If so I like it. (Though I do really like the long coats 10 and then 11 were later...)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 27 January 2014, 19:30:28
Official??

If so I like it. (Though I do really like the long coats 10 and then 11 were later...)

Yep, it's up on the BBC website.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: mathesont on 27 January 2014, 19:56:13
A little more color somewhere in the costume would have been nice, unless he intends to spend a lot of time blending into dark corridors
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 27 January 2014, 19:57:46
He's supposed to be more 'intense' than previous Doctor's.  Besides, that's still more colour than Ecclestone's 9th.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 27 January 2014, 20:36:27
A little more color somewhere in the costume would have been nice, unless he intends to spend a lot of time blending into dark corridors

Has no less color than the 11th's second costume. (Which I really liked by the way.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 27 January 2014, 20:41:58
I'm sure he'll get another outfit or two as time goes by, like how Tennant had the brown and blue suits and Smith had the military overcoat
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 27 January 2014, 20:43:24
I'm sure he'll get another outfit or two as time goes by, like how Tennant had the brown and blue suits and Smith had the military overcoat

Funny thing...the 10th's suits changed color depending on whether they were going forward or backward in time. Same thing with the 11th's bowtie.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 28 January 2014, 03:51:33
A little more color somewhere in the costume would have been nice, unless he intends to spend a lot of time blending into dark corridors

I wouldn't call it Pertwee-esque--no frills & ruffles, no cape!

Speaking of costumes (yo, Øystein!!), having watched "The Day of the Doctor" a few times, I felt there was something a bit familiar about the dress of the Trenzalorians...and then it struck me, their costumes (IMO) greatly resemble Norwegian bunads (regional folk costumes).  Any others think so?
(NOTE:  this would only occur to anyone who is Norwegian, of Norwegian descent, or who had lived in Norway for a little while.)
EDIT:  in fact, Trenzalore, a wintry world with only a few minutes of daylight every day, could easily be North Norway in the dead of winter...
cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Øystein on 28 January 2014, 04:01:42
True, it does remind you somewhat about bunads :)

Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 28 January 2014, 07:03:37
So yeah, Pertwee-esque in costume at least:

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BfAZ7I9CUAA_8ba.jpg)

I'd say more Hartnell or Troughton than Pertwee.  I like it though.  Between the older Doctor and this outfit, seems to have more the feel of the older Classics.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Marveryn on 28 January 2014, 11:32:17
Official??

If so I like it. (Though I do really like the long coats 10 and then 11 were later...)

if that the official one why do I feel it is a call back to the 2nd doctor?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: worktroll on 28 January 2014, 17:54:05
Besides, that's still more colour than Ecclestone's 9th.

Ecclestone only wore black because he was waiting for something darker to come along ...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: DEZOAT on 30 January 2014, 08:19:10
 ??? I have a question . Why have they not release in DVD the Adventure in time and space  the making of Doctor Who. I see its only in Australia. Any information. I check BBC website noting there. Funning they came out with Day of the Doctor , but not Adventure in time space .
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 30 January 2014, 08:21:40
Looks like it's only been released in the UK thus far.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ANS Kamas P81 on 30 January 2014, 10:07:49
Ecclestone only wore black because he was waiting for something darker to come along ...
I saw a blue box and I want to paint it bla~a~ack...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: worktroll on 30 January 2014, 20:30:17
You lightened the state pf homicidal rage work has me in at the moment, for which I thank you O0

(OTOH, for anyone who's read Simon Green's Nightside series, Ecclestone would make a great Alex the Bartender, and descendant of Merlin Satanspawn, no?)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 30 January 2014, 22:41:02
??? I have a question . Why have they not release in DVD the Adventure in time and space  the making of Doctor Who. I see its only in Australia. Any information. I check BBC website noting there. Funning they came out with Day of the Doctor , but not Adventure in time space .

Yeah. Both Australia and the UK have already seen the release for Adventures in Time and Space. [I got my copy here in Australia about a week or so ago.]

So far as I know, the release of the DVD in the US has been held up. I haven't learnt why yet.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 02 February 2014, 11:47:58
Capaldi's upcoming outfit, to me, is...meh in the picture. Need to see it move to know if I'll like it...

BTW, I know it's just a book, so the canonicity of it is questionable, but did anyone notice that the Tales of Transalore novel says that Matt Smith's Doctor was there, protecting the planet for 900 years?

Either the book's wrong, the last regeneration has an extra long cycle or we were off on what constitutes dying of old age for a regeneration...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 02 February 2014, 14:16:46
Capaldi's upcoming outfit, to me, is...meh in the picture. Need to see it move to know if I'll like it...


You asked...so here it is:

(http://24.media.tumblr.com/4a7c1e80ed95403e491663e14728f2d3/tumblr_n02uqaRgZb1ryvq99o1_500.gif)


BTW, I know it's just a book, so the canonicity of it is questionable, but did anyone notice that the Tales of Transalore novel says that Matt Smith's Doctor was there, protecting the planet for 900 years?

Either the book's wrong, the last regeneration has an extra long cycle or we were off on what constitutes dying of old age for a regeneration...

Ruger


I thought "The Time of the Doctor" said 300...but, could just be misremembering...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 02 February 2014, 14:38:03
Looks like their busy filming Dr. Who.  Ain't Cool News has a link about them filming in London.  Associate news leak that talks about it, talks about who 1st new villian of the season is.  Not crazy, about it, but what hey. Jack the Ripper
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Marveryn on 03 February 2014, 00:21:06
Capaldi's upcoming outfit, to me, is...meh in the picture. Need to see it move to know if I'll like it...

BTW, I know it's just a book, so the canonicity of it is questionable, but did anyone notice that the Tales of Transalore novel says that Matt Smith's Doctor was there, protecting the planet for 900 years?

Either the book's wrong, the last regeneration has an extra long cycle or we were off on what constitutes dying of old age for a regeneration...

Ruger

remember he was 300 years older when he die in impossible astronaut and he didn't seem to age at all.  So if he was saving Christmas for 900 years my guess is that aging for a time lord is a very long process.   How old was the first doctor before his first regeneration?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 03 February 2014, 06:57:45
Who knows.  If you go and listen to how old the Doctor says he is over the years, he contradicts himself a lot.  Guess he lost count and makes up numbers now.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 03 February 2014, 09:02:48
Capaldi's upcoming outfit, to me, is...meh in the picture. Need to see it move to know if I'll like it...

Agreed, this is just...enh.  I hope Capaldi stays around for a few years, so he can change up the costume a bit like Tennant and Smith did.

BTW, I know it's just a book, so the canonicity of it is questionable, but did anyone notice that the Tales of Transalore novel says that Matt Smith's Doctor was there, protecting the planet for 900 years?

Ruger

I didn't think it could've been more than 500...still, it's the most time the Doctor has spent in any one place, except for the youth of his first incarnation on Gallifrey.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: DEZOAT on 08 February 2014, 09:43:38
 I have watching some of the Doctor Who DVDs for the last week. The beginning and Lost in time sets. I have to admit it was very enjoyable.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 08 February 2014, 18:12:41
I found Lost in Time to be fascinating.  I'd not seen any Hartnell or Troughton episodes before, and I was impressed with the production quality.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: StCptMara on 08 February 2014, 19:03:49
I found Lost in Time to be fascinating.  I'd not seen any Hartnell or Troughton episodes before, and I was impressed with the production quality.

Lost in time is..Hartnell and troughton? Or just Troughton? I have only seen the Aztec Story Arc with Hartnell,
thanks to BBC airing it as part of the Doctors Revisted, and would love to see more of Hartnell...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 09 February 2014, 05:06:56
Uh, ok....looking through my DVD collection, seems I have two copies of "Snakedance".......

Um,..how much woukd one go for?.....
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 09 February 2014, 05:21:19
Lost in time is..Hartnell and troughton? Or just Troughton? I have only seen the Aztec Story Arc with Hartnell,
thanks to BBC airing it as part of the Doctors Revisted, and would love to see more of Hartnell...

It's a compilation of the episodes in the BBC archives from all the serials with missing parts.  3-disk set, 1 of Hartnell episodes and 2 of Troughton. Of course, it includes The Enemy of the World and The Web Planet, which have since been completed (or in the Web Planet's case, all bar one episode was recovered which has been animated)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: MrJake on 09 February 2014, 17:27:58
Dr. Who song here: http://www.cracked.com/article_20865_6-unintentionally-hilarious-songs-by-fictional-characters_p2.html  (http://www.cracked.com/article_20865_6-unintentionally-hilarious-songs-by-fictional-characters_p2.html)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 09 February 2014, 18:20:54

You asked...so here it is:

(http://24.media.tumblr.com/4a7c1e80ed95403e491663e14728f2d3/tumblr_n02uqaRgZb1ryvq99o1_500.gif)

ARGH!!!

 ;)

Quote
I thought "The Time of the Doctor" said 300...but, could just be misremembering...

He had been there for 300 years between the time he made Clara leave and when she showed back up the first time. There was no mention of how long it was between that visit and when she came back as he was getting ready to die...

How old was the first doctor before his first regeneration?

Well, the second Doctor told Victoria he was around 450 years old in "The Tomb of the Cybermen" (and the first Doctor was supposed to have died of old age), but we all know the Doctor lies is rule 1...

Lost in time is..Hartnell and troughton? Or just Troughton? I have only seen the Aztec Story Arc with Hartnell,
thanks to BBC airing it as part of the Doctors Revisted, and would love to see more of Hartnell...

The "In the Beginning" boxed set has the first 3 serials, "An Unearthly Child", "The Daleks" and "The Edge of Destruction", and there are numerous other serials of the first Doctor's adventures available for purchase (I have the "In the Beginning" and "Lost in Time" boxed sets, as well as "The Dalek Invasion of Earth" and "The Tenth Planet" for the first Doctor myself...although I also have the novelizations of "The Daleks", "The Edge of Destruction", "The Sensorites", "The Romans", "The Space Museum", "The Time Meddler", "The Massacre" and "The Tenth Planet")...I wouldn't mind getting more myself...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 09 February 2014, 18:39:08
Personally my favorites among the 1st Doctor's run are some of his "no-monsters" stories. "The Aztecs", "The Planet of Giants", "The Romans". (I honestly think "The Romans" should stand up there with "City of Death" as one of the best stories from the classic series. If you can I suggest everyone should get a copy of it on DVD. The writing is...amazing!)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 13 February 2014, 19:53:26
Okay, I just wanted to hear your guy's thoughts on this:

What if Doctor Who had been American? (http://www.buzzfeed.com/newu456/what-if-doctor-who-was-american-5pxx)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Khymerion on 13 February 2014, 19:55:16
I would not have wanted to watch any of those...  well, except War Doctor Ford.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 13 February 2014, 20:17:48
Now that i see that I'm shocked they didn't actually try to make Goldblum the movie doctor
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: worktroll on 13 February 2014, 20:54:19
It might have been interesting to see how Vincent Price might have played the 3rd Doctor. Particularly facing the Roger Delgado Master. That might have been a double-act worth seeing!
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 13 February 2014, 20:58:28
It might have been interesting to see how Vincent Price might have played the 3rd Doctor. Particularly facing the Roger Delgado Master. That might have been a double-act worth seeing!

Oh I second that!!! O0
(Delgado will always be the Master as far as I'm concerned. Ainley would have been good, but they forced him to play it like Delgado. And Simm...never found him menacing or scary enough. Wish Jacobi would have been allowed to play it longer.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: worktroll on 13 February 2014, 21:23:21
The problem I always had was some character confusion: I found this:

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/9f/Master_Ainley.jpg)

as too close to this:

(http://vintage45.files.wordpress.com/2011/10/mcgee01.jpg?w=350&h=243)

Given Henry McGee's role as "Mr. Nastyperson" in The Goodies, I could never give Anthony Ainley a fair chance ...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 13 February 2014, 22:16:46
I really like the choice for the alternative American-cast Fifth Doctor.

The others are, for the most part, questionable. Although an older Ford as the War Doctor would have been something to see as well, I think.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 14 February 2014, 00:43:26
John DeLancie as the Master FTW. :)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Scotty on 14 February 2014, 01:32:53
I could definitely get behind Bryan Cranston as the 12th Doctor now, never mind in an alternate Americanized version from the start.  Seriously.  Bryan Cranston is fantastic.

Also Harrison Ford.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 14 February 2014, 04:53:12
Who related.  Sean Pertwee - Jon's lookalike son, is playing Alfred Pennyworth in Gotham PD.  (I'm unclear what the late Wayne's butler has to do with the police department though.)

On Topic: Christopher Walken is a much better choice than Colin Baker.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 14 February 2014, 09:06:27
Who related.  Sean Pertwee - Jon's lookalike son, is playing Alfred Pennyworth in Gotham PD.  (I'm unclear what the late Wayne's butler has to do with the police department though.)

I've not read up on the proposed synopsis for the Gotham television series lately... but last I heard, it was supposed to be showing bits of Bruce's childhood.

...

Even if it doesn't, the Waynes are the "Celebrity-Elite" of Gotham. They're always going to be under the watchful eye of GCPD. Perhaps Alfred will be managing whatever "relations" the Wayne family has with the Gotham City Police.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Marveryn on 14 February 2014, 09:58:11
we do know that the older wayne was a doctor  before he became rich.. sorry not up to date on batman lore so I Thomas wayne history is a bit vague with me.. but maybe he help the police from time to time.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ANS Kamas P81 on 14 February 2014, 11:07:54
Burgess Meredith as the crotchety old first doctor?  VINCENT PRICE as The Abominable Doctor Who?  Sweet mother of Gallifrey yes.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 14 February 2014, 18:21:40
The Waynes die in the pilot.  And in the final episode of season 13 (if we age going 1 year per season) Bruce dons the cape and cowl.  What really scares me is that they are planning for 'every' Batman villain to appear in the show.  Which crime do you figure 12 year old Selina Kyle will be committing?  (Remembering she is a cat burglar and ex-prostitute.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 14 February 2014, 20:35:02
John DeLancie as the Master FTW. :)

Thread won. That's it folks, everyone can go home now...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 14 February 2014, 21:06:47
Burgess Meredith as the crotchety old first doctor?  VINCENT PRICE as The Abominable Doctor Who?  Sweet mother of Gallifrey yes.
63-66 Burgess Meredith is the Doctor.  66-69 he is the Penguin.  Talk about a step down.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 15 February 2014, 03:26:39
Thread won. That's it folks, everyone can go home now...

What's really frightening is imagining the Master with the powers of Q.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 15 February 2014, 04:31:45
What's really frightening is imagining the Master with the powers of Q.

Even more frightening:  I can actually picture DeLancie playing the role of either the Doctor or the Master.  I dunno if anybody can pull off both roles.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 15 February 2014, 05:37:21
Even more frightening:  I can actually picture DeLancie playing the role of either the Doctor or the Master.  I dunno if anybody can pull off both roles.

Hmmm.

Are we talking of casting mischievous TNG-era DeLancie in "Classic Who" or an older-more-mellow DeLancie cast instead in "NuWho?"

I'd be happy with either choice, really.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 15 February 2014, 06:58:58
Hmm, if we can't have Bryan Cranston as the Doctor, maybe he can be the next Master?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 15 February 2014, 09:48:14
This is really sad. I mean it really is. He did a lot of great episodes.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tvandradio/doctor-who/10640524/Doctor-Who-director-dies-after-escalator-fall.html (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tvandradio/doctor-who/10640524/Doctor-Who-director-dies-after-escalator-fall.html)

(But the manner in which he....)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 15 February 2014, 12:18:31
Hmmm.

Are we talking of casting mischievous TNG-era DeLancie in "Classic Who" or an older-more-mellow DeLancie cast instead in "NuWho?"

I'd be happy with either choice, really.

Either one will work, MHO.
This is really sad. I mean it really is. He did a lot of great episodes.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tvandradio/doctor-who/10640524/Doctor-Who-director-dies-after-escalator-fall.html (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tvandradio/doctor-who/10640524/Doctor-Who-director-dies-after-escalator-fall.html)

(But the manner in which he....)

RIP.   :(
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 19 March 2014, 01:42:22
Hi all,

OK, I'm pretty much caught up to the current state of affairs now.  But there is something in "The Name of the Doctor" that's really bugging me.  Has to do with what seems to me is a glaring inconsistency in the 11th Doctor's character.

So, we know that the Doctor is less merciful than he was before the Time War (by the 10th Doctor's own admission), but what's getting me is the scene where the Great Intelligence and his Whisper Men attempt to blackmail the Doctor in order to gain admission to the latter's tomb (the derelict, oversized TARDIS on future Trenzalore).  The Doctor's true name needs to be spoken in order to do so, and even as the Whisper Men come quite close indeed to killing his companion and friends, he continues to hesitate and seems ready to try and negotiate with the G.I.  It's finally River Song (basically a ghost at this point) who speaks his name (Clara having forgotten what she saw in the Time War book), saving the others and allowing access to the tomb.

Something's wrong here.  This kind of self-serving, skin-saving reaction seems just totally uncharacteristic of the Doctor--this one, anyway.  Is this the same Doctor who said he would gladly sacrifice a nuclear-armed submarine, with himself still on it, to prevent World War III breaking out ("Cold War")?  If I were Clara and the Paternoster Gang, I think I would have a *great* deal less respect for--and trust of--the Doctor after this little episode.  Was he really willing to throw their lives away in order to avoid giving the G.I. what it wanted?

The only way I can rationalize this is through a "needs of the many" way of thinking, which the Doctor has shown a number of times before.  If the Doctor had some notion of what was going to happen should the G.I. gain access to his timestream, and knew that it would result in the deaths of billions (which did happen, until Clara set things right) then letting a handful of people die in order to save all those lives--even including his best friend--would be consistent with that way of seeing things.  But this is basically the same decision the War Doctor faced when he used The Moment to destroy Gallifrey, and even he later came to see (in "The Day of the Doctor") that would've been the wrong decision.***  And just as with that decision, the 11th Doctor might have been able to live with it initially, but it would end up eating away at him as time went on.  And remember, he's already allowed a companion to die once--has he ever come to terms with that?

So, whether it was the Doctor or River who spoke the name and opened the tomb was ultimately immaterial, as the outcome would've been the same.  But the fact that it was River who did it considerably diminished the character of the Doctor in my eyes--and should have in the eyes of his friends too. 
 

***Technically speaking, did the War Doctor ever actually destroy Gallifrey?  Or has the whole revived series up until now been predicated on a premise that was (retroactively) actually false?   

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 19 March 2014, 02:02:50
He believed he trapped Gallifrey in the void between universes along with the Daleks.  Even Rassilon and the Council believed this.  And that was certainly where the bulk of the Daleks were, until the alternate Earth Cybermen and Torchwood/UNIT opened the door.
And the key here is belief.  Everything the Doctor did in his next four lives (Eccleston, Tennant 1&2, and Smith) was based on this belief.  Only now, after Trenzalore, does he know the truth.  Gallifrey Falls No More.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 19 March 2014, 10:04:52
GreenDragon has the right of it.

The ONLY thing I would add... is a point of emphasis that Moffat did state that the Name, Day, and Time of the Doctor episodes would comprise something of a shift in the character of the Doctor, and the way in which DW stories would be told in the future.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: glitterboy2098 on 19 March 2014, 18:38:04
Hi all,

OK, I'm pretty much caught up to the current state of affairs now.  But there is something in "The Name of the Doctor" that's really bugging me.  Has to do with what seems to me is a glaring inconsistency in the 11th Doctor's character.

So, we know that the Doctor is less merciful than he was before the Time War (by the 10th Doctor's own admission), but what's getting me is the scene where the Great Intelligence and his Whisper Men attempt to blackmail the Doctor in order to gain admission to the latter's tomb (the derelict, oversized TARDIS on future Trenzalore).  The Doctor's true name needs to be spoken in order to do so, and even as the Whisper Men come quite close indeed to killing his companion and friends, he continues to hesitate and seems ready to try and negotiate with the G.I.  It's finally River Song (basically a ghost at this point) who speaks his name (Clara having forgotten what she saw in the Time War book), saving the others and allowing access to the tomb.

Something's wrong here.  This kind of self-serving, skin-saving reaction seems just totally uncharacteristic of the Doctor--this one, anyway.  Is this the same Doctor who said he would gladly sacrifice a nuclear-armed submarine, with himself still on it, to prevent World War III breaking out ("Cold War")?  If I were Clara and the Paternoster Gang, I think I would have a *great* deal less respect for--and trust of--the Doctor after this little episode.  Was he really willing to throw their lives away in order to avoid giving the G.I. what it wanted?

The only way I can rationalize this is through a "needs of the many" way of thinking, which the Doctor has shown a number of times before.  If the Doctor had some notion of what was going to happen should the G.I. gain access to his timestream, and knew that it would result in the deaths of billions (which did happen, until Clara set things right) then letting a handful of people die in order to save all those lives--even including his best friend--would be consistent with that way of seeing things.  But this is basically the same decision the War Doctor faced when he used The Moment to destroy Gallifrey, and even he later came to see (in "The Day of the Doctor") that would've been the wrong decision.***  And just as with that decision, the 11th Doctor might have been able to live with it initially, but it would end up eating away at him as time went on.  And remember, he's already allowed a companion to die once--has he ever come to terms with that?

So, whether it was the Doctor or River who spoke the name and opened the tomb was ultimately immaterial, as the outcome would've been the same.  But the fact that it was River who did it considerably diminished the character of the Doctor in my eyes--and should have in the eyes of his friends too. 
 

***Technically speaking, did the War Doctor ever actually destroy Gallifrey?  Or has the whole revived series up until now been predicated on a premise that was (retroactively) actually false?   

cheers,

Gabe

keep in mind.. the Doctor had been told that saying his name while on that planet would bring about destruction on a universal scale.

so as far as the Doctor knew, stating his true name at that time and that place would cause far more damage than what he and his companions were being threatened with. so him trying to avoid answering (since he would have to say the truth) was in character. and to be honest, with the two main combatants of the time war now free (the timelords and the Daleks), lots of destruction seems probable.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 20 March 2014, 02:15:12
keep in mind.. the Doctor had been told that saying his name while on that planet would bring about destruction on a universal scale.

so as far as the Doctor knew, stating his true name at that time and that place would cause far more damage than what he and his companions were being threatened with. so him trying to avoid answering (since he would have to say the truth) was in character. and to be honest, with the two main combatants of the time war now free (the timelords and the Daleks), lots of destruction seems probable.

Yes, but was that still the case on the future Trenzalore seen in "The Name of The Doctor"?  My guess is the state of the planet in that story showed what would've happened had the Time Lords not granted the Doctor a new life cycle, the Doctor finally died of old age (or was killed by the Daleks), and the Papal Mainframe finally followed through on their threat to glass the world.

So, I think I've answered my own question about whether or not the War Doctor actually destroyed Gallifrey.  He couldn't have.  After all, the entire reason the Doctor ends up at Trenzalore in the first place is because that's where the Time Lords are trying to break through, after Gallifrey has been hidden away in "The Day of the Doctor".  If Gallifrey actually had been destroyed, there never would've been a siege of Trenzalore to start with.   

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ColonelCody on 20 March 2014, 04:52:21
Does anyone have a hard date for the new episodes to start in the US on BBC America??
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 20 March 2014, 04:56:27
There isn't even a date for UK airings yet.  I believe they're talking about one full series in August instead of splitting it in two again.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 20 March 2014, 23:37:46
Just watched "The Doctor's Wife" (really good episode by the way), and it has brought up a point I have trouble with in the 50th and the season finale.

Namely that the Doctor never destroyed Gallifrey. He locked it and the entire time war in a time lock. That's what the moment did. "The Stolen Earth"/"Journey's End", "The End of Time" show this. And in fact he didn't do it to protect the Time Lords, he did it to protect the Universe from the Time Lords (remember the Lord High President (Rassilon) and the other members of the High Council wanted to destroy the universe. (The same as Davros and the Daleks incidentally.)

But back to "The Doctor's Wife"...there is a moment where the Doctor is talking to Amy and Rory about the other Time Lord he thinks may be there. And he is talking about what he did and why he did it.

So that's my biggest problem with the last two episodes. They directly contradict "The End of Time" in how they portray the Time Lords. So if the Doctor was so terrified of them coming back that he was (for a second) ready to kill the Master to prevent it, why would he be happy now? Also why would they give him a new set of regenerations?

I don't know...there are and have been conflicts in continuity, but this seems like a blatant rewrite. Maybe there is a plan behind this, but I can't see it.

(Also, I have to be honest, the way the Doctor got his new regenerations felt sooo lame. I was expecting something exciting and then got that...fan-fic...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 21 March 2014, 00:12:26
Actually it is not as contradictory/inconsistent as you might think.  The End of Time made it pretty clear that The Moment was in possession of the Doctor and had not been resolved in it's use yet.  This could have caused a temporary/limited time lock while that particular event played out and the Oracle was foretelling the fall of Gallifrey, not it's imprisonment.  This is backed up by how they decided to send an escape plan back in time to the Master.

With Rassilon's death it is entirely plausible that he was exerting some rather extraordinary influence on much of the rest of the High Council that was now removed and they were able to see how misguided they had become under his rather despotic leadership.

So when the Moment was resolved and the Doctor realized he had found another way and that Rassilon and his scheme was at an end he had a change of heart about the return of Gallifrey.

At least that's my theory as best as I can cram it into the available evidence.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 21 March 2014, 01:16:02
So that's my biggest problem with the last two episodes. They directly contradict "The End of Time" in how they portray the Time Lords. So if the Doctor was so terrified of them coming back that he was (for a second) ready to kill the Master to prevent it, why would he be happy now? Also why would they give him a new set of regenerations?

Well, he got them into the pocket universe, he's probably the only one who can get them out.  By giving him a full set of regenerations, rather than just one or two, they increase the chance that eventually he'll find a way to get them out of it.

Also, could be that one of the reasons the war went south for the Time Lords was a disconnect between the politicians and the military, as so often happens in real life.  The Time Lord general is heard commenting to his subordinate about the High Council that "they have their own plan", which the generals apparently weren't privy to.  So, if/when Gallifrey is eventually released, how the Doctor (and us) should receive the Time Lords depends on which faction is in control.  The military seemed to have at least a shred of decency left. 

The scariest option is that the Master has killed Rassilon and taken control of the High Council. 

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ANS Kamas P81 on 21 March 2014, 06:39:34
keep in mind.. the Doctor had been told that saying his name while on that planet would bring about destruction on a universal scale.
Well, that super-regeneration sure as hell did for the Daleks.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 21 March 2014, 21:18:31
There isn't even a date for UK airings yet.  I believe they're talking about one full series in August instead of splitting it in two again.

Really? Last I read, which was last month, it stated that we'd get the full 13-episode Eighth Season without the split.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 21 March 2014, 21:31:53
That's what I said - no split this year.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 21 March 2014, 23:47:14
Why does the BBC do this?  Looking back over the program's history, it seems they've never settled it into a consistent schedule.  Personally I had no problem with the split schedule.

Since all 13 episodes will air from August to December, the season will presumably end with the Christmas special--when something big usually happens.  Any word yet on whether Peter Capaldi will return for another series?

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 22 March 2014, 02:15:30
There is a rumor he's a one and done, and is just here to ride out Moffatt's final year, while all his dangling plots are resolved. 
By the way, the same rumor says that this is Moffatt's final year.

Also rumored (by McCoy) the Master has been cast.  It is further rumored that we saw him last year, working with Clara.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 22 March 2014, 02:27:59
Hmmm...have a little theory about the Valeyard...you know how he was supposed to be a distillation of all of the Doctor's worst attributes? Well...I think we may have already seen him...

My theory...the Valeyard is the Dream Lord from "Amy's Choice". Yes, yes. The Doctor said it was just that weird spore thingy. But rule #1....the Doctor lies. Also, why did the Doctor see a reflection of the Dream Lord at the end? So the Doctor's explanation is that the spores fed or were directed or whatever by the Doctor's darker side. Isn't that exactly what the Valeyard is?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 22 March 2014, 22:52:48
Hmmm...have a little theory about the Valeyard...you know how he was supposed to be a distillation of all of the Doctor's worst attributes? Well...I think we may have already seen him...

My theory...the Valeyard is the Dream Lord from "Amy's Choice". Yes, yes. The Doctor said it was just that weird spore thingy. But rule #1....the Doctor lies. Also, why did the Doctor see a reflection of the Dream Lord at the end? So the Doctor's explanation is that the spores fed or were directed or whatever by the Doctor's darker side. Isn't that exactly what the Valeyard is?

I was thinking the same thing when I saw that episode, "that actor would make a great Valeyard."

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 24 March 2014, 21:19:17
Another thing I missed the boat on:  why was there no full series in 2009?

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 25 March 2014, 04:26:39
According to Russell T. Davies (in The Writer's Tale) it was to allow Steven Moffat and the incoming production team enough time to get up to speed and prepare for their first series.  While David Tennant took the opportunity of the shorter work year on the show to play Hamlet, he decided to do so after he was informed of the show.  It's often assumed that the specials were in response to Tennant's desire to get back into theatre.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 25 March 2014, 22:43:03
That's what I said - no split this year.

Sorry, I was reading your earlier reply on a smaller screen and I missed a little of your post.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 25 March 2014, 22:44:26
According to Russell T. Davies (in The Writer's Tale) it was to allow Steven Moffat and the incoming production team enough time to get up to speed and prepare for their first series.  While David Tennant took the opportunity of the shorter work year on the show to play Hamlet, he decided to do so after he was informed of the show.  It's often assumed that the specials were in response to Tennant's desire to get back into theatre.

It had a little to do with Moffat's crosswork on Sherlock as well, which also tended to absorb a lot of his production time.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 26 March 2014, 03:20:48
That might also explain why Sherlock is only 3 2hr episodes a year.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Klep on 26 March 2014, 10:18:01
That might also explain why Sherlock is only 3 2hr episodes a year.
Actually it's Doctor Who that's more the outlier in that regard. Most British television only runs a handful of episodes per "series".  Sherlock's production cycle is fairly typical for the BBC.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 27 March 2014, 12:28:55
What Klep said. I think the average is 4 or 6 episodes a series for most shows.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 27 March 2014, 14:25:09
Most of the ones I've watched were 13.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 27 March 2014, 15:14:07
It really depends on the show.  Comedies tend to be 6-12 episodes per series, dramas anything from 2-14.  Some shows will have multiple series in a given year, especially popular magazine shows like Top Gear and panel shows like QI or Never Mind the Buzzcocks.  And there are some shows that run all year around, especially soap operas (which will run 2-5 episodes per week all year around!).

Doctor Who, for example ran for between 39 and 45 weeks in the year during the First and Second Doctor's tenures, before settling into 25-26 weeks for the Third Doctor and hovering around that until the Sixth Doctor's first year, when they switched to 14 45 minute episodes, and then 14 half hour episodes for his second year and the Seventh's three years.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 29 March 2014, 10:32:16
OK, so I just went to see "Mr. Peabody and Sherman" (actually managed to get an English-language showing here in China)...and while I never paid much attention to the original cartoons as a kid, there is something oddly familiar about the setup...

Considering that "The Rocky and Bullwinkle Show" aired from 1959-1964, is it at all conceivable that Mr. Peabody and his WABAC machine were at least a partial inspiration for the Doctor and the TARDIS???

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 29 March 2014, 11:15:32
Probably not, as I understand it American TV wasn't regularly imported to the UK until the 70s.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 29 March 2014, 11:47:15
Probably not, as I understand it American TV wasn't regularly imported to the UK until the 70s.

But recall that the creator of Dr. Who, Sydney Newman, was Canadian, and from Toronto.  As such he would've been fairly familiar with American TV programs.  Although, at the time Rocky and Bullwinkle began, he would've been working for what's now ITV...

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 31 March 2014, 03:03:21
Not a good week for past Doctor Who contributors...

Kate O'Mara, who played the Rani, has passed away age 74:
http://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-26809417 (http://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-26809417).

And earlier, Arthur Martinus, director of "The Tenth Planet" (and a few other Who serials), was, um, "upgraded" (depending on your spiritual point of view):
http://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-26789825 (http://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-26789825)

cheers,

Gabe

Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 03 April 2014, 07:34:26
Here you can see another shot of Peter Capaldi and Jenna Coleman on set, with Capaldi already changed into the new costume:

http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/tv/s7/doctor-who/news/a556148/doctor-who-peter-capaldis-first-episode-thrilling-says-mark-gatiss.html#~oAn7hAgESSDcnq (http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/tv/s7/doctor-who/news/a556148/doctor-who-peter-capaldis-first-episode-thrilling-says-mark-gatiss.html#~oAn7hAgESSDcnq)

I think the look on Jenna's face says it all about how Clara is dealing with this new Doctor...

Capaldi looks visibly older than he did in "The Fires of Pompeii".  :(  If he's really not staying around for more than one series, perhaps there's a reason...

cheers,

Gabe

Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 03 April 2014, 10:15:07
But recall that the creator of Dr. Who, Sydney Newman, was Canadian, and from Toronto.  As such he would've been fairly familiar with American TV programs.  Although, at the time Rocky and Bullwinkle began, he would've been working for what's now ITV...

cheers,

Gabe

Except Sidney Newman wasn't involved with creating the show. Not to that degree at least. In, it was one of the script writers (forget his name), who came up with the idea of a police box. Because they were so common at that time. The original idea had been that it would change its appearance each story, however that was deemed too expensive. So the police box staid.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 03 April 2014, 21:46:22
Except Sidney Newman wasn't involved with creating the show. Not to that degree at least. In, it was one of the script writers (forget his name), who came up with the idea of a police box. Because they were so common at that time. The original idea had been that it would change its appearance each story, however that was deemed too expensive. So the police box staid.

I didn't mean the police box specifically, I meant the general idea of somebody with encyclopedic knowledge, a time machine, and a traveling companion.  Why settle for a cartoon talking dog when you could do it live-action?

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Marveryn on 06 April 2014, 00:19:13
the tardis was always explain to not be perfect with lots of issue, among thing the doctor never got around to fixing was the tardis ability to change its outer appearance.  I not positive but I think he did manage to get it working for a few shows.  Maybe during the original run when they were doing historical shows
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 06 April 2014, 11:52:22
He did, but always decided he was too attached to the police box. From what I understand his TARDIS was going to be scrapped when he stole it.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 07 May 2014, 09:29:44
OK, still getting caught up on odds and ends, this time "The Angels Take Manhattan". 

First of all, SHAME ON YOU STEVEN MOFFAT, FOR NOT BEING ABLE TO TELL THE QIN AND QIN*G* DYNASTIES APART!  If you're going to have both the universe's foremost time traveller and a far-future archaeologist make allusions to Chinese culture and history, the least you could do is have a competent Chinese history consultant to make sure you got it right!!!
(see below for further comments)

Second, just how long were Amy and Rory travelling with the Doctor?  How much time passed for them, compared to the friends and family they left behind?  Was the Doctor kidding when he alluded to Amy's having aged visibly?

Also, I've been getting caught up on that *OTHER* (ahem) series Moffat is showrunner for, and I've noticed a couple of things.

The portrayal of the Tong gang, and especially the Chinese circus in "The Blind Banker" was really quite anachronistic, being far more suited to the original setting of the Holmes stories than modern times--and the gang was even based in the wrong area of China.  Combined with the error noted above, I think it shows just how much Moffat really knows about China--a reflection of lingering colonial attitudes among the Brits?  (Then again, I'm hardly objective...)

How much creative control and micro-managing does Moffat exert?  Does he go so far as to "suggest" how the actors should portray their characters?  I wonder, because "Sherlock"'s Irene Adler seems in some ways like an amped-up River Song, while the portryal of Moriarty is more than a bit reminiscent of John Simm's "Mad-ster" (although that predates the Moffat era of Doctor Who).

And does Moffat have some obsession with psychopaths?  His Sherlock, Moriarty, and Adler are all fundamentally the same kind of person (Moffat himself described them as such), and in "The Time of the Doctor", the Doctor pretty much calls Tasha Lem a psychopath to her face.  River was engineered to be a psychopath, and gives that as one of the reasons why she won't travel full-time with the Doctor, even hinting the Doctor hismelf is one.  What gives here?

cheers,

Gabe   


Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ColonelCody on 07 May 2014, 11:34:30
the tardis was always explain to not be perfect with lots of issue, among thing the doctor never got around to fixing was the tardis ability to change its outer appearance.  I not positive but I think he did manage to get it working for a few shows.  Maybe during the original run when they were doing historical shows
He stole it broken and only got around to fixing it during the Tom Baker run I believe, but if I'm not mistaken he decided to leave it as it had become something of a signature for him.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 07 May 2014, 23:35:30
He stole it broken and only got around to fixing it during the Tom Baker run I believe, but if I'm not mistaken he decided to leave it as it had become something of a signature for him.

IIRC, only the Sixth Doctor got the chameleon circuit working again.  However, he didn't get it working *right*--it never produced an appearance for the TARDIS that matched the location--and he just set it back to police box, for exactly the reasons you mention.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Stormlion1 on 10 May 2014, 00:28:14
The Doctor didn't steal the Tardis. The Tardis stole the Doctor.  ;)

And while it didn't always take him where he wanted to go, it took him where he needed to be.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 10 May 2014, 07:19:26
The Doctor didn't steal the Tardis. The Tardis stole the Doctor.  ;)

And while it didn't always take him where he wanted to go, it took him where he needed to be.

But he (and we) didn't know that for the longest time, until the TARDIS told him.  ;)  :D

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: DEZOAT on 10 May 2014, 11:21:24
 Man I wish this season would start right now , but no we have to wait til Aug. :'(
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 10 May 2014, 12:10:34
Hasn't it been postponed till next year?


(Sorry...sorry, couldn't resist.)


So what does everyone think about the photo of Janet Fielding and Peter Capaldi? Anyone think Tegan is coming back? I always rather liked Tegan. It was a shame they never really gave her much to do. Could have had a really great arc. Could have had her character grow so much. Such a wasted opportunity.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ds9guy on 10 May 2014, 18:56:26
What photo of Janet Fielding and Capaldi?  Is Teegan coming back to the show?

Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 10 May 2014, 19:33:50
What photo of Janet Fielding and Capaldi?  Is Teegan coming back to the show?

(http://spdk1.files.wordpress.com/2014/03/janet-fielding-peter-capaldi.jpg)

It was a photo Janet Fielding tweeted a few months ago. And no, there's been no official word on whether she will be returning to the show or not. But we can hope. ;)

(Btw, she has been doing a very good job on the Big Finish audio dramas. If any of you guys haven't listened to any, I would strongly recommend them.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 11 May 2014, 16:41:09
What it be wrong for me to think that having Janet Fielding as companion seem to better fit Capaldi since they look like there roughly the same age?  Having older looking doctor hanging out with a 20-something who was in love with each other at one point seems to be odd to me.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 11 May 2014, 16:45:30
What it be wrong for me to think that having Janet Fielding as companion seem to better fit Capaldi since they look like there roughly the same age?  Having older looking doctor hanging out with a 20-something who was in love with each other at one point seems to be odd to me.

The Doctor is over 900 years old. Once you realize that...even the Doctor/Rose thing is a bit...

Honestly? No, she'll probably only be in for an episode. Besides Clara was never in love with the Doctor.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 11 May 2014, 18:56:46
The Doctor is over 900 years old. Once you realize that...even the Doctor/Rose thing is a bit...

Honestly? No, she'll probably only be in for an episode. Besides Clara was never in love with the Doctor.

Didn't the truthfield on Tranzalore make Clara say something like "And I'm flitting about time and space with this guy because I fanc..." And then she grasped her mouth to prevent her from finishing the sentence...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: worktroll on 11 May 2014, 19:38:15
The Doctor is over 900 years old. Once you realize that...even the Doctor/Rose thing is a bit...

The Doctor isn't even human. Humans must seem to a Gallifreyan like particularly clever dogs (which I trust you'd agree fits how most Doctors have treated their companions). Which then makes the Doctor/Rose thing even more ...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 11 May 2014, 19:59:54
The Doctor is over 900 years old. Once you realize that...even the Doctor/Rose thing is a bit...

Honestly? No, she'll probably only be in for an episode. Besides Clara was never in love with the Doctor.

If you look at it from that standpoint, then ALL of the Doctor's female companions (save perhaps Romana) have been a bit...um...

I do think Clara was in love with the Doctor.  Seems there were some scenes and dialogue from "Time of the Doctor" left on the cutting-room floor where she pretty much stated so.


And I've already seen spoilers from the opening sequences of the upcoming 1st episode, as Clara watches the Doctor struggle through his post-regeneration trauma.  Throughout this sequence, I must say, though Jenna Coleman doesn't say a word, the expression on her face perfectly captures shock, bewilderment, pain, and loss all at the same time, as she realizes the man she knew--and probably loved--is gone for good.


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 11 May 2014, 20:05:39
If they did intend for her to fall in love with the Doctor...that would actually ruin the character for me. I reason why I liked her was that she didn't seem to be in love with him. Had affection for him certainly, but not love.

I can't tell you how tired I am of the way the revived series has been insisting that the only way they can justify having a female companion is if she falls in love with him. Why I enjoyed Donna's time so much. They were just best mates, nothing else going on. No need for anything else to go on. And that's why I found Amy so annoying.

Why do we need that aspect? The classic series didn't need it. The only classic companions I can think of that had feelings for the Doctor were Jo, Romana and maybe Peri.

Can't we have one that's just a friend relationship? Or maybe the teacher/student like Hartnell had at the beginning or 7 and Ace?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 12 May 2014, 02:29:07
If they did intend for her to fall in love with the Doctor...that would actually ruin the character for me. I reason why I liked her was that she didn't seem to be in love with him. Had affection for him certainly, but not love.

Reactions like that are probably why they cut that scene. :P

I can't tell you how tired I am of the way the revived series has been insisting that the only way they can justify having a female companion is if she falls in love with him. Why I enjoyed Donna's time so much. They were just best mates, nothing else going on. No need for anything else to go on. And that's why I found Amy so annoying.

Why do we need that aspect? The classic series didn't need it. The only classic companions I can think of that had feelings for the Doctor were Jo, Romana and maybe Peri.

Can't we have one that's just a friend relationship? Or maybe the teacher/student like Hartnell had at the beginning or 7 and Ace?

I think it's going to have to be that way from now on, now that the Doctor clearly looks old enough to be Clara's father.  Personally, I felt the romantic affection only went one way.  The Doctor looked at and treated Clara more like a cute kid sister, and eventually a daughter as he aged during the Siege of Trenzalore.  I think he learned his lesson with the Rose/Martha experience, and was why he insisted on having Rory along with Amy, even if Rory was frequently just comic relief.
(though you can get into a whole bunch of issues with River being Amy's daughter and whatnot...)

And it's been implied previously that Sarah Jane and the Fourth Doctor had more than just platonic feelings for each other--that was one of the reasons why he abandoned her.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 17 May 2014, 12:07:06
A little bit of a mash-up:

(https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/t1.0-9/q85/s720x720/1965028_10152069791445009_1711853187366658738_n.jpg)


That...would actually be pretty epic...  ;D O0
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: DEZOAT on 18 May 2014, 13:56:17
 YA!! That would be very epic. My only question is which doctor would you use for that epic stand?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Medron Pryde on 18 May 2014, 19:41:43
The War Doctor...

;)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Stormlion1 on 19 May 2014, 10:15:00
Needs some humor so it would have to be the Fouth Doctor.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 29 June 2014, 22:47:21
Arise Whovians!, a promo for the new season Doctor Who has been posted.

Here! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UKyKI2Gg8HU)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 29 June 2014, 23:04:34
Cool!! Just a few days before my birthday. Awesome. ;D

I can't wait. (I just hope we get better stories, the last couple years have been rather dull and unmemorable.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 30 June 2014, 01:50:05
Yeah,whole Matt Smith run seems more like a collection of fanfics than a real show....
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 30 June 2014, 01:59:03
So...any thoughts on the upcoming world tour?

(A world tour.  Whatever happened to "I got too big" ?)

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 30 June 2014, 03:01:25
Yeah,whole Matt Smith run seems more like a collection of fanfics than a real show....


Glad to see I'm not the only one that feels that way.
It's odd though...Moffet can and does write brilliant Doctor Who ("Blink" anybody?)...just not since taking hold of the reins...

So...any thoughts on the upcoming world tour?

(A world tour.  Whatever happened to "I got too big" ?)

cheers,

Gabe

World Tour? You lost me...
What's up with a world tour?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 30 June 2014, 11:54:43
Glad to see I'm not the only one that feels that way.
It's odd though...Moffet can and does write brilliant Doctor Who ("Blink" anybody?)...just not since taking hold of the reins...

More and more, I feel like I'm the only one on this forum who will actually remember the Smith years fondly.
While I agree some of the stories were a bit lacking (OK, "Nightmare In Silver" was pretty crappy), I hold to my opinion on my preference for Matt Smith's characterization of the Doctor, as opposed to Tennant's and Eccleston's.
Especially the way he went out in "The Time of The Doctor"--Tennant's farewell just seemed so petulant and immature by comparison.

World Tour? You lost me...
What's up with a world tour?

You mean, you hadn't heard?

http://www.doctorwhonews.net/2014/06/doctor-who-world-tour.html (http://www.doctorwhonews.net/2014/06/doctor-who-world-tour.html)

cheers,

Gabe

Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 30 June 2014, 13:06:38
Don't worry, I'm with you on the Smith front.  Some of the arc storylines fell flat, but I'd rate his era overall higher than the last couple of years of David Tennant's for sure.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 30 June 2014, 13:12:13
@gyedid.


I don't have any problem with Smith's Doctor. I liked him, I think he is fantastic. Just like all of the ones before him. I just don't think he had many good stories to support him. That and I just got annoyed with Moffet bashing us over the head with melodrama. I mean, seriously, how many times did Amy or Rory die? A companions death should be a major thing. Look at Adric's. Or Donna's (I know, I know). But by the time they finally did leave, I have to be honest and say I was relieved to finally see them go.


I can't speak for anyone else, but it's not a problem with Smith for me...just with the writing of the stories he had during his tenure. I don't know...can't really explain how I feel about them. It's like...Moffet tried to make everything far too epic and every episode a blockbuster, and they simply collapsed from the weight. To me at least, the best stories of those series are the small ones.


Actually...I think that was a great way for Tennant to go out. Because that fit his character. He was petulant and immature. People forget that. But it does show though at times. One of the biggest is the way he treated Martha. He was basically just leading her on...
Though I will say Eccleston wouldn't have been so quick to fight and kill as Smith was.


(By the way, my favorite Doctor is Sylvester McCoy.


And your link doesn't work.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Medron Pryde on 30 June 2014, 19:05:58
Tennant's Doctor was "forever" separated from the woman he'd grown to love.  Yeah...he was pissed...

As for Smith...yeah...I do like his DOCTOR.  He brought more carefree joy to the character than either of the other two.  The others had elements of it.  "The Doctor Dances" and stuff like that.  But I too was happy to see Amy and Rory leave.  Too much...whatever...there.  And as noted above, every story tried to be epic and therefore brought them all down.

The new companion I actually rank up with Rose and I can't wait to see what the new Doctor does.  :)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 30 June 2014, 19:55:52
I've been thinking about it today and I think I know what it is. Moffet's favorite era of the classic series was when John Nathan-Turner was in charge. Mid-eighties. And I feel the exact same way about many of those stories as well.Some cool ideas, but overall stories are a bit "meh". So maybe Moffet is emulating JNT?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 30 June 2014, 20:52:44
I've been thinking about it today and I think I know what it is. Moffet's favorite era of the classic series was when John Nathan-Turner was in charge. Mid-eighties. And I feel the exact same way about many of those stories as well.Some cool ideas, but overall stories are a bit "meh". So maybe Moffet is emulating JNT?

JNT is reviled in some quarters as The Man Who Killed Doctor Who.  Emulating him wouldn't be a wise move IMO.
But I'd be inclined to agree with your assessment, given the way Moffatt continually references 80s storylines.  (Like, how many people except long-time fans of the classic series would've picked up on the Five Doctors reference in "The Time of The Doctor"?  Worst sort of fanboyism if you ask me.)

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 30 June 2014, 20:56:59
And your link doesn't work.

But I was just looking at that page when I copied the link in...

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 30 June 2014, 22:00:35
Moffat's problem is he's too big a fan.  Too many moments devoted to showing off, either by a display by the Doctor (in the Pandorica Opens, or the one with the giant Star Monster) or by someone talkng about him, just how great and important the Doctor is.  He was turned from unknown (in the Classic Era), to a Universe Wide Fairytale (the Davies Era), to a wildly popular Superstar.  And it brought the show down.  Combined with Moffat's seeming ignorance as to what teh word "continuity" means it almost ruined the feel of the show for me.  Smith's performance was all that saved it (well, and having a hot redhead to look at...).
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 04 July 2014, 20:19:45
You know, Classic Who often gets a bad rap for having a really low budget, but the early years were actually quite good. Of course there are some missteps, but Hartnel's era generally very good. Of course B&W filming is much more forgiving than color.
For example I'd cite "The Aztecs" as one of the best produced stories of the era. As well as "The Romans".

Oddly enough my favorites of then are the pure historical episodes. Something I'd like to see return. Would give the show a bit more depth instead of the formaliac monster-of-the-week.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 04 July 2014, 23:40:26
Don't know if anyone else has seen these or not, but here up some teasers for the new series:

"Am I a good man?" (http://youtu.be/XnEQVA2UmPs)

"I see into your soul Doctor..." (http://youtu.be/LbX4tNG_k3s)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 05 July 2014, 02:49:53
You know, Classic Who often gets a bad rap for having a really low budget, but the early years were actually quite good. Of course there are some missteps, but Hartnel's era generally very good. Of course B&W filming is much more forgiving than color.
For example I'd cite "The Aztecs" as one of the best produced stories of the era. As well as "The Romans".

Oddly enough my favorites of then are the pure historical episodes. Something I'd like to see return. Would give the show a bit more depth instead of the formaliac monster-of-the-week.
That would be a welcome change.  Especially if it means the monsters that were really scary their first appearance, and have now become just this side of a "ho-hum, them again" - like the weeping Angels - don't get an episode because of that selection.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 05 July 2014, 03:18:05
Yeah, some of the enemies are overused.  And the bad writing under Moffat isnt helping.

Weeping Angeks under Davies: cool and scary.  Weeping Angels under Moffat:  eh, wake me up if I doze off...or not. 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 05 July 2014, 16:05:46
Don't know if anyone else has seen these or not, but here up some teasers for the new series:

"Am I a good man?" (http://youtu.be/XnEQVA2UmPs)

"I see into your soul Doctor..." (http://youtu.be/LbX4tNG_k3s)

I had seen the "Am I a good man?" trailer several times, but the above link was the first time I saw the "I see into your soul Doctor..." trailer...thank you...

And you know what irks me? Call me behind the times, but I do not own a Blue Ray player...so I got really ticked off when I saw that Best Buy had the blue ray version of season 5 (Matt Smith's first season, and the only season I do not yet own from the new series) for $20, but the DVD version is still priced at $70 there...

ARGH!

 [madflame] [tickedoff] [metalhealth]

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 05 July 2014, 16:09:56
I had seen the "Am I a good man?" trailer several times, but the above link was the first time I saw the "I see into your soul Doctor..." trailer...thank you...

And you know what irks me? Call me behind the times, but I do not own a Blue Ray player...so I got really ticked off when I saw that Best Buy had the blue ray version of season 5 (Matt Smith's first season, and the only season I do not yet own from the new series) for $20, but the DVD version is still priced at $70 there...

ARGH!

 [madflame] [tickedoff] [metalhealth]

Ruger

I know, riiiight? Go to Barnes and Noble to look at DVDs of the classic era and they're $40-$70 for one DVD. It's ridiculous. None of the other BBC shows there are quite so bad. (Though they are still marked up.) They're comparatively priced, but because of the £ to $ conversion...they go up double.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 05 July 2014, 16:22:23
I know, riiiight? Go to Barnes and Noble to look at DVDs of the classic era and they're $40-$70 for one DVD. It's ridiculous. None of the other BBC shows there are quite so bad. (Though they are still marked up.) They're comparatively priced, but because of the £ to $ conversion...they go up double.

Oh, I know...that's why most of my older serial DVD's were purchased used or with a large discount sale or special...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 05 July 2014, 16:35:26
Oh, I know...that's why most of my older serial DVD's were purchased used or with a large discount sale or special...

Ruger

Oddly enough...according to their website they're priced $10-$25 (for most of them). But if you go in to the actual store...they're way more than that....
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 05 July 2014, 17:46:32
Oddly enough...according to their website they're priced $10-$25 (for most of them). But if you go in to the actual store...they're way more than that....

Hadn't noticed that before...but I do see something else that doesn't make sense to me on there...they have the "War Games" DVD (10 thirty minute episodes) priced at $90+...but the "E-Space Trilogy" (12 thirty minute episodes) is less than $50, and the "Black Guardian" trilogy (also 12 thirty minute episodes) is just over $58...

How does that make sense?

 ???

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 05 July 2014, 21:57:44
How about Key to Time?  ~10 hours total, runs around $120-200.  Though they have some shorter ones at reasonable prices.  The first three episodes (Unearthly Child, the Daleks and Edge of Destruction), The 3 Doctors and The 5 Doctors are around $20-25.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Darth Nichos on 05 July 2014, 23:02:55
I swear that sounds like Davros to me in that second trailer; which would be kind of cool in my opinion. I have heard rumors that the "Master" is set to return as well
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 06 July 2014, 00:48:40
@ GreenDragon: Try looking in their website. It might be cheaper.

@Darth Nichos: Its Davros. Capaldi basically demanded a Dalek episode.
As for the Master...unless Moffet is going to completely ignore "The End of Time", the Master pretty much has to return. The only question...is who will he be played by. (And hopefully he will return to his more traditional menacing self. Simms just never felt like the Master to me.)

(Actually, I watched that three part arc that finished Martha's season...and have to say, the last two episodes were absolutely absurd. I think that is about the silly low point of the show.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 06 July 2014, 02:49:26
@ GreenDragon: Try looking in their website. It might be cheaper.

@Darth Nichos: Its Davros. Capaldi basically demanded a Dalek episode.
As for the Master...unless Moffet is going to completely ignore "The End of Time", the Master pretty much has to return. The only question...is who will he be played by. (And hopefully he will return to his more traditional menacing self. Simms just never felt like the Master to me.)

(Actually, I watched that three part arc that finished Martha's season...and have to say, the last two episodes were absolutely absurd. I think that is about the silly low point of the show.)
Responding to the bolded statement.  Another good example of the good in small doses, but less so with repetition.  Especially when the second time involved multiple copies.  Particularly weird is that, each of them is the Master - with all the ego that entails - but the Master that used to be PotUS still acted like PotUS, and the one that used to be a housewife still acted like a housewife.  As opposed to each one vying for supreme, personal, power.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 06 July 2014, 07:23:59
How about Key to Time?  ~10 hours total, runs around $120-200.  Though they have some shorter ones at reasonable prices.  The first three episodes (Unearthly Child, the Daleks and Edge of Destruction), The 3 Doctors and The 5 Doctors are around $20-25.

I got the Key to Time series for far less...think I bought a used boxed set...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 06 July 2014, 12:23:40
@ GreenDragon: Try looking in their website. It might be cheaper.

@Darth Nichos: Its Davros. Capaldi basically demanded a Dalek episode.
As for the Master...unless Moffet is going to completely ignore "The End of Time", the Master pretty much has to return. The only question...is who will he be played by. (And hopefully he will return to his more traditional menacing self. Simms just never felt like the Master to me.)


The Master will be played by Charles Dance, who up until a few weeks ago played Tywin Lannister on _Game of Thrones_.  What remains to be seen is whether it'll be a new regeneration, as with the Doctor, or simply an aged version of John Simm's "Mad-ster".

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 06 July 2014, 12:26:15
The Master will be played by Charles Dance, who up until a few weeks ago played Tywin Lannister on _Game of Thrones_.  What remains to be seen is whether it'll be a new regeneration, as with the Doctor, or simply an aged version of John Simm's "Mad-ster".

cheers,

Gabe

That's mere rumor at this point...so I wouldn't put too much stock into it until the BBC officially says one way or another.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 06 July 2014, 12:28:14

(Actually, I watched that three part arc that finished Martha's season...and have to say, the last two episodes were absolutely absurd. I think that is about the silly low point of the show.)

Really?  Despite what you said up-thread, you actually don't think the low point was among Matt Smith's stories? :P

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: StCptMara on 07 July 2014, 19:14:42
Really?  Despite what you said up-thread, you actually don't think the low point was among Matt Smith's stories? :P

cheers,

Gabe

Everyone has a favourite Doctor. But everyone has a Doctor they don't like. There are people who love Matt
Smith, and people who cannot stand Tom Baker. I liked Smith's Doctor, but was not too thrilled with Eccleston.
Then again, I don't think Eccleston really had enough time in the role for people to get used to him.

And, honestly, I think dissing on one Doctor or another's is really not very polite(at best). I know some people
could take attacks on their favourite Doctor as a personal attack(because, you know, fans are like that). That
said, personally, I have come to really like Hartnell's Doctor, and wish we had more like him, instead of all the
Troughton/Pertwee/Baker I inspiration.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 07 July 2014, 23:46:55
I like all the Doctors really.  The show writers....not necessarily.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: pheonixstorm on 08 July 2014, 00:11:13
I never got into Smith as the Doctor. Mainly because of how the show looked with his newest companion and her sidekick. Tennant I liked as he has his crazy momments and most of his companions I remember were more down to earth and not using T&A for extra male viewers (seriously, loved Donna but she wasn't made out to be a skimpy harlot and had more plain jane to her).

Favorite Dr for me was Dr #4. Any one remember him? I spent a lot of time watching Dr Who, Star Trek, and Incredible Hulk growing up. My gandfather was a sci-fi junky though I got my start with the premiere of Star Wars in 78.

If anyone doesn't have netflix and hasn't seen the older Who series it can be found there. Forget how much they have, but I know they have em as well as the newer shows. Might be worth the free trial to have a week long Dr Who binge. ;)  O0
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 08 July 2014, 00:24:33
I've watched all that Netflix has to offer for Doctor Who.  I do wish they had more as I did kind of like Pertwee but I still like Tennant best because I watched him do more with a facial expression then any of the others could do in several lines of dialogue.  Smith isn't my least favorite Doctor either though.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 08 July 2014, 00:39:43
Really?  Despite what you said up-thread, you actually don't think the low point was among Matt Smith's stories? :P

cheers,

Gabe

I think you are misinterpretting what  I was trying to say. I never said I disliked Matt Smith or his Doctor. (In fact I explicitly said otherwise.) However, I do have issues with the writing of the show during his run. Precisely because there were some really awesome ideas during that era. However, on the whole I feel that the writing didn't live up to the promise (so to speak).
I find it hard to explain how I feel l about the last few series. I don't hate them...but, I don't love them either...I guess, I always feel anti-climatic when I watch them. They always seem to promise so much...and I never feel that they quite lived up to it. Take the 50th Anniversary for example. I was really looking forward to that one. And it was a good story....just not for the 50th. Honestly, except for those two scenes at the end (with the 13 Doctors and then with the museum curator), it didn't feel like any sort of celebration. Yeah sure, it had two Doctors...but to me...it felt like they ran out of time and squished two episodes together into one. It was cool seeing the Zygons again, and it was awesome to have the War Doctor...however, it just felt like the stories would have been better served if they had been done as two separate episodes.
I guess that's my main complaint: Moffet just tries to be two epic...puts too much into a story. And you can tell when he has a knock-out story because it is generally very low key. "Vincent and the Doctor" for example.
I am critical of his run, maybe too much I admit. But it's not out of a spirit of meanness or hatred of Moffet. But because he brings so much promise to it, that it's a bit frustrating to see it fall short. (At least IMHO.)

And on the other hand, I don't hold the Davies era up on a pedestal. Eccleston's series was okay, they were still getting on their feet. The second series was a bit wobbly, but getting there. The third series...as much as I liked Martha (She was far superior to Rose in every way), there were a lot of misses in there. The fourth series...I have to admit, I feel this was the high point of the show. When you only have two weakish stories ("The Sontaran Stratagem"/"The Poison Sky"), that's pretty good. Then the year of special's..."The Next Doctor" is pretty good. "Planet of the Dead"...well, a good not-quite-companion, though the rest of the story was meh. "The Waters of Mars" was fantastic. "The End of Time"...two words: Timothy Dalton.

Out of all of the Smith stories, I think I like the ones with Clara best. I don't know...they just feel more...right.


(EDIT: If all of that is still incomprehinable....it's 12:40 in the morning and I've been up since 6 AM yesterday....)

HULU has some of the Classic series as well. Have to watch commercials though...

What I want to know is why can't either one show more of McCoy's stories? He's my favorite...
(And I was telling someone about "The Greatest Show in the Galaxy". They haaate clowns.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Medron Pryde on 08 July 2014, 00:53:18
I agree.

Something about Clara felt more right to me when it comes to Smith's doctor.  Just the low key way she talked to him.

In many ways I think her scenes in the 50th Anniversary and Smith's final episode really nailed her as a character.  And the way she stopped him in his tracks with just a few words.  I think they worked together and gelled very well as a team.  I will be interested in seeing how she and the new doctor work together.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: trboturtle on 08 July 2014, 01:09:26
A few musings.....

1) I think the Big Finish audios are great. Yes, there are a few stinkers ("Minute in Hell" comes to mind), but there are some great ones, and I think Colin Baker's Doctor gets some things he didn't during his TV stint --- Some good stories, his own companions and strong character development. The same for Paul McGann audios. (If ayone saw the mini-episode that saw the 8th Doctor regenerate into the War Doctor, where he calls out to his companions --- they were all audio adventure characters.) And now with Tom Baker doing a few audio adventures, it's a great way to get you classic doctors fix.

2) DVDs -- there's a certain store that has a website that carries everything Doctor Who. prices are better than the big box. Won't drop a link here, but there's enough info here to figure it out (I think they might be at Gencon, seeing as Indy's where the store is), Try there and see.

3) Matt Smith --- I liked his Doctor, but all the Doctors have something I liked about them, even Colin Baker's. I looking forward to Peter Capaldi's Doctor and see what he brings to the role.

4) Oh, and apparently some idiot managed to get ahold of the five or so of the scripts for the new season and has been posting them around. I hope they track whoever did it and string him up for Dalek target pratice......

Craig
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Medron Pryde on 08 July 2014, 05:02:33
ERASIATE!
ERASIATE!
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Darth Nichos on 14 July 2014, 02:08:57
New trailer is up
http://m.youtube.com/?#/watch?v=q6Yh0oBoKso

T-Rex stampeding London!
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Darth Nichos on 14 July 2014, 23:39:59
Oops my bad

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TivqZTq5u6Y

Does anyone else think the thing in :43 looks like Omega?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: I am Belch II on 14 July 2014, 23:54:29
Oops my bad

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TivqZTq5u6Y

Does anyone else think the thing in :43 looks like Omega?


Got to love a T-Rex walking thru London!!
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 15 July 2014, 00:03:29

Got to love a T-Rex walking thru London!!

But no Brigadier this time... :'(
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 15 July 2014, 16:28:45
Oops my bad

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TivqZTq5u6Y

Does anyone else think the thing in :43 looks like Omega?

Some kind of robotic knight I think.  Aren't we getting a bunch of robot episodes this time around?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 15 July 2014, 17:59:02
Cyborg wearing the Derby reminds me of Star Wars Empire Strike Back cyborg Londo had. Actor almost looks like him.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 15 July 2014, 22:15:48
New trailer is up
http://m.youtube.com/?#/watch?v=q6Yh0oBoKso

T-Rex stampeding London!

What I liked in the voice-over is the implication that the Doctor has been lying about his true age for some time  :P  Or, perhaps he's finally including the years he spent as the War Doctor in the count.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 15 July 2014, 22:20:40
What I liked in the voice-over is the implication that the Doctor has been lying about his true age for some time  :P  Or, perhaps he's finally including the years he spent as the War Doctor in the count.

Or it's just more proof Moffat doesn't know how to count
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Darth Nichos on 15 July 2014, 23:15:25
Or maybe the 12th Doctor and Clara had a bit of a break after his regeneration; it happened before with the 11th and the Ponds with him on his own for a time
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 16 July 2014, 00:45:38
Just watched "Midnight" again tonight. And I have to say, I think it's one of the best written stories in the entire 50 year history of the show. Except for a little bit at the beginning and at the end, there's no CGI. It's completely dialogue driven. I can't think of many other episodes that felt so intense. Especially at the end. And somehow, the creature in this story is one of the most scary. More so than the weeping angels. No, perhaps not exactly scary, more...disturbing. Yes, that's the word.

Anyway, what is everyone else's thoughts on this masterpiece of an episode?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 16 July 2014, 02:03:46
Or it's just more proof Moffat doesn't know how to count

Or they're including the time he spent on Christmas in the count.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 16 July 2014, 04:01:28
Still doesnt explain how the tenth doctor is ykunger than the seventh
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 16 July 2014, 04:26:34
Who was younger than the 6th, both of whom were younger than the 3rd.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 16 July 2014, 10:28:15
"Rule #1: The Doctor lies". Especially about his age. He is quite vain. He's probably quite old, even for a Time Lord. And is just trying to make himself sound younger. ;D
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 16 July 2014, 13:21:56
Or maybe the 12th Doctor and Clara had a bit of a break after his regeneration; it happened before with the 11th and the Ponds with him on his own for a time

It would be before the regeneration, I think.  Such a break could've occurred in the time between "The Name of the Doctor" and "The Day of the Doctor".  It was enough for Clara to have gone from live-in nanny to primary school teacher; unknown how much time passed for the Doctor.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 17 July 2014, 21:47:53
Isn't the current Doctor the 13th?  Or they not going count the War Doctor?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 17 July 2014, 22:21:13
Isn't the current Doctor the 13th?  Or they not going count the War Doctor?

Still not going to count that incarnation.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 18 July 2014, 00:52:21
Isn't the current Doctor the 13th?  Or they not going count the War Doctor?

Actually....technically....Capaldi is Doctor #14.

Doctor (Number of Regenerations) #1(0) Hartnell, #2(1) Troughton, #3(2) Pertwee, #4(3) Baker I, #5(4) Davison, #6(5) Baker II, #7(6) McCoy, #8(7) McGann, #9(8,) Hurt, #10(9) Eccleston, #11(10) Tennant, #12(11) Tennant 0.5, #13(12) Smith

John Hurt does count as far as regenerations go. But he put off the name of the Doctor during that incarnation (so Eccleston is still considered Doctor #9). And Tennant's regeneration in "The Stolen Earth/Journey's End" still counts, even though the Doctor shunted off the regeneration energy into his hand.

All that to say that Capaldi is the 12th Doctor, even though he is in his 14th body.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 18 July 2014, 05:22:15
Wait, I why in would anyone start counting from Zero?  I thought it wasn't regenerations, it was how many total bodies he had. Hartnell was the first to be the doctor.  Zero mean you have nothing if my old calculation are right.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: trboturtle on 18 July 2014, 09:20:02
Wait, I why in would anyone start counting from Zero?  I thought it wasn't regenerations, it was how many total bodies he had. Hartnell was the first to be the doctor.  Zero mean you have nothing if my old calculation are right.

0 in this case means the number of regenerations used --- Time Lords can regenerate up to twelve times. So Troughton was the first time the Doctor regenerated, Pertwee was the second time he regenerated, ect. Smith was the last of his first cycle of regenerations, Capaldi is the first regeneration of his second cycle --- Equivelent to Hartnell in the cycle.

Craig
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 25 July 2014, 13:42:53
Some interesting news:

1) http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/doctor-who-showrunner-says-peter-721153?utm_source=facebook (http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/doctor-who-showrunner-says-peter-721153?utm_source=facebook)

2) http://www.doctorwho.tv/whats-new/article/doctor-who-series-8-episode-1-to-be-screened-in-cinemas-around-the-world (http://www.doctorwho.tv/whats-new/article/doctor-who-series-8-episode-1-to-be-screened-in-cinemas-around-the-world)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 26 July 2014, 23:47:15
It seems Hulu has most of the classic series. Which is cool.
Been watching the Seventh Doctor again. The last couple of seasons were amazingly good. Watching "The Happiness Patrol" now, it's quite good. It could have been quite silly, but it works. And the Candyman is very creepy!

Watched "Delta and the Bannermen" again the other day. It is very good. I've always enjoyed it. And I think Mel comes of very well in it. Never understood the dislike she got. She is worlds and worlds better than Peri ever was. Granted, the only story she had that was any good during the Sixth Doctor was "Terror of the Vervoids". But she was a good match with McCoy I think.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 27 July 2014, 00:11:49
Was Mel around very long?  I seem to remember Ace being with Radagast for most of his run.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 27 July 2014, 03:26:33
IIRC Mel left at the end of his first episode, and Ace joined Doctor McCoy in the next.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: trboturtle on 27 July 2014, 10:23:03
IIRC Mel left at the end of his first episode, and Ace joined Doctor McCoy in the next.

"Dragonfire" --- Mel leaves, Ace comes in.....

Again, I wold like to recommend the Big Finish Audio adventures --- Mel comes off a lot better in most of these stories she's in, as does Colin Baker.

Craig
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 27 July 2014, 12:04:41
IIRC Mel left at the end of his first episode, and Ace joined Doctor McCoy in the next.

She was with him through his entire first season. "Time and the Rani". "Paradise Towers", "Delta and the Bannermen" & "Dragonfire".
I think she was pretty good in those. Especially "Delta and the Bannermen".


"Dragonfire" --- Mel leaves, Ace comes in.....

Again, I wold like to recommend the Big Finish Audio adventures --- Mel comes off a lot better in most of these stories she's in, as does Colin Baker.

Craig


I completely agree. Colin Baker really shines in the Big Finish stories. I really wish this was the Doctor we got on his TV run. I think he pairs very well with Evelyn Smythe.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 28 July 2014, 09:34:20
Some interesting news:

1) http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/doctor-who-showrunner-says-peter-721153?utm_source=facebook (http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/doctor-who-showrunner-says-peter-721153?utm_source=facebook)

2) http://www.doctorwho.tv/whats-new/article/doctor-who-series-8-episode-1-to-be-screened-in-cinemas-around-the-world (http://www.doctorwho.tv/whats-new/article/doctor-who-series-8-episode-1-to-be-screened-in-cinemas-around-the-world)

This just doesn't seem right to me.  Why does Doctor Who need to be built into a global brand?  Is this actually BBC policy now, or is Moffat the guiding hand behind all this, and this is a fine example of his "megalomania" ?  (And if it is him, he can't be doing it without Auntie Beeb's blessing...)

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 28 July 2014, 09:54:50
I'd say it's the BBC. And what they should have done ages ago.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 03 August 2014, 08:44:07
Looks like there's going to be some lead-up specials to the season opener...I believe there are one or two on Saturday the 16th, another on Monday the 18th at 10PM, Chris Hartwick is hosting another one at 7:30 PM before "Deep Breath" on Saturday the 23rd, and another review special at 11 PM after the premier of the other series that BBC America is starting that same night at 9 PM...

And they are asking for people to vote for their favorite episodes to run a marathon on Sunday the 24th...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 04 August 2014, 13:48:51
I think this is the most that Moffat has let on yet about the character of the upcoming Doctor:

 http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/new-doctor-who-is-loud-723079 (http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/new-doctor-who-is-loud-723079)

And it seems to confirm one of my worst fears:  that we'll be looking at the Sixth Doctor and Peri all over again.  :(  :(

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 04 August 2014, 14:00:35
I think this is a case of different "yokes for different folks".  If 12Th Doctor is cranky and rude old guy who has flavor of the older doctors, it may put some people off.  Colin Baker wasn't my favorite doctor either, then again, this is alot hear say.  I'm going wait and see before passing some kind judgement that hasn't been yet.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Marveryn on 04 August 2014, 14:08:12
one of my favorite Doctors is Sylvester McCoy.  He seldom took to fistacuff.  He let Ace handle that sort of detail but he use his mind to win the day.  He was not cranky but more fatherly.  This current doctor may be more along those vain.  The last couple of doctor seem to be guys we wouldn't mind going out with our daughters we needed to get back to the doctor who was more like father time.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 04 August 2014, 15:48:01
I think this is a case of different "yokes for different folks".  If 12Th Doctor is cranky and rude old guy who has flavor of the older doctors, it may put some people off.  Colin Baker wasn't my favorite doctor either, then again, this is alot hear say.  I'm going wait and see before passing some kind judgement that hasn't been yet.

Given that this comes directly from the showrunner, I would call it more than hearsay.  I hope it's deliberate misdirection. :-S

one of my favorite Doctors is Sylvester McCoy.  He seldom took to fistacuff.  He let Ace handle that sort of detail but he use his mind to win the day.  He was not cranky but more fatherly.  This current doctor may be more along those vain.  The last couple of doctor seem to be guys we wouldn't mind going out with our daughters we needed to get back to the doctor who was more like father time.

The Sixth Doctor, at least portrayed on TV, was neither father figure nor boyfriend material.  I REALLY hope Capaldi's Doctor doesn't turn out to be like that.  As for the Seventh Doctor, well, if you like your dad to be crafty, manipulative, and deliberately put your life in danger as a means to his ends, then sure, he's fatherly. 

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 10 August 2014, 08:00:35
Given that this comes directly from the showrunner, I would call it more than hearsay.  I hope it's deliberate misdirection. :-S

The Sixth Doctor, at least portrayed on TV, was neither father figure nor boyfriend material.  I REALLY hope Capaldi's Doctor doesn't turn out to be like that.  As for the Seventh Doctor, well, if you like your dad to be crafty, manipulative, and deliberately put your life in danger as a means to his ends, then sure, he's fatherly. 

cheers,

Gabe

I'm not sure I'd be comparing him to the Sixth Doctor. To me, all this talk is reminding me of the First Doctor more than the Sixth...which makes sense, considering that Capaldi and Hartnell (the actors) are the same age when they started as the Doctor in their respective time frames...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 10 August 2014, 22:08:34
But no Brigadier this time... :'(

That was a lot of fun the first time around.

Isn't the current Doctor the 13th?  Or they not going count the War Doctor?

Canonically, yes, Capaldi is the 13th Doctor. According to Moffat. And the War Doctor counts as the, 9th Doctor, I suppose. Also according to Moffat.

But who is to say whether this might change at some future point or when new writers/showrunners come into the picture.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 11 August 2014, 18:19:05
Technically (according to Moffat, which makes it canon :( ) Capaldi is the 14th Doctor.  "Ten" (David Tennant) doubled up as the 11th and 12th incarnation - the regeneration scene in Journey's End apparently counts.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 11 August 2014, 19:04:28
Even the Doctor counted it when he did it.  And when he told Clara he was dying.  As such I'm not sure why it is such a shock that it counts.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 11 August 2014, 19:05:58
Not a shock so much, just lame.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 11 August 2014, 19:10:16
I guess I should have said disappointment instead of shock then.  Personally I would have been more disappointed if it didn't count since it would have shown a greater disregard of the established rules of regeneration then what we got.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 17 August 2014, 14:33:17
6 more days until the new series!!!!! I'm excited and yet rather scared. After the rubbish that was the previous series I'm not sure what to expect. I know Capaldi will be brilliant. But not sure about the story writing...

And this sums up all of my grievances quite nicely:

http://richardhcooper.blogspot.com/2011/11/how-steven-moffat-ruined-doctor-who.html (http://richardhcooper.blogspot.com/2011/11/how-steven-moffat-ruined-doctor-who.html)
http://richardhcooper.blogspot.co.uk/2013/05/steven-and-women-or-how-steven-moffat.html (http://richardhcooper.blogspot.co.uk/2013/05/steven-and-women-or-how-steven-moffat.html)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 17 August 2014, 21:23:09
So it seems Coleman *may* be leaving at the 2014 Christmas special.

Not sure how to feel about that, yet. I suppose we'll learn more once the series starts, and I'll be able to decide whether the end of her adventures with the new Doctor, will be either positive or negative.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 17 August 2014, 21:29:03
So it seems Coleman *may* be leaving at the 2014 Christmas special.

You know, I popped in when read that Coleman was leaving.  For second I though you were writing about Loren Coleman!  ;D
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 17 August 2014, 21:32:06
That's sad that Coleman is leaving, but I don't think her character clicks with new Doctor.  It just doesn't seem from what little I've seen of the together that they have chemistry.  It properly better start new again, he ain't her Doctor who she was drawn to in first place.

This Doctor seems to be more like a Batman doesn't want a Robin for a while.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 17 August 2014, 22:11:55
I'm thinking that, maybe, with what Moffat and the other writers have been saying about Capaldi's Doctor being more "alien" and "less human friendly," along with him not being so "lovable" with the young lady companions, that we might actually, and finally, being seeing an older, more mature travelling female companion.

I really hope so. Another Donna Noble-age-level companion would be kind of neat.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 17 August 2014, 22:29:24
I'm thinking that, maybe, with what Moffat and the other writers have been saying about Capaldi's Doctor being more "alien" and "less human friendly," along with him not being so "lovable" with the young lady companions, that we might actually, and finally, being seeing an older, more mature travelling female companion.

I really hope so. Another Donna Noble-age-level companion would be kind of neat.

Oh I totally agree with you. But I have a feeling it'll be awhile before we get another fully developed female character. (Neither Amy, nor River, nor Clara were it.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: I am Belch II on 17 August 2014, 23:33:03
I would hate to see Jenna leave. But it's the cycle with Dr. Who and I guess it's the same for the companions. But it's what keeps show going after 50 years.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 18 August 2014, 03:22:23
I'd heard rumors that she and Capaldi were both only doing one series, and leaving (possibly with Moffatt) after 13 episodes.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 18 August 2014, 06:41:40
That be funny if they managed get Donna Noble back to knock some sense back into him.  You need strong character, then again maybe they'll bring Captain Jack back.   

I hadn't realized it, i just saw Guardians of the Galaxy, I didn't realize former Dr. Who companion Karen Gillan aka Amy Pond was in the movie.  That now explains to me why she had ware a wig when she did her cameo in Moffats last episode!
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 18 August 2014, 09:06:29
I'd heard rumors that she and Capaldi were both only doing one series, and leaving (possibly with Moffatt) after 13 episodes.

Aye. Apparently, Capaldi has yet to sign anything beyond the Christmas Special.

But, then, neither Moffat nor the BBC have released any info about finding "the next Doctor,"... and considering the hype surrounding the selection of Capaldi in the first place, I would assume this means he intends to stay on into the Ninth Season.

You need strong character, then again maybe they'll bring Captain Jack back.

Jack needs more screen time. Especially after the frustration that was Miracle Day.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 18 August 2014, 15:39:04
Looks like a website announced episodes names of the upcoming season of Dr. Who!  Here (http://www.doctorwhotv.co.uk/series-8-all-titles-revealed-64718.htm)

Interesting development.  Don't look if you want it spoilers of sorts.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 23 August 2014, 15:03:11
So...it seems the new Doctor's title sequence may look something like this: http://youtu.be/oXOBHnWiinY (http://youtu.be/oXOBHnWiinY)
That video's creator made it as a sort of portfolio piece. But it seems to have come to the attention of Moffet, who was so impressed he hired the guy to help design the official sequence.
http://youtu.be/HuINCfDNwik (http://youtu.be/HuINCfDNwik)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 23 August 2014, 15:03:30
So...everyone going to be watching tonight? ;D
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 23 August 2014, 15:17:39
It just finished airing, i really enjoyed it.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Dragon Cat on 23 August 2014, 15:40:24
It just finished airing, i really enjoyed it.

As did I such a good and different Doctor exactly what it needed!  Someone wild and crazy but not in the way that Tennant or Smith were.  The accent jokes were awesome.

Favourite line "I'm Scottish.... oooo I can complain" or "Everyone sounds so... English" lol as a Scot it was a nod to the change.

I liked Jenna Coleman as well as the torn companion not having a clue who this new edgy Doctor was and the ending really capped it off.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Getz on 23 August 2014, 16:48:45
I thought the episode was rather weak, but I'm already liking the new Doctor - I thought the bit where he poured himself a glass of whiskey and reflected that he's probably going to have to kill someone, whilst totally sounding like he could and would do it, was a great character establishing moment.  Also, Clara is still one of my favourite companions and I liked what they did with her being conflicted over the new, older man she's suddenly found herself tied to.

Oh, and Maria Gomez at the end...  Apparently she's the "Gatekeeper of the Netherspace" or some such rot, but I'm putting money on her being the new Master - or should that now be the Mistress?  She did introduce herself as Missy after all...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: I am Belch II on 23 August 2014, 17:35:38
Cant wait. This Dr12 looks a lot like Dr. House.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 23 August 2014, 19:22:23
Not sure about the music, but otherwise, I love the opening sequence...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 23 August 2014, 20:52:24
Just under ten hours to go, here.

My anticipation for this series has been building since the first brief glimpse of Capaldi's crossed brows and eyes from The Day of the Doctor anniversary special.

This evening I'll be in complete lockdown. No family, no friends, no phones, no tablets, no books, etc... Just me and the Doctor. ;D
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 23 August 2014, 20:56:36
Nice cameo...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Darth Nichos on 23 August 2014, 22:22:21
I liked it; this new Doctor seems a mix of the 3rd and 6th but still unique. The cameo at the end was nice and did not seem like a cheat. It seems to me that we are doing something similar to how the 11th started out with a major plot point in the background which is mysterious.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 24 August 2014, 00:27:40
So got to watch it. Was pretty good. Stronger I think than either Tennant's or Smith's first episode (storywise I mean).
I do wonder if they are going to make more out of the clockwork robots in the future?
The writing was good, not a great episode by any stretch; but a good one. But. The new Doctor...


Capaldi is BRILLIANT!!!
[/size]
[/size][size=78%]He is amazing!! So much range. I believe he may even eclipse Exxleston, Tennat & Smith as the best Doctor of the revived Who. Can't wait to see more![/size]
[/size]
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[/size][size=78%][rant]And on a slightly different topic, there has been a trend I've been noticing lately. And it's starting to disturb me a bit. Doctor Who is starting to get violent. I know it always has. Even the classic era had quite a high body count in most stories. But this is different. It feels to me like the show has gotten to the point where it feels like it is starting to glorify violence. Which, to me, goes completely against the ideals of the Doctor and the show. Whereas, in the classic series the Doctor rarely descended to that level. He abhorred violence. Would seek out any other to end things. But the revived series seems to be letting the Doctor take things quicker. He may not get his hands dirty, but lets his companions do it for him. (Even Davros sees that in "The Stolen Earth/Journey's End"). Of course you could say it is because of the Time War. But that feels like a bit of a cop-out to me.[/size]

I don't know. Maybe it's just me, making too much of nothing. But I'll give an example: Madame Vastra and Jenny. They're cool characters and an interesting pair. But...they've become the Doctor's go-to army. His soldiers if you will. Anytime he needs some fighting done, he calls on them. To me...that somehow feels unDoctorish. (Of course that could just be Moffet's unability to write good female characters. He seems to think that giving a woman a gun or sword or whatever weapon makes her a strong admirable character.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 24 August 2014, 09:51:30
As an episode to establish the new Doctor and how he is different I didn't expect a great episode off the bat and as such I will agree it was an "okay" episode that accomplished it's goal nicely.

I do look forward to Capaldi's Doctor.

As for the violent aspect that has been there since the revival really and there certainly have been episodes in the classic series where the Doctor has done some pretty terrible things.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 24 August 2014, 10:29:01
Yeah, I know. And you could say the 7th Doctor was like that. But I don't know, this still feels different. Before it was almost always a last resort. Now it almost feels like the Doctor secretly revels in it while trying to keep the moral high ground by not getting his directly dirty.
Perhaps it's a move to reach out to the popular audience. Trying to make the show more mainstream?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 24 August 2014, 10:31:47
Okay, I have another separate question for all of you: do you think the leaked scripts were purposely leaked? To drum up interest and excitement for the new series? Because the BBC have shown that they are very good at keeping secrets. I don't know. Could be wrong. But then again, I did rather think the same thing when those Matt Smith episodes were leaked as well...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Atlas3060 on 24 August 2014, 10:34:30
I did like the camera work with the silver plate and that discussion about "getting a new face".
Plus I did love the cameo at the end, that whole talk with Clara almost sounded like the writers and actors open letter to the fans too.
I need to rewatch the whole thing though, I was working on some flooring earlier. Overall though I like this Doctor's direction, or the potential for it.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Mecha82 on 24 August 2014, 12:41:35
That was very interesting start for new season and for new version of the Doctor. I did like it very much. 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: jimdigris on 24 August 2014, 15:32:04
It seems like they're trying to emphacize the "steampunk" look.
At first, I thought that the crazy lady at the end was Mother Superior of the Papal Mainframe, but they're played by different actresses.

Edit: Last night's episode is related to another episode: Season 2, episode 4 The Girl in the Fireplace.  Google it.  The names of the ships the Doctor was trying to remember were seen here.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: mathesont on 24 August 2014, 21:08:30
The intro especially the music sucked.  Liked that the companion had as much or more trouble with the regeneration as the Doctor.  Thought the cameo being used to bring Doctor and Clara together was an easy way out.  A well written conversation between the two would have been better.  The story was weak and the fight at the end was pathetic.  Hoping for better writing in the next episode and to get a good feeling for the new Doc.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 24 August 2014, 21:19:09
The intro especially the music sucked.  Liked that the companion had as much or more trouble with the regeneration as the Doctor.  Thought the cameo being used to bring Doctor and Clara together was an easy way out.  A well written conversation between the two would have been better.  The story was weak and the fight at the end was pathetic.  Hoping for better writing in the next episode and to get a good feeling for the new Doc.

Don't get your hopes up too much. The writing was the same it's been the last few years. The easy outs...

But Capaldi is awesome though. I think I'm really going to enjoy his Doctor. Brings some danger back to the character. The Doctor was originally rather unnerving and frankly a bit frightening. See the first few stories with Hartnell. (True, they did make him more likeable as time went on.) But still, you could never be quite sure about him. Which I like. The Doctor shouldn't be a cuddly little playful hero. He should be a bit frightening, a little be unapproachable. He should be good, but not safe. He should never be "safe".
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 24 August 2014, 21:28:15
I did like the camera work with the silver plate and that discussion about "getting a new face".
Plus I did love the cameo at the end, that whole talk with Clara almost sounded like the writers and actors open letter to the fans too.

I think that Moffat is trying (at least) to respond to the criticisms leveled at his portrayal of female characters.  I think we learned more about Clara as a person in this one story than we did in all of the episodes from last season where she appeared.  And, when she's not kicking butt (on behalf of the Doctor or otherwise), I would have to say Vastra is the projection of Moffat himself into the stories.  However, weakly developed female characters are nothing new in Doctor Who--Elisabeth Sladen herself once described the 70s version of Sarah Jane as "a bit of a cardboard cut-out"...and let's not get started about Leela and Peri...hey that's it...for Moffat, Leela is the archetype of "strong female character"  ;D

As far as the Paternoster Gang being the Doctor's proxy army goes, do remember what happened to the Doctor the last time he tried to do his own fighting...still, it would be nice to see him reach back deep into his old memories and bust out some of those Venusian Aikido moves.  ;)

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 24 August 2014, 21:35:34
(Of course that could just be Moffet's unability to write good female characters. He seems to think that giving a woman a gun or sword or whatever weapon makes her a strong admirable character.)

Or, in the case of Tasha Lem, a very large spaceship and a militarized (quasi-?)religious order at her disposal.  :P

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 24 August 2014, 22:12:34
I like the new intro.  Incorporates some classic elements, and is new at the same time.
New TARDIS is OK.  I could have done with more of the Round thingees.  I loved those.
New Doctor isn't Ginger.  Maybe next time...

Nice cameo by Matt Smith.  Obviously that takes place after he has boarded the TARDIS, and turned young again, but before Clara came in.
And the other Cameo.  Is that who i think it is?  I mean the actual actress - as well as her character.  Certainly looks like The Rani and her TARDIS.


Theory regarding another Time Lord possibly returning:
There is a rumor the Master will return.  But if he does, it diminishes his sacrifice against Rassilon.  What if the Rani clones him?  He still died a hero, sending Rassilon and his followers back into Stasis.  And she has brought him back.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 24 August 2014, 22:24:01
And the other Cameo.  Is that who i think it is?  I mean the actual actress - as well as her character.  Certainly looks like The Rani and her TARDIS.

That would be...interesting. Very interesting...

Theory regarding another Time Lord possibly returning:
There is a rumor the Master will return.  But if he does, it diminishes his sacrifice against Rassilon.  What if the Rani clones him?  He still died a hero, sending Rassilon and his followers back into Stasis.  And she has brought him back.

Did that even happen now? I mean in light of the events of "Day of the Doctor" and "Time of the Doctor". That's the one wrinkle I'm having a hard time seeing Moffet untangle. Of course he could just say it never happened in the first place or he could simply ignore it. I'm just having a hard time seeing the Time Lords of "The End of Time", who have basically gone evil being reconciled with the ones that would give the Doctor a new set of regenerations in "Time of the Doctor". But we'll see. The rumors are saying this year will see the return of the Time Lords.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 24 August 2014, 22:26:33
Overall, I enjoyed the season opener. And unlike the introductory episodes of the last three Doctors, I'm already sold on Capaldi.

He's a solid casting choice, with a sense of wit and wisdom that not only channels most of the Doctors who came before him, but adds something of his own uniqueness to the role as well.

Additionally, I like the rather subtle explanation for why his face may have been seen in the past. It's not an outright and full on confirmation... just the kind of wavy and iffy theory we've long come to expect from the Doctor. Fantastic!

The Half-Face Man and the piecing-together-robots were some of my favourites "bads" from the Tennant-era, so I was happy to see them again. And I rather loved the ambiguity of whether the Doctor killed him or not. Kind of reminiscent of Tennant's "reflection of the man/Doctor" he is/was after his sword duel with the Sycorax lord.

"Missy" seems like she'll be the season's Big Bad, so I'm looking forward to seeing how that plot angle plays out.

Clara's internal and external conflicts were handled well, too, I thought. Because it reflected something of the transition that those who aren't immediate travel companions of the Doctor must also go through as well, when they see him with a new face.

And the cameo... I like that Moffat's said that this scene was put together during the time of shooting Time of the Doctor. That just made it so much more prophetic, and fittingly tragic.

Good stuff!
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 24 August 2014, 22:28:32
I like the new intro.  Incorporates some classic elements, and is new at the same time.
New TARDIS is OK.  I could have done with more of the Round thingees.  I loved those.
New Doctor isn't Ginger.  Maybe next time...

Nice cameo by Matt Smith.  Obviously that takes place after he has boarded the TARDIS, and turned young again, but before Clara came in.
And the other Cameo.  Is that who i think it is?  I mean the actual actress - as well as her character.  Certainly looks like The Rani and her TARDIS.

I was wondering that myself, once the long shot of the garden was shown on-screen. I immediately started thinking it was designed somewhat like a TARDIS control room.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 24 August 2014, 22:30:39
That would be...interesting. Very interesting...

Did that even happen now? I mean in light of the events of "Day of the Doctor" and "Time of the Doctor". That's the one wrinkle I'm having a hard time seeing Moffet untangle. Of course he could just say it never happened in the first place or he could simply ignore it. I'm just having a hard time seeing the Time Lords of "The End of Time", who have basically gone evil being reconciled with the ones that would give the Doctor a new set of regenerations in "Time of the Doctor". But we'll see. The rumors are saying this year will see the return of the Time Lords.

Until it's actually addressed in-show, I guess all we have are fan-theories.

For now, I think it's simply the safest option to assume that so long as the demands of Moffat's plot lines require it then whether the events of "The End of Time" really happened or not, depends on the showrunners and the season's writers.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 24 August 2014, 22:49:54
I was wondering that myself, once the long shot of the garden was shown on-screen. I immediately started thinking it was designed somewhat like a TARDIS control room.

Isn't it the same garden that was seen in "The Girl Who Waited" ?

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: jimdigris on 24 August 2014, 23:22:24
Does anyone remember the name of the ship that crashed and got infested with weeping angels?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 25 August 2014, 01:01:33
Byzantium
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Scotty on 25 August 2014, 01:11:55
I like Capaldi.  Capaldi does well.

I grow weary of Moffat.  It's okay to have a dark and edgy episode once or twice a series (maybe even three times, pushing it), but I feel like every single episode for the last few series has been dark and edgy, and it has long since worn thin.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 25 August 2014, 03:49:59
@ YingJanshi:
The Day of the Doctor doesn't invalidate End of Time, it simply changes it.  The Council - lead by Rassilon - locked themselves away, and assumed they were thrown into the void along with the Daleks.  The Gallifreyan High Command had no contact with them when all Twelve Doctors arrived to save Gallifrey by moving it into stasis.
From the Council's perspective, things still are exactly as the Doctor has believed.  They were trapped in the Void, with a tether to the Master to bring them back.  And when he died, they were thrown back in.  But they were not in the Void, but Stasis.
And something - likely Rassilon's machinations in End of Time - created a crack.  And the Stasis began leaking.  This created the crack at Trenzalore, which was associated with the destruction of the TARDIS, and the events of the Amy, Rory, River episodes.  And because of that, while Gallifrey is still trapped in another dimension, time is passing - though possibly at less than 1 second per second.  While Rassilon's Council wouldn't likely support the Doctor, there were others, including the High Command and Former President Romana who would.  After all, their continued existence is thanks to the Doctor.  Their best chance to get home is the Doctor.  If he dies, they are trapped for eternity.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: roosterboy on 25 August 2014, 04:21:52
This created the crack at Trenzalore, which was associated with the destruction of the TARDIS, and the events of the Amy, Rory, River episodes. 

The crack at Trenzalore was created by the explosion of the TARDIS that the Kovarian sect of the Silence caused when they tried to kill the Doctor to prevent him letting the Time Lords through the crack on Trenzalore. It's a paradox.

So this was my first episode of Dr Who in real time after powering through the entirety of the reborn series in the past few months. I've never been a big fan but the prospect of Peter Capaldi as the new Doctor finally convinced me to catch up on the whole thing. He, of course, was awesome.

I very much enjoy Vastra, Jenny and Strax, so it was great to see them again. Though all the marriage jokes were more than a little strained. Man, Vastra sure does treat Jenny poorly; I don't think we've ever really seen that to this extent before. Honestly, it felt like Moffat was recycling some leftover Coupling jokes or something.

Clara... well, at least she finally seems to have gotten the beginnings of a personality. Egomaniac control freak isn't a great characterization, but at least it is a characterization. As opposed to being a walking plot device like she was in series 7. I still don't care for her very much at all, but if they continue to develop her in upcoming episodes, I might have to change that opinion.

All of the "oh no, he's old now" was too heavy-handed and Vastra's condescension towards Clara unmotivated by anything we'd seen to date. Not to mention that this came not that long after Clara met the War Doctor, so I'm not sure why she'd be so freaked out at Eleven regenerating into an older form.

As cool as Michele Gomez is, I'm not really looking forward to how that'll play out. I'm betting it's just going to turn into another chance for Moffat to mistake overly complicated plotting and annoying catchphrases for depth and character development. I'll reserve final judgment, but after the increasing nonsense of the three Matt Smith series I'm not hopeful.

Speaking of which, I hope to all that is good and holy that we've seen the last of River Song.

Finally, why the hell was that T. rex so freakin' big?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Mecha82 on 25 August 2014, 04:48:53

Speaking of which, I hope to all that is good and holy that we've seen the last of River Song.


Way Missy talked about Doctor made me think that maybe she is evil version of River Song but maybe not. Oh and maybe I am weird but I really liked River Song. 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 25 August 2014, 08:09:13
Speaking of which, I hope to all that is good and holy that we've seen the last of River Song.

Moffat's most recent word on the subject... provided I've not missed anything, has been that while River's story is mostly done, we've yet to see the last of her on-screen.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 25 August 2014, 14:38:05
Because even though her timeline runs in the opposite direction of the Doctor, and we saw their first and last dates in a webisode, obviously her story isn't finished.  Sort of like a pair of companions leaving the TARDIS, and still being series regulars for another year.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 26 August 2014, 03:45:37
I grow weary of Moffat Hinchcliffe and Holmes.  It's okay to have a dark and edgy gothic episode once or twice a series (maybe even three times, pushing it), but I feel like every single episode for the last few series has been dark and edgy gothic, and it has long since worn thin.

Fixed for you :P

cheers,

Gabe

Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 26 August 2014, 03:57:51
@ YingJanshi:
The Day of the Doctor doesn't invalidate End of Time, it simply changes it.  The Council - lead by Rassilon - locked themselves away, and assumed they were thrown into the void along with the Daleks.  The Gallifreyan High Command had no contact with them when all Twelve Doctors arrived to save Gallifrey by moving it into stasis.
From the Council's perspective, things still are exactly as the Doctor has believed.  They were trapped in the Void, with a tether to the Master to bring them back.  And when he died, they were thrown back in.  But they were not in the Void, but Stasis.
And something - likely Rassilon's machinations in End of Time - created a crack.  And the Stasis began leaking.  This created the crack at Trenzalore, which was associated with the destruction of the TARDIS, and the events of the Amy, Rory, River episodes.  And because of that, while Gallifrey is still trapped in another dimension, time is passing - though possibly at less than 1 second per second.  While Rassilon's Council wouldn't likely support the Doctor, there were others, including the High Command and Former President Romana who would.  After all, their continued existence is thanks to the Doctor.  Their best chance to get home is the Doctor.  If he dies, they are trapped for eternity.

This isn't quite correct.  The tether to the Master was to pull Gallifrey not out of stasis, but out of the time lock.  So, the events seen in "The End of Time" have to happen all throughout "The Day of The Doctor"--Gallifrey has to be pulled out of the time lock, and put back in, all in time for the 3 Doctors (War, 10.2, and 11) to summon the other Doctors and seal the planet in another dimension.  10.2 and 11 ought to have known about this and should have stalled for time to make sure Gallifrey would be back in place and the plan would work.  So, we seem forced to suppose that by the time the plan goes off, the events of "The End of Time" have already occurred.  You would think the High Command, or 11,  would've remarked on that though.  (See below, for 10.2 it hasn't happened yet!)

Another difference between "The End of Time" and 'Day of the Doctor' concerns the fact that Gallifrey doesn't appear to be actively under attack by the Daleks in the former--the broken Citadel dome is surrounded by what appear to be dozens, if not hundreds, of wrecked Dalek saucers--whereas in the latter, Gallifrey is under active attack, apparently surrounded by a massive Dalek fleet in orbit, and the Daleks have breached the world's defenses.

So...wouldn't Gallifrey being pulled out of the time lock, but not bringing the orbiting Dalek fleet along with it, have effectively pulled off the 3 Doctors' plan to make Gallifrey disappear and the Dalek ships annihilate each other?

What makes this even more mind-twisting is that when 10.2 arrives on the Ood-Sphere at the beginning of "The End of Time" he's just helped save Gallifrey (he's already had his dalliance with Elizabeth I and jilted her), and he doesn't remember it, while by the end of the episode, he's sent it back to what he's certain is its doom!

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 26 August 2014, 19:19:30
I finally watched the episode today.  First episode was enjoyable, I think Capaldi did okay.  I'm not completely sold on his doctor yet, I'd have see more episodes.

I like the cameo, it was touching moment.  Michelle Gomez's episode at end is going to be a scary persona. We have to wait see if Missy is someone we know in different skin or not. Her taunting herself as Doctor's boyfriend is "interesting".  Reviving the half-man demonstrates her being more than she seems.  I don't know if she would be a master.  I wonder if she could be insane version of Romana.  I do think though she crazy batty waiting to happen.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 26 August 2014, 21:27:59

I like the cameo, it was touching moment.  Michelle Gomez's episode at end is going to be a scary persona. We have to wait see if Missy is someone we know in different skin or not. Her taunting herself as Doctor's boyfriend is "interesting".  Reviving the half-man demonstrates her being more than she seems.  I don't know if she would be a master.  I wonder if she could be insane version of Romana.  I do think though she crazy batty waiting to happen.


Already some wild hypotheses on who "Missy" is:
--The Master, regenerated somehow into a female body ("The Doctor's Wife" established that this is possible for Time Lords)
--The Master, having hijacked the body of a woman close to the Doctor, similar to what he/she/it did to Nyssa's father.  The Master now has all of this person's memories and knowledge of the Doctor.  The somewhat unhinged behaviour hints at this being a continuation of John Simm's "Mad-ster"--new appearance but fundamentally the same personality.  The most chilling possibility is that the unfortunate victim is "that woman"  from "The End of Time" who kept appearing to Donna's father and who appeared behind Rassilon as one of the dissenters.  Russell T Davies has hinted she is the Doctor's mother!
--The Rani.  Probably the most obvious choice.  IIRC, she had a thing for dinosaurs.  Perhaps there's some connection with the dinosaur in "Deep Breath"?
--Romana, having gone bad somehow.  We've seen this happen to other powerful Time Lords.
--River Song, somehow remade into a new, dark form by The Library's computer (data corruption?).  Probably very upset that he didn't come back more often to check up on her.
--The Doctor's old girlfriend from his Time Lord Academy days.  ;D


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 26 August 2014, 21:32:59

Already some wild hypotheses on who "Missy" is:
--The Master, regenerated somehow into a female body ("The Doctor's Wife" established that this is possible for Time Lords)
--The Master, having hijacked the body of a woman close to the Doctor, similar to what he/she/it did to Nyssa's father.  The Master now has all of this person's memories and knowledge of the Doctor.  The somewhat unhinged behaviour hints at this being a continuation of John Simm's "Mad-ster"--new appearance but fundamentally the same personality.  The most chilling possibility is that the unfortunate victim is "that woman"  from "The End of Time" who kept appearing to Donna's father and who appeared behind Rassilon as one of the dissenters.  Russell T Davies has hinted she is the Doctor's mother!
--The Rani.  Probably the most obvious choice.  IIRC, she had a thing for dinosaurs.  Perhaps there's some connection with the dinosaur in "Deep Breath"?
--Romana, having gone bad somehow.  We've seen this happen to other powerful Time Lords.
--River Song, somehow remade into a new, dark form by The Library's computer (data corruption?).  Probably very upset that he didn't come back more often to check up on her.
--The Doctor's old girlfriend from his Time Lord Academy days.  ;D


cheers,

Gabe
Well, either case, this may lead to the hinted return of River Song one more time.  If this hussy is going after her man, those are possibly fighting words to her!  ;D
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 27 August 2014, 06:11:48
You know, I keep hearing all theze theories, but no one has yet,that I've seen, suggested my idea, which I first had upon seeing the scene.

She's probably the Black Guardian
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 27 August 2014, 12:16:29
Personally while it may be the most obvious/likely possibility I think it would be best if it is Rani.  The Master coming back while possible would not be near as interesting with how his plot line last stood.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 27 August 2014, 14:16:32
You know, I keep hearing all theze theories, but no one has yet,that I've seen, suggested my idea, which I first had upon seeing the scene.

She's probably the Black Guardian
Now there's a name I haven't heard in a great while...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 27 August 2014, 14:44:19
I hadn't even really considered that possibility and that could be interesting.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 27 August 2014, 21:26:10
Now there's a name I haven't heard in a great while...

Well, we shouldn't put it past Moffat.  After all, he's already brought back one rather obscure past villain (The Great Intelligence) and fashioned it into a credible modern Who adversary.  (One of his better moves IMO.)


But if it is the Black Guardian, then shouldn't the White Guardian be in the picture as well...?

And speaking of the Great Intelligence/Simeon, have we seen the last of him...?


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 27 August 2014, 21:43:10
You know, I keep hearing all theze theories, but no one has yet,that I've seen, suggested my idea, which I first had upon seeing the scene.

She's probably the Black Guardian

Now that, would be kind of cool!
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 27 August 2014, 22:12:18
Well, we shouldn't put it past Moffat.  After all, he's already brought back one rather obscure past villain (The Great Intelligence) and fashioned it into a credible modern Who adversary.  (One of his better moves IMO.)


But if it is the Black Guardian, then shouldn't the White Guardian be in the picture as well...?

And speaking of the Great Intelligence/Simeon, have we seen the last of him...?


cheers,

Gabe

I actually suspect the answer to your question is no and I actually don't mind that as I tend to agree that it was a fairly decent villain and the plot line last we saw of it has left some interesting possibilities.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 28 August 2014, 02:19:54
Yet another wild hypothesis as to the true identity of Missy...


I seriously doubt Missy is River Song--Missy referred to the Doctor as her boyfriend, not as her husband.  Rather, I think Missy could well be Clara--or rather, a distillation of all her worst characteristics (including possessive feelings toward the Doctor) given corporeal form, in much the same way that the "Dream Lord" (remember him?) was a representation of all the Doctor's worst tendencies (especially his self-loathing).  How she's given form remains to be revealed.  Perhaps she's somehow generated from one of the copies created when Clara fell through the Doctor's time stream?

And on that last point...think there's any chance that "Clara Prime" will encounter one of those copies during her further travels?


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Luciora on 28 August 2014, 13:18:08
It looks like the rights to a former Who villainess have been settled as she's been appearing in the big Finnish audios.  So she could be a contender for a return even if not in the current series.   
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 29 August 2014, 16:39:58
Just watched Deep Breath again (and will watch again later tonight with my dad), and I have to say, that whatever else I may feel about the show; I am quite certain Capaldi nailed it first try. He isn't going to need a warm up period for me. As far as I'm concerned he is the Doctor. Though, when he was sitting there, pouring the drinks, that's the moment I know the Doctor had arrived. A very good scene.

Mere speculation here, but if the android had killed himself...would he not have fallen face first? Of course it doesn't mean anything, the Doctor could have easily thrown him out backwards, or he could have even fallen back. But it is something interesting to consider...

Did anyone else consider it a bit odd that the androids were called "droids"? Perhaps it doesn't have any sway in the UK (very likely not), but I was under the impression LucasFilms had a copyright on "droid(s)"? It's not exactly a generic word...

It looks like the rights to a former Who villainess have been settled as she's been appearing in the big Finnish audios.  So she could be a contender for a return even if not in the current series.   

I would be curious to know how they would explain how she survived the Time War. If even the Master was called in to help...I'd be surprised to learn that the Rani had not.
Did she run like the Master? I think it would be more likely that one of her experiments backfired...

Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: roosterboy on 29 August 2014, 17:50:09
Lucasfilm has a trademark on "droid", not a copyright; you can't copyright a word. So it's technically okay for some other work to use the term "droid", as long as it's not used as part of the marketing. Same reason DC can have (or used to have before the New 52) a character named Captain Marvel but can't have a comic titled Captain Marvel; Marvel owns the trademark on that name.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 29 August 2014, 21:17:33
Just watched Deep Breath again (and will watch again later tonight with my dad), and I have to say, that whatever else I may feel about the show; I am quite certain Capaldi nailed it first try. He isn't going to need a warm up period for me. As far as I'm concerned he is the Doctor. Though, when he was sitting there, pouring the drinks, that's the moment I know the Doctor had arrived. A very good scene.

I'm still not sure why, but that scene just reminded me so much of the Tom "Fourth Doctor" Baker-era.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: StCptMara on 30 August 2014, 20:06:30
So..I just saw a show where Capaldi and Coleman were going around meeting fans doing
awesome stuff with Doctor Who around the world. It surprised me. I would have thought,
since Doctor Who originates in England, it would be like other British companies and following
the law to aggressively defend their trademarks?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 31 August 2014, 07:17:19
No comments yet on "Into the Dalek"?  ???

Thought it was a decent episode overall myself...loved the homages to "Fantastic Voyage" and "Dalek"...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 31 August 2014, 07:20:11
The Doctor is certainly becoming a bit more rigid as he used to be able to tolerate soldiers.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: StCptMara on 31 August 2014, 08:13:40
The Doctor is certainly becoming a bit more rigid as he used to be able to tolerate soldiers.

I am not sure..I think that might very well be carry-over from the end of Smith's Doctor.

However, I think that this episode is the first one where we start to see the REAL Doctor of this
Doctor. He really is coming across a lot like he was inspired by Hartnell's Doctor. This will be a
very cool Doctor, I think.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 31 August 2014, 08:20:57
I am not sure..I think that might very well be carry-over from the end of Smith's Doctor.

However, I think that this episode is the first one where we start to see the REAL Doctor of this
Doctor. He really is coming across a lot like he was inspired by Hartnell's Doctor. This will be a
very cool Doctor, I think.

When I heard crotchety old Doctor, I immediately thought we were coming full circle to Hartnell...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: I am Belch II on 31 August 2014, 10:10:36
It is a more darker Dr. by far over the other Drs. Very confused with heaven shots with that lady greating people but I'm sure that will be explained.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: worktroll on 31 August 2014, 19:03:14
Re Missy - I'm going on record as being in the "Mistress" / female Master school of thought.

Re "Into the Dalek" - bit rough on old "swallow this" generic redshirt ... Although I can't help but feel the "Doctor never kills" hype comes out of softened memories of the kid-friendly orginal serials plus fan-hype on the current ones, because while the Doctor may not often kill with his own hands, he's certainly left huge trails of devastation behind him.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: StCptMara on 31 August 2014, 19:31:49
because while the Doctor may not often kill with his own hands, he's certainly left huge trails of devastation behind him.

There is a reason the Daleks call the Doctor the "Oncoming Storm"...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 31 August 2014, 20:56:38
I'm still waiting to see second episode in my end of the world. I hope the on-demand shows it.  My wife is into the show now, something scifi we can both watch!   We just watched the first 4 episodes from season 7 for first time together.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 31 August 2014, 21:18:27
Re Missy - I'm going on record as being in the "Mistress" / female Master school of thought.

Re "Into the Dalek" - bit rough on old "swallow this" generic redshirt ... Although I can't help but feel the "Doctor never kills" hype comes out of softened memories of the kid-friendly orginal serials plus fan-hype on the current ones, because while the Doctor may not often kill with his own hands, he's certainly left huge trails of devastation behind him.

1) I'm almost positive it won't turn out this way; but what if she is a personification of "Death"? And everyone that sacrifices himself/herself/itself for the Doctor...ends up in her "heaven"? That would be quite an army....
Yeah, I know. That sounds like something more out of the Virgin New Adventure line than the current TV show.



2)That has been touched on before. See the interchange between the Doctor and Davros in "The Stolen Earth/Journey's End". Or going even farther back, "Trial of a Time Lord". It has always been a part of the Doctor's character. But I think...from the War Doctor on, it is part of the Doctor that is becoming more and more pronounced.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 31 August 2014, 21:43:00
It is a more darker Dr. by far over the other Drs. Very confused with heaven shots with that lady greating people but I'm sure that will be explained.

Well, the wrap up episodes for this season deal directly with Missy and "Heaven," so I'm assuming any great reveal re: her character and this particular location will be featured then.

...

Re:  the "Into the Dalek," I very much liked that this has now become a recurring theme that individual Daleks see the Doctor as being more Dalek, sometimes, than they themselves can be. Multiple times in the new series, since the Ninth Doctor's-era, he's been told that he'd make a great Dalek. And the festering hatred he carries seems to make it harder for him, as a developing character in this new incarnation, to completely divorce himself from it.

We really need to think on that. Because with each new Doctor, every new incarnation, the weight of literally centuries' worth of hatred against the Daleks would surely be pressing down with greater force on his mind after each regeneration. To the point, perhaps, where he might simply never be able to see anything else but hatred for them. Maybe it's an as yet undocumented negative consequence of regenerations beyond the standard 13 lives. We know it eventually resulted in the Master becoming unstable. What if we're starting to see the same thing with this Doctor, now? What might future incarnations be like? Will his collective hatred for Daleks eventually make the Doctor's mind so unstable that it ultimately consumes him in a rage to destroy everything even remotely associated with these creatures?

Hmmm.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: I am Belch II on 01 September 2014, 00:23:35
To me the hate of the Dr. to the Daleks is justified to me. They wiped out the homeworld Gallifrey and that would make people very bitter. The Daleks have no compassion or even want to changed their minds on the universe, they want to wipe it all out and is there only plan on the their mind. The Doctor try's to do good in the universe over time and space, but one mans good guy is the bag guy on the other side. If your were harmed by the Dr. or the Timelords in some way you would think the Timelords are the bad guy.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 01 September 2014, 01:49:49

Re "Into the Dalek" - bit rough on old "swallow this" generic redshirt ... Although I can't help but feel the "Doctor never kills" hype comes out of softened memories of the kid-friendly orginal serials plus fan-hype on the current ones, because while the Doctor may not often kill with his own hands, he's certainly left huge trails of devastation behind him.

Just how many times in the original series did the Doctor actually kill another humanoid?  For me, the only one that comes to mind is the casual hand-off of the live grenade to Graf Vynda-K in "The Ribos Operation".

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 01 September 2014, 04:08:09
It is a more darker Dr. by far over the other Drs. Very confused with heaven shots with that lady greating people but I'm sure that will be explained.


Is there any way that this new Doctor could be the beginnings of the Valeyard?


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 01 September 2014, 05:17:36
Echoes of "Dalek" where the damaged Dalek said much the same thing to the Doctor.  He rants about how all Daleks should be destroyed, and the injured, helpless, Dalek replies "you would make a good Dalek."
This new Doctor has thrown off the coping mechanisms of Tennant and Smith, and is more like Eccleston.  A darker Doctor, one who might not do the right thing.  Which played out well back then. 
Dalek Commander: "Are you a man or a mouse, Doctor?"
Doctor (tossing away doomsday device that could defeat the Daleks): "Mouse.  Any day."
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 01 September 2014, 09:06:01

Is there any way that this new Doctor could be the beginnings of the Valeyard?


cheers,

Gabe

I was thinking the same thing.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Mecha82 on 01 September 2014, 14:57:41
I think I actually like more serious Doctor after seeing him in Into the Dalek.

He was dealing with member of his archenemy race and yet not only he tried to help it but also in the end hoped that he could do some good. It must had been hard for him considering that not only he knows what daleks are like but also he saw what they did to his people. Sure it was Clara who end up keeping that hope alive but still.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Pa Weasley on 01 September 2014, 21:01:12
When I heard crotchety old Doctor, I immediately thought we were coming full circle to Hartnell...

Ruger
Especially if he starts gallivanting with not one but two teachers from Coal Hill school.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: StCptMara on 02 September 2014, 04:07:08
Especially if he starts gallivanting with not one but two teachers from Coal Hill school.

You know...a thought: Maybe that is why he told the other at the end "I don't like soldiers." Not that
he doesn't like soldiers..but he was trying to make an excuse to NOT have a second teacher from the same
school on his Tardis. Kind of makes you wonder if he will finally keep that promise from 10th Planet to return
one day? This WOULD be a good time to do it, after all.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: mdauben on 02 September 2014, 14:25:26
No comments yet on "Into the Dalek"?  ???
Just watched it last night.  I thought it was very good.  I like the slightly darker tone they seem to be setting with Capaldi.  Its a nice change of pace from Tennant and Smith, much as I enjoyed their runs.   

I'm not quite sold on Coleman yet, though.  She worked okay with Smith but just doesn't seem to have much chemistry with Capaldi (not talking romantic chemistry like some of the previous Doctor/Companion pairs, but just... relationship chemistry).  Maybe its just a deliberate choice on Moffat's part, given the "I don't know this Doctor" angle they introduced in Deep Breath

Of course, I didn't really care for Piper until almost the end of her run, although that had as much to do with the character as the actress. 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: mathesont on 02 September 2014, 19:33:43
Just got to watch "Into the Dalek".  Half way through the episode my wife turned to me and said, "I think this is the first time I have ever been bored watching Doctor Who."  She made it another ten minutes before leaving the room.  I stuck it out the end and best I can say is that this was the worst episode in recent memory.  Some might call it homage, but I think the junk that passes for writers were stealing any ideas they could.  Dialogue was limp, the idea that the Doctor would seal the radiation leak without expecting a return to normal Dalek mindset is absurd and Clara crawling along tubing slapping panels to reawaken memories was just sad.

Next episode better have some witty dialogue and a reasonable story or I will be crossing my fingers that everyone leaves at the end of the season and we can start fresh.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 03 September 2014, 01:58:03
Amazing how the same episode can provoke such diametrically opposite reactions  ;D

It left me a little cold.  Not because I found it boring, but because of...Capaldi.  I'm still not sold on his interpretation of the Doctor, and I didn't find him to be a hands-down better actor than Tennant or Smith this time.
A little too casual IMO.

But this episode did offer a fair bit of food for thought...


The way the Doctor basically sacrificed that rebel soldier to the robot "antibodies" so the others could get away was pretty dark.  But we've seen that in him before; the Fourth Doctor evinced a similar attitude it on a few occasions.
Whatever the case, it shows we're back to a Doctor with not-quite-human morality.

The Doctor is fundamentally right, IMO--there's no such thing as a "good" (i.e. truly benevolent) Dalek--at least not yet.  Even before the Doctor repaired "Rusty's" radiation leak, its (do Daleks even have sexes/genders?) first impulse in response to its newfound "goodness" was to lash out at those that would destroy all other life i.e. "proper" Daleks.  Basically a Dalek eco-terrorist  ;)  And seeing the deep hate the Doctor carries for the Daleks only seemed to cement that attitude in Rusty's mind.  No Dalek Sec here.  But, surely, somewhere deep inside, the Doctor carries a little spark of satisfaction that this one Dalek could be the vehicle for realizing his darkest dream...?

Clara has come a long way in a remarkably short time.  There's definitely an added maturity to her that wasn't there before.  She sure seems to be moving fast with regard to finding a new boyfriend.  And that slap...totally redefined the relationship between Clara and the Doctor.  He sure won't be able to treat her as "little girl lost" anymore--and I don't think Clara sees herself that way any longer.   (Who else has hit him like that before?  River, Jenny Flint...)

So why wouldn't the Doctor take Journey on as a companion?  Does she remind him too much of himself, especially as the War Doctor?  The whole "you mean well, but I wish you hadn't been a soldier" bit.

I think what I didn't like the most was the revelation that the Dalek shell has an emotion/memory suppressor, similar to what the Cybermen are equipped with.  It detracts from the idea of a creature bred for pathological hatred.  They can be made "good" just by pressing the right buttons, as it were.  (But see above comment)


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 03 September 2014, 06:01:17
I've not gotten a chance to watch episode 2.  Should I bother? I don't want turn off my wife to watching it, she did enjoy Capaldi's 1st episode.   Should we wait till there a Moffet written episode?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 03 September 2014, 06:49:58
I've not gotten a chance to watch episode 2.  Should I bother? I don't want turn off my wife to watching it, she did enjoy Capaldi's 1st episode.   Should we wait till there a Moffet written episode?

No, go ahead and watch it. It wasn't the best episode by any stretch (basically a remake of "Dalek"), but it was still good. I think Capaldi was even better in this one.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 03 September 2014, 21:26:44
I've not gotten a chance to watch episode 2.  Should I bother? I don't want turn off my wife to watching it, she did enjoy Capaldi's 1st episode.   Should we wait till there a Moffet written episode?

I think it's worth at least one viewing.

It plays up the Doctor's internal wrestling with his morals concerning the Daleks. Kind of like the Fourth Doctor and "Genesis of the Daleks." Not to that extent, of course, but it does a good job of providing us with further evidence that this will be a very conflicted Doctor.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: mdauben on 04 September 2014, 09:58:23

The way the Doctor basically sacrificed that rebel soldier to the robot "antibodies" so the others could get away was pretty dark.
 
Brutally practical, perhaps. As the Doctor said, the one soldier was a dead man the moment he "damaged" the Dalek.  There was evidently nothing he could do to save him, so he did what he could and saved the rest of the group.

Clara has come a long way in a remarkably short time. 
Where you are not sold on Capaldi, I myself am not sold on Clara.  She's just not "clicking" for me yet as a Companion.  Certianly there have been different types of relationships between the Doctor and various Companion, but I'm just not seeing a proper synergy between the two yet as either actors or characters.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: roosterboy on 04 September 2014, 15:14:18
Perhaps that's because Clara hasn't had a real personality until recently (and that's still in early days yet). Since her introduction she hasn't been anything more than a walking plot device in service of Moffat's anniversary story. Now that that's out of the way, perhaps things will change.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 04 September 2014, 17:57:44
I don't know. I've enjoyed the actress (I'm waiting tomorrow to see episode 2 of season 8 ), so far.  I agree her character origin didn't make things easy to be introduced. I like Coleman, she did work well with Smith, but with new guy its hard for me to say. I can understand the message at end of episode 1 Love me for who I am, not what I look like. but it certainly a different relationship.  Maybe we audience needs more episode to flesh things out more.   I recently saw episode 1 of season 7 when actress was introduced, she certainly had a lot personality I enjoyed.  With Peter, she doesn't seem to have that yet.  She looked like her character was alienated by drastic change in him.

I do wonder though aside form the Clara debate, what Peter's Doctor was jabbering about why he "Chose" this face. Asking the question why.   Smith's character cameoing at end of the episode didn't sound like he was happy about getting old again.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 04 September 2014, 19:51:29
Sharing just because... :D
http://youtu.be/bdENjiUW66w (http://youtu.be/bdENjiUW66w)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 05 September 2014, 01:56:56
He "chose" the face of a Pompeiian Patrician.  Or possibly of a British official involved in the deal with aliens for Earth's children.  (Capaldi played both parts).
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 05 September 2014, 03:20:53
He "chose" the face of a Pompeiian Patrician.  Or possibly of a British official involved in the deal with aliens for Earth's children.  (Capaldi played both parts).

Yes, but why that face?  What subconscious directive drove him to "choose" that face, especially since the 11th Doctor, in his "dying" moments, and having just been rejuvenated, expressed some distaste at the idea of getting old again?  (having watched himself age over the course of...oh...at least 500 years?)

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 05 September 2014, 08:31:02
Well. I'm still expecting a last hurrah for River Song, between these would be girl friends of the Doctor.  That should provide quality entertainment of comedic and possibly violent kind.

Hopefully, River will appreciate the new face and body.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 05 September 2014, 09:33:56
Well. I'm still expecting a last hurrah for River Song, between these would be girl friends of the Doctor.  That should provide quality entertainment of comedic and possibly violent kind.

Hopefully, River will appreciate the new face and body.

I think this will be the last we see of River.  I'm expecting that when she makes her next appearance, it'll be right before she goes with her team to The Library, and the Doctor, already knowing what will happen, violates their "no spoilers" policy and gives her the sonic screwdriver to store her consciousness in--it would certainly explain River's "you're so young" comment in "Silence In the Library", if the last time she'd seen him he was the visibly much older 12th (13th) Doctor.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 05 September 2014, 09:59:58
So, back to the topic of the Valeyard...

We know that Moffat is a fanboi and likes to drop references (needlessly IMO) to details from the old series that would likely be missed by a lot of the newer fanbase.  However, since the "prophecy" of the Great Intelligence in "The Name of the Doctor" of a dark future for the Doctor, coupled with what seems to be a slightly amoral streak in #12, has a few of us wondering, will we see the Valeyard emerge soon?  Now, given what I said above, that line from "NotD" may be nothing more than a red herring, another example of Moffat not being able to help himself.  Yet, considering that this was a character who was the Big Bad for a whole season of the Sixth Doctor, it doesn't seem quite so easy to dismiss.

Up-thread, YingJanshi gave his speculation on who the Valeyard might be.  Now it's my turn.  And, now that we know more about the Doctor's hidden past during the Time War and the correct counting of his regenerations, it makes a certain sense.

We know from the old series that the Valeyard is supposed to emerge somewhere between the Doctor's 12th and 13th incarnations.  We now know that after #8, the War Doctor was the "real" 9th Doctor, even if he didn't use the name.  So that means..

War Doctor-->actual 9th
9th Doctor (Eccleston)-->actual 10th
10th Doctor (Tennant)-->actual 11th
10.2 (Tennant after "Journey's End")-->actual 12th
                                                  <--so, who goes here?
11th Doctor (Smith)-->actual 13th

Who goes in the space between "10.2" and "11"?  Somebody who has all the Doctor's knowledge and memories (at least up until his creation), but who lacks the crucial ability to regenerate?  Somebody who's already demonstrated a bit of an aggressive streak?

Not too hard to figure out... ;)

cheers,

Gabe

 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 05 September 2014, 10:08:14
War Doctor-->actual 9th
9th Doctor (Eccleston)-->actual 10th
10th Doctor (Tennant)-->actual 11th
10.2 (Tennant after "Journey's End")-->actual 12th
                                                  <--so, who goes here?
11th Doctor (Smith)-->actual 13th

Who goes in the space between "10.2" and "11"?  Somebody who has all the Doctor's knowledge and memories (at least up until his creation), but who lacks the crucial ability to regenerate?  Somebody who's already demonstrated a bit of an aggressive streak?

Not too hard to figure out... ;)

cheers,

Gabe
There two i can think of, but i have to admit i was watching off and on during David Tennent run.  i would speculate it was the Doctor's Daughter or River.  River i would have a hard time believing she is the doctor.  It be cool if the Daughter came back in some form.   

Then again....the woman in black, who insanely thinks the Doctor is her boyfriend knows quite a bit of about him. Put the add in episode 1 to lure the Impossible Girl to the "fake" restaurant.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Medron Pryde on 07 September 2014, 01:01:43
At the end of Bad Wolf, the Doctor's Hand regenerated into a new Doctor that stayed with Rose when the link between our universe and that universe was closed...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: mathesont on 07 September 2014, 02:10:23
What the hell is happening to Doctor Who?!

Robot of Sherwood was horrible.  The Doctor was reduced to acting like a clueless quarrelsome toddler, the plot and dialogue were on the level of the worst fan fiction and the ending was... pound head on keyboard.  The closest thing to a bright spot was Clara's conversation with the Sheriff.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Mecha82 on 07 September 2014, 02:29:36
Doctor Who has always had it's share of bad episodes. From new Who I can think Love and Monsters to be worst episode ever and classic Who also had it's share of bad episodes. So no, Doctor Who is not perfect series.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 07 September 2014, 03:00:46
At the end of Bad Wolf, the Doctor's Hand regenerated into a new Doctor that stayed with Rose when the link between our universe and that universe was closed...

That was Journey's End, not Bad Wolf.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 07 September 2014, 08:35:56
What the hell is happening to Doctor Who?!

Robot of Sherwood was horrible.  The Doctor was reduced to acting like a clueless quarrelsome toddler, the plot and dialogue were on the level of the worst fan fiction and the ending was... pound head on keyboard.  The closest thing to a bright spot was Clara's conversation with the Sheriff.

You've described any Matt Smith episode ever.....so no change then...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: I am Belch II on 07 September 2014, 10:03:16
It not the new Doctor, it the episodes that are really trying hard and failing.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Mecha82 on 07 September 2014, 10:10:03
IMO Tennant era was far worse than Smith era and what made it worse to me was that Rose was annoying during Tennant era. More so than she was during short Eccleston era. Besides, Love and Monsters was Tennant era episode. I would had loved to see Eccleston as Doctor more than one season but I understand why they did that. They wanted to introduce concept of regeneration to new fans as soon as possible.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 07 September 2014, 12:00:59
IMO Tennant era was far worse than Smith era and what made it worse to me was that Rose was annoying during Tennant era. More so than she was during short Eccleston era. Besides, Love and Monsters was Tennant era episode. I would had loved to see Eccleston as Doctor more than one season but I understand why they did that. They wanted to introduce concept of regeneration to new fans as soon as possible.

Actually he left because he didn't want to do it for more than once year. It was his decision to leave, not the showrunners. (Also the fact that he felt the showrunners treated the crew poorly also has something to do with that.)

Would you care to explain why you felt that way about the Tennant era? Granted his first two series were a bit weak, but I felt then (and still do) that the fourth series with Donna is the best of the revived show. It was the most emotionally mature I feel. Then yes, the specials after that were a bit weak. But I just felt that there was no emotional depth to the series during Smith's era. (Partly because it seems like "emtional depth" means "let's kill Amy/Rory" during those stories.) I don't know, I just never connected with it. Sure it looks cool and exciting..but has no meat to it.
I guess in one way it felt like in the fourth series the Doctor could face "no win" scenarios, ones that he truly couldn't save everyone. (Like "Fires of Pompeii.) But during Smith's era, they cheapened that, by giving the Doctor some sort of Deus Ex Machina to save the day. Anyway, just my 2¢
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: worktroll on 07 September 2014, 14:58:09
On the other hand, this episode had Lester from Primeval as the Sherriff. Am I the only one who thought
a) he looked good in the beard, and
b) he could have done a very Roger Delgado riff on the Master with that look?

Okay, he wasn't acting particularly - I kept expecting him to say "Good mammoth!" - but he could have looked the part.

And I did like "THis is getting silly!" Definitely a humour-based episode. "I'm bantering?!"
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 07 September 2014, 15:06:11
I quite liked Robots of Sherwood.  It wasn't an amazing piece of TV, and the end of the episode made no sense at all but the dialogue amused me, the cast played well off one another and the robots looked well enough. 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: I am Belch II on 07 September 2014, 19:04:10
To me the Robin Hood and Clara had a lot of the same feel as the Van Gogh and Amy episode.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 07 September 2014, 19:30:54
Funny thing, Peter Capaldi is staring in the Musketeers series that's airing at the same time as 8th Season of doctor who.

For some crazy reason when I saw the Robin Hood thing, I thought they were doing silly cross over with The Musketeers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Musketeers). Which I think Peter Capaldi is the villain, Cardinal Armand Richelieu.  He had to be replaced.....but still its actually funny if they did do a cross over.  ;D

I've not seen the 3rd episode yet, but I'm properly going wait till Friday!
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 07 September 2014, 20:15:10
Just watched "Robot of Sherwood" and I don't think it was all that bad. Silly, yes, but it doesn't try to take itself very seriously. It'd be hard to see this working for many of the other Doctors (maybe the 4th could have pulled it off), but with Capaldi and Jenna Coleman it mostly works. It really just felt like a filler episode. Which, with only 12-13 a season they can't really afford. And I agree, the ending was far too silly. I did like the end scene with the Doctor and Robin talking though, it really defines who this Doctor is going to be I think.

I'm not really sure where they're going with this season. Capaldi is really turning in a brilliant performance, I think he's becoming a fantastic Doctor...but it's like they're giving him scripts from the reject pile. Next week may be a creepy one though.

I have one finally thought about this current series: the Doctor may be darker, a bit difficult, but it doesn't seem like his stories are going to be. I don't think he's going to have to face any kind of moral dilemma, I don't think he is going to ever be put in a no-win situation. It seems like even though the he may be darker, his stories are going to be lighter. More childish.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 07 September 2014, 21:10:38
The Doctor was reduced to acting like a clueless quarrelsome toddler ...

I actually liked that aspect of his character for this story. It had a noticeable Second Doctor-vibe to it.

On the other hand, this episode had Lester from Primeval as the Sherriff. Am I the only one who thought
a) he looked good in the beard, and
b) he could have done a very Roger Delgado riff on the Master with that look?

Oh, very much so. In fact, a few times during the episode, I had to remind myself that he was the Sheriff and not actually a Delgado-inspired Master impersonator.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: jimdigris on 08 September 2014, 15:45:04
As much as I'd like Peter Capaldi to do well, he just doesn't feel like "The Doctor" to me.  He's not easy to empathize with.  The writing is falling on its face as well.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 08 September 2014, 21:24:09
Interesting article on the callous side of the Doctor's character:

http://www.denofgeek.com/tv/doctor-who/31963/doctor-who-the-doctors-most-callous-moments (http://www.denofgeek.com/tv/doctor-who/31963/doctor-who-the-doctors-most-callous-moments)

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 09 September 2014, 05:24:54
Just watched "Robot of Sherwood" and I don't think it was all that bad. Silly, yes, but it doesn't try to take itself very seriously. It'd be hard to see this working for many of the other Doctors (maybe the 4th could have pulled it off), but with Capaldi and Jenna Coleman it mostly works. It really just felt like a filler episode. Which, with only 12-13 a season they can't really afford. And I agree, the ending was far too silly. I did like the end scene with the Doctor and Robin talking though, it really defines who this Doctor is going to be I think.

Oh for sure.  Mark Gatiss himself said that he wrote the story to have a "Key to Time" kind of vibe.  It would have fit in quite well during the "Douglas Adams years" of the 4th Doctor--but those are precisely some of Tom Baker's least favourite...also, the whole "spaceship disguised as a castle" thing was slightly reminiscent of "State of Decay", from Baker's final season.


The fight between Robin and the Sheriff was hastily re-shot to avoid any unfortunate comparisons to current events in the Middle East--the original climax of the fight would've been Robin chopping the Sheriff's head off.  Or did you mean the whole golden arrow as extra fuel bit?



I'm not really sure where they're going with this season. Capaldi is really turning in a brilliant performance, I think he's becoming a fantastic Doctor...but it's like they're giving him scripts from the reject pile. Next week may be a creepy one though.

I have one finally thought about this current series: the Doctor may be darker, a bit difficult, but it doesn't seem like his stories are going to be. I don't think he's going to have to face any kind of moral dilemma, I don't think he is going to ever be put in a no-win situation. It seems like even though the he may be darker, his stories are going to be lighter. More childish.
We'll have to wait and see on that one.  I think he did already face a moral dilemma in "Into the Dalek", and both succeeded and failed, IMO.  He tried to do the "right" thing, but he didn't really reform Rusty, just gave it a new target for its basic directive.  As for what kind of Doctor Capaldi is, I have to agree with the above post that said he was difficult to empathize with.  He's narrow-minded and prickly in a way his immediate predecessors wouldn't be.  In the last episode in particular, I was especially put off by his pat dismissal of the possibility Robin Hood could be real--wouldn't verifying the historical accuracy of legendary figures be exactly the kind of thing the Doctor would jump at?  (Kind of surprising he hadn't addressed this particular case already!)  I mean, I could just see the 11th Doctor, with his usual kid-like enthusiasm, exclaiming "OMG you're REAL!!!" (or something to that effect) upon meeting Robin in the flesh.

So yes...I *want* to like Capaldi's Doctor, but he seems to be shaping up to be something of an anti-hero so far.

cheers,

Gabe

Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 09 September 2014, 08:56:19
And I think that is where we the viewers are starting to have some difficulty.  I in particular think Capaldi is doing well as the Doctor with some, shall we say not great, scripts but his Doctor is still coming off a bit like the 1st Doctor before they started softening him up.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 09 September 2014, 17:01:04
Oh for sure.  Mark Gatiss himself said that he wrote the story to have a "Key to Time" kind of vibe.  It would have fit in quite well during the "Douglas Adams years" of the 4th Doctor--but those are precisely some of Tom Baker's least favourite...also, the whole "spaceship disguised as a castle" thing was slightly reminiscent of "State of Decay", from Baker's final season.

Well...Douglas Adams did write "City of Death" which is consistantly voted as one of the best stories ever. (Personally I find it better than "Caves of Androzani".)



The fight between Robin and the Sheriff was hastily re-shot to avoid any unfortunate comparisons to current events in the Middle East--the original climax of the fight would've been Robin chopping the Sheriff's head off.  Or did you mean the whole golden arrow as extra fuel bit?
I have no idea what you are talking about there....I was talking about the three of them shooting the arrow into the spaceship

We'll have to wait and see on that one.  I think he did already face a moral dilemma in "Into the Dalek", and both succeeded and failed, IMO.  He tried to do the "right" thing, but he didn't really reform Rusty, just gave it a new target for its basic directive.  As for what kind of Doctor Capaldi is, I have to agree with the above post that said he was difficult to empathize with.  He's narrow-minded and prickly in a way his immediate predecessors wouldn't be.  In the last episode in particular, I was especially put off by his pat dismissal of the possibility Robin Hood could be real--wouldn't verifying the historical accuracy of legendary figures be exactly the kind of thing the Doctor would jump at?  (Kind of surprising he hadn't addressed this particular case already!)  I mean, I could just see the 11th Doctor, with his usual kid-like enthusiasm, exclaiming "OMG you're REAL!!!" (or something to that effect) upon meeting Robin in the flesh.


So yes...I *want* to like Capaldi's Doctor, but he seems to be shaping up to be something of an anti-hero so far.

cheers,

Gabe

Except the episode "Dalek" dealt with a similar situation. And I think it dealt with it better.



And I think that is where we the viewers are starting to have some difficulty.  I in particular think Capaldi is doing well as the Doctor with some, shall we say not great, scripts but his Doctor is still coming off a bit like the 1st Doctor before they started softening him up.



You know, I think you are very right about that. He does feel like he belongs with the Doctors from the Classic series. Which is good I think. It's time to get away from the fangirl/fanboy pandering of the Tennant and Smith years.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 09 September 2014, 17:38:56
*nod*

I tend to think it is a sign that they do want to start doing more with the Doctor and I do like that it seems to be moving away from the companion has to be a romantic interest.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 09 September 2014, 20:02:21
*nod*

I tend to think it is a sign that they do want to start doing more with the Doctor and I do like that it seems to be moving away from the companion has to be a romantic interest.

Oh God yes, please, let it be so.



You know the more I think about how Clara reacted to Capaldi, the more I think that is more a metaphor for the Doctor's fans than just a character's reaction. I've talked to several people that strongly dislike the new Doctor. So much so that they've stopped watching. And mostly for the same reason's Clara initially disliked the Capaldi. He's old, he isn't cute, he isn't fun. Basically he isn't fanfodder. So I wonder how many fans the show will lose...(well, won't call them Whovians, just Smith-fans.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 09 September 2014, 20:57:33

Well...Douglas Adams did write "City of Death" which is consistantly voted as one of the best stories ever. (Personally I find it better than "Caves of Androzani".)

Well, there are fan favourites, and actor favourites.  Baker has gone on record as saying that he felt the quality of the stories and scripts declined after the Hinchcliffe & Holmes years.


[/font]I have no idea what you are talking about there....I was talking about the three of them shooting the arrow into the spaceship

Yes, that's what I meant as well.

Except the episode "Dalek" dealt with a similar situation. And I think it dealt with it better.

I don't think anybody has said that that "Into the Dalek" was the superior story.  I was merely pointing out that it was a case where this new Doctor did have a moral dilemma to face, even if it wasn't as weighty as, say, what the 10th Doctor faced in "The Fires of Pompeii"--where he basically had to correct history by allowing mass mortality.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 09 September 2014, 21:05:06
You know the more I think about how Clara reacted to Capaldi, the more I think that is more a metaphor for the Doctor's fans than just a character's reaction. I've talked to several people that strongly dislike the new Doctor. So much so that they've stopped watching. And mostly for the same reason's Clara initially disliked the Capaldi. He's old, he isn't cute, he isn't fun. Basically he isn't fanfodder. So I wonder how many fans the show will lose...(well, won't call them Whovians, just Smith-fans.)

http://observationdeck.io9.com/the-adult-doctor-1630402018 (http://observationdeck.io9.com/the-adult-doctor-1630402018)

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 09 September 2014, 21:42:10
http://observationdeck.io9.com/the-adult-doctor-1630402018 (http://observationdeck.io9.com/the-adult-doctor-1630402018)

cheers,

Gabe

Mm...true to a point. But I'm not really sure it applies to what I said. I'm not saying kick these fans out...rather they've decided to leave on their own. Their reaction mirrored Clara's perfectly. And instead of seeing that it is still Doctor Who, they've decided to  quit because they don't like the new guy. (Yes, some people never do get used to a new doctor...but this is different, in stead of not liking the new actor, they dislike the entire show. Almost violently.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Mecha82 on 10 September 2014, 02:06:11
So were do then fit? I liked Smith and I like Capaldi as well. They are different but that's fine by me. Classic Who did also have change each time there was new actor playing Doctor. Some were more light hearted, some were more serious.     
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 10 September 2014, 08:06:32
So were do then fit? I liked Smith and I like Capaldi as well. They are different but that's fine by me. Classic Who did also have change each time there was new actor playing Doctor. Some were more light hearted, some were more serious.   

Not just the actor, but also the executive producer (now showrunner) and other members of the production team.
To get back to the previous example, think about the differences in look, feel, and mood between the Philip Hinchcliffe, Graham Williams, and JNT eras of Tom Baker's tenure, and how Baker had to adjust his style for each.
This is something that hasn't yet happened with modern Who.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: jimdigris on 10 September 2014, 15:23:27
So I wonder how many fans the show will lose...(well, won't call them Whovians, just Smith-fans.)
Many Whovians would be offended by this notion.  Whether or not they agree with you, they're still Doctor Who fans.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 10 September 2014, 17:40:37
Do you guys think that the classic  seriies's run was better when was not so commerialized?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 10 September 2014, 21:24:28
Do you guys think that the classic  seriies's run was better when was not so commerialized?

That's not an easy question to answer... especially for the dedicated DW fans who, like myself, are devotees of both the Classic and NuWho- eras.

To put it simply, I would say that the Classic series probably benefited, at times, from more explorative writers [that weren't commercial BIG NAMES in the industry, nor] who certainly weren't afraid to push the boundaries of what could become "believable" in terms of the mythos for the show. And the non-commercialisation helped... since there wasn't nearly as much hype for an upcoming episode's story that we see prevalent with upcoming NuWho episodes these days. So not many fans could usually "dump" on an episode if it didn't manage to live up to their expectations of the hype seen before the episode aired.

On the other hand, the overall commercialisation of NuWho has allowed the "DW phenomenon" to reach new televised shores that it may not have seen in the past. It's also helped to achieve levels of popularity and support that were hardly ever fully realised in the Classic Who era.

...

I need to think on this more, actually. As I said, it's not an easy question to answer.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: jimdigris on 11 September 2014, 15:29:39
The question is complicated by the fact that many of the older episodes have been completely lost.  The original films where poorly preserved or simply thrown out.  We don't have the baseline that we could use.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 11 September 2014, 16:03:30
At this point only 97 episodes are missing (from a total of 803), and the audio tracks and studio photographs exist for all of them, so we have some level of record of the entire show.  Even discounting the missing episodes, there's more than enough Classic Who out there to form an opinion.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: worktroll on 11 September 2014, 16:29:46
Okay, speaking as someone who started with the old serieses (?!), I think it's fair to say that the old series were cheaply and shoddily made - BBC special effects = cardboard & flash powder, mainly, with a wide range of actors some of whom were actually good actors, many of which were from the pool of unemployed British actors.

The elements which lifted it were, IMHO, the imaginations of the writers, the opportunity to re-use existing BBC historical sets & costumes, the recurring story elements (Daleks, Cybermen, the Master in later old series) - remember, "light entertainment" hadn't discovered the story arc at that point. And above all, the strong (overacted?) characterisations provided by the key actors playing the Doctor.  A lack of serious competition - Star Trek came and went, and only lived on in syndication.

The latter series - McCoy and later - suffered, again IMHO, from weaker actors, greater competition, and (towards the end) weaker writing. YMMV, of course. Post Star Wars there were other TV sci-fi stories being shown, and DW suffered by comparison. Consider Blake's 7, from a similar point in time - same BBC cardboard, a better set of spaceship effects, and strong ensemble acting by Blake, Avon and Servalan, amongst others.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: roosterboy on 11 September 2014, 18:19:16
Ugh, ****** Robin Hood.

I'm glad there was no scene with Missy this time, just the more subtle reference to the Promised Land.

But what a stupid episode this was.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 13 September 2014, 21:00:07
"Listen"....well now, that episode had some stuff in it I did not see coming...

Edit: No comments on the show?  ???

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 14 September 2014, 12:03:01
Sorry.  It'll be sitting in the DVR until I can watch it(sometime tomorrow).
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Mecha82 on 14 September 2014, 12:38:19
To be fair I didn't know what to expect from latest episode. Turned out that it had some interesting things in it. 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 14 September 2014, 16:44:22
Just watched "Listen". Pretty good episode. I think Moffet's stories work best when he keeps them simple. Sometimes he tries to put too much in and they collapse. This one shows how good he can be when he doesn't follow that temptation.

One question though: how the heck did the manage to make it to Gallifrey??? Since its locked away somewhere, shouldn't getting there be impossible for every point in it's timeline?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 14 September 2014, 21:56:10
One question though: how the heck did the manage to make it to Gallifrey??? Since its locked away somewhere, shouldn't getting there be impossible for every point in it's timeline?


What if it wasn't Gallifrey?  ;)

That is something I've often wondered about though, whether Gallifrey somehow exists outside of whatever the "normal" space-time continuum is in the Whoniverse.  Anything that happens there seems to affect the world's entire timeline.  It only seems to have a present, but its past and future are strangely inaccessible.  Would explain why the Time Lords can't alter their own history to fix/prevent certain things from happening.  Like, "we've come from several thousand years in the future to tell you that Gallifrey is a hair's breadth from falling to the Daleks.  Better beef up your defenses to make sure that doesn't happen."  Or better yet, why not prevent Davros from ever being born... 


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Mecha82 on 15 September 2014, 02:49:21
From what I could gather from what Clara said to young Doctor they didn't go to Gallifrey. There were in that place were War Doctor took that weapon.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Getz on 15 September 2014, 06:56:03
Well, I have to say that was - in my opinion - the first now reservations, genuinely good episode of the season.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 15 September 2014, 12:16:08
*nod*

The 50th did seem to make it pretty clear that barn was not on Gallifrey so it seems they did have colonies.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 15 September 2014, 13:49:55

What if it wasn't Gallifrey?  ;)

That is something I've often wondered about though, whether Gallifrey somehow exists outside of whatever the "normal" space-time continuum is in the Whoniverse.  Anything that happens there seems to affect the world's entire timeline.  It only seems to have a present, but its past and future are strangely inaccessible.  Would explain why the Time Lords can't alter their own history to fix/prevent certain things from happening.  Like, "we've come from several thousand years in the future to tell you that Gallifrey is a hair's breadth from falling to the Daleks.  Better beef up your defenses to make sure that doesn't happen."  Or better yet, why not prevent Davros from ever being born... 


cheers,

Gabe


As for that, it's always been my theory that the TARDISes were timelocked to Gallifrey in their present. So time aboard a TARDIS and on Gallifrey progresses at the same speed. Would explain why the Doctor always seems to arrive in a linear fashion. Also the Time Lords seem to have their own version of the Prime Directive. And I would expect that would include mucking about in Gallifrey's past as well.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 15 September 2014, 14:16:01
The Doctor specifically disabled the TARDIS's safety features earlier in the episode, and they'd already made it to the end of time, which the Doctor said they shouldn't be able to do. So there's at least some hand waving that could justify them going to Gallifrey.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: roosterboy on 15 September 2014, 15:24:38
Ponderous, boring and we're back to Clara as a plot device.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 16 September 2014, 22:18:18
Just watched "Listen". Pretty good episode. I think Moffet's stories work best when he keeps them simple. Sometimes he tries to put too much in and they collapse. This one shows how good he can be when he doesn't follow that temptation.

One question though: how the heck did the manage to make it to Gallifrey??? Since its locked away somewhere, shouldn't getting there be impossible for every point in it's timeline?

I always thought it odd that this particular world might be Gallifrey. It seems like a confusing place for the War Doctor to "hide" The Moment weapon.

My guess... it's either a "lost world," or a world that the Doctor spent some time on as a child. We know he had some difficulty adjusting to an early life of structured education at "Timelord Academy," so I wouldn't be surprised to learn that this was one of his secretive "hidey hole" worlds that he fled to when he slipped out of school on occasion.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 16 September 2014, 23:17:16
The Doctor specifically disabled the TARDIS's safety features earlier in the episode, and they'd already made it to the end of time, which the Doctor said they shouldn't be able to do. So there's at least some hand waving that could justify them going to Gallifrey.

Well, they've been to the end of the universe before, in "Utopia", and that was due to the TARDIS trying to shake off the temporally anomalous Captain Jack.  So it can suspend its own safeties if it feels the need is great enough.


The whole "end of the universe" sequence was replete with references to "Utopia" and "Midnight".  I get the feeling that's what this episode was--Moffat trying to have his "Midnight".  I kept expecting the "Toclafane" or other protagonists from "Utopia" to turn up, but no such luck...also, this last world seemed to still have a sun, whereas the one in "Utopia" was down to rapidly-dwindling artificial power sources.

And that thing on young Danny's bed...when it pulled off the cover we could see just an inkling of a face, the edge of a head and an eye...unclear what it was but didn't look human from the bit we saw.

I think one of the great disservices the episode did was taking a sizeable chunk out of the Doctor's mystery.  That's always been one of the main motivating factors of the show, and the final sequence in the barn just made it seem smaller somehow.  Sure, we don't know what happened in the Doctor's life between then and when he finally ran from Gallifrey, but now we're just a step closer to knowing and understanding "Who?".  But, it is new canon.

And this episode just seems to confirm that Clara has a relationship with the Doctor like no other companion.  "The Name of the Doctor" made her a kind of guardian angel to the Doctor, but still in a very reactive way, always racing to undo the damage wrought on his timeline by the Great Intelligence.  Now, she's the one who ensures that the Doctor will become the man he is--but the way it was handled was more PROactive and, dare I say, emotionally engaging and satisfying than what we saw in "Name".  There was something almost motherly about the way she comforted the young Doctor, almost becoming the Doctor in place of the man himself.  She assimilated her previous experiences remarkably rapidly.  And kudos to Jenna Coleman for carrying it off surprisingly well.     


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 21 September 2014, 17:34:55
No comments on "Time Heist"?

Fun little episode, with the Doctor doing a bank heist...also loved several of the nods to former things, some outside of Who (loved Peter's "Shuttity Up Up Up"...and thought they'd get in at least one "Trust the thing" as many times as they commented about having or doing a thing)...and loved the other characters that helped in the bank heist...

Oh, and yet again, confirmation that the Doctor hates himself...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 21 September 2014, 18:48:52
I found it to be very average.  Nothing bad about it, but nothing spectacularly good either.  Some nice bits, great performances from Capaldi and Coleman, and a few scenes that really feel like the writers came up with them at some point in the past and wanted to use them in an episode.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 21 September 2014, 18:50:10
I found it to be very average.  Nothing bad about it, but nothing spectacularly good either.  Some nice bits, great performances from Capaldi and Coleman, and a few scenes that really feel like the writers came up with them at some point in the past and wanted to use them in an episode.

And this sums up Moffat's tenure as showrunner.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: roosterboy on 21 September 2014, 20:47:13
Better than the previous two, but just kinda average. And the entire plot falls apart with just a minimum of thought.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 21 September 2014, 20:53:59
No comments on "Time Heist"?

Oh, and yet again, confirmation that the Doctor hates himself...

Ruger

I thought we would be seeing less of this. 
It was easy to suppose that the Doctor's self-loathing that we've seen up to this point was rooted in his destruction of Gallifrey and the Time Lords, but now that he (and we) know that wasn't true, this episode shows the root cause(s) of those feelings goes beyond the climax of the Time War.

Capaldi is proving to be a disappointment as the Doctor, IMO.  This was the first episode where he was really front and centre--shades of the 7th Doctor in being the master manipulator--but he didn't really own it the way he should have.  I thought he was actually more effective in "Listen", which was a borderline "Doctor-lite" story.

It's really not clear what this season is building toward.  Don't know if that's good or bad.  It's like none of the episodes are real standouts ("Listen" being the possible key exception), but they're all dropping pieces of a puzzle that many of us still can't fit together, or even see the outline of.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 21 September 2014, 21:02:06
*nod*

It was a decent but not great episode but I really feel like the writing is doing a lot of the same old thing that was happening in Smith's era.  Namely that the Doctor getting old and daft thus relying on his companions more to figure things out.  I can tolerate this to a certain degree as we know that the Doctor is getting old/been doing this for a long time and there is a certain element of this is uncharted territory for the Doctor himself but I feel like they're only really exploring that first part without touching on the second very well and like I said that was done already.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 21 September 2014, 21:51:53
I guess I'm in the minority here. But I love Capaldi. And I felt like "Time Heist" is the best episode so far. (Granted, not saying much.)
It seems the strongest episode. "Deep Breath" did a good job on the regeneration and aftermath, but the actual plot was just okay. "Into the Dalek" was good, but just a lessor remake of "Dalek". "Robot of Sherwood" was basically just a silly filler episode. "Listen" was very good one until the end (which just felt unconnected to the previous 30-odd minutes). "Time Heist" just seems the best written and paced of the episodes so far. And I also think it shows that while this Doctor seems more callous and cold, he still does care. But perhaps he's just been around so long, lost so much that he has created this shell to protect himself. Watch his reactions to Saibra and Psi's apparent deaths and the revelation of their surviving. It's subtle, but Capaldi does show the sadness/relief respectively. That's one reason I love his Doctor, his subtlety: under the coldness, the brashness, the emotions are still there to be seen.

As for his "self-loathing", I didn't read it that way. To me it was more the realization that "Hey, these personality traits are really annoying me...wait, I have these traits too." Like when you meet someone that has some trait that just really bugs you and then someone else tells you, "You have that exact same trait".


To be repeat myself from upthread...honestly, I have to say I like Capaldi better than any of the Doctors in the revived series. Better than Eccleston, better than Tennant, certainly better than Smith. He honestly feels more like the classic Doctors than the revived ones. I think part of the problem people are having with him is that he isn't "cuddly". Not like Tennant was, totally unlike Smith was. He's more of a return to the classic Doctors in that he's not safe to be around. Not just because of the trouble he gets into, but because of who he is. He's a bit curmudgeonly like the first Doctor. He jumps into trouble just to satisfy his curiosity (and intentionally put his companions in danger) like the fourth Doctor did on so many occasions. He's pragmatic like the sixth Doctor. He's a bit manipulative like the 7th Doctor. If you look, you could probably find echoes and shades of all of the previous Doctors in his performance. And knowing how big a fan of the show Capaldi is...that's probably very deliberate.

So to sum up...yeah, Capaldi is quickly becoming one of my favorite Doctors. And I really, really hope that he stays longer than one year. Hopefully outstays Moffet so he gets some scripts to match his abilities. And hopefully gets a companion that is more character than plot point.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: I am Belch II on 21 September 2014, 22:09:10
Is not the Peter Capaldi and playing of the Doctor 12 is the problem. I think he does as good as he can. The Doctor seems like Dr House playing the Dr. He even wrote stuff down on a chalkboard.

It the episodes to me, they are ok, but nothing overly great. I know it's early in the series, but they are just not as good as the other seasons.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 21 September 2014, 22:25:47
Better than the previous two, but just kinda average. And the entire plot falls apart with just a minimum of thought.


Like how the Doctor broke into the bank without being detected in order to set everything up, just so he could break into the bank again with his team after they had wiped their minds?


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Mecha82 on 22 September 2014, 04:56:37
Over all that was rather interesting episode. Doctor doing heist with his team was rather thrilling.

Faking deaths of Psi and Sabrina was rather suprising. I really thought they had died before it was released that they were not dead.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 22 September 2014, 13:28:37

Like how the Doctor broke into the bank without being detected in order to set everything up, just so he could break into the bank again with his team after they had wiped their minds?


cheers,

Gabe

Actually that is the easy part to explain/holds up best.  He could use the TARDIS to put the items he would need into position but something about the final private vault prevents the TARDIS from being able to land there(which it has been shown in the series previously it is possible to TARDIS proof areas/rooms).  So to gain final entry he needed the team and the plan.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 22 September 2014, 14:10:14
Actually that is the easy part to explain/holds up best.  He could use the TARDIS to put the items he would need into position but something about the final private vault prevents the TARDIS from being able to land there(which it has been shown in the series previously it is possible to TARDIS proof areas/rooms).  So to gain final entry he needed the team and the plan.

As the Doctor said, the solar storm interfered with the TARDIS.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 22 September 2014, 14:14:30
And this sums up Moffat's tenure as showrunner.

It sums up pretty much every era of the show IMO.  There's always enough diamonds in the rough and fun stories to keep me around.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: mdauben on 25 September 2014, 12:18:25
No comments on "Time Heist"?
Just got a chance to watch it last night.  Another good one, I think.  Some interesting situations involved, and the the Doctor's reason for agreeing to take part in "The Heist" was a surprise (to me at least).  Plus Clara didn't annoy me as much this time.   ;)

Better than the previous two, but just kinda average. And the entire plot falls apart with just a minimum of thought.
Perhaps compared to the best of the episodes of the new Doctor Who, but I think this season is doing... pretty well.  My own opinion of the current seasons runs something like this:


I guess I'm in the minority here. But I love Capaldi.
I'm with you.  I really like Capaldi and the way he's playing the Doctor.  Its certainly very different than Ten and Eleven, but I think that's a good thing, myself.  We needed something different with this regeneration. 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: roosterboy on 27 September 2014, 23:22:37
"The Caretaker": Best episode of the season so far.

I love Capaldi's grouchy Doctor.

I wasn't really sold on Danny Pink at first because he comes across as so bland, but I enjoyed his interactions with the Doctor here. I'm looking forward to when he starts traveling in the TARDIS. His acrobatics were a little over the top, though.

And Clara is finally becoming more of a character. They showed some progress at the start of the season and then backslid a bit but this episode was a step in the right direction. She has good chemistry with Capaldi, that's for sure, much more than she had with Smith.

Nice expansion of the mystery of Missy this time around. And it's always nice to see Chris Addison.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Sharpnel on 28 September 2014, 04:09:21
It's too bad that Jenna-Louise (Clara0 is leaving after the XMas special. I really do enjoy her character.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 28 September 2014, 05:03:30
That's still just a rumour, right?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Sharpnel on 28 September 2014, 06:55:38
AFAIK it's for real.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: roosterboy on 28 September 2014, 11:33:17
Nothing has been officially said and Coleman is coy about it in intervies, neither confirming nor denying.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Mecha82 on 28 September 2014, 12:08:28
Interaction between Doctor and Pink was actually funny so having another robot as threat didn't bother me. 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 28 September 2014, 16:58:11
"The Caretaker": Best episode of the season so far.

I love Capaldi's grouchy Doctor.

I wasn't really sold on Danny Pink at first because he comes across as so bland, but I enjoyed his interactions with the Doctor here. I'm looking forward to when he starts traveling in the TARDIS. His acrobatics were a little over the top, though.

And Clara is finally becoming more of a character. They showed some progress at the start of the season and then backslid a bit but this episode was a step in the right direction. She has good chemistry with Capaldi, that's for sure, much more than she had with Smith.

Nice expansion of the mystery of Missy this time around. And it's always nice to see Chris Addison.

Believe I agree with you on all points here RB...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: worktroll on 28 September 2014, 19:44:21
The Scobie Bryant (or whatever) was very lame; however, it was just a mcguffin to precipitate the Danny/Doctor clashes.

Capaldi's acting was a pleasure, even in the somewhat silly scenes.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: mathesont on 28 September 2014, 21:30:20
Was off at a course so today I sat down for a triple feature of "Listen", "Time Heist" and "The Caretaker" to catch up.

Listen - Hints of what a Capaldi Doctor is capable of but for all the running around the episode really did nothing and that bugged me.

Time Heist - Unimaginative, predictable dribble with the Doctor running around literally clueless for most of the episode before we are told how clever he really was at the end.  Would have been much better if they showed us the prep work and ended with everyone reaching for a worm.

Caretaker - Flimsy story, typical of the season, and the Doctor annoyed me almost as much as his bickering with Robin Hood.  Got nothing against Capaldi, think he could be a great Doctor, but the writers don't seem to be able to write for him so... shrug.

Have been watching the Doctor since #2 so will keep going but enthusiasm waning.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 28 September 2014, 22:35:48
Just thought I'd share these (http://stephadoo.tumblr.com/post/98545832968/circular-time-sedxctively-dedxctive-katy)...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 28 September 2014, 22:53:00
Okay, so watched "Caretaker" tonight:

Honestly, I think it's the best writing of the season so far. I'll put that down to Gareth Roberts. I think this has been Clara's best episode so far. And I like how they've handled her trips with the Doctor. It's one thing very few of the other companions have tried to do. Live a normal life and travel with the Doctor as well. They did it with Amy and Rory, but I don't think it quite worked then. There was never really a sense that they had any life away from the Doctor. But Clara does, especially with Danny Pink. (Who I thought was pretty good btw, his acrobatics not withstanding).
The Doctor has always seemed to have a thing against soldiers, now even more pronounced (maybe because he finds their mentality so close to his own at times?).
Also...Capaldi...brilliant!!! I really liked him in this episode. Was having a lot of flashbacks to Hartnell. You can tell he is enjoying the role immensely. Now, I don't know the real order they were filmed in, and I don't know how much of it is the scripts. But to me, this episode feels like the one where Capaldi has finally worn into the Doctor. And I can't wait to see how he develops further. If the Christmas special really is his last episode as the Doctor...I'm going to be heartbroken....
Now, the only thing I didn't like about this episode was the monster. Just plain found it silly. Just couldn't take it seriously. Sort of like the last round of the Cybermen (Nightmare in Silver). Just...no menace what's so ever.
In conclusion...it will be interesting to see Danny and the Doctor sizing each other up in the coming episodes. It's intentional of course...but if you really look at each character...they are very similar. Both were soldiers, both grew tired of it, both are now trying to do something more in life.


Hm...just thought of something...all the male companions of the revived series have had similar names: Mickey...Rory...Danny...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: worktroll on 28 September 2014, 23:25:21

The Doctor has always seemed to have a thing against soldiers, now even more pronounced (maybe because he finds their mentality so close to his own at times?).



I'm afraid I have to disagree strongly here, on behalf of Sargeant Benton, Captain Yates, Brigadier Lethbridge-Stewart, and the other members of UNIT. The 3rd Doctor had no problems dealign with soldiers then, beyond the usual "smarter than you" issues common to all incarnations. The 4th Doctor also had a useful relationship with UNIT.

I'd have said it was something new since the Time War, except note that the death of the Brigadier played an inportant point in Matt Smith's Doctor facing (sort of) hsi own death - he'd have hardly been so moved by the Brig's passing had he always had problems with soldiers, no?

Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 29 September 2014, 00:26:17

I'm afraid I have to disagree strongly here, on behalf of Sargeant Benton, Captain Yates, Brigadier Lethbridge-Stewart, and the other members of UNIT. The 3rd Doctor had no problems dealign with soldiers then, beyond the usual "smarter than you" issues common to all incarnations. The 4th Doctor also had a useful relationship with UNIT.

I'd have said it was something new since the Time War, except note that the death of the Brigadier played an inportant point in Matt Smith's Doctor facing (sort of) hsi own death - he'd have hardly been so moved by the Brig's passing had he always had problems with soldiers, no?



Go rewatch those again. (Especially "Doctor Who and the Silurians") It took him a bit of time to warm up to them. And they've always been the exception rather than the rule. Mostly because the Brig did listen to the Doctor. But then again, how many times did the 3rd Doctor and the Brig argue over the best way to approach any given situation? (Just about every episode I'd wager.) That's really what he despises most. The shoot first, clean up later approach. The only time he will give any military character any sort of respect is if they listen to him. (And I think we'll see the Doctor warm up to Danny.)

Though it has been more pronounced since the Time War, I will agree with that. But could that philosophical dislike for what the military represents have turned something stronger because of what the Doctor had to do in the Time War?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 29 September 2014, 03:42:35

Though it has been more pronounced since the Time War, I will agree with that. But could that philosophical dislike for what the military represents have turned something stronger because of what the Doctor had to do in the Time War?



There are 2 times in his life when the Doctor has been forced into the role of soldier:  the Time War, and the Siege of Trenzalore, which you can think of as re-fighting the Time War in miniature.   In both cases, he wore out an incarnation fighting.  I would suggest his current disdain for soldiers stems from the latter phase.  Although, it's never been specified just what the extent of his activities during the Time War were (and I thought we'd turned the page on that after "Day of the Doctor").  He may have done a lot of things that other incarnations would've considered atrocities.  Whatever they were, I don't think #11 engaged in any such activities himself as he aged through the Siege.  However, he may have seen other things perpetrated by the forces of the Church of the Papal Mainframe.

Speaking of that church...is it actually supposed to be a distant future descendent of the Catholic Church (or maybe the Anglican Church), or some new religion spawned when humanity spread into space?  And is it the same as the militarized church forces seen in "Time of Angels" and "A Good Man Goes To War"?


And in the Time War, "Day of the Doctor" suggests that among the Gallifreyan power structure, it was the military, and not the High Council, that managed to maintain some shreds of decency.


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Istal_Devalis on 29 September 2014, 09:27:50
Interaction between Doctor and Pink was actually funny so having another robot as threat didn't bother me.
I don't mind a robot. I just wish it wasn't such a silly looking robot.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: roosterboy on 29 September 2014, 10:30:40
Eh, it wasn't any sillier looking than any other modern Who robot. I was fine with it since the fight against the whatever blitzer really wasn't the story being told in this episode.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 29 September 2014, 10:53:49
Eh, it wasn't any sillier looking than any other modern Who robot. I was fine with it since the fight against the whatever blitzer really wasn't the story being told in this episode.

I thought it was rather Battletech-looking myself!  ;D  The Marauder-pod-type arm?  Pulse lasers?  Colossal-like tripod design?  (Well OK, definitely not the size, but...)

And yes...the first episode where I actually liked Capaldi's Doctor--like Hartnell on crystal meth.  Great chemistry all around among the 3 leads.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 29 September 2014, 14:29:15
It was an interesting episode and I do tend to agree that the Doctor is growing more anti-soldier then he used to be and it could easily be explained by events in his relatively recent past.

And yes the Church of the Mainframe is the same church as seen in a "A Good Man Goes to War" as evidenced that the Doctor chastised Tasha Lem at Trenzalore for Madame Kovarian's actions.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: jimdigris on 01 October 2014, 15:25:37
I have to wonder if the Doctor has become anti-soldier because he is afraid that he was turning into that.  In the "Dalek" episode, when he shares minds with the Dalek, it finds common ground in the hatred that the Doctor feels for the Daleks.  He may feel that being around soldiers may bring more of that out of him.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: I am Belch II on 01 October 2014, 17:09:26
He is still very upset for what he did being War Doctor. Being "War" Doctor would make you a solider fighting, no matter if you are a offical soldier or not. He hates soliders becuase he hates what he did.


Just my 2cents. If Im wrong, I am. 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 04 October 2014, 21:02:25
"Kill the Moon"...I could see why the Doctor did what he did, but I also completely understand Clara's reaction...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 06 October 2014, 21:36:12
No thoughts on "Kill the Moon"? Really?

I think it was mostly a good episode. Yes, there were absolutely huuuge plot holes. Yes, the science was unbelievably atrocious. But, the moral dilemma, the emotional depth of the episode let me over look all of that. Only have a few observations to make.
1) This is Jenna Coleman's best episode of Doctor Who. Hands down. I was never really sold on her, have always enjoyed her more than Amy (probably me least favorite companion of all time) and Rose (who was good...but became too much of fan favorite), but with 11 she was never anything more than a living plot point. I feel with Series 8 she is finally becoming a real character. A real flesh and blood character.
2) I've been reading a lot of hate for Doctor #12. That he is too cold, too uncaring. Too dark. And honestly, I don't see that. He does care, it's just...he has become so remote, he sees humans as his pets. Now, this isn't my idea, just read it as a comment on a review of the episode, but I think it perfectly captures the Twelfth Doctor: "That last scene, where we see his deep care and respect for Clara mingling with hurt at being rejected mingling with utter bafflement at being criticized mingling with utter conviction that he's in the right is just perfect".
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 06 October 2014, 22:49:39
It was an interesting episode and completely understandable for both sides to act the way they did.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: roosterboy on 06 October 2014, 22:50:04
I was utterly bored by "Kill the Moon". And Clara's big moment at the end felt unearned.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 06 October 2014, 23:39:46
He is still very upset for what he did being War Doctor. Being "War" Doctor would make you a solider fighting, no matter if you are a offical soldier or not. He hates soliders becuase he hates what he did.


Just my 2cents. If Im wrong, I am.

Yes, but we still don't know the full extent of what he did during the Time War.  He no longer has to live with believing he destroyed Gallifrey, but what other activities did he engage in during that time that would earn the odium of both previous and subsequent incarnations?  Clearly, the War Doctor was different from the others in a number of ways...I mean, can you picture any of the other incarnations using the TARDIS as a battering ram?

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 07 October 2014, 06:49:49
I was utterly bored by "Kill the Moon". And Clara's big moment at the end felt unearned.

In what way?

I felt it was completely understandable. I mean the Doctor abandoned her. Completely.
It's about time the Doctor is called out for stuff like this (and especially this Doctor).
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Istal_Devalis on 07 October 2014, 07:18:16
They were both right.

It really was humanity's decision to make...but the Doctor was rather a large prick about it.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 07 October 2014, 09:01:00
In what way?

I felt it was completely understandable. I mean the Doctor abandoned her. Completely.
It's about time the Doctor is called out for stuff like this (and especially this Doctor).

I could understand if it were clear that the Doctor is grooming Clara for something greater, but it's not at all clear he's doing that.  And doing what he did...was so very 7th Doctor.  In fact, it's even more 7th than McCoy's version!  Clara really needs to meet Ace and compare notes.  ;D

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: roosterboy on 07 October 2014, 15:50:56
In what way?

I felt it was completely understandable. I mean the Doctor abandoned her. Completely.
It's about time the Doctor is called out for stuff like this (and especially this Doctor).

I just didn't buy it coming from her with how her characterization has been to date. It felt like she only said that stuff because that's what the plot required, not because her character would actually feel those things at that point in her relationship with the Doctor. Maybe farther down the road, after he pulled a few more stunts like that or disappointed her in other ways, but not now.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: worktroll on 07 October 2014, 16:53:58
I don't know if it's intentional, or a Lucasian oversight, but consider in "Listen", Clara and the Doctor were shown departing on and returning from a number of "undocumented" adventures (eg. the opening scene of them chained to rocks in a desert). Perhaps we're meant to assume more character development as a result of things we're not shown and not really told about?

W.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: roosterboy on 07 October 2014, 17:23:33
That was actually in last week's "The Caretaker" but that could be. If that were the case, however, it would be ridiculously shitty writing.

But I don't actually think it is the case; I just think the Who writers have no idea what they're doing with Clara and feel free to write her as needed for the plot, heedless of things like motivation or setup. Which is odd, given how long they teased Amy and Rory growing apart from Eleven and desiring a more normal life before actually pulling that trigger. So they can do it, they just choose not to with Clara for whatever reason. That's kind of been a problem with her all along.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 07 October 2014, 18:46:35
In retrospect I do tend to think roosterboy is on to something.  It would make a lot more sense if Clara hadn't been established as remembering(at least partially) her time scattered across the Doctor's incarnations.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 07 October 2014, 22:20:13
I don't know if it's intentional, or a Lucasian oversight, but consider in "Listen", Clara and the Doctor were shown departing on and returning from a number of "undocumented" adventures (eg. the opening scene of them chained to rocks in a desert). Perhaps we're meant to assume more character development as a result of things we're not shown and not really told about?

W.

I certainly think so; such development would've started in the time between "Name of the Doctor", when Clara is still a live-in nanny; when we next see her in "Day of the Doctor", she's become a teacher at Coal Hill.  (What qualifications does one need to be a high school teacher in the UK, anyway?  In Canada, a M.Ed. is mandatory.)  Presumably she sorted out a number things about her life in the interim.

Also, we've seen hints dropped in previous episodes that Clara has not been seeing, or rather I think, choosing not to see, the truth of some negative aspects of the new Doctor's character.  And with his behaviour in "Kill the Moon", she can't look the other way anymore.  I would say that deep down, she still considers #11 "her" Doctor, and keeps wanting and hoping that #12 will eventually be like him.  And now she's realized, in an amazingly painful way, that this is not "her" Doctor--that the hacker from "Time Heist" and Danny were right--and she'll never be able to have the dynamic with him she did before.  (I'd also say this is a pretty good sign Jenna Coleman will, in fact, be leaving the show.)

When was the last time the Doctor and a companion actually parted amicably?

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: worktroll on 07 October 2014, 23:06:44
Leela stays on Gallifrey and marries a Gallifrean soldier, IIRC, so that should count. And Adric crashes into the earth in an out-of-control spaceship and wipes out the dinosaurs.

What?

It made me happy ...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Pat Payne on 07 October 2014, 23:42:22
EDIT -- never mind, I misread the post...

Sarah Jane left the TARDIS on good terms with Four... even though he did leave her accidentally in Aberdeen... ;D
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 07 October 2014, 23:58:25
I certainly think so; such development would've started in the time between "Name of the Doctor", when Clara is still a live-in nanny; when we next see her in "Day of the Doctor", she's become a teacher at Coal Hill.  (What qualifications does one need to be a high school teacher in the UK, anyway?  In Canada, a M.Ed. is mandatory.)  Presumably she sorted out a number things about her life in the interim.

Also, we've seen hints dropped in previous episodes that Clara has not been seeing, or rather I think, choosing not to see, the truth of some negative aspects of the new Doctor's character.  And with his behaviour in "Kill the Moon", she can't look the other way anymore.  I would say that deep down, she still considers #11 "her" Doctor, and keeps wanting and hoping that #12 will eventually be like him.  And now she's realized, in an amazingly painful way, that this is not "her" Doctor--that the hacker from "Time Heist" and Danny were right--and she'll never be able to have the dynamic with him she did before.  (I'd also say this is a pretty good sign Jenna Coleman will, in fact, be leaving the show.)

When was the last time the Doctor and a companion actually parted amicably?

cheers,

Gabe

And this is why I think her reaction is at least somewhat plausible.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: roosterboy on 08 October 2014, 01:19:30
It's not character development if it happens offscreen, though. That's just writers using the characters as plot devices. Which has been Clara's problem all along.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: I am Belch II on 08 October 2014, 02:22:55
The newer episodes seem to me more about Clara instead of the new doctor. It almost seemed almost 50/50 with Clara and Dr.12. Which is ok becuase Jenna is a great actress and finally able to act now. But it is also called Dr. who and Peter is a great actor and should be a little more then what he gets.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 08 October 2014, 22:30:17
That seems to be par for cohrse with the nuWho.  The companions are made just as important, sometimes even more so, than the Doctor.

Remember the first two seasons, when Billie Piper was the star of the show?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 10 October 2014, 22:41:58
Next episode, "Mummy On the Orient Express", looks to be another humorous one-off, not tied to the season arc (which has been rather loose).

Something perhaps significant:  Clara didn't appear in any of the previews...(?)  So, this one is intended as a Capaldi vehicle, I take it.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 12 October 2014, 13:06:50
Just in case you don't know, Perkins wasplayed by Frank Skinner, a comedian, chat show host and TV personality in the UK...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 12 October 2014, 21:29:38
I'm honestly not sure what it is they are wanting to do with Clara at this point but overall I kind of liked how the Doctor did remind her that he can't always save everyone and sometimes people do have to die before he can prevail all while knowing that is the case.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: I am Belch II on 12 October 2014, 23:08:33
I liked the Train episode. It reminded me of classic dr who. Weird scifi plot, and the Doctor with the answer.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 13 October 2014, 01:28:43
I'm honestly not sure what it is they are wanting to do with Clara at this point but overall I kind of liked how the Doctor did remind her that he can't always save everyone and sometimes people do have to die before he can prevail all while knowing that is the case.


What a difference a week makes (though it was several weeks in story time).  That was actually quite a disturbing ending, if you think about it--the idea that for Clara, traveling with the Doctor is an addiction she can't kick.  No matter how badly it hurts you and those around you, you always find a way to rationalize going back for more.  First the Doctor lied to her (well, he did as #11 too, although much more charmingly), then he got her to lie on his behalf, and by the end of it, she's lying of her own volition--to Danny, to the Doctor, and to herself.

I think a big part in her turnaround, though, is that this was a case where the Doctor clearly played the hero--pretty much exactly the way Clara still wants him to be.  He was willing to bet the farm in order to solve the mystery of the mummy, and he saved everybody (still alive anyway) at the end, rekindling whatever embers of hope Clara still clings to.

The two guys--Moorehouse and Quell--who basically sacrificed themselves for the Doctor were not taken up by Missy and/or Seb.  How does one have to die to merit being invited to their "afterlife"?

And is Gus, or whoever is behind him/it, affiliated with either of the above?  Or is this yet another hidden actor?  Seems the TARDIS' phone number isn't such a huge secret.


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 18 October 2014, 20:08:30
It's the Incredible Shrinking TARDIS!!!!

Edit 1: Interesting episode. Clara had to be the Doctor since he was stuck in the TARDIS...she was really good at it, but you could tell that upset the Doctor...most likely because it signifies that he's making another companion into a warrior who thinks of the greater good ilo of the individual good, and therefore is willing to sacrifice the few to save the many...

Ruger

Edit 2: Actually, I think I'm going to change my mind...it wasn't that the Doctor was upset he was changing Clara...I think it was more that she didn't recognize the changes herself, and that he's still questioning whether or not he's a "good man"...His statement that she was an extraordinary Doctor, but that this isn't necessarily "good" shows that this is still the case...

And I cannot wait to find out exactly what is up with Missy...


Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 19 October 2014, 19:18:41
I can't believe that the season is almost over already.  But Sherlock is coming to BBCA the same night as the finale.  I hope that means the new season, and that we don't have to wait for next spring to watch the new episodes on PBS/Masterpiece Mystery.  Because the cliffhanger ending was almost as interesting as figuring out how Holmes survived that fall.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 20 October 2014, 00:45:47
I'm not sure if Sherlock series 4 has even started production yet.  It's definitely not aired yet anyway.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 20 October 2014, 03:04:38

Edit 2: Actually, I think I'm going to change my mind...it wasn't that the Doctor was upset he was changing Clara...I think it was more that she didn't recognize the changes herself, and that he's still questioning whether or not he's a "good man"...His statement that she was an extraordinary Doctor, but that this isn't necessarily "good" shows that this is still the case...

And I cannot wait to find out exactly what is up with Missy...



I'm telling you, Missy is Clara--an up-powered, embittered future version of her.  I think it's becoming clear that Clara is being set up for something greater; she's more than the Doctor's companion now, she's almost like his protegee.  But why would the Doctor need a protege now that he has a new lease on life...? 

As for when the big reveal behind Missy will happen, I'm guessing we'll have to wait until the Christmas special to find out.


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 20 October 2014, 10:02:11
Because the Doctor can't possibly know how many times he can regenerate now for sure.  He may suspect he has another normal set and finding out would require some rather extreme testing.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 20 October 2014, 10:12:59
I can't believe that the season is almost over already.  But Sherlock is coming to BBCA the same night as the finale.  I hope that means the new season, and that we don't have to wait for next spring to watch the new episodes on PBS/Masterpiece Mystery.  Because the cliffhanger ending was almost as interesting as figuring out how Holmes survived that fall.

You'll have to wait longer than that. We're not getting a full season of Sherlock till 2016. They're doing a Christmas Special based on "The Ble Carbuncle" in 2015, but that's it.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 22 October 2014, 07:02:00
Saw "Flatline" last night.  Interesting new monster, but like so many Moffat monsters, really only good as a one-off (yes I know Moffat wasn't the author of this episode). Was disappointed there were no outright references to the story "Flatland". 

Were the guest actors actually using real Bristol accents?

And it seems Roosterboy is vindicated-- Clara is once again a plot device, a pawn deliberately set in the game by Missy. And there's a big hint as to who is behind Missy--in the scene where we see her looking at Clara on the tablet, what does that hole in the wall behind her left shoulder look like...?  Regardless, I still think Clara is being groomed for something larger.

And it's clear some scenes with the Doctor alone in the shrinking TARDIS were re-shot or added later--anyone notice what happens to his hair?


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: worktroll on 22 October 2014, 17:23:51
Given that TV shows, like movies, are rarely shot by consecutive scenes, it's entirely possible that the Bristol scenes were shot either separately from, or at the same time, as the Doctor-only scenes. And that Continuity screwed up over the hair.

What, BBC making a continuity error? Never ...  ::)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: mdauben on 25 October 2014, 09:27:02
Finally got a chance to watch Flatline last night.  Despite this being a Clara-centric episode, and me not being much of a fan of the character, I really enjoyed the episode.  I almost found it anti-climactic when the Doctor finally got out of the Tardis and banshed the bad guys back to their own dimention.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 25 October 2014, 10:44:00
Finally got a chance to watch Flatline last night.  Despite this being a Clara-centric episode, and me not being much of a fan of the character, I really enjoyed the episode.  I almost found it anti-climactic when the Doctor finally got out of the Tardis and banshed the bad guys back to their own dimention.

And I thought that was the best speech of the Doctor's so far...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: mdauben on 25 October 2014, 10:48:24
And I thought that was the best speech of the Doctor's so far...
Not a bad one, certainly. I guess after Clara carried the show up to that point, I was expeting her to actually save the day.   But maybe the writers felt it was just too soon for that? 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 25 October 2014, 21:06:00
"In the Forest of the Night"...fun little romp...but I think the promo for part one of the season finale outshone it...

Still loved the interaction between Clara, Danny and the Doctor...and I think this is almost the most people we have seen at one time on the TARDIS...well, maybe when they were towing Earth home they had about the same numbers...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 25 October 2014, 23:01:26
It will be interesting to see how Missy and Clara play out here in the next two episodes but it does make me wonder who the next companion is going to be after Clara.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: StCptMara on 26 October 2014, 02:13:48
It will be interesting to see how Missy and Clara play out here in the next two episodes but it does make me wonder who the next companion is going to be after Clara.

I definately hope we have Capaldi for a while, though...Because, when he is let to be the Doctor, he is awesome.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 26 October 2014, 09:04:54
And I thought that was the best speech of the Doctor's so far...

It pretty much paralleled the one #11 gave the Atraxi at the climax of "The Eleventh Hour".
It's like the Doctor has finally remembered who he is and what Earth means to him.

And the name he gave the creatures...the "Boneless"...suits them well of course, but like I said above, another one-trick pony.  Is the name some oblique reference to the style of the notorious Viking, Ivar?

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 26 October 2014, 20:46:25
I definately hope we have Capaldi for a while, though...Because, when he is let to be the Doctor, he is awesome.

Agreed...he needs to stay for a long while...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: I am Belch II on 26 October 2014, 20:58:00
I like Capaldi as the Dr. It's just the shows are missing something to me.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 26 October 2014, 22:40:47
Agreed...he needs to stay for a long while...

Ruger

He'll be back for at least one more season. 

All told, a good choice; just because the Doctor has a new life cycle, doesn't mean he should just cavalierly throw away his regenerations (like the Master seems to have done)--especially when nobody (not even him) knows just how many he has.
And Capaldi has waited his whole career to portray the Doctor--why not stick around for the standard 3 seasons?  If he's still healthy and his interest hasn't waned there's no reason he shouldn't.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: StCptMara on 27 October 2014, 02:59:52
He'll be back for at least one more season. 

All told, a good choice; just because the Doctor has a new life cycle, doesn't mean he should just cavalierly throw away his regenerations (like the Master seems to have done)--especially when nobody (not even him) knows just how many he has.
And Capaldi has waited his whole career to portray the Doctor--why not stick around for the standard 3 seasons?  If he's still healthy and his interest hasn't waned there's no reason he shouldn't.

cheers,

Gabe

I really want Capaldi's run to be like Hartnell's run...you know: go until he literally cannot do it anymore.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 27 October 2014, 07:59:30
I really want Capaldi's run to be like Hartnell's run...you know: go until he literally cannot do it anymore.

Well, Capaldi does at least seem to be in considerably better health than Hartnell was when he started, so who knows?  Then again, I'm sure he doesn't want to spend the rest of his career as the Doctor.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 27 October 2014, 08:29:58
He's also the Cardinal on the Musketeers.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 27 October 2014, 09:04:35
He's also the Cardinal on the Musketeers.
I was half expecting episode where they were going to do silly cameo or nod to his presence in the other show.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 27 October 2014, 09:47:44
1 week to go until we find out...but has this person already cracked the mystery of Missy?

http://inky-paw.tumblr.com/post/100991645541/who-is-missy-general-musings-on-the-plot-lots-of (http://inky-paw.tumblr.com/post/100991645541/who-is-missy-general-musings-on-the-plot-lots-of)

EDIT:  and haven't I been saying nearly the same thing since shortly after the season began?  :P  ;)

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: mathesont on 27 October 2014, 22:31:41
Caught up again and finally a couple episodes I rather enjoyed.  Good to see Capaldi getting material to work with even in Claracentric episodes.  Shame the season is ending, but at least this Missy nonsense will be dealt with and it looks like the last of Clara, which is now a good thing in my book.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 29 October 2014, 01:48:41
Caught up again and finally a couple episodes I rather enjoyed.  Good to see Capaldi getting material to work with even in Claracentric episodes.  Shame the season is ending, but at least this Missy nonsense will be dealt with and it looks like the last of Clara, which is now a good thing in my book.

Whether you think it's a good thing or not, the burning question is what kind of exit is it going to be for Clara?  Will she die a tragic, violent death like Adric?  Leave on good terms after having been put through the wringer and want a quiet normal life?
Or are we in for something else entirely, once we find out the truth behind both Missy and Clara--especially the now rather strong implication that Clara is not, and never was, what she appeared to be. What I think we can expect is that SOMETHING happens that finally makes Clara turn against the Doctor.  Most of this season, she's been pretty much a Doctor-in-training.  And it was suggested back in "Deep Breath" that she has some not-so-endearing personality traits--she's egotistical and controlling.  Put all those together, and maybe the apprentice thinks it's time to take over from the master...especially if said master can't be relied upon to consistently do the right thing.

Somehow I'm getting a kind of "Revenge of the Sith" vibe from all this...as in the Great Intelligence, split up throughout time, and with knowledge of all of the Doctor's timeline, engineered Clara's conception with the intent of turning her into a weapon against the Doctor, much like Palpatine/Darth Sidious engineered the conception of Anakin Skywalker. 

Or, alternatively, to make reference to a certain surreal early '90s TV series...Clara is Agent Cooper, and the GI is "Bob".  Clara didn't come out of the Doctor's timeline the same as she was when she went in.



EDIT:  Oh, by the way, the Cybermen are back.  Hopefully Moffat handles them better than Neil Gaiman did in "Nightmare In Silver".

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 29 October 2014, 06:54:16
EDIT:  Oh, by the way, the Cybermen are back.  Hopefully Moffat handles them better than Neil Gaiman did in "Nightmare In Silver".

cheers,

Gabe

Well, we can hope we don't get another talking head Cyberman as the next temporary companion.  ;D
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 29 October 2014, 07:25:46
Well, we can hope we don't get another talking head Cyberman as the next temporary companion.  ;D

I kind of liked Handles actually  :P  ;).  He filled much the same role as K-9.  Too bad we never saw where and how #11 picked him up.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 29 October 2014, 12:13:35
Uh-oh...

So we know the title of the upcoming episode is "Dark Water".

I've been going around various Who-oriented online forums reading comments on that title...given Moffat's propensity for word games and clues, I really, REALLY hope this isn't telegraphing the identity of Missy--obvious who it would be with that title.  That would be just all kinds of bad.

It would actually be refreshing if Missy turns out to be a genuinely new villain.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 29 October 2014, 22:48:03
If it's who I think it is....

....

What happened, how did she get corrupted, and how did she manipulate things from inside a computer?

(Yes, I saw a theory that said that Missy's identity was her.  Doesn't mean it is her, mind you, but if it really is......  :o )
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 29 October 2014, 23:31:55
If it's who I think it is....

....

What happened, how did she get corrupted, and how did she manipulate things from inside a computer?

(Yes, I saw a theory that said that Missy's identity was her.  Doesn't mean it is her, mind you, but if it really is......  :o )

Well, you can go back a bit further than that...if it is HER...

How was she able to project herself outside of The Library computer in "The Name of the Doctor" without a physical body in the first place?  (Everyone else at that meeting had one...) And how was she able to maintain a psychic link with Clara?

As for her motivation...well, if your time-travelling husband left what was basically your soul locked up inside a computer on an abandoned library planet infested with dust-sized carnivorous shadow creatures and never came back even to check up on you, wouldn't you be just a bit pissed?


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 30 October 2014, 11:22:55
From cultbox.co.uk, this is one of the most amusing hypotheses on the identity of Missy I've seen yet...

Quote
One commenter suggested Missy is Death personified – the Doctor’s everlasting companion – but our favourite has to be a bitter, jilted TARDIS… the one which didn’t get stolen from Gallifrey by the Doctor due to Clara’s intervention and has been hunting him for two thousand years. Brilliant!

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 01 November 2014, 16:06:46
Dark Water just finished airing on BBC 1.  I am quite satisfied with Missy's true identity.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 01 November 2014, 16:24:49
I haven't seen it, but I heard something about it.  I'm still going to watch the episode, though it'll be tomorrow afternoon after I DVR it.  This is going to be a blast.  }:) :)

(And no, I'm not revealing it. :)  Even if she wasn't who I thought she was.  ;) )
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 01 November 2014, 21:02:58
Dark Water just finished airing on BBC 1.  I am quite satisfied with Missy's true identity.

That whole episode was just freaky!!!

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 01 November 2014, 23:53:50
watching as I type (during commercial break).  Just got the the reveal, and wanna say


It would have been a better surprise if BBC America hadnt showed Cybermen in the promo commercial!! >:( >:(  >:(

Finished Episode:  so much for that one fanfic concept I had :-(
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 02 November 2014, 00:54:29
watching as I type (during commercial break).  Just got the the reveal, and wanna say


It would have been a better surprise if BBC America hadnt showed Cybermen in the promo commercial!! >:( >:(  >:(

Finished Episode:  so much for that one fanfic concept I had :-(

I won't argue, though I did enjoy the episode.  :)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 02 November 2014, 01:55:42
Well, with all of the fan theories being bandied about, *one* of them had to be correct eventually.  ;)


And after all that mostly fruitless supposition, we find that the principle of parsimony holds--the simplest solution was the correct one.  Kind of disappointing in a way.


Still one hell of an episode though.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 02 November 2014, 04:56:22
Dark Water just finished airing on BBC 1.  I am quite satisfied with Missy's true identity.
I on the other hand am now offended by the entirety of Stephen Moffatt's run as EP.  This is an offense to the character.
The Doctor would have done anything to save the Master - BOTH of his previous regenerations.  The Master died - his last final death - to thwart Rassilon. 
AND, he worked with the Cybermen before.  They betrayed him.  He swore never to work with them ever again.
For that matter, assuming he somehow Regenerated, and magically teleported somewhere else at the same time, he had no Gallifreyan tech.  Where would he have gotten it?
Nothing in this episode makes sense with regards to everything we know about the Master.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 02 November 2014, 07:59:39
Well, with all of the fan theories being bandied about, *one* of them had to be correct eventually.  ;)


And after all that mostly fruitless supposition, we find that the principle of parsimony holds--the simplest solution was the correct one.  Kind of disappointing in a way.


Still one hell of an episode though.

cheers,

Gabe

Nah, I didn't find it disappointing.  Though it does bring new meaning to #5 and #10's exchange in "Time Crash".  Especially after Missy vaporizes Dr. Chang.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 02 November 2014, 13:14:09
I would have been a lot happier if they had gone a different route.  Too obvious and as pointed out too many questions that make the identity we were given not make sense.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 02 November 2014, 14:15:46
Was quite pleased with it actually. Quite a good episode I think. And I agree with Lazarus Jaguar about the BBC promos. Oh well.
Hopefully they will be much better than the crappy Cybermen we got in "Nightmare in Silver".

I on the other hand am now offended by the entirety of Stephen Moffatt's run as EP.  This is an offense to the character.
The Doctor would have done anything to save the Master - BOTH of his previous regenerations.  The Master died - his last final death - to thwart Rassilon. 
AND, he worked with the Cybermen before.  They betrayed him.  He swore never to work with them ever again.
For that matter, assuming he somehow Regenerated, and magically teleported somewhere else at the same time, he had no Gallifreyan tech.  Where would he have gotten it?
Nothing in this episode makes sense with regards to everything we know about the Master.


The easiest way to think of it, is that "The Day of the Doctor" cancels out "The End of Time". Of course, Moffet may reconcile the two in "Death in Heaven". Maybe.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: worktroll on 02 November 2014, 14:20:53
I on the other hand am now offended by the entirety of Stephen Moffatt's run as EP.  This is an offense to the character.
The Doctor would have done anything to save the Master - BOTH of his previous regenerations.  The Master died - his last final death - to thwart Rassilon. 


Ah, but the Doctor knows that the Master is no longer the last other of his kind. Gallifrey exists on the wrong side of the cracks, and does not appear to be under threat. Plus, this incarnation is more inclined to let inevitable deaths happen.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 02 November 2014, 22:36:04
I on the other hand am now offended by the entirety of Stephen Moffatt's run as EP.  This is an offense to the character.
The Doctor would have done anything to save the Master - BOTH of his previous regenerations.  The Master died - his last final death - to thwart Rassilon. 



This is the only point I would agree with.  The whole bit about being left behind, being left for dead, finding the way back, makes no sense in light of the Master's willingly going back into the time lock (honestly, those lines would've made MORE sense if spoken by Romana).  However, he was motivated as much by personal desire for revenge against Rassilon as helping the Doctor thwart Rassilon's plan to end the universe.  The Master/Mistress (guess we'd better get used to that now) is many things, but NEVER an altruist.  Still, why blame the Doctor for his/her predicament?



AND, he worked with the Cybermen before.  They betrayed him.  He swore never to work with them ever again.



When was this?  I don't recall the Cybermen and the Master ever working together.  If it was in the novels or the Big Finish audios, all of that is of highly dubious canonicity.  I really would love it, though, if Missy believes she's tamed the Cybermen, only to have it all blow up in her face.



For that matter, assuming he somehow Regenerated, and magically teleported somewhere else at the same time, he had no Gallifreyan tech.  Where would he have gotten it?



From the last place we know the Master ended up--Gallifrey.  ;)  Is Missy running the High Council now?  What if, as has been suggested on some other, dedicated Who forums, it was the Master/Missy who was responsible for providing the Doctor with the additional regenerations?


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 02 November 2014, 22:43:27


When was this?  I don't recall the Cybermen and the Master ever working together.  If it was in the novels or the Big Finish audios, all of that is of highly dubious canonicity.  I really would love it, though, if Missy believes she's tamed the Cybermen, only to have it all blow up in her face.


cheers,

Gabe


The Five  Doctors


Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 03 November 2014, 10:17:47
Yeah I would have been far happier if it had been Romana, or hell even Susan.  The lines would have made a lot more sense.  Maybe they'll pull the rug out from under us and have it really be Romana or Susan having decided to call themselves Missy now and all be a misdirection.  But that'd be way too good of a twist for Moffat's displayed talents so far.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 03 November 2014, 22:45:44
I can't really say how I'm feeling about Missy's reveal. It's not that it wasn't completely unexpected, just that, well, I'm a little disappointed with the fact that there was a lot of potential here to either beef up a really old and classic villain, like the Rani, or introduce a new villain that would be wholly for the Twelfth Doctor.

Ah, well. It seems like Moffat might be playing up to a new interpretation of the infamous Third Doctor/The Master rivalry of the classic era with this Twelfth/Missy set-up. So I'm okay with that too.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 03 November 2014, 23:11:45
I can't really say how I'm feeling about Missy's reveal. It's not that it wasn't completely unexpected, just that, well, I'm a little disappointed with the fact that there was a lot of potential here to either beef up a really old and classic villain, like the Rani, or introduce a new villain that would be wholly for the Twelfth Doctor.

Ah, well. It seems like Moffat might be playing up to a new interpretation of the infamous Third Doctor/The Master rivalry of the classic era with this Twelfth/Missy set-up. So I'm okay with that too.

But the Rani isn't a really old, classic villain--she was introduced during #6's time.  What you describe is what Moffat did with the Great Intelligence--and I was hoping Missy would have something to do with that.  The classic villain who needs a shot in the arm, IMO, is the Cybermen.

But what's done is done, whether we like it or not, and it remains to be explained as to how The Master/Missy made it off Gallifrey, why a woman's form now, why she blames the Doctor, and what she had to do with setting up the Doctor/Clara meeting.

Here's a thought...what if, before they both left Gallifrey, the Doctor and the Master were...well, you know....?



cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 03 November 2014, 23:22:23
But the Rani isn't a really old, classic villain--she was introduced during #6's time.  What you describe is what Moffat did with the Great Intelligence--and I was hoping Missy would have something to do with that.  The classic villain who needs a shot in the arm, IMO, is the Cybermen.

But what's done is done, whether we like it or not, and it remains to be explained as to how The Master/Missy made it off Gallifrey, why a woman's form now, why she blames the Doctor, and what she had to do with setting up the Doctor/Clara meeting.

Here's a thought...what if, before they both left Gallifrey, the Doctor and the Master were...well, you know....?



cheers,

Gabe

Actually, I was kind of thinking that Clara is to The Mistress/Master what the Valeyard was to The Doctor.  But I'm batting .000, so I'm probably off.   
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 03 November 2014, 23:33:54
As for the Master/Doctor relationship hinted in the new episode, what about this:

What if what the Doctor(s) did in the 50th, ie: not using the moment, but instead locking Gallifrey away in a bubble universe...undid everything we saw of the Master in nuWho. So so, Derek Jacobi Master, no John Simm Master.
What if during the Time War there was a bit where the Doctor abandoned the Master, where before the rewrite the Master ran away and became Derek Jacobi and all we see following that...
But now, since the Doctor locked up Gallifrey in the bubble universe, and all we have seen never actually happened, Missy is still angry at the Doctor for abandoning her back then. Would explain how she got hold of Time Lord tech...

Honestly though, that's one of the very few things Moffet needs to do before he ever steps down. Needs to square the 50th with "The End of Time". Because basically it invalidates it completely.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 04 November 2014, 07:03:53
Which was probably his goal.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 04 November 2014, 08:26:22
But the Rani isn't a really old, classic villain--she was introduced during #6's time.

Perhaps I should've been clearer. I meant "really old and classic villain" in terms of a prominent villain from the classic series.

And I tend to see the Rani as a really old villain. Yes, she was introduced in the 6th Doctor era, but that was nearly thirty years ago, now.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 04 November 2014, 09:53:24
Perhaps I should've been clearer. I meant "really old and classic villain" in terms of a prominent villain from the classic series.

And I tend to see the Rani as a really old villain. Yes, she was introduced in the 6th Doctor era, but that was nearly thirty years ago, now.

Perhaps so, but the 2 stories that featured her aren't regarded as classics by a goodly portion of Who fandom.  And, with the Master now having assumed a female form, the character is kind of redundant.

I think those two points are related somehow  ;D

cheers,

Gabe 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 04 November 2014, 15:33:17
Another option is that Missy is a regeneration that predates Jacobi and Simm's Masters
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: jimdigris on 04 November 2014, 16:05:47
I'm jumping in a little late, but this has been the first good episode this season, in my opinion.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 04 November 2014, 18:12:15
I'm jumping in a little late, but this has been the first good episode this season, in my opinion.

Maybe I'm more forgiving (or just really enjoy watching Capaldi, have I yet said how much I love his Doctor?), but I'd say there were some pretty good ones this season, not great, but good: "Time Heist", "The Caretaker", "Flatline", "In the Forest of the Night". I thought those had been the best four of the season.

And I can't say why. I can't put my finger on it. But this season just feels more like classic Who than any of the previous 7 series. For all it's falsesteps, I love this series (I can't really say the same for 5-7...).
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 04 November 2014, 19:50:20
For me too many episodes have been rehashing so much of the Doctor "getting old and daft so the sexy female companion has to figure out the problem/save the day" that we got from Gillian/Smith's era.  If they got back to more of the Doctor being ahead of everyone else like in Time Heist I'd feel a lot better about this current season.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 04 November 2014, 22:44:55
Perhaps so, but the 2 stories that featured her aren't regarded as classics by a goodly portion of Who fandom.

Not sure what part of the fandom you're talking to... but most of the classic DW fans I know, either online or personally, are all eagerly awaiting the return/reboot of the Rani in the new series.  Maybe it's just a personal preference for classic Who villains, I suppose.

Quote
And, with the Master now having assumed a female form, the character is kind of redundant.

Not necessarily. The Master and the Rani have teamed up before. So a Missy/Rani team-up isn't too much of a stretch. And might be kind of fun to see, actually.

Another option is that Missy is a regeneration that predates Jacobi and Simm's Masters

Or, perhaps, just another body that the Master has taken over/assimilated. Kind of like a Tremas of Traken type scenario.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 04 November 2014, 22:56:04
Okay...here is something I'd like to see...Missy meeting either River Song...or Captain Jack... ;D

(Of course I'm still waiting for that Captain Jack/River Song spin-off show... :D :D :D Can you imagine the sparks? :D)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Medron Pryde on 05 November 2014, 02:15:21
[Sulu]Oh Myyyyyyy[/Sulu]

That would be....well....fantastic!

:)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 05 November 2014, 06:39:41
For me too many episodes have been rehashing so much of the Doctor "getting old and daft so the sexy female companion has to figure out the problem/save the day" that we got from Gillian/Smith's era.  If they got back to more of the Doctor being ahead of everyone else like in Time Heist I'd feel a lot better about this current season.

Time Heist was the only one I liked this season.  It felt like a classic or even Tennant era adventure.  Not the Dany Pink/Clara Oswald soap opera most other episodes degenerate jnto.  The Doctor should not be a support character.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 05 November 2014, 09:48:46
I would say we are getting at least slightly higher quality episodes and not quite as many duds but otherwise I agree that the Doctor has become too much of the companion.

Hell if this keeps up I'd rather Moffat just make the next Doctor an attractive woman.  Maybe then we can get back to a clever Doctor who is constantly five steps ahead of everyone else and not the support vehicle that Smith and Capaldi have been.  Which is a bit of a shame because I do like Capaldi as the Doctor despite the scripts we've gotten so far.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 05 November 2014, 22:14:46
Okay...here is something I'd like to see...Missy meeting either River Song...or Captain Jack... ;D

A Missy/River Song confrontation would be kind of cool.

Quote
(Of course I'm still waiting for that Captain Jack/River Song spin-off show... :D :D :D Can you imagine the sparks? :D)

Captain Jack needs to make a return -- regardless of whether it's a team-up or not. After Miracle Day, Jack needs the fun of the Whoverse once again.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 05 November 2014, 23:55:09
While Miracle Day was way better than Children of Earth I'm inclined to believe Torchwood is dead as a doornail at this point and the likelyhood of Captain Jack coming back in any form is fairly nil.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 06 November 2014, 01:58:47

(Of course I'm still waiting for that Captain Jack/River Song spin-off show... :D :D :D Can you imagine the sparks? :D)

Of friction, as they fight over the Doctor!  ;D  ;D

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 08 November 2014, 22:21:23
Poor Osgood.   :'(
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Grognard on 08 November 2014, 22:50:26
not impressed with the season ending.

overall, this season with Cipaldi: very, very unimpressed.

what is BBC trying to do? product crap for ScyFy to rerun?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 09 November 2014, 11:59:31
Poor Osgood.   :'(

That was almost painful...

Definitely loved the tributes to the Brigadier...and Kate's introduction of herself to the Cybermen was bloody brilliant...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: jimdigris on 09 November 2014, 12:24:48
I'm still without a clue about what the Doctor found at the end of the show.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 09 November 2014, 14:57:42
I guess I'm the only one that wasn't in any way affected by Osgood's death. To me she was never an actual character, but simply a forgettable caricature of the fans from a forgettable episode.


It might be because this was simply the "resolution" half of a two partner, but I found it rather flat. Certainly compared to the tension of last week's. The tribute to the Brig was great, as was seeing Kate again. Hopefully she and UNIT will be back for more episodes. (Though....nuWho hasn't really been very nice to UNIT).

I'm still without a clue about what the Doctor found at the end of the show.

No Gallifrey.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 09 November 2014, 16:37:26
Yeah not a great ender but it certainly did have some moments that I liked.

Kate and her dad was a nice touch but I think my favorite was the stinger.  Got a good laugh out of me.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 09 November 2014, 16:59:58
And at this point Julia Deakin, Katy Carmichael and Mark Heap are the only Spaced alumni yet to appear in Doctor Who.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: mdauben on 09 November 2014, 20:05:11
I finally got a chance to watch the two part season finale today and (unlike a lot of people it seems) I really liked them.  Some excitement, some fansquee, even some emotion. 

I'm not sure about everyone else, but I was quite surprised by the revelation that Missy was The Master.  The whole giving control of the Cybermen to the Doctor was I thought a cool idea in light of the Doctor's ongoing moral dilemma this season.


I never particularly cared for either Clara or her relationship with Danny Pink, but I still got a bit caught up in the emotions of him being a Cyberman, saving her, and in the end not coming back in favor of the boy he accidentally killed in the war.


The irony of both the Doctor and Clara, giving up their relationship under the false impression that they were doing the other a favor so their friend could be happy was probably the first time I actually felt anything for Clara beside mild annoyance.  ;) 


Now, I'll just have to wait for more...  :'(
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 09 November 2014, 20:54:06
I finally got a chance to watch the two part season finale today and (unlike a lot of people it seems) I really liked them.  Some excitement, some fansquee, even some emotion. 

I'm not sure about everyone else, but I was quite surprised by the revelation that Missy was The Master.  The whole giving control of the Cybermen to the Doctor was I thought a cool idea in light of the Doctor's ongoing moral dilemma this season.


At least the Doctor has morals.  Though it probably didn't occur to the Master/Mistress after all these years that the best way of ruling the universe is being an idiot and not wanting to (or having no desire to) rule the universe.

...

Wait, didn't they cover that on Pinky and the Brain once?
:P

That said, I liked the episode, and I don't mean to sound harsh with my spoiler.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lore on 09 November 2014, 22:18:45
No Gallifrey.

I think that was just half of it, actually. The remaining half, I believe, was that *THIS* Doctor found himself vulnerable enough [or perhaps, desperate enough] to take Missy's "conviction" that she'd found Gallifrey, seriously.

In other words, I do think he was starting to accept that Missy was telling the truth. Forgetting the one cardinal rule when it comes to dealing with Time Lords... that they almost always lie.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 09 November 2014, 22:23:47
I actually quite suspect Missy/The Master told a half truth.  Gallifrey hasn't moved, why would it?  But it is still in another dimension and thus quite inaccessible.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: mathesont on 10 November 2014, 02:02:42
A dismal end to a dismal season.  And the teaser for the Christmas Special actually made my wife groan - visiting relatives might be a better option for once. 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: William J. Pennington on 10 November 2014, 08:52:24
Has there been a deliberate choice to make the fans hate Clara this season? Did the actress irritate show writers at the end of last season? The character seems to be very inconsistent with last season, and written o be deliberately unlikeable and foolish.

I feel a little let down by the build up. I wanted to see the use of many of those who died and were 'greeted' by Missi in earlier episodes. But there was a lot I enjoyed. I'm ok with the Doctor, but the failings of the proper use of the Companion and Villain made it well, not bad, just nto as good as it could have been.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 10 November 2014, 15:52:15
Not impressed.  Missy was almost tolerab!e, but other than that whole thing was a whole lot of blah.

And leave it to Moffat, he finally has the balls to kill a cbaracter, and it's one of the few of his I actually liked.  Its almost like hewants people to stop watching the show.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 10 November 2014, 21:00:06
Has there been a deliberate choice to make the fans hate Clara this season? Did the actress irritate show writers at the end of last season? The character seems to be very inconsistent with last season, and written o be deliberately unlikeable and foolish.

Really? I've found her much more interesting and have more depth to her character than she did last season. Last season it was almost like she was just the Doctor's pet. He wasn't really interest in HER, just in the mystery ABOUT her. This season she actually feels like a real person now. Reacting in real ways to the stuff the Doctor pulls. Not just going about in blind faith like companions really do. She has the guys to call the Doctor out when she feels the need to. (Such as the Doctor abandoning her during "Kill the Moon".) The only other companions I can think of that did that were Romana, Ace and Donna (such as "Fires of Pompeii".) Personally I find Clara to be the best female character that Moffet has created. (Amy wasn't really very interesting. Basically what a 14 year old boy would write as a character and the less said of River Song the better...)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 10 November 2014, 21:21:26
I haven't seen enough of Romana and Ace to say where I'd rate Clara as a companion versus them but versus the ones I have seen enough of I'd say she's more of a character than Amy for sure but only just but Donna Noble is easily a more developed character.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: William J. Pennington on 11 November 2014, 00:25:45
Not impressed.  Missy was almost tolerab!e, but other than that whole thing was a whole lot of blah.

And leave it to Moffat, he finally has the balls to kill a cbaracter, and it's one of the few of his I actually liked.  Its almost like hewants people to stop watching the show.

Maybe he killed the spare.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: mdauben on 11 November 2014, 00:29:14
And leave it to Moffat, he finally has the balls to kill a cbaracter, and it's one of the few of his I actually liked.  Its almost like hewants people to stop watching the show.
Are you talking about Danny?  I thought overall he was just a walking plot device, there to feed Clara prompts about how she should feel about the Doctor and highlight the whole issue of Clara being "addicted" to traveling with the Doctor.  Overall, his whole relationship with Clara seemed forced and unrealistic and I don't think they ever really justified the "love" that she felt for him in the finale.  The season finale was the closest I came to actually caring about him, and that was not all that close.   ;)

Slight digression, what happened to that supposed descendant of Danny Pink in Listen?  There was no suggestion that Clara was pregnant at the end of this season AFAIK, and no suggestion that he might have children from a previous relationship, either.  So, how did he have a descendant?   ???

I haven't seen enough of Romana and Ace to say where I'd rate Clara as a companion versus them but versus the ones I have seen enough of I'd say she's more of a character than Amy for sure but only just but Donna Noble is easily a more developed character.
I don't know what it was, but I never warmed to Clara.  She seemed to alternate between plot device and grating distraction from the story.  I actually liked Amy a bit more, but I'll admit I wasn't a truly dedicated viewer of her run on the show and probably only caught half her episodes, often out of chronological order.  I know I was much sadder to see Amy disappear in The Angels Take Manhattan than I was to see Clara walk away in Death in Heaven.

Maybe I just like redheads better.   ;D
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 11 November 2014, 02:35:12
I'm shocked that with Companions coming back from the grave, that Moffatt didn't have Amy and Rory Williams show up.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 11 November 2014, 09:38:15
Slight digression, what happened to that supposed descendant of Danny Pink in Listen?  There was no suggestion that Clara was pregnant at the end of this season AFAIK, and no suggestion that he might have children from a previous relationship, either.  So, how did he have a descendant?   ???

I don't know what it was, but I never warmed to Clara.  She seemed to alternate between plot device and grating distraction from the story.  I actually liked Amy a bit more, but I'll admit I wasn't a truly dedicated viewer of her run on the show and probably only caught half her episodes, often out of chronological order.  I know I was much sadder to see Amy disappear in The Angels Take Manhattan than I was to see Clara walk away in Death in Heaven.

Maybe I just like redheads better.   ;D

In reverse order:

I think it is because Clara in her own way was a worse 14 year old boy's fantasy than Amy was but only slightly more redeemable because she did actually have a few moments where she did stand up to the Doctor.

My personal theory is that what we saw in Listen is not a genetic descendant of Danny Pink but the unnamed boy he sent back taking the Pink name.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 11 November 2014, 10:52:28
I'm shocked that with Companions coming back from the grave, that Moffatt didn't have Amy and Rory Williams show up.

Or Sarah Jane for that matter  :D

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 11 November 2014, 12:04:00
Or Sarah Jane for that matter  :D

cheers,

Gabe

That would be rather difficult.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 11 November 2014, 13:20:42
That would be rather difficult.

No more than it was the Brig....
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 11 November 2014, 14:17:20
Actually that is a good question.  I haven't seen anything that actually says what the fate of the Sarah Jane character was after the actress passed.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 11 November 2014, 20:31:47


My personal theory is that what we saw in Listen is not a genetic descendant of Danny Pink but the unnamed boy he sent back taking the Pink name.

I was thinking the same thing.  He probably adopted the "Pink" name in tribute of Danny.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 11 November 2014, 21:06:29

Slight digression, what happened to that supposed descendant of Danny Pink in Listen?  There was no suggestion that Clara was pregnant at the end of this season AFAIK, and no suggestion that he might have children from a previous relationship, either.  So, how did he have a descendant?   ???

Actually, there was.

If you go over the Post-It notes in Clara's apartment that she was planning to show Danny (which several fan sites have done), you'll see one of them says "three months". 

But, if that were the case, you would've expected her to be much more cut up over Danny's demise, and not be so eager to throw herself into danger with the Doctor again...

Then again, Christmas is supposed to be a time for new birth...


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 12 November 2014, 10:55:15
I'm going to watch the finale again before giving a full opinion, but I will say that on the whole, it did NOT live up to the setup of "Dark Water".

One thing I DID like though:  Michelle Gomez.  She is a revelation as the new Mad-ster.  Totally blows John Simm out of the water, and the way in which she disposed of Osgood makes her easily the most heinous, odious version of the character since...well...maybe ever!
Notice when she did that, she was affecting an accent similar to Karen Gillan's?

I hope she plays the role for many years to come.  Who needs Charles Dance? :P

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: mdauben on 12 November 2014, 13:41:57
I think it is because Clara in her own way was a worse 14 year old boy's fantasy than Amy was but only slightly more redeemable because she did actually have a few moments where she did stand up to the Doctor.
I'm not quite sure if you are suggesting I have the reactions of a 14 year old boy, or not...?   ;D

Just to explain, I often found Clara annoying and/or distracting from the episodes storyline in ways that Amy never did.  To me, the only real exception was Flatline where Clara actually shined.  I also thought the Amy/Rory relationship was much better developed and believable than the Clara/Danny one.  I could believe Amy would sacrifice herself to be with Rory, not so much with Clara and Danny.


Quote
My personal theory is that what we saw in Listen is not a genetic descendant of Danny Pink but the unnamed boy he sent back taking the Pink name.
But he looked like Danny Pink, which makes no sense if he was some random kid Pink was unrelated to. 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Medron Pryde on 12 November 2014, 20:35:45
I'm one of those really weird people who saw Clara before Amy.

I never saw the Matt Smith episodes on first run since my Cable company doesn't have BBC America.  The first Matt Smith episode I saw was the 50th Anniversary Episode, followed by the last Episode of the Matt Smith run.  And in those two episodes we saw a Clara that understood the Doctor, who called the Doctor on his errors, and who was willing to tell the Time Lords what was going on when the Doctor wouldn't say a word to them.  In those episodes she was the perfect companion in my opinion.

Amy never reached those levels in her run in all the episodes I've seen since.  Of course, I can't watch the current run because my Cable company doesn't have BBC America.  So I can't see how she does in this run...:(
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 13 November 2014, 09:05:57
I've not had chance to watch the later episodes of the season, but I'm slowly catching up.

I found that Clara had better chemistry with Matt Smith's doctor than she does with Peter's.  Maybe the writers are all worn out, because I think they may need refreshing things up.  If Doctor's no longer the girl magnetic he used to be because he was being played by a young actor, they should clear the companion and writers to make way for different take of the show.

I don't mind Peter's doctor, but having watched old series and new series up to this doctor, I've found Matt's doctor and David before him were better fits with audience watching them.  Peter's doctor is cool, but he bit too craggy and almost unlikeable way Peter is portraying him.  I found the War Doctor more watchable than this one unfortunately. 

Clara was fine until Peter's Doctor showed up.  Writers I think didn't do hot job integrate these two as team, not the way they captured the audience with Smith.   Clara may need go and properly the writing staff itself it's having that much trouble making things click.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: mdauben on 13 November 2014, 10:13:38
The first Matt Smith episode I saw was the 50th Anniversary Episode, followed by the last Episode of the Matt Smith run.  And in those two episodes we saw a Clara that understood the Doctor, who called the Doctor on his errors, and who was willing to tell the Time Lords what was going on when the Doctor wouldn't say a word to them.  In those episodes she was the perfect companion in my opinion.
Fair enought.  I have not actually seen those episodes, so my only experience with Clara was during the current Capaldi run.

I found that Clara had better chemistry with Matt Smith's doctor than she does with Peter's. 
Again, I've not seen Clara with Smith, but I agree that for the most part she seemed to lack any chemistry with Capaldi.  Since the show is Doctor Who and not The Companion, I think that's a fatal flaw in the character, whether its the actress's fault or the writer's. 

Quote
I don't mind Peter's doctor, but having watched old series and new series up to this doctor, I've found Matt's doctor and David before him were better fits with audience watching them. 
This may be true, but I was under the impression that it was a deliberate choice to go with a different type of Doctor for this reincarnation.  It may alienate some of the previous fans of the "new" Doctor Who, but as someone who remembers the old Doctors (and as an older viewer myself) I find I like the change.  Now, I liked all the actors who played the Doctor in this new incarnation but I like Capaldi's take on the character, too.  Something different is not a bad thing on such a long running show.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 22 November 2014, 21:32:10
After watching "Dark Water"/"Death in Heaven", I have to say Michelle Gomez plays a good Master. Think the role suits her.
That said...I wish they had written her differently. To be honest...I find her a female John Simm. That same loony craziness. The Master has always had one problem throughout the show. One that the Doctor has always managed to avoid. Namely: having to follow the line set down by his/her predecessor.

Delgado was the first (and to my mind the best) Master. It is always fun to watch him. Plays the part with such relish. Can tell he enjoys it very much and the chemistry between him and the other actors is great.
Peter Pratt and Geoffrey Beevers only had one story each ("The Deadly Assassin" and "The Keeper of Traken" respectively), so it's hard to judge them. What I remember of Pratt is a well done performance. (Never actually seen "TKoT" to be honest".)
Next comes Anthony Ainley. Who is....good. Could have been great. Unfortunately it seems like most of his stories were written for Delgado's Master. There are moments where you can see just how good he could have been if given free reign with the character. Too bad he was never really given the chance. I think his last performance ("Survival") was his best. It is hard to judge between Delgado and Ainley because they are so similar. If they had been more different, they could have stood together (like each of the Doctor's incarnations do) instead of Ainley forever being in Delgado's shadow.
And next...Eric Roberts. Such a perfect casting ruined by a horrible, horrible script. If it had had a much better script, I think Roberts would have joined D. and A. among the best Masters. At the end of the TV movie, when he has become his full self. You can almost see how great he would have been. He has that charm of Delgado, and the psychopathy of John Simm.
Derek Jacobi would have been great if he had stayed the Master instead of immediately regenerating. Jacobi has even said he enjoyed it very much, would have loved to have come back. (Trivia time: This was actually his second time playing the Master. The first was in the "Scream of the Shalka" webcast. Which is on DVD now, I'd suggest picking it up. A very good story. Richard E. Grant is the Doctor...and honestly he feels like a cross between the Classic Doctors and the new. And kind of similar to Capaldi.)
And then came John Simm. Above I talked about the Master's regenerations not being allowed to be different. Well they did with this one...and how. I think it shows what can happen when you go too far the other way. Simm is a good actor. His role on DW is wacky, crazy, dangerous...but not the Master. At least, not to me. He has no purpose, except to torment the Doctor. And to me...that seems to miss the point of the role. Killing/tormenting the Doctor was never his main goal, it was more like a hobby. And I just never found his portrayal scary or menacing. I don't know, just never warmed up to him.
And finally Michelle Gomez...who feels like a female clone of Simm. Again, what's her motivation? The one she gave to the Doctor seems suspect to me. If that was truly her motivation...I think someone needs to reevaluate this character.

I think the problem with the Master in nuWho...is that the writers feel they have to PROVE the Master is a baddie. For instance her recent killing of Osgood to prove that she was evil. To me, that's just lazy writing. Plus it didn't have any impact because one, you saw it coming the moment the two of them were together and two, Osgood as a character is a non-entity.

I really think Ms. Gomez can be great in this role. But, the writers really need to give her depth. Not just have her capering around the cosmos cackling madly and twirling her figurative mustache.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 26 November 2014, 16:04:00
http://www.blastr.com/2014-11-25/new-details-doctor-whos-christmas-special-revealed-title-synopsis-and-promo-art

The Doctor and Clara face their "Last Christmas."
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 26 November 2014, 17:17:13
Don't have the link at the moment...but it has been confirmed that Capaldi will stay the Doctor for series 9 and 10. No word on Jenna Coleman though.

I'm actually really happy about this. I know he's been really decisive...but I love his performance. Was talking with a friend a few days ago, and she said the Capaldi really reminded her of Hartnell. Both started out very gruff, very hard to like...but gradually grew warmer, more approachable.

So I am really looking forward to seeing what he does with the role. (Just hope he get's some better stories. Or better yet...Moffet decides to pack up and make room for a new showrunner...)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 30 November 2014, 00:52:42
I just had to share this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1SZs4xudf8 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1SZs4xudf8)

I'm sorry...I'm so sorry...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 30 November 2014, 06:04:14
It illustrates perfectly why Ron Gainer allegedly said "Did I write that?" when he heard the Radiophonic Workshop's arrangement of the theme.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 30 November 2014, 08:41:29
I just had to share this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1SZs4xudf8 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1SZs4xudf8)

I'm sorry...I'm so sorry...

I'll raise it with this unused intro, complete with Delaware theme. (http://youtu.be/3_lvf_aVFjE)

(IIRC, the theme was used on a couple of episodes during the Pertwee era, but only the Aussie versions due to a shipping error)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 06 December 2014, 12:00:06
I just had to share this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1SZs4xudf8 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1SZs4xudf8)

I'm sorry...I'm so sorry...

Now we just need a Doctor Who adventure to be set during an episode of Hawaii Five-O.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 06 December 2014, 12:20:37
So did anyone else here watch "The Five(ish) Doctors Reboot"? It was epic. A vastly superior celebration of the show than the official 50th Anniversary.

And supposedly...Paul McGann has let slip there might be a sequel to it made...maybe released this year...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 06 December 2014, 14:33:57
I want see Matt Smith doing funny comments in gag films for the new Terminator Movie.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 10 December 2014, 19:39:56
http://www.cultbox.co.uk/news/headlines/doctor-who-spin-off-lethbridge-stewart-novels-announced (http://www.cultbox.co.uk/news/headlines/doctor-who-spin-off-lethbridge-stewart-novels-announced)

I so want to read these....
The Brig was always cool. ;D
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 13 December 2014, 17:56:01
For those of you who haven't had a chance or inclination to get caught up on Classic Who...you can now watch all of the episodes of the entire 26 year run, all at the same time...here (http://youtu.be/s-XqZmLhOCY).
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 14 December 2014, 09:36:56
I also like that if you click on the blocks of the individual runs, it'll bring you to a video of all their episodes.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 23 December 2014, 17:18:37
I've been listening to the early Big Finish audio plays (can download them on their website for $3 each) at work lately. They do help the time pass more quickly.

And as much I as enjoy the new TV episodes (and Capaldi very greatly), there is something very gratifying in listen to the the BF plays. They really do feel like classic episodes. And I have to be honest, I have a very much greater appreciation for Colin Baker's Doctor now. I know I've said it before, but in these audio dramas his Doctor is much more nuanced then he was in the TV episodes. I think the closest we really saw to what his Doctor has now become was in "Terror of the Vervoids". (And I would have liked to have seen more of him with Mel, but at least now I can listen to them.)

Listened to "The Spectre of Lanyon Moor" today. And I loved it. Nothing spectacular, just a good, solid classic Doctor Who story. Oh, and it has the Brig in it, so that is in itself a major plus (the Brig is one of the coolest companions around). For any "New Tricks" fans out there it also has James Bolam in it (I recognized his voice immediately, but it wasn't until almost the end that I finally figured out who it was, was driving me nuts).

And finally, I want to start a petition to the BBC to make Evelyn Smythe fully canon. She is one of the coolest and most interesting companions the Doctor has ever had. I love her to bits. :D
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 25 December 2014, 13:17:14
I've been thinking about something for awhile now, would like other Whovians thoughts on it: namely that all, or at least the vast majority of the Doctor's adventures we've seen/heard/read (on TV/Big Finish/novels) are all battles in the Time War. We do know that the Time Lords have used the Doctor as their proxy (the CIA sending him on missions), we also know that they can take control of the TARDIS whenever they please. Who know's what or  who the Dalek's might use as their proxies. And since it is a TIME War, even future Doctors could be part of it. (Just because Gallifrey has been put in a pocket universe for now, doesn't mean that the war is finished. Far from it.)

It would also neatly explain all of the inconsistencies and discontinuities across all of the various Doctor Who media. The time line keeps getting rewritten by all of the Time Lord's and Dalek's shenanigans. 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 25 December 2014, 23:00:34
The Last Christmas was interesting mind teaser episode.   I like how where I am they played last year's special right after it. 


I can't say I'm shocked, but episode end pull rug multiple times on fans i think fooling is she staying or is she cameoing in this special.
I guess we Clara will appear in next season for now.  I'm still wondering if they'll answer the Impossible Girl thing though.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Sharpnel on 26 December 2014, 01:31:49
Jenna Coleman is going to do one more season of Doctor Who per multiple online sources. Just Google her name and you will find it.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: roosterboy on 26 December 2014, 21:12:25
I'm still wondering if they'll answer the Impossible Girl thing though.

That was answered in the 50th anniversary special. What more is there?

I wish Coleman wasn't doing another season, not because I dislike Clara (which I do, but because of the writing for the character, not because of the actor) but because I thought having the Doctor rescue her when she was old and hadn't seen him for 62 years would have been a good way for the character to end her run. I'm not a huge fan who is up on all the history, but has something like that ever been done with a Companion before?

This special was another one of Moffat's too-clever-for-its-own-good stories. By the time we got to the end, I didn't give a rat's ass if they were still in a dream or if it was real or what. The performances from the four guest actors were mostly bland, though I enjoyed Faye Marsay's Shona more than the rest. Nick Frost as Santa was... well, there really was no point to it except that it was a Christmas special so I guess they needed to work in something Christmassy. The story would have been the same whether it had been Santa or some other character.

I enjoyed Capaldi's performance in his first season as the Doctor, but the writing rarely lived up to it. And the writers never seemed to decide if Clara should be an actual character or a mere plot device. Hopefully, they'll do a better job in the next season. And while I mostly liked Danny Pink, I think Clara's arc with him was ultimately detrimental to the stories and I hope the writers don't try to tie her down to present-day Earth too much. One thing I'd like to see more of is just how fun and exciting "all of space and time" would be. Forget a season-long arc and just do one- and two-parters that are well written and fun.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 26 December 2014, 21:52:10
That was answered in the 50th anniversary special. What more is there?

I wish Coleman wasn't doing another season, not because I dislike Clara (which I do, but because of the writing for the character, not because of the actor) but because I thought having the Doctor rescue her when she was old and hadn't seen him for 62 years would have been a good way for the character to end her run. I'm not a huge fan who is up on all the history, but has something like that ever been done with a Companion before?

This special was another one of Moffat's too-clever-for-its-own-good stories. By the time we got to the end, I didn't give a rat's ass if they were still in a dream or if it was real or what. The performances from the four guest actors were mostly bland, though I enjoyed Faye Marsay's Shona more than the rest. Nick Frost as Santa was... well, there really was no point to it except that it was a Christmas special so I guess they needed to work in something Christmassy. The story would have been the same whether it had been Santa or some other character.

I enjoyed Capaldi's performance in his first season as the Doctor, but the writing rarely lived up to it. And the writers never seemed to decide if Clara should be an actual character or a mere plot device. Hopefully, they'll do a better job in the next season. And while I mostly liked Danny Pink, I think Clara's arc with him was ultimately detrimental to the stories and I hope the writers don't try to tie her down to present-day Earth too much. One thing I'd like to see more of is just how fun and exciting "all of space and time" would be. Forget a season-long arc and just do one- and two-parters that are well written and fun.

I pretty much agree with everything you've said. Though, I did like Clara better in this season than in season 7, it felt like they were still trying to make her more of a real character, not just a puzzle for the Doctor to figure out. But I would like to point out for everyone complaining that it's become too much of "Clara Who"...well, that's just Moffet's vision of the show. I'm sorry I don't have the link handy, but in an interview he basically said that to him the show is about the Doctor, but the main character is the companion. And we've seen that philosophy throughout his run. Just look at Amy and Rory.

And as for whether the Doctor not coming back in 62 years...well, kind of. I mean, the Doctor does have a habit of just leaving people. But an exact example like that...hm, can't think of one right of hand.

I liked Danny...I liked how Clara was trying to have a life beyond the Doctor. I mean, she isn't really quite attached to 12, not like she was with 11. So it seems like she wants a real life, not just travel forever with the Doctor. (And honestly is the Clara/Danny relationship and different than the Rose/Mickey or Any/Rory relationships before the guys started traveling with the Doctor?)
But yes, I'd like to see less Earth-centric stories as well. Get back to exploring the wonders of the Universe.

And I totally agree with your summation of the Christmas special as well. It was...okay. Better than "Robots of Sherwood" (not that that is saying much). It really felt like it had no justification other than that it was a Christmas special. I kept expecting Tiny Tim to show up or the Doctor to break the fourth wall and wish everyone a Merry Christmas (oh wait, he's already done that (http://youtu.be/zvqeixdSSP0)). In the end this special committed the worst sin any television show can: it was boring.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 26 December 2014, 21:56:09
*nod*

I think I had a fairly similar problem with the most recent season.  They really didn't seem to make up their mind about Clara and the season long story arc.

As far as the Impossible Girl the 50th didn't explain that one bit.  We got a partial one in The Name of the Doctor but it still really didn't explain how she was able to do what she did and survive.

Christmas Special in particular.  Yeah I got to admit it was predictable and was kind of boring.  I've seen so many similar themed stories that it wasn't even that great of a fake out episode.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 26 December 2014, 22:12:58
Are these christmas specials/movies replacement for the 10 minute specials like when 5th Doctor meet David Tennet's Doctor then Titantic crashes into the Tardis?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 26 December 2014, 23:42:33
I thought "The Name of the Doctor" did explain it...in that when she entered the Doctor's time stream it split her up, so that all of the Claras that died were Clara...but not (for lack of a better term), Clara Prime (the one that got his number from the "woman in the shop").
So Clara from "Asylum of the Daleks" and "The Snowmen" were both Clara...but not Clara Prime...

Are these christmas specials/movies replacement for the 10 minute specials like when 5th Doctor meet David Tennet's Doctor then Titantic crashes into the Tardis?

No. That particular one ("Time Crash") was done for the Children in Need telethon.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 26 December 2014, 23:49:43
The dialogue in The Name of the Doctor indicated Clara Prime should not have been able to survive being shredded along the Doctor's time line like that.  So it did explain how she was there to die to save his life but not how she was able to come back out from being shredded.  It is a mystery I can live with though as it is really a fairly minor nitpick.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 26 December 2014, 23:54:21
The dialogue in The Name of the Doctor indicated Clara Prime should not have been able to survive being shredded along the Doctor's time line like that.  So it did explain how she was there to die to save his life but not how she was able to come back out from being shredded.  It is a mystery I can live with though as it is really a fairly minor nitpick.

Put it up to the Doctor jumping in after her and bringing her back out?

Though to be honest...him jumping into his own time stream (from his future no less) should have had fairly apocalyptic effects for the entire cosmos...


(And at least it's still not as confusing as that whole "Pandorica" thing... #P )
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 27 December 2014, 00:07:46
There are certain things I'm okay with not knowing about Clara and the Doctor.  How Clara was even able to survive long enough for him to pull her out is one of them.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Mecha82 on 28 December 2014, 13:03:34
Xmas special was Inception Doctor Who style. Dreams within dreams within dreams. Oh and Clara was in it from beginning to end. Funny how Doctor got angry when he heard that there is horror movie called Alien. 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 28 December 2014, 16:14:53
I liked Frost's performance in the special, despite him being figment of collective people's imagination.  Specially Santa's car security remote. ;)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 28 December 2014, 19:37:08
Xmas special was Inception Doctor Who style. Dreams within dreams within dreams. Oh and Clara was in it from beginning to end. Funny how Doctor got angry when he heard that there is horror movie called Alien.
I said Inception too!  And yeah, the Doctor's reaction to Alien was hilarious.
I liked Frost's performance in the special, despite him being figment of collective people's imagination.  Specially Santa's car security remote. ;)
Nick Frost, playing Santa Claus was inspired typecasting.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 29 December 2014, 11:08:38
Okay, I do have to admit: having Nick Frost in it made me happy. Especially considering Simon Pegg has been in an episode as well.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 29 December 2014, 15:21:56
Yeah, at this point only Mark Heap and Julia Deakin are left from the main cast of Spaced.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: I am Belch II on 29 December 2014, 18:35:33
Im glad that Jenna Coleman is back for another season...I just hope the story and writing of show gets better.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 02 January 2015, 21:23:03
Im glad that Jenna Coleman is back for another season...I just hope the story and writing of show gets better.

With Moffat still in charge, that's not going to happen.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: mdauben on 05 January 2015, 11:06:12
Im glad that Jenna Coleman is back for another season...I just hope the story and writing of show gets better.
I, on the other hand, was quite disppointed to see she's returning next season.  I thought after the end of Death in Heaven we were done with her.   :(

I actually would have been happy if they had just stopped at 80 year old Clara.  I thought that would have made a nice farewell to her character.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 05 January 2015, 22:47:26
I, on the other hand, was quite disppointed to see she's returning next season.  I thought after the end of Death in Heaven we were done with her.   :(

I actually would have been happy if they had just stopped at 80 year old Clara.  I thought that would have made a nice farewell to her character.

It was supposed to be Clara's farewell.    You could tell in the cold open something was amiss from the way Clara touched the Doctor and spoke about being back in TARDIS, like she really hadn't done it in decades.  The ending was supposed to parallel Clara's last minutes with the aged #11 near the end of last year's Christmas special.  But, after all of Jenna Coleman's hemming and hawing about staying on or not, and finally deciding to stay, they did a hasty rewrite and filmed the additional scene.  Very creditable job on the makeup BTW, though she didn't play old nearly as well as Matt Smith did.

Why did Jenna finally decide to stay?  Was she looking for a better gig and couldn't find one? Perhaps she got spooked into returning by the fate of Karen Gillan's series _Selfie_?  Was she really conflicted about whether or not she wanted another season?  Or was it the usual base motives (i.e. just holding out for more money)?

Well, she'll be back, seemingly for a full season.  This will give her a length of tenure equal to Karen Gillan's, and puts her in the same league as other long-serving companions like Sarah Jane and Romana.  Hopefully she'll just be  the companion now, not used as a plot device.  And her final farewell is going to have to be something REALLY special.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 06 January 2015, 00:04:18
How much of it was really Coleman's decision? And how much was it the BBC making "drama"?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: mdauben on 14 January 2015, 10:55:37
I didn't notice right away, since there's no new Doctor Who episodes to watch right now, but I realized unril last night that my stupid cable system had dropped BBC America!   [madflame]

I sent in a complaint, but I don't expect any satisfactory resposne.  My cable system is littered with "junk" channels these days, and they drop one of the few broadcasting (mostly) quality programming.  Feh! Maybe its time to drop cable altogether and just rely on Netflix or Amazon Prime for my viewing.   :(
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: roosterboy on 14 January 2015, 11:34:17
Netflix is losing all their BBC shows—including Doctor Who—at the end of the month.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 14 January 2015, 13:54:16
Not terribly surprising.  It'd be nice if more of the networks/studios and Netflix could play nicer together but hey at least Netflix is going to be putting out a Dare Devil series in April.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: mdauben on 14 January 2015, 19:14:57
Netflix is losing all their BBC shows—including Doctor Who—at the end of the month.
Anyone here if Amazon is having any issues with the BBC?  They have the complete run of the NuWho series in their Instant Video line so if they continue carrying the show next season it would be a viable alternative to my crappy cable. 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 14 January 2015, 19:24:25
Don't really care about Netflix loosing Doctor Who. Hulu has a far, far bigger selection (almost all of them I think, except for the missing episodes and "Trial of a Timelord").
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 14 January 2015, 19:45:56
In Netflix' case, it's just that they've not reached a new licensing agreement with the BBC yet.  This has happened a few times recently with different shows or distributors and is frequently resolved before the deadline or shortly thereafter.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 15 January 2015, 00:46:56
Don't really care about Netflix loosing Doctor Who. Hulu has a far, far bigger selection (almost all of them I think, except for the missing episodes and "Trial of a Timelord").
Hulu Plus, not the free service.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 15 January 2015, 07:58:24
Sounds like providers trying to cash in on the Doctor Who gravy train whenever they can.

God, i miss it being on PBS in America, no worries about hyper-commercialism/capitalism.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 18 January 2015, 22:57:25
So watched "Fires of Pompeii" again tonight. Really brilliant episode. That's the kind of story I wish we'd get for series 9. Honestly though, except for the two part Sontaran story (which wasn't bad, just the weakest story of the series), Series 4 has about the best writing that nuWho has seen (at least IMHO). "Fire of Pompeii", "Planet of the Ood", "Turn Left", had some stories with real emotional punch (if you can watch the escape pod scene in FoP without at least getting a lump in your throat, you have no soul).

I've just felt that emotional depth from Series 5 on was just...lacking. They did try in Series 8. Notably "Kill the Moon", which in some ways reminds me of "Fires of Pompeii". In both the Doctor is faced with an impossible decision. Who lives? Who dies? But there are notable differences, for 1) when the 10th Doctor wants to leave, you feel like he is serious; when the 12th leaves it doesn't feel like he really left, only waiting in the wings to swoop in if Clara messes up. 2) when Donna chastises the Doctor for wanting to run away, it is because of her empathy, her humanity: the magnitude of what happens breaks her heart; when Clara chastises the Doctor, I can't help but feel that it isn't because of what might or might not of happened or how many people might have died: but because the Doctor put her in a difficult situation, made her make the tough decisions instead of making it for her. And finally 3) it really begins Donna's journey to become someone so much more special and important than she could ever imagine herself to be: for one moment... one shining moment... she was the most important woman in the whole wide universe. And as for Clara....oh she told the Doctor where to get off...but did that experience change her in anyway? No...by the next story she was back to her addiction...

So yeah, I want to see more stories with the emotional depth of "Fire of Pompeii"...I want a story to actually affect me....make me feel...not just look pretty...

(As a side note...did anyone else think Peter Capaldi was channeling Stan Laurel in that episode?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: mdauben on 31 January 2015, 08:13:40
I just read that Amazon is dropping Doctor Who from their Instant Video service because they could not negotiate exclusive rights to the program.  Since my cable dropped BBC altogether, looks like no Who for me next season.    :'(
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 01 February 2015, 20:10:48
I just read that Amazon is dropping Doctor Who from their Instant Video service because they could not negotiate exclusive rights to the program.  Since my cable dropped BBC altogether, looks like no Who for me next season.    :'(

Fortunately the box sets usually come out fairly quickly after the season ends.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 01 February 2015, 23:55:47
Also, if you have a Windows PC, you can buy the season on Microsoft Video (or XBox Video if you have 360/One). They usually release them the day after it airs. That's how I watched season 8.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 02 February 2015, 07:05:00
Has there been talk about what next season may in tale?  I was bit disappointing that the events of the Day of the Doctor, with time lords giving the Doctor second batch of regenerations didn't lead to movement behind that plot. I did miss half of the later part of season but doesn't sound like anything heart shattering accrued.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 02 February 2015, 18:35:47
Has there been talk about what next season may in tale?  I was bit disappointing that the events of the Day of the Doctor, with time lords giving the Doctor second batch of regenerations didn't lead to movement behind that plot. I did miss half of the later part of season but doesn't sound like anything heart shattering accrued.

Well, we know that the Master/Missy seems to have made it off Gallifrey somehow and knows its location.  In "Death in Heaven", she lied to the Doctor about it still being in its original location.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 02 February 2015, 18:40:13
Well I have a pet theory about that.

Gallifrey is still in it's original position(accounting for whatever drift may have occurred) but is still locked away/cannot be accessed by the Doctor.  To me it seems the perfect half truth for the Master/Misstress in his/her final moment.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 03 February 2015, 00:10:13
Well I have a pet theory about that.

Gallifrey is still in it's original position(accounting for whatever drift may have occurred) but is still locked away/cannot be accessed by the Doctor.  To me it seems the perfect half truth for the Master/Misstress in his/her final moment.

Except that wasn't her final moments. Missy has already been confirmed to return in Series 9. That's one of the very few things we actually know about the upcoming series.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 03 February 2015, 00:15:24
Ugh.  Why can't they just let the Master/Misstress stay dead.  I'm really starting to lose my tolerance for the crap in recent Doctor Who.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 03 February 2015, 01:45:36
If there's one character who'll always come back from certain death in Doctor Who, it's the Master. 

And Davros.

Two!  If there are any two characters who'll always come back from certain death in Doctor who it's the Master, Davros and the Rani.

I'll come in again
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 03 February 2015, 11:43:37
I'd be more okay with it if the Master/Mistress were not quite so decidedly vaporized and hadn't been so overused.

Davros at least his end was questionable enough I could possibly tolerate his return if the story around it was good.

Rani, same.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 03 February 2015, 13:16:14
I'd like Missy more if she was different from the previous Master. Her personality seems exactly the same to me. But I guess that's what Moffet likes (see Moriarty in "Sherlock").
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 03 February 2015, 20:15:48
If there's one character who'll always come back from certain death in Doctor Who, it's the Master. 

And Davros.

Two!  If there are any two characters who'll always come back from certain death in Doctor who it's the Master, Davros and the Rani.

I'll come in again

I'll take it.  If there are any characters who'll return from certain death in Doctor Who, it's the Master, Davros, and the Rani. Oh and the Cybermen and the Daleks and...

Oh, wait..... [blank]
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 07 February 2015, 15:06:01
I know I've said it several times before, but everyone simply must check out the Sixth Doctor's adventures from Big Finish. They given a lot of depth to his personality. And allowed Colin to grow the character however he wished to.


So, that said, I have a bit of bittersweet news: the Sixth Doctor is getting his regeneration scene (http://www.blastr.com/2015-2-5/doctor-will-regenerate-again-2015just-maybe-not-one-you-were-expecting).


So we will finally get to learn what led to him regenerating into McCoy. And oh, yes, it will involve the Valeyard.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 08 February 2015, 00:05:44
I wonder how their going to do Collin Baker's last hurrah?  CGI like they did in the new Terminator movie and some stand ins?

Not like he was old man when he regenerated, but we may see something of what were missing out.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 08 February 2015, 00:14:52
From what it looks like, it's only going to be the audio play, so you'll have to imagine it.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 08 February 2015, 11:16:07
From what it looks like, it's only going to be the audio play, so you'll have to imagine it.

Ahhh....Well, they've done animation style for the lost episodes of Dr. Who they had only audio for.  I can image they could do that too.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 08 February 2015, 14:31:45
Ahhh....Well, they've done animation style for the lost episodes of Dr. Who they had only audio for.  I can image they could do that too.

Um...no. Just...no.

Big Finish only does audio plays. They're quite good actually. You really should check them out. I'd say many of them are better than many of the televised stories. (Especially comparing their Sixth Doctor stories to the televised Sixth Doctor ones.) They also introduced one of my all time favorite companions: Professor Evelyn Smythe. She was played by Maggie Stables (may she rest in peace), and was absolutely wonderful. Was a great fit with Colin Baker.
Also, their Seventh Doctor range is great! (Of course I'm biased, McCoy was my first Doctor.) And they've also done many, many stories featuring Paul McGann's Eighth Doctor. He's really cool.
And they also have non-Doctor stories. They have this one series about the rise of Davros on Skaro, from when he was a young boy to when (I believe) right before the 4th Doctor met him in "Genesis of the Daleks". (Haven't finished it yet.) It was...disturbing to say the least. Creepy boy that...
And the production values on them are generally quite good. So seriously, don't let the lack of a visual medium deter you. Go check them out! :D

Big Finish (http://www.bigfinish.com/)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 20 February 2015, 20:49:44
Well, just finished watching 'Last Christmas.'

Wow.

I have no words to convey how awful that was.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 20 February 2015, 21:20:22
Well, just finished watching 'Last Christmas.'

Wow.

I have no words to convey how awful that was.

I know, right?

We need good (won't even go so far as to wish for great) stories ASAP. The whole last season has been "meh" to "bleh". If they don't come up with some decent stories soon Peter Capaldi will become the Colin Baker of the revised series....
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 21 February 2015, 02:26:46
And if he does, it wont even be his fault, just like Baker.  This is Moffat s crap writing at work.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Medron Pryde on 24 February 2015, 07:37:27
I think we need some Captain Jack to spice things up.

"Hello."

"Stop flirting."

"I was just saying hello!"

"For you that's flirting...."

Ah....the good old days...;)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 24 February 2015, 11:13:24
Can you imagine if Jenny (the Doctor's daughter) and Captain Jack came back in the same episode?
(And you thought he was protective of Clara toward Danny...!!!)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 26 February 2015, 13:07:01
Missy-haters, despair!

http://www.doctorwhonews.net/2015/02/missy-190215100008.html

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 27 February 2015, 13:31:29
Missy-haters, despair!

http://www.doctorwhonews.net/2015/02/missy-190215100008.html

cheers,

Gabe

Yeah, that was revealed within days of the end of series 8.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 28 February 2015, 13:47:40
I know I've been going on about these here for quite a while, but I'm going to do it again:

An Introductory Primer for the Audio Adventures of Doctor Who (http://toybox.io9.com/an-introductory-primer-for-the-audio-adventures-of-doct-1688541023/+riamisra#)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 28 February 2015, 14:04:07
Yeah, that was revealed within days of the end of series 8.

We knew Missy was going to be back for Series 9, but that soon???  Getting yet more bad vibes here...like Moffat is going to overuse Missy the way he did with the Weeping Angels and River Song.

Still no word AFAIK on whether River will return.  I know many here aren't looking forward to such an event--but if it happens, I think it would only be fitting if it's the Doctor's last meeting with her, an adventure that takes place right before the events of "Silence In the Library" from River's perspective.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 28 February 2015, 19:03:40
They've already established in an internet exclusive clip (from about series 6 I believe) that it's Eleven that has the last meeting with River Song.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 01 March 2015, 01:29:38
They've already established in an internet exclusive clip (from about series 6 I believe) that it's Eleven that has the last meeting with River Song.

But that's the disembodied River who exists inside the Library computer (though how is she able to project herself?).  What I meant would be for #12 to meet a still-corporeal River who's getting ready for the Library adventure--does he break their "no spoilers" policy and attempt to dissuade her from going, or not tell her and allow her to meet the fate he knows is in store for her? 

It would also give her "you're so young" comment to #10 some meaning, if the last Doctor she had seen was the older-looking (and temporally older) #12, and is then confronted with the youthful #10.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 01 March 2015, 07:15:45
But that's the disembodied River who exists inside the Library computer (though how is she able to project herself?).  What I meant would be for #12 to meet a still-corporeal River who's getting ready for the Library adventure--does he break their "no spoilers" policy and attempt to dissuade her from going, or not tell her and allow her to meet the fate he knows is in store for her? 

It would also give her "you're so young" comment to #10 some meaning, if the last Doctor she had seen was the older-looking (and temporally older) #12, and is then confronted with the youthful #10.

cheers,

Gabe

There was a short created (and included in the boxed set for one of the seasons)...it has the Doctor and River crossing their timestreams with themselves on their first date and last date. Both Doctors are Matt Smith....

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 02 March 2015, 15:27:32
There was a short created (and included in the boxed set for one of the seasons)...it has the Doctor and River crossing their timestreams with themselves on their first date and last date. Both Doctors are Matt Smith....

Ruger

I know this may sound odd, but did they even have a honey moon?  They never seem to be together for very long....
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 31 March 2015, 11:43:36
Look who will be guest starring in the upcoming season...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/32118693 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/32118693)

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 31 March 2015, 14:15:50
And Arthur Darvill will be a time traveler in his own right for the CW.

http://www.blastr.com/2015-3-31/doctor-who-star-and-new-hawkgirl-join-arrowthe-flash-spinoff
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: I am Belch II on 31 March 2015, 17:52:45
Look who will be guest starring in the upcoming season...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/32118693 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/32118693)

cheers,

Gabe

Sounds like a good episode. Its pretty neat that Masie Williams has had very little acting roles before being the "awesome girl" on Game of Thrones, and being no better then 16.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 01 April 2015, 14:06:39
Sounds like a good episode. Its pretty neat that Masie Williams has had very little acting roles before being the "awesome girl" on Game of Thrones, and being no better then 16.

Personally, I hope she appears in very heavy makeup and costume and is almost unrecognizable.  I won't disagree that she's been pretty awesome as Arya Stark, especially for someone with so little prior experience, but I think that she's in great danger of being too closely associated with a particular role too early in her career.  As Sylvester McCoy himself once said of playing the Doctor, "I don't think you ever really can get away from him, can you?"  (the main difference being that he was already a broadly experienced comedian, actor, and TV host when he took on the role of the 7th Doctor).

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 06 April 2015, 18:58:52
Sorry for the quote necromancy, but..

Well, we know that the Master/Missy seems to have made it off Gallifrey somehow and knows its location.

If this was brought up before, my bad, but I just noticed something.  I was watching the 50th anniversary episode and couldn't help but notice something:  Right when the Doctor(s) blast the Dalek out of the "Gallifrey Falls No More" painting, a hand sticks out of the painting. :o

If you guys saw/discussed this before me, you have my permission to call me a slow witted Sontaaran kisser. :-[
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 22 April 2015, 22:40:50
Just watched "The Enemy of the World" on DVD. Was a very enjoyable story. A refreshing change of pace for Doctor Who (especially for that era). No monsters. Just the evils of humanity. Not only was Patrick Troughton a really good Doctor, but he played a very evil villain (if with a dodgy accent). As always Jamie was fun to watch, I've always thought him one of the best companions. And I know Victoria gets a bad rap as one of the worst of the screamers, but honestly I don't think she screamed once in this story. Thought she handled her own quite well.

In some ways the Hartnell and Troughton years were the best for Doctor Who: in that there was no show formula. It was still very experimental. By the Pertwee years it became very much a "Monster-of-the-Week" show. Oh there were the rare exception ("Black Orchid" is a lovely example), but on the whole the formula for the show never really changed. And the revived series feels even more trapped in that. While the latest season dabbled in different genres ("Time Heist" was a very good heist story, and "Mummy on the Orient" express with it's obvious homage), even still it never seems to escape that fundamental premise. I have a very hard time imaging them doing a story like "The Mind Robber" today. So I enjoy those years, when it was finding it's identity. Changing from purely a light sci-fi show specializing in historical education to monsters and scares and pure entertainment.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 23 April 2015, 05:17:14
Enemy of the World is on my to-watch list, I remember being quite impressed with the episodes that were on the Lost in Time DVDs
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 29 April 2015, 22:40:13
Just thought I'd share some cool music stuff I've found:

The Doctor Who Radiophon-A-Tron (http://www.bbc.co.uk/doctorwho/classic/news/radiophonatron.shtml)
(Make your own theme arrangement.)

And I think everyone here has probably heard this:
Doctor Who Theme (1963) (https://youtu.be/75V4ClJZME4)

But have you heard it like this:
Doctor Who Theme (Time-Stretched) (https://youtu.be/An-_WttF490)
That sounds super amazing if you ask me...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 16 May 2015, 17:48:00
Somehow, they've found a way to bring back Ingrid Oliver as Osgood for the next series...

http://www.kasterborous.com/2015/05/heres-ingrid-oliver-back-osgood-location/ (http://www.kasterborous.com/2015/05/heres-ingrid-oliver-back-osgood-location/)

Question is...is that really Osgood?

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 16 May 2015, 19:46:24
Considering the way Moffat writes stuf, yeah probably.  He doesnt kill off anyone.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 17 May 2015, 10:29:37
I thought he said in an interview recently that the one Missy killed was the Zygon Osgood...

Speaking of Osgood...I must be the only Whovian that doesn't like that character...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 17 May 2015, 11:48:15

Speaking of Osgood...I must be the only Whovian that doesn't like that character...

Don't worry, ask any two Whovians for the opinion on anything about Doctor Who and you'll get at least 12 conflicting answers.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: StCptMara on 08 June 2015, 00:56:16
Don't worry, ask any two Whovians for the opinion on anything about Doctor Who and you'll get at least 12 conflicting answers.

Oh..this is why I wish there was a like button on here..
This is so bloody true! Worse is when we start arguing our reasons with our selves and turning around
to represent our different arguments to ourselves!

What? Am I the only one who does that?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Darth Nichos on 09 July 2015, 19:55:06
Series 9 Trailer is up

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fi3nJBlJs48

So the girl at the end- Doctor's Daughter or Susan Foreman?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 09 July 2015, 20:12:06
Well I'm inclined to say not his Daughter(from the machine) since they said she couldn't regenerate.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 09 July 2015, 22:10:18
Well...

that put's the rumor about no Daleks this season to rest. Also, did anyone else see the Doctor rocking out on a guitar? I have to see that!!! Anyone else think it would be epic of Craig Ferguson guest starred?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 09 July 2015, 23:13:02
Well I'm inclined to say not his Daughter(from the machine) since they said she couldn't regenerate.

Unless Rule #1 is in effect. :P
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 10 July 2015, 00:53:06
Or something Timey-Wimey occurred.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 10 July 2015, 09:01:46
Obviously my inclination could be wrong and I do grant it is only an inclination, not an absolute "not his daughter(from the machine)" notion.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 10 July 2015, 12:40:11
And there's also:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQouVe5ZBdM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQouVe5ZBdM)

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 10 July 2015, 14:52:39
And there's also:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQouVe5ZBdM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQouVe5ZBdM)

cheers,

Gabe

I wish that was also a special video program too.  :D
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 10 July 2015, 18:12:01
Unless Rule #1 is in effect. :P

Actually, as I think about it, I forget that Susan's suppose to be his granddaughter, and we've never seen his first spouse/kid(s)/et al.

(Though I believe his mom was suppose to be on the council.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 10 July 2015, 18:15:04
*nod*

Tons of people it could be from the Doctor's past that we have plenty of loose threads for.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 10 July 2015, 18:52:27
Actually, as I think about it, I forget that Susan's suppose to be his granddaughter, and we've never seen his first spouse/kid(s)/et al.

(Though I believe his mom was suppose to be on the council.)

Well....depends...according to the New Adventure stories published in the 90s Susan wasn't technically the Doctor's granddaughter...but...well it's complicated...

Yeah, I do believe RTD did say that...then again he's also said it could have been the Doctor's wife...or even Susan once...so...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 10 July 2015, 18:53:33
*nod*

Tons of people it could be from the Doctor's past that we have plenty of loose threads for.

True that.

Well....depends...according to the New Adventure stories published in the 90s Susan wasn't technically the Doctor's granddaughter...but...well it's complicated...

Yeah, I do believe RTD did say that...then again he's also said it could have been the Doctor's wife...or even Susan once...so...

We'll just have to see.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 10 July 2015, 19:01:24
We'll just have to see.

Honestly, I rather hope we don't. I really miss the Doctor being a mysterious character. From Tennant on it seems like they just keep tearing away more and more of the mystery of the Doctor. :/
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 10 July 2015, 19:53:00
Tennants Dicor still had mystery.  Its been Smith's that seems to have the mist backstory filked out.  Almost like Moffat is trying to force his vision onto everyone.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 13 July 2015, 12:07:30
Well....depends...according to the New Adventure stories published in the 90s Susan wasn't technically the Doctor's granddaughter...but...well it's complicated...

Yeah, I do believe RTD did say that...then again he's also said it could have been the Doctor's wife...or even Susan once...so...

The BBC made the new adventures stories non-canon.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 13 July 2015, 14:06:11
The BBC made the new adventures stories non-canon.

Well they were never really canon to begin with. But I still think on the whole they're better stories than the revived TV show. (And the Big Finish plays are even better still.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Darth Nichos on 18 September 2015, 21:24:40
Anyone been watching the marathons? Also, they announced that Jenna Coleman (Clara Oswald) is leaving in Series 9 for her role as Queen Victoria in an upcoming BBC Series. Wonder who we will get next?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 19 September 2015, 06:30:11
There have also been two prequel mini-episodes to season 9 released with the second airing on BBC America last night at 10 PM ET...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Darth Nichos on 19 September 2015, 14:42:15
Well BBC did something stupid and released the promo to Episode 2 early; even before Episode 1 aired

Davros is back!
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: StCptMara on 20 September 2015, 03:35:22
So, an interesting perspective...
Assuming that Missy/The Master isn't lying about the Doctor being her best friend,
it raises an interesting bit of alien-ness to the Time Lords we had not seen before. I mean,
what sort of best friends try to kill each other? The kind where the society encourages
growth through conflict. And suddenly, with that, everything makes sense: His companiosn are
friends..so he makes sure they go through the crucible that shapes them into better people.
The same as he and the Master try to kill each other to make each other rise above themselves..


What do people think on that speculation?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 20 September 2015, 03:35:38
BBC America dropped "The Magician's Apprentice" for free on Facebook.

All I can say is...wow...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Khymerion on 20 September 2015, 03:49:02

What do people think on that speculation?

I like that speculation.   Really something to mull over honestly.   Lets see how this pays off!
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 20 September 2015, 08:50:26
So, an interesting perspective...
Assuming that Missy/The Master isn't lying about the Doctor being her best friend,
it raises an interesting bit of alien-ness to the Time Lords we had not seen before. I mean,
what sort of best friends try to kill each other? The kind where the society encourages
growth through conflict. And suddenly, with that, everything makes sense: His companiosn are
friends..so he makes sure they go through the crucible that shapes them into better people.
The same as he and the Master try to kill each other to make each other rise above themselves..


What do people think on that speculation?


Hm, while I would agree about his companions...I'd have to disagree about the Doctor/Master relationship.
It's been pretty clear from even early in their onscreen relationship that they were very good friends once. They've always been dropping hints on the show even since the Classic series.
The Doctor and Master did belong to the same College after all.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 20 September 2015, 10:27:15
So, an interesting perspective...
Assuming that Missy/The Master isn't lying about the Doctor being her best friend,
it raises an interesting bit of alien-ness to the Time Lords we had not seen before. I mean,
what sort of best friends try to kill each other? The kind where the society encourages
growth through conflict. And suddenly, with that, everything makes sense: His companiosn are
friends..so he makes sure they go through the crucible that shapes them into better people.
The same as he and the Master try to kill each other to make each other rise above themselves..


What do people think on that speculation?

To quote something I saw on an old bottle of soap:

"The surest way to defeat your worst enemy is by becoming his most sincere friend."

Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 20 September 2015, 18:07:33
It makes sense.

Overall despite growing tired of seeing the same old enemies time and time again I think this story rather worked well, especially for what it seems to be setting up for what seems to be the season long theme.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 22 September 2015, 06:13:41
I wonder if they'll shake up things by adding new villians this seasons or new threats that will be around. 

Since Peter joined, i don't know.  Its not the same as when Tennent and Smith were on.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 22 September 2015, 10:12:11
How did the Doctor initially fail to realize that he was on Skaro in the middle of the Kaled/Thal war?  He'd been there before, he knew what conditions were like and should've been familiar with the mix of high/low tech the combatants had been reduced to using by that point.

Now those hand mines...anybody else think of the cover of Stephen King's Night Shift?  Especially the story "I Am The Doorway" ?



And who do you think is more deserving of the title of Doctor's Archenemy... Davros, or the Master/Missy ?

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: StCptMara on 22 September 2015, 13:51:00
How did the Doctor initially fail to realize that he was on Skaro in the middle of the Kaled/Thal war?  He'd been there before, he knew what conditions were like and should've been familiar with the mix of high/low tech the combatants had been reduced to using by that point.



I think that was explained by the Doctor rather well.. He did ask which war was it, because he had seen so many. There could easily have been others with similar mixes of high/low tech on other world.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 22 September 2015, 22:50:08
I think that was explained by the Doctor rather well.. He did ask which war was it, because he had seen so many. There could easily have been others with similar mixes of high/low tech on other world.

Point taken, but couldn't the TARDIS have given him some indication as to where he was?  AFAIK, that planet has not been repeatedly relocated in space...

What do you all think about the yet-again re-jigged presentation of Clara here?  We don't know how much time elapsed between this story and "Last Christmas", but it seems like she and the Doctor have been apart again for a while.  And yet, she now seems to be acting as the Doctor's proxy on Earth when he's not around.  She seems much more mature, more hard-edged, and has insight into the the Doctor's way of thinking and doing things that very few, if any, other companions have ever had.  At first I thought this was just another step in the continuing Mary Sue-ification of the character, but then I considered who the episode's villain was, and remembered his previous monologue about how the Doctor molds his companions into a proxy army.  In Clara's case, it certainly seems to have worked.  Though that theme would've been more in keeping with last season.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 26 September 2015, 21:19:55
NEW SONIC!!!!

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 26 September 2015, 23:36:46
I've not seen 9th season yet aside the preview. i'm trying get my wife watch. i've gotten see 3 episodes of the 8th season, up to episode 8.    Curious see what going on with Missy joining forces with the Doctor.  Preview for season 9 has doctor rocking out.  funny and weird.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 27 September 2015, 09:31:46
After watching the episode, I had to wonder, Has the Doctor ever heard a Dalek cry for mercy?  I mean, IIRC, Rose showed one mercy, one begged River Song for mercy, albeit in vain. 

Oh, and I wonder what plans Scary Poppins is going to come up with.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 27 September 2015, 22:13:57
After watching the episode, I had to wonder, Has the Doctor ever heard a Dalek cry for mercy?  I mean, IIRC, Rose showed one mercy, one begged River Song for mercy, albeit in vain. 

I had thought about that too.  The Doctor wasn't there.  I guess we must infer the Dalek in the latter case was somehow one of the strain seen in these episodes.  However, it goes to show--and this is a topic for a whole separate post--that the treatment of the Daleks under Moffat's tenure has just been spectacularly inconsistent, especially in terms of how deeply ingrained their hatred of everything that's not Dalek is/isn't.

Quote
Oh, and I wonder what plans Scary Poppins is going to come up with.


Davros did mention the prophecy of a Dalek/Time Lord hybrid.  Perhaps Missy is going to make it happen?

And how much of the Doctor's regeneration energy was siphoned off?  Seemed like he was stuck on those cables for a while...might have lost most of his new set of lives there.


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 28 September 2015, 09:27:30
I had thought about that too.  The Doctor wasn't there.  I guess we must infer the Dalek in the latter case was somehow one of the strain seen in these episodes.  However, it goes to show--and this is a topic for a whole separate post--that the treatment of the Daleks under Moffat's tenure has just been spectacularly inconsistent, especially in terms of how deeply ingrained their hatred of everything that's not Dalek is/isn't.


Davros did mention the prophecy of a Dalek/Time Lord hybrid.  Perhaps Missy is going to make it happen?

And how much of the Doctor's regeneration energy was siphoned off?  Seemed like he was stuck on those cables for a while...might have lost most of his new set of lives there.


cheers,

Gabe

Probably only one.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: elf25s on 29 September 2015, 10:55:46
monty python invaded doctor who in 1979
i spotted john cleese in city of death with tom baker....surprise! ;D
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: DEZOAT on 03 October 2015, 10:27:09
 >:( Well my cable company drop BBC America so I can't watch Doctor Who this  season . I have buy the end season set.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: mdauben on 05 October 2015, 09:25:23
>:( Well my cable company drop BBC America so I can't watch Doctor Who this  season .
I have the same problem.  Unlike you I'm on the fence over buying the season.  While I like Capaldi's Doctor, I'm not a hard-core fan of the series and I'm not really very fond of Clara.  If it was still "free" to watch I probably would.  Just not sure I want to see it bad enough to pay to watch it.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 10 October 2015, 21:55:12

And how much of the Doctor's regeneration energy was siphoned off?  Seemed like he was stuck on those cables for a while...might have lost most of his new set of lives there.


cheers,

Gabe

My bet is that the answer is...



However much the story demands...


Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 10 October 2015, 22:15:31
My bet is that the answer is...



However much the story demands...


Ruger

Best.  Answer.  Ever. :O0
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Mecha82 on 11 October 2015, 14:17:25
I found Missy to be pure fun in those episodes and every time she was on screen she stole the show. Too bad that it means that she stole show from title character but least she made it less about Clara.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Khymerion on 11 October 2015, 18:19:40
I found Missy to be pure fun in those episodes and every time she was on screen she stole the show. Too bad that it means that she stole show from title character but least she made it less about Clara.

And that is exactly what the show needs.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 11 October 2015, 19:05:45
So any thoughts about "Beneath the Lake"/"Before the Flood"?

Thought they felt very much like a classic story. And the big baddy was quite a monster design. ;D
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: I am Belch II on 11 October 2015, 19:08:24
Did anybody notice Corey Taylor's scream cameo from the last episode.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Khymerion on 11 October 2015, 19:10:36
The Monster design was really interesting.   I found the premise interesting and at least the opening was nice to help explain what was to play out later in the story.  Not bad honestly.   Not as good as the opening for the season but definitely not as bad as some episodes.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 11 October 2015, 19:47:47
So any thoughts about "Beneath the Lake"/"Before the Flood"?

Thought they felt very much like a classic story. And the big baddy was quite a monster design. ;D

I actually kind of suspected at first that the Doctor was hiding in the suspended animation chamber.  I just dismissed it because it seemed too obvious.  That said, I enjoyed it.  Oh, anybody notice the reference to Harold Saxon/Missy/The Master's tenure as the Minister of Defense?  Or was that Prime Minister, it's been awhile since I saw the episode.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Khymerion on 11 October 2015, 20:15:35
I actually kind of suspected at first that the Doctor was hiding in the suspended animation chamber.  I just dismissed it because it seemed too obvious.  That said, I enjoyed it.  Oh, anybody notice the reference to Harold Saxon/Missy/The Master's tenure as the Minister of Defense?  Or was that Prime Minister, it's been awhile since I saw the episode.

Yes, they did properly reference the Saxon/Master reign as Prime Minister in the episode.  Saxon/The Master was in the Ministry of Defense (Where we got the Valiant before it was... sunk?  Shot down?  Axed due to being too interesting) but that was not referenced in the episode.   What is interesting is the idea that there is a Ministry of War coming that the Doctor doesn't know about yet.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 14 October 2015, 02:31:27
So any thoughts about "Beneath the Lake"/"Before the Flood"?

Thought they felt very much like a classic story. And the big baddy was quite a monster design. ;D

I actually thought this was the best story of Capaldi's tenure so far, and his best turn as the Doctor yet, better than "Time Heist" and "Listen".  Although, I feel that with the increasingly numerous references to popular Earth culture, now including taking up electric guitar, he's starting to take on shades of #10.  (Yes, I know Capaldi used to play in a punk band.)

Was perhaps a bit too much time spent on running through corridors in a base under siege?  Granted, these are both staples of classic Who, but if they're still turning to the same tricks and tropes after so many years...

And there should have been more of that Fisher King.  That must've been a rather expensive "prop-stume" and it was under-utilized.
Looking at it made me think of things like the Wirrn from "The Ark In Space" and the Tractators from "Frontios".


I still don't understand why O'Donnell's ghost wasn't initially present with Prentis' in part 1.  She didn't die long after he did and given that it happened, her ghost should've been there--the Doctor even remarked on it.  The only explanation I can think of is that being transplanted from another point in time had something to do with it--you can't become a ghost unless you've actually died--whereas Prentis was not a time traveller and his death in 1980 was a certainty.


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 14 October 2015, 16:31:32
I don't know if I'd call this the best story of his tenure...but it was pretty good.
And it really did feel like a Classic story to me. But I think that's by design: so far this season there seems to be a lot of nods to the Classic series. Mostly pretty subtle, but still there.

I don't know, I think the way the did it was pretty good. I think if they had shown any more it wouldn't have been quite as effective. Though that was an amazing costume. Definitely one of the best of recent years.

Did anyone else notice that the mural of the sea monster on the wall of the base's dining room had the Fisher King's face?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Darth Nichos on 20 October 2015, 01:40:03
Well this was a good episode and I was caught by surprise the reveal of who the girl played; seemed we got trolled by the trailer after all

Btw, I wonder if the two-parters are the new theme is the series as homage to the original serials?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 20 October 2015, 11:19:11
Kinda figured that much.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 20 October 2015, 21:14:21
Well this was a good episode and I was caught by surprise the reveal of who the girl played; seemed we got trolled by the trailer after all

Btw, I wonder if the two-parters are the new theme is the series as homage to the original serials?

I felt it was quite similar to "Robot of Sherwood" in tone, but the humor seemed more effortless this time.  Still, there's a significant portion of Who fandom that feels the show MUST be serious drama and can't tolerate episodes like this.  They wanted it to be Game of Thrones with aliens.

IIRC, the last time this format--stories spread over two 45-minute episodes--was used was during Colin Baker's first season, right?

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 22 October 2015, 10:26:13

Did anybody notice the way the Doctor recoiled a bit when he first laid eyes on Ashildr--like he'd seen her somewhere before?

I get the brief revisiting of "The Fires of Pompeii", and how it explains why #12 has that face, but there is a difference here--before, the Doctor saved the life of a man and his family who were supposed to die, and they got to live out normal lives.  This time he's changed somebody's life in an extraordinary way--and I got the distinct impression from the way the expression changed on Ashildr's face as the camera panned around her that she thought immortality and eternal youth were cool at first, but ultimately became burdensome.  Will we find out why she didn't use the other immortality chip the Doctor left for her?  (He could at least have explained how to use it...)  And is it right for the Doctor to take it upon himself to give such a "gift"--one that he himself doesn't actually have?

And...where are Vikings supposed to get hold of electric eels, a taxon that is unique to South America?  This is a science fail on par with "Kill The Moon" IMO .


And how long is long enough after an episode that discussion doesn't need to be spoilered?

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 22 October 2015, 14:09:28
I distinctly got the "Timelord Victorious" vibe when the Doctor decided to save her. And I don't think it'll work out any better this time.

Also I think he explained the look he gave her, with the little speech about premonitions.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 29 October 2015, 22:18:35
No thoughts on "The Woman Who Lived" ?

Did anyone else think that Maisie Williams was actually pretty awesome here as Ashildr/"Me"?  Arya Stark was no fluke...

The Grand Moff has stated at least once this past year that he'd like to see the Doctor become a woman.  While this is an idea that I think would meet tremendous resistance from the great majority of Who fandom, if it's going to happen, then I think Maisie just became the #1 candidate for the role.  IMO.

She's slated to return in episode 10.

And if she can be pried away from "Game of Thrones".

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 05 November 2015, 02:04:55
Oh my...

I've often heard it said that good sci-fi should be an allegory for events in our own times, but in "The Zygon Invasion", the allegory is just SO blatantly obvious and ham-fisted with regard to current events (especially in the UK and the rest of Europe) that...well...is it even possible to discuss this episode here, without violating half of the forum rules?

Well, we could discuss what's known about the mechanics of the Zygons' shape-shifting abilities, and how they're able to get thoughts and memories from their models--they did create a duplicate of Clara that was so convincing that not even the Doctor could tell it wasn't actually her.

And why "Bonnie"?



cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 05 November 2015, 12:52:19
Oh my...

I've often heard it said that good sci-fi should be an allegory for events in our own times, but in "The Zygon Invasion", the allegory is just SO blatantly obvious and ham-fisted with regard to current events (especially in the UK and the rest of Europe) that...well...is it even possible to discuss this episode here, without violating half of the forum rules?

Yeah, I'd say be very careful with what you throw up  We could probably talk about a lot of it(including the next part that I'm going to quote), but anything that gets into rule 4 territory will probably bring in the mods, so yeah.  That said:

Quote
Well, we could discuss what's known about the mechanics of the Zygons' shape-shifting abilities, and how they're able to get thoughts and memories from their models--they did create a duplicate of Clara that was so convincing that not even the Doctor could tell it wasn't actually her.

And why "Bonnie"?

[/spoiler]

Why not "Bonnie?"  I'll worry about that one later.

As for the duplicate, why do I get the impression the Doctor knew she was a duplicate was a duplicate?  He probably had to play dumb 1) to see what the double was up to, and 2) in case the double might be an ally.  You know, in case Clara was in trouble. 

Just my thoughts.

Oh, and I'm sure it's been brought up before, but....Is it me, or does the Osgood Weapon look like The Moment/Pandorica/TARDIS in siege mode?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: DEZOAT on 05 November 2015, 15:43:14
 They have season 9 part 1 out right now. WHY!!! I rather have the whole season not half.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 06 November 2015, 01:15:40

Why not "Bonnie?"  I'll worry about that one later.

As for the duplicate, why do I get the impression the Doctor knew she was a duplicate was a duplicate?  He probably had to play dumb 1) to see what the double was up to, and 2) in case the double might be an ally.  You know, in case Clara was in trouble. 

Just my thoughts.

Is it supposed to be some play on Bonnie and Clyde?  Or some oblique reference to Bonnie Langford, who played Mel--the last time that one of the Doctor's companions was impersonated (by the Rani in this case)?

Oh, and I'm sure it's been brought up before, but....Is it me, or does the Osgood Weapon look like The Moment/Pandorica/TARDIS in siege mode?

Was thinking the same thing myself...


Also, in "The Day of The Doctor", when #10 & #11 mindwipe the humans and Zygons in the room, there are two Osgoods (the real one and the Zygon double), but also two Kate Stewarts.  Neither Osgood could remember which was the real one, so they became a kind of human-Zygon hybrid.  So what happened to the Zygon double of Kate, who would have been in the same situation? 


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 08 November 2015, 22:14:18
So, after watching last night's episode, I have one question:

Given the "Oh, Missy, you're so fine!" jokes, if the Doctor's name is Basil, does that mean that his next companion's going to be named Toni, or Kitty? 

...

Wait, Kate's a form of the name Kitty, right?


 :D ;D :)

(Sorry, had to get the joke out of my system. :P :) )
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 09 November 2015, 15:17:03
This is a British show: his next companions will be Sybill, Polly and Manuel
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 09 November 2015, 22:14:43
This is a British show: his next companions will be Sybill, Polly and Manuel

They've already had a Polly, but that was a long time ago...

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 10 November 2015, 12:53:06
Apparently the Fourth Doctor and his beloved companion, Sarah Jane are going to get a limited series of Comic books made about one of their adventures. Posted on io9 (http://io9.com/oh-my-god-the-fourth-doctor-is-getting-his-own-doctor-1741692146).
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 14 November 2015, 23:37:01
Ok saw last week's episode.  Typical Moffat.  Talking up the Doctor's actions in an episode he wrote then talking about how great Clara is.  The guy is high on his own work to the point of ruining the enjoyment once the speech started.

I did like the ambiguity of Osgood's identity though.  And loved the line "You said that the last 15 times"

And I agree with whoever said it, the metaphor was a bit heavy handed.  Bordering on Joss Whedon in season 6 of Buffy.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 15 November 2015, 02:19:22
Strangely, this episode didn't move me.  But I've been in one of my moods lately, so I blame that.  Bout as far as I will go with that.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: I am Belch II on 15 November 2015, 02:59:09
Can't say I'm overly impressed with this season either. Better then the last.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 15 November 2015, 08:43:23
Can't say I'm overly impressed with this season either. Better then the last.

Actually, MHO, the season's actually been pretty good, except last night's episode.  Though again, that's more my mood as of late.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 16 November 2015, 17:44:17
It's not just you.  The monster dust episode wasn't very good.  As the doctor said, none of it made sense
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: qc mech3 on 16 November 2015, 22:10:28
It was like a redoo of ''Blink'' but without the creep element. I didn't hate it but really, not the best to date. Hope it's one of those episodes you only found was important later.  :-X
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Medron Pryde on 17 November 2015, 02:36:20
Blink STILL freaks me out years later.

Awesome episode.

BAD one to watch in the dark.

Or if you live near a cemetery...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 17 November 2015, 14:59:52
Blink STILL freaks me out years later.

Awesome episode.

BAD one to watch in the dark.

Or if you live near a cemetery...

My parents' house is beside a cemetary, and my bedroom looked right over the wall.  Less creepy than you'd think.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Medron Pryde on 17 November 2015, 21:08:15
Depends on the cemetery.  ;)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 20 November 2015, 22:40:46
It's not just you.  The monster dust episode wasn't very good.  As the doctor said, none of it made sense

I don't understand all the hate for this episode.

  Sure, it's very heavily indebted to "The Ring", and the explanation of how sleep dust could become a living being was, well...but I found it effective enough as a whole.  Had a strangely '80s Who kind of feel, I could easily see it as a 5th Doctor story.  And the fact that the Morpheus process was infectious and ends up consuming the unwitting subject from within was yet another nod to something like the Wirrn.

Given the reveal of what Rasmussen was (or had become), I think the implication was *he* was "the man who hadn't slept in five years".  Does that mean the other Sandmen were the station's former crew? 


I also liked how the story was placed within Who continuity and the cultural fusion (the casting reflected that, even down to the actresses who played the pod singers), and the suggestion that in the future, humanity will spend several centuries of outward power and prosperity, with accompanying moral/ethical turpitude--by the...41st?...Century, they've gone from purpose-breeding people to enslaving pacifistic alien races ("The Impossible Planet/The Satan Pit" and "Planet of The Ood").

cheers,

Gabe 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 22 November 2015, 07:30:01
No comments yet about last night's episode?  ???

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 22 November 2015, 09:07:53
One thing I'm wondering is why the contract wasn't simply transfered?  Seems like the terms were not actually altered and Ashilder should have still been able to remove the chronolock.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 22 November 2015, 11:14:51
No comments yet about last night's episode?  ???

Ruger

Had to let the whole thing sink in.

One thing I'm wondering is why the contract wasn't simply transfered?  Seems like the terms were not actually altered and Ashilder should have still been able to remove the chronolock.

I'll have to rewatch it, but what if she picked him for a reason?  "Me"/Ashilder could've lied to whoever she made the deal with and said that he was close to the Doctor.  I know, she could've used Clara, but I get the impression that she probably saw Clara as a friend.  I mean, I know that she has a limited memory and all, but after going over all her notes, she probably wound up liking Clara
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Darth Nichos on 22 November 2015, 21:56:51
I just finished watching it and found it sad; though it was a very Claraestic way for her to go. I even liked the Danny reference That order she gave him was very well thought out; the fury of a Timelord is something we have seen well before

I am curious though- have they picked a new Companion and letting it be a surprise?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 22 November 2015, 23:48:10
I just finished watching it and found it sad; though it was a very Claraestic way for her to go. I even liked the Danny reference That order she gave him was very well thought out; the fury of a Timelord is something we have seen well before

I am curious though- have they picked a new Companion and letting it be a surprise?

Finally somebody mentioned the elephant in the room.


So whose fault is it, really?  It seems like it's a little bit of a murder-on-the-Orient-Express situation, with several parties equally at guilt for Clara's demise.  But the more I think about it, it really seems the lion's share of the blame should be placed on the Doctor himself.  He saw the signs of Clara's increasingly reckless and potentially self-destructive behaviour, and even remarked on it to Rigsy.
But he did nothing to stop it.  It seems unfair of him to blame Ashildr/Me for that.  Then again, this is example #2 of her forming a pact with an alien power that she doesn't really understand. 
(But the way Capaldi delivered that threat...OH SO WELL.  I actually can't picture any of the previous actors except maybe Tom Baker speaking those words and sounding like he meant them.  I think it's only this season that Capaldi has really owned the role.) 


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Medron Pryde on 23 November 2015, 03:16:28
I will always remember Tennant's threat in the Library.

I am The Doctor. This is a library.  Look me up and see what I can do to you if you don't work with me.

I know that is a paraphrase, but I will always remember his look when he delivered that almost-threat.  He was giving them one last chance and they recognized it for what it was...and they took it...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Darth Nichos on 23 November 2015, 21:02:31
It occurs to me that we are getting two more episodes in the series where there is no official new Companion by his side. Usually, there is one to take the immediate place of the one who left- this time we might actually have the Doctor be alone for a few episodes
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 23 November 2015, 22:09:03
It occurs to me that we are getting two more episodes in the series where there is no official new Companion by his side. Usually, there is one to take the immediate place of the one who left- this time we might actually have the Doctor be alone for a few episodes

From what I've read, there are only two people in the next episode: the Doctor and whatever being/monster he is to face...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 28 November 2015, 22:12:06
Um....wow...

BRING ON NEXT SATURDAY!!!!

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 29 November 2015, 14:55:22
So...."Heaven Sent"....

I thought it was a fantastic episode. Very well written and Capaldi has given probably the best performance of his entire tenure so far. And.. Gallifrey is back!! But my question is: when is this Gallifrey? The Gallifrey he put into the pocket universe was ravaged by the Time War, the dome on the Citadel destroyed. Is he on Gallifrey some time before the Time War? Or were they able to repair everything while stuck in the pocket universe? I'm assuming it never escaped from it? Then again...Moffat's handling of the whole thing has been a confused mess...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 29 November 2015, 15:07:34
Despite me seeing the "gimmick"(for lack of a better word) coming a mile away for this episode I do agree it was a most interesting episode and am most eagerly awaiting next week's.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 29 November 2015, 17:00:56
So...."Heaven Sent"....

But my question is: when is this Gallifrey? The Gallifrey he put into the pocket universe was ravaged by the Time War, the dome on the Citadel destroyed. Is he on Gallifrey some time before the Time War?

I don't remember seeing the Citadel destroyed; just Arcadia...

???

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 30 November 2015, 01:29:18
I don't remember seeing the Citadel destroyed; just Arcadia...

???

Ruger


The partially destroyed Citadel was shown in "The End of Time", surrounded by what look like wrecked Dalek saucers.  In "The Day of the Doctor", the Citadel is under attack, but its defenses have apparently not been breached. How this connects to Gallifrey temporarily being drawn out of the time lock, and then being pushed back in, is still unresolved, as those events would have had to happen during "The Day of the Doctor". 

Unless what we see in "The End of Time" was Gallifrey being drawn out not from the time lock, but out of the pocket universe...


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: trboturtle on 30 November 2015, 02:32:05
https://www.facebook.com/PeterJacksonNZ/videos/vb.141884481557/10153602968491558/?type=2&theater (https://www.facebook.com/PeterJacksonNZ/videos/vb.141884481557/10153602968491558/?type=2&theater)

Makes you wonder, doesn't it?

Craig
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 30 November 2015, 10:48:38


So...basically the entire thing took place inside the Doctor's confession dial????

And...wasn't that all just a little bit "Edge of Tomorrow" ?

And "the Hybrid...is me."  Who does he mean--himself, or Ashildr/Me?  She's back again next week...

...bad job on the "next time" spoilers by the Beeb, giving away far too much.  And it looks like Maester Luwin from _Game of Thrones_ will be in it. 

But it was a masterful performance by Capaldi.  He just might go down as one of the greatest Doctors ever, especially now that he's finally gotten worthy material.



cheers,

Gabe

Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: solmanian on 01 December 2015, 06:16:02

And...wasn't that all just a little bit "Edge of Tomorrow" ?
Actually EOT was about going over the same day, like an action packed futuristic "groundhog day" (sounds awesome, doesn't it? Loved that movie).

More like the "Dark tower" series finale: being stuck in a time loop (not really a "time" loop), where in the end of each loop instead of the "pay off" i.e. cathartic "Boss fight", you make a tiny difference to make it easier/better for the next loop, knowing true victory will only come after many iterations. The equivalent in EOT is that the protagonist changed himself, made himself better; however he doesn't make any lasting impact on the world until his "boss battle". I wonder if they'll make EOT2?

Anyways, can't think of one out of the to of my head, but I'm positively certain Doctor Who already used that shtick sometime somewhere; it's basically inevitable when you're a show about time travel.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Darth Nichos on 05 December 2015, 22:25:32
Well that was a Hell of a way to end the season; you have to love how the writers did that twist!

Is it me or have we in a sense gone back to the original Serials in a sense; With the Timelords in the background and the Doctor doing what he wants?

Also Talk about the potential for a spinoff with Clara and Ashildr
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 05 December 2015, 23:05:11

Also Talk about the potential for a spinoff with Clara and Ashildr

I want that!!!!

Oh, and love the new sonic...next up is River's sonic trowel...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 07 December 2015, 10:29:22
I want that!!!!

Ruger

Are you serious, or is that just dripping with implied sarcasm?  ;D  ;)

I have to say, I really liked the way the final resolution was handled.  Actually brought just a hint of a tear to my eye.  I've said it before and I'll say it again:  whether you liked it or not, Moffat made sure that Clara would be a companion like no other.

In fact, I would say Moffat made his Rose now.  Think about it...of all the companions, only the two of them got what they wanted with respect to the Doctor...kind of.  Rose wanted the Doctor himself, and she kind of got him.  Clara's whole post-Impossible Girl arc was basically about her wanting to be just like the Doctor...and now she kind of is, with her own TARDIS and all...(lovely re-use of the set they made for "An Adventure In Space and Time" BTW...)...is this how Moffat follows through on his suggestion for the Doctor to be a woman?  And I think there's more than a twist of bitter irony, with the suggestion that really, they never should have been together.
Less a hybrid, and more of a sort of anti-symbiosis, if you get what I mean.

But did anybody else feel the Time Lords were kind of wasted?  I mean, Rassilon still had his Power Glove of Doom...so when he realized his soldiers were mutinying, why didn't he just disintegrate them, like we'd seen him do before?  Though, given how the Doctor basically deposed and exiled the entire High Council, there is the setup for another encounter and revenge later on.  And I think the Sisterhood of Karn will probably be gunning for the Doctor too.

And all the things left out...like how the Time Lords were able to free Gallifrey from the pocket universe and move it into the far, far future, without the Doctor being able to sense them...and just what arrangement existed between the High Council and the military (i.e. why didn't the General and his forces depose the Council sooner?)


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 07 December 2015, 11:41:35
Well I have a theory on the last question asked:

I think they were waiting for the Doctor's return.  Someone who could be seen as a legitimate replacement without it coming across as another military dictatorship.

Overall it was an interesting setup and I too think we haven't seen the last of Rassilon and the High Council.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: solmanian on 07 December 2015, 13:43:43
Damn you for putting spoilers in the spoilers tags!!!  #P
Don't you know you only suppose to put in there benign knowledge that everybody guessed already?

p.s.
Maybe should implement "super spoilers" tags, where you need to input a password to see it?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 07 December 2015, 19:19:33
So I guess Clara and Me work at the Restaurant at the End of the Universe.  Given that Mr. Adams contributed to Dr. Who....
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 08 December 2015, 08:15:25


Did anybody else catch the Buckaroo Banzai and Game of Thrones references?

FYI:  Donald Sumpter, the actor who played Rassilon here, and who is known to some of us primarily as Maester Luwin from the first 2 seasons of _Game of Thrones_, first appeared on _Doctor Who_ all the way back in 1968, in "The Wheel In Space".  That's the thing about this show:  even actors who were involved with it half a lifetime ago seem to like coming back.



cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 08 December 2015, 22:58:03
Damn you for putting spoilers in the spoilers tags!!!  #P
Don't you know you only suppose to put in there benign knowledge that everybody guessed already?

p.s.
Maybe should implement "super spoilers" tags, where you need to input a password to see it?

Which is why I had asked previously:  how long after an episode is aired should serious discussion be "embargoed"?  Even with the use of spoiler tags?

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 08 December 2015, 23:06:36
Well I have a theory on the last question asked:

I think they were waiting for the Doctor's return.  Someone who could be seen as a legitimate replacement without it coming across as another military dictatorship.



And it's not the first time the Doctor has claimed the presidency either.  But he's never stuck around to actually fulfill the duties of the position.  So with the entire High Council gone, doesn't that leave something of a power vacuum on Gallifrey?


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 09 December 2015, 13:58:33
The episode was a colossal let down, and yet more Moffat ego stroking. Which annoys me extra, because I thought this season was the strongest since Moffat took over.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 09 December 2015, 15:29:18
Oh, I dunno, I thought the episode was awesome.  Although:

I hear there was some backlash about the Doctor shooting the General.  I had no problems with it myself.  I'm not going into the reasons he did it, but I noticed that he at least asked the general what regeneration he was on.  Personally, I think if that was the General's last incarnation, I don't think the Doctor would've pulled the trigger.  But that's just me.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 09 December 2015, 19:21:25
Here's just some of my issues with it...

Shooting the General
The return of Gallifrey wasn't even a side-show, is was a device towards Clara's resurrection. This should have been an entire arc for a season, not just, oh hey Gallifrey's back, oh look, shiny  >:(
Undoing Clara's death! As it stands, she is effectively immortal. LAME.
The Time Lords needed the Doctor to point out that Rassilon needed to be removed.
That Rassilon just took off after being told by the Doctor to leave. WHAT?! Rassilon was THE Time Lord, he built their empire. Weak.
Me is such an annoying character.
What was the ACTUAL danger that set off ALL the cloisters?
The Doctor playing Clara's theme on his guitar
Clara's ****** TARDIS
Given that Time Lords can sense each other, it shouldn't matter that Gallifrey was at the end of the universe, the Doctor should have known.
That bloody barn. Again.


Oh, and the next time where we see that River Song is back. I might just throw up.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 13 December 2015, 12:57:54
For those of you that want to own your Doctor Who rather than just get it via Netflix and the like, Barnes and Noble has British tv dvd's on sale through tomorrow for 50% off...I just added 9 more original serials to my collection. Only 79 left to go to have all the ones currently available...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 15 December 2015, 08:53:37
Watch Paul McGann take a stab at the epic anti-war monologue from "The Zygon Inversion" using his 8th Doctor persona:

http://io9.com/watch-the-eighth-doctor-totally-nail-the-twelfth-doctor-1747897840 (http://io9.com/watch-the-eighth-doctor-totally-nail-the-twelfth-doctor-1747897840)

Is there really no way to get this guy to appear alongside the current Doctor?

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Mecha82 on 15 December 2015, 09:04:06
Oh, and the next time where we see that River Song is back. I might just throw up.

I have actually been waiting for River Song's return to see how she interacts with 12th Doctor. If that interaction is good then it would be worth waiting for least to me.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 15 December 2015, 09:18:10
I have actually been waiting for River Song's return to see how she interacts with 12th Doctor. If that interaction is good then it would be worth waiting for least to me.

I really hope that it's the closing of the loop started in "Silence In The Library", and that the special ends with River going off to take up the Library assignment and #12 trying to stop her, breaking their "no spoilers" policy.  However, the trailer seems to indicate that this will be a light-hearted romp.

What will make *me* throw up is if the Headless Monks return.  Most useless Who monster ever (well, next to the Abzorbaloff).

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 23 December 2015, 00:43:21
I'm really quite surprised that there was so little discussion of the season finale here...did it really leave most of you guys cold/disgusted?

So, we got Gallifrey back.  Out of the pocket universe, near the end of time, seemingly under the Time Lords' own power.  How did they do it???  Well, I think there's only one way it could've happened, really...and only one person who could've engineered it.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 23 December 2015, 12:59:28
I'm really quite surprised that there was so little discussion of the season finale here...did it really leave most of you guys cold/disgusted?

So, we got Gallifrey back.  Out of the pocket universe, near the end of time, seemingly under the Time Lords' own power.  How did they do it???  Well, I think there's only one way it could've happened, really...and only one person who could've engineered it.

cheers,

Gabe

I've made my feelings on it pretty clear.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 24 December 2015, 03:38:49
Kind of off topic(well, not really, but not a new ep), but I was thinking about "Sleep No More."  Mind, I probably need to rewatch the episode(first time around, as I said, it did nothing for me, but that was more due to my mood and mindset at the time), but I thought about something:  Am I crazy, or was the flip-flopping between color-I'm sorry, colour and black and white suppose to be a nod to the B&W episodes?

(I need sleep, I'm coming up with crazy ideas. :P )
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 26 December 2015, 01:35:39
So, I guess this is why the Doctor has been putting that date off. :(

I thought it was rather sad that she didn't recognize who he was.  Guess it's kind of an odd form of foreshadowing.  OTOH, given how many people, as well as minerals, she was married to... :o

Still, though, that's a nice Christmas gift, for once they don't meet in reverse order. :)  Pity we probably won't get to see her again. :(
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: StCptMara on 26 December 2015, 05:24:20
I thought it was rather sad that she didn't recognize who he was.  Guess it's kind of an odd form of foreshadowing.  OTOH, given how many people, as well as minerals, she was married to... :o

Or, maybe she DID know who he was, but was trying to pretend he wasn't to keep from
ruining his cover...until the moment he said something where she could no longer hide who he really
was?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 28 December 2015, 10:15:23
OK - so two things:

1) Positive.  The season 2 finale of the Librarians, Flynn Carson and co. realize they must time travel, and look through the Library's collection of time machines.  When Cassandra partially reveals a Blue Police Call Box a bar of a distinctive theremin piece plays.  A moment later someone exposes the license plate "Justintime" on the back of a distinctive car, while legally distinct music plays.  I'm certain some of the other time machines in the scene were from other shows, but I didn't recognize any on two play throughs.  Certainly nothing as distinctive as a large stone donut.

2) Negative.  I have been trying to dredge up any enthusiasm to watch this season.  Missy in last season's finale was that much of an annoyance.  Then, once again, after a Companion's second final departure, she returns.  I am tempted to just ignore the show until Moffatt is gone.  But, I see that the Gallifrey arc plays heavy in this season, and I don't want to miss anything important.
OTOH Missy is back again.  >:(

I've skipped reading this thread all season to avoid spoilers.  I would appreciate it if I could get a few spoiler free thoughts.  Some advice on whether or not this season was worth my time.

Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 28 December 2015, 15:37:30
I really enjoyed this year, but I'm of the opinion that most Whovians online take the show far too seriously, and generally find a lot to like every year.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: DEZOAT on 03 January 2016, 10:31:29
 Hey did they do Christmas  special for 2015?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 03 January 2016, 10:59:51
The Husbands of River Song.

It was okay and certainly wasn't the worst Christmas Special but it wasn't the best either.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 03 January 2016, 13:57:52
Thankfully, there was a lot less IT'S CHRISTMAS!!! than in previous years. Also, the least obnoxious appearance of River Song since series 4.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 04 January 2016, 10:39:16
Thankfully, there was a lot less IT'S CHRISTMAS!!! than in previous years. Also, the least obnoxious appearance of River Song since series 4.

The two leads were really hamming it up and having a good time.  Arguably, Alex Kingston has better chemistry with Capaldi than she did with either Tennant or Smith.

And I got what I wanted from it:  it basically closes the loop started in "Silence in The Library".

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Mecha82 on 04 January 2016, 13:22:14
Over all it was good Christmas episode. Not as good as Christmas Carol but then again that one is hard to beat. Interaction between River and current Doctor was better than I thought so it was worth all wait just for that alone. Everything else felt rather average.     
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 04 January 2016, 20:20:08
I've been holding back watching Season 9 until i could convince my wife to watch.  Dam has broken finally, i'm on Episode 3.  Gaud. I hope darn hecks (i've not seen rest of the season yet.) that Doctor looses the Raybands....that just too odd and gimmick for me.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 22 January 2016, 17:48:24
Quote
Doctor Who showrunner Steven Moffat quits to be replaced by Broadchurch creator Chris Chibnall
Only a Doctor Who Christmas special will air in 2016. Moffat's final series to be broadcast next year in order to create a “huge event” for fans. Chibnall will begin his tenure in 2018

Steven Moffat has decided that his “timey wimey” as showrunner of Doctor Who has come to an end and he will step down as the show’s lead writer and executive producer after six series at the helm, RadioTimes.com can reveal.

Moffatt will hand over the keys to the TARDIS at the end of the next series in 2017 to Broadchurch writer and Doctor Who fan Chris Chibnall.

BBC1 has decided to air Moffat’s final 12-part series - the 10th of the modern era - in spring 2017. Chibnall’s debut series as head writer and executive producer will launch in 2018.

A Christmas special WILL air this year overseen by Moffat, though it is unclear whether Peter Capaldi’s new companion will feature. The companion, who will replace Jenna Coleman's Clara Oswald, will definitely be in place for the spring 2017 series, say BBC sources.
http://www.radiotimes.com/news/2016-01-22/doctor-who-showrunner-steven-moffat-quits-to-be-replaced-by-broadchurch-creator-chris-chibnall3

Chibnall would not be my choice to take over
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 22 January 2016, 18:27:37
Broadchurch season 1 was good.  I couldn't get into s2, and am shocked it is still going.  What part of the season long mystery that was solved in the first season hasn't been resolved?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 23 January 2016, 00:45:36
The more concerning thing is that we won't be getting any new Who in 2016, save for the Christmas special (perhaps).  The Euro championships and the Olympics will be over (or almost so) by the time a new season of Who would otherwise begin in August, like it has the past 2 years.  I think there's something more going on here...shades of 1985-1986, anyone?

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Mecha82 on 23 January 2016, 08:35:33
Sports broadcasts have habit of having priority over written programs like Doctor Who. It's reason why we here in Finland were one episode behind with season 9.   
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: StCptMara on 25 January 2016, 11:38:25
The more concerning thing is that we won't be getting any new Who in 2016, save for the Christmas special (perhaps).  The Euro championships and the Olympics will be over (or almost so) by the time a new season of Who would otherwise begin in August, like it has the past 2 years.  I think there's something more going on here...shades of 1985-1986, anyone?

cheers,

Gabe

Maybe more like the end of Davies run. I just REALLY hope we get a case where the Doctor stays the same..I would love to see what someone other than Moffat can do with Capaldi's Doctor. I can understand taking a year to get a new head broken in, working out, etc with the christmas special to be the hand over of the reins.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 25 January 2016, 21:06:20
WOOHOO!! Good riddance Moff!

Please excuse me while I do a happy dance.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 26 January 2016, 09:02:22
Maybe more like the end of Davies run. I just REALLY hope we get a case where the Doctor stays the same..I would love to see what someone other than Moffat can do with Capaldi's Doctor. I can understand taking a year to get a new head broken in, working out, etc with the christmas special to be the hand over of the reins.

That's not quite it.  There will be the Christmas special--MAYBE--at the end of 2016, with not even another "year of specials" to tide us over.  Moffat's last season will be in 2017, then Chris Chibnall takes over for 2018.  The show is effectively on hiatus for 2016.  Hopefully they will be putting all the pieces in place for the transition, so that when Moffat does finally bow out, the new showrunner takes over seamlessly.  Hopefully, that's all it really is and there's nothing more sinister going on behind the scenes.

I knew something was wrong when, by the 2015 Christmas special, they hadn't yet announced a new companion.  Consider:  during Tom Baker's tenure, there were, what, three? four? changes of showrunner (but they didn't call it that back then), with no such hiatus.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: cavingjan on 26 January 2016, 11:01:44
I suspect BBC is using the hiatus to cool off the fans. This isn't the first time they've done it. I think they are looking for more of the long term fan base.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 26 January 2016, 13:46:50
WOOHOO!! Good riddance Moff!

Please excuse me while I do a happy dance.

Are you familiar with Chibnall's work on Doctor Who and Torchwood?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 26 January 2016, 13:53:29
Are you familiar with Chibnall's work on Doctor Who and Torchwood?

Not really. I have to check that out. I'm just thrilled Moffat and his self-indulgent crap is gone.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 26 January 2016, 14:56:38
Not really. I have to check that out. I'm just thrilled Moffat and his self-indulgent crap is gone.

I'm fairly certain people will be crying out for Moffat's return by the end of Chibnall's second series at the absolute latest.

Now, I'm saying this as much because Doctor Who fans are the archetypical unpleasable fans as Chibnall is a mediocre writer, but still, mark my words.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: cavingjan on 26 January 2016, 18:18:48
Didn't he do the dinosaur episode?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 26 January 2016, 18:58:55
Dinosaurs on a Spaceship and The Power of Three are the last times he wrote for the show.  He also did the Silurian two-parter in series 5, 42 (the episode where the Doctor and Martha have to save a spaceship by answering trivia questions), and most damnigly, he was the showrunner on the first two series of Torchwood.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Mecha82 on 26 January 2016, 19:36:15
Seems like BBC just can't get actually good show runner for Doctor Who. Considering how huge franchise Doctor Who is I doubt it's matter of them not caring enough to make sure that series has best possible show runner. How ever unlike so many fans I don't hate Moffat because he might had his share of bad episodes but there were good once as well during his run or least episodes that I happen to like.     
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 26 January 2016, 19:40:04
I'm wondering jf they're oicking show runners baded on internal politics.  Both Moffet and Chibnall both sound like they worked on a lot of shows around the network before.  It may be the decision is based on promoting a favored writer to the head of the flagship show, whether he's qualified or not
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: roosterboy on 26 January 2016, 20:24:25
I think both men are qualified, really. What does it take to be qualified to run Doctor Who? Experience with the franchise and experience in showrunning. That's it. Moffat had that and so does Chibnall. Now, whether one likes the stuff they've done with the franchise or on other shows is an entirely different thing.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Sharpnel on 27 January 2016, 04:35:26
Dinosaurs on a Spaceship and The Power of Three are the last times he wrote for the show.  He also did the Silurian two-parter in series 5, 42 (the episode where the Doctor and Martha have to save a spaceship by answering trivia questions), and most damnigly, he was the showrunner on the first two series of Torchwood.
Which were the two best series, btw
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 27 January 2016, 06:51:32
That doesnt say much though.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 27 January 2016, 08:30:03
I think both men are qualified, really. What does it take to be qualified to run Doctor Who? Experience with the franchise and experience in showrunning. That's it. Moffat had that and so does Chibnall. Now, whether one likes the stuff they've done with the franchise or on other shows is an entirely different thing.

You make it sound like they were both more qualified than Russell T. Davies  ;D

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Medron Pryde on 27 January 2016, 11:59:16
Davies was better....

 8)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wombat on 28 January 2016, 09:51:23
Seasons 4, 5, and 6 were my favorite Who seasons so far...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 28 January 2016, 11:27:48
Davies was better....

 8)

I felt that Davies' series may have had better great episodes, but more awful ones, and the average quality was lower than Moffat's run.  Also, say what you will about the ongoing narratives in Moffat's run, at least he did more than drop a couple of cryptic lines into a given episode, and then go "ooh, look it's all connected" in the finale. And his series 3 and 4 finales were awful IMO. 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 23 February 2016, 06:53:05
Firstly, I have not read any posts regarding the past season, up until the recent announcement about Moffatt.  So apologies if I'm retreading old ground.

I've finally watched the first two episodes of the 35th season.

Missy was less annoying in presentation.  But still annoying in a few key areas.  Namely, unless this incarnation existed prior to the Delgado Master - impossible given some of the comments, and because of the Timelock regarding the Time War - the this was not the first time he/she met Davros.  I can't cite the specific episode, but there were two of us in the room that recall such a meeting.

Once again trying to be too clever, while not checking the lore.

And I guess Daleks have greatly upgraded their mechanicals.  Ian (I'm pretty sure it was Ian) piloted one manually.

Plus, whether the Doctor saved the young Kaled boy or not was immaterial.  Fixed point in time and all that.  He had to live, so the Time Lords could offer the Doctor a pardon from his exile on Earth if he killed him before the Daleks were born.  Too which the Doctor noted that the Daleks and their atrocities were necessary to the timeline.  A fact ignored in the McCoy era and onward.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 24 February 2016, 03:40:06
That young Kaled boy was Davros. Also, we don't know whether it was really was a fixed point in time. As for the Daleks being neccassary....not so much that, but the Doctor questioning whether he had the right to cancel out all of the good that actually came about because of the Daleks...not simply because the timeline needed them. (Also, remember that this was long before the Time War, the post-TW Doctor has a very different perspective on the Daleks...)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: GreenDragon on 29 March 2016, 02:41:26
So I finished the season.  One last question: We've already seen her last night with the Doctor before the Library.  He took her to the same place they went for their first date.  And he was wearing the same face on both occasions.  So is this date in the middle of the Last one?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 23 April 2016, 16:46:52
And the new companion is announced...a young actress named Pearl Mackie will be the Doctor's new companion, Bill...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 23 April 2016, 17:25:37
Looks okay. I just hope the writers *cough* Moffet *coughcough* can resist the urge to make her teh most important person EVAR, as has been the case for most of the new companions.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Sharpnel on 24 April 2016, 00:15:01
Looking forward to Chris Chibnall taking over for Moffat as he can't be any worse
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 24 April 2016, 05:30:12
Don't Jinx it!
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 24 April 2016, 19:57:25
And the new companion is announced...a young actress named Pearl Mackie will be the Doctor's new companion, Bill...

Ruger

I loved how they referenced Back to the Future in her trailer. :)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 08 November 2016, 20:01:01
Sorry to resurrect this, but Something NEW-sorta has finally has come out.
Rejoice if your a old time Dr. Who fan, The Power of the Daleks (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Power_of_the_Daleks) has been resurrected!

Well reconstructed, this was a 6 episode arc that was lost from the very beginning of the 2nd Doctor Who series.
Video Trailer (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8Vupj-BGEA)

This may not be for everyone. My wife is a reluctant fan of the show, she like newer ones but she hates animation.  I've never seen this so I'm curious, its suppose to have been released right now.

Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 17 November 2016, 21:57:12
Sorry to resurrect this, but Something NEW-sorta has finally has come out.
Rejoice if your a old time Dr. Who fan, The Power of the Daleks (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Power_of_the_Daleks) has been resurrected!

Well reconstructed, this was a 6 episode arc that was lost from the very beginning of the 2nd Doctor Who series.
Video Trailer (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8Vupj-BGEA)

This may not be for everyone. My wife is a reluctant fan of the show, she like newer ones but she hates animation.  I've never seen this so I'm curious, its suppose to have been released right now.

While the dvd won't be released until january in the states, we will be able to see the first episode this saturday on BBC America starting at 8:25 pm...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 04 January 2017, 10:43:27
No comments on the Christmas special?


Well, they went lighthearted romp again, with this being Moffat's love letter to comic book heroes, specifically Superman.  Wonder if Grant "The Ghost" will be a one-off, or if he'll return?

Nice to see Matt Lucas back as Nardole, with his head re-attached to his body.  He really should've been given more to do though.
At least the Doctor seems to have taught him a few tricks already, like how to materialize the TARDIS around another person.  And the preview reel at the end suggests he'll be staying on as a companion for at least some of the upcoming season.

I get the feeling that the Shoal (for lack of a better name for the brain aliens) are being set up as the Big Bads for the new season.
At least one has infiltrated UNIT.  They do seem to have gone downhill a bit between 2016 and 5343 though, from would-be conquerors to worshipers of a cyborg king.  Their surgeons from the future also appear less skillful.



cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 04 January 2017, 10:58:14
No comments on the Christmas special?


Sure, it was garbage.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 04 January 2017, 12:40:46
No comments on the Christmas special?


I enjoyed it.  Though I do have one question:  If Clark Kent is Superman, how come nobody else noticed it? 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 04 January 2017, 12:50:19
Sure, it was garbage.

Like every other episode from Deep Breath forward...No matter how bad the writing (and let's be honest, there's been quite a few stinkers), Capaldi's performance shines through.

I really do hope he stays on for at least a couple more seasons.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 04 January 2017, 12:54:55
It was okay.  Not great, not bad, but just okay.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 04 January 2017, 14:12:19
Like every other episode from Deep Breath forward...No matter how bad the writing (and let's be honest, there's been quite a few stinkers), Capaldi's performance shines through.

I really do hope he stays on for at least a couple more seasons.

Like most everything Moffat has done since becoming show runner. Thankfully that's almost done.

Smith and Capaldi have done a fantastic job with their performances, it's just a shame they haven't had much of substance to work with.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 04 January 2017, 14:35:32
No comments on the Christmas special?
cheers,

Gabe

It was amusing, but it wasn't one of there more stand upish specials.
I did like how they resurrected a Tom Baker's "City of the Dead" episode for Christmas for some random reason.

I've been watching the Power of the Darlek episodes, my wife doesn't like the animation.  I enjoyed it thou i wish they had been able make it more visually watchable.  I forgot how bad in taste those earlier Doctors were in cloths.  Especially the hat!  :P

Now how long until season starts?  Like Spring or something?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 04 January 2017, 20:58:28
It was amusing, but it wasn't one of there more stand upish specials.
I did like how they resurrected a Tom Baker's "City of the Dead" episode Christmas for some random reason.

I've been watching the Power of the Darlek episodes, my wife doesn't like the animation.  I enjoyed it thou i wish they had been able make it more visually watchable.  I forgot how bad in taste those earlier Doctors were in cloths.  Especially the hat!  :P

Now how long until season starts?  Like Spring or something?

The second doctor was known as a hobo for a reason...

And I heard April for the start of the new season...

Ruger
Title: Re: The Day is Near
Post by: StoneRhino on 05 January 2017, 02:11:54
By simply having Rose Tyler in the trailer, my interest drops by about 75%

I just saw this thread right now and I must say that I completely disagree. That spoiler is what got my attention and without it led to me forgetting about the show until recently.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: StoneRhino on 05 January 2017, 02:21:40
Like every other episode from Deep Breath forward...No matter how bad the writing (and let's be honest, there's been quite a few stinkers), Capaldi's performance shines through.

I really do hope he stays on for at least a couple more seasons.

I just realized that this thread is ancient. I watched season 1 with Rose Tyler and part of season 2 before I lost track of the show. When they switched Doctors and had Amy as his companion I probably caught the starting and decided not to watch it thinking that they changed the show into something different. I recently watched seasons 1-8, I believe.

The funny thing is that I started with what was the newest season available on Amazon prime which was the first season for Capaldi and then went from season to season. I did so out of order and it didn't help, or perhaps it did make it funnier when there were parts that were out of order themselves.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 05 January 2017, 06:56:11
The companion for season 10 doesn't seem to look promising.  The comedian in the special (we missed latter half of season 9) looks actually more promising than this lady. 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 05 January 2017, 10:18:43
The companion for season 10 doesn't seem to look promising.  The comedian in the special (we missed latter half of season 9) looks actually more promising than this lady.

A chip shop girl...basically Rose all over again.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 31 January 2017, 09:42:30
 :'(  :'(

http://www.denofgeek.com/uk/tv/doctor-who/46900/doctor-who-peter-capaldi-quitting-role-at-end-of-2017 (http://www.denofgeek.com/uk/tv/doctor-who/46900/doctor-who-peter-capaldi-quitting-role-at-end-of-2017)

And I was really hoping he might take a run at Tom Baker's record.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 31 January 2017, 11:07:04
His tenure as the Doctor has been wasted, IMO. Fine actor, excellent portrayal. Poor scripts, terrible management by the Beeb and Moff.

I suspect that marketing has also revealed that there's no place for an 'old' Doctor anymore.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 31 January 2017, 14:48:16
This is too bad.  By leaving now when the writing is so bad his run will be remembered as a bad one.  He wont get a chance to be a good Doctor.  And I worry fans may blame him the way they did Colin Baker.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 31 January 2017, 18:52:46
And I worry fans may blame him the way they did Colin Baker.

To be fair, the fans blame pretty much everyone involved with Doctor Who for the failure of Doctor Who.  You'll even find people who hate Chris Eccelston and David Tennant.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 01 February 2017, 14:59:23
Sad News (slightly Dated), Sir John Hurt whom portrayed the War Doctor has passed. (http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-38778145)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 25 February 2017, 12:42:27
So new season starts on April 15th.

...I don't want Capaldi to go... :'( :'( :'(
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 25 February 2017, 18:11:04
Not too crazy about the female companion.  She seems like to be little flighty/valley girl from the previews.  I hope it improves.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 16 April 2017, 15:42:54
*steps out of old fotomat*

Well, saw the new episode last night.  Not the best episode, but enjoyable.  My only complaint was cutting short the "What's a Dalek" scene from Bill's intro promo.  Not the best episode, but I enjoyed it.  :)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 16 April 2017, 16:16:50
*steps out of old fotomat*

Well, saw the new episode last night.  Not the best episode, but enjoyable.  My only complaint was cutting short the "What's a Dalek" scene from Bill's intro promo.  Not the best episode, but I enjoyed it.  :)

It has its moments...I especially loved the two pictures on his desk...but at times Bill seemed EXTREMELY flighty...not sure about her going forward...

Just one question:

What's in the vault?

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Tymers Realm on 16 April 2017, 16:25:19
I'll agree along that season 10's opener was ok.
What I liked though was at the end when the female companion was about to be mind-wiped and she unknowingly called out the Doctor about having it done to him...

And, as a side point, I liked towards the end of Class' pilot ep when the Doctor saw the board of the school's teachers. A very nice touch indeed...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 16 April 2017, 16:30:21
I'll agree along that season 10's opener was ok.
What I liked though was at the end when the female companion was about to be mind-wiped and she unknowingly called out the Doctor about having it done to him...

And, as a side point, I liked towards the end of Class' pilot ep when the Doctor saw the board of the school's teachers. A very nice touch indeed...

Sadly, I missed Class, but only because I was watching the taped recorded version of Pilot. :(

It has its moments...I especially loved the two pictures on his desk...but at times Bill seemed EXTREMELY flighty...not sure about her going forward...

Just one question:

What's in the vault?

Ruger

Not sure, but if I where going to place a bet....GALLIFREY!!!!!!!

Yes, I know we saw it last season, but we're not sure how it got there.  For that matter, is it Time War Gallifrey, or post Time War Gallifrey?  Maybe we'll see how The Curator gets his hands on Gallifrey Falls No More. :)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 16 April 2017, 17:05:49
Sadly, I missed Class, but only because I was watching the taped recorded version of Pilot. :(

Not sure, but if I where going to place a bet....GALLIFREY!!!!!!!

Yes, I know we saw it last season, but we're not sure how it got there.  For that matter, is it Time War Gallifrey, or post Time War Gallifrey?  Maybe we'll see how The Curator gets his hands on Gallifrey Falls No More. :)

Perhaps...

Oh...I almost forgot the most important thing I saw in the previews for the season...what appeared to be...CYBERMONDASIANS!!!

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 16 April 2017, 17:41:36
Yep, I knew they where coming back.  Also, guess who's returning, with the copywritten beard? ;) :) THEY'RE FINALLY KEEPING UP WITH THE DOCTOR!!!!!!! :)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 16 April 2017, 19:08:27
Just finished watching "The Pilot". Was pretty good. Reserving judgment about Bill. New companions always take a bit to get used to them. Did like seeing the Movellans though.

A few things to note:
Saw few things in the "Next Time" trailer at the end: Missy is back; the first version of the original Mondas Cybermen as already noted; what looked like the Doctor's regeneration; oh and John Simms is coming back as well.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Tymers Realm on 16 April 2017, 19:17:55
what looked like the Doctor's regeneration

Well Capaldi mentioned on the Graham Norton Show ep that aired last night as well, that he's filmed his death scene.
Now all we need to know who is gonna be 14?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 16 April 2017, 19:21:17
A few things to note:
Saw few things in the "Next Time" trailer at the end: Missy is back; the first version of the original Mondas Cybermen as already noted; what looked like the Doctor's regeneration; oh and John Simms is coming back as well.

And he's sporting a beard!!!!! :o
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 16 April 2017, 22:35:01
Well Capaldi mentioned on the Graham Norton Show ep that aired last night as well, that he's filmed his death scene.
Now all we need to know who is gonna be 14?

And...is there going to be a Valeyard?

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 30 April 2017, 18:56:58
Any thoughts on the newest episode? For myself, still not sold on Bill, but I thought she was better in this episode...and I'm still wondering what's up with that vault and the Doctor's vow!

Oh, and who else's been watching "Class" after Who? There's parts of the show I almost like, but others...no...just, no...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 30 April 2017, 19:28:24
Class... blech. Yet another unnecessary supernatural teen high school drama.

I like Bill's character so far.

The vault will likely contain the Master.

I have no strong opinions about the episodes so far. They're not the trash of previous seasons, but they're nothing special either. I was rather hoping for more with this being Capaldi's final season.

Still, I'm intrigued by the rumours swirling about that the First Doctor will have a role in the Christmas special.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 30 April 2017, 22:20:19
Class... blech. Yet another unnecessary supernatural teen high school drama.

I like Bill's character so far.

The vault will likely contain the Master.

I have no strong opinions about the episodes so far. They're not the trash of previous seasons, but they're nothing special either. I was rather hoping for more with this being Capaldi's final season.

Still, I'm intrigued by the rumours swirling about that the First Doctor will have a role in the Christmas special.

I've...been batting .000 with my guesses, so I'll agree that it's probably the Master.  Assuming that it's not Gallifrey.  Although after seeing a response earlier, if it is the Valeyard, I'm going to be very stunned. 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 01 May 2017, 11:47:19
It was good. Not a spectacular episode, but it was good. Bill is growing on me. She seems to have a more natural response to traveling with the Doctor: equal parts wonder and terror. Some of the recent companions have seemed too eager from the beginning to be quite believable to me. Sad she is leaving at the end of the season as well.

(Rumor is, Capaldi didn't actually want to leave, but jumped before he was pushed. Apparently the BBC has decided the low viewership of recent years is because Capaldi is too old to play the Doctor. (And nothing to do with them scheduling it in a "kill slot"). So they've decided that with a new show runner coming on they need a new Doctor, one who is younger and sexy and male. Someone like David Tennant. And a new companion as well. All rumors do far, but it does jive with how the BBC has treated the show in the past. Sorry to sound elitist, but if your only complaint against Capaldi is that he is too old, you aren't a real Doctor Who fan...)


As for what's in the vault...no idea. Missy kind of seems like a safe bet. Gallifrey is possible, weird, but possible. Could also be the Doctor's next incarnation for whatever reason. (As for the Valeyard, well, anything is possible, but I'd say unlikely: from what we know it seems much too late in the Doctor's life for that. Chronologically speaking, the Valeyard would fit in sometime between Tennent2 and Smith, so during the year of the specials (The Planet of the Dead, The Next Doctor, The Waters of Mars, The End of Time").)


Anyone else sign up for BritBox? They've finally added Classic Who. Mostly complete: besides the missing episodes there are a few stories unavailable at the moment (Remembrance of the Daleks for instance.) Also, unlike when they were on Hulu, BritBox isn't streaming them in HD. Actually, everything I've watched on there (not just Doctor Who, but everything) looks like bad quality VHS. I know it's not on my side (can have 3 to 4 HD streams on other sites running simultaneously and still look great). So has to be on their end. :/
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 02 May 2017, 00:10:35


As for what's in the vault...no idea. Missy kind of seems like a safe bet. Gallifrey is possible, weird, but possible. Could also be the Doctor's next incarnation for whatever reason. (As for the Valeyard, well, anything is possible, but I'd say unlikely: from what we know it seems much too late in the Doctor's life for that. Chronologically speaking, the Valeyard would fit in sometime between Tennent2 and Smith, so during the year of the specials (The Planet of the Dead, The Next Doctor, The Waters of Mars, The End of Time").)

I hate to bring the argument up, but actually, according to the Master, at least in the TV episode*, the Valeyard was composed of his darker side, sometime between his Twelfth and final incarnation.  I realize, of course, that 10.2 was technically incarnation 12, but still, even with that, we're along ways off from "final incarnation."

*Of course, the novelization does say, "12th and 13th regeneration."  Either way, there's always the possibility that the Metacrisis Doctor becomes the Valeyard.  Just my 2 cents. :)

EDIT:  May as well throw the link up for proof.  Make of it as you will. (https://youtu.be/Y2INBe_qZFo)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 02 May 2017, 02:50:25
Well, this is just more pure fan speculation here, but...

If the meta-crisis Doctor is NOT the Valeyard, then how could such a being be generated?  Perhaps it will have something to do with his next regeneration...maybe the regen process will reverse the effects of Clara's mindwipe, bringing back all the memories and all the negative things he did because of her influence.  This creates a concentration of all the evil aspects of the Doctor's character, which are somehow spun off into a separate being, with all of the Doctor's memories and abilities up to that point, but only a single lifetime.
And what he wants more than anything is to have more lifetimes.

I would like to ask more questions about that mindwipe.  It seems to me that this would cover everything that happened between "The Snowmen" and "Hell Bent".  So, if the Doctor is confronted with anybody who was involved in those adventures, does that mean he doesn't remember them at all, or anything that occurred?  So things like the Boneless, the Sandmen, Rigsy...the entire hiding of Gallifrey...total blank?

I also find it hard to believe that, for all the time Clara spent on the TARDIS, that there would be no visual record of her preserved there.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 02 May 2017, 10:27:54
I hate to bring the argument up, but actually, according to the Master, at least in the TV episode*, the Valeyard was composed of his darker side, sometime between his Twelfth and final incarnation.  I realize, of course, that 10.2 was technically incarnation 12, but still, even with that, we're along ways off from "final incarnation."

*Of course, the novelization does say, "12th and 13th regeneration."  Either way, there's always the possibility that the Metacrisis Doctor becomes the Valeyard.  Just my 2 cents. :)

EDIT:  May as well throw the link up for proof.  Make of it as you will. (https://youtu.be/Y2INBe_qZFo)

Well, technically Smith was his final regeneration. Capaldi is the first incarnation of his second regeneration cycle that the Time Lord's granted him on Trenzalore.

There's always the possiblity the Master lied about who the Valeyard was...though I do like the idea about the Metacrisis Doctor: he couldn't regenerate.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 02 May 2017, 11:06:19

I also find it hard to believe that, for all the time Clara spent on the TARDIS, that there would be no visual record of her preserved there.

cheers,

Gabe

The TARDIS herself may have hidden all such things from the Doctor...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 02 May 2017, 11:33:22

There's always the possiblity the Master lied about who the Valeyard was...though I do like the idea about the Metacrisis Doctor: he couldn't regenerate.

And he already showed a tendency towards solving things with violence.  He would need something to push him over the edge...like, say, if Rose were somehow no longer available...(and he's got to get out of that parallel universe somehow)

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 02 May 2017, 15:52:38
And he already showed a tendency towards solving things with violence.  He would need something to push him over the edge...like, say, if Rose were somehow no longer available...(and he's got to get out of that parallel universe somehow)

cheers,

Gabe

But there's still the question of how he got a new body for his appearance at the Doctor's trial...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 03 May 2017, 02:32:23
But there's still the question of how he got a new body for his appearance at the Doctor's trial...

1)  Perhaps he pulled the same stunt the Master pulled when he went from "Crispy" to Ainley/morphant to Roberts.

2)  Or perhaps they gave him enough regeneration energy to pull off one regeneration, and held the Doctor's regenerations over his head as a reward.

3)  Then again, it would be the first case of a retroactive one of these. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheOtherDarrin) :o :)  (Meant as sarcasm, of course.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 05 May 2017, 09:07:48
It's 1814.  How the heck do you manage to chain a kilometre-long sea serpent to the bottom of the Thames to start with???  That's my biggest question about the whole premise of "Thin Ice".


cheers, Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Luciora on 05 May 2017, 11:32:32
Wibbley wobbly timey wimey?

It's 1814.  How the heck do you manage to chain a kilometre-long sea serpent to the bottom of the Thames to start with???  That's my biggest question about the whole premise of "Thin Ice".


cheers, Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 05 May 2017, 11:37:25
It's 1814.  How the heck do you manage to chain a kilometre-long sea serpent to the bottom of the Thames to start with???  That's my biggest question about the whole premise of "Thin Ice".


cheers, Gabe

Don't think on it too hard. You'll unravel the fabric of existence.

Wibbley wobbly timey wimey?


No. Just, no.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 05 May 2017, 14:13:04
It's 1814.  How the heck do you manage to chain a kilometre-long sea serpent to the bottom of the Thames to start with???  That's my biggest question about the whole premise of "Thin Ice".


cheers, Gabe

Scuba suit, alien technology, it's a TV show, don't dwell on it, Captain Ja....oh, right. :P
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 07 May 2017, 00:50:23
Just got through watching a recording of the episode.

Damn, those where some hungry termites. :o Still, even though I figured that something in that house was alive, I enjoyed it.  It's taken me a while to finally enjoy the series. :)  Oh, if that ain't the Master/Missy in there, it's someone/something familiar.  Previous incarnation, Valeyard, Who knows?

btw, how'd they figure out the combination, and when the hell did they sneak in the piano.  And whatever/Whoever's in there, good taste in music.  Ein Kleine Nactmusic :)

EDIT:  And that was a twist.  9 was right about mothers.  And for once, everybody lives!  Well, almost.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 07 May 2017, 05:05:45
Oh, if that ain't the Master/Missy in there, it's someone/something familiar.  Previous incarnation, Valeyard, Who knows?

They have done some heavy hinting already that whatever is in there, it probably has something to do with Susan Foreman, the Doctor's granddaughter...between her picture on his desk in the first episode of the season, and Bill continually calling the Doctor grandfather in last night's episode...it probably is Missy, but I'm almost willing to bet that Susan ties into this somehow...

Or maybe Bill is a mindwiped and regenerated Susan...


Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 07 May 2017, 10:53:44
Whatever is in there is living in its own little Romper Room, given the music. ;)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 07 May 2017, 11:55:16
I've just had a thought...what if we're approaching the vault from the wrong angle? What if the vault doesn't contain another person? What if it holding the Doctor? Specifically his next incarnation? What if, for whatever reason, he's holding it off? We know from the 4th's change to the 5th that each Time Lord's incarnations have...well, not exactly an independence, but, well can bump into, or permeate the previous incarnation before the actual regeneration.

And the way he was evasive about it to Bill...makes it seem like he knows it's approaching...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 09 May 2017, 22:43:55
Whatever is in there is living in its own little Romper Room, given the music. ;)

Considering how the music changed when the Doctor mentioned the story with alien bugs eating young people, I'd bet that yeah, it's probably the Master/Missy.

As for the Bill actually being a regenerated Susan...no mention of a fob watch so far...

Apparently we won't have to wait much longer for what's in the vault to emerge, it'll be in episode 6.  The Doctor really hasn't been very nice to Nardole (limited screen time or not); I'm expecting that Nardole will betray him and let whoever it is out.


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 11 May 2017, 13:51:07
Funny thing is, in one of the groups I belong to, it gets brought up to the point where this  picture was put up.  Tongue in cheek, the admin didn't mind, but I thought it was hilarious. :D
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: roosterboy on 11 May 2017, 15:01:59
Considering this is Steven Moffet's Doctor Who we're talking about, whoever or whatever is within the vault will end up being simultaneously the coolest thing possible and also the dumbest thing possible.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 11 May 2017, 15:33:59
I think it is pretty safe to say that it is Missy.

Haven't been much discussion of it, but I think "Knock, Knock" was the best episode of the season though. Largely due to David Suchet: his performance was brilliant. And only gets better with subsequent viewings. He pretty much carried that episode completely on his own performance.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 11 May 2017, 16:06:13
I think it is pretty safe to say that it is Missy.

If not her, then John Simm as the Master or David Bradley as the First Doctor.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 14 May 2017, 01:33:00
:o  Poor Doctor!!!!  Blinded!!!!  Well, I mean, he did save Bill, and convinced the space station that everybody dying wouldn't be profitable, but damn, the feels!!!!
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 14 May 2017, 07:14:42
:o  Poor Doctor!!!!  Blinded!!!!  Well, I mean, he did save Bill, and convinced the space station that everybody dying wouldn't be profitable, but damn, the feels!!!!

Didn't really land for me.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 14 May 2017, 09:59:01
Is this actually going to be permanent, until the end of the season???

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 14 May 2017, 13:35:14
Is this actually going to be permanent, until the end of the season???

cheers,

Gabe

Who knows?  There is speculation that the regeneration scene that's been going around in the promos may have been done with the intent of curing him.  Then again, it's probably a red herring.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 14 May 2017, 15:17:20
Who knows?  There is speculation that the regeneration scene that's been going around in the promos may have been done with the intent of curing him.  Then again, it's probably a red herring.

Dude, don't get my hopes up about Capaldi staying...I can't take it...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 15 May 2017, 22:37:01
Just watched "Oxygen". Brilliant episode! It's sadly rare these days to see the Doctor actually scared. He is always at his best when he has no more options.  Also I hope they don't replace his sonic screwdriver too soon, would be good to go a few stories without his "magic wand". (That's really been a major complaint of mine since the series came back in 2005: the writers rely on it far too much to get the Doctor & Co. out of trouble. It's simply lazy writing.)

I wonder if the events of this episode will in any way change Bill's relationship with the Doctor? Probably not, but it should. "Doctor, I thought you'd left me to die. How can I trust you anymore?" Or something along those lines.

Oh and I was actually surprised Nardole was as good as he was in this one. I've found his character mildly annoying ever since "The Many Husbands of River Song". Maybe he'll actually bring something to the show in the coming episodes.

Oh and one final thing: Missy is back next week!!!
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 17 May 2017, 23:50:11
It was a very good body horror story, but I don't think the basic premise of the episode hung together very well.

If the suits were capable of independent operation, why did they need a human inside at all?

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 18 May 2017, 04:33:56
Critical decision making ability?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 18 May 2017, 05:20:47

I would like to ask more questions about that mindwipe.  It seems to me that this would cover everything that happened between "The Snowmen" and "Hell Bent".  So, if the Doctor is confronted with anybody who was involved in those adventures, does that mean he doesn't remember them at all, or anything that occurred?  So things like the Boneless, the Sandmen, Rigsy...the entire hiding of Gallifrey...total blank?

cheers,

Gabe

And Missy!  He shouldn't remember Missy either!

so what's she doing in that vault? How does the Doctor even know who she is?
Clearly there's a lot of stuff that happened off-screen between "Hell Bent" and the start of the current season.

Maybe we'll get comics and audio plays one day...


cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 18 May 2017, 07:55:27
Maybe we'll get comics and audio plays one day...
[/spoiler]

I am really, really, really hoping that Capaldi will do at least a series of two of those. The series that David Tennant and Catherine Tate did was awesome!  (Was great hearing them back together.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 18 May 2017, 13:19:46
It was a very good body horror story, but I don't think the basic premise of the episode hung together very well.

If the suits were capable of independent operation, why did they need a human inside at all?

cheers,

Gabe

Same reason stores with self checkouts need cashiers, I suppose, given the nature of the episode. ;) :)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 18 May 2017, 13:22:51
And Missy!  He shouldn't remember Missy either!

so what's she doing in that vault? How does the Doctor even know who she is?
Clearly there's a lot of stuff that happened off-screen between "Hell Bent" and the start of the current season.

Maybe we'll get comics and audio plays one day...


cheers,

Gabe

From what I've seen(I believe from the little bit of Class that I saw, and Hell Bent), he apparently remembers most of it.  He probably at least knows about Missy.  Of course, there was an urban legend(I wish I could find the source on it), that supposedly there was a deleted scene that revealed that the Doctor did remember it, but couldn't let Clara know.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 21 May 2017, 00:05:00
Well, that answers which Master's in the vault, and why she's there.  So, I guess the Doctor's now got a bit of an upper hand.  And leave it to Missy to figure out how to cheat death.  She's just never needed the Doctor's help in doing so.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 23 May 2017, 23:21:51
Well, had a discussion in one of my groups about the episode, and it's something I didn't think about until after the fact.  So, it's a given that the TARDIS generally does an auto translate for almost all languages(save for the Judoon language, and written Gallifrian), someone pointed out that the TARDIS didn't translate the Italian the Vatican guys where using.  I kind of had the theory(and this kind of was the consensus) that since the whole thing was a simulation, they didn't see the need to factor in the translation circuits on the TARDIS.  Thoughts?

Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 30 May 2017, 22:30:22
So, "The Pyramid at the end of the World" was rather...meh. Can't help but feel like we've seen it before in previous stories (got a real sense of déjà vu with it).

Funnily enough, I think if the story had just been about the lab and the accident with no aliens involved it would have worked a lot better. Like, if Bill and the Doctor just showed up and had to help the struggling scientists save the world. Did enjoy the interaction between the Doctor and Erica, shame it wasn't longer.

Overall I think this was a rather weak episode, and not just because it was a middle part. These "Monks" just aren't doing anything for me.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 30 May 2017, 23:19:10
I thought it was so dumb I stopped watching halfway through.  Typical Moffat lameness
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: garhkal on 31 May 2017, 01:04:59
Over on one of my SW sites, someone has a Off topic like thread asking people if they could have any ONE starship, which it would be.
Some are talking about the Tardis, but i've never seen it shown in the show that it can fly in space..  Anyone care to prove me wrong?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 31 May 2017, 01:34:06
It has done so many times.

Most notable was when it towed Earth back to where it belonged.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 31 May 2017, 02:22:31
Overall I think this was a rather weak episode, and not just because it was a middle part. These "Monks" just aren't doing anything for me. [/spoiler]

I don't think they're what they appear to be.

  Case in point:  every time they talk, their mouths open and words come out, but their lips don't move.  Where have we seen that before? Have to go back quite a long ways...

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 31 May 2017, 08:41:00
I don't think they're what they appear to be.

  Case in point:  every time they talk, their mouths open and words come out, but their lips don't move.  Where have we seen that before? Have to go back quite a long ways...

cheers,

Gabe

Cybermen?...well, the season trailer did appear to show Cyber-Mondasians...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 31 May 2017, 09:15:20
Cybermen?...well, the season trailer did appear to show Cyber-Mondasians...

Ruger

  That, plus the fact that the Monks have a rather corpse-like appearance.

If so, this would be a new M.O. for them.  They've never resorted to that kind of elaborate deception before.  Especially not the 1st-gen Cybermen--remember, they're an attempt to go cyber with clunky 1950's tech.
 


EDIT:  I'm also trying to think about which other monster we've seen so far actually sound like the Monks' voices, and I can only think of
the Silence.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 31 May 2017, 12:23:42
  That, plus the fact that the Monks have a rather corpse-like appearance.

If so, this would be a new M.O. for them.  They've never resorted to that kind of elaborate deception before.  Especially not the 1st-gen Cybermen--remember, they're an attempt to go cyber with clunky 1950's tech.
 


EDIT:  I'm also trying to think about which other monster we've seen so far actually sound like the Monks' voices, and I can only think of
the Silence.

cheers,

Gabe

Actually, you know who they remind me of?

The Mummy from "Mummy on the Orient Express."  Which begs the question:  Are they our Mummies?

;) :D

*waits for the picture of 9 telling me to go to my room*
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: garhkal on 31 May 2017, 14:56:19
It has done so many times.

Most notable was when it towed Earth back to where it belonged.

???  Towed a frikken planet?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 31 May 2017, 15:02:19
EDIT:  I'm also trying to think about which other monster we've seen so far actually sound like the Monks' voices, and I can only think of
the Silence.

cheers,

Gabe
Actually, you know who they remind me of?

The Mummy from "Mummy on the Orient Express."  Which begs the question:  Are they our Mummies?

;) :D

*waits for the picture of 9 telling me to go to my room*

Makes sense. I believe those villains were all portrayed by the same actor.

???  Towed a frikken planet?

Episode 4x13, after the Daleks had been defeated... again.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 31 May 2017, 17:19:07
???  Towed a frikken planet?

We've also seen it fly after a starship after rescuing River Song after she ejected herself from it...then there was the time that the Doctor let Amy Pond float in space outside the door while he held onto her foot (though granted, that's not exactly "flying")...then there's all the times it's flown through the atmosphere of Earth...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: qc mech3 on 31 May 2017, 20:17:09
Don't forget getting Rose back from a Dalek ship and evading a missile or all 13 versions of it freezing Galifrey in a timelock from orbit.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 31 May 2017, 23:44:42
Makes sense. I believe those villains were all portrayed by the same actor.

Episode 4x13, after the Daleks had been defeated... again.

Oh yes, where Rose gets left on a beach again.  I forgot about that one.

Unfortunately, so did Donna.  :o No, YOU shut up! :D  CAVEAT:  I'm only kidding, honest.  Most people who know me will know that I'm a Donna/Martha/Ace/Leela fan. :)

Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 01 June 2017, 05:39:50
Makes sense. I believe those villains were all portrayed by the same actor.

Jamie Hill portrayed the Foretold (the Mummy) and the Monks.  He doesn't appear to have portrayed one of the Silence.ot

Got me thinking about that episode...was it ever established who was behind GUS, the train's malevolent AI?

Cheers, Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 04 June 2017, 23:04:28
Just finished watching "The Lie of the Land" and (spoilers ahead obviously. No, really, major spoilers)...

This was very much Bill's episode. She dominated and quite simply, had a brilliant performance. Her confrontation with the Doctor on the prison ship was breath-taking and heart-breaking. I think she would have been quite right to punch him after his revelation. (Incidentally that was the regeneration scene teased in the Series 10 trailer.) In a way that was a death scene, not of a character, but of a character's innocence and belief in another. Personally, I found that much more affecting and painful than the "death" scenes of Rose, Amy, or Clara. It was the loss not just of a life, but something more: the meaning of a life.

That was the high point of the writing of this episode. The rest just didn't quite fit. There were a few really good moments, broken by others that felt flat. It was a very tone deaf episode. There was a forced levity, a "don't worry folks, everyone lives!" current that made all of the drama and danger and sacrifice of the episode seem pointless. The Doctor's "Haha, see I tricked you" at the the conclusion of the aforementioned scene. The way the script glossed over a character's self-sacrifice at the end by having said character inexplicably surviving what just moments before we were told would be certain death. If the writers truly wish to pluck these emotional chords, then they have to be willing to follow through. It would be an immense risk to kill off a central character mid-season,  but without taking that risk, the end result feels cheap and manipulative.


Also, the pacing of the last three episodes has felt rather...brisk. Instead of lingering to enjoy a scene, the brilliance of an idea or the way a character shines, writers are a step behind us, herding, rushing us on to the next scene. If there is some crisis, that briskness can work in the writers favor, giving us the feeling of breathlessly following the characters as they race against the clock. For instance, last episode and the Doomsday clock, there was a definite crisis to advert. This story didn't have that, the Monks had already won. It felt, in all honesty, like the writer was hurrying us along, solely to be done with this adventure and on to the next one.


In the end, this episode will have one (maybe two) really memorable scenes. Which are unfortunately let down by the rest of the script. It was a very tonally inconsistent script. One that everyone involved tried their best to make work. Capaldi was fantastic as usual (even if his levity at certain moments felt off-key). And Pearl Mackie brought her A-game for an All-Star performance.


Miscellaneous observations: 1) Well, we finally get to see Missy. Does anyone really, truly, believes she's trying to turn a new page? 2) The Doctor's wardrobe has been just absolutely fantastic this season. Each episode he's wearing something different, and yet each one is undeniably him. (Seriously, I just love that jacket from this episode!) 3) Nardole has actually been growing on me, in "The Many Husbands of River Song" and "The Return of Doctor Mysterio" and the first couple of this series, he was just annoying. But the last few episodes he's actually becoming an interesting character and not just a walking joke.


Oh and next week...the Ice Warriors return!! Yay!!!!
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 05 June 2017, 01:41:14
I thought the episode was OK.  Not the best, but enjoyable.  But just MHO.


Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 05 June 2017, 04:43:47
I thought the episode was OK.  Not the best, but enjoyable.  But just MHO.

This has been my feeling about the entire season thus far.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 08 June 2017, 22:17:51
I tried posting about this earlier, but the browser kept timing out...

Anyway, has anyone else heard about the new Doctor Who Miniatures game out from Warlord Games?

Into the Time Vortex (https://doctorwhotimevortex.com/)

Kind of confusingly the base set is called "Exterminate!" and features Daleks vs Cybermen (with Cybermats).
Most of the Daleks, Cybermen and other minis do look good. The monsters at least. The people, like the Doctor and Missy and the Companions...not so much.
The offerings so far are rather slim as well.
A 10th Doctor set, a 12th Doctor set, a Missy/Cybermen set, the Silence, Davros, Zygons, Professor Yano & Chantho, Judoon, the Clockwork Droids (think Lucasfilms/Disney knows about that?), the Tetraps oddly enough (from the 7th Doctor's first story), and the last set is one that I think is actually rather cool: a cyberman set that contains 1 figure for every version of the cybermen we've ever seen on screen.

I don't know how I feel about them, on the one hand it's fantastic to get an officially licensed miniatures game. On the other hand they are incredibly expensive (especially since Warlords license doesn't allow them to distribute the game in the US); and it's 38mm scale, so hard to fit in with any other minis.



(EDIT: I forgot to mention that you can get a free PDF of their rules on the site.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 11 June 2017, 22:21:52
"The Empress of Mars"...

Holy cow that was a brilliant episode! Hands down best of the season. Probably one of the best of a while. Ice Warriors yay! (I always liked them. They and the Silurians are two of the most interesting monsters on DW.) The writing was topnotch (as to be expected from Mark Gatiss.) This one really felt like a "Classic Who" episode. The whole Victorians in space thing was well done. This one really should have been the two parter of the season instead of the lackluster monk set. Would have given the writers a bit more time to explore the Ice Warriors. Oh well, it can't be helped. Overall I'm giving this one a 5 out of 5.

(Oh and we do get a really cool cameo of someone we haven't seen since the Pertwee years.)


Well, that's 9 episodes down, only 3 left in the season: "The Eaters of Light", "World Enough and Time", & "The Doctor Falls".
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 22 June 2017, 03:03:37
Sorry, but the past couple of episodes really didn't do it for me.  I found the Ice Warriors one in particular a letdown, they just didn't come across as very interesting, though the whole Victorian redcoats in space thing was amusing; the actors who played Godsacre and Catchlove in particular came across very well.  The latter reminds me of a character from _The Jewel in the Crown_ (anyone ever seen this series about the twilight of British India?)--the opportunistic sycophant who'll do anything to both advance his own position and save his own sorry hide.  I didn't understand:  if Godsacre had already been tried and executed (albeit unsuccessfully) for desertion, how was he able to rise to command of another detachment?  And I had also been hoping for tie-in to "The Waters of Mars", that the mystery Martian pathogen would be revealed as an Ice Warrior bioweapon that got out of control (a la Engineers' black goo), or worse, deliberately left behind to prevent future visitors from ransacking the remains of their civilization.

"The Eaters of Light" really felt like it could have used way more exposition, like it needed to be a one-and-half parter.  I feel a script by Rona Munro--the only classic series writer who has also penned a script from the revived series--deserved more, but I suppose that reflects how little is really known about the Picts.  I will say I was a bit taken aback by how ready the Doctor seemed to be to sacrifice himself in order to seal off the portal. 
And did anyone else think the monsters from this episode looked like miniature versions of Pacific Rim kaiju?

(And prior to that, I was pretty disappointed too that the Monks were revealed to not be Cybermen.  But it makes sense, seeing as they seemingly have concerns about things that are of no concern to the Cybermen.  Since when have the Cybermen ever cared about getting permission to invade?)

Hard to believe this season has gone by so fast.  Let's get to Bill. 

She has been much stronger than expected for a first-time companion, especially one who started as a university cafeteria employee.  I don't think she's what she appears to be, and there have been hints dropped.
--her encyclopedic knowledge of sci-fi tropes, especially knowing how the Doctor could erase memories
--the fact she referred to the Doctor as her grandfather in "Knock Knock"
--the simulation of her trying to convince her/itself of its own existence in "Extremis"--sure, in that episode, nobody was real, but here I think it has a deeper meaning
--in "Eaters", somehow suddenly figuring out that the TARDIS confers universal translation ability without needing it explained by the Doctor or Nardole.

In short, I think Bill is not who or what she appears to be.  There are 2 episodes left, and I would keep a close eye on the Doctor's pockets.  I have a feeling a certain fob watch is going to be making a re-appearance.  And if it's not that, then...think "Logopolis".

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 22 June 2017, 09:57:20
As far as Bill figuring out the TARDIS language abilities...she honestly should have figured that out sooner...

But I want to know: how did the Ice Queen know English as soon as she woke up? (The TARDIS was off Mars by the time...)

So...John Simms is back as the Master, for all the teasers we've got so far, who else thinks he is just going to be in one quick little flashback scene?

As for Bill being Susan...nope, sorry, not seeing it. First, she has a mother on Earth (who the Doctor nipped back in time to photograph for Bill); second, she's seen the photo of Susan on the Doctor's desk, no recognition; and finally, the Dalek invasion of Earth doesn't happen until the mid-twenty-second century. I think Bill is important, but only in the same way all of the Doctor's companions are important.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 22 June 2017, 18:52:56

So...John Simms is back as the Master, for all the teasers we've got so far, who else thinks he is just going to be in one quick little flashback scene?

As for Bill being Susan...nope, sorry, not seeing it. First, she has a mother on Earth (who the Doctor nipped back in time to photograph for Bill); second, she's seen the photo of Susan on the Doctor's desk, no recognition; and finally, the Dalek invasion of Earth doesn't happen until the mid-twenty-second century. I think Bill is important, but only in the same way all of the Doctor's companions are important.


On the Master...one of the previews shows him dancing with Missy, so no, I don't think he'll just be in flashbacks...unless that's a mental illusion or something similar...

As to the other, the indications do seem to point to the unlikeliness of Bill being Susan, but the fob watch has accounted for changed memories, including families and such, in both the Doctor and the Master...and being in control of a time machine would allow Susan to be transported back earlier than the 22nd century after being there for a while...


Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 24 June 2017, 21:15:18
Well...their genesis is different from what has been speculated before...part of me prefers the theories in David Banks's book...but this works too...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 25 June 2017, 07:48:02
Finally, an episode that worked well.

I like the origin for the Mondasian Cybermen. It's weird, but also makes sense in context.

[suspicious]RIP Bill Potts.[/suspicious]

I wish they hadn't spoiled that John Simms was returning, [suspicious]because I was looking for him very specifically and spotted him right away, which ruined the 'surprise' later in the episode. "Do you still like disguises?" I really enjoyed the return of this aspect of the Master.[/suspicious]
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 25 June 2017, 13:56:18
It actually took me a while to spot him, and I was expecting him.  Then again, I've been told that I'm exceedingly dense to begin with. ;D

My own observations.

1)  I'm wondering if this is what inspires Missy to do the Necro Cybermen in her first appearance.

2)  I understand why Missy doesn't remember being on the ship(unless there's a Rule 1a that probably applies), but the Master recognizing his future incarnation ahead of time?  Either he's crossed paths with herself at some point, or something else is going on.  (BTW, my apologies if I used the pronouns wrong.  No offense intended, let me know if I need to clean that up.)

EDIT:  Right, forgot, he was watching her on the television...a la Trial of a Timelord.  I'm an idiot.  :P

2a)  Which makes me wonder if her crying at the end of the last episode really is remorse and feeling sad for being evil, or if she regrets knowing what's in store for the Doctor.

3)  I will agree, it was sad to see what happened to Bill.  However, am I the only one that, upon seeing Bill cry, got reminded of Yvonne Hartmann?

Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 26 June 2017, 02:15:09
Well, I guess this all means that this episode supersedes the excellent Big Finish audio "Spare Parts" as the official origin for the Cybermen.
(Which was a 5th Doctor + Nyssa story, for those who haven't heard it.)

Poor, poor Bill...I did not see that coming***.  And if Bill really is Susan like I speculated, that makes it doubly devastating for the Doctor.

***which means the hint at her ultimate fate wasn't any of the ones I mentioned before, but it was "Oxygen" !

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 26 June 2017, 15:14:13
BTW, did anybody notice something about cyberBill's eyes, like her "callback to Yvonne Hartmann" might've prompted a design change?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 26 June 2017, 16:49:30
BTW, did anybody notice something about cyberBill's eyes, like her "callback to Yvonne Hartmann" might've prompted a design change?

Yeah...I also noticed that the design, while close, was not true Cyber-Mondasians from The Tenth Planet...in that serial, the Cybermen had human hands...unless I'm mistaken, Cyber-Bill had gloves on, did she (it?) not?

The flashlight (for lack of a better term) on top of her head was also smaller than the original one...

I do have to ask if they are still going to have them rely on energy being beamed to them, like in The Tenth Planet (this was the primary way they were defeated in the original show...when Mondas absorbed too much energy too quickly and vaporized, all the Cybermen on Earth collapsed and died from lack of energy)? They hinted at this already with Bill being unable to travel far from the hospital as her artificial heart depending on power from it...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 26 June 2017, 20:46:14
Well, I guess this all means that this episode supersedes the excellent Big Finish audio "Spare Parts" as the official origin for the Cybermen.
(Which was a 5th Doctor + Nyssa story, for those who haven't heard it.)


Finally got around to watching...actually, this episode basically *is* a somewhat reworked version of "Spare Parts".  Probably about half of the tropes and plot points are carryovers or modified from that story. 

I hope Moffat worked something out with the original author, because that guy's name should've been in the writing credits IMO.

And I also feel the need to point out that visually, there are a load of references to " The Empty Child"
.

Cheers, Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 27 June 2017, 03:15:01
EDIT: On second thought, too big.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 11 July 2017, 18:46:13
Thought the season finale was a truly excellent episode...but hating the fact that we have to wait until Christmas for The Doctors to find out what happens next...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 12 July 2017, 17:09:13
I know. I wonder how long they're going to hold out until they announce the next Doctor.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 12 July 2017, 20:10:07
I'm curious the series will continue to evolve.  I kept thinking that despite it's success that it's going run out of steam with them going through so many doctors in short amount of years.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 12 July 2017, 20:51:33
I'm curious the series will continue to evolve.  I kept thinking that despite it's success that it's going run out of steam with them going through so many doctors in short amount of years.

For the original run, most didn't last any longer:

Hartnell: 3+ years
Troughton: 3 years
Pertwee: 5 years
Tom Baker: 7 years
Davison: 3 years
Colin Baker: 2 years
McCoy: 3 years
McGann: 1 movie
Eccleston: 1 year
Tennant: basically 4 years (3 seasons and 1 year of specials)
Smith: 3 years
Hurt: 1 special
Capaldi: 3 years

Overall, the new Doctors are lasting just about as long as the originals, excepting the extremely long stint of Tom Baker (and, of course, McCoy was given no choice in doing just three seasons, considering the show was put on hiatus at the end of his tenure)...granted, the newer ones do have the additional exceptions of McGann, who never really got a chance (on tv) to expand on his Doctor), Eccleston due to issues, and Hurt (who many never saw coming)...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 12 July 2017, 21:59:46
Actually Hartnell and Baker2 didnt really have a choice either.  Hartnell left for medical reasons.  Baker2, was fired.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 13 July 2017, 19:29:28
Actually Hartnell and Baker2 didnt really have a choice either.  Hartnell left for medical reasons.  Baker2, was fired.

True enough...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 14 July 2017, 17:11:29
Yay!! For the forums back up!! (And can actually post now...)

Anyway...just saw this on Instagram:

https://youtu.be/-N4ayz8u3sA (https://youtu.be/-N4ayz8u3sA)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 15 July 2017, 01:08:10
Yay!! For the forums back up!! (And can actually post now...)

Anyway...just saw this on Instagram:

https://youtu.be/-N4ayz8u3sA (https://youtu.be/-N4ayz8u3sA)

I CAN'T WAIT!!!!!!!11111eleventyone
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Sharpnel on 15 July 2017, 02:12:52
So, will it be a non-white male this time? or a woman of any ethnic background?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 15 July 2017, 06:09:57
We won't know until after Wimbledon on July 16th.

Has there been any indication they may go with something less traditional as far as a lead?  Doctor has never shown he was interested in gender bending (in character). The  Master certainly was, but that's because he was as loon in his later years.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 15 July 2017, 08:56:43
So, will it be a non-white male this time? or a woman of any ethnic background?

I seriously doubt it.


[EDIT: I can admit when I am wrong. https://youtu.be/q1IczjLYCIM (https://youtu.be/q1IczjLYCIM) I can't say I recognize her from anything I've watched. Anyone seen in her other shows?]
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 16 July 2017, 14:30:37
She was in Broadchurch, Attack the Block, and The History of You episode of Black Mirror. The lay of those is the only one I've seen and I enjoyed the episode
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 16 July 2017, 14:34:12
She's got talent. Her portrayal of a grieving mother who has to rebuild her life in Broadchurch was excellent. Great emotional range, which is essential for the Doctor. So long as the scripts are quality, which I'm not worried about with Chibnell, means the Doctor is in good hands.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Stormlion1 on 16 July 2017, 14:37:07
Won't lie, I'm not a fan of this revelation.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Tymers Realm on 16 July 2017, 14:51:21
Won't lie, I'm not a fan of this revelation.
Neither is my GF, who's a older DW fan than I am. I think this decision is gonna split the fanbase. Looking at the likes/dislikes of the BBC vid @YingJanshi posted, it was roughly 3.3k like & 1.3k dislike when I viewed it.

As to how she'll do as The Doctor, we'll have to see.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 16 July 2017, 14:58:27
For the doomies and naysayers, something posted by a friend...

Quote
I for one demand that my shows about time traveling aliens who instinctively know how human history is supposed to proceed while they navigate paradoxes and interstellar wars with gold-sensitive robots and coincidentally British people sprinkled throughout space and time, that the main character who comes back to life repeatedly after they die as a convenient way to switch actors must be from the heterogametic sex. The very idea of suspending disbelief to allow for the homogametic sex to take a central role is just too hard for my fragile, 2017 mind to accept. What next, will Wonder Woman be a good film?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 16 July 2017, 15:00:13
She's got talent. Her portrayal of a grieving mother who has to rebuild her life in Broadchurch was excellent. Great emotional range, which is essential for the Doctor. So long as the scripts are quality, which I'm not worried about with Chibnell, means the Doctor is in good hands.

I honestly can't remember her in it. :/ Then again it's been awhile since I watched it.

As for the Doctor being a woman. *Shrugs* If done well I'm indifferent. I'm glad this wasn't something that happened under Moffat though. What has really bothered me though, is the Doctor falling for his companion. That was crossing a line for me. Then again, the new series has been humanizing him too much anyway.


Won't lie, I'm not a fan of this revelation.
Neither is my GF, who's a older DW fan than I am. I think this decision is gonna split the fanbase. Looking at the likes/dislikes of the BBC vid @YingJanshi posted, it was roughly 3.3k like & 1.3k dislike when I viewed it.

As to how she'll do as The Doctor, we'll have to see.


Could you both explain why? Just curious.  :)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 16 July 2017, 15:04:58
long as the scripts are quality, which I'm not worried about with Chibnell

You've not seen any of the episodes he's written then?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: I am Belch II on 16 July 2017, 15:07:35
I think this is a huge gamble with really nothing to lose. Peter Capaldi is a great actor, but a very bitter Dr. Who to me, rude and kinda a jerk. They lost a lot of ratings with casting of him. This will make more fans come back to the show then it will lose over the casting of her.
I hope she does well. Its just a actor playing the doctor to me rather they are a woman or a man....that is how you are supposed to  look at it. But most people are not looking it like that.  She has some big shoes to fill in the role, to keep the show going and bring fans back to that with out ruining it.
Me personally the show needs better writers with a better direction then it is right now. That is what turned me off to the show.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 16 July 2017, 15:12:18
They lost a lot of ratings with casting of him. 

First-run ratings have been consistently between 5 and 9 million viewers per episode in the UK since the relaunch.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 16 July 2017, 15:13:18
You've not seen any of the episodes he's written then?

I've seen the episodes he's done under Moffat, yes. Yes, they were terrible. But I'd remind you that Moffat wrote some of the best episodes of the Davies run, and his time as show runner was terrible.

I'm basing my opinion of Chibnell on the three seasons/series of Broadchurch, which is a better measure IMO.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 16 July 2017, 15:18:33
I've seen the episodes he's done under Moffat, yes. Yes, they were terrible. But I'd remind you that Moffat wrote some of the best episodes of the Davies run, and his time as show runner was terrible.

Matter of opinion, I far preferred Moffat's run to Davies.  Davies' run had higher highs, but much lower lows.  Moffat had a better average, but fewer exceptional episodes.

Quote
I'm basing my opinion of Chibnell on the three seasons/series of Broadchurch, which is a better measure IMO.

In all honesty, I'm sure Chibnall's run will be well within the parameters set by the prior lead writers, with a fair share of exceptional and awful episodes. 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 16 July 2017, 17:09:50
I think this is a huge gamble with really nothing to lose. Peter Capaldi is a great actor, but a very bitter Dr. Who to me, rude and kinda a jerk. They lost a lot of ratings with casting of him. This will make more fans come back to the show then it will lose over the casting of her.
I hope she does well. Its just a actor playing the doctor to me rather they are a woman or a man....that is how you are supposed to  look at it. But most people are not looking it like that.  She has some big shoes to fill in the role, to keep the show going and bring fans back to that with out ruining it.
Me personally the show needs better writers with a better direction then it is right now. That is what turned me off to the show.

I'll agree with you on the writing. Personally, regardless of who is the showrunner, I think that person needs to write less episodes. We need more voices writing.  The show runner needs to be the showrunner, not chief writer.

But I'm going to have to disagree with you about Capaldi. He was a brilliant Doctor, he had no bad or loose performances (not saying he always had the best material to work with). He was no more bitter or dark than Eccleston was, or Smith for that matter. His doctor was very much more in the vein of the classic Doctors than the cuddly Doctor we got with Tennant and Smith. (For me he really calls back Hartnell's Doctor: Hartnell at the beginning of the show came off very rude and even mean at times. Of course he mellowed, as did Capaldi's Doctor.)

It's good to go off in different directions, trying to fit the show back into a "successful" mold of a previous Doctor will kill the show. (And as for dip in viewership during his tenure, how much of it is because he was "too old" and how much of it was the BBC jumping the airing time all over the place?)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 16 July 2017, 17:12:14
I think this is a huge gamble with really nothing to lose. Peter Capaldi is a great actor, but a very bitter Dr. Who to me, rude and kinda a jerk.

Hmm...sounds a lot like many of the older Doctor's, especially the First Doctor who continually (and usually on purpose) got Ian Chesterton's name wrong (one of his first companions), locked his granddaughter out of his TARDIS and left her on a 22nd century Earth just recently freed from the Daleks, etc....and the second Doctor who acted like a space hobo to trick people into underestimating him...and the Fourth Doctor, who often reminded his companions that he wasn't a human...and the Fifth who didn't try to go back in time to save Adric...and the sixth who actually tried to strangle his companion when he first regenerated (of course, said companion WAS Peri, so...)...and the Seventh, who serials started revealing a darker past...can't remember much on the third, or I would have commented on him as well...

Combine those traits that are already there with the events of the Time War, and everything that's happened since...

I personally had no issues with Capaldi's Doctor being a tad Scottish in outlook...

 ;)

Quote
They lost a lot of ratings with casting of him. This will make more fans come back to the show then it will lose over the casting of her.
I hope she does well. Its just a actor playing the doctor to me rather they are a woman or a man....that is how you are supposed to  look at it. But most people are not looking it like that.  She has some big shoes to fill in the role, to keep the show going and bring fans back to that with out ruining it.
Me personally the show needs better writers with a better direction then it is right now. That is what turned me off to the show.

We'll just have to see how the direction, writers, and Ms. Whittaker do with the show, and judge them on their own merits...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 16 July 2017, 17:19:37
So has anyone been watching any of the Classic Doctors on BritBox? It has probably about 80% of the stories on it I'd say (not counting any of the "Lost" stories).

The one thing that really bugs me about it, is that there is no way to watch them in HD. You could when they were on HULU. :(
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Darth Nichos on 16 July 2017, 21:36:14
To be honest, I am quite divided over the revelation. While I am curious to see where they go with this and admit that it could go well, I am also worried that they will play the "romance" card for some reason given that female leads in shows get thrown romantic partners at them by writers most of the time for some reason

I am also hoping that this had always been the plan and not something forced upon by the current political climate
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 16 July 2017, 22:56:34
Hmm...sounds a lot like many of the older Doctor's, especially the First Doctor who continually (and usually on purpose) got Ian Chesterton's name wrong (one of his first companions), locked his granddaughter out of his TARDIS and left her on a 22nd century Earth just recently freed from the Daleks, etc....and the second Doctor who acted like a space hobo to trick people into underestimating him...and the Fourth Doctor, who often reminded his companions that he wasn't a human...and the Fifth who didn't try to go back in time to save Adric...and the sixth who actually tried to strangle his companion when he first regenerated (of course, said companion WAS Peri, so...)...and the Seventh, who serials started revealing a darker past...can't remember much on the third, or I would have commented on him as well...

Combine those traits that are already there with the events of the Time War, and everything that's happened since...

I personally had no issues with Capaldi's Doctor being a tad Scottish in outlook...

 ;)
Ruger
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/51/1a/1d/511a1d250f3be9ba57c13fd2895ce16b.jpg)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 16 July 2017, 22:57:27
(And I hope that Jodie turns out to be a good Doctor. :) )
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 16 July 2017, 23:21:44
I have no strong opinion on the announcement.  But, I am wondering if Missy may have been some sort of 'beta test' to see how gender switching would work for the show before trying it with the Doctor.

And now I'm wondering if Romana should be a dude when she comes back
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 16 July 2017, 23:35:30
It is impossible to determine for sure what drops a shows viewing numbers but I do think the method by which they are gathered is flawed or networks are putting too much emphasis on first time broadcast viewing numbers for this modern age of streaming/internet viewing/DVRs.  Possibly both.  All I know for sure is that I watch very little actual live TV.

I'm actually okay with the Doctor becoming a woman.  In a way I think it was past time for such a change.  By waiting this long it does seem more like the execs trying to stay relevant in the modern social environment than making a legitimate "what is best for the show" change.

So as long as they don't try and make the Doctor have some new love interest.  Reviving an old one can be tolerated on my part, the Doctor's certainly had a couple, as long as it isn't human and is well written.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: worktroll on 17 July 2017, 04:35:51
Well, technically, the Doctor being interested in a human is kind of like a human being attracted to a particularly clever Alsatian dog. Rithshathra aside, I don't think the BBC is quite ready "sex outside one's species".

And yes, 9th Doctor's attraction to Rose was, for me, kinda "yuck", and I'll be kind & put it down to post-Time War PTSD. Worth noting the copy left behind with Rose was genetically human.

Counterpoint 4th Doctor's treatment of Leela, vs. Romana. (Although if they meant that at the time, they're better than I give them credit for.)

So let's see.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 17 July 2017, 11:32:22
I'm on the fence about this.  I'm sure Jodie Whittaker will make a great doctor.  It really depends on the writing and how much a good mix / chemistry the cast will have.  I honestly don't know.  Not everyone will like this change in direction. 

I don't think the series will have same feel to it.  Certainly this change in the show will split the fan base up a bit until a) they get used to it or b) drop the series. 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Giovanni Blasini on 17 July 2017, 13:45:57
I'll reserve judgement on Whittaker as the Doctor until I see her in the role, same as anyone else who's taken the part.  If she's half as good as Michelle Gomez as the Master, then she'll be a great Doctor.

That said, I will bitterly miss Capaldi's Doctor nonetheless.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 17 July 2017, 15:12:54
Does anyone know how we can start a petition to get Capaldi working with Big Finish making new audio dramas? (That would be so cool!)




[EDIT: Didn't want to add a new post so soon after my last one. But from talking to all my Doctor Who friends (I mean real friends, not just internet acquaintance), almost all of the ones against the new Doctor being female are female themselves. These friends run the gamut of old-school Whovians that been with the show since it was on PBS in the '80s, to ones that came on with Smith. Most of the guys are indifferent to a couple that were excited. Granted, small sample size (less than 20), but I was still surprised by that. Anyway, was just a random observation.]
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: worktroll on 17 July 2017, 17:25:47
I've read reports indicating it's unlikely Capaldi would want to have anything more to do with what he sees as a cheap and exploitative franchise.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Giovanni Blasini on 17 July 2017, 17:48:05
Hadn't heard anything about that. Details?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 17 July 2017, 20:57:18
Wat... :o

That's does not sound good.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 17 July 2017, 21:26:00
I've read reports indicating it's unlikely Capaldi would want to have anything more to do with what he sees as a cheap and exploitative franchise.

Eh...there's too many reports going around. I wouldn't read too much into them.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: worktroll on 17 July 2017, 23:29:26
Hadn't heard anything about that. Details?

Quote from: Peter Capaldi
Doctor Who is a great job, but it is a bit of a television factory. You do twelve episodes a year, and I just worried that I wouldn’t be able to continue to do my best work. I like to be able to learn the lines and do some preparation and come in and give it some vigor and not hate it.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 18 July 2017, 05:45:21
That still seems a bit of a leap.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 18 July 2017, 09:41:17
Yeah...that's basically what Tennant and Smith said when they left too. And they're both engaged with the show even after they left.

(On a said note, I do always laugh when they complain that 12 episodes is too much, considering most shows in the US have twice that many in a season. Then again I guess it would be a lot to do if you are used to only doing 4 or 6 episodes a season...)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 18 July 2017, 11:29:00
Is Tennant more involved? Like producing or writing?  He was with new show runner in his last gig.  I though i read David Tennant was in deeper this time.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Xtrahmxwohld on 18 July 2017, 11:51:05
Personally, I think they should have left the Doctor's gender the 1 trait that doesn't change. Yes, his DNA is rewritten, but whatever, not my decision.

A buddy of mine summed up my feelings on this:
Quote
'm still a bit torn on this, but I'm not upset at it at all. It'll really depend on the writing. If the show just goes on as it generally does with a new Doctor, it'll be fine. If they make a big production out of it and have it be a real, "Look at me, I'm a WOMAN now!" it will likely be bad, but that will have nothing to do with her or the fact that the character is a woman now, it'll be on the writers.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 18 July 2017, 13:20:39
I would had been happier if the Doctor's Daughter came in and replace him.  Even if she was different actress.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 18 July 2017, 14:43:36
Is Tennant more involved? Like producing or writing?  He was with new show runner in his last gig.  I though i read David Tennant was in deeper this time.

He's big on going to cons when he can. And he and Catherine Tate have done some audios for Big Finish. He might not have anything to do with the show anymore, but he is still very much engaged with the wider world of Doctor Who.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 18 July 2017, 17:12:49
Personally, I think they should have left the Doctor's gender the 1 trait that doesn't change. Yes, his DNA is rewritten, but whatever, not my decision.

A buddy of mine summed up my feelings on this:

Except that we've had at least three instances of Time Lords changing gender in the show's history.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 18 July 2017, 17:55:11
Except that we've had at least three instances of Time Lords changing gender in the show's history.

Four now...The Corsair (granted, mentioned only, in The Doctor's Wife), the Master to Missy, the General (seen in Hell Bent), and now the Doctor...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 18 July 2017, 23:29:32
And apparently there was talk about doing that to the Doctor back in the 80's, so there's that.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 19 July 2017, 01:00:31
Yeah, since Ton Baker announced he was leaving.  Joanna Lumley was a fan favourite to take over as The Doctor at the time, casting her as the Thirteenth Doctor in The Curse of Fatal Death was an in-joke to that.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 19 July 2017, 03:07:10
Yeah, since Ton Baker announced he was leaving.  Joanna Lumley was a fan favourite to take over as The Doctor at the time, casting her as the Thirteenth Doctor in The Curse of Fatal Death was an in-joke to that.

Gee, how ironic. :O

(I'm not saying that in a bad way, I still think it was an odd coincidence.  Unless.....S/HE DOES EXIST!!!! :O )
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 19 July 2017, 09:13:38
Yeah, since Ton Baker announced he was leaving.  Joanna Lumley was a fan favourite to take over as The Doctor at the time, casting her as the Thirteenth Doctor in The Curse of Fatal Death was an in-joke to that.

That had perfect casting all round actually. Jonathan Price as the Master was priceless. And interestingly enough Jim Broadbent had played the Doctor before that on a different sketch show.

And Richard E. Grant also played the Doctor in "The Scream of the Shalka" which was a fantastic story by the way. (And also featured Derek Jacobi as the Master ironically enough.) It's a shame it's not canon: I liked that version of the Doctor.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 19 July 2017, 11:10:39
I find it funny, despite clearing up that War Doctor exists, that new one is the Thirteenth Doctor.  Won't she be the Fourteenth?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Øystein on 19 July 2017, 11:21:20
I find it funny, despite clearing up that War Doctor exists, that new one is the Thirteenth Doctor.  Won't she be the Fourteenth?

Nope, the War Doctor is still not one of the numbered ones.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 19 July 2017, 12:38:12
Actually he does count, it's because Tennant got two turns that the numbering is off.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Xtrahmxwohld on 19 July 2017, 12:57:47
http://tardis.wikia.com/wiki/War_Doctor

Quote
The new Doctor promptly rejected his name, declaring, as he picked up and donned Cass' bandoleer, "Doctor no more", (TV: The Night of the Doctor) renaming himself "the Warrior" for a time.

The Doctor himself doesn't consider the War Doctor a "Doctor" as that incarnation didn't follow the principles that made him the Doctor.  So that's why Eccelson is the 9th and not John Hurt.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 19 July 2017, 13:25:38
http://tardis.wikia.com/wiki/War_Doctor

The Doctor himself doesn't consider the War Doctor a "Doctor" as that incarnation didn't follow the principles that made him the Doctor.  So that's why Eccelson is the 9th and not John Hurt.

Yep, and since Tennant burnt a regeneration, he's still technically the 10th, even though he should be 10 and 10.2.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 19 July 2017, 14:59:55
That had perfect casting all round actually. Jonathan Price as the Master was priceless. And interestingly enough Jim Broadbent had played the Doctor before that on a different sketch show.

Yeah, Victoria Wood's show. A fantastic comedian who died recently, and quite young.

Quote
And Richard E. Grant also played the Doctor in "The Scream of the Shalka" which was a fantastic story by the way. (And also featured Derek Jacobi as the Master ironically enough.) It's a shame it's not canon: I liked that version of the Doctor.

It was considered canon when it came out, even though the live-action relaunch was in pre-production at the time with the full intention that the animation would be discarded once it was ready to go.  Weird, but nobody involved in the production of the show has ever really cared about canon.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 19 July 2017, 22:35:52
I liked that version of the Doctor though, that's all.


As far as the new Doctor, there's one thing that really, really bugs me about her....that I have to wait till next year to see her in action.  :( :( :-[
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 20 July 2017, 06:08:32
I liked that version of the Doctor though, that's all.


As far as the new Doctor, there's one thing that really, really bugs me about her....that I have to wait till next year to see her in action.  :( :( :-[
Ain't that the truth.  Well, on the bright side they have good stretch of time to write up some good stories and film them right!  8)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 17 August 2017, 14:24:43
Wow, we've been quiet for some time.  I know, board's down and all that.  Still, since we've been civil, and it's been a good thread that we all can take part in, I figured I'd leave this here as a gift.  Enjoy. :)

(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/c0/96/66/c09666021ad51a1972c1e36183f40b0d.jpg)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 17 August 2017, 18:21:07
Wow, we've been quiet for some time.  I know, board's down and all that.  Still, since we've been civil, and it's been a good thread that we all can take part in, I figured I'd leave this here as a gift.  Enjoy. :)

(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/c0/96/66/c09666021ad51a1972c1e36183f40b0d.jpg)

Too soon man...too soon... :'(

(To be serious though, anyone else see the trailer for the Christmas special? Okay then...since the spoiler tag is still broken I won't say that...  :-X )
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 17 August 2017, 18:31:48
I like Michelle Gomez's master. I was sad that her character was died.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 17 August 2017, 18:39:08
I like Michelle Gomez's master. I was sad that her character was died.

Did she though? Dum, dum, duuuum......
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 17 August 2017, 21:27:43
Just got back from the Rifftrax Live showing of the Five Doctors.

That was awesome.  Love when they do this in theaters.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 17 August 2017, 23:08:52
Too soon man...too soon... :'(

Could be worse.  Last group I threw it in, it started a chain of memes that included someone asking, "Why would you post something like that?"  To which I responded with a picture of the Master, and it spilled out from there. :D

(Don't worry, if I was going to go that far, I'd throw it in the Hall.  Hmmm....sounds like an idea.  Doctor Who meme thread in the Hall. :) Someone will have to start that sometime. :) )

Quote
(To be serious though, anyone else see the trailer for the Christmas special? Okay then...since the spoiler tag is still broken I won't say that...  :-X )

Not yet.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 17 August 2017, 23:28:12
Could be worse.  Last group I threw it in, it started a chain of memes that included someone asking, "Why would you post something like that?"  To which I responded with a picture of the Master, and it spilled out from there. :D

(Don't worry, if I was going to go that far, I'd throw it in the Hall.  Hmmm....sounds like an idea.  Doctor Who meme thread in the Hall. :) Someone will have to start that sometime. :) )

I'd be up for that. :D
(https://media.giphy.com/media/siREjlLKjdSZq/giphy.gif)

Not yet.

Then here you go...

https://youtu.be/YCkDXegqjR0 (https://youtu.be/YCkDXegqjR0)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 18 August 2017, 00:10:08
I'd be up for that. :D
(https://media.giphy.com/media/siREjlLKjdSZq/giphy.gif)

Then here you go...

https://youtu.be/YCkDXegqjR0 (https://youtu.be/YCkDXegqjR0)

Awesome! :)  I wanna see it now! :)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 20 August 2017, 21:07:30
I like Michelle Gomez's master. I was sad that her character was died.

Well, we'll see about that...since it's still an open question of how the Master is going to escape from the little loop he seems to have trapped himself/herself in.  Knowing how the next incarnation will turn out, is it possible he might remember just enough for long enough to re-direct his regeneration into somebody who's NOT Missy?

(And it seems we'll be having to get used to using bi-gendered pronouns in all aspects of this thread now...)

On another note, (didn't get to post these comments since it happened during the White-Out and then had a very busy family holiday) I really liked John Simm's return as the Master in the finale.  He toned down the raving loon act; I could see this portrayal as being a younger, slimier version of Derek Jacobi's take on the character.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 20 August 2017, 21:46:31
Well, we'll see about that...since it's still an open question of how the Master is going to escape from the little loop he seems to have trapped himself/herself in.  Knowing how the next incarnation will turn out, is it possible he might remember just enough for long enough to re-direct his regeneration into somebody who's NOT Missy?

(And it seems we'll be having to get used to using bi-gendered pronouns in all aspects of this thread now...)

On another note, (didn't get to post these comments since it happened during the White-Out and then had a very busy family holiday) I really liked John Simm's return as the Master in the finale.  He toned down the raving loon act; I could see this portrayal as being a younger, slimier version of Derek Jacobi's take on the character.

cheers,

Gabe

It's funny actually, if he'd played the Master more like this in the Tennant stories I would have liked his portrayal a lot better. (Otherwise I rank him down about the bottom of the list of my favorite Masters.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 21 August 2017, 02:57:07
I also never piped in on the whole kerfuffle (although it didn't materialize into one here) on the casting change and the choice of Jodie Whittaker to step into the role.

After mulling over it for some time, just want to say that it's not like we haven't been prepared for the possibility--just that so few fans thought the producers would actually follow through on the idea.  (Is it in fact true that Joanna Lumley was considered as a successor to Tom Baker, back in the early 80s?  If so, this really isn't such a novel idea...)  The worst thing about it, if there's anything "bad" so far, is that given this actress' past association with the new showrunner, it smacks a bit of cronyism on his part.

For those of you who've never heard Jodie Whittaker, here is a BBC interview where she gives her first real thoughts at being chosen to play the next Doctor: 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p05br8l3 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p05br8l3)

If that's how she's going to deliver her lines, then first approximation for her portrayal is female Eccleston.  (Her accent is actually broader than either his or Capaldi's!)  Or will she go the Tennant route and try something closer to RP?**

I also hope they go with the clothes she wore in the reveal announcement as her costume, at least for a while.  It would provide a sense of continuity with Capaldi's Doctor.

**(If you can, look on Youtube and try to find Tennant's delivery of Hamlet's soliloquy.  He is ABSOLUTELY SPELLBINDING.)

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 25 August 2017, 07:11:56
More news on the Christmas special.  It seems it won't just be the First Doctor making an appearance, he'll be bringing along some of his contemporary companions too (played by new actors of course).  And Susan isn't one of them.

http://www.denofgeek.com/uk/tv/doctor-who/48818/doctor-who-christmas-special-hollyoaks-star-cast (http://www.denofgeek.com/uk/tv/doctor-who/48818/doctor-who-christmas-special-hollyoaks-star-cast)

Instead we get Ben & Polly, so this must be from a point close to the end of the Doctor's first incarnation.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 25 August 2017, 07:30:46
It looks very much to me like the Christmas episode will be happening around the time of (or during) 'The Tenth Planet.'
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 25 August 2017, 09:28:13
I think the theme of the episode will be both Doctor's coming to terms with regenerating. (Incidentally, both are the first incarnation of their respective regeneration cycles.)

And yes, since it takes place simultaneously with the events of "The Tenth Planet" it would have to feature Ben and Polly.


As I side note, I'd just like to point out that the last two episodes did not rewrite the origin of the Mondasian Cybermen. It is more a splinter group. And for all we know, the Master could have pushed the survivors in that direction. And also as the Doctor says at one point, wherever humanity goes, the Cybermen are inevitable (or words to that effect).
(Sorry for the mini rant, but I've talked to several people who were convinced it was a retconned and seemed determined to gripe about it.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 26 August 2017, 00:48:27
I think the theme of the episode will be both Doctor's coming to terms with regenerating. (Incidentally, both are the first incarnation of their respective regeneration cycles.)

And yes, since it takes place simultaneously with the events of "The Tenth Planet" it would have to feature Ben and Polly.


As I side note, I'd just like to point out that the last two episodes did not rewrite the origin of the Mondasian Cybermen. It is more a splinter group. And for all we know, the Master could have pushed the survivors in that direction. And also as the Doctor says at one point, wherever humanity goes, the Cybermen are inevitable (or words to that effect).
(Sorry for the mini rant, but I've talked to several people who were convinced it was a retconned and seemed determined to gripe about it.)

I think that was the consensus in one or two Doctor Who groups I belong to on Facebook.  I'm fine with it.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 06 November 2017, 16:00:49
So the Doctor is getting 3 new companions for Series 11, which is going to be 10 episodes long starting in Autumn of 2018. *Sigh*

http://www.doctorwho.tv/whats-new/article/meet-the-thirteenth-doctors-three-new-companions (http://www.doctorwho.tv/whats-new/article/meet-the-thirteenth-doctors-three-new-companions)

In other news the Doctor's daughter is returning to Doctor Who!!
http://www.doctorwho.tv/whats-new/article/the-doctor-s-daughter-jenny-returns-for-new-audio-adventures (http://www.doctorwho.tv/whats-new/article/the-doctor-s-daughter-jenny-returns-for-new-audio-adventures)

And we are getting a new Doctor Who novel from Douglas Adams:
http://www.doctorwho.tv/whats-new/article/coming-in-2018-douglas-adams-doctor-who-and-the-krikkitmen (http://www.doctorwho.tv/whats-new/article/coming-in-2018-douglas-adams-doctor-who-and-the-krikkitmen)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 06 November 2017, 17:59:09
I wished they had been able to do video thing with Doctor's Daughter vs audio.  Its nice to see something for the character!

Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 06 November 2017, 20:36:05
I wished they had been able to do video thing with Doctor's Daughter vs audio.  Its nice to see something for the character!



Yeah, it would have been cool to see. On the other hand I'm glad Big Finish is able to incorporate so much from the new show. (Though if I'm honest, the one episode I really wish we could have seen was one with Capaldi, River Song, Jack Harkness and Missy. I find the idea of the four of them stuck together to be hilarious.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 06 November 2017, 22:31:11
So the Doctor is getting 3 new companions for Series 11, which is going to be 10 episodes long starting in Autumn of 2018. *Sigh*

And we are getting a new Doctor Who novel from Douglas Adams:
http://www.doctorwho.tv/whats-new/article/coming-in-2018-douglas-adams-doctor-who-and-the-krikkitmen (http://www.doctorwho.tv/whats-new/article/coming-in-2018-douglas-adams-doctor-who-and-the-krikkitmen)

This isn't a "new" novel.  Adams' idea for the story dates back to 1976; he eventually reworked it into _Life, The Universe, and Everything_ (book three of the Hitchhiker's Guide series).

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 06 November 2017, 23:22:15
This isn't a "new" novel.  Adams' idea for the story dates back to 1976; he eventually reworked it into _Life, The Universe, and Everything_ (book three of the Hitchhiker's Guide series).

cheers,

Gabe

It's new in that it's never been published. (Though to be fair it's written by someone else from notes that DA wrote back when he was working on the show.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 09 November 2017, 13:01:27
http://www.syfy.com/syfywire/first-look-jodie-whittaker-doctor-who (http://www.syfy.com/syfywire/first-look-jodie-whittaker-doctor-who)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: HobbesHurlbut on 09 November 2017, 14:03:40
That is rather a delightfully Doctor outfit.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 10 November 2017, 07:59:49
I wonder pins they'll put n her suspenders.  Like the question mark or something amusing.  Be nice to see the question mark again.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 10 November 2017, 10:11:30
I could've been patient for a few more months.  I *REALLY* wish they wouldn't reveal things like this until AFTER the Christmas special--unless, that is, they plan to have her change into the new costume in the final scenes, after the regeneration.

OTOH, filming on the new series has apparently already started and will continue through the first half of 2018.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 24 December 2017, 00:02:35
Well, here we are.  The end of an era is upon us.  (Two eras, if you count the change in showrunner.)

But we will always remember when the Doctor was HIM.

She's coming...

Cheers, Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 24 December 2017, 00:30:11
Still not ginger, though. :(

Apparently, BBCA's been doing a marathon.  I've been missing it due to work, but it's fine.  In case I miss the next episode, I've got it set to record. 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 24 December 2017, 00:46:58
Well, only couple days until Winter Special comes out. I pray my local cable carrier doesn't pull a fast one or have glitch and prevent me from watching the episode.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 25 December 2017, 23:51:26
Well, it's out in the wild.

It was interesting adventure.  I like the beginning, it was interest twist near the end.   I did find it strange that it ran little bit longer than i expected. (more than hour.) 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 26 December 2017, 00:01:21
Well, it's out in the wild.

It was interesting adventure.  I like the beginning, it was interest twist near the end.   I did find it strange that it ran little bit longer than i expected. (more than hour.)

I liked the reveal on who the WW1 captain actually was...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Tymers Realm on 26 December 2017, 01:12:56
I just through watching it myself.
Quite interesting. I rather enjoyed the shout-outs to the original First Doctor material as well.
While I don't have a firm read on Capaldi's regen speech, I think you get the feeling he wanted a bottom-up change. And in full honesty, how can you do that than switching genders? The only thing I didn't care for was cliffhanging it like the Tennant/Smith transition.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 26 December 2017, 01:53:25
I liked the reveal on who the WW1 captain actually was...

Ruger

As if we couldn't see that coming from a mile away...

cheers,

Gabe

EDIT:  I see the spoiler tag is STILL not working.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 26 December 2017, 02:04:51
I miss Rusty. :( The whole episode was a feels fest, and while I enjoy those, I normally make fun of those. :(

(No offense, of course, I do so in a light hearted way, and try not to intentionally offend anyone.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ActionButler on 26 December 2017, 06:57:00
As if we couldn't see that coming from a mile away...

True, but it was still pretty satisfying, IMO.

I liked the epsiode, overall.  BBCAmerica butchered it with the constant commercial breaks, but it was pretty solid. Chuckled at the Doctor's reaction when he found out what the the glass people were doing, loved Capaldi's final speech, really enjoyed Bradley as the First, super excited to see how Jodie takes to the role. 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 26 December 2017, 06:58:27
I wish the spoiler tag was working or i'd talk in more detail.  #P
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 26 December 2017, 21:12:50
I wish the spoiler tag was working or i'd talk in more detail.  #P

I concur.  Hence why I tried to keep my comment spoiler minimum.  Even without knowing that Rusty's in the episode, I presume somebody knows that I like Rusty the Dalek*. :)

*From "Into the Dalek," of course. :)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 26 December 2017, 22:22:50
Just finished it and...I'm completely broken-hearted. I knew it would suck saying goodbye to Capaldi's Doctor, but still...damn.
All in all, a really fine episode. I read a review of it earlier and they compared it favorably to "The Empty Child/The Doctor Dances" (Moffat's first TV episode). And in someways I can see what they were getting at.

And I concur, Capaldi's final speech was magnificent, poignant. Really boiled down the essence of his incarnation. Bradley was also brilliant as the first. I'm glad they could bring him back like that (and apparently he is also doing new First Doctor stories for Big Finish). And it's always fun to see Gatiss acting again. As sad as I am to see him go, I couldn't think of a better exit for Capaldi.

I'm sure Whittaker will make a brilliant Doctor. I just think I'm too much a fan of Capaldi in the role to really give her an unbiased try. Oh well, we'll see next autumn.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 26 December 2017, 22:31:09

I'm sure Whittaker will make a brilliant Doctor. I just think I'm too much a fan of Capaldi in the role to really give her an unbiased try. Oh well, we'll see next autumn.

That's about all we can do.  Truthfully, I think Jodie will make a great Doctor. 

Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 27 December 2017, 00:11:44
And already people ate hating the new Doctor and saying the show has turned into Ghostbusters


I hate the Internet
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 27 December 2017, 02:34:04
And already people ate hating the new Doctor and saying the show has turned into Ghostbusters


I hate the Internet

Meh. Don't listen to them. They complained when Matt Smith took over from David Tennant. They complained when Capaldi came on board ("He's too oooold!!). The Internet always finds something to whine about. I'm sure the new Doctor will turn out just fine. (If only we didn't have to wait so long though...)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 27 December 2017, 03:50:46
Meh. Don't listen to them. They complained when Matt Smith took over from David Tennant. They complained when Capaldi came on board ("He's too oooold!!). The Internet always finds something to whine about. I'm sure the new Doctor will turn out just fine. (If only we didn't have to wait so long though...)

Who fanzines were complaining about the new guy about as long as there's been semi-organised Who fandom.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 27 December 2017, 05:30:06
Who fanzines were complaining about the new guy girl about as long as there's been semi-organised Who fandom.

FFY.

In this case, though, the complaints stem pretty well exclusively from the new actor's gender, not because of age, appearance, or lack of qualification for the role.

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 27 December 2017, 08:14:51
I thought the actress who David Tennet costarred with in Broadchurch, Olivia Colman would been good choice as female doctor.  Then again,  Catherine Tate was awesome as David's companion, for short while was sharing his Doctor's abilities when there was two of him.  I would loved see her in the role.

I just wanted the role go to who best tell a good story, no matter who they are. 

I just hope the stories improved, Moff's stuff was hit and miss at times. I still think the "The Day of the Doctor" (when all the doctor's showed up) was the best.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ActionButler on 27 December 2017, 08:57:02
Well, Jodie was the mom in Broadchurch, so you were close. 

Good call on Olivia Coleman, though,  She would do nicely.  I didn't have anyone in-mind this time, like I did last time.  I retrospect, though, I would have liked to see Colin Salmon give the role a go.  Or David Warner.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 27 December 2017, 15:59:35
FFY.

Nope, I was talking about fanzines in the days prior to the internets.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 27 December 2017, 17:05:19
So would anyone else think it would be interesting to see a Doctor stranded for a season? Would make a change (and hasn't been done really since the 3rd Doctor)...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ActionButler on 27 December 2017, 18:36:23
I could get behind a stranded season.  I wondered if that wasn't the plan with the ending of the Christmas special.  My big problem with that is that it requires that the threats come to the Doctor, rather than the other way round. 

That being said... IF we get a stranded season, and IF it would happen to be in... say... Victorian London... and IF it would result in Vastra/Jenny/Strax as season-long companions... you could cast a small dog as the Doctor and I would watch it and love it.

Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 27 December 2017, 18:50:07
And already people ate hating the new Doctor and saying the show has turned into Ghostbusters

Considering the fact that the new Ghostbusters was freaking great and hilarious, I can see that comparison as a good thing...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 27 December 2017, 19:20:52
After talking to a couple other friends, and we all agreed that the only thing that was really worth griping about was how heavy handed they were about showing how sexist the First Doctor was. The first couple of times it was amusing seeing Bill's reaction, but after that it just became tedious. Yes, we get the point, times have changed, the Doctor has changed too. They could have been much more subtle and on point with that instead of whacking it with a sledgehammer.

I could get behind a stranded season.  I wondered if that wasn't the plan with the ending of the Christmas special.  My big problem with that is that it requires that the threats come to the Doctor, rather than the other way round. 

That being said... IF we get a stranded season, and IF it would happen to be in... say... Victorian London... and IF it would result in Vastra/Jenny/Strax as season-long companions... you could cast a small dog as the Doctor and I would watch it and love it.



It's a shame they didn't get their own spinoff show. Of course I would also be interested if they did it that way with Kate Stewart as well.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 28 December 2017, 00:48:13


It's a shame they didn't get their own spinoff show. Of course I would also be interested if they did it that way with Kate Stewart as well.

The Who spinoffs have been pretty hit-or-miss IMO.  Sarah Jane Adventures worked (at least until its star's untimely death), Torchwood was very uneven, and Class got canned after one season.

That said, one big thread that was left dangling (and I was pretty surprised it wasn't touched on at all this past season) was the infiltration of UNIT by The Shoal (the brain aliens) at the end of last year's Christmas special.  I think addressing that problem would make a good basis for a UNIT-centred spinoff starring Jemma Redgrave.

Cheers, Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 28 December 2017, 01:36:22
I'm going to miss 12. :(
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 28 December 2017, 07:46:52
Was Class even a spin off?  Or was it a different show somekne tacked the Doctor onto to try to make people watch it despite being unwatchable
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 28 December 2017, 07:55:26
I'm not a fan of the stranded style seasons.  :P

It will be interesting how they explain the doctor survives a plummeting from the Tardis while like 10,000 feet in the air?

Personally, i thought it was kinda silly for 12 to torch the Tardis (again) with his regeneration. Didn't the doctor learn from the last time 10 keep doing that and ended badly?!?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Sharpnel on 28 December 2017, 08:01:19
Considering the fact that the new Ghostbusters was freaking great and hilarious, I can see that comparison as a good thing...

Ruger
Really? I can't remembr laughing during that film. I could see where they were trying to be funny, but they failed miserably, especially Kate McKinnon.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 28 December 2017, 12:50:35
Question: Billy that was in the Christmas special really a copy of her vs she returned and turned into a Sentient Oil (That's what Pilot was called on the wiki page species wise.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 28 December 2017, 16:46:53
I'm gonna take a guess and say it was established that she was effectively a copy.  She may have been that living oil...whatever thing, but if she was, I guess the process basically rendered her a copy.  Just my guess.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Luciora on 28 December 2017, 18:08:06
Man. What is wrong with the Doctor having a nice quiet regeneration?  I guess today's audiences need to have a huge Bay-esque ending to start over?  I really liked Capaldi as well, and I wish Jodie well in the new role, but the year hiatus they did for Capaldi pretty much killed my watching interest.  I still love the series and will peek in on the wiki and this thread for example, but that's it for me.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ActionButler on 28 December 2017, 19:20:32
Question: Billy that was in the Christmas special really a copy of her vs she returned and turned into a Sentient Oil (That's what Pilot was called on the wiki page species wise.)

99.9% sure it was just a copy.
Otherwise what was the point of that line about a person just being a bunch of memories?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 28 December 2017, 19:52:02
Man. What is wrong with the Doctor having a nice quiet regeneration?  I guess today's audiences need to have a huge Bay-esque ending to start over?  I really liked Capaldi as well, and I wish Jodie well in the new role, but the year hiatus they did for Capaldi pretty much killed my watching interest.  I still love the series and will peek in on the wiki and this thread for example, but that's it for me.

I'm assuming it's just to give them an excuse to redecorate the TARDIS (though why they feel they need any excuse beyond the Doctor just saying "I want a change" is beyond me).

What's really silly to me is how they've taken the very specific occurrence of the Eccleston/Tennant regeneration and retroactively applied it to all of the regenerations...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 28 December 2017, 21:10:03
99.9% sure it was just a copy.
Otherwise what was the point of that line about a person just being a bunch of memories?

It's also a reflection of the Doctor...new face and new body with new mannerisms, but as the memories are the same, it is still person within...a man that may doubt himself from time to time, but in the end always come through for what's right and kind...

It was also about how the Doctor wasn't quite himself ever since he lost most of his memories of Clara, and how he regained much of that when the Testimony gave them back to him...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lazarus Jaguar on 29 December 2017, 00:07:09
Except they only changed the TARDIS once after regeneration,  between Tennent and Smith.  After Eccleston it remajned the aame, as well as between Smith and Capaldi.  However, it did change half way through Smith's run.  So it does seem more on writer whi, rather than new Doctor=new TARDIS.

I wouldnlike to see the Doctor stranded again though.  Even for one season.  That would be fun again
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 29 December 2017, 07:42:35
99.9% sure it was just a copy.
Otherwise what was the point of that line about a person just being a bunch of memories?
Only reason why i was asking, is she REMEMBERED becoming oil creature. The New Earthers had said they grabbed people at point of death.  Thus if she had infacted "died" for their purposes as when she was transformed into a oil creature, she wouldn't have remember anything AFTER that.  It could been it was slip of the tongue on writers thinking what parts Billie would have remembered.

As side noted, i would have been entertained to have Billie there for Doctor's transformation to see what she though the Doctor after the fact.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 29 December 2017, 13:59:02
My pet theory:

When she turned into the oil creature, it probably changed her enough to where, if scanned, she would register a copy.  The process probably rewrote her DNA a bit.  Sadly, I'm not sure how to flesh it out more.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 29 December 2017, 14:10:10
My pet theory:

When she turned into the oil creature, it probably changed her enough to where, if scanned, she would register a copy.  The process probably rewrote her DNA a bit.  Sadly, I'm not sure how to flesh it out more.
Weird thing is i not sure how that could have worked. The New Earthers (sorry i can remember what their called), are Time Lords of their own right. They're method was to go to the point of death, freeze time.  Grab the person they wanted (while alive) scan and erase their memory of the encounter and put them back in moment they left.

That's not just scan, their them hauling these living people who are verge of death (not actuallying dying per say) putting them into some kind of scanning chamber and then depositing them back at place.  I could by the scanning part if it was remotely, but it wasn't. They even goofed and put the British officer in wrong location where the Doctor's where having their meeting of the ages.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 29 December 2017, 15:01:06
They we're called Testimony. And Bill was a copy, Testimony was using her to keep an eye on the Doctors. Clara and Nardole were both copies as well.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 29 December 2017, 15:39:57
Considering how much of the plot was hammering the viewer over the head of what makes a person them and that these were just copies of the original I am surprised so many people are having difficulty understanding that Bill was a copy.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 29 December 2017, 17:05:32
Considering how much of the plot was hammering the viewer over the head of what makes a person them and that these were just copies of the original I am surprised so many people are having difficulty understanding that Bill was a copy.

Put it down to the last 4 companions "dying", then getting a deus ex machina escape from death. Makes it kind of hard to tell if someone is really dead or not...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: monbvol on 29 December 2017, 17:49:49
It was still pretty clear and a pretty central element to the plot that I have trouble understanding how it is confusing what Bill was.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 29 December 2017, 21:21:48
Funny thing is, with time travel.  Your never completely dead, but your not quiet alive either.  Since you can go those moments when they're still around.

Nardole could had good number years before the Cybermen overcame his position in the colony ship.

Given he was alien to begin with, i forgot that it wasn't just humans the Testimony was collecting records of their lives.   Makes me wonder if they had recorded those people that Cybermen & Missy had gathered to become an army before the Doctor and Cyberman who still had free will like the Brigade manged to stop them.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 30 December 2017, 14:52:36
I'm going to miss 12. :(

Though I do think 13 will be good. :)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 30 December 2017, 18:50:30
Here i thought you were going to be the next companion, Marek!  :))

So you won't miss a thing!
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 31 December 2017, 03:13:54
Me travel with the Doctor?  I'd probably get shot by a Dalek, or vaporized by the Master, or heaven forbid, get drunk and mistake the Eye of Harmony for a toilet. :D

(Actually, I can see being finished off by the Judoon for sneezing.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 31 December 2017, 03:28:54
Me travel with the Doctor?  I'd probably get shot by a Dalek, or vaporized by the Master, or heaven forbid, get drunk and mistake the Eye of Harmony for a toilet. :D

(Actually, I can see being finished off by the Judoon for sneezing.)

Or face Peri's fate: married off to Brian Blessed... XD
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 31 December 2017, 04:11:33
Or face Peri's fate: married off to Brian Blessed... XD

:o
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 31 December 2017, 15:50:27
You know, after cleaning my desk off, I got hit by a thought.  Well, actually, it was one of my TNC's that bomped me on the head :D(that's gonna leave a bruise #P ), but a thought entered my head(and it will eventually die of loneliness and starvation).  Am I the only one that noticed that 13's departure from the TARDIS almost mirrors the departure of the Salamander?  Could it be a nod to Doctor #2?

(For those wondering, the Salamander was a character from one of the Second's episodes.  Basically, they land on Earth and have to deal with a dictator known as the Salamander, who bears a striking resemblance to the Doctor, or at least the Second incarnation.  The two fought in the end, and the Salamander found himself falling out of the TARDIS, sliding out the front door and right into space.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 31 December 2017, 17:02:52
I wonder if all three of the Doctor's new companions will be travelling in the TARDIS or if some will just occasionally make a trip (sort of how Clara and Danny Pink did it)?

You know, after cleaning my desk off, I got hit by a thought.  Well, actually, it was one of my TNC's that bomped me on the head :D(that's gonna leave a bruise #P ), but a thought entered my head(and it will eventually die of loneliness and starvation).  Am I the only one that noticed that 13's departure from the TARDIS almost mirrors the departure of the Salamander?  Could it be a nod to Doctor #2?

(For those wondering, the Salamander was a character from one of the Second's episodes.  Basically, they land on Earth and have to deal with a dictator known as the Salamander, who bears a striking resemblance to the Doctor, or at least the Second incarnation.  The two fought in the end, and the Salamander found himself falling out of the TARDIS, sliding out the front door and right into space.)

That was a great story by the way. (Could tell Troughton was having a lot of fun with it too.) Hm, maybe? Though Salamander fell out into the Time Vortex (nasty way to go). And 13 seems to be falling back to earth.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 31 December 2017, 19:14:02
I wonder if all three of the Doctor's new companions will be travelling in the TARDIS or if some will just occasionally make a trip (sort of how Clara and Danny Pink did it)?

That was a great story by the way. (Could tell Troughton was having a lot of fun with it too.) Hm, maybe? Though Salamander fell out into the Time Vortex (nasty way to go). And 13 seems to be falling back to earth.

I enjoyed that one, actually.  I'm ashamed to admit that, outside of 3 Doctors, 5, Doctors, and Two Doctors, I've only seen a couple of Two's adventures(that one, and Tomb of the Cybermen). :(

Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 31 December 2017, 19:46:06
I enjoyed that one, actually.  I'm ashamed to admit that, outside of 3 Doctors, 5, Doctors, and Two Doctors, I've only seen a couple of Two's adventures(that one, and Tomb of the Cybermen). :(


Oh, then you have to go sit down and watch "The Mind Robber". It's not only one of the best 2nd Doctor stories, but one of the best stories in the show 50+ years.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 31 December 2017, 22:41:01
Oh, then you have to go sit down and watch "The Mind Robber". It's not only one of the best 2nd Doctor stories, but one of the best stories in the show 50+ years.

I'm going to have to check it out, then. :)

On that note, for some reason, I'm hung up on "The Face of Evil."  In fact, as I think about it, for some reason, Neva's behavior for some reason reminds me of a Comstar acolyte.

(Then again, so do the Tesh. :D )

(In fact, now that I think about it, I really wish they'd revisit...oh, I forget the name of the planet, but you get the idea.  Revisit the Servatem and the Tesh.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 01 January 2018, 07:52:44
I enjoyed that one, actually.  I'm ashamed to admit that, outside of 3 Doctors, 5, Doctors, and Two Doctors, I've only seen a couple of Two's adventures(that one, and Tomb of the Cybermen). :(

Other than two serials in his last season and "The Two Doctors", I have all of the second's stuff on dvd...at least all that is currently commercially available...he's one of my top favorite Doctors...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 01 January 2018, 10:07:16
I grew up watching (not being die-hard fan when i was young) mainly Tom Baker's Doctor and then his successor.  I fell off the wagon indirectly when Baker's cousin took over because his character early on was unpleasant to me.  I never even saw the number's 7s shows since PBS by then stop airing it and early ones (Doctor's 1-3) prior to Tom Baker weren't even aired.

I found David Tennent's doctor being well rounded in-comparison to past one. I like some of the adventures, as i did with Matt Smith's.   The Twelfth Doctor i watched steadily (given how reliable on demand is i missed some episodes... :P), but I think David's and Matt's were more lively and fun incomparison to Peter Capaldi's earlier travels.  It maybe because the insanity of putting his mind together after his regeneration.  I liked Peter Capaldi later in his run, he reminded me of Third Doctor, in style and his attitude was good.    I however keep watching the Matt Smith and Tennent runs and found them more entertaining.  As for companions, i thought Clara was one of the better ones, as was our doomed Amy.  I know people don't like Clara for some reasons.  In Romano, who was infact a Timelord in her own right, was nearly up there with being nearly awesome of a companion.  I wad disappointed that Missy never (temporarily) became the Doctor's companion.  I guess it was doomed i guess with Peter leaving.

I hope new Doctor is able bring back the liveliness back.  I just hope it doesn't get too political with the Doctor now a woman. 
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: ClarkeMarek on 01 January 2018, 13:12:56
I grew up watching (not being die-hard fan when i was young) mainly Tom Baker's Doctor and then his successor.  I fell off the wagon indirectly when Baker's cousin took over because his character early on was unpleasant to me.  I never even saw the number's 7s shows since PBS by then stop airing it and early ones (Doctor's 1-3) prior to Tom Baker weren't even aired.

Uh, I hate to correct, but Tom and Colin aren't related.  At least not directly(though if they are, it's way way way back.)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 04 January 2018, 17:07:04
A few reviews for the new Warlord Game's "Into the Vortex" game:

https://www.miniaturemarket.com/reviewcorner/doctor-who-exterminate-the-miniatures-game-core-set-review/ (https://www.miniaturemarket.com/reviewcorner/doctor-who-exterminate-the-miniatures-game-core-set-review/)
https://meeplewatching.com/2017/06/21/doctor-who-exterminate/ (https://meeplewatching.com/2017/06/21/doctor-who-exterminate/)
https://tabletopgamesuk.co.uk/2017/05/01/dr-who-exterminate-first-thoughts/ (https://tabletopgamesuk.co.uk/2017/05/01/dr-who-exterminate-first-thoughts/)

I haven't played it yet, but have looked over the free rules they released, and I have to agree with the first reviewer, it does seem rather half-baked.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: elf25s on 17 February 2018, 00:05:44
not sure if any one posted this yet but if you are a bit of a whovian...maryland baltimore this march may be yur month

https://regenerationwho.com/
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: YingJanshi on 20 February 2018, 17:19:44
Sneak peek of the new series logo:

https://youtu.be/IhFVT19_IuM (https://youtu.be/IhFVT19_IuM)
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: gyedid on 23 September 2018, 07:02:02
WE HAVE AN AIR DATE!!!

Series 11 gets underway Sunday October 7.  Exact air time hasn't been announced yet.

http://www.denofgeek.com/uk/tv/doctor-who/42147/doctor-who-series-11-news

cheers,

Gabe
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 23 September 2018, 07:40:32
WE HAVE AN AIR DATE!!!

Series 11 gets underway Sunday October 7.  Exact air time hasn't been announced yet.

http://www.denofgeek.com/uk/tv/doctor-who/42147/doctor-who-series-11-news

cheers,

Gabe

That was actually announced about two weeks ago now...just about 2 weeks to go now...

And I'm not crazy about the move to Sunday's...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Getz on 23 September 2018, 16:04:57
That was actually announced about two weeks ago now...just about 2 weeks to go now...

And I'm not crazy about the move to Sunday's...

Ruger

Well it's the day after my birthday, so I can go to the pub on saturday and watch Doctor who on sunday...
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 23 September 2018, 16:21:33
Well it's the day after my birthday, so I can go to the pub on saturday and watch Doctor who on sunday...

My understanding is that it's going to premier in both England and the States at the same time. BBCAmerica will then re-air it that evening for those that don't catch the earlier showing...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Jaim Magnus on 23 September 2018, 17:02:33
B-b-b-but, that's Thanksgiving! :(
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Luciora on 23 September 2018, 18:55:52
Let's get a new thread for the new Doctor!
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Wrangler on 24 September 2018, 06:21:20
Naah.  We can hold off.  New season can get new thread.  Leave the baggage (good and ill) of the our talks here.

Looks like the first and second episodes will be action pack of the trailers suggest anything.  Sort like the steam punk like appearance of the doctors with those goggles she was wearing in one of the clips.

A lot companions in this one, three no less.  I hope that doesn't become a thing, it doesn't leave room doctor to get guest people coming on for a story arc I think.
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Ruger on 07 October 2018, 12:03:58
Less than 45 minutes to go to the premier of the new season (and the new thread?)...

Ruger
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: jimdigris on 08 October 2018, 13:24:57
I started a new thread.  Do we want to retire this one?
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: hoosierhick on 08 October 2018, 13:58:44
We might as well.  No reason for two threads,  and rod one is on page 49 anyway
Title: Re: Unified Doctor Who thread
Post by: Lorcan Nagle on 09 October 2018, 12:46:25
Closing this thread in favour of the new one.  Please discuss the new era of Doctor Who here: https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php?topic=63146.0