Unified Doctor Who thread

[Drewbacca]

Based on what I've heard it pretty much went the way Lorcan Nagle said.
Christopher has been noted saying something like "I don't bathe twice in the same river".
The culture around the show didn't mesh with him and so with those conflicts he left.

I don't think we'll ever get the full picture, but I did love his performance as the 9th.

Os he still the ninth. After this special I think he should be 10, which leaves us moving on to the last.

[Drewbacca]

 Yes, the creation of the War Doctor was due to outside events, but look at the end of the episode, with 12 Doctors standing there.

[Khymerion]

Okay, fair enough. But to me the biggest problem with the two now is that up till this point it been specifically stated that the entire war was time locked (see "The Stolen Planet/Journey's End"). So the biggest threat in "The End of Time" was not just the return of the crazy Time Lords, but of everything in the Time War spilling back into the universe.
So if the new "quest" is the return of Gallifrey, how are they going to reconcile that?

Thank you for point that out.   I had forgotten that.  Well, I guess we get to wait till christmas and next year...  which is nice.  Right now thought, I am going to sit back and enjoy the warm afterglow/fall out till the next local club meeting to really get to theorycrafting this...  and perhaps the show runners can pull a rabbit out of their hat for their next trick.   Either way, they have me hooked for another season (or 50).

[Khymerion]

I have a feeling that by re-writing history like he did in this episode, we are going to actually get to see some of these terrors that were mentioned but never shown.   So we might be seeing the Could've Been King and his Army of Meanwhiles and Neverweres show since the lock may or may not be in place amongst other things.   This means new monsters, new villains that he knows without having to constantly dip into the same well.

[DoctorMonkey]

I though the time-lock was broken by The Moment and that was, to some extent, her/its WMD-power

[GreenDragon]

I missed that episode.  Could you elaborate?

To sum up:
Rassilon was a peer of Omega.  The pair were involved in creating the means by which time travel was possible.  As a consequence, Omega was trapped in an antimatter universe at the bottom of the black hole that powers the TARDISs.  And for whatever reason Rassilon was entombed, alive, inside what was later called the "death zone."  During the Five Doctors, the Lord President of Gallifrey summons the first five incarnations of the Doctor (though #4 and Romana #2 get stuck in the time vortex) to free Rassilon so he can have immortality.  The others, along with various companions (retiring Brigadier Leftbridge-Stewart, Sarah-Jane, the current companions of #5) are deposited in the zone, face cybermen, daleks, and other threats.  And the Master is also captured to help - and is offered a new regeneration cycle for it.
Interesting that the Master would be summoned to free Rassilon.
Sidenote: The episode also features what appears to be Zoe and Jamie, post trial, but who remember their travels with the Doctor - a fact that allows #2 to figure out they are imposters.  Except that this #2 was visiting the Brigadier at his retirement in 1988 (also seen during the McCoy era), and thus should not remember events that have not yet happened for him.  (Immediately after their memory wipe and return home, he was forced to regenerate into #3).

For some reason, that others here have mentioned, during the time of McGann, the Council released Rassilon, and impeached President Romana.  This is why he is President during the Time War.

btw, did anyone else have trouble with that link.  I need to know if the problem is on my end or not.  I was having similar problems a week ago, and reinstalled Flash.  If it is on my end, that was the first sign.

[GreenDragon]

There never was a Time Lock.  Gallifrey vanished, and the Daleks that were supposed to be in the Time Lock with it were mostly destroyed.  The ones we see in Stolen Planet were supposed to have been in the Time Lock.  But if that were really true, wouldn't their release have released Gallifrey?  Or wouldn't they have still been in there when Gallifrey returned in End of Time?
Clearly they were simply removed from the timestream - perhaps they did an emergency temporal shift right in the middle of Gallifrey's departure and were trapped by the chronal waves.  This made everyone assume they were Time Locked.
It is not as if there were a great number of people specifically trying to time travel into moments specifically affected by the War.  The Doctor was avoiding it.  And everyone else with time travel capability accepted his word for it.

[YingJanshi]

There never was a Time Lock.  Gallifrey vanished, and the Daleks that were supposed to be in the Time Lock with it were mostly destroyed.  The ones we see in Stolen Planet were supposed to have been in the Time Lock.  But if that were really true, wouldn't their release have released Gallifrey?  Or wouldn't they have still been in there when Gallifrey returned in End of Time?
Clearly they were simply removed from the timestream - perhaps they did an emergency temporal shift right in the middle of Gallifrey's departure and were trapped by the chronal waves.  This made everyone assume they were Time Locked.
It is not as if there were a great number of people specifically trying to time travel into moments specifically affected by the War.  The Doctor was avoiding it.  And everyone else with time travel capability accepted his word for it.

Eh...except for Dalek Caan. "The Stolen Planet/Journey's End" specifically states that that it was Time Locked. As does "The End of Time"...

[omega2010]

It seems to me that the regeneration limit is pretty much dead and buried with what we see at the end of the episode.  The Curator subtly reveals he is a retired future incarnation of the Doctor who has taken on the face of the Fourth.

[YingJanshi]

Just finished watching "An Adventure in Space and Time", and all I can say is... :'( ;D Wow.
I loved it. I really did. (Was actually more impressed by this than I was by "The Day of the Doctor".) Especially all of the cameos spread throughout it (But be sure to pay attention to the women in the crowd during Ms. Lambert's farewell party. Among others.)
The entire cast did an amazing job on this production. Especially David Bradley. He really did a fine job of capturing Mr. Hartnell.

It really is amazing how well all of the 1st Doctor's stories still stand up. There is a magic contained in them that cannot be diminished by flubbed lines or shaky cameras. They still grab your imagination and draw you in.

And Mr. Hartnell as the Doctor...well, without his talent the show would never have lasted long enough to become what it is (plus Daleks of course :D). Its amazing how well his characterization foreshadows all of the Doctors to follow. Every subsequent Doctor can be found in him. So he will always be one of my favorites.

After watching this, I would really love to see William Russell and Carole Ann Ford come back for an episode.  :'(

[GreenDragon]

Beings trapped between one moment and the next.  How would they know the difference?

[YingJanshi]

It seems to me that the regeneration limit is pretty much dead and buried with what we see at the end of the episode.  The Curator subtly reveals he is a retired future incarnation of the Doctor who has taken on the face of the Fourth.

Um, I think you are ready to much into that. Personally I think it was just them being a bit playful with Time and the Doctor.

[YingJanshi]

May I present the real 50th special:

The Five(ish) Doctors Reboot

This feels like a good celebration of the show. The actual episode was really good, but it just felt like they tacked on the 50th stuff at the end...

[omega2010]

Um, I think you are ready to much into that. Personally I think it was just them being a bit playful with Time and the Doctor.

Not really.  While the Curator doesn't confirm he's the Doctor, his lines to the 11th Doctor about never forgetting a face and revisiting an old face heavily hint that he is the Doctor.  At least I hope I'm not reading too much into it.

[Wombat]

Like any Doctor Who, it just felt...fun! (and thats the point - continuity doesn't have to be perfect, and the story lines can't always match up in perfect Trekkie-symmetry, but my goodness it MUST be fun).

[bytor]

Like any Doctor Who, it just felt...fun! (and thats the point - continuity doesn't have to be perfect, and the story lines can't always match up in perfect Trekkie-symmetry, but my goodness it MUST be fun).

Agree with this 100%  O0

[ClarkeMarek]

Agree with this 100%  O0

I'll second that! :)

[Darth Nichos]

It was good; a nice docudrama to show how things went behind the scenes.

btw, Hartnell was pretty sick by the time of "The Five Doctors" and his wife had to use cue cards so he could say his lines.

[Pat Payne]

Well there was one line that was certainly a problem.  When 13 Doctors showed up.  Tennent got 2 regenerations so there should have only been 12.

The thirteenth was Peter Capaldi (due to take over as The Doctor during this year's Christmas special), who is seen in an extreme-close-up cameo during the sequence.

[monbvol]

I know he's the 13th incarnation of the Doctor.  But Tennant got 2.  It goes Hartnell, Troughton, Pertwee, T.Baker, Davison, C.Baker, McCoy, McGann, Eccleston, Tennant, Tennant, Smith, and Capaldi.  So unless the two Tennant Doctors got split up there should have only been 12.

[JoeJones]

I know he's the 13th incarnation of the Doctor.  But Tennant got 2.  It goes Hartnell, Troughton, Pertwee, T.Baker, Davison, C.Baker, McCoy, McGann, Eccleston, Tennant, Tennant, Smith, and Capaldi.  So unless the two Tennant Doctors got split up there should have only been 12.

Don't forget the War Doctor, John Hurt, who falls between 8 & 9 in in-series continuity (for now, at least).

[JoeJones]

btw, Hartnell was pretty sick by the time of "The Five Doctors" and his wife had to use cue cards so he could say his lines.

Actually, it was "The Three Doctors" where he was very ill & needed the cue cards. He had passed away some time before "The Five Doctors" was filmed, so the BBC used another actor, Richard Hurndall,  to play the part of the First Doctor for that episode.

[Lorcan Nagle]

I enjoyed An Adventure in Space and Time for the most part, it was very slight - there's not a huge amount of tension to be mined from the series' production.  But the cast and crew really made the show into a love letter to Doctor Who, and that makes up for the straightforwardness of the story.  Reese Shearsmith was a bit crap as Patrick Troughton though.

[Khymerion]

I know he's the 13th incarnation of the Doctor.  But Tennant got 2.  It goes Hartnell, Troughton, Pertwee, T.Baker, Davison, C.Baker, McCoy, McGann, Eccleston, Tennant, Tennant, Smith, and Capaldi.  So unless the two Tennant Doctors got split up there should have only been 12.

Moffet stated that Tennant counts as two and Smith is actually number 13 but the regeneration issue is going to figure prominently in the Christmas Special... so we only got a month till we get our answers.

[Darth Nichos]

Actually, it was "The Three Doctors" where he was very ill & needed the cue cards. He had passed away some time before "The Five Doctors" was filmed, so the BBC used another actor, Richard Hurndall,  to play the part of the First Doctor for that episode.

Yeah, thats right- my bad

[GreenDragon]

But Tennant never went to Trenzalore.  You know the "fall of the 11th"?

[Lazarus Jaguar]

May I present the real 50th special:

The Five(ish) Doctors Reboot

This feels like a good celebration of the show.

They should have shown this on tv right after the show.  This was great. 

[Drewbacca]

But Tennant never went to Trenzalore.  You know the "fall of the 11th"?

Exactly. Not to mention when the high command said all 13 doctors where there, they showed Capaldi.

[ClarkeMarek]

Not really.  While the Curator doesn't confirm he's the Doctor, his lines to the 11th Doctor about never forgetting a face and revisiting an old face heavily hint that he is the Doctor.  At least I hope I'm not reading too much into it.

I actually thought about this earlier, and while it's possible I may be reading too much into a lot of stuff(or for that matter forgetting a lot of things that I need to play catch up), what if the Curator is Susan?  I mean, isn't she suppose to be a Time Lord as well?  We never know what happened to her, and I'm sure after not seeing his granddaughter for years, he's probably unaware that she survived the Time War.  I mean, Time Lords can regenerate into an opposite gender, right?  Just my theory.


EDIT to add:  Feel free to disagree and/or correct me.  I promise I won't be offended. :)

[monbvol]

That's actually a good theory.  I think I like it more then the more "obvious" theory.