Author Topic: Behemoth!  (Read 702 times)

Liam's Ghost

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Behemoth!
« on: 19 December 2024, 19:29:17 »
So if you look around on the internet for a bit you can find some of the pre-release versions for mechs presented in TRO 3055. In addition to discovering that the Phoenix Hawk IIC was originally going to be named the Matador and have nothing to do with the Phoenix hawk, you can also find in these entries some honestly very detailed statistics of the original Behemoth.

This information indicates that the mech was supposed to be 175 tons, carry four autocannon 5s in the torso and PPCs in the arms, and had a design speed of up to 30 KPH (which it never achieved because of breakdowns).

(This, of course, is obviously a nod to the Behemoth minis of the battledroids era and the Robotech Monster that inspired them)

So I took those stats, and imagined someone trying having a look at the original plans and trying to make them work with modern superheavy technology (probably purely as an engineering puzzle).

Then I made this. The weapons are meant to reflect the art of the original Monster (or Mac II if you played the original Palladium RPG), with the guns attempting to cosplay for the gloriously huge artillery cannons on the back and the PPCs matching the tri muzzled arms (actually artillery missile launchers, or giant tri-barrel laser canons in the early version of the Palladium RPG).

The resulting design... works? That is all the parts fit and it can move under its own power and it doesn't need the "illegal design quirk". But it's clearly inefficient, even beyond the problems of being a superheavy mech in the first place, and it would need a lot of refinement before it could be considered fit for duty. Certainly no modern superheavy would be allowed to hit the field with such an archaic weapon load, if nothing else.

But it was a fun little way to put off cleaning the kitchen for a bit.

(Also, my personal headcannon is that both the Behemoth described in the unreleased version and the Matar we got in XTRO boondoggles existed, with the Matar being a second pass at the concept in the hopes that shaving off a bunch of weight might result in a machine that actually functions)


Behemoth SA-RS-5X

Mass: 175 tons
Chassis: Endo Steel Superheavy Biped
Power Plant: 350 XL
Cruising Speed: 21.6 kph
Maximum Speed: 32.4 kph
Jump Jets: None
     Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Standard
Armament:
     6 PPC
     1 Medium Laser
     4 AC/5
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking System: Unknown
Introduction Year: 3125
Tech Rating/Availability: E/X-X-F-F
Cost: 55,467,042 C-bills

Type: Behemoth
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Advanced)
Tonnage: 175
Battle Value: 2,940

Equipment                                          Mass
Internal Structure            Endo Steel           17.5
Engine                        350 XL                 15
   Walking MP: 2
   Running MP: 3
   Jumping MP: 0
Double Heat Sink              23 [46]                13
Superheavy Gyro                                       8
Superheavy Cockpit                                    4
Armor Factor                  530                  33.5

                          Internal   Armor   
                          Structure  Value   
     Head                    4         12   
     Center Torso            53        80   
     Center Torso (rear)               26   
     R/L Torso               37        56   
     R/L Torso (rear)                  18   
     R/L Arm                 29        58   
     R/L Leg                 37        74   


Right Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm
Left Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm

Weapons
and Ammo              Location  Critical   Heat    Tonnage   
Double Heat Sink         LL        3        -       1.0   
3 Double Heat Sink       CT        9        -       3.0   
CASE                     RT        1        -       0.5   
Double Heat Sink         RT        3        -       1.0   
2 AC/5                   RT        8        1       16.0 
AC/5 Ammo (80)           RT        4        -       4.0   
Double Heat Sink         LA        3        -       1.0   
3 PPC                    LA        9        10      21.0 
CASE                     LT        1        -       0.5   
Double Heat Sink         LT        3        -       1.0   
2 AC/5                   LT        8        1       16.0 
AC/5 Ammo (80)           LT        4        -       4.0   
Double Heat Sink         RL        3        -       1.0   
Medium Laser             HD        1        3       1.0   
Double Heat Sink         RA        3        -       1.0   
3 PPC                    RA        9        10      21.0 
Good news is the lab boys say the symptoms of asbestos poisoning show an immediate latency of 44.6 years. So if you're thirty or over you're laughing. Worst case scenario you miss out on a few rounds of canasta, plus you've forwarded the cause of science by three centuries. I punch those numbers into my calculator, it makes a happy face.

(indirect accessory to the) Slayer of Monitors!

Daryk

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Re: Behemoth!
« Reply #1 on: 19 December 2024, 19:55:46 »
That's way too much ammo for a 'mech that can auto-shut down doing an alpha strike...

Wrangler

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Re: Behemoth!
« Reply #2 on: 19 December 2024, 20:45:29 »
I do like it.  The Monster/MAC II in Macross TV if you look closely at few times it was deployed the legs are seldom used, as when you see it on Mars the it actually is hovering (barely) as it skirts back into the Daedalus ramp
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Sabelkatten

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Re: Behemoth!
« Reply #3 on: 20 December 2024, 02:07:09 »
IIRC I managed to fit 4 Thumper artillery and 6 LPPCs on a 2/3 superheavy. That's probably about as close as you can get to the MAC-II.

Daryk

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Re: Behemoth!
« Reply #4 on: 20 December 2024, 04:33:28 »
I think I remember that one... it was pretty good! :)

Liam's Ghost

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Re: Behemoth!
« Reply #5 on: 07 January 2025, 02:35:48 »
So I had misremembered and the entry in the unpublished version actually had large lasers instead of AC 5s.

So here's that.


Behemoth SA-RS-4X

Mass: 175 tons
Chassis: Standard Superheavy Biped
Power Plant: 350 XL
Cruising Speed: 21.6 kph
Maximum Speed: 32.4 kph
Jump Jets: None
     Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Standard
Armament:
     6 PPC
     4 Large Laser
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking System: Unknown
Introduction Year: 3125
Tech Rating/Availability: E/X-X-F-F
Cost: 54,166,292 C-bills

Type: Behemoth
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Advanced)
Tonnage: 175
Battle Value: 2,926

Equipment                                          Mass
Internal Structure                                   35
Engine                        350 XL                 15
   Walking MP: 2
   Running MP: 3
   Jumping MP: 0
Double Heat Sink              31 [62]                21
Superheavy Gyro                                       8
Superheavy Cockpit                                    4
Armor Factor                  480                    30

                          Internal   Armor   
                          Structure  Value   
     Head                    4         12   
     Center Torso            53        76   
     Center Torso (rear)               20   
     R/L Torso               37        55   
     R/L Torso (rear)                  16   
     R/L Arm                 29        55   
     R/L Leg                 37        60   


Right Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm
Left Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm

Weapons
and Ammo              Location  Critical   Heat    Tonnage   
Double Heat Sink         LL        3        -       1.0   
Double Heat Sink         CT        3        -       1.0   
4 Large Laser            CT        8        8       20.0 
5 Double Heat Sink       RT        15       -       5.0   
2 Double Heat Sink       LA        6        -       2.0   
3 PPC                    LA        9        10      21.0 
5 Double Heat Sink       LT        15       -       5.0   
Double Heat Sink         RL        3        -       1.0   
2 Double Heat Sink       RA        6        -       2.0   
3 PPC                    RA        9        10      21.0 
Good news is the lab boys say the symptoms of asbestos poisoning show an immediate latency of 44.6 years. So if you're thirty or over you're laughing. Worst case scenario you miss out on a few rounds of canasta, plus you've forwarded the cause of science by three centuries. I punch those numbers into my calculator, it makes a happy face.

(indirect accessory to the) Slayer of Monitors!

Liam's Ghost

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Re: Behemoth!
« Reply #6 on: 07 January 2025, 03:44:24 »
Also here's this goofy thing


Behemoth SA-RS-4Y

Mass: 175 tons
Chassis: Standard Superheavy Biped
Power Plant: 350 XL
Cruising Speed: 21.6 kph
Maximum Speed: 32.4 kph
Jump Jets: None
     Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Standard
Armament:
     1 Medium Laser
     6 Binary Laser (Blazer) Cannon
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking System: Unknown
Introduction Year: 3125
Tech Rating/Availability: E/X-X-F-F
Cost: 53,855,542 C-bills

Type: Behemoth
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Advanced)
Tonnage: 175
Battle Value: 3,039

Equipment                                          Mass
Internal Structure                                   35
Engine                        350 XL                 15
   Walking MP: 2
   Running MP: 3
   Jumping MP: 0
Double Heat Sink              33 [66]                23
Superheavy Gyro                                       8
Superheavy Cockpit                                    4
Armor Factor                  530                  33.5

                          Internal   Armor   
                          Structure  Value   
     Head                    4         12   
     Center Torso            53        86   
     Center Torso (rear)               20   
     R/L Torso               37        58   
     R/L Torso (rear)                  16   
     R/L Arm                 29        58   
     R/L Leg                 37        74   


Right Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm
Left Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm

Weapons
and Ammo                Location  Critical   Heat    Tonnage   
Double Heat Sink           LL        3        -       1.0   
Double Heat Sink           CT        3        -       1.0   
ECM Suite                  CT        2        -       1.5   
2 Binary Laser Cannon      CT        8        16      18.0 
5 Double Heat Sink         RT        15       -       5.0   
3 Double Heat Sink         LA        9        -       3.0   
2 Binary Laser Cannon      LA        8        16      18.0 
5 Double Heat Sink         LT        15       -       5.0   
Double Heat Sink           RL        3        -       1.0   
Medium Laser               HD        1        3       1.0   
3 Double Heat Sink         RA        9        -       3.0   
2 Binary Laser Cannon      RA        8        16      18.0 
Good news is the lab boys say the symptoms of asbestos poisoning show an immediate latency of 44.6 years. So if you're thirty or over you're laughing. Worst case scenario you miss out on a few rounds of canasta, plus you've forwarded the cause of science by three centuries. I punch those numbers into my calculator, it makes a happy face.

(indirect accessory to the) Slayer of Monitors!

Daryk

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Re: Behemoth!
« Reply #7 on: 07 January 2025, 05:21:22 »
6 Blazers!?  And it can fire them more than once!! ;D

Sabelkatten

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Re: Behemoth!
« Reply #8 on: 07 January 2025, 06:24:40 »
Somebody please check my math...

Code: [Select]
175 ton superheavy biped
17.5 tons ES structure, 7 crits
22.5 tons 350 LFE 2/3 move, 5 crits
5 tons 15 DHS, 2 crits RA
8 tons gyro, 2 crits
4 tons cockpit, 5 crits
Actuators (S+UA), 12 crits
29 tons armor
15 tons Thumper, 4RT/4CT
15 tons Thumper, 5LT/3CT
15 tons Thumper, 6RT/2RL
15 tons Thumper, 6LT/2LL
4 tons ammo, 2 crits RA
2 tons ammo, 1 crit LA
1 ton CASEII, 1 crit RA
1 ton CASEII, 1 crit LA
9 tons 3xLPPC, 3 crits RA
9 tons 3xLPPC, 3 crits LA
3 tons comm gear, 2 crits LA

Arguably the MAC-II would be best represented as a tripod in CBT to account for its 3-man crew and exceptional stability... :undecided:

NUT-BUSTING TORQUE

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Re: Behemoth!
« Reply #9 on: 07 January 2025, 12:50:46 »
(Also, my personal headcannon is that both the Behemoth described in the unreleased version and the Matar we got in XTRO boondoggles existed, with the Matar being a second pass at the concept in the hopes that shaving off a bunch of weight might result in a machine that actually functions)

I actually like that idea, as this point of "Superheavies aren't really a consistent, concrete 'class' outside of just weighing more than 100 tons, and the Word's development is only seen as the 'real' one because it's the first that consistently worked well enough for actual deployment." That way (with some quirks or fluff or whatever) you could fluff superheavies/colossus class as having different physical builds or methods of working, but have it all "fit" because everyone is basically trying to figure out how best to make them.

Liam's Ghost

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Re: Behemoth!
« Reply #10 on: 19 January 2025, 11:10:09 »
So what if you gave the original plans to a cabal of fricken nerds and gave them a few decades outside of warrior oversight on a hidden system with more resources than they knew what to do with?

You might get something like this.


Behemoth Z

Mass: 175 tons
Chassis: Standard Superheavy Biped
Power Plant: 350 XXL
Cruising Speed: 21.6 kph
Maximum Speed: 32.4 kph
Jump Jets: None
     Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Standard
Armament:
     6 ER Large Pulse Laser
     4 ER Large Laser
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking System: Unknown
Introduction Year: 3090
Tech Rating/Availability: F/X-X-F*-X
Cost: 241,519,208 C-bills

Type: Behemoth
Technology Base: Mixed (Experimental)
Tonnage: 175
Battle Value: 3,823

Equipment                                          Mass
Internal Structure                                   35
Engine                        350 XXL                10
   Walking MP: 2
   Running MP: 3
   Jumping MP: 0
Double Heat Sink              41 [82]                31
Superheavy Gyro                                       8
Superheavy Cockpit                                    4
Armor Factor                  530                  33.5

                          Internal   Armor   
                          Structure  Value   
     Head                    4         12   
     Center Torso            53        76   
     Center Torso (rear)               30   
     R/L Torso               37        54   
     R/L Torso (rear)                  20   
     R/L Arm                 29        58   
     R/L Leg                 37        74   


Right Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm
Left Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm

Weapons
and Ammo                                  Location  Critical   Heat    Tonnage   
2 Double Heat Sink                           LL        4        -       2.0   
4 ER Large Laser                             CT        4        12      16.0 
3 Double Heat Sink                           CT        6        -       3.0   
10 Double Heat Sink                          RT        20       -       10.0 
3 ER Large Pulse Laser                       LA        9        13      18.0 
10 Double Heat Sink                          LT        20       -       10.0 
2 Double Heat Sink                           RL        4        -       2.0   
Nova Combined Electronic Warfare System      HD        1        -       1.5   
3 ER Large Pulse Laser                       RA        9        13      18.0 
   
Features the following design quirks: Battle Computer, Combat Computer, Stable, Non-Standard Parts, Prototype


Or maybe this, if they're feeling especially extra.


Behemoth Z2

Mass: 175 tons
Chassis: Standard Superheavy Biped
Power Plant: 350 XXL
Cruising Speed: 21.6 kph
Maximum Speed: 32.4 kph
Jump Jets: None
     Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Standard
Armament:
     6 Improved Heavy Large Laser
     4 Large Pulse Laser
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking System: Unknown
Introduction Year: 3090
Tech Rating/Availability: F/X-X-F*-X
Cost: 240,485,208 C-bills

Type: Behemoth
Technology Base: Mixed (Experimental)
Tonnage: 175
Battle Value: 3,731

Equipment                                          Mass
Internal Structure                                   35
Engine                        350 XXL                10
   Walking MP: 2
   Running MP: 3
   Jumping MP: 0
Double Heat Sink              45 [90]                35
Superheavy Gyro                                       8
Superheavy Cockpit                                    4
Armor Factor                  530                  33.5

                          Internal   Armor   
                          Structure  Value   
     Head                    4         12   
     Center Torso            53        76   
     Center Torso (rear)               30   
     R/L Torso               37        54   
     R/L Torso (rear)                  20   
     R/L Arm                 29        58   
     R/L Leg                 37        74   


Right Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm
Left Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm

Weapons
and Ammo                                  Location  Critical   Heat    Tonnage   
2 Double Heat Sink                           LL        4        -       2.0   
4 Large Pulse Laser                          CT        8        10      24.0 
3 Double Heat Sink                           CT        6        -       3.0   
10 Double Heat Sink                          RT        20       -       10.0 
2 Double Heat Sink                           LA        4        -       2.0   
3 Improved Heavy Large Laser                 LA        9        18      12.0 
10 Double Heat Sink                          LT        20       -       10.0 
2 Double Heat Sink                           RL        4        -       2.0   
Nova Combined Electronic Warfare System      HD        1        -       1.5   
2 Double Heat Sink                           RA        4        -       2.0   
3 Improved Heavy Large Laser                 RA        9        18      12.0 
   
Features the following design quirks: Battle Computer, Combat Computer, Stable, Non-Standard Parts, Prototype
« Last Edit: 19 January 2025, 11:17:06 by Liam's Ghost »
Good news is the lab boys say the symptoms of asbestos poisoning show an immediate latency of 44.6 years. So if you're thirty or over you're laughing. Worst case scenario you miss out on a few rounds of canasta, plus you've forwarded the cause of science by three centuries. I punch those numbers into my calculator, it makes a happy face.

(indirect accessory to the) Slayer of Monitors!

Dave Talley

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Re: Behemoth!
« Reply #11 on: 19 January 2025, 12:59:10 »
Damn
Most of these you can watch the thermal bloom from orbit
Resident Smartass since 1998
“Toe jam in training”

Because while the other Great Houses of the Star League thought they were playing chess, House Cameron was playing Paradox-Billiards-Vostroyan-Roulette-Fourth Dimensional-Hypercube-Chess-Strip Poker the entire time.
JA Baker

Liam's Ghost

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Re: Behemoth!
« Reply #12 on: 19 January 2025, 13:03:17 »
Though you can engineer around it to an extent, that's always a risk when you're making a primarily energy based superheavy. There's just so much tonnage to use relative to the space you have.

(Also, I intentionally went overboard on the Society versions, because setting them up in a more ideal way would be boring)
Good news is the lab boys say the symptoms of asbestos poisoning show an immediate latency of 44.6 years. So if you're thirty or over you're laughing. Worst case scenario you miss out on a few rounds of canasta, plus you've forwarded the cause of science by three centuries. I punch those numbers into my calculator, it makes a happy face.

(indirect accessory to the) Slayer of Monitors!