Author Topic: Naval Pictures VII: Underway, Shift Colors! (Read 152685 times)

beachhead1985 · « **Reply #990 on:** 27 March 2020, 11:04:32 »

Quote from: Luciora on 27 March 2020, 08:08:25

Off topic muse, but I wonder what the overall damage toll was on marine life during and post World War 2. It had to have made an impact, sve the ocean is only so big.

Subs especially with the sonar pulses had to have disrupted whales quite frequently in the more safer zones of non commerce perhaps.

Farley Mowatt writes in IIRC; "The Regiment" about sailing home and noticing how dead and quiet the seas were and asking the capatin about it. The captain confirmed to him that the whole sea war had basically been a slaughter house of sea life with whales often attacked for practice or out of boredom; untold damage from banging away with sonar, ruptured oil tankers, transports hauling all manner of chemicals, ghost fishing like you wouldn't believe, ect.

I think part ofthe reason sharks (and yes; giant squid and octopus) were so active at the time was due to how much of their food chain was being annihilated in the crossfire.

Colt Ward · « **Reply #991 on:** 27 March 2020, 11:38:38 »

I would take that with a huge grain of salt . . .

Yeah, a depth charge is going to kill fish if they are in the pressure zone . . . but its not like a guy in a rowboat tossing dynamite. The ship has already come banging around in the area and there would be a lot of other noise to drive off the sea life. The pings surface ships were using to detect subs are different IIRC than what is used now that are claimed to cause whales to beach.

Sharks, squid and octopus were probably no more active than before, there were just more folks spread out to observe their activity- previously they had been a tree falling in the forest with no one to hear.

I shied away from this, but bluntly sunken cargoes and lost crews would provide for the cycle of life.

R.Tempest · « **Reply #992 on:** 27 March 2020, 12:40:39 »

Quote from: Colt Ward on 27 March 2020, 11:38:38

I would take that with a huge grain of salt . . .

Yeah, a depth charge is going to kill fish if they are in the pressure zone . . . but its not like a guy in a rowboat tossing dynamite. The ship has already come banging around in the area and there would be a lot of other noise to drive off the sea life. The pings surface ships were using to detect subs are different IIRC than what is used now that are claimed to cause whales to beach.

Sharks, squid and octopus were probably no more active than before, there were just more folks spread out to observe their activity- previously they had been a tree falling in the forest with no one to hear.

I shied away from this, but bluntly sunken cargoes and lost crews would provide for the cycle of life.

Agree entirely.
I have a memory of watching a Cousteau special when I was a kid (late 60's or early 70's) where they were diving on a sunken group of ships in the Pacific. It was amazing to how quickly the coral had taken hold and was building a reef with all the variety of life that a reef supports. It had been around 25 years since the ships were sunk and they were all encased to a certain extent.
As I'm writing this, the phrase 'Truk Lagoon' comes to mind as a location.

Giovanni Blasini · « **Reply #993 on:** 27 March 2020, 13:42:06 »

Good news for battleship fans:

https://battleshiptexas.org/battleship-updates/

Looks like the Battleship Texas Foundation just announced yesterday that they got their permits to relocate and repair the USS Texas. I know they'd been talking about moving her up the coast, but I've no idea where, and I know her hull's got some issues, but their most recent announcement says that among the repairs will torpedo bulges and hull work.

For the picture tax:

Colt Ward · « **Reply #994 on:** 27 March 2020, 13:54:31 »

Further away from salt water & air? Quite a few people on her in that picture . . . when I tried to get around the bow to get a shot without the gangway we were being divebombed by squadrons of mosquitoes.

Weirdo · « **Reply #995 on:** 27 March 2020, 13:56:41 »

Getting her away from the mosquitoes while still keeping her in the state is beyond modern engineering, I suspect. Unless you're talking about a fully enclosed drydock?

Colt Ward · « **Reply #996 on:** 27 March 2020, 14:02:58 »

Lol, we did not have a mosquito problem on the ship with open water and a breeze . . . but walking around the inlet to the side opposite the gangway & museum shop/office to get a photo without them in it gets to more swampy land and thus the mosquitoes. Basically I was trying to get further to the right from where that picture was taken.

Just going up river gets them further away from salt-ladden air and the brackish water she is sitting in, and while she COULD end up somewhere in state without the coastal humidity . . . well, I do not think she could float up to the panhandle or out to the Odessa area.

worktroll · « **Reply #997 on:** 27 March 2020, 14:08:28 »

Could you put her up on blocks?

(yeah ....)

chanman · « **Reply #998 on:** 27 March 2020, 14:29:15 »

Quote from: worktroll on 27 March 2020, 14:08:28

Could you put her up on blocks?

(yeah ....)

Getting them out of the water usually is a big help, yeah

Wrangler · « **Reply #999 on:** 27 March 2020, 14:51:30 »

I guess they gave up on the Waterless Drydock berth they were shooting for. Its not good keep her in water forever. The Alabama was raised out the water, however she had issue due to hurricane that smacked her and causes her to list at 5? degree angle.

BairdEC · « **Reply #1000 on:** 03 April 2020, 17:50:09 »

A Venezuelan naval vessel rammed a cruise liner and sunk itself. If I'm reading the Venezuelan statement right, it was this boat(?)

https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/03/americas/venezuela-navy-cruise-liner-incident-intl/index.html
http://www.mindefensa.gob.ve/mindefensa/2020/03/31/comunicado-oficial-de-la-fuerza-armada-nacional-bolivariana-5/
https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/AB_Naiguat%C3%A1_(GC-23)

Dave Talley · « **Reply #1001 on:** 03 April 2020, 21:33:45 »

the liner has an icebreaker bow ;-)

Wrangler · « **Reply #1002 on:** 03 April 2020, 21:50:21 »

USS Saratoga CV-3's bridge underwater in the Bikini Atoll.

Cannonshop · « **Reply #1003 on:** 03 April 2020, 22:10:25 »

Quote from: Dave Talley on 03 April 2020, 21:33:45

the liner has an icebreaker bow ;-)

thing that occurs to me, is that the Venezuelan Navy crew thought RAMMING a ship that was significantly larger, was a smart thing to do. Clearly, these guys were trained by House Davion in Naval Tactics.

Daryk · « **Reply #1004 on:** 04 April 2020, 04:55:49 »

It sounds like they were trying to shoulder the liner, but were obviously doing that wrong...

kato · « **Reply #1005 on:** 04 April 2020, 05:10:13 »

It should be noted that that German cruise liner is a rather small Finnish-built polar expedition boat (123m length), and the Venezuelan boat is a rather large OPV (79m length). So it's not like we're talking some speedboat ramming itself into the side of an ocean liner.

If as described in the CNN article they were coming on from starboard at 135° then they were trying to shift the cruise liner into a starboard-side turn for a port-to-port pass as required by standard naval rules, and they had the right of way in doing so. The scuffs on the bow of RCGS Resolute also corroborates with rather them not observing the rules and ramming the other ship.

Sharpnel · « **Reply #1006 on:** 04 April 2020, 07:03:25 »

However the Resolute outweighed the Naiguata by nearly 5700 tons (nearly 5x heavier). so the OPV fought a battle it could not win and paid the price.

God and Davion · « **Reply #1007 on:** 04 April 2020, 08:01:49 »

Quote from: BairdEC on 03 April 2020, 17:50:09

A Venezuelan naval vessel rammed a cruise liner and sunk itself. If I'm reading the Venezuelan statement right, it was this boat(?)

https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/03/americas/venezuela-navy-cruise-liner-incident-intl/index.html
http://www.mindefensa.gob.ve/mindefensa/2020/03/31/comunicado-oficial-de-la-fuerza-armada-nacional-bolivariana-5/
https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/AB_Naiguat%C3%A1_(GC-23)

The name of the ship was Naiguatá GC-23. Luckily, there have been no casualties. Everybody on that ship survived.

Daryk · « **Reply #1008 on:** 04 April 2020, 13:31:30 »

I think we might be getting a little close to Rule 4 here...

JadeHellbringer · « **Reply #1009 on:** 04 April 2020, 13:50:32 »

Quote from: Daryk on 04 April 2020, 13:31:30

I think we might be getting a little close to Rule 4 here...

...again. Which is very discouraging.

Daryk · « **Reply #1010 on:** 04 April 2020, 13:56:19 »

The world's a busy place... lots of things happening all the time that could get us close to the line.

Moonsword · « **Reply #1011 on:** 05 April 2020, 19:42:11 »

===MOD NOTICE===

Okay, I've cleared out the thread. Hopefully you've all got it out of your systems. Political commentary is not acceptable, as I think you should all be well aware by now. JadeHellbringer's certainly made that point enough recently.

Quote from: Daryk on 04 April 2020, 13:56:19

The world's a busy place... lots of things happening all the time that could get us close to the line.

Yes, yes it is. That means you need to pay better attention to where the line is.

The moderation staff is reluctant to close this thread - some of us enjoy posting in it! - but if we have to take a heavy-handed approach to managing it, measures will be taken and people will not enjoy them. Knock it off, folks. An administrator should not have to post twice in a week to remind people to avoid Rule 4 even if the Venezuelan Navy is making a go at reenacting the fate of the Curacoa.

I'm going to give everyone a little time to absorb this before I unlock the thread.

Moonsword · « **Reply #1012 on:** 06 April 2020, 14:04:08 »

===MOD NOTICE===

Alright. I'm going to reopen this. I trust you've all gotten the point on Rule 4. If you haven't, you're going to find pointed messages from moderators suddenly appearing in your inbox with words like "warning" and "suspension from posting" in them.