Author Topic: Talk to me about A Time of War  (Read 15518 times)

abou

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Talk to me about A Time of War
« on: 01 August 2016, 16:03:22 »
I have been playing Pathfinder (D&D 3.5 with extras) for over a year now. I've taken bits and pieces of that with inspiration from our Dungeon Master into my group's Alpha Strike game. Now we are at this point where wanting to increase the depth of gameplay and developing players' characters into something more three dimensional is pulling me toward A Time of War.  As a GM, I have managed to work in some pretty awesome twists and turns, but I still don't feel as though I am consistently good at it. Ergo, I had a few questions for everyone here:

1. How well does A Time of War play compared to Pathfinder obvious differences aside (D6s v D20s)?

2. How quickly do new players pick it up?

3. How easy is it for someone to GM?

4. A Time of War has a lot of "monster" stats in the back of the handbooks. What about NPCs? Is there a good database for that similar to Pathfinder?

5. Overall thoughts of the system?

6. We are playing a late Succession Wars game just before the end of the 3rd SW. Any tips or advice that I should look out for?

7. Tips and tricks for a veteran player, but relatively novice GM are appreciated.

EDIT:

8. How do you choose to incorporate 'mech-scale combat? Total Warfare or Alpha Strike?
« Last Edit: 01 August 2016, 16:18:01 by abou »

ElectricPaladin

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #1 on: 01 August 2016, 16:12:27 »
I'm as ignorant as you, abou, but as roleplayer primarily, a wargamer second, and a new Battletech player...


abou

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #2 on: 01 August 2016, 16:31:09 »
I am saving that photo.

ElectricPaladin

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #3 on: 01 August 2016, 16:32:42 »
I am saving that photo.

Heh. Great!

Acolyte

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #4 on: 01 August 2016, 17:23:16 »
1. AToW plays quite differently than any of the DnD games. There are no levels for one and your hit points are based off one of your stats - so there is a hard limit. With the hit locations in the AToW Companion combat can be quite real - as real as games get, anyway.
The game mechanics are like battletech with the modifiers flipped. In battletech you apply all modifiers to the target number, then roll. In AToW you apply all modifiers to the roll itself and compare to a static target. Overall, it's about like Alphastike in it's complexity especially if you don't use hit locations.

2. If you play Battletech or Alphastrike, it shouldn't be that hard to pick up.

3. It's like any other game system to GM - you just need to familiarize yourself with the rules.

4. There are some generic type NPC stats in AToW and the Companion in addition to the pre-made characters that can also be used.

5. I really like the system. In fact I tend to use it for any sci-fi or post apocalyptic games I run, not just BT.

6. If you're using the lifepath system to make characters, you'll probably need to adjust them. Other than that there is a lot of equipment that isn't available to this time period. There are availabiliy stats listed with each piece of equipment, though, so sorting them out isn't hard.

7. If you don't have it, fudge it. You don't have to make up all the stats for everyone they meet. If it's, say, a security guard that they are in combat with, just assume 5 in stats a security guard would find important (STR, BODY) and a 4 elsewhere and give a generic skill of maybe 2 or 3 in the things a security guard needs. If they are more competent, up the stats. This gives you all the info you need. If you want to get more fancy, you can.
Also, have a list of 20 names. When they meet someone who is not a significant npc (like they approach the janitor and you weren't expecting it) just use one of those names. Replenish between games as needed.

8. We use Total Warfare for our 'Mech Combat. Each individual 'Mech is more important and is a significant part of the character. It's good to know when the arm gets blown off.

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Atlas3060

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #5 on: 01 August 2016, 18:56:44 »
I do like that pic as well.
Okay onto the advice!

Quote
1. How well does A Time of War play compared to Pathfinder obvious differences aside (D6s v D20s)?
In A Time of War, if you are in combat then either you messed up or are in a position to ambush someone.
Combat can be very lethal with it ending in one or two gun shots assuming the person's armor doesn't hold.
Which is why I've always seen it more for roleplaying than personal combat, but AToW Companion DOES have optional rules for "heroic mode". Meaning it buffs up the health points, makes healing easier, etc.

Perhaps a few tweaks with that will make it more run and gun.

Quote
2. How quickly do new players pick it up?
If the GM can tell a story, not too bad. My group played with the quick start rules a few times and we were okay with it.
A point of advice, use character point creation first instead of the life module.
That way people can get what they want without wondering if the life modules will provide in the end.

Quote
3. How easy is it for someone to GM?
Aside from Tactical Armor rules, or whatever they use for Battle Armor, the rest isn't too bad.
A good GM will make or break the session really.

Quote
4. A Time of War has a lot of "monster" stats in the back of the handbooks. What about NPCs? Is there a good database for that similar to Pathfinder?
AToW and the Companion have generic enough stats for skinning on what most games use.
The low level, the higher up guy, the big boss, etc.
Also don't forget Lance Dossiers and other electronic releases from CGL which actually offer character sheets.
Maybe if you like that person, you could use them (or kill them).

Quote
5. Overall thoughts of the system?
Aside from that whole "mods to the dice instead of the TN" thing, I don't have much gripes on it.

Quote
6. We are playing a late Succession Wars game just before the end of the 3rd SW. Any tips or advice that I should look out for?
You'll need to tweak it until something for that timeframe comes along. Personally I'd take the Era Report 3052 and tweak it a bit since that runs the 3039 - 3052 time frame, which is the closest based on existing releases.

Quote
7. Tips and tricks for a veteran player, but relatively novice GM are appreciated.
I'll 'borrow' from Acolyte's advice, but tweak it a bit. If you don't have stats, assume the value is a 6 for an attribute. That's the rule of thumb from the books last I read, or at least the Quick Start.
Sit down, have fun, don't worry about what's canon and just carve out your own stories for the group.

Quote
8. How do you choose to incorporate 'mech-scale combat? Total Warfare or Alpha Strike?
Duels: Total Warfare.
No way am I using the Tactical Combat ruling, unless someone REALLY wants that Solaris itch.

Normal fighting: Alpha Strike, where the Mech Unit's pilot gets "killed off for real" if I do a roll of under 10 or so. Something like that.
It's not about winning or losing, no it's all about how many chapters have you added to the rule books after your crazy antics.

Daryk

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #6 on: 01 August 2016, 19:03:29 »
I echo Atlas3060's recommendation for Era Report 3052, and would also point you to one of the many character creation aids posted here (not just mine).  The bookkeeping can be intimidating for new players.

hive_angel

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #7 on: 02 August 2016, 11:15:04 »
1. How well does A Time of War play compared to Pathfinder obvious differences aside (D6s v D20s)?
I have two+ years experience with ATOW and 0 years experience with Pathfinder. ATOW requires less dice to roll as most rolls are conducted with 2D6 and sometimes 3D6. Combat is ultra deadly and if a GM is not cautious in designing enemies players can be easily killed off. Rerolling a character is not an easy affair in ATOW. I do a few things to tweak this.
1. Outlaw shotguns (They kill, nuff said).
2. player characters have issued concealed and non concealed armor both fir for FWL duties, this helps buff against being attacked in the open.
3. If a player dies in combat I instantly refund two bod points and adjust fat accordingly. This allows a character to be saved and use med skills.
4. I use a mix of low power, mid power goons and usually a high power boss.
4. Players and NPCs both benefit from a tweak.

2. How quickly do new players pick it up?
Very easily depending upon how fast a GM learns and retains rules. A GM can introduce everything in waves to make everything go smoother, character creation (long part), RP skill usage, RP combat (melee and ranged), etc.

3. How easy is it for someone to GM?
Easily as how good you are at story telling. In my opinion like all RPGs if you are good at story telling from a cannon perspective go with it and with a non-cannon perspective go with that. I go with non-cannon, but still follow basic fundamentals.
In my position it took much longer to blend RPG elements into Battletech before I took on out of mech combat. RPG was slow at first, but once a story got rolling I got better and so did the game sessions.

4. A Time of War has a lot of "monster" stats in the back of the handbooks. What about NPCs? Is there a good database for that similar to Pathfinder?
Very little usable NPCs in the book and they are mostly cookie cutter NPCs. Your best bet is to design NPCs yourself to use over time and for single usage. Example I have custom created NPCs to help players with skills they need and are teammates, with this they have come alive over time. I use custom NPCs for grunts, tools, and bosses.

5. Overall thoughts of the system?
For first RPG I like it and it truly shines with story telling so players have something to unfold and allow characters to grow over time.

6. We are playing a late Succession Wars game just before the end of the 3rd SW. Any tips or advice that I should look out for?
Avoid the mad max BS. Let your players use their stuff. However, due to the time frame (Post SSW) restrict rare stuff (Mostly star league equipment) when needed and even allow things that should be dead be alive. Example my players occasionally find a downgraded star league mechs on the field and rarely a star league mech on the field. Another example is allow players to feel the slow crawl of things failing and falling apart - my players mechs over time have suffered irreparable inner armor, irreplaceable outer armor, malfunctioning, self issues, etc.

7. Tips and tricks for a veteran player, but relatively novice GM are appreciated.
No samurais in space and avoid the rising sun - ask the squid and the one who wears a red shirt. Seriously though I think the trick is to blend battletech and ATOW together. In my first campaign for example I had a grand mix of RPG/Battletech sessions.

Here is a post of my completed first campaign. Might offer some tips or not and a fun read.

http://ststh.blogspot.com/2015/04/battletech-time-of-war-campaign-complete.html

8. How do you choose to incorporate 'mech-scale combat? Total Warfare or Alpha Strike?
Depends on one thing and one thing only SALVAGE. If your players depend on salvage - Battletech, if your players don't depend on salvage - Alpha strike. If you care not for small parts, but mostly mechs Alpha strike would most I believe as long as a mech is not destroyed. Battletech + Strategic Operations lets players get salvage and lets players and GM know what can and can not be salvaged. Example coring a mech in battletech rules means you can only salvage parts and not the mech.
Follow my blog for Battletech battle reports!

http://ststh.blogspot.com

Search for "Battle Report"

PurpleDragon

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #8 on: 02 August 2016, 11:32:34 »
What's been said pretty much covers everything to answer your questions.  The only thing I want to add to is the comment about random names.   My group used to keep a fairly thick phone book from the nearest large city we could get our hands on.  If we needed a name, we just rolled a d20 and a d8, add together, subtract 1 and re-roll if the result was 27.   That gave the 1st letter of the last name.  Repeat to get the first letter of the first name.  Then flip to random page with those results and point to with eyes closed to get the name. 

Since I started using MekHQ, which has a great name generator for the characters you hire, I have been using that instead for all of my other than fantasy based games. 
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abou

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #9 on: 03 August 2016, 16:04:03 »
Thanks for the tips. I am concerned by the complexity of the character creation. Whether that is real or perceived, let me know. The points-only system is straightforward, but you do need to reference a lot of pre-requisites. The module system is more daunting; yet, allows for a more natural character progression.

It is clear I will need to go over the rules a few more times and then carefully coach my players through creation.

guardiandashi

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #10 on: 03 August 2016, 17:17:50 »
Thanks for the tips. I am concerned by the complexity of the character creation. Whether that is real or perceived, let me know. The points-only system is straightforward, but you do need to reference a lot of pre-requisites. The module system is more daunting; yet, allows for a more natural character progression.

It is clear I will need to go over the rules a few more times and then carefully coach my players through creation.
for the GM I would actually recommend going through creating chars using modules until its pretty easy for you. this gives you a better feel for char creation and its not a waste, especially if you save the chars in a notebook or similar, because it gives you a bunch of potential NPC's to use in the games you run, even if you "strip them down" to the core parts needed for the encounter/game

I will say there are a bunch of chars that you will never need much such as "thug #1-10" or police officer whatever, and those can be as simple as a couple lines on a note card, but I guarantee you will have times when you need to help the players make and or tweek chars to fit better in a campaign.

as far as campaigns go in the ~3025 timeframe I come from the idea that letting a character or 2 have some "special" piece of rare or "lostech" can be an interesting plot hook.  like Letting a player have a SLDF Neural Helmet that has benefits but not all the suggested disadvantages, or having a pulse laser pistol (or rifle) that's over 200 years old so its grips are worn down enough that there is only 1 "right" way to hold it or something.

monbvol

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #11 on: 03 August 2016, 18:55:08 »
Module build is very much just subtract module cost from XP pool then add XP to indicated Attribute, Trait, and Skills in specified amounts.  So complicated I do feel is the wrong word for it but I will certainly grant just how many numbers can get involved that daunting is a reasonable word to describe it.  That said it does proceed fairly straight forward.

Certainly running through it a few times will help and if you keep the number of modules limited in the build it can even go fairly fast.

Acolyte

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #12 on: 03 August 2016, 19:28:57 »
Module build is very much just subtract module cost from XP pool then add XP to indicated Attribute, Trait, and Skills in specified amounts.  So complicated I do feel is the wrong word for it but I will certainly grant just how many numbers can get involved that daunting is a reasonable word to describe it.  That said it does proceed fairly straight forward.

Certainly running through it a few times will help and if you keep the number of modules limited in the build it can even go fairly fast.

This +1. The math is easy - there's just a lot of it. Once you've done a few characters it get easy.

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Atlas3060

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #13 on: 04 August 2016, 09:05:09 »
Thanks for the tips. I am concerned by the complexity of the character creation. Whether that is real or perceived, let me know. The points-only system is straightforward, but you do need to reference a lot of pre-requisites. The module system is more daunting; yet, allows for a more natural character progression.

It is clear I will need to go over the rules a few more times and then carefully coach my players through creation.
Lately my position has been the following when it comes to character creation:

1. Super Easy mode: GM created sheets or just grab the archetypes from the books or Quick Start Rules
2. Easy Mode: Character Points ruling
3. Advanced Mode: Life modules

For some players, who are used to classes and such, Points is probably going to be the best bet. Yeah there's a bit of math, but once you get a few done the rules tend to stick in your head. This is probably the easier way of "just making a Mechwarrior". Okay there you go, purchase the requirements and dump your remaining points into things. Viola now go play.

Life Modules are better suited for the player who really wants an organic creation system, flaws and all. Min-Maxing can occur, but I feel isn't as powerful compared to how Points would do it. Here you might have a gregarious, unattractive, Aerospace pilot who takes up knitting as a past time and can't stop smoking cigars. How did that happen? Not totally sure but wow did the Modules allow for some strange stuff.
It's not about winning or losing, no it's all about how many chapters have you added to the rule books after your crazy antics.

abou

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #14 on: 04 August 2016, 13:57:54 »
I'm glad to see that ER:3052 has some details for previous regions like the Tamar Pact.

What about the older Handbooks? Is what is in the Davion book compatible with A Time of War, because a quick glance makes me think it won't.

Atlas3060

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #15 on: 04 August 2016, 14:39:20 »
Handbook House Davion and some of the older ones work off the MW3RPG system.

Right off the bat, no they aren't completely compatible, but can they be inspiration for tweaks? Oh sure!

Any animals and weapons are useful, I think the stats for weapons aren't too different from one version to the other.
That's assuming said books or animals aren't already in AToW or the companion to it.
« Last Edit: 04 August 2016, 14:41:17 by Atlas3060 »
It's not about winning or losing, no it's all about how many chapters have you added to the rule books after your crazy antics.

abou

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #16 on: 04 August 2016, 14:41:34 »
Ah nuts, I thought A Time of War was just a rebranding of MW3 due to licensing issues with Microsoft.

Probably not that hard to convert though once I know the system, right?

Atlas3060

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #17 on: 04 August 2016, 15:04:39 »
MW3RPG (Also called CBTRPG) was the Third Edition RPG with the title of Mechwarrior on the cover.
Actually I think Mechwarrior was chosen way back before Microsoft.
Then they took it to distinguish themselves from Battletech.
Then CGL went with AToW for rebranding since now MW is associated with electronic stuff.
A fun ride really, if any of that is accurate.

One key difference between that and A Time War (basically the 4rth edition RPG for the Battletech franchise) is the fact it used D10s for actions.
There's also a crappy wound system, a horrible 'threshold' for attributes, bloated amount of skills and traits, etc.

Now as for converting things, this is where I strongly recommend AToW Companion.
It gives you advice on how to convert ALL the Mechwarrior edition characters to AToW.
Got a favorite from the 1st edition game? You can convert.
Want to play with the Archetypes from MW2? Convert them.
Third Edition character want to be imported over? Yes you can!

The systems themselves do have some measure of similarities. I can't really remember how much at the time of this posting.
I will say one big difference between AToW and MW3RPG for character creation is how their Life Modules are different.
There's no wacky rolling for events in AToW, at least the Core book.
The Companion does have a little rule dealing with people who want something like the event rolls and how it would work out for AToW.
I haven't played with that enough to compare to MW3's event rolls.

Personally I believe if you just kept the traits, attribute updates, and skills from whatever module you're using before doing a life module event roll, you'll be close to what AToW does with it's own modules.
« Last Edit: 04 August 2016, 15:07:20 by Atlas3060 »
It's not about winning or losing, no it's all about how many chapters have you added to the rule books after your crazy antics.

monbvol

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #18 on: 04 August 2016, 16:24:17 »
As for the AToW Companion's random events it is just roll 2d6 and add or subtract XP at each stage.  So rather boring really but contrasted to how unbalanced and concept breaking CBTRPG/MW3ED got with it's event rolls it is a fair improvement I think.

guardiandashi

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #19 on: 04 August 2016, 16:59:32 »
in a lot of ways ATOW is closer to a more fleshed out version of MechWarrior 2nd edition than it is to mw3rd edition IMO. 
The biggest difference is instead of having the priority step that determined how much you had available for advantages, resources, attibutes, skill points, etc.  its all rolled into xp, and "everything" comes from that 1 xp pool at various costs during character creation/development.

Daryk

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #20 on: 04 August 2016, 17:33:27 »
When I ran my game here (before the last board crash), I basically went with Atlas3060's method one.  I had the players tell me what they wanted in general terms, then I generated their characters, and gave them one or two opportunities to make tweaks (that I implemented).

Atlas3060

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #21 on: 05 August 2016, 09:07:53 »
in a lot of ways ATOW is closer to a more fleshed out version of MechWarrior 2nd edition than it is to mw3rd edition IMO. 
The biggest difference is instead of having the priority step that determined how much you had available for advantages, resources, attibutes, skill points, etc.  its all rolled into xp, and "everything" comes from that 1 xp pool at various costs during character creation/development.
That's always been my take away too.
I remember a thread where I had lengthy discussion with folks over the merits and flaws of MW2 versus AToW.
They saw MW2 as the best "campaign" book, to them how can they run a Mech Company.
Well now we have Campaign Operations for that kind of thing.

I always saw AToW as the RPG focused book MW2 failed to be.
You could spend countless sessions playing through entire star systems and not once touch a 'Mech control, but that's perfectly fine!
AToW really took the premise of what MW3 tried to be (RPG focus first), used the simplicity of MW2 (Got at the most 3D6? You can play!), and tied to together in a way I never expected to like.

My only problem is I don't have time to meet up with my table to play it.
It's not about winning or losing, no it's all about how many chapters have you added to the rule books after your crazy antics.

HABeas2

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #22 on: 05 August 2016, 09:20:05 »
Handbook House Davion and some of the older ones work off the MW3RPG system.

Right off the bat, no they aren't completely compatible, but can they be inspiration for tweaks? Oh sure!

Any animals and weapons are useful, I think the stats for weapons aren't too different from one version to the other.
That's assuming said books or animals aren't already in AToW or the companion to it.

The conversion between MW3/CTBRPG and AToW is typically quite easy, as Attributes, Skills, and Traits all generally swap on a 1:1 basis. Weapons and gear from all previous sourcebooks were included in A Time of War (something some of my colleagues thought we shouldn't have done, for some odd reason), with the general conversion being no more than changing damage values by simply dropping the "D6"s (thus a 1 * 4D6 weapon in MW3 becomes AP 1, BD 4 in AToW).

The same generally applies to animals as well, so most/all should convert with little fuss.

-

guardiandashi

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #23 on: 05 August 2016, 10:42:17 »
The conversion between MW3/CTBRPG and AToW is typically quite easy, as Attributes, Skills, and Traits all generally swap on a 1:1 basis. Weapons and gear from all previous sourcebooks were included in A Time of War (something some of my colleagues thought we shouldn't have done, for some odd reason), with the general conversion being no more than changing damage values by simply dropping the "D6"s (thus a 1 * 4D6 weapon in MW3 becomes AP 1, BD 4 in AToW).

The same generally applies to animals as well, so most/all should convert with little fuss.

-
there is one weapon that I really disliked the conversion of, and I use the old version from tro3026 (although I use the damage stats from ATOW) which is the Manpack PPC.
in 3026 it is listed as an ~40kg rifle, which no one will reasonably argue is so massive that its practically unusable as anything but an emplaced weapon for an unaugmented person.
TRO 3026 had the solution in the form of exo-skeletons that upgrade the strength to take the load off the wielder, OR the Waldo (which is effectively a 1 arm and partial torso exo) allowing the wielder to use the M-PPC like a giant rifle.
ATOW does not have the exos, or the waldo they only give you a "weapon sling" and thus restrict the M-PPC (and other support weapons) to being exclusively crew served weapons.

HABeas2

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #24 on: 05 August 2016, 10:46:42 »
ATOW does not have the exos, or the waldo they only give you a "weapon sling" and thus restrict the M-PPC (and other support weapons) to being exclusively crew served weapons.

That's simply because exos had already been reclassified as battle armor, and were featured in TRO: Vehicle Annex.

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Panthros

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #25 on: 08 August 2016, 00:01:52 »
Save your time/money and play something else.  A Time of War is not properly supported by Catalyst.  0 modules/adventures have been released for the game!  Unless you want all of the work to create the everything lol.  Sorry, I have a family and a day job.  I want a RPG that is supported.  At least 1 module per quarter should not be asking too much even if community written.

Acolyte

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #26 on: 08 August 2016, 00:05:26 »
And yet there are a lot of other people who seem not to have a problem playing it. Try adding something constructive next time.

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bluedragon7

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #27 on: 08 August 2016, 01:23:56 »
0 modules/adventures have been released for the game!
thats an outright lie.
I can understand and share the wish for more frequent material but that statement is just not true. There are a couple of modules available. The main focus however seems to be to provide hooks and other source material instead of fully statted adventures.

Atlas3060

  • ugh this guy again
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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #28 on: 08 August 2016, 02:02:38 »
Save your time/money and play something else.  A Time of War is not properly supported by Catalyst.  0 modules/adventures have been released for the game!  Unless you want all of the work to create the everything lol.  Sorry, I have a family and a day job.  I want a RPG that is supported.  At least 1 module per quarter should not be asking too much even if community written.
Necromo Nightmare, Empires Aflame, the Free RPG day downloads floating around the internet, the adventure seeds in the Touring the Stars releases, and the RPG hooks that the Handbooks provided.
These show signs of support, so the notion that "0 modules/adventures" is wrong.

Now do they provide-absolute-granular-level-30 grues will eat you on THIS part of the map? No, but then as always CGL has steered from that way in most of their products.
It's not about winning or losing, no it's all about how many chapters have you added to the rule books after your crazy antics.

abou

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Re: Talk to me about A Time of War
« Reply #29 on: 08 August 2016, 08:06:14 »
Herb, thanks for fighting to include a lot of those details in A Time of War. I'm glad to hear that they are there.