Author Topic: Feudal plots, intrigue, and positioning  (Read 1785 times)

Colt Ward

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Feudal plots, intrigue, and positioning
« on: 14 March 2018, 18:22:54 »
While reading Milan's last book one of the main characters gets tutored in 'intrigue' by an ancestor in order to prepare her for the struggle ahead, particularly with the set up of the Empire.  Game of Thrones and the War of the Five Kings had bits that seemed to be pulled from history and dressed up for the setting (something Martin did a lot).  The Tudors was also interesting and while it was dramatized the show raised questions about how I perceived events of the time with some hints about the motivations as factors of the politics.

Battletech is supposed to have a feudal setting for how the star spanning empires are managed, letting local structures operate as long as they will as long as it generally is stable and the taxes get to the House.  While the local government may be a absolute monarchy, constitutional monarchy, some form of democracy/republic, dictator or any one of the varied forms we have built over the years to govern our societies the politics still comes back to people.  And generally those who reach for or hold the levels of power have their own goals which they often have opposition to either inside the same government or another competing on the regional (couple of worlds range) level.

What historical intrigues or plots could easily be dropped into Battletech for campaigns?

I am going to go with a few easy ones . . .

English Civil War- nobles & parliment tried to avoid taxes & redress grievances.  Lots of options here with armies raised in other regions, monarch fleeing the seat of government for more 'friendly' territory, a monarch being executed or driven into exile, and fun succession politics.

Scottish-English relations 1540s-  Henry's troublesome neighbor has a ally involved in a war and unable to support Scotland.  Henry does some saber rattling and even military strikes trying to force the Scots to the negotiating table and even make them subordinate to the English throne.
Colt Ward
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Daryk

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Re: Feudal plots, intrigue, and positioning
« Reply #1 on: 14 March 2018, 18:39:09 »
Honestly?  Pick a Shakespeare play!  :)

iamfanboy

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Re: Feudal plots, intrigue, and positioning
« Reply #2 on: 14 March 2018, 18:59:25 »
How much have you read the old, old House books? The ones from the 1980s? Most of those have intrigues and plots that spanned decades, old problems half-solved leading to new problems - some of which taken from history, some of which caused by the Battletech universe's problems, some of which are a mix of the two. Take the Davion Civil War during the 2500s - the Prince dies, possibly at the hands of a man who married into the Davions, with his 5-year old son left to the regency of said man and his aunt who was completely under his thumb. He ended up 'ruling' for the next ninety years, though the first parts of it were in name only.

Or the Von Rohrs, nearly erased from Kuritan history because they were somehow even worse than the Kuritans. Or the...

Man, there's just so much stuff in those books. I'll still take them down from the shelf and read them to this day, because it's some of the best history books that never actually existed.

Nightlord01

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Re: Feudal plots, intrigue, and positioning
« Reply #3 on: 15 March 2018, 06:41:04 »
How much have you read the old, old House books? The ones from the 1980s? Most of those have intrigues and plots that spanned decades, old problems half-solved leading to new problems - some of which taken from history, some of which caused by the Battletech universe's problems, some of which are a mix of the two. Take the Davion Civil War during the 2500s - the Prince dies, possibly at the hands of a man who married into the Davions, with his 5-year old son left to the regency of said man and his aunt who was completely under his thumb. He ended up 'ruling' for the next ninety years, though the first parts of it were in name only.

Or the Von Rohrs, nearly erased from Kuritan history because they were somehow even worse than the Kuritans. Or the...

Man, there's just so much stuff in those books. I'll still take them down from the shelf and read them to this day, because it's some of the best history books that never actually existed.

Yeah, the original sourcebooks were inconsistent and messy, but damn they told good stories. I really loved the ComStar sourcebook, it told the story so well, including depicting both the hatred and insidious nature of WoB.

Colt Ward

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Re: Feudal plots, intrigue, and positioning
« Reply #4 on: 15 March 2018, 08:43:49 »
I actually do not have those books but I have heard such.

I was actually thinking of events that could be re-dressed for smaller level government conflicts which means it does not involve House lords or other big canon figures in the campaign plot.  I do not pretend to be a expert on the history of European or Asian feudalism which is why I was asking if anyone else had some historical events they think would drop right into BT's setting with a few name shuffles.
Colt Ward
Clan Invasion Backer #149, Leviathans #104

"We come in peace, please ignore the bloodstains."

"Greetings, Mechwarrior. You have been recruited by the Star League to defend the Frontier against Daoshen and the Capellan armada."

Garrand

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Re: Feudal plots, intrigue, and positioning
« Reply #5 on: 15 March 2018, 09:40:28 »
Conquest of Ireland ca: 12th C.

Small bands of nobles from the FedSuns (or any of the successor states) invade a number of independend, sparsely populated but culturally homogenous & warring worlds outside the border. A conquest led by private interests for private ambitions, but given some sort of approval by the House.

Formation of the Kingdom of Sicily, ca: 12th C. Mercs or private organizations insert themselves into an unstable group of warring petty states, & then by hook & crook forge a new independent nation. This is something I wish the Chaos march had developed into.

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Tai Dai Cultist

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Re: Feudal plots, intrigue, and positioning
« Reply #6 on: 15 March 2018, 10:04:44 »
Well BattleTech actually has very few truly novel concepts.  Not to disparage it... I love that it's essentially a reskinned mashup of disparate historical eras retold with giant robots.

If you're looking for influences for your own story:

The Anabasis/Xenophon's March of the Ten Thousand.  Arguably already done for the BTU in McCarron's Long March, but no reason you can't down your own as well.

The Sieges of Constantinople and then Vienna could be adapted into planetary sieges as decisive battles in a massive campaign where one power is rising to threaten to conquer a Successor State (or the entire Inner Sphere) and is then checked.

The Barbary Wars could serve as a template for an Anti-piracy punitive campaign.

If you're looking specifically for Petty Noble vs Petty Noble shenanigans, the Hundred Years War is oft cited as being BattleTech without the 'Mechs.  However I'd focus a bit to the east, and read up on the HRE.  That obnoxious patchwork of Duchies and Principalities is a much truer representation of neo-feudal distributed power in the BTU in my opinion.


Karasu

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Re: Feudal plots, intrigue, and positioning
« Reply #7 on: 15 March 2018, 10:32:59 »
IIRC The Succession Wars were inspired by the Wars of Alexander's Successors in the 3rd and 4th centuries BC.  There's quite a bit of hinting in the names...

Another place to look for interestingpetty feudal politics is The Romance of the Three Kingdoms (which you can get a bit of a flavour of by reading the fluff in the Dynasty Warriors computer games).  Betrayal, assassination, battles, named weapons and Lu Bu (the mightiest man alive).

Natasha Kerensky

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Re: Feudal plots, intrigue, and positioning
« Reply #8 on: 15 March 2018, 11:21:40 »

Consolidation of power in Viking Age Scandinavia.  Kings took power from multiple jarls, integrated different Norse peoples under their rule, and set up dynasties, starting the Sweden, Norway, and Denmark we know today.  In BT, this could be done at the planetary level.  Some Chaos March worlds described as having multiple factions in that sourcebook were good candidates.  Similar historical arcs played out earlier with the Franks, culminating in Charlemagne, and at different stages in Britain with Alfred the Great and William the Conqueror.

Securing trade routes from Sweden through Slavic territory to Byzantium and Baghdad by the Rus (Swedish Vikings) during the Vendel and Viking Ages.  The establishment of trade posts like Kiev and Novgorod along the Volga and Dnieper Rivers, and the consolidation of the surrounding Slavic tribes laid the foundations of the Russian state.  In BT, this could play out over several worlds along a key jump route as a mercantile interests take over planetary governments (maybe using mercenaries where necessary) to link valuable resources and/or population centers.

The establishment of Norse buffer states during the Viking Age.  After suffering years of raids and paying bribes to Viking raiders not to return, British and French rulers either accepted the Danelaw de facto or gave Viking leaders title and territory like Normandy, with the expectation that these buffer states would absorb or defend British and French territory from further Viking raids and invasions.  The Romans did the same thing with various Germanic tribes in earlier eras.  In BT, this could play out on almost any House border with the Periphery that is plagued by bandits.

Multi-generational feuds between families in Iceland and other Norse colonies.  This is the stuff of many Icelandic sagas and is reflected in the larger Norse culture in legends and myths like Nibelungenlied.  Think Hatfields and McCoys, only longer waits for more poetic vengeance.  In BT, this could happen between feuding nobles and their house guards on any minor planet largely ignored by the ruling House or regional government.  The ruling families of various Italian city-states undertook similar feuds that usually involved trade and mercenaries, made most famous in Romeo and Juliet.

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Niopsian

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Re: Feudal plots, intrigue, and positioning
« Reply #9 on: 15 March 2018, 11:56:14 »
I always thought it would be interesting to see a 'bad' First Prince ala Henry VIII. Yes, he's a monster, but he's a mostly disinterested one, meaning he leaves the running of the country to a succession of mostly capable ministers who all suffer from a variable life expectancy due to their boss being, well, a monster.

When Caleb was introduced, I was hoping that he would go down in history as personally unlikable but remarkably effective thanks to his long suffering Champion Erik Sandoval.

I got the personally unlikable part right, at least... #P



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Kidd

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Re: Feudal plots, intrigue, and positioning
« Reply #10 on: 15 March 2018, 12:18:50 »
A lot of what GRRM wrote was pulled from English and European history. His Easteros and Free Cities stuff is rather transparent reskinning of other world cultures too.

Anyway... Battletech to me doesn't really politick well, I don't think we've seen any absolutely Machiavellian twists and turns. Which sortof makes sense - in a world focused on open warfare spanning centuries, less political play is needed. You tend to see that where factions are in a state of detente, with multiple factions jockeying for position and to shift the balance of power a few points with every world won over and so on.

Less need for that when the lore concentrates on taking said world by force of arms.

Which is what is somewhat attractive about Aaron and Erik Sandoval's storylines in the MWDA novels. I think that is where the politicking reached its height, for BT... Perhaps the Mariks arc as well.

I'd look at stories of feudal England and France, the Italian merchant-princes, or the German states during Frederick the Great's era... places in history where a number of roughly equal city-states competed for power, not necessarily militarily.

The Romance of the Three Kingdoms
is practically de rigeur reading for chinese political players, in office or govt

Colt Ward

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Re: Feudal plots, intrigue, and positioning
« Reply #11 on: 15 March 2018, 12:45:11 »
Melissa's actions against Vedet strikes me as the proper sort of scheming that could happen behind the scene that we really do not get in the narrative since most the stories feature the action.  He was given enough rope to get himself well and truly out on the ledge (to mix metaphors) when the whole thing collapsed under his 'leadership' which should have destroyed his ambitions.

I had actually started doing a bit over Alfred in England, in part inspired by the Last Kingdom (show & novels)- which is also another source that had got me thinking on these lines for BT.
Colt Ward
Clan Invasion Backer #149, Leviathans #104

"We come in peace, please ignore the bloodstains."

"Greetings, Mechwarrior. You have been recruited by the Star League to defend the Frontier against Daoshen and the Capellan armada."

Dmon

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Re: Feudal plots, intrigue, and positioning
« Reply #12 on: 15 March 2018, 18:11:46 »
I recently started a personal project over on Sarna that has the express purpose of digging up as many of the noble houses as I can find. I expect as the project goes on I will end up charting all kinds of interesting minor story arcs :-)

Daryk

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Re: Feudal plots, intrigue, and positioning
« Reply #13 on: 15 March 2018, 18:29:00 »
How the Grimaldis came to rule Monaco is a good story...

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Re: Feudal plots, intrigue, and positioning
« Reply #14 on: 17 March 2018, 08:48:50 »
I'm a fan of the quandary of the rightful ruler being incompetent.

Do you prop up/try to save/train the rightful fool or support a more capable usurper and then which one?
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