Author Topic: Long standing House Units (Read 2194 times)

Papabees · « **on:** 18 March 2018, 14:11:21 »

Are there storied units within the five major houses that existed from 3025 that lasted and survived through the Jihad? I'd like to paint up some units that I can use throughout the time line but wanted to try and hit a canon scheme.

Fed Suns - 1st Kathil Uhlans?
Lyran
Cappies
Kurita
Free Worlds

Any help would be appreciated.

Jaim Magnus · « **Reply #1 on:** 18 March 2018, 14:25:22 »

Sadly the Kathil Uhlans are disbanded in 3060, the survivors become Star League troops. Any survivors ended up joining the RotS.

So...

FedSuns - Any of the Davion Guards Brigade are a good bet
Lyrans - 3rd Lyran Guard, or 2nd Donegal Guard
Cappies - Red Lancers or Death Commandos
Kurita - Genyosha or a Sword of Light regiment
Free Worlds - 1st or 2nd Free Worlds Guard (understanding that they didn't exist between 3085 and 3139)

Psycho · « **Reply #2 on:** 18 March 2018, 14:30:34 »

You'll have a bit more luck focusing on brigades than individual regiments, though there are some of those for sure. Even when some individual regiments go down, it's rare to see a whole brigade removed from the rolls. I'll just hit the big ones for now. I'm sure others will provide more specifics as the thread progresses.

Davion - the Uhlans, IIRC, become a SLDF unit. Look to the Brigade of Guards, Crucis Lancers, and Avalon Hussars for your main-line options.

Steiner - Royals and Lyran Guards will always be around in some form.

Capellans - Most Warrior Houses, and the Red Lancers are the cream here.

Kurita - Can't go wrong with the Sword of Light; just got to watch a couple switches in the Jihad/post-Jihad eras. Ryuken and Genyosha have their roots in the 4thSW era too.

Marik - To survive all the way through, you'll want to look at the sub-factions and see what units end up where. Andurian units got dismantled after their secession attempt and only re-formed after the jihad-era break-up of the state, for one example. If you've got thoughts on specific units, I'm sure we can help with their timelines, but it's pretty jumbled to just point to a unit or two. Like, the first few Regulan Hussar units make it through, but if you don't like the Regulans, that doesn't help you.

Sartris · « **Reply #3 on:** 18 March 2018, 21:12:26 »

Hey just because we decided to try living apart for a while doesnt mean the colors were struck. After all, can you really consider yourself an FWL pilot if you never participated in a civil war?

1st FWG (2426) / 2nd FWG (2464)
Ductal Guard (2485)
First Orloff Grenadiers (2691)
1st Oriente Hussars / 2nd Oriente Hussars
Steel Guard (2799)
1st Regulan Hussars (2247) / 2nd Regulan Hussars (2478) / 3rd Regulan Hussars (Pre 2577) / 5th Regulan Hussars (ca. 2760)

(SMD)MadCow · « **Reply #4 on:** 18 March 2018, 21:29:38 »

For House Davion, as others have said the Davion Guards, Avalon Hussars, and Crusis Lancers. In addition there are the Robinson Rangers in the Draconis March and the Syrtis Fusiliers in the Capellan March. Some other fun units are the Ceti Hussars, New Iaaverson Chasseurs, First Kestrel Grenadiers, and the First Fed Suns Armored Cavalry.

Colt Ward · « **Reply #5 on:** 18 March 2018, 21:58:42 »

Pretty sure 3 or 4 of the Warrior Houses got wiped in the Jihad, and if the book Aris Sung is introduced in is accurate Romano was the one that restored a few in the 3040s that had been wiped out earlier.

Karasu · « **Reply #6 on:** 19 March 2018, 06:16:29 »

I have a spreadsheet where I try to track all of this. Davion and Steiner get a bit complex due to the Federated Commonwealth years in the middle

For house units only (not affiliated mercenaries) active on 3025, 3050, 3067 and 3145:
Kurita: 22
1st Amphigean Light Assault Group
2nd An Ting Legion
2nd, 4th and 6th Arkab Legion
2nd, 6th and 17th Benjamin Regulars
2nd and 3rd Dieron Regulars
5th, 6th and 19th Galedon Regulars
2nd Legion of Vega
6th and 7th Pesht Regulars
5th Sun Zhang Academy Cadre
1st, 2nd, 5th, 7th and 8th Sword of Light (That seems wrong...)

Liao (Yikes!): 7
Holdfast Guard and Red Lancers of the Capellan Hussars
Warrior Houses Dai Da Chi, Hiritsu, Ijori, Imarra and Kamata

Marik: 9
1st, 2nd and 3rd Free Worlds Guards
Ducal Guard of the Fusiliers of Oriente
1st, 2nd and 3rd Oriente Hussars
1st Orloff Grenadiers
Steel Guard of the Protectorate

Steiner: 14
15th, 17th and 23rd Arcturan Guards
2nd, 4th, 8th, 11th and 17th Donegal Guards
3rd Lyran Guards
3rd and 8th Lyran Regulars
1st, 2nd and 3rd Royal Guards

Davion: 25
17th and 20th Avalon Hussars
Sirdar and Valexa Capellan March Militia
1st and 2nd Ceti Hussars
1st, 3rd, 5th and 6th Crucis Lancers
Kestrel, Marlette and Remagen Crucis March Militia
1st, Assault and Light Davion Guards
Dahar and Milligan Draconis March Militia
1st Federated Suns Armoured Cavalry
1st Kestrel Grenadiers
1st and 2nd New Ivaarsen Chasseurs
2nd Robinson Rangers
5th and 6th Syrtis Fusiliers

Papabees · « **Reply #7 on:** 19 March 2018, 07:12:43 »

This is awesome. Thanks!

Quote from: Karasu on 19 March 2018, 06:16:29

I have a spreadsheet where I try to track all of this. Davion and Steiner get a bit complex due to the Federated Commonwealth years in the middle

For house units only (not affiliated mercenaries) active on 3025, 3050, 3067 and 3145:
Kurita: 22
1st Amphigean Light Assault Group
2nd An Ting Legion
2nd, 4th and 6th Arkab Legion
2nd, 6th and 17th Benjamin Regulars
2nd and 3rd Dieron Regulars
5th, 6th and 19th Galedon Regulars
2nd Legion of Vega
6th and 7th Pesht Regulars
5th Sun Zhang Academy Cadre
1st, 2nd, 5th, 7th and 8th Sword of Light (That seems wrong...)

Liao (Yikes!): 7
Holdfast Guard and Red Lancers of the Capellan Hussars
Warrior Houses Dai Da Chi, Hiritsu, Ijori, Imarra and Kamata

Marik: 9
1st, 2nd and 3rd Free Worlds Guards
Ducal Guard of the Fusiliers of Oriente
1st, 2nd and 3rd Oriente Hussars
1st Orloff Grenadiers
Steel Guard of the Protectorate

Steiner: 14
15th, 17th and 23rd Arcturan Guards
2nd, 4th, 8th, 11th and 17th Donegal Guards
3rd Lyran Guards
3rd and 8th Lyran Regulars
1st, 2nd and 3rd Royal Guards

Davion: 25
17th and 20th Avalon Hussars
Sirdar and Valexa Capellan March Militia
1st and 2nd Ceti Hussars
1st, 3rd, 5th and 6th Crucis Lancers
Kestrel, Marlette and Remagen Crucis March Militia
1st, Assault and Light Davion Guards
Dahar and Milligan Draconis March Militia
1st Federated Suns Armoured Cavalry
1st Kestrel Grenadiers
1st and 2nd New Ivaarsen Chasseurs
2nd Robinson Rangers
5th and 6th Syrtis Fusiliers

Hayden. · « **Reply #8 on:** 19 March 2018, 09:00:48 »

Quote from: Karasu on 19 March 2018, 06:16:29

Liao (Yikes!): 7
Holdfast Guard and Red Lancers of the Capellan Hussars
Warrior Houses Dai Da Chi, Hiritsu, Ijori, Imarra and Kamata

There are a few missing here, I think the point of confusion is the shifting naming conventions seen in the CCAF, and the lack of accounting for St. Ives forces (several of which survive, despite the fate of the compact).

-1st St. Ives Lancers
-2nd St. Ives Lancers
-Shepard's/Aleshia's/Roman's Mounted Fusiliers (Later 1st St. Ives Sentinels)
-Devon's/Marcella's Armored Infantry (Later 2nd St. Ives Sentinels)
-Kamakura's/Phyr's Hussars (Later 1st Liao Hussars)
-Kincade's Rangers/Renshield's Dragoons/Paget's Dragoons/1st Liao Dragoons
-Ishara's Grenadiers/Vong's Grenadiers/Chao's Grenadiers/1st Liao Grenadiers
-Kingston's Legionnaires/Kingston's Victoria Commonality Rangers/1st Victoria Rangers
-Sung's Cuirassiers/Sung's Victoria Commonality Rangers/2nd Victoria Rangers

While not yet a house unit in the 3025 era, McCrarron's Armored Cavalry was in Liao service in one form or another in this list's timeframe, and I believe at least some constituent regiments went the distance.

I might have missed a couple, but you get the idea.

Sartris · « **Reply #9 on:** 19 March 2018, 09:10:26 »

Quote from: Karasu on 19 March 2018, 06:16:29

Marik: 9
1st, 2nd and 3rd Free Worlds Guards
Ducal Guard of the Fusiliers of Oriente
1st, 2nd and 3rd Oriente Hussars
1st Orloff Grenadiers
Steel Guard of the Protectorate

3rdFWG was reformed after the Jihad. The original unit first defected to the wobbles and then to Regulus where it was absorbed.

The loss of the Marik Militia regiments really makes this list anemic

Colt Ward · « **Reply #10 on:** 19 March 2018, 09:22:13 »

Yeah, and I think the whole thing with the broken up FWL Protector regiments messes with things b/.c of their name change.

Karasu · « **Reply #11 on:** 19 March 2018, 10:05:08 »

Quote from: Hayden. on 19 March 2018, 09:00:48

There are a few missing here, I think the point of confusion is the shifting naming conventions seen in the CCAF, and the lack of accounting for St. Ives forces (several of which survive, despite the fate of the compact).

-1st St. Ives Lancers
-2nd St. Ives Lancers
-Shepard's/Aleshia's/Roman's Mounted Fusiliers (Later 1st St. Ives Sentinels)
-Devon's/Marcella's Armored Infantry (Later 2nd St. Ives Sentinels)
-Kamakura's/Phyr's Hussars (Later 1st Liao Hussars)
-Kincade's Rangers/Renshield's Dragoons/Paget's Dragoons/1st Liao Dragoons
-Ishara's Grenadiers/Vong's Grenadiers/Chao's Grenadiers/1st Liao Grenadiers
-Kingston's Legionnaires/Kingston's Victoria Commonality Rangers/1st Victoria Rangers
-Sung's Cuirassiers/Sung's Victoria Commonality Rangers/2nd Victoria Rangers

While not yet a house unit in the 3025 era, McCrarron's Armored Cavalry was in Liao service in one form or another in this list's timeframe, and I believe at least some constituent regiments went the distance.

I might have missed a couple, but you get the idea.

Whilst I agree on the shifting names (not sure how to easily manage that on the big table I use), I don't think the St Ives units would be appropriate for the OP's request for a Liao unit that goes from 3025 - end Jihad.

Karasu · « **Reply #12 on:** 19 March 2018, 10:18:10 »

Quote from: Sartris on 19 March 2018, 09:10:26

3rdFWG was reformed after the Jihad. The original unit first defected to the wobbles and then to Regulus where it was absorbed.

The loss of the Marik Militia regiments really makes this list anemic

It certainly does. On my list, the 1st, 3rd and 4th Marik Protectors are listed as 'Minor Mercenaries' for want of a better term.

I've basically used the entire order of battle for 2765, 2786, 2821, 2830, 2864, 3025, 3050, 3067, 3145 to generate a whole series of comparisons. Unfortunately, I think that's all the dates that have a complete order of battle available at the moment (and 3025's ones are a little light on things like strength and loyalty)

Colt Ward · « **Reply #13 on:** 19 March 2018, 10:21:26 »

They are not really mercenaries, they are more like free agents for what was the League worlds- often the independents.

Karasu · « **Reply #14 on:** 19 March 2018, 10:43:40 »

Yeah. But what else do you call a unit that is not a national (House) unit and working for pay for a faction or factions that isn't a major one? Especially since I give each unit a Mercenary or House identifier...

It really isn't the correct term, but it's the one that works in my spreadsheet.

Sartris · « **Reply #15 on:** 19 March 2018, 10:46:30 »

Quote from: Karasu on 19 March 2018, 10:18:10

It certainly does. On my list, the 1st, 3rd and 4th Marik Protectors are listed as 'Minor Mercenaries' for want of a better term.

I've basically used the entire order of battle for 2765, 2786, 2821, 2830, 2864, 3025, 3050, 3067, 3145 to generate a whole series of comparisons. Unfortunately, I think that's all the dates that have a complete order of battle available at the moment (and 3025's ones are a little light on things like strength and loyalty)

Field Manual: 3085 also has force listings.

Psycho · « **Reply #16 on:** 19 March 2018, 11:13:52 »

Quote from: Karasu on 19 March 2018, 06:16:29

1st, 2nd, 5th, 7th and 8th Sword of Light (That seems wrong...)

The 2nd was de-activated after the jihad due to their Black Dragon connections, and wasn't re-activated until shortly before 3145. I think the others were kept in active service throughout the modern period. I'm not as well versed in the pre-4thSW eras. You'd think *something* had to have happened in the past when we're told the 5 regiments represent the 5 pillars of Combine society in FM:DC, but they're numbered 1, 2, 5, 7, and 8.

Karasu · « **Reply #17 on:** 19 March 2018, 11:25:32 »

Quote from: Sartris on 19 March 2018, 10:46:30

Field Manual: 3085 also has force listings.

Well, there's an excercise for me in the future :)

Karasu · « **Reply #18 on:** 19 March 2018, 11:30:28 »

Quote from: Psycho on 19 March 2018, 11:13:52

The 2nd was de-activated after the jihad due to their Black Dragon connections, and wasn't re-activated until shortly before 3145. I think the others were kept in active service throughout the modern period. I'm not as well versed in the pre-4thSW eras. You'd think *something* had to have happened in the past when we're told the 5 regiments represent the 5 pillars of Combine society in FM:DC, but they're numbered 1, 2, 5, 7, and 8.

According to my notes,

the 3rd were (re?-) raised between 2765 and 2786, but were gone by 2821
the 4th were lost between 2765 and 2786, but re-activated between 3067 and 3145 (as a 6th pillar??)
the 6th has never been seen, so was raised and destroyed during the Age of War

Tai Dai Cultist · « **Reply #19 on:** 19 March 2018, 11:49:33 »

The Pillars thing is probably more of a 3rd SW-born coincidence of there being 5 extant Sword of Light regiments. The legion had 8 standing regiments at the onset of the 1st SW; it's unlikely back then they would've have had 5 tied to a Pillar and 3 stepchild regiments.

In 3145 we have 6 of them again. It's still unclear if some or all of the Sword of Light regiments are still totems of the Pillars of Combine society.

Colt Ward · « **Reply #20 on:** 19 March 2018, 13:33:37 »

Quote from: Karasu on 19 March 2018, 10:43:40

Yeah. But what else do you call a unit that is not a national (House) unit and working for pay for a faction or factions that isn't a major one? Especially since I give each unit a Mercenary or House identifier...

It really isn't the correct term, but it's the one that works in my spreadsheet.

They just cut out the middle man of the FWLM and quatermasters since they take the 'taxes' from those who pay them and buy the equipment/supplies they want.

Deadborder · « **Reply #21 on:** 19 March 2018, 23:44:20 »

Also, Warrior House Ijori was destroyed in the Capellan Crusades and not reactivated until 3134.

Archangel · « **Reply #22 on:** 20 March 2018, 20:20:06 »

Quote from: Deadborder on 19 March 2018, 23:44:20

Also, Warrior House Ijori was destroyed in the Capellan Crusades and not reactivated until 3134.

If I remember correctly wasn't House Kamata also briefly deactivated while they reformed and chose a new House Master (fate chose a new House Master for the and thereby avoided being defeated in one of the failed invasions of the Republic?

Karasu · « **Reply #23 on:** 23 March 2018, 08:34:38 »

By-the-by, the longest lasting mercenary command is the Illician Lancers. It exists in 2786, working for the Steiners, and is still going strong in 3145, but working for the Davions. This is kind-of equalled by the Screaming Eagles, as they still exist as a sub-command by 3145, and were also active in 2786. They never stopped working for Davion, though.