Anyway To Enhance the Effectiveness of Small LRM Launchers?

[Dayton3]

I was wondering if there was any new technology from the 32nd century era that would help enhance the effectiveness of relatively small LRM launchers like the LRM-5s on my Grasshopper.   I suppose I could add an Artemis FCS but it seems like a waste to add a one ton fire control system to a launcher and ammo set up that mass only 3 tons combined.

I was hoping there were something like new types of warheads that could enhance the LRM effectiveness without increasing mass.   

I'm not familiar with anything after the Jihad era (and barely it).

[Kit deSummersville]

Mines are a great way to tell the enemy where you want them to go...and not to go.

People will freak out about the potential of taking 5 points of damage to the leg of their assault 'Mech for some reason.

[JadeHellbringer]

Mines are a great way to tell the enemy where you want them to go...and not to go.

People will freak out about the potential of taking 5 points of damage to the leg of their assault 'Mech for some reason.

And if they show up with vehicles, they'll have legitimate reason to panic about five-point minefield-spam. There aren't many things that ruin a Demolisher's day like a Sling loaded with T-Augs.  ;D

[Weirdo]

Smoke rounds are also fun, especially if that tiny rack is your only long-range weapon, like on the aforementioned Grasshopper. You can use the smoke to cover your approach, reducing the amount of damage you take before getting into your own weapons range. If you're in range but facing multiple enemies, you can lay the smoke to shield you from some of them, leaving clear LOS to the target you want to shoot at.

Be careful about moving directly into your smoke, though. Do that often enough, and people will get the hint that the smoke is telegraphing your planned move for the next turn. Good way to start eating more than your daily recommended allowance of artillery.

If your opponent likes to use indirect LRM fire, dropping smoke in front of a spotter can be a good way to force him to move, vacating a perfectly good spot or degrading the to-hit numbers.

If you play with fire rules and your opponent likes to use conventional units, a mech-heavy force can use incendiary LRMs to flush non-mech units out of woods or buildings.

[Daryk]

And best of all, Smoke LRMs are available in 3025...  ^-^

[Nightsong]

A teammate with a NARC beacon is always a lot of fun when it comes to LRMs.

[Hellraiser]

As mentioned above, the best use for an LRM-5 sniping is to load them with T-Aug or Smoke.

Those 2 ammo types are VERY good at changing the flow of a battle with their "terrain modification" abilities.

[garhkal]

And if they show up with vehicles, they'll have legitimate reason to panic about five-point minefield-spam. There aren't many things that ruin a Demolisher's day like a Sling loaded with T-Augs.  ;D

OR use swarm ammo.

[AJC46]

the best enhancement is to replace it if possible with MML-5 so many more options open up with a MML-5 in place of a LRM-5.  ;D

[Dayton3]

the best enhancement is to replace it if possible with MML-5 so many more options open up with a MML-5 in place of a LRM-5.  ;D

MML's are a piece of hardware that I'm not overly familiar with.

[RoundTop]

MML's are a piece of hardware that I'm not overly familiar with.

MMLs can fire LRM or SRM ammo. So they are great on light designs which normally choose one or the other.
http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Multi-Missile_Launcher

The MML3 is only 1.5t (vs 2t for LRM5), but budget for having 1 more ton of ammo to carry both.
MML5 is 3t.  So as a quick replacement for LRM5+1t ammo, MML3+2t ammo, and find .5t to free up.

MMLs can also carry any LRM or SRM specialty ammo (eg: inferno, semi-guided, smoke, etc).  MML3s with smoke LRMs can do the same as the LRM5 with smoke, but up close use SRMs as well.

[Weirdo]

Not really going to fit in his Grasshopper without extra modding, though. MMLs really need multiple tons of ammo to get the most use it of them. I'd stick to ammo options that work with the existing LRM rack.

There aren't any new ammo types in the Dark Age, your best bet would be to browse Total War and TacOps for ideas.

[monbvol]

If you need some extra anti infantry capability fragmentation would help there, especially on a Grasshopper.

But yeah the real game changers for a LRM-5 have already been mentioned.

[mbear]

MML's are a piece of hardware that I'm not overly familiar with.

You didn't ask, but IMHO the best use of an MML is on designs that have mixed LRM & SRM launchers. If you have a unit with an LRM5 and SRM2, you can drop in an MML5 at no cost in tonnage. Replacing the SRMs with similar MMLs adds just that extra little bit of long range firepower, or alternative munitions if you don't want to give up a lot of firepower. (An MML-5 laid smokescreen is just as effective as a smokescreen from an LRM-15.) One of the best examples of using MMLs to support LRMs is found on the HawkWolf. Two LRM-15s supported by two MML-5s. At short range, the ability to send out some SRMs is useful, but IMHO not really something I'd rely on.

The really nice thing about the MML is that it can use any enhancement available to stock LRM/SRM launchers, and any ammunition type available to them (except torpedoes). So if you want to have an Artemis FCS attached to your MML, you can. Narc compatible ammo? No problem.

The downside is the relatively small size of the racks (largest one has 9 missiles), their weight, and their critical slot requirements. To get the best use out of them you'll need at least two ammo bins, which means two tons and critical slots. (You don't have to do that though, there's at least one design that has a single ton ammo bin. Havoc? Gambit?) The MML-5 seems to be the best in terms of size and weight; As I mentioned earlier you can drop a single MML-5 in any unit that has an LRM-5 and an SRM-2 at no weight penalty.

[Sabelkatten]

I was wondering if there was any new technology from the 32nd century era that would help enhance the effectiveness of relatively small LRM launchers like the LRM-5s on my Grasshopper.   I suppose I could add an Artemis FCS but it seems like a waste to add a one ton fire control system to a launcher and ammo set up that mass only 3 tons combined.

I was hoping there were something like new types of warheads that could enhance the LRM effectiveness without increasing mass.   

I'm not familiar with anything after the Jihad era (and barely it).

Why would you need that? The LRM5 is already the most effective LRM rack unless you really want Artemis on it...

[Dayton3]

Why would you need that? The LRM5 is already the most effective LRM rack unless you really want Artemis on it...

Because the ability to inflict a mere 5 pts. of damage per shot seems rather paltry.  Little more than two medium laser hits.

[Weirdo]

I believe his idea is that many folks who build customs prefer massed LRM-5s over larger racks, since you do the same damage, but at a slight tonnage efficiency.

Also, that five-point group is a lot less than two medium laser hits, since a single laser is also a five-point hit.

[Dayton3]

I believe his idea is that many folks who build customs prefer massed LRM-5s over larger racks, since you do the same damage, but at a slight tonnage efficiency.

Also, that five-point group is a lot less than two medium laser hits, since a single laser is also a five-point hit.

I thought a medium laser was a two point damage per hit?

[Daryk]

Mediums are 5 points of damage and 3 heat... Smalls are 3 damage and 1 heat... not sure where you got 2 damage from.  SRMs do that per missile, and Machine Guns too...

[monbvol]

Multiple smaller racks versus one bigger rack:

Pros:

-Thanks to the volume of fire it does improve the odds of at least one of them hitting thus increasing the minimum damage.
-With Inner Sphere LRMs you do save weight and even criticals
-The ammo works out the same for total number of vollies
-You can not fire some to help control heat
-Lucky criticals are not as big of a deal

Cons:

-You do have to roll more in TW, each one is it's own to hit roll and a cluster hit roll after that so getting the same average damage or maximum damage
-The larger LRM racks are more heat efficient
-Artemis must be applied to all valid launchers or none unless that's been reversed on me again

[CrossfirePilot]

In 3025 I actually like modding mechs that have 1 large rack with multiples of LRM5s.  It usually doesn't create heat problems and for the Atlas it matches the original fluff.  It also allows you to tailor your deliveries. So you don't have to launch an entire salvo of 15 or 20 at that long range light, but you can do 5 or 10 just to let them know you are thinking about them.  The downside is that it does produce more rolling and I have also feel (read no statistical evidence to back that) that you tend to hit with less missiles.

[monbvol]

That is because some of your launchers will miss.

Let's take that Light Mech you just mentioned at Long Range.  Right off we're talking a +4 from range.  Being a Light a +2 seems reasonable.  And you're already at a +6 which means you need to have a pretty good gunner already to even get half of your launchers to hit.  Then each one that does hit still has to roll on the cluster chart.  The most likely outcome is for 3 missiles.  Compared to a 20 rack's 12 that means you'd have to get a bit lucky to match that damage.

[CrossfirePilot]

Yeah except its more likely than not to miss.  But even up close.  The damage probably evens out. But instead of missing one turn and hitting the next it is more likely to be hitting 2/4 launchers every turn.

[RunandFindOut]

It's all statistics really, the more rolls you make the more chances you have.  You're doing about the same amount of damage overall between the two, one is just doing the damage as a steady stream of more small hits.  While the other does more damage when it hits but hits or misses once in the same time the other option gives you four chances to do so. 

[monbvol]

There are a lot of variables involved in this to be sure but the important thing to remember is it takes big rack/LRM-5 hits to keep damage the same.  That pretty well assures for the same to hit numbers the bigger rack will actually have a better average damage over time.

[Colt Ward]

NARC is the biggest thing, after DHS IMO its the best upgrade to forces running 3025 tech after 3050.  It can make the Archers, Catapults and Crusaders that you have put out more damage without having to do any sort of upgrade work on those machines- problem is canon NARC launchers are rather limited.  For some reason its a piece of equipment TPTB sort of forgot as time went on.  IMO it honestly should have gone on Jenners and other 30-40 ton scout/electronics mechs.  For the 3050s before the proliferation of ECM the Jihad encouraged it would have been extremely useful.  But its not just mechs, its also neglected on the wheeled/hovercraft scouts.

[Alsadius]

I think semi-guided rounds are in many ways the natural evolution of Narc. They serve the same purpose, are equally compatible, but the TAG is lighter than the Narc launcher and compatible with more other weapon types, and SG rounds get better bonuses. Narc is a bit of a dead end, even with the alternate ammo types(because tbh, none of them are very impressive).

[Colt Ward]

Except Semi-G is not as widely available as NARC capable munitions, or available at all when NARC comes on the scene.  Nor does Semi-G work for SRMs.

[Alsadius]

Except Semi-G is not as widely available as NARC capable munitions, or available at all when NARC comes on the scene.  Nor does Semi-G work for SRMs.

I know Narc comes on the scene sooner, which is why I refer to SG as the evolution of it, not as something that's purely better. I do agree that the SRM side is better served by Narc, but in practice, Streak is better still. Most people will just go Streak if they want to boost their SRMs. Narc SRMs would mostly be used in MML tubes in 3080, I'd wager, because there's no Streak MMLs.

[Colt Ward]

See, I am one of the people that prefer regular SRMs for the simple reason that I can vary the ammo type- inferno being the key difference IMO.  You can also get more SRM launchers for the weight of SSRM launchers.

Additionally Semi-G ammunition is three times the cost of regular LRM ammo while NARC is just twice the cost.  The cost for not being in the League after the Jihad trying to get that ammo is going to ratchet the cost up even more.  Before the Jihad, to get Semi-G you had to be a unit with good standing in the FWLM or a Blakist . . . after the Jihad its still going to be harder to find and cost way more than NARC ammo.

Finally, as pointed out that NARC launcher is going to make your LRM AND SRM launchers more effective which is why I said after DHS for 3025 designs makes it ideal for force improvement.