BattleTech - The Board Game of Armored Combat
BattleTech Game Systems => Ground Combat => Topic started by: Col Toda on 09 January 2020, 09:16:25
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Available all Eras but almost never seen on canon units . I put it on a custom pegasus scout . How often you seen it used???
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One-off missions? never.
A regular ongoing campaign? All the time.
It's only available on the Boomerang Spotter Plane, the Lexan Surveilance VTOL, and the SeaBuster Strike Fighter, but it is an essential part of battle information for any mercenary force IMO. Each of those units are still only close to 2 million C-Bills, with the cheapest -- the Boomerang Spotter Plane -- being less than 85,000 c-bills.
If the Boomerang saves you only a ton of armor by not being surprise attacked only once in its entire lifetime before being shot down, it's almost paid for itself right then and there.
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I put it on custom designs all the time. A half-ton, 3025-era TAG? Color me sold! :thumbsup:
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In campaign, we use the vehicle design rules to make UAVs. There is no reason to keep BT in the 1980s.
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I had a nice 35 ton scout unit that uses them, even though I have it fluffed as a late SLDF Royal limited run unit. Worked really really well under the old recon camera rules. Don't know about the new revised TAG like rules... just don't like that change one bit... :ticked: :bang: :crash:
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If the Boomerang saves you only a ton of armor by not being surprise attacked only once in its entire lifetime before being shot down, it's almost paid for itself right then and there.
I bought a couple for my 3rd Crucis Lancers Task Force in the 3040 era. We still count Boomerang as conventional fighters (because that's what the TRO and RS say it is and always was) and following that ruling, the thing is a beast (okay a puppy beast). Put a drop tank under it and it has great range (SO rules for fuel consumption, of course) and it can even drop a single bomb or attack with a Rocket Pod.
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I like Recon Cameras. They're good to mount externally on aircraft to make them spotters. I also use them on faster units to make them better spotters and as replacements for TAG. Sometimes even in addition to TAG.
I bought a couple for my 3rd Crucis Lancers Task Force in the 3040 era. We still count Boomerang as conventional fighters (because that's what the TRO and RS say it is and always was) and following that ruling, the thing is a beast (okay a puppy beast). Put a drop tank under it and it has great range (SO rules for fuel consumption, of course) and it can even drop a single bomb or attack with a Rocket Pod.
What version of the Boomerang are you using? The one in TRO:3039 doesn't have hard points. It's built using support vehicle rules and doesn't have any mounted.
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Phoenixstorm: What old rules are you talking about, exactly? ???
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What version of the Boomerang are you using? The one in TRO:3039 doesn't have hard points. It's built using support vehicle rules and doesn't have any mounted.
As mentioned, we still count them as being a Conventional Fighter, since that's the chapter its printed under in TRO and RS 3039 and I started playing BT before Support Vehicles were a thing.
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As mentioned, we still count them as being a Conventional Fighter, since that's the chapter its printed under in TRO and RS 3039 and I started playing BT before Support Vehicles were a thing.
Ah Ok. Missed that. Thanks. :)
Me too although I never quite figured out how they figured the Cruise/Flank Speed in TRO:3025.
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Probably just ruled it. The original TRO 3025 doesn't seem to have had a fully fledged out Aerospace rule set as foundation. Just my guess, though. :)
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TRO:3025 Aerospace units used Aerospace 1. So that's not the problem. The Boomerang seems to be based on ground vehicle rules. Besides Cruise/Flank Speeds, there's the armor locations: Front, Rear, Sides, Turret, and it has an internal structure. I want to say they used the VTOL construction rules but that doesn't work because of the lift factor. I wonder if they wanted propeller aircraft treated differently from Jet and Aerospace Fighters but left the rules out.
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Phoenixstorm: What old rules are you talking about, exactly? ???
The one that doesn't treat recon cameras as a poor mans TAG. Meaning you have to roll the dice when using RC the same way you do with TAG.
This ruling has changed from previous errata versions.
An aerospace unit with a Recon Camera that is between Altitudes 5 and 10 on the Low Altitude map gains the ability to either spot for LRM indirect fire or artillery, or attempt to reveal hidden units. In either case, it may not make any other attacks while attempting to do so. For an aerospace unit to spot, the base to-hit number to designate a target is the pilot’s Gunnery Skill +2. The target must be on the ground mapsheet that corresponds to the camera unit’s atmospheric hex.If the aerospace unit is attempting to reveal hidden units (see p. 259, TW), during the Movement Phase of any turn where the camera unit passes over a ground mapsheet that corresponds to its atmospheric hex and contains a hidden unit hostile to its force, the hidden unit may be revealed. The hidden unit’ s controlling player must roll 2D6 for each such hidden unit. The target number is 9, plus any applicable terrain modifiers; for submerged units, apply a +1 terrain modifier per depth past 1. Rolling equal to or higher than the target number immediately reveals that hidden unit to the camera unit.
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The one that doesn't treat recon cameras as a poor mans TAG. Meaning you have to roll the dice when using RC the same way you do with TAG.
That rule applies to Aerospace units.
This ruling has changed from previous errata versions.
An aerospace unit with a Recon Camera that is between Altitudes 5 and 10 on the Low Altitude map gains the ability to either spot for LRM indirect fire or artillery, or attempt to reveal hidden units. In either case, it may not make any other attacks while attempting to do so. For an aerospace unit to spot, the base to-hit number to designate a target is the pilot’s Gunnery Skill +2. The target must be on the ground mapsheet that corresponds to the camera unit’s atmospheric hex. If the aerospace unit is attempting to reveal hidden units (see p. 259, TW), during the Movement Phase of any turn where the camera unit passes over a ground mapsheet that corresponds to its atmospheric hex and contains a hidden unit hostile to its force, the hidden unit may be revealed. The hidden unit’ s controlling player must roll 2D6 for each such hidden unit. The target number is 9, plus any applicable terrain modifiers; for submerged units, apply a +1 terrain modifier per depth past 1. Rolling equal to or higher than the target number immediately reveals that hidden unit to the camera unit.
I think its because even if you see it you still have to get the coordinates right.
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What RifleMech said...
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Forgot a section
For ground units, a Recon Camera instead allows the unit to act as a spotter for LRM indirect fire (see p. 111, TW) against a single target per turn and still make a weapon attack or spot for artillery (at normal visual ranges) with no additional to-hit penalty. To spot for LRM indirect fire, the unit must ‘hit’ the target using the same rules and ranges as TAG as appropriate for that unit.
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Right, those are the TAG-like rules I thought you were talking about...
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Yeah they are TAG like but you still have to send the right coordinates.
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Just started a 3036 campaign . Recon camera and 2 medium lasers on my Cicada Recon lance units . Will know how well it works in 2 weeks . Corporate unit rotates out units to get CASE factory refits . Something gets reintroduced getting it out there is important
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That rule applies to Aerospace units.
I think its because even if you see it you still have to get the coordinates right.
The roll for LRM spotting from the air is only gunnery+2? That doesn't sound bad at all.
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Just started a 3036 campaign . Recon camera and 2 medium lasers on my Cicada Recon lance units . Will know how well it works in 2 weeks . Corporate unit rotates out units to get CASE factory refits . Something gets reintroduced getting it out there is important
Cool... I'll certainly be looking for updates on how it's working out for you.
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Those things give me pause. As currently written they seem a bit overpowered no? I haven't reviewed the last errata, but you could mount one on a mast mount on a VTOL, and have a +1 to hit on your indirect LRMs using standard ammo in 3025 play right? :o I love the idea, but they would seem to need a bit of a Nerf.
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No nerf required... a to hit roll is involved already.
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Doesn't it make Semi-Guided LRMs obsolete before they even hit the field? Why develop them if you could get a similar effect with regular (cheaper) LRM ammo using much simpler tech than involved in the development of a TAG unit?
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Competing technologies are developed all the time... and Recon Cameras never went out of production, so there's plenty of Succession War goodness that could happen before Semi-Guided come around.
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And SG LRMs remove the TMM of the target if TAG is successful. There is a reason there is BV cost for each ton of SG ammo, it's a definitive upgrade.
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Anyone see recon cameras installed on buildings ?
Anyone see recon cameras put on an Airship ?
I could see either . But at traffic circles or intersections for civil defense does make sense .
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Yes and Yes. If just used to monitor traffic I think a regular vid camera would work for that.
I think it's a shame that the range for ground units is so limited. I would think under double blind rules the range would be a lot longer. Like it'd add so many hexes to the range a unit can see.
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Why would you put recon cameras in buildings? You gain no benefit, because if the building has a camera, the crew can spot just as well as the camera can.
There are multiple canon airships with recon cameras.
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One of my characters was dropped onto a Clan-occupied world and planted recon cameras in traffic lights, signs, everywhere enemy units would travel. Sometimes you can't just place them in plain sight.
Eventually gaining access to Clan facilities as a janitor, it was obvious how lax they were about security, eventually every office was bugged, documents copied, computers hacked...because the old guy pushing a mop and emptying their trash cans was never even noticed.
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You put Recon Cameras on buildings with Drone equipment controlled with the Drone Control equipment in the same civil defense bunker as the communication equipment that monitors the remote sensor network . You can even hard wire it with fiberoptic cables so ECM does not screw with it . Not as good as Stealth battle armor spotting but less life loss and more time consuming to uproot and destroy
It also has the advantage of being in place not caught going from one building to the next . I like saying the round a corner and get peppered by indirect fire from trailers 3 streets over .
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>:D