Clan Nova Cat - Zombie Catgirl Extravaganza

[cmerwin]

One is fighting for survival and relevance while the other is taking the slow nation building route

This!

If only we had parlayed with the Bears. If only they had actually listened.

Although, to be honest, I think we were only fighting for survival *because* of the choices we made as a Clan. Choices that our Khans made to fulfill the Great Father's vision. We went forward believing that those choices were RIGHT. Those choices were the fulfillment of Clan belief.


Then we were betrayed by: our sister and brother Clans (except the Snow Ravens and Diamond Sharks), then the Ghost Bears, then the Draconis Combine, the 2nd Star League, and pretty much everyone else after that (we'll see how the Mariks &/or the ilKhan treat us).

Kev Rosse (RIP), Rikkard, Kisho, and anyone else claiming Nova Cat descendency - and each of us - has every right to be angry as hell.

[parable]

(In sincere curiosity, because I don't remember and I don't see it on Sarna - how did the Bears vote regarding our Abjuration? For or Against?)

@parable - I think you've nailed it.

IIRC (though I do not always recall correctly), the vote for abjuration was unanimous.  Star Adder wanted to annihilate us but were shot down.

As for the Ghost Bears in general?  I think they were stung not solely because of our betrayal of the others of Kerensky's chosen, but because we were a dark mirror to them.  The Ghost Bears crusaded to advance a warden cause, the Nova Cats were crusaders until circumstances turned us warden.  We allowed ourselves to be subsumed into an IS power, they ruled theirs.  For the deeply conservative Ghost Bears, Clan Nova Cat was a perfect foe because we represented all the things they saw as weakness.  It also feels somewhat one-sided, with CGB holding animosity against their 'traitor' neighbors, while CNC is still working out how to recover from a genocide.

In another world, the Clan that doesn't treat old age as a liability and the one that still has family systems, both Clans preferring swift tactical strikes, both Clans liking to take their time and wait for the perfect time to strike, both Clans deciding to merge with the IS quickly after the Invasion...in that world, the Nova Cats and the Ghost Bears could've been brothers.  But alas, we were everything CGB hated and we were -right there- and we know if angered sufficiently the Bears go berserk...
Clan Nova Cat would never not come into conflict with Clan Ghost Bear.

[Jellico]

IIRC (though I do not always recall correctly), the vote for abjuration was unanimous.  Star Adder wanted to annihilate us but were shot down.

As for the Ghost Bears in general?  I think they were stung not solely because of our betrayal of the others of Kerensky's chosen, but because we were a dark mirror to them.  The Ghost Bears crusaded to advance a warden cause, the Nova Cats were crusaders until circumstances turned us warden.  We allowed ourselves to be subsumed into an IS power, they ruled theirs.  For the deeply conservative Ghost Bears, Clan Nova Cat was a perfect foe because we represented all the things they saw as weakness.  It also feels somewhat one-sided, with CGB holding animosity against their 'traitor' neighbors, while CNC is still working out how to recover from a genocide.

In another world, the Clan that doesn't treat old age as a liability and the one that still has family systems, both Clans preferring swift tactical strikes, both Clans liking to take their time and wait for the perfect time to strike, both Clans deciding to merge with the IS quickly after the Invasion...in that world, the Nova Cats and the Ghost Bears could've been brothers.  But alas, we were everything CGB hated and we were -right there- and we know if angered sufficiently the Bears go berserk...
Clan Nova Cat would never not come into conflict with Clan Ghost Bear.

Yeah nah. You are over thinking it.
Real world. Bear players didn't have any particular feelings about the Nova Cats. Maybe traitors? That is about it. Then Trial of Retribution happened and there was a collective WTF?

Over the following decades the gaps have been filled in. The Bears had three WarShips taken out by TF Serpent as collateral damage of the Nova Cat's actions. That is a good place to start with the hard feelings. As the Cats were Abjured there was no reason to show mercy in the 1st DC war. For all of Path of Glory, the Cats are again on the side of the IS power attacking a Clan.

From here on in geography takes control. Who else can the Nova Cats take their frustrations out on? It is a narrative trap. From the Bear point of view you can't hit the Nova Cats because that will bring in the DC. The Cats can't get respect because they are the vassal of the DC, so they are going to keep coming at the Bears. Any time Bears get the chance (2nd DC War) they are going to try and make the problem go away.

I don't like the situation; it is frustrating because there is no way out of it short of opening a third front, and that isn't happening at Irece Prefecture. That or genocide, which is where we ended up. The Cats were probably better off leaving wholesale for the Republic. The Clan Protectorate offers them many more narrative options.

[ANS Kamas P81]

Assuming they ever get there...

[Kerfuffin(925)]

Sarna said Warden Clans out a stop to Annihilation, which would have inncluded the Ghost Bears at the time. But sarna says the abjuration vote was unanimous (not contested).

[Dragon Cat]

Assuming they ever get there...

I think if the Nova Cats chose to leave after the 2nd War which who could have blames them the Republic would have supported them in the fluff of the big pocket warship (I cannot for the life of me think ot the name) the Republic reportedly deployed them as peacekeepers after the 2nd War

Now we know this couldn't have happened as the Nova Cats were still there in the DA but should history have been different the Republic had more than enough firepower to escort them away

If the timeline had been written in order (I.e no MWDA) maybe that would have happened but AFAIK the fluff of the 2nd War was written post DA era stuff

[cmerwin]

Sarna said Warden Clans out a stop to Annihilation, which would have inncluded the Ghost Bears at the time. But sarna says the abjuration vote was unanimous (not contested).

Cheers, you're absolutely right. My brain wanted to remember that but didn't look hard enough.

Still, in the context of the situation, it's hard to imagine anything *more* Warden than a Khan uttering the sentences:


"The Star League is come to oppose us. The question is not whether we can stand against them, but if we should stand against them." After having just reminded the ilKhan and the entire Clan Council that the Nova Cats has ever been to preserve the ideals of the Star League.


Yet, somehow, the audacity of being more Warden than the Wardens was enough for unanimous Abjuration.

[Tyler Jorgensson]

Something I put in the Fan Tribble was ‘what if the Ghost Bears stage a Trial of Absorption on the Nova Cats as they flee Clan Space and try to settle in the DC?’ Militarily the Bears had twice the Clusters but the Navies were more balanced.

That being said: Jellico hits the nail on the head. 100%

[cmerwin]

From here on in geography takes control. Who else can the Nova Cats take their frustrations out on? It is a narrative trap. From the Bear point of view you can't hit the Nova Cats because that will bring in the DC. The Cats can't get respect because they are the vassal of the DC, so they are going to keep coming at the Bears. Any time Bears get the chance (2nd DC War) they are going to try and make the problem go away.

I agree with most of this, and I think it paints a fair view of the Bears relations. However, I think there is one aspect that is missed that is important, one that places the Cats in a hard place. The Nova Cats saw themselves first and foremost as rejoining the Star League, we just *happened* to have been given planets in the Combine to govern, in exchange for mutual military cooperation.


Maybe it was our naivete about IS politics (we were duped by the Black Dragon Society too late), maybe it was honest misunderstanding ("Thanks for the worlds, we're happy to help, but we report to the Star League, not the Coordinator") between the Cats and the Combine ("You govern our worlds, therefore you are honor bound to fight for the Dragon").


I think your statement that from the Bears perspective, it's "Nova Cats, you continue to be a problem, we are going to make that problem go away...dezgra" is 100% on the money.

[parable]

Maybe it was our naivete about IS politics (we were duped by the Black Dragon Society too late), maybe it was honest misunderstanding ("Thanks for the worlds, we're happy to help, but we report to the Star League, not the Coordinator") between the Cats and the Combine ("You govern our worlds, therefore you are honor bound to fight for the Dragon").

This is what I get from how things went.  The Dracs wanted a semi-autonomous subject that can govern planets and serve as an assault force, CNC wanted to form an enclave within the IS while still remaining Clan and self-determining, betting on their hosts' honor and adherence to bushido. 

A dumb move for us, considering our generally -pragmatic- interpretation of zellbrigen and the fact that we were genocided (several million killed with no quarter during the truce period of the Abjuration counts, IMO) when we tried to join the second Star League should have made us a little more careful, honestly. 

for some off-topic CNC, I posted some (terrible) pics of my Nova Cat minis on the miniatures board.

[cmerwin]

for some off-topic CNC, I posted some (terrible) pics of my Nova Cat minis on the miniatures board.

Nice! Working on my Alpha Galaxy. Like that you chose Sigma Galaxy! Great work!

[Spirit Cat Refugee]

New Shrapnel just dropped, has a short Nova Cat story in it.

Sounds like from the brief it has to do with the Nova Cat Rebellion...

[Jaim Magnus]

New Shrapnel just dropped, has a short Nova Cat story in it.

Sounds like from the brief it has to do with the Nova Cat Rebellion...

It might at that...

[Rncavenger]

 Yes. It's about the Nova Cats rebellion. To be more precise, about its very end. About a desperate battle with no chance of victory with a nuclear strike at the end. Judging by the text, the order for the complete destruction of Nova Cats was not given by Torunaga, but personally by Yori Kurita. From the more positive: Irice was without aerospace support because everything that was left went with Kisho. The story also mentions Star Colonel Cox Devalis. And he is also on some unknown task. Maybe the same with Kisho.

[ds9guy]

That is exciting news.  I look forward to reading the story. :thumbsup:

[Wrangler]

Shrapnel #12 has the last moments of the Nova Cat's struggles on Irene.

[Jaim Magnus]

I mean, I think it's pretty good, but I might be slightly biased.

[Angrii]

I mean, I think it's pretty good, but I might be slightly biased.

It was. And I really  enjoyed the Elemental PoV; we don't get that enough IMO.

[Rncavenger]

I mean, I think it's pretty good, but I might be slightly biased.

Yes, it's pretty good  :).  One question if you can answer. Is the minor mention of Cox Devalis an element of fanservice towards a forgotten character of the Dark Age Era? Or is there some other story behind it?

[Jaim Magnus]

Yes, it's pretty good  :).  One question if you can answer. Is the minor mention of Cox Devalis an element of fanservice towards a forgotten character of the Dark Age Era? Or is there some other story behind it?

I'm not privy to higher decision making. For me it was more a nod to a character from the Dark Age. If the PTBs wish to do more, that'd be cool too.

[Geg]

Yes. It's about the Nova Cats rebellion. To be more precise, about its very end. About a desperate battle with no chance of victory with a nuclear strike at the end. Judging by the text, the order for the complete destruction of Nova Cats was not given by Torunaga, but personally by Yori Kurita. From the more positive: Irice was without aerospace support because everything that was left went with Kisho. The story also mentions Star Colonel Cox Devalis. And he is also on some unknown task. Maybe the same with Kisho.

Torunaga could have been ordering the strikes her name.  So she, not he, took the fall out from the use of Nukes. I really hope this conflict gets fully fleshed out formally in the near future.

[Kerfuffin(925)]

That would be a solid edition to the upcoming Brush Wars reboot

[Spirit Cat Refugee]

I'm not privy to higher decision making. For me it was more a nod to a character from the Dark Age. If the PTBs wish to do more, that'd be cool too.

Makes me wonder just how many Spirit Cats went back to Clan Nova Cat versus went to Marik, vs stayed in the Republic. We know all three happened.

[Geg]

Makes me wonder just how many Spirit Cats went back to Clan Nova Cat versus went to Marik, vs stayed in the Republic. We know all three happened.

There is a non-zero amount (no-Kisho) of Nova/Spirit Cats that escaped from the DC to end up on Marik as well.

[Istal_Devalis]

That would be a solid edition to the upcoming Brush Wars reboot

One can hope. Bittersweet as it is, a faction's death should have more then 2 pages dedicated to it.

[WONC]

One can hope. Bittersweet as it is, a faction's death should have more then 2 pages dedicated to it.

This is the same thought that goes through my head whenever I see someone complaining about how their faction, that got a whole sourcebook/novel/whatever devoted to them, got done dirty in some way. At least they got the luxury of being able to nitpick the details. But I digress as apparently some wounds are still a bit more raw than I initially thought they were.

[tassa_kay]

One can hope. Bittersweet as it is, a faction's death should have more then 2 pages dedicated to it.

If it makes narrative sense, sure. The Steel Vipers were Annihilated in the span of 2 pages, and by every metric, they were vastly more important to the narrative than the Nova Cats. That said, the entire conflict between Yori/Toranaga and Emi/Katana/Nova Cats definitely could use a little more fleshing out. That whole conflict really didn't sit right with me because it just felt like the writers were trying to clear the deck for the Combine to invade the FedSuns, and wasted a lot of well-written characters to make that happen.

[Jellico]

How about a different metric. The term "Nova Cat" shows up 29 times and "Spirit Cat" 6 times in BattleTech Legends. Kisho even gets an entry.
The Sea Foxes / Diamond Sharks get 13 including Petr Kalasa.
The Jags get 19.
The Ravens get nothing.
The Horses get 4 passing references.
The Bears / Dominion / Rasalhague get 7 and the only entry is for the pirate Abdoun Ricol with 3 of those references.

Now the point I am making isn't Legend's is the most important book ever. Rather it notices the nails that stick up, and though they haven't got a book, the Cats have shown up and been involved a lot.

[tassa_kay]

Now the point I am making isn't Legend's is the most important book ever.

I certainly hope not, because that book is rife with errors.  :D

[Rncavenger]

If it makes narrative sense, sure. The Steel Vipers were Annihilated in the span of 2 pages, and by every metric, they were vastly more important to the narrative than the Nova Cats.

Not a completely correct example, since Steel Vipers played a major role throughout the Wars of Reaving. And their annihilation is the endgame of this book.
For comparison, Nova Cats were destroyed in two pages in the first half of the Era Report. One of the pages is the prehistory of the uprising, the other is the entire uprising, including the final battle. Not even a single  CNC cluster was mentioned. After that, even the characters of Kurita do not remember about this uprising. Among the important epochs of Torunaga's life before the defeat of the Davions was the hunting of pirates on the border worlds. He didn't even remember about the genocide of an entire clan before his death. An insignificant episode.

Regarding Kisho and the number of mentions of Cats in Legends. This is fine, but it has not yet found any embodiment in products. Kisho is the only hero of Ilclan era who has not yet appeared in any source.  Well, we are waiting for what will happen next. However, I don't know what to expect because at the moment there are no officially announced books. And I'm not talking about Nova Cats, but in general about the IlClan era.

At this moment I am glad that at least small materials with an emphasis on Nova/Spirit cat have finally begun to appear. Description of the Spirit Cats unit in one Shrapnel, a good story about the last battle for Irice in the last. And from this story we even learned the name of one of the Nova Cats clusters that participated in the uprising. Already a huge progress compared to what it was.