Are Fully Articulated Hands of Any Advantage in Combat?

[Dayton3]

I could be wrong but from game playing perspective, it seems as long as you have something on the end of your mechs arm like a weapons pod to pound on an enemy mech then articulated hands offer no advantages.

[Maniac Actual]

Generally speaking, no, your right.  OTOH, you can pick up a club with a hand, and you don't suffer minus's to your punch attacks with a hand either.  And the rules from Tac Ops ad more fun stuff to do with hands as well.  I mean, throwintg some pore schumk in his BA suit?  Friggin' awesome@   O0

[Weirdo]

Improvised clubs. Handheld weapons pods. Picking up and throwing enemies. Picking up and keeping salvage/loot. Picking up loose women. Grabbing turrets. Grabbing enemies. Climbing. Basic diplomacy.

Lots of things you can do with a hand. All else fails, it can also absorb a crit meant for a gun or ammo slot.

[Kobold]

All else fails, it can also absorb a crit meant for a gun or ammo slot.

This alone is probably worth the price of admission, though I admit in a campaign with resource tracking, repairing a busted hand would be pretty low on my list of priorities to spend money and parts on.

[Weirdo]

Hands also let you get plenty of peacetime use out of your mechs. Useful for improving the public perception of your unit, or giving your pilots a chance to keep their skills sharp while the public gets a direct return on their tax money, or for a merc unit on garrison(or between contracts) to gain a little extra cash on the side.

[gleamingterrier]

Don't forget hand signals for communication (Wasn't that a thread in the last month?).

[Charlie Tango]

Hands also let you get plenty of peacetime use out of your mechs. Useful for improving the public perception of your unit, or giving your pilots a chance to keep their skills sharp while the public gets a direct return on their tax money, or for a merc unit on garrison(or between contracts) to gain a little extra cash on the side.

Want to help the local population?  Battlemechs with hands are good at getting rid of those nasty deep-dug in trees or large boulders in the new field a farmer wants to open up. 

Constructing your base (or for that matter civilian buildings) goes a lot faster with 'Mechs with hands doing the heavy lifting.

How about clearing the rubble you just caused of a city to help to look for survivors?

Yeah, in combat, not so much.  Out of Combat (where most of your time is spent anyway)...

[Ouchies]

Want to help the local population?  Battlemechs with hands are good at getting rid of those nasty deep-dug in trees or large boulders in the new field a farmer wants to open up. 

Constructing your base (or for that matter civilian buildings) goes a lot faster with 'Mechs with hands doing the heavy lifting.

How about clearing the rubble you just caused of a city to help to look for survivors?

Yeah, in combat, not so much.  Out of Combat (where most of your time is spent anyway)...

I concur.  The advantage of the battlemech's hands is its ability to help with various logistical concerns- carrying freight, repairing infrastructure, personal maintenance, clearing roads, building improvised defenses, recovering wrecks/pilots, etc.

[cray]

I was going to jump in an extol the combat advantages of hands and their non-combat utility, but everyone's summed it up. So, +1.

There's also a question of basic design concepts. A 'Mech is, yes, primarily defined by its legs. The all-terrain mobility advantages of a BattleMech are, really, its defining feature. But hands are a significant part, too. If you delete hand actuators, there's no sense wasting a lot of expensive and complicated articulation on what are basically fancy turrets (arms) when you could reduce a 'Mech to a cheaper, simpler walking tank (like the Goliath, especially if torso turret optional rules are used.) And then you have a war machine that's missing a lot of the utility of 'Mechs: giant arms and hands get things done that tanks cannot accomplish.

Like Elemental tossing. :)

[Matti]

Hey, can 'Mech with hands reload ammo for another 'Mech? Well... that could be done by J-27 equipped with Lift Hoist...

Like Elemental tossing. :)

One 'Mech throws Elemental at another 'Mech which is holding a bat ( = club) }:)

[Weirdo]

Hey, can 'Mech with hands reload ammo for another 'Mech?

Yes. See TacOps. 8)

[garhkal]

Hey, can 'Mech with hands reload ammo for another 'Mech? Well... that could be done by J-27 equipped with Lift Hoist...

One 'Mech throws Elemental at another 'Mech which is holding a bat ( = club) }:)

Na..  Elemental Cornhole!

[misterpants]

Don't forget hand signals for communication (Wasn't that a thread in the last month?).

"Sir, we've received a response to our demand that they surrender, hand signal only."

[Pa Weasley]

Na..  Elemental Cornhole!

Wouldn't that require mech scale red solo cups to hold in the other hand?

[gleamingterrier]

"Sir, we've received a response to our demand that they surrender, hand signal only."

A sentiment that is not without historical precedent.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Bulge#Bastogne

[Sockmonkey]

IIRC mech hands aren't really fully articulated. For instance, you couldn't use mech-scale chopsticks or anything especially dexterous like that.
It's more like a powered clamp with seperate fingers.
Individual digits allow for a better grip by conforming to the object held even if the fingers aren't individually actuated.
I'd compare it to a bear or raccoon front paw. You can pick stuff up and push yourself up off the ground with it.
Allthough I imagine that many would mod the middle fingers to be seperately mobile for the reasons peviouslt stated.

[Charlie Tango]

"Sir, we've received a response to our demand that they surrender, hand signal only."

+1

Someone should so steal that for a signature...

[misterpants]

Now I have in mind a fluff piece for unauthorized 'mech movement circuit boards, eventually leading to warbooks including a gesture database.

[cold1]

Na..  Elemental Cornhole!

Those mech hands better be real useful if the elemental survives cuz if he does I think the pilot will be living in the cockpit for a while lest he be Hulk smashed into itty bitty squishy pieces.

But seriously, I put together a lance of mercs (the IS is not really my favorite thing) and had 2 requirements; designs that are available throughout the timeline and designs with hands.  They seem more practical.

[MadCapellan]

I'm a huge proponent of the values of hands on BattleMechs, and TacOps is the hand-fan's best friend!

There are simply so many things you can do with hands....

They help you 'Mech stand up more easily from a fall.... (TacOps,  pg.25)
They can be used to climb up steeper cliffs than a 'Mech can normally traverse....(TacOps, pg.22)
They can be used to crawl to cover if you've suffered leg damage....(TacOps, pg.20)
You may pick up enemy equipment and steal it in a raid.....
You may pick up friendly equipment and evacuate it easily in the event of an enemy surprise attack.....
You may pick up an enemy's blown off limb and beat him with it for extra humiliation factor.....
You may pick up ProtoMechs, battle armor and small vehicles and throw them...... (TacOps pg.92)
You may drag a valuable but damaged friendly unit off the field to prevent it's capture.... (TacOps pg.99)
They may be used to grab and grapple an enemy unit, preventing it's escape or to prevent it from effectively using it's weapons...... (TacOps pg.90)
And finally, the presence of hands allows a 'Mech to have a basic Omni-like capacity via it's own ability to lift hand-held weapons.  Close combat 'Mech need the ability to attack at a distance?  Handheld LRM racks.  Conventional 'Mech need a weapon it can use underwater?  Handheld torpedos.  Need an artillery spotter?  Handheld TAG.  Need a minefield?  Handheld Thunder-LRM launcher, etc.

And you get ALL THIS for ZERO tons and just ONE critical slot!  Quite frankly, the hand can be one of the most useful pieces of equipment on a 'Mech, and my preference is always to have at least one, if not both.

[SteveRestless]

+1

Someone should so steal that for a signature...

Done!

[Thatguybil]

IIRC mech hands aren't really fully articulated. For instance, you couldn't use mech-scale chopsticks or anything especially dexterous like that.
It's more like a powered clamp with seperate fingers.
Individual digits allow for a better grip by conforming to the object held even if the fingers aren't individually actuated.
I'd compare it to a bear or raccoon front paw. You can pick stuff up and push yourself up off the ground with it.
Allthough I imagine that many would mod the middle fingers to be seperately mobile for the reasons peviouslt stated.

Novel fluff would say otherwise, but novel fluff is just that fluff.

The technical manual has some pretty amazing things to say about the DI and the large amounts of decentralized sensors and relays built into a mech to enable mechs to... Well be mechs.

Running,  walking, skipping, dodging through a forest over broken terrain is likely no more complicated then wielding mech size chop sticks. :)

[misterpants]

Solaris VII needs mech-scale knife games.

[Alain Dumont]

They allow you to hold 'Mech-scale boomboxes.    O0

[cray]

IIRC mech hands aren't really fully articulated. For instance, you couldn't use mech-scale chopsticks or anything especially dexterous like that.

Nope, some actuators are that dexterous. The waldoes in the cockpit (see Tech Manual's description of hand actuator interfaces) allow pretty decent mimicry of MechWarrior hand gestures - up to and including chopsticks. An Awesome's giant clamp might not be good for playing on a giant piano, but a Griffin or BattleMaster can accomplish impressive feats of manual dexterity.

[misterpants]

They allow you to hold 'Mech-scale boomboxes.    O0

"So what did they hire you for? Cadre duty? Garrison? Riot control?"

"Nope. Bitchin' block parties  [rockon]"

[Atlas3060]

+1

Someone should so steal that for a signature...

That's it! Challenge the Clans to rock-paper-scissors in 3050! A good portion of the 'Mechs didn't have hands so the Inner Sphere would win!

[Kit deSummersville]

You may pick up BattleMechs, ProtoMechs, battle armor and small vehicles and throw them...... (TacOps pg.92)

a Griffin or BattleMaster can accomplish impressive feats of manual dexterity.

The Shadow Hawk was know for its dextrous hands.

[misterpants]

The Shadow Hawk was know for its dextrous hands.

TWSS?

[Medron Pryde]

That's it! Challenge the Clans to rock-paper-scissors in 3050! A good portion of the 'Mechs didn't have hands so the Inner Sphere would win!

Why oh WHY did we NEVER see something like THIS in the books!

 ;D

 O:-)