Clan Jade Falcon III: Admittedly, We May Have Falconed a Little Too Hard

[Gaiiten]

It would be the best, if Jiyi Chistu and Stephanie Chistu fight a Trial for the senior Khanship of the Falcons.

IHMO Jiyi would be the better choice.

[Metallgewitter]

Again, cannot technically Terran Falcons derive genetic material for new Sibkos from literally the warriors left ? (As was the case from the first Generation of Trueborns after the second exodus). Also when they get contact with the Sudeten Falcons, assuming all is nice, again, cannot they get copies of the genetic stock from them ?

They probably have done that already but for one it seems as if none of the Terran Clans have the necessary iron wombs and laboratories to even start new sibkos.
Second it will take 16 years for the first sibko to even be able to aprticipate in trials of position (or to be thrown right into the first battle)
And not to forget the Falcons on Terra are supposed to become the body guard of the First Lord. I would suspect that widespread creation of Falcon sibkos will be a no no to not dilute their role.  We might see more mixing of Falcon and Wolf genes though. And again, every dead clan warrior opens more holes in their rosters. I would suspect that the Terran Clans won't look much Clan once they have managed to bring down the Confederation

And even though this probably belongs in the Wolf threat:
Remember the League just started an all out assault right after the empire's cpaital had been sacked. The Dragoons wiped out the lead cluster plus Othar's body guard unit. The majority of the Empire's worlds have no garrisons except a few solahmas. And several of the Empires 9 remaining clusters are already bound in combat (and one is stuck on Simpson's Desert) If the League manages to copy it's steamroller strategy of Operation Guerrero the Empire will be flattened by overwhelming forces. Unless of course someone throws a monkey wrench into this whole plan (like the Lyrans or even the Protectorate)

[JAMES_PRYDE]

To the second part, that really depends on Jiyi, and I don't get the impression that he's going to want to hitch his wagon to Alaric's.

Oh, I did not mean pack up the Free Zone and move to Terra, I meant that the Terran Falcons can fight a (symbolic) "harvest" Trial or something to get the genetics and tech needed to bring their Iron Wombs back online

[JAMES_PRYDE]

It would be the best, if Jiyi Chistu and Stephanie Chistu fight a Trial for the senior Khanship of the Falcons.

IHMO Jiyi would be the better choice.

That's a hard one, Stephanie and Jiyi are on the same page about getting the Falcons good again, but at this point in time, after all that I have read, yes Jiyi is more appropriate for the top job. But it will be interesting to see what Stephanie has been up to when IKEO releases. (November ?)

[Tyler Jorgensson]

Removed

EDIT: how do I spoiler tags lol?

[spoiler] test [/spoiler]

My phone must be really dumb…..

[spoiler] test 2 [/spoiler]

[Scotty]

[ spoiler] and [ /spoiler]

[Church14]

That's a hard one, Stephanie and Jiyi are on the same page about getting the Falcons good again, but at this point in time, after all that I have read, yes Jiyi is more appropriate for the top job. But it will be interesting to see what Stephanie has been up to when IKEO releases. (November ?)

So far we have Stephanie saying she wants a new falcons. Until we get novels or iMEO that involve her that occur after the ilClan trial, we don’t know what kind of khan she will be. She might bring about the dawn of a new Falcon era. Or she might have to compromise with the surviving mongols and make deals that leave the falcons a questionable entity

[Alan Grant]

Early in the history of Clan Jade Falcon they experienced a culling. Internal dissent, a group of the Falcons were unhappy with Kerensky's new society and some of the decisions he made. Elizabeth Hazen and others made an example of them to save the Clan. I could see something like that happening again.

Reason being, so far everything that has happened has been Alaric (an outsider) telling the Falcons who they are now and what they are going to do. Rather than a path the Falcons chose for themselves. I could see a scenario where the Falcons go for that for a little while, but dissent and dissatisfaction grows, there's some sub-faction of unhappiness there, then have an internal crisis where they have to choose a future for themselves.

It could be small, a handful of individuals, yet they make a splash. Or it could be a bigger deal.

It could be a good story, an interesting story that does a lot to share how the new Falcons (post this crisis) have made sense of their new place in the universe and a path that they have chosen for themselves. Rather than just obeying what Alaric said.

[Metallgewitter]

I think the main issue might be coming from Tara Campbell. She is for all intents and purposes an outsider. Born and raised in a state that is now gone but most likely still clinging to it's ideals. Ideals that just don't mesh with Clan culture. And I can see her raise her voice frequently whenever "her" Clan does something that does not sit well with her. Though I can see Stephanie siding with her just to get rid of their war crime image. Or just letting her loose on trials of grievances to settle scores or decisions

[JAMES_PRYDE]

@ Alan

Yes, I agree, as another fiction / development, besides Terran Falcons ops and military. Perhaps it will be like (cringe / lol) ironically the Wolves, a significant group decides to "apply" to move to the Sudeten Falcons (just no Mongols lol), thus another plot point, making them stronger

Who knows Tara might get wind of how Jiyi and the Free Zone is run, and says to Stephanie, "look this is good, you do the same"

Another funny plot twist, IF Jiyi makes it more official that he does not want to be under a Wolf, would the Horses do a kind of non aggression pact, so they can concentrate on more pressing issues at their borders, again, allowing Jiyi breathing time

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

Given that Jiyi humiliated the Horses during Operation STAMPEDE, I don't see them doing any sort of official pact.  But Fulk Lassenerra isn't an idiot, so I suspect that he might be willing to temporarily ignore the Falcon Free Zone for a while (especially since Jiyi isn't really in a position to mount any offensive operations at the moment).

[JAMES_PRYDE]

Thus why I am a "Jesse" (Warden?) as in, make sure you have more than enough strength, before attacking, then pick and choose your battles wisely, instead of rushing in all guns blazing and making it up on the go

To me Jiyi has a very Warden, almost now "care-bear" attitude, but Warden conquers up Wolves, what would be a more Falcon appropriate title ?

[Gaiiten]

If Jiyi`s Falcons do not submit to Alaric`s ilClan, he might send "his" Falcons to get them in line. So another Flacon civil war might come.

[Alan Grant]

I think it would be foolish of Alaric to send his Falcons to deal with the other Falcons. Maybe just "risky" is the better word. Warfare is hard enough without sending proverbial brother against brother, you know? It's not that hard to imagine a percentage of chance that your forces might get distracted by the complexities of it and not fight at their best. Or that some conflicted sense of loyalty might set in. At the extreme end of a spectrum, his Falcons might end up betraying him.

Better to send some non-Falcon forces to fight, if he needs to do that.

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

He’s also got the considerably more pressing issue of the Confederation barking at his door. Sending a force to crush a tiny group that offers no threat to him at present would be extremely foolish.

[Fire Scorpion IIC]

It would be the best, if Jiyi Chistu and Stephanie Chistu fight a Trial for the senior Khanship of the Falcons.

IHMO Jiyi would be the better choice.

That's kinda redundant

In terms of legitimacy Jiyi has Clan civilians on his side to say nothing of the fact that he actually stayed with them

This alone makes the whole matter settled, he is now the Khan of Clan Jade Falcon

Terran Falcons will have to chart their own course now, they abandoned everyone and followed Malvina into this mess hence it's now solely up to themselves to figure out where to go from here

Rest of the old Clan already moved on without them

[Metallgewitter]

That's kinda redundant

In terms of legitimacy Jiyi has Clan civilians on his side to say nothing of the fact that he actually stayed with them

This alone makes the whole matter settled, he is now the Khan of Clan Jade Falcon

Terran Falcons will have to chart their own course now, they abandoned everyone and followed Malvina into this mess hence it's now solely up to themselves to figure out where to go from here

Rest of the old Clan already moved on without them

Not to mention Jiyi should have the entire Genertic repository in his hand therefore making his Clan the "real" Jade Falcons.

And who knows I could see the Horses make an alliance of convenience should the Hinterland Falcons decide to keep out of the new League. Enemy of my enemy and all that? Though that might be more of a Cobb then a Lassenara thing. Maybe a repeat of the alliance when the Hellions threw their temper tantrum.

And sending the Terran Falcons all the way back to Sudeten? Not gonna happen. The Ilkhan can't send his bodyguard on errands now can he?

[Crimson Dynamo]

I've been wondering about the nature of the AML and Clan Sea Fox's relationship. I know they're friendly to one another, but do you think Syndic Marena has enough influence with the Foxes to disadvantage Jiyi's Falcons in any way?

[Tyler Jorgensson]

What I was trying to say earlier (but spoiler tags seem broken: either my phone is stupid or the forums bugged) is that in the latest Shrapnel theirs a campaign set with the Turkina Ascendancy and they get a table of organization and an insignia (which I don’t think they had in Tamar Rising), which is kinda cool

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

I don't think that the forum can do spoiler tags anymore.

[Scotty]

[spoiler]That would be a bit of a problem[/spoiler]

EDIT: Well they sure don't

[tassa_kay]

I think some of you are jumping the gun in asserting that the matter of the Khanship of the Falcons is "settled". These are the Clans, and we've seen them devour and genocide each other over far less pressing things than an illegitimate Khan...and yes, by Clan law, Jiyi Chistu is 100% illegitimate; he was not voted into his position by a quorum of the Clan's Bloodnamed warriors. Hell, the Falcons just fought a civil war over the legitimacy of their Khan within the last twenty years, so it's not like there isn't a precedent here. WoR showed us that the Clans are big on the letter of the law as much as the spirit (hence why it took them so long to overturn the Great Refusal), and the Falcons are one of the most conservative Clans that ever existed.

While I do agree that 1) current circumstances prevent Alaric and Stephanie from dealing with that situation right now and 2) the expression "possession is 9/10ths of the law" absolutely applies here right now, it seems rather foolish to assume that there won't be a reckoning at some point. Especially with Alaric in the mix; we all literally just watched him demand the RasDom go all-in on his new Star League, and we've seen the lengths he will go to in order to get what he wants. And if that so happens to be a united Clan Jade Falcon, well... a reckoning will happen sooner or later.

Then, of course, there's the biggest reason why the Khanship of the Jade Falcons is far from "settled": this isn't PeaceTech, it's BattleTech, and we've watched factions make foolish decisions time and time and time again because those decisions fuel the incessant warfare that makes this setting what it is. If TPTB decide that Alaric and/or the Terran Falcons decide that it's time to bring the rest of the Falcons under the new Star League's aegis with the Khan that actually was elected by her Clan's Bloodnamed warriors, then that's what we're gonna get.

 Opinions are all fine and dandy, but let's not speak of them as if they're facts. No one here knows how this story is going to go.

[JAMES_PRYDE]

Not to mention Jiyi should have the entire Genertic repository in his hand therefore making his Clan the "real" Jade Falcons.

Yeah, that is what I have been saying, how this can benefit the Terran Falcons, as in a (symbolic) "harvest" Trial can be conducted, so they can get copies of Genetic material and some Iron Womb tech, so they can restart their own on Terra (Yes, results will only show in 16-18 years, but at least the Terran Falcons can tick that off in their check list of getting settled)

[Church14]

I think some of you are jumping the gun in asserting that the matter of the Khanship of the Falcons is "settled". These are the Clans, and we've seen them devour and genocide each other over far less pressing things than an illegitimate Khan...and yes, by Clan law, Jiyi Chistu is 100% illegitimate; he was not voted into his position by a quorum of the Clan's Bloodnamed warriors. Hell, the Falcons just fought a civil war over the legitimacy of their Khan within the last twenty years, so it's not like there isn't a precedent here. WoR showed us that the Clans are big on the letter of the law as much as the spirit (hence why it took them so long to overturn the Great Refusal), and the Falcons are one of the most conservative Clans that ever existed.

While I do agree that 1) current circumstances prevent Alaric and Stephanie from dealing with that situation right now and 2) the expression "possession is 9/10ths of the law" absolutely applies here right now, it seems rather foolish to assume that there won't be a reckoning at some point. Especially with Alaric in the mix; we all literally just watched him demand the RasDom go all-in on his new Star League, and we've seen the lengths he will go to in order to get what he wants. And if that so happens to be a united Clan Jade Falcon, well... a reckoning will happen sooner or later.

Then, of course, there's the biggest reason why the Khanship of the Jade Falcons is far from "settled": this isn't PeaceTech, it's BattleTech, and we've watched factions make foolish decisions time and time and time again because those decisions fuel the incessant warfare that makes this setting what it is. If TPTB decide that Alaric and/or the Terran Falcons decide that it's time to bring the rest of the Falcons under the new Star League's aegis with the Khan that actually was elected by her Clan's Bloodnamed warriors, then that's what we're gonna get.

 Opinions are all fine and dandy, but let's not speak of them as if they're facts. No one here knows how this story is going to go.

Along these lines, the only way by clan custom to decide which Jade Falcons are the 'legitimate' is basically a trial over it.

Regarding if Alaric and Stephani Chistu will 'deal' with Jiyi's... I feel like Alaric will just declare they answer to Stephanie Chistu because she answers to Alaric. If Jiyi says nope, then it'll arcs towards violence, because Alaric is a guy who in June 3152 declared he owns the universe. Not really any room for compromise with the guy as he exists now.

But... unless Wolves power up like saiyans again, or Stephanie's Falcons do so, the Falcon factions aren't likely to meet each other directly any time soon.

[Metallgewitter]

Along these lines, the only way by clan custom to decide which Jade Falcons are the 'legitimate' is basically a trial over it.

Regarding if Alaric and Stephani Chistu will 'deal' with Jiyi's... I feel like Alaric will just declare they answer to Stephanie Chistu because she answers to Alaric. If Jiyi says nope, then it'll arcs towards violence, because Alaric is a guy who in June 3152 declared he owns the universe. Not really any room for compromise with the guy as he exists now.

But... unless Wolves power up like saiyans again, or Stephanie's Falcons do so, the Falcon factions aren't likely to meet each other directly any time soon.

Alaric's message is timewise quite hilarious considering it came right after the Empire's capital had been sacked and a sibko of his children was abducted. I doubt the Dragoons will send a few of those to the Hinterland Falcons but it would be funny nontheless.

Also, he can delcare the Terran Falcons the real Jade Falcons all he wants but the hard relaity is that there are at least two factions that claim to be Jade Falcons that don't answer (for now) to the IlClan. The main question will be if the "IlKhan's bodyguard" will even be allowed to travel back to their old territory to get access to their own genetic legacies. I reckon that will take some time unless we get a Deus ex Machima that says "The two Terran Clans were so smart they brought a full set of their genetic samples to Terra and kept them out of arms reach". After all the Wolves have the same issue but on the flip side have a vastly bigger gene pool left (surviving warriors) to start again

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

I reckon that will take some time unless we get a Deus ex Machima that says "The two Terran Clans were so smart they brought a full set of their genetic samples to Terra and kept them out of arms reach".

Which would have been seriously out of character for Malvina.

[Natasha Kerensky]

Which would have been seriously out of character for Malvina.

Not if she put the samples on a warship and then hurled the warship at a RoTS or Wolf formation on Terra.

[Gotthammer]

It's a brilliant strategy. Dropping millions of potential soldiers at once, and then have them deploy all over the battlefield with explosive speed.

[BrianDavion]

That's a hard one, Stephanie and Jiyi are on the same page about getting the Falcons good again, but at this point in time, after all that I have read, yes Jiyi is more appropriate for the top job. But it will be interesting to see what Stephanie has been up to when IKEO releases. (November ?)

def too early to tell, judging best of those two right now would be like declaring Canidate A is the best canidate after only seeing a single campaign ad, for canidate A

[Fire Scorpion IIC]

def too early to tell, judging best of those two right now would be like declaring Canidate A is the best canidate after only seeing a single campaign ad, for canidate A

Candidate B has no country anymore and her old one doesn't want her

Candidate A has been in the driver seat for a while now