Author Topic: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements  (Read 32919 times)

monbvol

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Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« on: 01 August 2019, 23:02:03 »
I could have sworn I had already done a thread for this but I couldn't find it.

Anyway intro post time.

There are only really two things that bother me about the Nebula California April Fools product that came out a few years ago now.

1. In the d20 section it doesn't tell you how to calculate AP values for certain attacks, like say a Dragon's Breath Weapon and a few other things I felt were a bit oversimplified.

2. The super powers are a little too flat and don't really do a good job of showing the difference between Wonder Woman and Superman without getting a bit difficult to handle properly.

I'm still working out the full framework of 2 but I think I've got 1 reasonably worked out already.

So I'll put what I got for 1 in the next post to keep things somewhat organized.

monbvol

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #1 on: 01 August 2019, 23:10:08 »
No BOD oversight:

Divide Constitution by 2 to determine Body attribute but only for purposes of attribute checks and attribute link modifiers.  Characters still get the normal HP/2 for determining how tough they are.

Natural Armor Bonuses:

To convert Natural Armor into AtoW's Melee/Ballistic/Energy/eXplosive standard perform the following steps for each category.

Divide Natural Armor by 2 and apply to Melee of character/creature.

Divide Natural Armor by 10 round normally and apply to Ballistic of character/creature.

Natural Armor no matter how high does not add any BAR rating against Energy attacks.

Divide Natural Armor by 5 round normally and apply to eXplosive of character/creature.

Natural Armor does not count as stacked armor for purposes of encumberance/endurance but does follow all other rules for stacked armor.  Natural Armor also never suffers degradation from damage.

Damage dealing class/racial/spell-like features:

If the ability mimics the effects of a spell use the lowest spell level the spell can be cast at to determine the AP of the ability if it does damage.  If for some reason it has a save DC but does not provide a calculation to determine save DC then also use the lowest spell level to determine save DC normally.

For class features that deal damage, such as an alchamist's bombs, divide the character's level by 2 and round up to determine the AP value of such attacks.

For breath weapons and similar such attacks to determine thier AP subtract 10 from their save DC then divide by 2 round up.  Any resulting AP above 10 does not provide additional effects or damage.

Special materials:

Adamantine weapons increase their AP to 10.  Adamantine armor degrades at 10 points of damage instead of 5.

Mithral armor can be stacked one time with any other armor without increasing encumberance and degrade at 8 damage instead of 5.  Mithral weapons have no additional effects.

Dragonscale armor increases Energy BAR by 1 against appropriate damage types.

Other special materials pending further review to determine if they have any special effects/abilities.

AtoW characters with Martial Arts of 4+ count as having the Improved Unarmed, Improved Grapple, and Improved Trip feats.  Melee skill of 4+ grants AtoW characters the Improved Disarm, Improved Feint, and Improved Sunder feats.  If an AtoW character has both skills at 4+ they are granted all remaining improved combat manuever feats that remove attacks of opportunity.

I am Belch II

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #2 on: 04 August 2019, 19:08:57 »
I really loves the Nebula California XTRO. I would love to see more of those out there.
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monbvol

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #3 on: 04 August 2019, 21:18:49 »
*nod*

It is a nice fun little product and for the superpowers I am still trying to figure out exactly what I want to do for drawbacks/limits on powers, how to price them, and how to translate all the stuff rattling around my head into something coherent/understandable.

I can't really think of anything that really stands out for the other stuff that needs expanding on.

monbvol

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #4 on: 23 August 2019, 17:21:45 »
Just an update to let people know I haven't forgotten about this project.  Just got caught up in a contract for a bit so my time to work on the super powers aspect of the Nebula California stuff has been heavily curtailed.

But I did want to toss out some ideas/concepts.

As is frankly some of the things you can do with the retrovirus, mutations, implants/prosthetics, and special abilities can be pretty good stand ins for low tier super powers.

A simple alteration to the Extraordinary Attribute trait can also provide some easy to scale power by instead of increasing the cap it removes the cap and just give the character a few hundred XP to sink into that attribute.

I already know I want a three tier progression when it comes to damage.  Like hand to hand starts at Fatigue but you can boost that to Lethal or spend even more to make it Tactical.  I am leaning toward a non-linear costing scheme because I think that would make it a little easier for dialing into the desired power level for the campaign.

HABeas2

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #5 on: 23 August 2019, 19:14:31 »
Wait. Someone made a NC TRO? Where?

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monbvol

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #6 on: 23 August 2019, 19:21:32 »
I suppose you are correct in that the Nebula California April Fools pdf is closer to a Touring the Stars than an XTRO.  :P

HABeas2

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #7 on: 23 August 2019, 21:55:22 »
Aw, I thought someone made a fan TRO for it...

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monbvol

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #8 on: 23 August 2019, 22:05:05 »
That would be pretty awesome I'll admit.

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #9 on: 24 August 2019, 06:00:28 »
Aw, I thought someone made a fan TRO for it...

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monbvol

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #10 on: 24 August 2019, 11:42:34 »
Okay time to put down my thoughts on the defensive powers I've at least somewhat figured out.

Keep in mind I'm still thinking about how to price these in terms of XP.  So you can expect them to change from what I have listed.

Enhanced Fatigue Recovery.  Whenever you take the Recover Fatigue action you gain extra Fatigue back equal to the rank of this power.

Cost: I'm debating between linear cost of 20 XP per Rank and nonlinear(10 XP for Rank 1, 30 XP(total) for Rank 2, 60 XP(total) for Rank 3 and so on) per Rank.

Enhanced Healing. When Resting/Recovering each rank of this power subtracts 1 hour from the time required to recover 1 health point.

Cost: Same as above, debating 20 XP per rank or the same nonlinear cost.

Even more Super version: Regain 1 health point a turn per rank.  This does not prevent death or allow the character to come back from death if all their Health Points become depleted.

Cost: Linear 200 XP per Rank, nonlinear 100 XP for Rank 1, 300 XP(total) for Rank 2, 600 XP for Rank 3 and so on.

Personal M/B/E/X armor.  Each rank in this power increases one of the armor types the character naturally possesses.

Cost: 20 XP per Rank linear, 10 XP Rank 1, 30 XP(total) Rank 2, 60 XP Rank 3 and so on nonlinear.

Special: If able to manifest this as a force field or otherwise able to protect more than the source character it is highly recommended that this power now also cost Fatigue to sustain each turn in use at a rate of 1 Fatigue per each cubic meter or 2 fatigue for each additional person protected and taking a complex action to sustain for the turn.

Tactical M/B/E/X armor.  Each rank in this power increases the armor types the character possesses but it now divides damage as though it were Tactical Armor.  Also if all types are maxed at 10 the character's health points becomes effectively Tactical Armor points.  As an example a Small Laser would do 3 damage to the character's health points while an Autorifle would have to strike with a Margin of Success(using AP rounds) of at least 6 to do 1 point of lethal damage.

Cost: Linear 200 XP, nonlinear 100 XP for Rank 1, 300 XP(total) for Rank 2, 600 XP(total) for Rank 3

Special: If it is to be used to protect areas or other characters the power no longer makes the possessing character's health points effectively Tactical Armor and the power must have it's own Tactical Armor pool that it uses to absorb damage.  Use the same cost progression per Tactical Armor point as the per rank cost above.  As with the standard M/B/E/X it is highly recommended it cost 1 fatigue per cubic meter or 2 fatigue to protect each additional character.

The last four ideas I have for this category are still barely in alpha stages really but I'll still put my general thoughts here.

Regenerative Tactical Armor/structure.  I'm thinking about having a separate Tactical Armor power that just provides additional ablative armor to either the character or whatever they are driving/piloting.  I'm thinking similar to but legally distinct from Ghost Rider's ability to repair damage to his vehicles and certain incarnations of similar to but legally distinct from Colossus.

The one that I'm really struggling with in terms of pricing is Drug, Poison, and Chemical resistances.  Mostly that it would not take all that much to render such items all but pointless to use on such a character combined with I just really don't want to bog down things with focusing on too much subcategorization to counter act that.

Organ/Limb regeneration is also proving quite difficult for me to work out in a sensible manner.

The last one is Mystic/Psychic defenses.  With how open ended all this stuff can potentially get I'll admit I might not create such frameworks at all but if I can figure out a way to keep it simple I will support it.  Or even borrow from the Critters&Castles/Roadseeker stuff if that makes more sense.
« Last Edit: 24 August 2019, 12:02:42 by monbvol »

HABeas2

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #11 on: 24 August 2019, 13:31:02 »
Working on my own supplemental docs, but my Society project has priority.
I might be able to finish some up next year.

MG! I recently looked at your Society XTR, and I gotta say, I'm pretty impressed! I'd been considering a couple "fan TROs" of my own lately, and would love to know some of the nuts and bolts of how you got your to look so much like an official product. (On my own, my skills generally top out at "making the words"; layout was always someone else's task.)

Sorry to derail your thread, monbvol.

- Herb

monbvol

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #12 on: 24 August 2019, 13:40:42 »
No worries.

It's nothing compared to the twists and turns of my own train of thoughts anymore.

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #13 on: 24 August 2019, 16:52:03 »
Given the effect of all of those recovery/regeneration/armor powers, I can only recommend non-linear advancement for them.

monbvol

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #14 on: 24 August 2019, 17:18:11 »
*nod*

I have to admit nonlinear does feel like the better option for another reason, it helps show that not all super powers are created equal and how even small advantages can be decisive.

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #15 on: 26 August 2019, 19:13:36 »
A thing Paul Sjardijn and I recognized quickly when making the Nebula California product was the absolute insanity of trying to codify superhero powers at all, which is why the rules given are so darned abstracted. For players taking a cue from any of the myriad comic book universes out there, the abilities of superheroes and mutants and the like are just too damned broad and nuanced to apply a set of bounded rules to them that cover all the options.

Of course, Paul handled both the D20 and Superheroes segment rules, so he favored a "less is more" approach in order to get it all done, while I mostly played with the Syberian Robots and the Solar Empire.

Ah, good times!

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monbvol

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #16 on: 26 August 2019, 20:32:59 »
I've looked at the Hero System for a lot of inspiration for this and I've come to the following conclusions:

1. It can be done surprisingly well but does make character creation a slog.

2. With the Hero System and Palladium's own take I really am re-inventing the wheel.  In the case of Hero System mostly because I can't get a DTF of their books and Palladium is Palladium(the rules work just enough that they work and you can have a lot of fun but damn if they aren't glaringly unfinished in a lot of spots).

3. You're right that there is just too much variance for some super powers.  I can do some of the basic stuff for Green Lantern easy enough but the full potential of what they can do?  I shudder at thinking how to even begin approaching some of the depicted feats.  That way lies madness.

monbvol

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #17 on: 30 August 2019, 23:04:07 »
A bit of an update.

I've got the early stages of an idea for how to refine my limb/organ regeneration powers.  I'll need to actually do some reading to finish them up.

I already know certain power archetypes are not going to get supported though no matter what.

Transformation powers like Beast Boy, Martian Manhunter, and Metamorpho.  Lower end transformation powers like The Question, Ant Man, and The Wasp I'll at least consider and may actually already have some ideas about.

As mentioned conjuring constructs, like Green Lantern, is far too likely to get out of hand.

Mystical/Mental powers I'm likewise going to not support a whole lot.  I mean I have ideas about how to handle Telekenisis but going full Charles Xavier I'm unsure on.

I do already have some ideas rattling around for the more offensively oriented super powers.

Almost all of them are going to come with some pretty hefty Fatigue costs to use and I'm kind of debating some of the area effect frameworks still, especially when it comes to cost.

I also know there are going to be certain powers that will just have a flat cost with no ranking structure.  Mostly looking at Spiderman's ability to cling to most any surface here.

I just had an idea for how to handle certain super powers that revolve around the idea of summoning/controlling animal friends, spirits, or other minions.  Can either be a Contact or Status trait.

Alternate movement options I also have some initial ideas rolling around already.

Last one I am seriously considering for the whole super power thing is more a super science thing.  Artificial people.  Red Tornado, Megaman, the Major, and even going full Kongo from Arpeggio of Blue Steel is something I am wanting to support.

Certain super powers are already pretty easy to do or would be easy to with some quick adjustments.

Ghost Tank I know is actually pretty easy to do without special rules thanks to existing stuff like the Shielded Advanced Robotics construction options.

Jessica Jones would be pretty easy to do if there was no cap on Strength and just dumping a bunch of extra XP there.

Likewise with what I've already got it'd be pretty easy to do Luke Cage or cover most of the basics for the Hulk.

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #18 on: 31 August 2019, 00:00:13 »
Quote
3. You're right that there is just too much variance for some super powers.  I can do some of the basic stuff for Green Lantern easy enough but the full potential of what they can do?  I shudder at thinking how to even begin approaching some of the depicted feats.  That way lies madness.
and don't forget that each group of storytellers can change the power level of the characters.

and yes Heros  system works as does Villains and Vigilantes
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monbvol

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #19 on: 31 August 2019, 09:45:12 »
*nod*

I have to admit Hero system conflicts me.  The character creation all but requires computerized assistance, it does take some work figuring out how to get some of the super powers to work in that system, and there are some things that I'd alter that don't make much sense.  Once all that is dealt with though it actually looks really simple to run/play.

I've actually thought about taking the easy out and establishing a conversion(30-50 AToW XP to each Hero Character Point is best I can figure depending on exactly where you want to compare) but since that requires another system I'm making myself work a lot harder than I probably should.

Back to another update.  I re-read the rules about how long it'd take to heal damage and how long it takes to after the fact get a replacement limb/organ to get some ideas about time frames for the regenerate limb/organ super powers.

Well after re-reading them I've determined that my current framework for recovering Standard Damage is actually way too slow.  Removing an hour from 5-12 days is pretty damn meaningless.  So I'm going to have to re-think that.

Limbs/Organs is shaping up.  I may cost it such that it is equal in terms of XP and time to getting a cloned replacement limb/organ with the small advantages of not needing medical supervision or chances of rejection for the lowest level of the power.  I'll have to think about how to cut down those times and how to scale the XP cost for it some more though.  I'll also have to think about organs that if damaged require medical intervention to keep the character alive and how to handle that at some of the higher levels.

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #20 on: 31 August 2019, 11:23:45 »
I was always a fan of TSR’s Marvel system.  I did a BattleTech conversion that set 1 point of BattleTech damage equivalent to 20 points of Marvel damage (a normal human in Marvel usually has around 20 health).  So a punch from Thor is equivalent to an AC/5, while a punch from a fully enraged Hulk does 25 damage.
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monbvol

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #21 on: 31 August 2019, 12:02:19 »
*nod*

A lot of it also depends on what era of comics you want to use for comparison too.

Like originally Superman couldn't actually fly or Wolverine's ability to regenerate was no where near as good as it is now and at one point his claws were part of his costume, not him.

Personally I'm aiming for stuff that is certainly impressive, retains the value of existing options as meaningful, and has a bit better structure to it so that other GMs can decide more easily what kind of power level they want.

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #22 on: 03 September 2019, 20:23:06 »
Monkey wrench time!

How would you handle Firestorm? With his integrated dual identities...

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monbvol

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #23 on: 03 September 2019, 21:22:30 »
The easy answer would be create the two separate characters and when they combine into one they both have access to the other's skills but from what I've seen of Firestorm there'd be no extra actions or other benefits.

The actual powers themselves, yeah I don't think I'd touch those at all because I know how crazy they are.

monbvol

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #24 on: 07 September 2019, 18:40:17 »
So the starting point for limb/organ regeneration is looking to be 600 XP for a few weeks to keep the other existing traits relevant.

I'm still considering exactly how to price upgrading the speed and what to do for organs you can't live without but certain heroes have survived without long enough to regenerate.

Health regeneration is likewise proving a bit tricky.

monbvol

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #25 on: 15 September 2019, 21:37:02 »
I have to be honest at this point  most of my motivation to keep working on this has completely gone away.

I just can't seem to come up with a good way to handle the enhanced healing/regeneration of limbs and organs.

But I figure I can at least put up the other stuff I had worked out.

Offensive abilities:

Change the AP type of hand to hand attacks or to set the AP type of power attacks 10 XP for fatigue/subduing 100 xp for lethal.

Increase AP 10, 30, 60(and so on) XP for fatigue/subduing 100, 300, 600(and so on) XP for lethal and attack costs 1 fatigue for every 3 increased AP or fraction thereof.

Increase BD 10, 30, 60(and so on) XP for fatigue/subduing 100, 300, 600(and so on) XP for lethal and attack costs 1 fatigue for every 5 increased BD or fraction thereof.

Hand to hand or power attack is lethal instead of fatigue/subduing 100 XP and attack costs 1 additional fatigue per use.

Terrain Conversion 10 XP per meter converted to rough.

Stealth abilities:
1 Camo 10 XP 1 fatigue/turn
2 30 XP 1 fatigue/turn
3 60 XP 1 fatigue/turn
4 100 XP 2 fatigue/turn
5 150 XP 2 fatigue/turn
6 210 XP 2 fatigue/turn
7 280 XP 3 fatigue/turn
8 360 XP 3 fatigue/turn
9 450 XP 3 fatigue/turn
10 550 XP 4 fatigue/turn

Same for ECM and IR.

Use the same cost progression for senses that counter act the stealth bonus.

Movement I'd do the same progression with no maximum, including flight.

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #26 on: 04 December 2019, 21:06:58 »
Hypo-theory about the Firestorm character...

Make three separate characters, assign 2 with the lowest physical attributes and completely different superior mindsets with different superpowers and the third with the opposite venue, ie: no superpowers. Roll 2D6 and the evens or odds combines with the physical third body to provide power skills. on a roll of eleven or twelve both halves apply, but with a minus ability as both try to control the same action.

Thoughts?

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monbvol

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #27 on: 04 December 2019, 22:47:28 »
Hmmm...

Better idea is two players make each half then they fight over what happens when they combine form.

Seriously though Firestorm is probably more trouble to work out than it might be worth to do so.

monbvol

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #28 on: 28 April 2020, 00:44:17 »
Just something else I though of to necro this thread.

We made another run at the Star Empire as their high enough tech in certain aspects that they are a ready source of spare parts for our more advanced equipment but not so dangerous as to be overly dangerous.

Then they let loose the beasts.

We already had to grapple with the idea of aliens from the Kingdom of Toreel with those freaks that we're hard pressed to explain as someone taking Star League/Clan gene editing technologies and cranking it to max.  These were just as unsettling but thankfully possibly explainable with aforementioned techniques.  Either way we're not keen to find out.

A tall lanky creature covered in fur got a hold of Adept Crusher and ripped his arm from his socket and beat him to death with it.

A much smaller furball drug Crusher's body off taking bites out of the flesh of his severed arm.

The rest of the raiding party took what we could from the raid and found a trading station.

In a more positive interaction we met a female that we hope was just heavily modified.  Bald with what are best described as tentacles protruding from above and behind her ears that came down past her shoulders.  If it were not for that she could be described as quite attractive and we basically had to beg her to put some less provocative clothes on so we could get down to trading.

From what we can tell these are not common creatures at all and thus why we missed them in our initial survey.  Perhaps we'll find more as we trade and steal for spare parts.

-Excerpt from Adept Frakes's journal


The Aliens of the Star Empire don't have any page space devoted to them.

Well there is some good news here.  There are d20 Star Wars books and if you find them a little troublesome to convert directly there are race building rules for Pathfinder 1st edition in the Advanced Race Guide that work really well that I used to convert most of the races.  I skipped a few on purpose, hell if I can remember why now, and probably missed a bunch from splat books but as I no longer have a d20 Star Wars book I can't convert them.

So you can use that as option 1.

Option 2 probably would be work out some phenotypes with some cybernetics and the retrovirals from the Companion providing some analogues that phenotypes can't cover by themselves to use.

Shaggies(similar to but legally distinct from a certain tall furry species from a forest world) could probably be Elemental phenotypes easy enough but with a serious speech impediment and thick skinned.

Not sure what I'd use for the rest really.  So best judgement would apply.
« Last Edit: 28 April 2020, 00:53:56 by monbvol »

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Re: Nebula California Revisions and Supplements
« Reply #29 on: 28 April 2020, 02:42:10 »

Might as well link here what I have now:


HyperTUBE eXtreme!!! (Stargate/Welcome to the Nebula California)
https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php?topic=69113.0


Nebula Confederation (StarTrek/Welcome to the Nebula California)
https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php?topic=68581.0
https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php?topic=68571.0
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