Raven Alliance: The Shiny Red Button of Orbital Doom

[Jaim Magnus]

The RA should trial for this Mech.

Btw, who wants to invade Terra along the way?

Phfft. Terra just paints a giant target on whoever holds it. Better to be an 'ally' of whoever holds it.

[Crow]

Totally unrelated: anyone want to help me get a fan funded Hippogriff in the works?

[Elcor05]

Phfft. Terra just paints a giant target on whoever holds it. Better to be an 'ally' of whoever holds it.

Would there be a clan that we WOULDN'T want to be allied with? I know I personally don't like Wolf or Jade Falcon (and really only like Hells Horses when they're not Crusaders), but would the RA care if it weren't the Bears or, to a lesser amount, the Sea Foxes?

[(SMD)MadCow]

Would there be a clan that we WOULDN'T want to be allied with? I know I personally don't like Wolf or Jade Falcon (and really only like Hells Horses when they're not Crusaders), but would the RA care if it weren't the Bears or, to a lesser amount, the Sea Foxes?

If the Sea Foxes get Terra, you know prices everywhere will skyrocket.

[truetanker]

Paticuarly when Harjel is found on Terra!

Terran Harjel. Three times the potential!

TT

[jklantern]

Paticuarly when Harjel is found on Terra!

Terran Harjel. Three times the potential!

TT

It must be Red Harjel.

[St.George]

Blue harjel is only found on the ocean floor,that's why the sea foxes will find it

[sadlerbw]

I have to say, I've got more than a passing curiosity about what is going to happen to the Raven fleet come ilClan time. Right now, they have far and away the most powerful navy in the Inner Sphere...when it's all active. However, they are having a hard time justifying the cost of keeping that huge fleet active with nothing to do with it. So, something will have to give and I doubt the Raven fleet will keep sitting around looking pretty for ilClan.

Do they try to start conquering more systems? Sounds nice, but unless all you want to do is blow them up, you need ground forces to hold planets. A warship fleet would be fine for blockading someplace, or even raiding to steal some of their stuff, but you can't really claim and hold a planet with a space ship. Heck, they are already having trouble managing the few worlds they have already taken or been given, how are they going to raise the tempo enough to give three full stars of Warships something to do? Being able to show up in orbit and broadcast, "Hey guys, you all belong to the Raven Alliance now," isn't going to cut it.

Do they lend/sell some of them? Probably not to their neighbors, who would likely end up turning around and using them against the Ravens before long, but maybe to the Sea Foxes or the RasDom. The Bears especially have most of their eggs in one big basket (or two, if the Leviathan III comes online), and could use the ability to station at least SOME naval power in different places across their empire. They have a whole lot of space to protect and one warship just can't be everywhere at once. They also seem to have abundant 'resources' which they could trade to the Ravens. They have Mechs, AeroSpace assets, Raw Materials, pretty much anything other than trained warriors, and even those might be possible with some sort of contrived trial. The Sea Foxes also have resources, and might not be averse to picking up a couple more hulls they can convert for Aimag duty.

Do they go to war with someone and get many of them blown up? That's going to be a little tough to manage. Their two neighbors have only three warships between them, two of which are corvettes, and they are unlikely to be more than a speedbump in a fight with even a single naval star. The FedSuns and the Combine just don't have the naval power to do much damage to a real naval star. So, who would they fight? The Falcons and the Wolves are really the only powers that have something approaching a credible fleet that could seriously damage or kill one of the Raven's naval stars. Unfortunately, they are on the other side of the Sphere. Heck, even if they somehow managed to hitch a ride on the 'Come conquer Terra...again!' bandwagon, the Republic isn't exactly flush with warships. And really, how many times can the magical SDS systems be resurrected and cripple yet another fleet. That system has been destroyed at LEAST three times already, how much can really be left!? Maybe if you could somehow convince the Bears and the Ravens to get in a fight, you might be able to erase some of the Raven fleet and the big Leviathans at the same time, but that seems like a stretch. They have always been friendly towards each other, and they are separated by the whole of the Combine. Why would they bother fighting each other?

I guess there is always the boring old 'stick them back in mothballs' option, but I find that unsatisfying.

So, what do you folks think might happen with the fleet?

[Vition2]

So, what do you folks think might happen with the fleet?

I see two real options for their use during this era.

1.  They are going to die.  It might be spectacular, or it might be with a whimper but I can see them getting destroyed to bring the focus nearly completely back to the ground game.

2.  They are going to be "consumed" by the ilClan which happens to force, coerce, or otherwise integrate the remaining clans (perhaps minus the Ghost Bears as they barely exist as clan anymore) into a single faction with each existing clan assuming a specific role within the organization.  The Wolves would be the higher end rank and file forces, the Falcons take on the role of shock troops, the Horses assume the more general rank and file forces, while the Foxes continue their role of armed merchants working to build up the faction's economy, and lastly the Ravens would be in charge of the navy.  If the Bears were to end up included in this, they'd probably end up being a clan that properly utilizes material resource extraction.

[jimdigris]

Warships can be used for orbital fire support against massed enemy formations.  The key is having a REALLY good gunner at the controls.  They can also be used for destroying factories or burning industrial districts with an hour's warning to keep the loss of life to a minimum.  In this sense, they are giant engines of coercion. 

[Maingunnery]

I see two real options for their use during this era.

1.  They are going to die.  It might be spectacular, or it might be with a whimper but I can see them getting destroyed to bring the focus nearly completely back to the ground game.

2.  They are going to be "consumed" by the ilClan which happens to force, coerce, or otherwise integrate the remaining clans (perhaps minus the Ghost Bears as they barely exist as clan anymore) into a single faction with each existing clan assuming a specific role within the organization.  The Wolves would be the higher end rank and file forces, the Falcons take on the role of shock troops, the Horses assume the more general rank and file forces, while the Foxes continue their role of armed merchants working to build up the faction's economy, and lastly the Ravens would be in charge of the navy.  If the Bears were to end up included in this, they'd probably end up being a clan that properly utilizes material resource extraction.

3. Exodus to the deep, deep, outer periphery. The Ravens have learned that it is good to have an exit plan ready, and with trouble brewing they prepared themselves for both combat and a possible exodus.

[sadlerbw]

Warships can be used for orbital fire support against massed enemy formations.  The key is having a REALLY good gunner at the controls.  They can also be used for destroying factories or burning industrial districts with an hour's warning to keep the loss of life to a minimum.  In this sense, they are giant engines of coercion.

Yeah, but you probably don't want to blow stuff like that up if you are trying to conquer the planet. I mean, if you want all that nice, shiny industry working for you, you can't very well shoot at it!

As for using it against massed forces, yeah that is certainly a thing, and quite effective. What I'm saying is, say you park a Cameron in orbit of some planet and tell everyone they are part of the Raven Alliance...and they say no. What do you do? If you are trying to capture the planet and make it part of your nation, you can't very well just start blowing up cities or fragging every dropship that leaves the surface. You would be blowing up the whole reason you wanted the planet in the first place. Warships can win battles, but you need ground forces to control a planet.

[Vition2]

3. Exodus to the deep, deep, outer periphery. The Ravens have learned that it is good to have an exit plan ready, and with trouble brewing they prepared themselves for both combat and a possible exodus.

True, and while I consider that very Raveny I do not think it would be allowed to happen.  Certainly they could go off into the aether, but at that point their story likely ends, and I would rather that not happen.

I had meant to add a wishful element in how the Ravens could use their warships, as long as they kept their borders relatively small, they could use their warships as a wall as they gradually expand towards the core of the Inner Sphere.  They probably could not take much more than a score of systems before this was no longer a reasonable option, but they could pick up some important more heavily industrialized and populous worlds doing so.

[sadlerbw]

I was thinking about this a little more last night, and came up with an admittedly odd and unlikely idea:

The Ravens could become the enforcement arm of the Sea Foxes. If the Wolves and Falcons keep getting less strictly clan in their behavior, it could become dangerous for the Aimags operating out in their space. While the foxes have Warships, I understand that they have largely been stripped and converted to be massive merchant vessels and may not be much good in a fight. The Ravens could decide it sucks out in the Periphery and merge with the Sea Foxes to provide them a real naval force to protect them in their travels. That would potentially split the fleet up over the whole sphere and help give it a reason to exist without being an overwhelming single force.

[truetanker]

You guys are thinking wrong!

They will place a Capital ship over the planet, place their demands, get refused and open fire on the surface with capital weapons. Most likely in a deserted place.They may even land a dropship and destroy it on the ground!

OR

They may jump back towards Home world and try to reclaim lost territory.

TT

[jimdigris]

Yeah, but you probably don't want to blow stuff like that up if you are trying to conquer the planet. I mean, if you want all that nice, shiny industry working for you, you can't very well shoot at it!

This is for planets that are too far to garrison or too difficult to capture.  You would be saying to this hostile power "Do not annoy us or we will halve you GNP."

[St.George]

If the planet can't get to the WS then they most likely won't argue (remember the shiny red button)

[sadlerbw]

If the planet can't get to the WS then they most likely won't argue (remember the shiny red button)

The FM:3145 entry for Delta Galaxy notes that the galaxy was basically forced off the surface of a planet they had captured by a non-compliant population they couldn't deal with.They still nominally control the planets in question through threat of orbital bombardment, but even with with warships around to blow stuff up, they were forced to leave the planet by locals with car bombs. Their warships were enough to 'own' the planet, but not enough to actually control it. It has to be sort of embarrassing at clan social functions to be forced to say, "That is our planet, but we don't ever go down there anymore. The locals would kills us if we did."

[Demongirl]

[Maingunnery]

Lets use both hands.  >:D

[jklantern]

I'm broadly in favor of John Hurt and/or the Doctor being Ravens.

[jimdigris]

We really should have one of those installed on each of our warships just for fun. }:)

[truetanker]

Ha!

TT

[jklantern]

We really should have one of those installed on each of our warships just for fun. }:)

John Hurts, the Doctors, or Shiny Big Red Buttons?

[Jaim Magnus]

John Hurts, the Doctors, or Shiny Big Red Buttons?

Yes.

[jklantern]

Yes.

Your ideas intrigue me.  Is there perhaps a newsletter I could subscribe to?

[Crow]

Hail DG, back from the dead

[jimdigris]

Yes.

What he said.

[Demongirl]

Hehe, I have returned from the Umbra, all shiny and Chrome...

I bringeth The Doctor as He is Snow Raven.

*nodnods*

[Demongirl]

We really should have one of those installed on each of our warships just for fun. }:)

Trothkin; you mean, you do not!?