Author Topic: Power is a goal. Pleasure is eternal. Welcome to Canopus. (Read 218053 times)

CanopusIV · « **Reply #660 on:** 14 January 2013, 00:41:41 »

I read through the Field Manual: 3085 and noticed something interesting. According the the lore, in 3085 after the Jihad the Periphery nations effective strengths is as following:

BattleMech Strength-

Magistracy of Canopus: 16 regiments
Taurian Concordat: 6 regiments, 2 battalions
Marian Hegemony: 6 legions, 1 cohort (approximately 8 regiments)
Calderon Protectorate: 5 regiments
Filtvelt Coalition: 3 regiments, 1 battalion
Fronc Reaches: 3 regiments

Considering how the Magistracy recovered their industry with very little issue and rebuilt their mildly damaged facilities on Canopus and Detroit, the Magistracy is by FAR the strongest force in the Periphery (except if you count the Ravens Alliance). The closest two powers would be the Hegemony which are about to lose an entire legion since the Fourth Legion is pretty much siding with the Lothian League rebels, and the TDF is in shambles after war with the Federated Suns.

The biggest caveats? Well, several regiments need updated equipment and are better suited to fighting pirates...but the biggest hurdle? The Magistracy isn't an empire builder! That's why I love the Magistracy so much! Even with Capellan allies the Magistracy and its people doesn't seem as interested in expansion like its neighbors (with the exception of the failed invasion of Capellan space with Andurian).

It'll be interesting to see how they write the Magistracy in the upcoming decades. They're the biggest and most powerful state in the Periphery and allied with a Successor State (even if it is the Capellans). They're lacking in serious rivals, and their largest concern is probably updating their units' equipment and not getting pulled into any wars the Chancellor starts.

Just thought I'd share O:-)

False Son · « **Reply #661 on:** 15 January 2013, 09:18:35 »

With Andurien in the fold, that opens up tons of great potential for the MAF. The Canopians have mechs, the Anduriens have conventional and aerospace units. That's a decent combination.

CanopusIV · « **Reply #662 on:** 15 January 2013, 15:33:17 »

Quote from: False Son on 15 January 2013, 09:18:35

With Andurien in the fold, that opens up tons of great potential for the MAF. The Canopians have mechs, the Anduriens have conventional and aerospace units. That's a decent combination.

I think in the book it also states that the Magistracy is trying to increase the size and quality of its aerospace assets since during the Jihad the Blakists almost always had the advantage in that area and it complicated defenses. I also know that sometime in the near future, Duke Humphries and Ilsa Centrella get married which helps cement positive relationships between the Canopians, Capellans and Andurians.

Gotta love how the Canopians help historical enemies get laid ;)

False Son · « **Reply #663 on:** 15 January 2013, 15:50:20 »

Canopians and Anduriens were friends. The Canopians were a little more fairweather in light of the Andurien Crisis. It's a good match. Andurien Aerotech has a nice range of products. Just a shame about Lopez. Assuming Detroit is still sending Troikas over to the MoC, they have a solid selection.

On the conventional side, Moltkes, Aerons, Harassers, Thumpers and Galleons. In cross trade the Anduriens would get LSRM Carriers, HLRM Carriers, Po HTs, Pikes, Manticores, Tamerlanes, Danais and Trinity BA. Good, good stuff. Some of it is redundant, like Danais and Thumpers (although, they have somewhat different applications, thanks to the slightly higher speed of the Danai), and the Moltke could easily overshadow the Manticore series. None the less, a combined industrial base that could allow the 2 states some breathing room.

CanopusIV · « **Reply #664 on:** 15 January 2013, 15:55:22 »

I know, right!? The MoC is by far the strongest Periphery power, but they don't seem that interested in conquest like their neighbors. It would be really easy to justify "recovering our former colonies" of the Fronc Regions, or "halting the expansion of the Marian Caesar" by declaring war on those two groups respectively, but they don't seem to have that in mind.

Instead they'll do what they always have done: quietly build up their assets, improve the standard of living for their people, and have more fun than the rest of the Inner Sphere combined.

False Son · « **Reply #665 on:** 15 January 2013, 16:34:33 »

I dunno. The expansion of both their armed forces and their industrial base under Emma would suggest that they have more than national security in mind. That's not to say that MoC is the 6th IS power, just that they have not just sat idly by. Some of their choices, like marrying into the Laio dynasty might be regretful, but in the short term they've been ambitious for a Periphery nation. I like to think of them as a wild card faction. Just don't too excited. Herb is bound to give them a good drumming eventually.

CanopusIV · « **Reply #666 on:** 15 January 2013, 22:18:20 »

*nods* no, I hear ya. It is interesting how far they've come as a Periphery state compared to their neighbors is all. The Magistracy still lags considerably behind the Inner Sphere in equipment, technology and Mech strength, so it would also be foolish to try and pick a fight. Geez, I should have some pompoms for how much I'm cheerleading for the Magistracy :P

And yes, I don't doubt that Herb will smack them down a peg. There is a Dark Age approaching where they do lose a number of their planets...but then again, so does everyone else. The Taurians probably taught a lot of nations just how far you can fall despite being so awesome for so long.

jimdigris · « **Reply #667 on:** 16 January 2013, 17:46:57 »

Perhaps the Majistracy will be used to knock someone else down a peg, like the Liao family. >:D

CanopusIV · « **Reply #668 on:** 16 January 2013, 18:04:59 »

Quote from: jimdigris on 16 January 2013, 17:46:57

Perhaps the Majistracy will be used to knock someone else down a peg, like the Liao family. >:D

Well, I believe they are poised to take the Capellan throne with their offspring. Not to mention, the Centrella bloodline might help get the crazy out of the Liaos over time. But not immediately because I think they eventually have an incestuous birth. Lawls...

Ian Sharpe · « **Reply #669 on:** 17 January 2013, 13:26:08 »

Personally, I'd love to see it pulled off, but its even more fun to poke at the Cappies with the idea of it.

False Son · « **Reply #670 on:** 17 January 2013, 13:42:34 »

Quote from: CanopusIV on 16 January 2013, 18:04:59

Well, I believe they are poised to take the Capellan throne with their offspring. Not to mention, the Centrella bloodline might help get the crazy out of the Liaos over time. But not immediately because I think they eventually have an incestuous birth. Lawls...

It didn't stop Daoshen. Creepy stuff going down in the Magistracy.

And who's to know how the future of Capellan-Canopian relations will go. I was given the impression that Ari Humphries was supposed to act as a sort of check against Daoshen pushing Ilsa around. Sure, Andurien-Canopus isn't going to defeat the CapCon. But, Daoshen won't be able to bully the Canopians and invade the crumbling Republic at the same time.

CanopusIV · « **Reply #671 on:** 17 January 2013, 16:27:40 »

Quote from: False Son on 17 January 2013, 13:42:34

It didn't stop Daoshen. Creepy stuff going down in the Magistracy.

And who's to know how the future of Capellan-Canopian relations will go. I was given the impression that Ari Humphries was supposed to act as a sort of check against Daoshen pushing Ilsa around. Sure, Andurien-Canopus isn't going to defeat the CapCon. But, Daoshen won't be able to bully the Canopians and invade the crumbling Republic at the same time.

As far as I know, the future leaders of the Capellan Confederation and the Magistracy are brother and sister with the brother leading the Capellan Confederation and the sister the Magistracy. I suppose the political allegiance of those two realms depends largely on how well the siblings get along....which is apparently quite well because they have a child together. I also know that in some of the Dark Age maps it lists Detroit as being under Capellan control.

I had a chance to ask Herb about that, and the way he saw it was that the Canopians still owned Detroit, they used the CCAF to act as garrison forces. Then again, it might be a bit too early to tell as far as lore is concerned. Things have a penchant of changing over time.

Ian Sharpe · « **Reply #672 on:** 21 January 2013, 22:36:53 »

I'm not terribly bothered about who has boots on the ground on Detroit. The MOC has benefited greatly from allying with the CC, but undeniably remains the junior partner. I accept that the CCAF will rate higher preference than most MAF units. But as the CCAF replaces and updates their own mechs and equipment, the older but solid mechs end up in MAF hands. Its a gradual process, and honestly, I'd rather more C-bills be spent on Canopian factories and facilities. Detroit was nice while it lasted, and undoubtedly the MAF still gets some of their stuff from it.

Maelwys · « **Reply #673 on:** 21 January 2013, 23:05:43 »

Yeah, I was happy to see factories showing up in the Magistracy during the Jihad, even if they're only producing Tamerlanes right now (have to start somewhere) and Battle Armor.

I was also glad to see the Princess Luxury Liner went into production, though I can't help but think "they REALLY need to produce a transport bigger than a Leopard eventually."

Ian Sharpe · « **Reply #674 on:** 21 January 2013, 23:20:36 »

Quote from: Maelwys on 21 January 2013, 23:05:43

Yeah, I was happy to see factories showing up in the Magistracy during the Jihad, even if they're only producing Tamerlanes right now (have to start somewhere) and Battle Armor.

I was also glad to see the Princess Luxury Liner went into production, though I can't help but think "they REALLY need to produce a transport bigger than a Leopard eventually."

I'd prefer an upgrade to making the Lung Wang, for starters. Much more useful overall than the Leo. Past that, aye. Union-sized mech carriers.

BrokenMnemonic · « **Reply #675 on:** 22 January 2013, 04:50:51 »

There are also those Dictators that appeared out of nowhere - it may be that the Magistracy is producing those too, somewhere that the ROTS hasn't identified.

ANS Kamas P81 · « **Reply #676 on:** 22 January 2013, 15:36:49 »

I doubt it. If they were in production, we'd get more tidbits about more of them being noticed; I think the sudden surge mid-Jihad and nothing apparently new since them leans too much in the 'one-time find' explanation.

False Son · « **Reply #677 on:** 22 January 2013, 16:03:42 »

You mean from the mysterious WoB cache that gave them Phoenixhawks?

Maelwys · « **Reply #678 on:** 22 January 2013, 16:24:33 »

Quote from: Ian Sharpe on 21 January 2013, 23:20:36

I'd prefer an upgrade to making the Lung Wang, for starters. Much more useful overall than the Leo. Past that, aye. Union-sized mech carriers.

I like the Lung Wang's nose bay and carrying capacity, but I can't get over the lack of weapons in its Aft Left/Right quarters. Its a small window, but the lack of weaponry there leaves actual gaps where the Lung Wang can be shot and not respond, since despite the picture, it a spheroid.

Quote from: False Son on 22 January 2013, 16:03:42

You mean from the mysterious WoB cache that gave them Phoenixhawks?

It seems the WoB updated the factory on Canopus to produce them, instead of a whole new factory. Which seems rather random to me, but there you have it.

The nice bit about the Princess Luxury Liner being back in production is that it shows the MoC is capable of handling larger DropShips. I wouldn't mind seeing an updated Dictator or something.

CanopusIV · « **Reply #679 on:** 22 January 2013, 17:56:56 »

I want to know more about what led up to the production of the Penny. They're not made on Detroit, but in Magistracy space and are very solid machines. Even if they're uglier than sin, they're heavy, they have a huge laser compliment and can jump.

Maelwys · « **Reply #680 on:** 22 January 2013, 22:36:27 »

Probably pretty much everything you said.

They're not made on Detroit, so companies that have been part of the Magistracy forever can make some money, instead of it all going to Detroit. Its a solid design without going too wild on cost or Tech, so can be produced cheaply and actually handled by the techs in the units it goes to. Its a heavy design, of which the Magistracy had only produced two of before. It jumps, so its able to have a little bit more maneuverability than a standard 4/6 `Mech, and its mostly energy-based weapon system lets it act for an extended period of time without too much of a reliance on ammo supplies.

So if I had to guess, I'd say what lead to the Penthesilea being produced was someone at MM&M saying "Hey, we're losing market share to Detroit. We need something new to sell to the MAF. We succeeded with the Koschei, so lets try a heavy again. Nothing too flashy, we want them buying them as fast as they come off the line. 4/6 is fine, but a little slow, lets add some jump jets. Lets stick our home built PPCs on it, and go from there."

Kit deSummersville · « **Reply #681 on:** 23 January 2013, 07:55:51 »

In universe, that's about the size of it.

Out of universe, I wanted to make them not so reliant upon Detroit because they might not have the same level of access in the Dark Ages.

cavalier1645 · « **Reply #682 on:** 25 January 2013, 13:52:09 »

Quote from: CanopusIV on 14 January 2013, 00:41:41

I read through the Field Manual: 3085 and noticed something interesting. According the the lore, in 3085 after the Jihad the Periphery nations effective strengths is as following:

BattleMech Strength-

Magistracy of Canopus: 16 regiments
Taurian Concordat: 6 regiments, 2 battalions
Marian Hegemony: 6 legions, 1 cohort (approximately 8 regiments)
Calderon Protectorate: 5 regiments
Filtvelt Coalition: 3 regiments, 1 battalion
Fronc Reaches: 3 regiments

Considering how the Magistracy recovered their industry with very little issue and rebuilt their mildly damaged facilities on Canopus and Detroit, the Magistracy is by FAR the strongest force in the Periphery (except if you count the Ravens Alliance). The closest two powers would be the Hegemony which are about to lose an entire legion since the Fourth Legion is pretty much siding with the Lothian League rebels, and the TDF is in shambles after war with the Federated Suns.

The biggest caveats? Well, several regiments need updated equipment and are better suited to fighting pirates...but the biggest hurdle? The Magistracy isn't an empire builder! That's why I love the Magistracy so much! Even with Capellan allies the Magistracy and its people doesn't seem as interested in expansion like its neighbors (with the exception of the failed invasion of Capellan space with Andurian).

It'll be interesting to see how they write the Magistracy in the upcoming decades. They're the biggest and most powerful state in the Periphery and allied with a Successor State (even if it is the Capellans). They're lacking in serious rivals, and their largest concern is probably updating their units' equipment and not getting pulled into any wars the Chancellor starts.

Just thought I'd share O:-)

Ya it seems Magistracy is the dominate state in the periphery. The TC is practically no more and only Marian Hegemony is the only real other growing power in the periphery and there too smart to tangle with the Magistracy.

CanopusIV · « **Reply #683 on:** 25 January 2013, 16:29:05 »

Well, despite the Marian's aggressiveness, they've become overextended, they've lost valuable military assets, and they lack a lot of the heavier industry needed to produce the high quality Mechs they were used to getting pre-Jihad. I highly doubt there'd be an armed confrontation between the two realms, but history has shown that the Magistrix has played a proxy-war against the Caesar and will no doubt help the Lothian League and Niops in political and material support.

Besides, once the League reforms, my guess is they won't be too happy about the Hegemony's aggressive expansionary policies against former members.

Offworlder · « **Reply #684 on:** 25 January 2013, 16:43:05 »

In the post Jihad, what sort of committments does Canopus have towards the Capellans? From what I've seen in recent publications, it seems that the Canopians actually had their army on their soil with none found in the Capellan Confederation.

Maelwys · « **Reply #685 on:** 25 January 2013, 17:03:40 »

Surprisingly, it doesn't seem like they have any. Maybe after the Capellan attack on the RAF failed in 3081, the Magistracy forces pulled back (I could swear there's something about MAF forces on the Capellan/Republic border at some point, maybe 3085?). On the other hand, the Field Report Periphery seems to have them all back in the Magistracy as well. So maybe they pulled back even before GOLDEN FORTRESS.

CanopusIV · « **Reply #686 on:** 26 January 2013, 00:12:49 »

If I had to guess, I would think that Canopian forces would continue to serve the purpose they served during the Trinity Alliance: mainly to garrison territories reclaimed by the Capellans which allowed the Capellans to devote more soldiers to the frontline. Sun-Tzu Liao and Naomi Centrella are married which maintains the political alliance, but the Canopians benefit primarily from access to Capellan goods and technologies brought on by the Xin-Sheng movement.

I'm not sure if the Canopians actually fight alongside the Capellans during Operation Golden Forces since it would mean also declaring war on the Republic of the Sphere and cause a great loss of face amongst the other Great Powers. Naomi is too cagey for that, so my guess is her forces act as garrison forces for Capellan space while the CCAF is away fighting the Republic. Of course, newer maps of the Magistracy show precisely where which units are stationed (and they're all in Magistracy space), so they might actually decide not to get involved.

False Son · « **Reply #687 on:** 26 January 2013, 00:58:24 »

My guess is that they likely did not contribute much. The Republic seems nervous about the MoC's capacities, going by the fluff in TRO3085 and Prototypes. It could be that they just don't know enough about how the MAF armed itself so suddenly. Could be that they have not yet contributed and the Republic is worried about the wildcard factor.

Maelwys · « **Reply #688 on:** 26 January 2013, 15:50:13 »

The MAF didn't really arm itself so suddenly though. They've been slowly building up from around the 4th Succession War, just like everyone else. From about 7 regiments in 3025 to 16 in 3085. And when they built a unit quickly they usually took it partially from another source (Mercs usually).

I think the Republic is worried about the Magistracy because they're tied to one of their opponents (Capellans) and because of the lack of intelligence assets in the area. The Republic knows the Magistracy has secrets that the Republic can't explain, so they worry. If the Magistracy can pull out a modified Vengeance-class DropShip from someplace, what's to stop them from showing up with something worse?

For the Republic right now, I'd expect the map of the Magistracy to have "Here be Dragons (And Canopians)" scrawled across it. As the Republic moves intelligence assets into the area and they get settled I'd expect the worry to drop a bit.

I also wouldn't be surprised if the Republic either has intelligence assets with the IE ships moving through the Canopian area, or has sponsored a few to check up on planets that the Magistracy might be using, but not put on any maps yet.

CanopusIV · « **Reply #689 on:** 26 January 2013, 15:52:50 »

Quote from: False Son on 26 January 2013, 00:58:24

My guess is that they likely did not contribute much. The Republic seems nervous about the MoC's capacities, going by the fluff in TRO3085 and Prototypes. It could be that they just don't know enough about how the MAF armed itself so suddenly. Could be that they have not yet contributed and the Republic is worried about the wildcard factor.

*nods*

Well, IIRC, the Capellans and the Magistracy were the only two powers that didn't send troops and forces to Devlin Stone to fight the Blakists and opted to do so "in their own way." While the other powers have some stake in playing nice with the new Republic (i.e they lost valuable worlds and soldiers), the Magistracy and the Capellans didn't. The Capellans weren't a part of the coalition, and I suspect you're right that the Republic views the Magistracy as a wild card. If they devoted their military to the Capellans, it would make Republican lives much more difficult, but it appears as though the Magistracy for the most part stays out of Operation Golden Fortress.