Author Topic: Power is a goal. Pleasure is eternal. Welcome to Canopus.  (Read 218062 times)

Moonsword

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Re: Power is a goal. Pleasure is eternal. Welcome to Canopus.
« Reply #240 on: 25 March 2011, 08:23:12 »
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Presence and rarity are not the same concept.  The MUL is specifically only dealing with the former.  I wouldn't assume any of the weird stuff is particularly common, just that there's some.

They way TRO:3085 read to me is that the two nations are still on a talking/trading relation.

Given that the Penthesilea is being exported to the Concordat in reasonable numbers, they definitely are conducting at least some trade in military goods.

shadow_walker

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Re: Power is a goal. Pleasure is eternal. Welcome to Canopus.
« Reply #241 on: 25 March 2011, 09:08:18 »
Given that the Penthesilea is being exported to the Concordat in reasonable numbers, they definitely are conducting at least some trade in military goods.

I think they was talk of canopian's waiting to get some 11T Warhammers. The Concordat and Majesty always seem to have a on and off relation.
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Top Sergeant

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Re: Power is a goal. Pleasure is eternal. Welcome to Canopus.
« Reply #242 on: 25 March 2011, 14:52:09 »
My Company of the 1st Canopian Cuirassiers:



Assault Lance


Fire Lance


Pursuit Lance



These were all painted by my good friend Jay who can really do a good job on yellow. :)
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Maelwys

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« Reply #243 on: 25 March 2011, 15:49:11 »
Presence and rarity are not the same concept.  The MUL is specifically only dealing with the former.  I wouldn't assume any of the weird stuff is particularly common, just that there's some.

Sure, but I think even the MUL people have said that if its on the list, it means there's more than one (in general, a handful, though relative to the size of the army in question, so you need more of them to make the list for the FedSuns than you do the MoC).

The weird stuff may not be common, and it may be focused in an individual unit, but its there. And some of the weird stuff is pretty weird. I didn't think the original Pillager was in production anywhere. Are these designs the MoC has had for hundreds of years (since they're Intro tech), or did someone start producing them for a limited time during the Jihad?

Yeah, it's kinda big, but I tried to shorten it up some.  Anyway...there's some interesting things.  The aforementioned artillery saturation, including the AIV Catapult.  Some nasty infantry, and a curious bit of Wolf's Dragoons hardware acquired after they get vaporized.  One wonders if there's a unit that went that way, or just how it ended up there.  Oh and that curious little IIC in there...that's the twin-CRAC-5(!!!!!!) and Clan LRM-10 version, with an ECM pack, 2 ERML, 2 ERSL, enough ammo to make the gunload workable, enough heat sinks to be an alpha-baby and still make slurpees, and unlike a certain Davion twin-RAC machine more rear armor than anything starting with R-I-F or J-A-G.  Crits for the crit god, headcaps for the skull throne?

I'd assume that the Dragoon hardware was bought on the open market. Those aren't the most cutting edge designs from the Dragoons, and I believe all of them were put on the general market. The MoC seems like its dipped heavily into that merc market to pick up designs.

The Warhammer IIC is just odd. I can't help but wonder if the Diamond Sharks were offering too good to be true deals on them. I can think of better designs for fighting in the MoC (such as designs that don't rely on ammo based weapons..ammo that the MoC may not be able to manufacture themselves), and I can think of designs better suited for pushing into your R&D labs, since, IIRC, those RACs are worse off than the standard IS RACs.

jimdigris

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« Reply #244 on: 25 March 2011, 15:52:28 »
Beautiful mechs, Top Sargent. O0

Moonsword

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« Reply #245 on: 25 March 2011, 16:01:28 »
I think they was talk of canopian's waiting to get some 11T Warhammers. The Concordat and Majesty always seem to have a on and off relation.

The model only entered production in 3084 and hasn't been opened for export to anyone yet, so I'd be cautious drawing any conclusions about their current relationship from that tidbit.  More to the point, the Canopians certainly seem to expect it to be available to them, they're just waiting on it, and the Taurians were the first ones cleared for exports of the Penthesilea.  They are selling the Canopians Brahmas, too.

(The wisdom of buying either 'Mech is something I'll leave for another time.)

Sure, but I think even the MUL people have said that if its on the list, it means there's more than one (in general, a handful, though relative to the size of the army in question, so you need more of them to make the list for the FedSuns than you do the MoC).

Right.  That's basically what I'm saying to keep in mind - there's at least a handful but that doesn't make anything common.

The weird stuff may not be common, and it may be focused in an individual unit, but its there. And some of the weird stuff is pretty weird. I didn't think the original Pillager was in production anywhere. Are these designs the MoC has had for hundreds of years (since they're Intro tech), or did someone start producing them for a limited time during the Jihad?

The original Pillagers did a lot of service in the Periphery during the Reunification War so it's possible someone salvaged some centuries old hulks.  Or they could be building them.  Since modern Pillager production is heavily based in the CC, it's possible they started a line and the Canopians picked up part of the production run.

I'd assume that the Dragoon hardware was bought on the open market. Those aren't the most cutting edge designs from the Dragoons, and I believe all of them were put on the general market. The MoC seems like its dipped heavily into that merc market to pick up designs.

Likely.

The Warhammer IIC is just odd. I can't help but wonder if the Diamond Sharks were offering too good to be true deals on them. I can think of better designs for fighting in the MoC (such as designs that don't rely on ammo based weapons..ammo that the MoC may not be able to manufacture themselves), and I can think of designs better suited for pushing into your R&D labs, since, IIRC, those RACs are worse off than the standard IS RACs.

The Sharks pushing ammo-using weapons on customers for vendor lock-in is not a new trick.  They've been doing that since at least the Mad Cat II.  However, while the RACs are a bit bulkier, they're longer-ranged and share lineage with the older RACs, so there's some reason to examine them.
« Last Edit: 25 March 2011, 16:03:09 by Moonsword »

Maelwys

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« Reply #246 on: 26 March 2011, 03:32:32 »
The original Pillagers did a lot of service in the Periphery during the Reunification War so it's possible someone salvaged some centuries old hulks.  Or they could be building them.  Since modern Pillager production is heavily based in the CC, it's possible they started a line and the Canopians picked up part of the production run.

Yup. The Faction Availability for it is odd as well. IS General, Merc General, TC, MC, and Clan Nova Cat. Once the Jihad is over that goes to Merc General, CC, FS, TC, MC, Nova Cats.

Weird, not necessarily common, but interesting :)

Much like the Buccaneer. Its not the greatest `Mech (I shudder to think of what they did to it compared to the original), there probably aren't more than a handful to get the "Available" tag..but why that `Mech specifically. IC and OOCly. Like I said, interesting :)

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« Reply #247 on: 26 March 2011, 04:16:03 »
Beautiful mechs, Top Sargent. O0
Agreed, but that color scheme just screams hit me.
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jimdigris

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« Reply #248 on: 26 March 2011, 07:28:12 »
Agreed.  I'm hoping TPTB could change that scheme in honor of the sacrifice the unit made during the Jihad.

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« Reply #249 on: 26 March 2011, 07:48:23 »
Agreed, but that color scheme just screams hit me.

Its what's in the book so that's what I had to go with :).
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Maelwys

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« Reply #250 on: 26 March 2011, 13:37:21 »
If I remember right, quite a few of the Magistracy color schemes sound kind of odd. Still, those `Mechs pretty much make a believer out of me and the yellow scheme.

Ian Sharpe

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« Reply #251 on: 26 March 2011, 19:20:36 »
What legs are on that Catapult, Top?

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« Reply #252 on: 26 March 2011, 20:58:57 »
What legs are on that Catapult, Top?

Catapult legs. I did not kitbash that one.

That is the Catapult from the new boxed set I bought two years ago.
« Last Edit: 26 March 2011, 21:00:33 by Top Sergeant »
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Ian Sharpe

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« Reply #253 on: 27 March 2011, 00:40:22 »
That is the Catapult from the new boxed set I bought two years ago.

Ah, not one I have.  Was wondering why I didn't recognize the legs. 

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« Reply #254 on: 27 March 2011, 03:45:18 »
Ah, not one I have.  Was wondering why I didn't recognize the legs.

In the company photo you can more easily see the fore-shortened hex base indicative of the contemporary box set miniatures.
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ANS Kamas P81

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« Reply #255 on: 27 March 2011, 06:04:36 »
The Warhammer IIC is just odd. I can't help but wonder if the Diamond Sharks were offering too good to be true deals on them. I can think of better designs for fighting in the MoC (such as designs that don't rely on ammo based weapons..ammo that the MoC may not be able to manufacture themselves), and I can think of designs better suited for pushing into your R&D labs, since, IIRC, those RACs are worse off than the standard IS RACs.
The ammo is something to consider, but the CRACs are hardly worse off.  They're certainly bulkier, but you get a 40% bump in range (out to 21!) for the trade.  Note that it matches the LRMs, which means it's a seventy-point bubble of critseeking death 43 minimum-range-free hexes across.  Something to keep in mind...
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Ian Sharpe

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« Reply #256 on: 27 March 2011, 12:55:08 »
I'd imagine any Clan mechs bought off the Sharks would probably be held back and rarely see combat.  But I like the sound of this CRAChammer.

Maelwys

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« Reply #257 on: 27 March 2011, 14:23:06 »
The ammo is something to consider, but the CRACs are hardly worse off.  They're certainly bulkier, but you get a 40% bump in range (out to 21!) for the trade.  Note that it matches the LRMs, which means it's a seventy-point bubble of critseeking death 43 minimum-range-free hexes across.  Something to keep in mind...

Ah, didn't realize the range advantage was quite that much. Might be worth studying then. I still think I'd have wanted major incentives to purchase one though :)

Ah, not one I have.  Was wondering why I didn't recognize the legs. 

And after being a Canopian fan for this long, Ian Sharpe is good with legs :)

Ian Sharpe

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« Reply #258 on: 09 April 2011, 15:43:07 »
Comedy stylings of Maelwys aside ;) , anything new on the Canopian front?  The Theseus is due to be sculpted soon-ish.  Hopefully just a few months later it will be released.

Maelwys

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« Reply #259 on: 09 April 2011, 16:51:12 »
Not a whole lot. Unless I completely missed it, there's not much about the Canopians in the new Liao Handbook, other than a picture of Naomi that seems to have her married a year early or something.

The only other new thing is the MUL.

I do find the Koschei situation interesting. Apparently the MoC is really taking a shine to the various types. They're listed as having access to the 3I, the 5I, the 5MC (natch) and the 5X interestingly. The 5X has a Jihad availability of the MoC, the WoB, and Mercs in general, while post Jihad its just the MC and Mercs. Might be another one of those advanced designs that the WoB put into production that was mentioned in M&M.

Same with the 8L Shadow Hawk which seems to be available to the MoC and WoB before the CC.

We're still awaiting the Field Report for the Periphery, and maybe some of the few remaining XTROs will deal with the Periphery a bit.

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« Reply #260 on: 09 April 2011, 17:48:00 »
It's too soon to say what we really have in the MUL.  Many errors have been found, including us getting Marian equiptment. [AAAH]

ArkRoyalRavager

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« Reply #261 on: 10 April 2011, 05:33:47 »
and maybe some of the few remaining XTROs will deal with the Periphery a bit.

I think the Periphery realms could get a lot of coverage in the XTRO Primitives volumes.

Maelwys

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« Reply #262 on: 10 April 2011, 07:20:00 »
It's too soon to say what we really have in the MUL.  Many errors have been found, including us getting Marian equiptment. [AAAH]

And the Marians getting some of ours. But still, there are some interesting things in there I think, and its a good first look atleast.

I think the Periphery realms could get a lot of coverage in the XTRO Primitives volumes.

Probably, though I'd expect the designs to be spread out, which really limits the "woohoo! Canopian!" outlook :) I am kind of curious if the upgraded "Willow Wisps" design will lead to a lightweight BA suit for the Canopians.

jimdigris

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« Reply #263 on: 10 April 2011, 14:22:54 »
It would be nice to get stats on the Athena class warship hinted at in StratOps.  I just hope it's not an upgunned Aquilla.

Maelwys

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« Reply #264 on: 10 April 2011, 14:52:02 »
That's sort of why I'm hoping not to see it in the Primitives XTRO :) I do believe its intro date is late enough that it should be its own design, using standard parts, instead of primitive engines and the like.

ArkRoyalRavager

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« Reply #265 on: 10 April 2011, 23:25:55 »
Isn't the Willow Wisps more a customized "merc" unit? Besides, the Canopians doesn't seem to be one of the Periphery "BA boomers", but stranger things have happened with XTRO Gladiators units, like the Warhammer.

The reason i stated Primitives is because we dont really got a lot of Periphery toys from the Reunification War even though they managed to hold the SLDF for 2 decades+. Also, Herb used to post a list of every XTRO in the old boards, and i dont remember an XTRO: Periphery in that list. None of the Periphery realms have any R&D going on like the Successor State programs, none of them can even muster an E technology level across the board for experimental technologies to appear, and they're still trying to rebuild their militaries to pre-Reunification War levels to care much about R&D when they can just buy whatever they can afford from the Successor States. Hence, the most likely new "experimental" units for the Canopians or other Periphery realms to appear in XTROs would be those using RetroTech. They can really help boost their militaries in an affordable and easily mass-produced manner.

Kit deSummersville

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« Reply #266 on: 10 April 2011, 23:42:15 »
Memories are such fickle things....

Quote from: Herb
In still more news: At this moment, there are 19 Experimental Tech Readouts on my "to do" list, with two completed, two assigned, and 15 more to assign. What's going INTO them is also already assigned (much to the chagrin of the writers, no doubt), and because I'm generous and gluttonous enough for this kind of abuse, here's the title rundown, in no particular order:

     XTR: Mercenaries
     XTR: Pirates
     XTR: ComStar
     XTR: Gunslingers
     XTR: Phantoms
     XTR: House Steiner
     XTR: House Marik
     XTR: House Liao
     XTR: House Kurita
     XTR: Periphery
     XTR: Boondocks
     XTR: Primitives (volume I)
     XTR: Republic of the Sphere
     XTR: Primitives (volume II)
     XTR: Corporations
     XTR: Primitives (volume III)
     XTR: Gladiators
     XTR: Clans

Bolding mine.
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Maelwys

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« Reply #267 on: 11 April 2011, 01:07:58 »
Isn't the Willow Wisps more a customized "merc" unit? Besides, the Canopians doesn't seem to be one of the Periphery "BA boomers", but stranger things have happened with XTRO Gladiators units, like the Warhammer.

Well, they're a merc/Gladiatorial unit, but their suits were rebuilt by Foxx? Infantry Systems "From the ground up" which seems to me should give them a pretty good idea how they're built. They even replaced the armor completely, and there's a fluffy new flexible joint system installed. They may not have the specs to build them, but they've obviously done some pretty detailed work on the suits, and should have lots and lots of data, which would allow them to use the suits as a starting point for a new MoC suit. After all, the same sort of data from Elemental suits lead to the IS standard, so it isn't that far fetched.

edit
Ah, shouldn't try to fix the spelling when an X is missing apparently
/edit
« Last Edit: 11 April 2011, 09:03:02 by Maelwys »

ArkRoyalRavager

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« Reply #268 on: 11 April 2011, 07:15:32 »
Memories are such fickle things....

Bolding mine.

Oops. Thanks Kit.

Well, they're a merc/Gladiatorial unit, but their suits were rebuilt by Fox
  • Infantry Systems "From the ground up" which seems to me should give them a pretty good idea how they're built. They even replaced the armor completely, and there's a fluffy new flexible joint system installed. They may not have the specs to build them, but they've obviously done some pretty detailed work on the suits, and should have lots and lots of data, which would allow them to use the suits as a starting point for a new MoC suit. After all, the same sort of data from Elemental suits lead to the IS standard, so it isn't that far fetched.
Well, that would be good, but considering the glut of powered armor in the market right now, wouldnt it be better to just license-build the Kobold/an Infiltrator MkI upgrade/Achileus?

Ebon Magistrate+BA=pwnage (EDIT:Is the Magistrate still around? These guys did some kind of heroic sacrifice against a Shadow Division, so i'm not sure if they're still a unit after the Jihad)

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« Reply #269 on: 11 April 2011, 08:31:46 »
Oops. Thanks Kit.
I live to serve.

Quote
Ebon Magistrate+BA=pwnage (EDIT:Is the Magistrate still around? These guys did some kind of heroic sacrifice against a Shadow Division, so i'm not sure if they're still a unit after the Jihad)

Sure, they have shock troops in the infantry section of TRO 3085.
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