Author Topic: Forced Boarding challenge?  (Read 705 times)

Cannonshop

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Forced Boarding challenge?
« on: 28 April 2024, 13:21:39 »
here's one for you all; design a smallcraft explicitly engineered for boarding actions (That is, deploying infantry marines or battlearmor) against an opponent who's resisting.  (to include an enemy who's trying to maneuver, spin, rotate, or otherwise make things difficult, and whose docking clamps will absolutely NOT engage).

Explain how it's supposed to work within the game rules.
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Daryk

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Re: Forced Boarding challenge?
« Reply #1 on: 28 April 2024, 13:33:21 »
The piece of gear that would most help here (the Tug Adapter) is too big to fit on a Small Craft.  Aside from that, you need speed and armor above all else

Retry

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Re: Forced Boarding challenge?
« Reply #2 on: 28 April 2024, 20:30:55 »
You can technically fit a tug adapter to a small craft, you just couldn't fit basically anything else after that.

Cannonshop

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Re: Forced Boarding challenge?
« Reply #3 on: 28 April 2024, 22:19:36 »
YOu guys can see why I'm bringing this up, right?  One of the major problems with getting Aerospace more popular, is that it's kinda...limited for the complexity.  (that is, too limited for the level  of complexity in the rules).

Forced boarding, however, is something that is likely, and while a tug  adapted dropship might be fine for locking onto a warship or jumpship?  going after a dropship is gonna be kind of both overkill, and complicated.
"If you have to ask permission, then it's no longer a Right, it has been turned into a Privilege-something that can be and will be taken from you when convenient."

PuppyLikesLaserPointers

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Re: Forced Boarding challenge?
« Reply #4 on: 29 April 2024, 06:35:05 »
Code: [Select]
Boarding Topedo (Prototype)
Type: Military Spheriod
Mass: 200 tons
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Standard)
Introduced: 3070
Mass: 200
Battle Value: 1,945
Tech Rating/Availability: E/X-X-E-D
Cost: 17,742,500 C-bills

Fuel: 7 tons (560)
Safe Thrust: 6
Maximum Thrust: 9
Heat Sinks: 11 (22)
Structural Integrity: 10

Armor
    Nose: 211
    Sides: 191/191
    Aft: 141

Cargo
    Bay 1:  BattleArmor (CS) (1)    1 Door   
    Bay 2:  BattleArmor (CS) (1)    1 Door   
    Bay 3:  Cargo (4.0 tons)        1 Door   

Ammunition:
None

Escape Pods: 0
Life Boats: 4
Crew:  1 officer, 2 enlisted/non-rated, 12 bay personnel

Notes: Mounts 35 tons of heavy ferro-aluminum armor.

Weapons
and Ammo              Location   Tonnage  Heat   SRV  MRV  LRV  ERV
2 Laser AMS             Nose      3.0      7      3    0    0    0 


Perhaps that's enough.

How to make a boarding attempt? It will just try to grapple the target ship(199.TO), that's all - it's all we need to do. Not much warships are have the cruising MP of 6+ so 6/9 would be enough to outspeed the target as long as it have enough time to accelerate.


Note that tug adaptor is unusable on grapple for it must dock with the unit in the first place, and also is not allowed when the target is actively resists. It's no in use on this topic.

Lagrange

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Re: Forced Boarding challenge?
« Reply #5 on: 29 April 2024, 07:20:31 »
Here's a 3025 tech solution.

Marines provide much denser marine points than battle armor, so instead of 24 tons of battlearmor bays, we have 10 tons of infantry compartments (storing up to 100 marines and providing up to 200 marine points) and the extra tonnage is used to mount an AC/20 making the design capable of assault as well as boarding.  The move is also 7/11 providing much more overtake than a 6/9 design.  When used as a boarding system it's short duration only since the marines are using suit air.

Code: [Select]
Interdictor Boardingcraft
Type: Military Spheriod
Mass: 200 tons
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Standard)
Introduced: 3025
Mass: 200
Battle Value: 2,244
Tech Rating/Availability: D/X-E-D-D
Cost: 13,376,750 C-bills

Fuel: 10 tons (800)
Safe Thrust: 7
Maximum Thrust: 11
Heat Sinks: 12
Structural Integrity: 11

Armor
    Nose: 201
    Sides: 169/169
    Aft: 137

Cargo
    Bay 1:  Cargo (2.5 tons)        1 Door   
    Bay 2: Infantry Compartments (10 tons) 3 Doors

Ammunition:
    20 rounds of AC/20 ammunition (4 tons)

Escape Pods: 0
Life Boats: 0
Crew:  1 officer, 2 enlisted/non-rated, 1 gunner

Notes: Mounts 39.5 tons of standard aerospace armor.

Weapons
and Ammo              Location   Tonnage  Heat   SRV  MRV  LRV  ERV
AC/20                   Nose      14.0     7     20    0    0    0 
5 Small Laser           Nose      2.5      1      3    0    0    0 

Edit: I'll add some notes.

Overtake is a key concept for hostile boarding ops.  It's how much faster the boarding craft is compared to the boarded.  Comparing speeds, we can form an overtake table as:
BoarderSpeed
5/86/97/11
Boarded3/5346
Speed4/6235
5/8013
The amount of time that a boarding target has to apply fire to boarding craft is inverse in the overtake.  So, in an extreme case a 5/8 boarding target may deliver 3x the fire against a 6/9 boarding craft relative to a 7/11 boarding craft.

W.r.t. making aerospace more popular, there's a fair bit of complexity in the SO rules.  There's some lack of canon units for many roles, addressed here.  But, my expectation is that popularity relative to mechs is actually driven by (lack of)identification.  Relative to mechs:
  • Lack of humanoid shape & actions for ASF => lack of identification.
  • Lack of stacking limits rewards quantity in ASF more making combat outcome more of a mathematical exercise => lack of identification.
  • Limited weapon complexity in ASF provides less rewards to tinkering design to mission => lack of identification.
There's nothing that can really be done about the first one within the limits of "realism".  For the second, I primarily wonder about screen launchers---they do AoE damage in space hexes and are underutilized in that role.  Theoretically, a sufficient quantity would strongly discourage stacking near a large craft.   For the third, of course you could just remove the limit on standard-only munitions for ASF.

I wonder about a 'drone first' strategy, where the pilots stay aboard a relatively-protected large craft in almost all cases and you pilot drones to achieve effects.  That at least allows a pilot to develop more (providing more identification). 

Daryk

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Re: Forced Boarding challenge?
« Reply #6 on: 29 April 2024, 08:48:22 »
If we're targeting DropShips, the Achilles might be a target...

Lagrange

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Re: Forced Boarding challenge?
« Reply #7 on: 29 April 2024, 09:04:48 »
If we're targeting DropShips, the Achilles might be a target...
It is possible to make a 9/14 boarding craft by discarding all weapons load.  If you can afford to specialize that much it provides great overtake.  One thing to be wary of is damage to the marines & crew when pulling 7g.  I've typically thought of boarding craft as assault craft which happen to also carry a few marines providing more versatility in deployment.

PuppyLikesLaserPointers

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Re: Forced Boarding challenge?
« Reply #8 on: 29 April 2024, 09:56:04 »
But if you want to make the boarding craft even faster, then you better take a dropship instead.


Code: [Select]
Boarding Topedo (Prototype 2)
Type: Military Spheriod
Mass: 200 tons
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Standard)
Introduced: 3070
Mass: 200
Battle Value: 1,692
Tech Rating/Availability: E/X-X-E-D
Cost: 15,597,000 C-bills

Fuel: 4 tons (320)
Safe Thrust: 7
Maximum Thrust: 11
Heat Sinks: 12 (24)
Structural Integrity: 11

Armor
    Nose: 192
    Sides: 192/192
    Aft: 92

Cargo
    Bay 1:  BattleArmor (CS) (1)    1 Door   
    Bay 2:  BattleArmor (CS) (1)    1 Door   

Ammunition:
None

Escape Pods: 0
Life Boats: 4
Crew:  1 officer, 2 enlisted/non-rated, 12 bay personnel

Notes: Mounts 31.5 tons of heavy ferro-aluminum armor.

Weapons
and Ammo              Location   Tonnage  Heat   SRV  MRV  LRV  ERV
None

Although I hesitated to drop the speed to 6/9, but if you want a 7/11 model then.... Anyway this version can also ship two level 1s of battle armors. Since such ships are more an one-shot weapon rather than an independent unit, lacks an internal cargo hold would be acceptable.

Else, will it better to set them as the marines rather than put the BA bay?

Hellraiser

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Re: Forced Boarding challenge?
« Reply #9 on: 20 May 2024, 21:39:11 »
Following for ideas.

Also, can anyone point me to the rules for docking w/ a hostile ship during game play?

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Daryk

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Re: Forced Boarding challenge?
« Reply #10 on: 21 May 2024, 03:23:47 »
TO:AR. pages 167-168... :)