Author Topic: Operation Not-LAM -or- Your Old LAM is Busted: What Now?  (Read 285 times)

Giovanni Blasini

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 7173
  • And I think it's gonna be a long, long time...
OK, so...after working on a similar project, I decided to just go overboard, and convert most of the canon LAMs that might've been around in one fashion or another to "Not-LAMs", using partial wings on what are otherwise BattleMech versions of the canon LAMs.  I envisioned these as old LAMs from the Succession Wars and early Clan wars that finally had their conversion gear fail, with their owners stuck trying to get as much performance out of their BattleMech forms as they can with what's on-hand.

To that end, I took the otherwise stock LAM stats, removed their conversion gear, and added a partial wing.  This tended to leave just a little bit of tonnage left over, which went towards minor improvements, usually a recon camera, or CASE, an extra laser, or a bit more armor.

I didn't, for the most part, bother revamping the Mk. I LAMs, with the exception of the WSP-100A Wasp LAM.  My goal was to create a conversion that could work in the early Clan wars, or even late Succession Wars, as parts for LAMs started to dwindle or, in the case of the Clan War, were suddenly cut off.

First up, then, is the Stinger LAM, which has two major variants: the STG-A5 and STG-A10.

The STG-A5 was pretty straightforward.  Swapping in a partial wing for LAM conversion gear freed up a half-ton of mass, which I put towards a recon camera, rather than more weaponry:

Code: [Select]
Stinger STG-A5N

Mass: 30 tons
Chassis: Standard Biped
Power Plant: 180 Fusion
Cruising Speed: 64.8 kph
Maximum Speed: 97.2 kph
Jump Jets: Standard
     Jump Capacity: 240 meters
Armor: Standard
Armament:
     3 Medium Laser
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking System: Unknown
Introduction Year: 3067
Tech Rating/Availability: F/X-X-E-D
Cost: 2,469,740 C-bills

Type: Stinger
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Advanced)
Tonnage: 30
Battle Value: 747

Equipment                                          Mass
Internal Structure                                    3
Engine                        180 Fusion              7
Walking MP: 6
Running MP: 9
Jumping MP: 8
Heat Sink                     11                      1
Gyro                                                  2
Cockpit                                               3
Armor Factor                  80                      5

                          Internal   Armor   
                          Structure  Value   
     Head                    3         9     
     Center Torso            10        12   
     Center Torso (rear)               3     
     R/L Torso               7         9     
     R/L Torso (rear)                  3     
     R/L Arm                 5         6     
     R/L Leg                 7         10   


Right Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand
Left Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand

Weapons
and Ammo              Location  Critical   Heat    Tonnage
Heat Sink                RT        1        -       1.0   
Medium Laser             RT        1        3       1.0   
3 Jump Jet               RT        3        -       1.5   
Medium Laser             LA        1        3       1.0   
3 Heat Sink              LT        3        -       3.0   
3 Jump Jet               LT        3        -       1.5   
Partial Wing           RT/LT      4/4       -       2.5   
Recon Camera             HD        1        -       0.5   
Medium Laser             RA        1        3       1.0   


With the STG-A10, meanwhile, instead of the recon camera, I added a fifth small laser, figuring that, since it already had a laser battery, what's one more?

Code: [Select]
Stinger STG-A10N

Mass: 30 tons
Chassis: Standard Biped
Power Plant: 180 Fusion
Cruising Speed: 64.8 kph
Maximum Speed: 97.2 kph
Jump Jets: Standard
     Jump Capacity: 240 meters
Armor: Standard
Armament:
     5 Small Laser
     1 Medium Laser
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking System: Unknown
Introduction Year: 3145
Tech Rating/Availability: F/X-X-X-D
Cost: 2,425,865 C-bills

Type: Stinger
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Advanced)
Tonnage: 30
Battle Value: 653

Equipment                                          Mass
Internal Structure                                    3
Engine                        180 Fusion              7
Walking MP: 6
Running MP: 9
Jumping MP: 8
Heat Sink                     11                      1
Gyro                                                  2
Cockpit                                               3
Armor Factor                  80                      5

                          Internal   Armor   
                          Structure  Value   
     Head                    3         9     
     Center Torso            10        12   
     Center Torso (rear)               3     
     R/L Torso               7         9     
     R/L Torso (rear)                  3     
     R/L Arm                 5         6     
     R/L Leg                 7         10   


Right Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand
Left Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand

Weapons
and Ammo              Location  Critical   Heat    Tonnage
Heat Sink                RT        1        -       1.0   
Medium Laser             RT        1        3       1.0   
3 Jump Jet               RT        3        -       1.5   
2 Small Laser            LA        2        1       1.0   
3 Heat Sink              LT        3        -       3.0   
3 Jump Jet               LT        3        -       1.5   
Partial Wing           RT/LT      4/4       -       2.5   
Small Laser              HD        1        1       0.5   
2 Small Laser            RA        2        1       1.0   

Neither of these are as optimized as they could be, but were meant to be more direct conversions: even the critical slot placement is essentially identical.  Both carry 11 single heat sinks, even if they probably don't need them.  There's plenty of room for improvement here, whether in the Succession War era or Clan Invasion era, and figure individual owner/operators stuck with semifunctional former LAMs probably differ wildly in what they do.
"Does anyone know where the love of God goes / When the waves turn the minutes to hours?"
-- Gordon Lightfoot, "The Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald"

Giovanni Blasini

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 7173
  • And I think it's gonna be a long, long time...
Re: Operation Not-LAM -or- Your Old LAM is Busted: What Now?
« Reply #1 on: 31 March 2024, 23:39:18 »
OK, and now for the Wasp LAMs.

Started with the WSP-100A, where the extra half-ton seemed best served as going towards CASE.  Another half-ton of armor, though, would be an equally valid choice:

Code: [Select]
Wasp WSP-100AN

Mass: 30 tons
Chassis: Standard Biped
Power Plant: 150 Fusion
Cruising Speed: 54 kph
Maximum Speed: 86.4 kph
Jump Jets: Standard
     Jump Capacity: 210 meters
Armor: Standard
Armament:
     1 Medium Laser
     1 LRM 10
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking System: Unknown
Introduction Year: 3145
Tech Rating/Availability: F/X-X-X-D
Cost: 2,407,340 C-bills

Type: Wasp
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Advanced)
Tonnage: 30
Battle Value: 687

Equipment                                          Mass
Internal Structure                                    3
Engine                        150 Fusion            5.5
Walking MP: 5
Running MP: 8
Jumping MP: 7
Heat Sink                     10                      0
Gyro                                                  2
Cockpit                                               3
Armor Factor                  64                      4

                          Internal   Armor   
                          Structure  Value   
     Head                    3         8     
     Center Torso            10        9     
     Center Torso (rear)               3     
     R/L Torso               7         7     
     R/L Torso (rear)                  3     
     R/L Arm                 5         5     
     R/L Leg                 7         7     


Right Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand
Left Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand

Weapons
and Ammo              Location  Critical   Heat    Tonnage
2 Jump Jet               LL        2        -       1.0   
Jump Jet                 CT        1        -       0.5   
Heat Sink                RT        1        -       1.0   
CASE                     RT        1        -       0.5   
LRM 10 Ammo (12)         RT        1        -       1.0   
LRM 10                   RT        2        4       5.0   
3 Heat Sink              LT        3        -       3.0   
Partial Wing           RT/LT      4/4       -       2.5   
2 Jump Jet               RL        2        -       1.0   
Medium Laser             RA        1        3       1.0   


Speaking of CASE, I went the same route for the WSP-105, adding CASE to protect the ammunition.  I'm not sure if it's the *best* choice, but it seemed like a good idea at the time:

Code: [Select]
Wasp WSP-105N

Mass: 30 tons
Chassis: Standard Biped
Power Plant: 180 Fusion
Cruising Speed: 64.8 kph
Maximum Speed: 97.2 kph
Jump Jets: Standard
     Jump Capacity: 240 meters
Armor: Standard
Armament:
     1 Medium Laser
     1 SRM 2
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking System: Unknown
Introduction Year: 3067
Tech Rating/Availability: F/X-X-E-D
Cost: 2,465,840 C-bills

Type: Wasp
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Advanced)
Tonnage: 30
Battle Value: 610

Equipment                                          Mass
Internal Structure                                    3
Engine                        180 Fusion              7
Walking MP: 6
Running MP: 9
Jumping MP: 8
Heat Sink                     11                      1
Gyro                                                  2
Cockpit                                               3
Armor Factor                  80                      5

                          Internal   Armor   
                          Structure  Value   
     Head                    3         9     
     Center Torso            10        12   
     Center Torso (rear)               3     
     R/L Torso               7         9     
     R/L Torso (rear)                  3     
     R/L Arm                 5         6     
     R/L Leg                 7         10   


Right Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand
Left Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand

Weapons
and Ammo              Location  Critical   Heat    Tonnage
SRM 2                    CT        1        2       1.0   
Heat Sink                RT        1        -       1.0   
3 Jump Jet               RT        3        -       1.5   
CASE                     RT        1        -       0.5   
SRM 2 Ammo (50)          RT        1        -       1.0   
3 Heat Sink              LT        3        -       3.0   
3 Jump Jet               LT        3        -       1.5   
Partial Wing           RT/LT      4/4       -       2.5   
Medium Laser             RA        1        3       1.0   



Lastly, we have the WSP-105M, which takes a page from the WSP-100A and switches to LRMs but, because of the higher ground speed, uses an LRM-5 instead of LRM-10.  CASE, meanwhile, protects that ammo bin:

Code: [Select]
Wasp WSP-105MNL

Mass: 30 tons
Chassis: Standard Biped
Power Plant: 180 Fusion
Cruising Speed: 64.8 kph
Maximum Speed: 97.2 kph
Jump Jets: Standard
     Jump Capacity: 240 meters
Armor: Standard
Armament:
     1 Medium Laser
     1 LRM 5
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking System: Unknown
Introduction Year: 3145
Tech Rating/Availability: F/X-X-X-D
Cost: 2,493,140 C-bills

Type: Wasp
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Advanced)
Tonnage: 30
Battle Value: 665

Equipment                                          Mass
Internal Structure                                    3
Engine                        180 Fusion              7
Walking MP: 6
Running MP: 9
Jumping MP: 8
Heat Sink                     10                      0
Gyro                                                  2
Cockpit                                               3
Armor Factor                  80                      5

                          Internal   Armor   
                          Structure  Value   
     Head                    3         9     
     Center Torso            10        12   
     Center Torso (rear)               3     
     R/L Torso               7         9     
     R/L Torso (rear)                  3     
     R/L Arm                 5         6     
     R/L Leg                 7         10   


Right Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand
Left Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand

Weapons
and Ammo              Location  Critical   Heat    Tonnage
LRM 5 Ammo (24)          RT        1        -       1.0   
3 Jump Jet               RT        3        -       1.5   
LRM 5                    RT        1        2       2.0   
CASE                     RT        1        -       0.5   
3 Heat Sink              LT        3        -       3.0   
3 Jump Jet               LT        3        -       1.5   
Partial Wing           RT/LT      4/4       -       2.5   
Medium Laser             RA        1        3       1.0   

"Does anyone know where the love of God goes / When the waves turn the minutes to hours?"
-- Gordon Lightfoot, "The Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald"

Giovanni Blasini

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 7173
  • And I think it's gonna be a long, long time...
Re: Operation Not-LAM -or- Your Old LAM is Busted: What Now?
« Reply #2 on: 31 March 2024, 23:50:27 »
Two more to go here without getting into the Wobbie LAMs, and they're both Phoenix Hawks.

First up, your traditional Phoenix Hawk LAM.  The partial wing here freed up 1.5 tons compared to a LAM conversion system, which went into armor, running the same as a PXH-2 Phoenix Hawk and CASE, because who doesn't want to protect your ammo?  Reducing the machine gun ammo down to a half-ton, plus the balance from the partial wing, left a whole ton free, so I threw on a recon camera and remote sensor dispenser.  Not sure it's my *best* choice, but it's definitely *a* choice.

Code: [Select]
Phoenix Hawk PHX-HK2N

Mass: 50 tons
Chassis: Standard Biped
Power Plant: 250 Fusion
Cruising Speed: 54 kph
Maximum Speed: 86.4 kph
Jump Jets: Standard
     Jump Capacity: 210 meters
Armor: Standard
Armament:
     2 Medium Laser
     2 Machine Gun
     1 Large Laser
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking System: Unknown
Introduction Year: 3067
Tech Rating/Availability: F/X-X-E-D
Cost: 4,615,250 C-bills

Type: Phoenix Hawk
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Advanced)
Tonnage: 50
Battle Value: 1,206

Equipment                                          Mass
Internal Structure                                    5
Engine                        250 Fusion           12.5
Walking MP: 5
Running MP: 8
Jumping MP: 7
Heat Sink                     12                      2
Gyro                                                  3
Cockpit                                               3
Armor Factor                  136                   8.5

                          Internal   Armor   
                          Structure  Value   
     Head                    3         8     
     Center Torso            16        23   
     Center Torso (rear)               5     
     R/L Torso               12        18   
     R/L Torso (rear)                  4     
     R/L Arm                 8         10   
     R/L Leg                 12        18   


Right Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand
Left Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand

Weapons
and Ammo                      Location  Critical   Heat    Tonnage
Jump Jet                         CT        1        -       0.5   
Heat Sink                        RT        1        -       1.0   
2 Jump Jet                       RT        2        -       1.0   
Large Laser                      RT        2        8       5.0   
Medium Laser                     LA        1        3       1.0   
Machine Gun                      LA        1        0       0.5   
Heat Sink                        LT        1        -       1.0   
Remote Sensors/Dispenser         LT        1        -       0.5   
2 Jump Jet                       LT        2        -       1.0   
CASE                             LT        1        -       0.5   
Partial Wing                   RT/LT      4/4       -       3.5   
Half Machine Gun Ammo (100)      LT        1        -       0.5   
Recon Camera                     HD        1        -       0.5   
Medium Laser                     RA        1        3       1.0   
Machine Gun                      RA        1        0       0.5   

That just leaves our other Phoenix Hawk LAM, the PHX-HK2M.  Here, the extra mass went to a second ton of LRM ammo, CASE, and a recon camera to help one LAM spot for indirect fire for another:

Code: [Select]
Phoenix Hawk PHX-HK2MN

Mass: 50 tons
Chassis: Standard Biped
Power Plant: 250 Fusion
Cruising Speed: 54 kph
Maximum Speed: 86.4 kph
Jump Jets: Standard
     Jump Capacity: 210 meters
Armor: Standard
Armament:
     2 Medium Laser
     1 LRM 10
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking System: Unknown
Introduction Year: 3067
Tech Rating/Availability: F/X-X-E-D
Cost: 4,613,000 C-bills

Type: Phoenix Hawk
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Advanced)
Tonnage: 50
Battle Value: 1,165

Equipment                                          Mass
Internal Structure                                    5
Engine                        250 Fusion           12.5
Walking MP: 5
Running MP: 8
Jumping MP: 7
Heat Sink                     12                      2
Gyro                                                  3
Cockpit                                               3
Armor Factor                  136                   8.5

                          Internal   Armor   
                          Structure  Value   
     Head                    3         8     
     Center Torso            16        23   
     Center Torso (rear)               5     
     R/L Torso               12        18   
     R/L Torso (rear)                  4     
     R/L Arm                 8         10   
     R/L Leg                 12        18   


Right Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand
Left Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand

Weapons
and Ammo              Location  Critical   Heat    Tonnage
Jump Jet                 CT        1        -       0.5   
Heat Sink                RT        1        -       1.0   
2 Jump Jet               RT        2        -       1.0   
LRM 10                   RT        2        4       5.0   
Medium Laser             LA        1        3       1.0   
Heat Sink                LT        1        -       1.0   
2 Jump Jet               LT        2        -       1.0   
CASE                     LT        1        -       0.5   
LRM 10 Ammo (24)         LT        2        -       2.0   
Partial Wing           RT/LT      4/4       -       3.5   
Recon Camera             HD        1        -       0.5   
Medium Laser             RA        1        3       1.0   


That takes care of the straightforward conversions, but obviously doesn't take advantage of all the tech tree that's open to a BattleMech that isn't open to a LAM.  Got some ideas on that, too.
"Does anyone know where the love of God goes / When the waves turn the minutes to hours?"
-- Gordon Lightfoot, "The Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald"

ColBosch

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 8717
  • Legends Never Die
Re: Operation Not-LAM -or- Your Old LAM is Busted: What Now?
« Reply #3 on: 01 April 2024, 00:09:20 »
I didn't, for the most part, bother revamping the Mk. I LAMs, with the exception of the WSP-100A Wasp LAM.

Yeah, the huge bomb bay on the WSP-100 doesn't allow for this kind of quick-and-dirty conversion. Five tons is a lot to fill when you don't have a plan for it. As for the STG Mk. I, you'd be better off breaking it down for parts and selling its advanced gear to just buy a better 'Mech.
BattleTech is a huge house, it's not any one fan's or "type" of fans.  If you need to relieve yourself, use the bathroom not another BattleTech fan. - nckestrel
1st and 2nd Succession Wars are not happy times. - klarg1
Check my Ogre Flickr page! https://flic.kr/s/aHsmcLnb7v and https://flic.kr/s/aHsksV83ZP

Giovanni Blasini

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 7173
  • And I think it's gonna be a long, long time...
Re: Operation Not-LAM -or- Your Old LAM is Busted: What Now?
« Reply #4 on: 01 April 2024, 01:40:07 »
Yeah, the huge bomb bay on the WSP-100 doesn't allow for this kind of quick-and-dirty conversion. Five tons is a lot to fill when you don't have a plan for it. As for the STG Mk. I, you'd be better off breaking it down for parts and selling its advanced gear to just buy a better 'Mech.

I figure any STG Mk. I LAM would soon start to resemble a Mk. II, and may even be where the STG-A10 came from.  But, yeah, you're dead on as to why.  Same with the Mk. I Phoenix Hawk LAMs.

Also, I forgot the Shadow Hawks.  Going in reverse this time, the SHD-X2 is another high-tech LAM, with double heat sinks and an ER large laser.  Assuming those were stripped, a downgraded replacement might look like this:

Code: [Select]
Shadow Hawk SHD-X2N

Mass: 50 tons
Chassis: Standard Biped
Power Plant: 200 Fusion
Cruising Speed: 43.2 kph
Maximum Speed: 64.8 kph
Jump Jets: Standard
     Jump Capacity: 180 meters
Armor: Standard
Armament:
     1 PPC
     1 Medium Laser
     1 SRM 2
     1 LRM 5
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking System: Unknown
Introduction Year: 3067
Tech Rating/Availability: F/X-X-E-D
Cost: 3,926,500 C-bills

Type: Shadow Hawk
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Advanced)
Tonnage: 50
Battle Value: 1,209

Equipment                                          Mass
Internal Structure                                    5
Engine                        200 Fusion            8.5
Walking MP: 4
Running MP: 6
Jumping MP: 6
Heat Sink                     13                      3
Gyro                                                  2
Cockpit                                               3
Armor Factor                  152                   9.5

                          Internal   Armor   
                          Structure  Value   
     Head                    3         9     
     Center Torso            16        23   
     Center Torso (rear)               8     
     R/L Torso               12        18   
     R/L Torso (rear)                  6     
     R/L Arm                 8         16   
     R/L Leg                 12        16   


Right Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand
Left Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand

Weapons
and Ammo              Location  Critical   Heat    Tonnage
Heat Sink                CT        1        -       1.0   
2 Heat Sink              RT        2        -       2.0   
LRM 5 Ammo (24)          RT        1        -       1.0   
2 Jump Jet               RT        2        -       1.0   
LRM 5                    RT        1        2       2.0   
CASE                     RT        1        -       0.5   
SRM 2 Ammo (50)          RT        1        -       1.0   
2 Heat Sink              LT        2        -       2.0   
2 Jump Jet               LT        2        -       1.0   
Partial Wing           RT/LT      4/4       -       3.5   
PPC                      LT        3        10      7.0   
SRM 2                    HD        1        2       1.0   
Medium Laser             RA        1        3       1.0   


As for the surviving SHD-X1, if anyone found it, you might end up with this:

Code: [Select]
Shadow Hawk SHD-X1N

Mass: 50 tons
Chassis: Standard Biped
Power Plant: 250 Fusion
Cruising Speed: 54 kph
Maximum Speed: 86.4 kph
Jump Jets: Standard
     Jump Capacity: 210 meters
Armor: Standard
Armament:
     1 Medium Laser
     1 LRM 5
     1 AC/2
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking System: Unknown
Introduction Year: 3067
Tech Rating/Availability: F/X-X-E-D
Cost: 4,436,000 C-bills

Type: Shadow Hawk
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Advanced)
Tonnage: 50
Battle Value: 1,057

Equipment                                          Mass
Internal Structure                                    5
Engine                        250 Fusion           12.5
Walking MP: 5
Running MP: 8
Jumping MP: 7
Heat Sink                     10                      0
Gyro                                                  3
Cockpit                                               3
Armor Factor                  152                   9.5

                          Internal   Armor   
                          Structure  Value   
     Head                    3         9     
     Center Torso            16        23   
     Center Torso (rear)               8     
     R/L Torso               12        18   
     R/L Torso (rear)                  6     
     R/L Arm                 8         16   
     R/L Leg                 12        16   


Right Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand
Left Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand

Weapons
and Ammo              Location  Critical   Heat    Tonnage
Jump Jet                 CT        1        -       0.5   
LRM 5 Ammo (24)          RT        1        -       1.0   
2 Jump Jet               RT        2        -       1.0   
LRM 5                    RT        1        2       2.0   
2 Jump Jet               LT        2        -       1.0   
AC/2 Ammo (45)           LT        1        -       1.0   
Partial Wing           RT/LT      4/4       -       3.5   
AC/2                     LT        1        1       6.0   
Medium Laser             RA        1        3       1.0   

"Does anyone know where the love of God goes / When the waves turn the minutes to hours?"
-- Gordon Lightfoot, "The Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald"

Daryk

  • Lieutenant General
  • *
  • Posts: 37418
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: Operation Not-LAM -or- Your Old LAM is Busted: What Now?
« Reply #5 on: 01 April 2024, 03:27:07 »
Not bad!  I like the Recon Cameras and Remote Sensor Dispensers! :)

Maingunnery

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 7187
  • Pirates and C3 masters are on the hitlist
Re: Operation Not-LAM -or- Your Old LAM is Busted: What Now?
« Reply #6 on: 01 April 2024, 06:54:02 »
These are all very useful designs, excellent work.  :smilie_happy_thumbup:
Herb: "Well, now I guess we'll HAVE to print it. Sounds almost like the apocalypse I've been working for...."

The Society:Fan XTRO & Field Manual
Nebula California: HyperTube Xtreme
Nebula Confederation Ships

DevianID

  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 1717
Re: Operation Not-LAM -or- Your Old LAM is Busted: What Now?
« Reply #7 on: 04 April 2024, 01:39:41 »
I am a fan of these, and I know my players would much rather hop around in these then trying to juggle the TAC ops book for turn modes, total warfare book for WIGE movement, and interstellar ops for the other LAM rules.  One player found a star league PPC phoenix hawk in a star league cache event, and I think he used it once and then never wanted to fly it on the tabletop again.

Giovanni Blasini

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 7173
  • And I think it's gonna be a long, long time...
Re: Operation Not-LAM -or- Your Old LAM is Busted: What Now?
« Reply #8 on: 05 April 2024, 02:27:38 »
I am a fan of these, and I know my players would much rather hop around in these then trying to juggle the TAC ops book for turn modes, total warfare book for WIGE movement, and interstellar ops for the other LAM rules.  One player found a star league PPC phoenix hawk in a star league cache event, and I think he used it once and then never wanted to fly it on the tabletop again.

I get what you're saying, though I will note that there's really no way around having to use Total Warfare and Interstellar Operations (or, alternatively, Record Sheets 3085 Print), since one's the core rulebook and the other's the rulebook containing LAMs.  I'll agree with you on Tactical Operations, not the least of which because I'm not in favor of turn modes being required for LAMs anyway.

With that said...this also illustrates a problem with Battletech under Total Warfare rules in general at this point.  Consider page counts on the core rulebooks, according to Sarna:

Total Warfare: 312 pages
Tech Manual: 352 pages
Tactical Operations: 424 pages
Strategic Operations: 448 pages
Interstellar Operations: 386 pages
Campaign Operations: 194 pages

Now, book splits have changed the page count a bit, but I think it's only bumped the page count up.  That's 2116 pages minimum.  Do you need them all at once?  No, of course not, but that's some significant rules bloat.
"Does anyone know where the love of God goes / When the waves turn the minutes to hours?"
-- Gordon Lightfoot, "The Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald"

Charistoph

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 3644
Re: Operation Not-LAM -or- Your Old LAM is Busted: What Now?
« Reply #9 on: 05 April 2024, 11:13:02 »
The nice thing about the split books is that you don't need to carry as many pages.

For Tactical Operations, you don't need Advanced Units & Equipment, unless other units you're bringing are using that equipment, or you've fit in Advanced Ammo or guns.

For Strategic Operations, you only need Advanced Aerospace.  Maybe.

For Interstellar Operations, you only need Alternate Eras. 

The only reason to carry the other books is if you're doing Battleforce, but then you might as well include the Alpha Strike Commander's book, too, if you want to be THAT prepared.  Campaign Operations is pretty much useful away from the table, 95% of the time (only need to look up SPAs and Force Abilities at the table).
Are you a Wolf, a Sheep, or a Hound?
Quote from: Megavolt
They called me crazy…they called me insane…THEY CALLED ME LOONEY!! and boy, were they right.

Charistoph's Painted Products of Mechanical Mayhem

Wrangler

  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 25064
  • Dang it!
    • Battletech Fanon Wiki
Re: Operation Not-LAM -or- Your Old LAM is Busted: What Now?
« Reply #10 on: 08 April 2024, 10:54:23 »
I have friend whom runs a Phoenix Hawk LAM in our campaign on MegaMek game we have weekly.

Quote from: List of LAM Rules References
Mech & Air Mech Modes
Total Warfare - Mech based Movement, Aerospace Fighter Rules
Interstellar Ops - LAM rules - 106 - Points other books 
Tac Ops 1st Ed - 1 Table - Turn Modes (pg 2) Move Radius - (Pg26) Fail Piloting Rule/turn -0
Strategic Ops - High Altiude (Fighter Mode)

Tac Ops and Interstellar Operations, most of the rules are in Interstellar,
Tac Ops mostly contains info related to Hybrid Modes WIGE Movement
And of course Total Warfare

Tac Ops it mostly just needing the turning Radius optional Rule, which is not Optional for LAMs
The Rule itself is optional for things other than LAMs, but Lams have to use it is all.
"Men, fetch the Urbanmechs.  We have an interrogation to attend to." - jklantern
"How do you defeat a Dragau? Shoot the damn thing. Lots." - Jellico 
"No, it's a "Most Awesome Blues Brothers scene Reenactment EVER" waiting to happen." VotW Destrier - Weirdo  
"It's 200 LY to Sian, we got a full load of shells, a half a platoon of Grenadiers, it's exploding outside, and we're wearing flak jackets." VoTW Destrier - Misterpants
-Editor on Battletech Fanon Wiki

Lycanphoenix

  • Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 190
  • Amaroq the Kitsune#1092
    • Message me on Telegram
Re: Operation Not-LAM -or- Your Old LAM is Busted: What Now?
« Reply #11 on: 08 April 2024, 12:53:01 »
Yeah, the huge bomb bay on the WSP-100 doesn't allow for this kind of quick-and-dirty conversion. Five tons is a lot to fill when you don't have a plan for it. As for the STG Mk. I, you'd be better off breaking it down for parts and selling its advanced gear to just buy a better 'Mech.
5 tons of cargo? :p

 

Register