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Wow, theres....a LOT being discussed here, and it's giving me some rethinks to the overall rules modding.

With all arguments so far presented, its hard to see Battlemech mode as not delicate compared to other battlemechs still. However, if we instead tweaked the other two modes, it becomes a bit more acceptable for more intricate operations.

Seems like theres also a major dissagreement on the Air Mech mode and what's so janky about it, speed being one of the major contentions.

The 5% weight has been my attempt at correcting some of the problems with how delicate and easily killed the LAM's are (for Battlemech and ASF, usually in the department of Speed/Armor/Weapons attributes, one is OK, one is bad, and the remaining one is terrible. Or all attributes are just overall bad in both modes). JJMPx2 was my way of curbing some of the heavy speeds LAM's can fly at, which make them pretty hard to hit overall. Then again, with having to change elevations at times (and the current contention on what an Air Mech can do, thanks to some stated rules seeming to compete with other stated rules from what Syzyx says), and the whole 5MP needed for takeoff by using its hover mode.

AirMechs don't fly any faster than other fast units, and slower than some. You can't nerf that without removing the reason for LAMs existing. Don't worry about the fastest AirMech. They're supposed to be fast. Think about the slowest. If you drop AirMechs speed down a third, even with a +2, the AirMech isn't any faster than that other light mechs. It removes the reason to use LAMs over a regular unit. Plus Mechs and Vehicles can move faster with XL and XXL Engines. AirMech's can't.

It take 5 MP to take off and another 5 MP to hover. To take off and hover its 10 MP +1 MP per hex moved (up to 4) +1 per elevation above 1 elevation above the ground.

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I see what Riflemech is talking about with Turn Modes being an issue and the targeting modifier. And honestly, Air Mech mode going so fast actually gives credence as to why not giving it advanced technology makes sense.

AirMech's speed was one reason for why tech restrictions. Players weren't happy with OMNI LAMs using ES and XL Engines. If speed were a problem though why don't other fast units have the same modifiers? Why single AirMechs out?
In universe they can't use those things because of the conversion system.

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So there's a couple of possible paths to take for balancing as opposed to my previous version:

Option 1:
Weight reduced to 5% of frame.
In addition to the 1 Ton of fuel, each JJ gives you a quarter Ton (20pts) of fuel built into their design.
ASF mode gains +1 MP for Safe Thrust.
Air-Mech Cruise MP = (JJx2)+2 (due to wings being treated as Partial Wings)
Increasing Elevation when Expending Cruise MP costs 1 MP each, however, does not cost anything more to maintain elevation.
There is no Turning Mode for Cruising MP, only for Flanking MP, and Flanking MP only incures air-slip of Turning Mode limit is broken.
No 5MP necessary to take off from the ground, only to hover.
Air Mech gains +2 to hit while expending Cruise MP, and +3 when expending Flank MP.
AirMech Mode can carry objects in arms, but must drop them when converting to ASF or Battlemech mode.

Option 2:
Weight is 10% of frame.
In addition to the 1 Ton of fuel, each JJ gives you a quarter Ton (20pts) of fuel built into their design.
ASF mode gains +2 MP for Safe Thrust.
Air-Mech Cruise MP = (JJx3)
There is no Turning Mode for Cruising MP, only for Flanking MP, and Flanking MP only incures air-slip of Turning Mode limit is broken.
Air Mech gains +2 to hit while expending Cruise MP, and +3 when expending Flank MP.
AirMech Mode can carry objects in arms, but must drop them when converting to ASF or Battlemech mode.

Wondering how these options fare compared to previously.

A long time ago, LAMs could be built, legally, up to 100 tons. The Conversion System weighed 10% and required a minimum of 3 JJ. Flying was 3xJJ with no heat. Launching and landing took 2MP each and was used for flying or jumping. Landing had a -4 modifier. AirMechs had to move 6 hexes. Flying gave it a +2 targeting modifier. Fire from the ground was a +4 to hit modifier, and a -1 to hit from aircraft. AirMech's wings have 1/2 of all the side torso armor (front and back). Side torso hits hit the wings. When the wings are destroyed the damage goes on to the torso, and the AirMech crashes. Damaged crits that prevented were also different as were the Fighter damage locations. Later it was refined that flying AirMechs moved like a VTOL but still had to move 6 hexes. There were no tech restrictions so XL Engines, ES, FF OMNIs were allowed.

Tactical Handbook change things some. AirMechs had a +1 targeting modifier when flying. Fighter mode had 30 points of fuel. Locations changed from Aerotech to Aerotech 2. Wings didn't have their own armor. No wing meant no flight but could still jump. LAMs can't carry bombs, can't be OMNIs.

The Quick Start rules changed things a lot more. IO changed them even more. Your rules feel like these LAMs would be a better than they were a long time ago in some ways and worse in others.

I'm okay with the 10% weight for the conversion system. I'm okay with the modified WiGE movement. Minus the Turn Modes. The Targeting shouldn't be any worse than any other unit. +1 for Cruise, +2 for Flanking, +3 when flying at 2+ Elevations above the ground. I'm okay with most tech restrictions. Cargo should be allowed though. I also think other items should be okay if they don't work in all modes and follow rules for MASC and TSM. But I'm okay if they don't.

General BattleTech Discussion / Re: Do you like Meta Currency?

« Last post by beachhead1985 on Today at 05:43:08 »

I ran a game of recon where the players had to juggle multiple types of metacurrency.

My players were highly functioning social types and they loved it.

I didn't have luck. Instead I had a favor economy where you owed people and people owed you. It was a fixed dollar value relational to every contact.

And I also had "pull". The pull economy basically worked on reputational authority. The more you did for your bosses, the more "pull" you had.

Pull and favors could be used for almost anything and almost anything could end up costing you. Failure was expensive. So was disobeying orders or going Rouge. Things like weapons and equipment were more easily traded.

It was easy to earn some favors by bringing back a few AKs for the supply rats to trade. Pull basically only came from pulling off missions. But if you had enough, you could use it to get out of a mission, even get some down time off base.

All this was in addition to us military "funny money" or piasters, illegal US dollars and South Vietnamese money, which I let them call "dong", even though that wasn't historically accurate.

They loved it.

Ground Combat / Re: What would you argue is the best Light Missile Tank in the Succession War Era?

« Last post by Sir Chaos on Today at 05:23:26 »

I voted Hunter, for the reasons everyone else has brought up, and Striker, because it´s reasonably fast, has a turret (and can thus run away while continuing to fire, instead of having to back up like the Hunter) and a backup short-ranged weapon. Hovercraft are just too vulnerable for my taste.

Clan Chatterweb / Re: Bondsmen: Random thoughts

« Last post by Metallgewitter on Today at 05:23:23 »

Yeah. And Jerome Blake was almost right when he wrote in his journal that Kerensky was going out there to simply getting himself killed.

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