Author Topic: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.  (Read 10231 times)

marauder648

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 8157
    • Project Zhukov Fan AU TRO's and PDFs
Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« on: 06 July 2019, 05:44:46 »
Eyrie Light Battlemech

The Eyrie whilst introducing nothing really new in terms of technology also represented a complete paradigm shift for Clan Jade Falcon and introduced a ‘new’ tactic and very much encouraged it. That of melee combat.

Traditionally the Clans always distained melee combat in Mechs, viewing such a thing as crude, barbaric and beneath them. Its far more honourable to rip an opponent apart whilst they are still a blip on the horizon, or, beat them to death with their bare hands in a Circle of Equals. Because the Clans are nothing if not totally contradictory. But with the Eyrie the Falcons designed a Mech to get in close and work in melee.

As one of Clan Jade Falcons Totem Mech’s the Eyrie is also the one that got the ball running with the Falcons new obsession (other than orbital bombardment) of making very stylized Mechs with distinctly avian features. With the Eyrie I get the feeling they were going for a Terror Bird kind of look as the Mech lacks arms save stubby little boxes and has long legs as well as a wickedly sharp looking beak around its cockpit.

And looking at stats, really its not THAT impressive. A 210 rated XL engine propels the 35-ton Mech up to 96kph. This is speed the Falcons are used to with their long love affair with the Kit Fox and slower Cougar, with them generally lacking super-fast light Mechs other than the near proprietary Fire Falcon. Six tons of Ferro-Fibrous armour protect the Endo-Steel skeleton and give the Mech near full protection, which is a nice change from the horribly fragile Kit Fox and probably influenced by how squishy the Kit Fox was.

Five standard Jump Jets also let the Mech leap up to 150 meters, but now one of the Eyrie’s party tricks comes into play. After testing the Partial Wing system on the Cougar X, the Eyrie went full ham with the system and made it integral to its design. This not only increased the Mech’s cooling but also gave it another 60 meters of jumping range, boosting it up to 210 meters at a time, which is a fair bit for a ‘slow’ light like the Eyrie.

This impressive agility lets the Mech leap over all but the heaviest terrain and get close which is what you really want to do in this Mech.

For a Clan Mech, the firepower appears a tad underwhelming. A pair of ATM-3’s give the Mech its main punch and 2-tons of ammunition give you some flexibility, a mix of HE and standard rounds is probably your best bet as ER ammunition’s wasted on 3 shot launchers unless you want to door ding someone.
For direct fire the Eyrie also has a pair of the good ‘ol ER Medium lasers, no complaints here, two nice solid punches with a decent range, can’t go wrong.
The remaining firepower’s a bit curious, a quartet of Micro pulse lasers don’t do that much damage individually but if all 4 hit one spot you’re still looking at a 12 point ‘dent’ in your armour. Still you'll notice that this is a fairly solid wallop. But its dispersed, spread out and not overly concentrated. But fine for thinning off a foe's armour or turning infantry into kibble. Don't expect a raw knock down punch, this isn't a Cougar Prime or a Puma Prime, or even a Kit Fox Prime, the Eyrie is all about mauling someone rather than punching through a certain area.

And that’s it…right?

Wrong. I said the Eyrie was a game changer, and mentioned melee utility, the Eyrie mounts the Clans first ever development in the field of close combat weapons. Heavily reinforced Talons on its foot actuators that can cause significant damage in a kick or probably when dragged down a Mech’s leg in a clawing like motion (which would also fit the Terror Bird like design of the Mech to a T).

The Talons are the final piece of the Eyrie puzzle. Its agility is there to let it get close and its firepower sure as hell works best up close and at point blank range it can start kicking you or even more dangerously, land a Death From Above attack. A kick from the Eyrie’s claws will do more damage than an AC-10 round, and if the Mech manages to land a DFA, then it does more damage than a Gauss Rifle and that isn’t at all bad for a 35-ton Mech.  And it must have been a terror for Inner Sphere pilots to have the Clanners piloting these things actively engaging them in melee. One might expect that from the Dominion, we know that their Rasalhagui forces like Melee and Dominion Mechs are now starting to sport retractable blades or claws, and they do have a small number of Berzerker’s in their TOE.  But to have the ultra-purist Falcons be more than willing to mix it up in melee must have come as a nasty surprise. And it wasn’t a one off either, the much later and much larger Jade Hawk Mech was also designed for close quarters combat and is far more effective at melee and this shift and increasing brutality got worse and worse under the Khanship of Malvina Hazen and her brutal, bloody interpretation of the Mongol Doctrine.

Thoughts

The Eyrie on paper looks a bit underwhelming for a Clan Mech, its not fast, its firepower is adequate but really only at short to medium ranges and its quite tough, a nice change from many Clan lights which tended towards being made of meringue when it came to armour. But it’s a Clan light quite unlike any other, and really against other Mech’s in its weight Class its still an unholy terror and is probably a superior machine than anything in its weight Class at what it does. The closest rivals are the lacklustre Mjolnir and Storm Raider. Whilst we may be used to Clan Mech’s being able to deliver big single punches of damage, the Eyrie sandblasts an opponent before the Warrior goes “KA-KAW MOTHER STRAVAG!!!” and kicking your Mech hard in the shins. The Eyrie is a real infighter, someone faster than you tries to run away, you should be able to jump after them and stay close enough. Fighting a big lumbering mech all alone, hop behind it and give him the good news into his back and the back of his legs. The Eyrie, like its bigger cousins isn’t about raw knock down power, its about whittling your opponent down before closing in to finish them off. And whilst the Talons are a nice addition and who’s going to say no to a +10 point whack, you want to thin off some armour before you go a kicking them to death.

Fighting one might be a bit unpleasant. The Eyrie’s heat neutral even if you fire the lot and jump as far as you can around so there’s no heat issues there which is a more usual Clan issue (Wulfen says hello). Its also got a lot of protection for a light Mech and whilst a few solid hits from big guns like heavy calibre AC’s or ER PPCs will put it down in short order, so would nearly any other Mech. Pulse lasers are your friends, but not if you’re having to use IS pulse lasers, because that tends to mean the Eyrie is very close to you and that’s where it wants to be. As its pretty much murder on two gangly legs for Lights you might need to devote a lot of firepower to killing this thing, but its jumping range can mean it’s a real pain in the neck to hit. And if pressed, it can jump away either behind you or behind cover.

Hard to put down and dangerous up close, the Eyrie will be a nasty thing to fight. And as the Falcons under Malvina have zero issues ganging up on people, if you see two Eyrie’s running and leaping towards you with a hungry gleam in their cockpit, prepare for some serious stinging. Still, like the Shrike and Gyrfalcon, the Eyrie requires a bit of finesse to use. Use the Mech's agility and dispersed but hard hitting firepower to weaken an opponent, never be afraid to gang up and always stomp on heads like you're crushing a tin can under your foot.

Also a though I just had. The four Falcon Totem Mech's each pair up. The Gyrfalcon and Shrike are meant to dance around at long range, picking you apart slowly. The Jade Hawk and the Eyrie are built to get in your face, and in the Jade Hawk JHK-03's case, that Mech's whole life is built around screaming RIP AND TEAR!!! before thundering towards you to bring its TSM beefed up claws to bare.

You can read the article about the Jade Hawk here - https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php?topic=38529.msg891097
And the Gyrfalcon here - https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php?topic=57138.0
And here's the Shrike - https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php?topic=65838.0








As always, thoughs and comments are most welcome!
« Last Edit: 06 July 2019, 06:23:08 by marauder648 »
Ghost Bears: Cute and cuddly. Until you remember its a BLOODY BEAR!

Project Zhukov Fan AU TRO's and PDFs - https://thezhukovau.wordpress.com/

Sabelkatten

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 6952
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #1 on: 06 July 2019, 05:55:28 »
As an IS player I think anything that makes the clanners want to close is a good thing!  >:D

Weirdo

  • Painter of Borth the Magic Puma
  • Catalyst Demo Team
  • Major General
  • *
  • Posts: 40758
  • We can do it. We have to.
    • Christina Dickinson Writes
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #2 on: 06 July 2019, 11:01:51 »
Not quite as necessary as with the Shrike, but this strikes me as another mech that gets disproportionately more lethal when an elite pilot is at the controls, especially when TacOps rules are in play. Imagine one of these coming at you, using Skilled Evasion to dodge most of your shots at range, then when close it uses Aimed Shots to put all the weapons damage into the legs prior to a taloned kick.
My wife writes books
"Thanks to Megamek, I can finally play BattleTech the way it was meant to be played--pantsless!"   -Neko Bijin
"...finally, giant space panties don't seem so strange." - Whistler
"Damn you, Weirdo... Damn you for being right!" - Paul
"...I was this many years old when I found out that licking a touchscreen in excitement is a bad idea." - JadeHellbringer
"We are the tribal elders. Weirdo is the mushroom specialist." - Worktroll

Empyrus

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 9102
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #3 on: 06 July 2019, 11:19:21 »
Unpleasant all right.
Kicks do 11 points of damage. ATMs with HE do up to 9 each. ERMLs and mPLs add another 14 and 12 damage.
And it will attempt that after a 7 hex jump, probably in your back. Figure your best bet is to fall on your back, on top of the Eyrie at that point. (Pity this not actually possible.)

Natasha Kerensky

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 3437
  • Queen of Spades, First Lady of Death, Black Widow
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #4 on: 06 July 2019, 13:52:13 »
Quote
... Dominion mechs are starting to sport retractable blades and claws...

Are there any canon Bear (or Wolf) mechs with claws yet?

I only because ask I’ve long thought there should be given the precedents the Falcons set with the Eyrie and Turkina.  That and I like decapitating my opponents.  Want to make sure I didn’t miss something.

Good article.  Not a fan of lights in melee combat, but the Eyrie is workable.  Wish the ground speed/engine size and weapons load out were more optimized.



« Last Edit: 06 July 2019, 14:19:15 by Natasha Kerensky »
"Ah, yes.  The belle dame sans merci.  The sweet young thing who will blast your nuts off.  The kitten with a whip.  That mystique?"
"Slavish adherence to formal ritual is a sign that one has nothing better to think about."
"Variety is the spice of battle."
"I've fought in... what... a hundred battles, a thousand battles?  It could be a million as far as I know.  I've fought for anybody who offered a decent contract and a couple who didn't.  And the universe is not much different after all that.  I could go on fighting for another hundred years and it would still look the same."
"I'm in mourning for my life."
"Those who break faith with the Unity shall go down into darkness."

Empyrus

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 9102
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #5 on: 06 July 2019, 14:03:05 »
Are there any canon Bear (or Wolf) mechs with claws yet?
Unfortunately no.
The Jade Hawk's mercenary version sports Claws, as does the Dasher II 3 but that's another design sold to mercs.

Even Falcons don't really use Talons. The Eyrie, Turkina X and U (spacemech config), Pariah US (another spacemech), and Sarath B (Inner Sphere 'Mech) are the only 'Mechs to use Talons.

The Ryoken III-XP C has a lance (and the chassis has TSM), and the 'Mech is a Wolf design so i reckon Wolves using melee weapons is only a matter of time. Maybe.
« Last Edit: 06 July 2019, 14:05:08 by Empyrus »

Scotty

  • Alpha Strike Guru by appointment to the FWLM
  • Catalyst Demo Team
  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 13687
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #6 on: 06 July 2019, 14:16:41 »
Good article.  Not a fan of lights in melee combat, but the Eyrie is workable.  Wish the ground speed/engine size and weapons load out were more optimized.

I'm pretty sure that the 6/9/5* movement speed is the most tonnage efficient way to get to a +4 TMM on a 30 ton design.  If you drop the Partial Wing and go to 7/11/7 with standard equipment only then it's a half ton overweight and also misses out on the bonus 3 heat dissipation, which at this size is 1:1 for the cost of DHSs for the same heat.  I don't think there's anything to optimize on the speed/engine front.

Weapons wise, paired ATM-3s with HE compare favorably to paired SRM-4s since the ATMs come with built-in Artemis IV that pushes their average damage above 6 per shot.  They also generate one point less heat each than an SRM-4 would at the same tonnage, and have advantage in damage groupings against bigger targets.  Micro Pulse Lasers are the only thing I can really see changing and even then you lose damage going up to a single Small Pulse each, or grouping all the lasers into two Medium Pulses.  Changing to all ER Mediums is... really boring even if it's technically 'optimized'.
Catalyst Demo Agent #679

Kansas City players, or people who are just passing through the area, come join us at the Geekery just off Shawnee Mission Parkway for BattleTech!  Current days are Tuesdays in the afternoon and evening.  I can't make every single week, but odds are pretty good that somebody will be there.

Empyrus

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 9102
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #7 on: 06 July 2019, 14:22:15 »
I'm not sure mPLs are bad here. Jumps reduce attack accuracy, and given that the Eyrie is likely a backstabber, few accurate shots seems good to me.

Though i suppose the thing can't be always backstabbing and more range in general wouldn't be bad.

EDIT Plus as it is, the 'Mech can maintain heat neutrality. Though i wouldn't mind extra firepower, damn the heat...

Natasha Kerensky

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 3437
  • Queen of Spades, First Lady of Death, Black Widow
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #8 on: 06 July 2019, 14:30:54 »
I don't think there's anything to optimize on the speed/engine front.

I was thinking of dropping the speed to 5/8/5 like the Cougar and keeping the Partial Wing.  I assumed that would save a ton or two for ploughing back into weapons or armor, but maybe I’m wrong.

Quote
Changing to all ER Mediums is... really boring even if it's technically 'optimized'.

She’s a jumpy design, so I’d be looking for targeting modifiers to offset that +3.  Bigger pulses, Artemis V, and/or targ comp/AES.  I know it’s munchkin, but this is the kind of mech that needs it absent really good gunnery skills.
"Ah, yes.  The belle dame sans merci.  The sweet young thing who will blast your nuts off.  The kitten with a whip.  That mystique?"
"Slavish adherence to formal ritual is a sign that one has nothing better to think about."
"Variety is the spice of battle."
"I've fought in... what... a hundred battles, a thousand battles?  It could be a million as far as I know.  I've fought for anybody who offered a decent contract and a couple who didn't.  And the universe is not much different after all that.  I could go on fighting for another hundred years and it would still look the same."
"I'm in mourning for my life."
"Those who break faith with the Unity shall go down into darkness."

Natasha Kerensky

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 3437
  • Queen of Spades, First Lady of Death, Black Widow
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #9 on: 06 July 2019, 14:33:11 »
Unfortunately no.

Thanks Emp.  Good to know I hadn’t missed something.
"Ah, yes.  The belle dame sans merci.  The sweet young thing who will blast your nuts off.  The kitten with a whip.  That mystique?"
"Slavish adherence to formal ritual is a sign that one has nothing better to think about."
"Variety is the spice of battle."
"I've fought in... what... a hundred battles, a thousand battles?  It could be a million as far as I know.  I've fought for anybody who offered a decent contract and a couple who didn't.  And the universe is not much different after all that.  I could go on fighting for another hundred years and it would still look the same."
"I'm in mourning for my life."
"Those who break faith with the Unity shall go down into darkness."

Empyrus

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 9102
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #10 on: 06 July 2019, 14:35:16 »
Dropping the engine would gain two tons for 5/8/7 movement. Maxed out crits at that point without additional tweaks.

Personally i'd be inclined to add AES to arms for the ATMs. -1 targeting bonus for missiles but without the ECM vulnerability Artemis V has.
AES would be 1 crit and 1 ton per arm, biggest issue is finding two slots...

EDIT Workshop: https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php?topic=65910
« Last Edit: 06 July 2019, 14:39:21 by Empyrus »

Firesprocket

  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 2945
  • Broke the Bandwagon
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #11 on: 06 July 2019, 15:19:30 »
The damage profile looks really good when you get right next to someone so you can unless hell.  I just can't get behind the design though because regardless of that 7 jump it has a 6/9 land speed and doesn't weapons to support just hoping around all the time outside of 3 hexes.  There are a modest amount of mechs that jump 6 and 7 hexes that carry pulse lasers and I feel they would eat the Eyrie for breakfast.  Perhaps it looks different when taken in the context of the Dark Age era.

Empyrus

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 9102
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #12 on: 06 July 2019, 15:32:09 »
I don't think the Eyrie is a zell 'Mech. That is, if you're engaging Eyries, you can be sure their companions are shooting at you as well.
So the Eyrie's lack of range may not be an issue since it can approach targets quickly while friendlies cover that approach.

Or since the Dark Age has greater emphasis on combined arms, even among the Clans (partially by necessity), and Clan conventional vehicles have never really taken part in zell, the Eyrie maybe supported by those, such as the Falcons' Gurzil.

Scotty

  • Alpha Strike Guru by appointment to the FWLM
  • Catalyst Demo Team
  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 13687
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #13 on: 06 July 2019, 15:52:50 »
She’s a jumpy design, so I’d be looking for targeting modifiers to offset that +3.  Bigger pulses, Artemis V, and/or targ comp/AES.  I know it’s munchkin, but this is the kind of mech that needs it absent really good gunnery skills.

I'm pretty sure Artemis V can't be applied to ATMs, so you'd be looking at reworking all of the missiles and probably consolidating to one launcher at most to avoid the 1.5 tons of Artemis V from stacking twice, which means that unless you gut the lasers (even if you do drop the engine weight) you're looking at... an SRM-6, at best.  Maybe an LRM-15 if you drop down to only one ton of ammo, which seems counter-productive.

Bigger pulse lasers actually significantly drop the damage the Eyrie will do.  Two Small Pulse Lasers is 10 damage instead of the four Micro Pulse's 12.  One Medium Pulse is 7 damage.  Bigger pulse weapons gets you a bonus when you're not at 1 hex range, but the Eyrie absolutely wants to be at 1 hex range for the extra kick damage.

The only weapons in the arms are missiles unless you basically click "clear" on the equipment list and start over.  At that point it's not really "optimizing" so much as "doing over".

The damage profile looks really good when you get right next to someone so you can unless hell.  I just can't get behind the design though because regardless of that 7 jump it has a 6/9 land speed and doesn't weapons to support just hoping around all the time outside of 3 hexes.  There are a modest amount of mechs that jump 6 and 7 hexes that carry pulse lasers and I feel they would eat the Eyrie for breakfast.  Perhaps it looks different when taken in the context of the Dark Age era.

Off the top of my head that short list includes the Uziel 8S and the Wraith.  The Uziel is a ****** monster of a machine that I would put 1-on-1 against most 'Mechs in the game, the Wraith is also pretty good.  I wouldn't necessarily pick the Eyrie to win either of those fights (honestly against the Wraith I'd call it pretty even and depending entirely on who wins initiative on a given turn) but that's more of a function of both of them being 20+ tons heavier with the same mission profile.

The Eyrie should absolutely be hopping around every turn; your weapons are for when you get close, not for closing.  Jumping 7 should allow you to close with almost any 'Mech in the game.  The ones you can't are the ones you probably won't have to chase because they'll be coming to you or they won't be engaging at all.
Catalyst Demo Agent #679

Kansas City players, or people who are just passing through the area, come join us at the Geekery just off Shawnee Mission Parkway for BattleTech!  Current days are Tuesdays in the afternoon and evening.  I can't make every single week, but odds are pretty good that somebody will be there.

Ghost_msl

  • Corporal
  • *
  • Posts: 63
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #14 on: 06 July 2019, 17:03:24 »
I'm pretty sure Artemis V can't be applied to ATMs, so you'd be looking at reworking all of the missiles and probably consolidating to one launcher at most to avoid the 1.5 tons of Artemis V from stacking twice, which means that unless you gut the lasers (even if you do drop the engine weight) you're looking at... an SRM-6, at best.  Maybe an LRM-15 if you drop down to only one ton of ammo, which seems counter-productive.

Bigger pulse lasers actually significantly drop the damage the Eyrie will do.  Two Small Pulse Lasers is 10 damage instead of the four Micro Pulse's 12.  One Medium Pulse is 7 damage.  Bigger pulse weapons gets you a bonus when you're not at 1 hex range, but the Eyrie absolutely wants to be at 1 hex range for the extra kick damage.

The only weapons in the arms are missiles unless you basically click "clear" on the equipment list and start over.  At that point it's not really "optimizing" so much as "doing over".

Off the top of my head that short list includes the Uziel 8S and the Wraith.  The Uziel is a ****** monster of a machine that I would put 1-on-1 against most 'Mechs in the game, the Wraith is also pretty good.  I wouldn't necessarily pick the Eyrie to win either of those fights (honestly against the Wraith I'd call it pretty even and depending entirely on who wins initiative on a given turn) but that's more of a function of both of them being 20+ tons heavier with the same mission profile.

The Eyrie should absolutely be hopping around every turn; your weapons are for when you get close, not for closing.  Jumping 7 should allow you to close with almost any 'Mech in the game.  The ones you can't are the ones you probably won't have to chase because they'll be coming to you or they won't be engaging at all.

RE: A5 and ATM's that is correct - but one COULD trade the regular ATM's for iATM's if they are available and that's a whole different kettle of fish.

Empyrus

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 9102
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #15 on: 06 July 2019, 17:06:22 »
iATMs don't seem to be available to Inner Sphere Clans, otherwise they'd be using them almost certainly already. I suspect that if the SharkFoxes, who compiled the Wars of Reaving book, have the specs, they're saving them for some emergency. But more likely they simply don't have those.

I think we should be thankful about that, imagine the Falcons upgrading all their ATMs to iATMs. Those things are pure murder...

Natasha Kerensky

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 3437
  • Queen of Spades, First Lady of Death, Black Widow
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #16 on: 06 July 2019, 17:17:55 »
I'm pretty sure Artemis V can't be applied to ATMs,

No, I meant replacing the ATMs with ArtV-enhanced SRMs.  Whether it makes sense given the design’s weight and critical limitations, I have not worked out.  Emp’s use of AES with ATMs is a good or better alternative.

Quote
Bigger pulse lasers actually significantly drop the damage the Eyrie will do.

That’s okay.  I’m interested in chunking leg armor at range so the opponent will more easily fall to the Eyrie’s kick in melee.  As a light, the Eyrie can’t afford to kick and kick and kick without getting whacked in return.  It needs to dance a little and land a couple hits before closing.  I think the missiles and a couple pulse or ER pulse medium lasers will provide enough close-range damage and critting to go with the kick.
"Ah, yes.  The belle dame sans merci.  The sweet young thing who will blast your nuts off.  The kitten with a whip.  That mystique?"
"Slavish adherence to formal ritual is a sign that one has nothing better to think about."
"Variety is the spice of battle."
"I've fought in... what... a hundred battles, a thousand battles?  It could be a million as far as I know.  I've fought for anybody who offered a decent contract and a couple who didn't.  And the universe is not much different after all that.  I could go on fighting for another hundred years and it would still look the same."
"I'm in mourning for my life."
"Those who break faith with the Unity shall go down into darkness."

JPArbiter

  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 3139
  • Podcasting Monkey
    • Arbitration Studios, your last word in battletech talk
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #17 on: 06 July 2019, 17:32:30 »
I'm pretty sure that the 6/9/5* movement speed is the most tonnage efficient way to get to a +4 TMM on a 30 ton design.  If you drop the Partial Wing and go to 7/11/7 with standard equipment only then it's a half ton overweight and also misses out on the bonus 3 heat dissipation, which at this size is 1:1 for the cost of DHSs for the same heat.  I don't think there's anything to optimize on the speed/engine front.

Weapons wise, paired ATM-3s with HE compare favorably to paired SRM-4s since the ATMs come with built-in Artemis IV that pushes their average damage above 6 per shot.  They also generate one point less heat each than an SRM-4 would at the same tonnage, and have advantage in damage groupings against bigger targets.  Micro Pulse Lasers are the only thing I can really see changing and even then you lose damage going up to a single Small Pulse each, or grouping all the lasers into two Medium Pulses.  Changing to all ER Mediums is... really boring even if it's technically 'optimized'.

Strait swap the ER’s for heavies. This puppy is a kicker so it is best to try and assure as many PSRs as possible.

As far as the micros, I view these more as unlimited use crit seekers as well as anti personnel weaponry. This is especially prevalent if you pair an eyrie with a cougar using a long range configuration (read: most of them) at that point an opponent will be running circles unsure of what threat to attack, and the eyrie can simultaniously supplement and screen for it’s omni cousin
Host of Arbitration, your last word in Battletech Talk

Empyrus

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 9102
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #18 on: 06 July 2019, 17:33:43 »
I tried fitting Art V SRMs but without significant changes, it is difficult. They take a lot of space for relatively low mass.
Plus Art V suffers from ECM removing the accuracy bonus.

Improved Heavy lasers are also problematic due to their space requirements.

Scotty

  • Alpha Strike Guru by appointment to the FWLM
  • Catalyst Demo Team
  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 13687
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #19 on: 06 July 2019, 17:54:33 »
That’s okay.  I’m interested in chunking leg armor at range so the opponent will more easily fall to the Eyrie’s kick in melee.  As a light, the Eyrie can’t afford to kick and kick and kick without getting whacked in return.  It needs to dance a little and land a couple hits before closing.  I think the missiles and a couple pulse or ER pulse medium lasers will provide enough close-range damage and critting to go with the kick.

The Eyrie should be trying to stay in an unkickable hex whenever it moves.  If it can't do that, it needs to not be in a hex that can become kickable.  That doesn't really change even if you extend the range of the pulse lasers.  It also means the Eyrie naturally excels at targeting a specific side of a given enemy, so you can ensure that the kick always hits the same side, and as much damage as possible is put onto that side of the target.

I almost wish the ER Mediums were actually more Micro Pulses, or maybe Small Pulses, so that it was feasible to look for a knockdown with just the pulse weapons for the accuracy bonus.
Catalyst Demo Agent #679

Kansas City players, or people who are just passing through the area, come join us at the Geekery just off Shawnee Mission Parkway for BattleTech!  Current days are Tuesdays in the afternoon and evening.  I can't make every single week, but odds are pretty good that somebody will be there.

Natasha Kerensky

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 3437
  • Queen of Spades, First Lady of Death, Black Widow
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #20 on: 06 July 2019, 18:42:47 »
The Eyrie should be trying to stay in an unkickable hex whenever it moves.  If it can't do that, it needs to not be in a hex that can become kickable.

That may work fine against some opponents and in some situations.

But there’s more to worry about when in melee range than getting kicked back.  There are other melee attacks or short-range loadouts that we wouldn’t want to expose a light like the Eyrie to for multiple turns.

And outside of 1-on-1 trials, there’s no way to control whether an opponent has a wingman covering certain hexes next to the Eyrie’s target or whether the Eyrie might not be the priority in the move sequence and need to stay at a safer distance.

For these reasons, I prefer that even a melee design be capable of some substantive mid-range damage, especially a light and vulnerable one like the Eyrie.  That said...

Quote
I almost wish the ER Mediums were actually more Micro Pulses, or maybe Small Pulses, so that it was feasible to look for a knockdown with just the pulse weapons for the accuracy bonus.

There’s nothing wrong with a riskier all-or-nothing design like this.  As long as we know what we’re playing with.
"Ah, yes.  The belle dame sans merci.  The sweet young thing who will blast your nuts off.  The kitten with a whip.  That mystique?"
"Slavish adherence to formal ritual is a sign that one has nothing better to think about."
"Variety is the spice of battle."
"I've fought in... what... a hundred battles, a thousand battles?  It could be a million as far as I know.  I've fought for anybody who offered a decent contract and a couple who didn't.  And the universe is not much different after all that.  I could go on fighting for another hundred years and it would still look the same."
"I'm in mourning for my life."
"Those who break faith with the Unity shall go down into darkness."

glitterboy2098

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 11991
    • The Temple Grounds - My Roleplaying and History website
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #21 on: 06 July 2019, 21:17:32 »
iATMs don't seem to be available to Inner Sphere Clans, otherwise they'd be using them almost certainly already. I suspect that if the SharkFoxes, who compiled the Wars of Reaving book, have the specs, they're saving them for some emergency. But more likely they simply don't have those.

I think we should be thankful about that, imagine the Falcons upgrading all their ATMs to iATMs. Those things are pure murder...
or the Foxes have enough data on the Wars of Reaving and the immediate aftermath to determine what the iATM could do, but not enough to be successful in reverse engineering it.

SteelRaven

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 9545
  • Fight for something or Die for nothing
    • The Steel-Raven at DeviantArt
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #22 on: 06 July 2019, 22:18:40 »
Never thought of the Eyrie as a sort of standard Cougar but it makes sense.
Battletech Art and Commissions
http://steel-raven.deviantart.com

Maelwys

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 4872
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #23 on: 06 July 2019, 22:44:02 »
IO has iATMs listed at Availability E for the Dark Age Era, so they're out there somewhere....

marauder648

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 8157
    • Project Zhukov Fan AU TRO's and PDFs
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #24 on: 07 July 2019, 00:57:08 »
Was the article alright folks? Tone and information wise that is :)
Ghost Bears: Cute and cuddly. Until you remember its a BLOODY BEAR!

Project Zhukov Fan AU TRO's and PDFs - https://thezhukovau.wordpress.com/

glitterboy2098

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 11991
    • The Temple Grounds - My Roleplaying and History website
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #25 on: 07 July 2019, 01:24:20 »
IO has iATMs listed at Availability E for the Dark Age Era, so they're out there somewhere....
Availability E = unique. so while they exist, they are basically unavailable short of GM intervention.

Empyrus

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 9102
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #26 on: 07 July 2019, 01:44:27 »
F is extremely rare. E is just rare. X is extinct or essentially unique.

EDIT Considering that Campaign Operations example that used the Homeworld Clans is set in 3085 or so, ie essentially after the Jihad, corresponding to the fourth letter, i'd say the availability rating is for the HW Clans.
iATMs are very rare tech overall during the Jihad/Wars of Reaving, but its post-war spread has increased its availability to E within the HW Clans.
Plus even though we've no news of the HW Clans, iATMs exists there, hence the rating. If the ratings were more detailed, it'd be probably be "IS:X, HW: E"

But we're drifting away from the Eyrie, we can set aside any hopes for iATM-equipped Eyries now. And "whatever works at your table" is always applicable.
« Last Edit: 07 July 2019, 01:51:34 by Empyrus »

Maelwys

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 4872
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #27 on: 07 July 2019, 01:48:57 »
Its availability F and X that are close to Unique, not E. IO (pg. 33) states "while F represents an item that is extremely hard to come by. An Availability code of x for a given era means the item oesn't exist, has gone extinct, or is so incredibly rare as to be effectively unique in the universe."

E is just very rare (to use the phrasing from ATOW). Its in the same category as say, Hardened Armor, Talons and Boosted Emergency systems, among others.

Deadborder

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 7881
  • Technical Victory!
    • Elmer Studios Blog
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #28 on: 07 July 2019, 04:16:04 »
The Eyrie is a horrible little beast made of fire and damnation. I've used them to eviscerate heavier 'Mechs with surprising ease; while they lack a big punch, they can do 40+ damage at close range and that's before the horrible kick.

Love this thing. But hate fighting it.
Author of BattleCorps stories Grand Theft Agro and Zero Signal



How to Draw MegaMek Icons the Deadborder Way. Over 9000 so far. Determination or madness?

Colt Ward

  • Lieutenant General
  • *
  • Posts: 28960
  • Gott Mit Uns
    • Merc Periphery Guide- Bakunin
Re: Slightly Early Mech of the Week - Eyrie.
« Reply #29 on: 07 July 2019, 23:07:31 »
Never really ran into one, but my impression is more 'meh' b/c the MWDA weps load out.  But a couple of posts have made me rethink that load . . . and for its purpose as a flying Fire Moth H, it might work.  Someone's suggestion of replacing the ERMLs with Heavy Meds might work if they were iHMLs- definitely exploit being behind someone that way.

Unlike the Shrike, I think this actually works for the Falcon's light portion of the touman- they would be replacing Kit Fox, Cougars, isorla Adders, Spirits, and maybe Hellion Omnis . . . the last two- Spirits & Hellions- I do not think would be a good replacement, since both those machines have speed & (can) jump.

How does it stack up against neighbors (again using some of the comparisons of the Shrike) . . . pretty good as a combat light, and maybe a passable job as a scout hunter.  I do not see it catching the Wulfen but most of the Steiner light scouts do not jump IIRC and likely the Horses would be using protos, hovers or other vehicles.
Colt Ward
Clan Invasion Backer #149, Leviathans #104

"We come in peace, please ignore the bloodstains."

"Greetings, Mechwarrior. You have been recruited by the Star League to defend the Frontier against Daoshen and the Capellan armada."

 

Register