Author Topic: Rasalhague Dominion: The voting will continue until morale improves!  (Read 51331 times)

MoneyLovinOgre4Hire

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The Support Golem is a hilarious source of Advanced SRMs that Will. Not. Die.  One point has half the number of missile tubes as an SRM carrier, but between the improved accuracy and improved cluster modifier of Advanced SRMs you'll probably do as much damage and it's also got at least twice the armor.  Shame you need a vehicle with an Infantry Bay to move it, though, since it's an assault suit.

Leg attacks are a good option- they can easily cripple a mech in a couple of hits.  Swarms, yeah, that's mostly only useful if you've got a mech that's immobile or prone. And since it doesn't start taking damage until the round after you've swarmed it, bleh.

As far as Elementals go, Elemental IIIs or Fire Resistant Elementals are the way to go.
Warning: this post may contain sarcasm.

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JAMES_PRYDE

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Golems with LRMs ? and x1 ER Medium laser ?

nice upgrade

MoneyLovinOgre4Hire

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Golems with LRMs ? and x1 ER Medium laser ?

nice upgrade

There's no Golem suit that has an ER Medium Laser or LRMs.
Warning: this post may contain sarcasm.

"I think I've just had another near-Rincewind experience," Death, The Color of Magic

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Kerfuffin(925)

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Has anyone actually used a Rime Otter?

I’m still not sure if it’s good
NCKestrel’s new favorite.

MoneyLovinOgre4Hire

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I like it.  Firepower isn't great for a Clan omni of its size, but it absorbs plenty of damage.
Warning: this post may contain sarcasm.

"I think I've just had another near-Rincewind experience," Death, The Color of Magic

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JAMES_PRYDE

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There's no Golem suit that has an ER Medium Laser or LRMs.

O ok, I thought there was a post about it in this thread ?

MoneyLovinOgre4Hire

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The Gnome suit has an LRM variant.
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Tyler Jorgensson

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Has anyone actually used a Rime Otter?

I’m still not sure if it’s good

Yes. I’ve used the Prime often and it does absorb a lot of damage and puts out a decent amount with its twin large pulse forcing opponents to either obliterate it and save your other mechs or ignore it and take hits from it. Going to use the hatchet version soon in a game

Jellico

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Trothkin! Some help/advice is needed.

I’m going to be running mass Elementals in games again soon and need to refresh myself on the rules: what’s the book for that again?

Also any advice on the Swarm/Anti-Mech attacks would be appreciated. AFAIK it’s just a good way to damage mech legs in melee as BA? But am I missing something big? (Obviously lol)

Usually I just run with APG Elementals BUT I kinda want to throw in a heavier suit with a big gun (still transportable by Omni). Any suggestions?

Thanks in advance

What do you want your BA to do? Eg, I try to avoid BA vs BA.

Has anyone actually used a Rime Otter?

I’m still not sure if it’s good
It is no better or worse than its peers. Mostly you can't shoot your way out of trouble like with a Stormcrow or Nova. It is not too different to a Stooping Hawk.

Tyler Jorgensson

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I’m going to be running against a full mech Star, and the Elementals will be riding shotgun on my Omnis (mostly configured for short range murder like the mentioned Rime Otter Hatchet (C?)).

In the past I’ve mostly used them as delaying forces, skirmishers, roadblocks, or annoyances. This time I want to maybe do a bit more. I’ve got about 3-4K BV for up to a Star if necessary although I don’t need to use the full BV.

Objective will probably be full on PvP last man standing. Probably against a bunch of Falcon staples: I honestly expect a Hellbringer, Grand Summoner, Jupiter, Jade Phoenix, Gyrfalcon, Heirofalcon, Zion Sparrow combo force… but I’m not honestly trying to form a force specifically tailored to murder them.

Jellico

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Honestly I would aim for missile spam. Rogue Bears and Elementals. Remember RBs can't keep up as well. I would take the STD for the extra missile.

Facing Mechs thr ERSmall Callistos are interesting for their big bite on a fastish chassis. The ER Medium is better against BA.

The Constable and Kobold aren't really useful in a knock down drag them out game. Some people recommend the Kobold IIC for knee capping. I can see how that would work. Don't bother with the Wraith.


MoneyLovinOgre4Hire

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Is there anything that the Wraith is actually good for?
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BrianDavion

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Is there anything that the Wraith is actually good for?

..... Warcrimes?
The Suns will shine again

Jellico

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I would try it as an anti tank platform. The Golem was surprisingly useful at stepping out of a building and critting with its Bearhunters. A Wraith should be similar.

truetanker

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Someone doing BA?

Have you tried the WoB and that meme way?

Kill it. Kill it with FIRE!!1! ?

Salamander (any), Elemental (Fire) and Resgate (any) and hose everything with Incendiary and Inferno missiles, and Heavy use of Flamers. Make it a living hell, set fire to everything. Dezgra, maybe...

If this is a pick-up game, why wouldn't you? Campaign, yeah, shouldn't or limit it to a few units.

But yeah,



TT
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Tyler Jorgensson

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Someone doing BA?

Have you tried the WoB and that meme way?

Kill it. Kill it with FIRE!!1! ?

Salamander (any), Elemental (Fire) and Resgate (any) and hose everything with Incendiary and Inferno missiles, and Heavy use of Flamers. Make it a living hell, set fire to everything. Dezgra, maybe...

If this is a pick-up game, why wouldn't you? Campaign, yeah, shouldn't or limit it to a few units.

But yeah,



TT

I have in the past against my local Hell Horse opponent who uses infantry. This upcoming fight will be a mech unit versus my light Nova. Not sure what my current opponents gonna bring.

Natasha Kerensky

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Usually I just run with APG Elementals BUT I kinda want to throw in a heavier suit with a big gun (still transportable by Omni). Any suggestions?

I’m going to be running against a full mech Star, and the Elementals will be riding shotgun on my Omnis (mostly configured for short range murder like the mentioned Rime Otter Hatchet (C?)).



Objective will probably be full on PvP last man standing. Probably against a bunch of Falcon staples: I honestly expect a Hellbringer, Grand Summoner, Jupiter, Jade Phoenix, Gyrfalcon, Heirofalcon, Zion Sparrow combo force…

Looking at your mech force, game objective, and opposing force, I’d forget about heavy suits and go with Wraiths.

You’re running light/medium omnis with short-ranged loadouts.  And you don’t need to hold objectives or ground.  And the opposition will probably have some bigger heavies/assaults.

That’s the perfect set-up for anti-mech leg and swarm attacks.  You don’t need heavy battle armor like the Golem to create zones of control.  You just need to kill mechs.  And the best way to kill/cripple/distract bigger, slower mechs with BA is with anti-mech attacks.  Some extra SRMs or medium lasers from heavy BA aren’t going to change the calculus much against those thickly armored opponents.  But taking out leg actuators or putting 20-point-plus holes in enemy armor will change the calculus against a heavy or assault mech.  And the Wraith’s vibroclaws (leg attacks) and dual MGs (swarm attacks) are purpose-built for each.

At 56BV, the Wraith is also cheap.  You can darn near buy two of them for the cost of one Golem, and they’re a considerable discount even to the AP Gauss Elementals.  And you’re running a fast-moving, short-ranged light/medium omnimech force, so your hatchet-wielding Otter and other omnis need to close rapidly and engage at close- to point blank range, anyway.  They might as well drop some kneecapping and face-hugging Wraith points while they’re at it.  As long as they’re can engage in anti-mech attacks, those Wraith will be more difficult for the opposition to deal with than Coronas or Gnomes (LRM) sitting in the backfield trying to stay in range for good to-hit numbers.

I’d also trade the Rime Otter C for a B.  Saves 1K in BV and you get better hole-punching and more versatility with the heavy medium lasers and LB 10-X.  As long as they’re not fragile and can handle the heat, I’d generally look for omnis with lots of improved heavy medium lasers and ATMs to match the firepower of the heavy/assault Falcons at close range.  Some Mongrel, Viper, Stooping Hawk, and Nova configs come to mind.  Maybe some other massed medium laser or SRM designs with low BV.  The Nova T and some kind of Arctic Wolf omni come to mind.  Would be hilarious to run a Sun Bear Prime with its Ultra-20.

Hope this helps… FWIW.

"Ah, yes.  The belle dame sans merci.  The sweet young thing who will blast your nuts off.  The kitten with a whip.  That mystique?"
"Slavish adherence to formal ritual is a sign that one has nothing better to think about."
"Variety is the spice of battle."
"I've fought in... what... a hundred battles, a thousand battles?  It could be a million as far as I know.  I've fought for anybody who offered a decent contract and a couple who didn't.  And the universe is not much different after all that.  I could go on fighting for another hundred years and it would still look the same."
"I'm in mourning for my life."
"Those who break faith with the Unity shall go down into darkness."

truetanker

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I have in the past against my local Hell Horse opponent who uses infantry. This upcoming fight will be a mech unit versus my light Nova. Not sure what my current opponents gonna bring.

I suggest Fast Recon as you to go hold area deniable PBI.

Split them up in Squad levels and watch your enemy try to chase them around. They are a natty thorn, sniping at longer range (that's an SRM 5 each turn per Squad) and can scoot across the terrain. But throwing in your leftover BV into them, you might be surprised. They are very effective.

TT
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That is, if true tanker doesn't beat me to it. He makes truly evil units.Col.Hengist on 31 May 2013
TT, we know you are the master of nasty  O0 ~ Fletch on 22 June 2013
If I'm attacking you, conventional wisom says to bring 3x your force.  I want extra insurance, so I'll bring 4 for every 1 of what you have :D ~ Tai Dai Cultist on 21 April 2016
Me: Would you rather fight my Epithymía Thanátou from the Whispers of Blake?
Nav_Alpha: That THING... that is horrid
~ Nav_Alpha on 10 October 2016

Tyler Jorgensson

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Thanks all for the advice.

Natasha: I’m actually going to try the Hunchback C again. I’ve had hilarious luck with it (admittedly the Sun Bear is probably better).

I’ll take a second look at the Wraith, and the other mechs you’ve mentioned. As much as I want to take your advice for the Rime Otter I haven’t used the B yet and I really want to test it out.

TT: I’m not running infantry anytime soon sorry. I’m working my way thru battle armor, vehicles, and one day (queue shocked expression) Warships and Aerospace. Infantry are below that at the moment.

Natasha Kerensky

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Natasha: I’m actually going to try the Hunchback C again. I’ve had hilarious luck with it (admittedly the Sun Bear is probably better).

I’ll take a second look at the Wraith, and the other mechs you’ve mentioned. As much as I want to take your advice for the Rime Otter I haven’t used the B yet and I really want to test it out.

What’s your BV2 limit again?  Must be more 3-4K if you’re running a star of mechs.

Here’s a “shock” nova that uses lighter, faster, aggressive mechs in combination with Wraiths.  The mechs all want to get within 3 hexes for optimal to-hit numbers on their heavy medium lasers, ATMs (HE), and standard SRMs.  That’s also the right range for releasing the Wraiths.

Ghost Bear Nova Shock

Stormcrow K, 2001 BV2, 6/9, 182, Gauss x1, iHML x4
     Wraith BA x5, 280 BV2
Rime Otter B, 1961 BV2, 5/8(13), 182 +Reinf, LB-10 x1, iHML x2, LMG x8 + Array
     Wraith BA x5, 280 BV2
Carrion Crow B, 2083 BV2, 7/11(14), 133 (160), ER Lar x1, ATM-9 x1, iHML x1
     Wraith BA x5, 280 BV2
Grendel T, 1936 BV2, 7/11/7, 144, Pul Lar x1, iHML x2, SRM-6 x1, ER Sm x1, iHSL x1
     Wraith BA x5, 280 BV2
Viper I, 1580 BV2, 8/12/8, 134 +AMS, iHML x3 + TC, ATM-3
     Wraith BA x5, 280 BV2

Total:  10,961 BV2

You got an anchor in the Stormcrow, two speed demons in the Rime Otter and Carrion Crow, and a couple jumpy flankers in the Grendel and Viper.  While closing, they can throw a Gauss, a LB-10, a Pulse Large, and an ER Large at a slow opponent or two to take them down a notch.  But once the speed demons and jumpy flankers have gotten within running distance of 3 hexes from their opponents — maybe even in position for rear attacks — the trap is sprung.  The nova rushes in, releases the Wraiths for leg attacks, and unleashes 12 improved heavy medium lasers, 12 high-explosive ATMs, 6 SRMs, and 8 LMGs for 176 points of short-range damage.  That will wreck a couple heavy/assault mechs.  If some opponents fall, the Wraiths switch to swarm attacks.  Your speed demons and jumpy flankers can use their extreme mobility to disengage if hit hard or caught in crossfire, or they can press the attack as needed, even trading opponents to keep their modifiers up.  The Stormcrow is like a sweep unit following up to rapidly put down opponents that the other mechs and Wraiths are having trouble with.  They all have decent heat management and above average survivability thanks to thick armor, 7+ hex jumps, and/or special materials and equipment (ferro-lamellor, reinforced structure, AMS).

Some decent alternatives that I was looking at for this nova.  The Skinwalker is an upgrade to the Stormcrow if you have spare BV, but you’ll want to familiarize yourself with the benefits of the interface cockpit and enhanced imaging implants so you take full advantage.  The Battle Cobra and Arctic Wolf pack a lot of firepower, but lack the survivability — armor and/or mobility — of the options in the original nova.  But they’re lower BV if you need to fit something in.  Just be aware that they may turn into one-hit wonders.  I might just take a second Viper I instead.

Skinwalker D, 2545 BV2, 6/9, 161 (193), UAC/10 x1, iHML x4
Arctic Wolf II B, 1678 BV2, 7/11/7, 124, Pul Lar x1, SRM-4 x4, Pul Sm x1
Battle Cobra X, 1492 BV2, 6/9, 124 +SFE, iHML x5

Nothing wrong with the Hunchback C or Rime Otter C, but if you want to kill heavier Falcons with smash-mouth tactics, a nova like this is probably optimal.  May post another nova or two using different weapons and tactics.
"Ah, yes.  The belle dame sans merci.  The sweet young thing who will blast your nuts off.  The kitten with a whip.  That mystique?"
"Slavish adherence to formal ritual is a sign that one has nothing better to think about."
"Variety is the spice of battle."
"I've fought in... what... a hundred battles, a thousand battles?  It could be a million as far as I know.  I've fought for anybody who offered a decent contract and a couple who didn't.  And the universe is not much different after all that.  I could go on fighting for another hundred years and it would still look the same."
"I'm in mourning for my life."
"Those who break faith with the Unity shall go down into darkness."

Natasha Kerensky

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This is a “striker” nova that also uses lighter, faster, aggressive mechs but is going after better targeting numbers instead of sheer damage.  The mechs all want to get within 4 hexes for optimal to-hit numbers on their pulse medium lasers and Streak SRMs.  Instead of Wraiths, they’re carrying stealthy Elemental III suits that can be dropped outside 3 hexes and deliver a salvo while closing for anti-mech attacks.  If you’re more worried about jumpy Falcons that are hard to hit than heavily armored Falcons that are hard to penetrate, then you may want to consider this nova.  With no Rime Otter or Viper and Elemental III instead of Wraith suits, this nova feels more like a Wolf than Bear formation.

Wolf Nova Striker

Stormcrow C, 1881 BV2, 6/9, 182, LB-10 x1, Pul Lar x1, Pul Med x2
     Elemental III (AP Gauss) x5, 380 BV2
Nova S, 2056 BV2, 5/8/5, 160 +AMS & BAP, Pul Med x6, MG x4
     Elemental III (AP Gauss) x5, 380 BV2
Carrion Crow C, 1826 BV2, 7/11/6, 133 (160), ER Pul Med x2, Streak-6 x2
     Elemental III (AP Gauss) x5, 380 BV2
Grendel G, 2209 BV2, 7/11(14)/7, 144 +WD CEWS, Pul Med x4, Pul Mic x4
     Elemental III (AP Gauss) x5, 380 BV2
Ice Ferret D, 1653 BV2, 8/12, 144 +AMS, Pul Med x4
     Elemental III (AP Gauss) x5, 380 BV2

Total:  11,525 BV2

Again, you got an anchor in the Stormcrow, a jumper in the Nova, and a speed demon in the Ice Ferret, while the Carrion Crow and Grendel pull double duty as speed demons or jumpy flankers.  While closing, this nova can only throw an LB-10 and a Pulse Large, so they need to close ASAP.  But once the speed demons and jumpers have gotten within running distance of 4 hexes from their opponents — maybe even in position for rear attacks — the trap is sprung.  The nova rushes in, releases the Elemental IIIs, and unleashes 18 pulse medium lasers and 12 Streak SRMs for 150 points of short-range damage, most with a -2.  That will wreck a couple jumpy mechs.  The Elementals close for leg attacks once their SRMs are expended or swarm attacks if an enemy mech goes down.  Your speed demons and jumpy flankers can use their extreme mobility to disengage if hit hard or caught in crossfire, or they can press the attack as needed, even trading opponents to keep their modifiers up.  The Stormcrow and Nova are like sweep units following up to rapidly put down opponents that the other mechs and Elementals are having trouble with.  They all have decent heat management and above average survivability thanks to thick armor, 5-7 hex jumps, and/or AMS.

This Battle Cobra is a more vulnerable (slower and more lightly armored) but cheaper in BV alternative to the Grendel or Ice Ferret.

Battle Cobra A, 1466 BV2, 6/9, 124 +SFE, Pul Med x4, Pul Sm x6
« Last Edit: 06 April 2024, 23:28:03 by Natasha Kerensky »
"Ah, yes.  The belle dame sans merci.  The sweet young thing who will blast your nuts off.  The kitten with a whip.  That mystique?"
"Slavish adherence to formal ritual is a sign that one has nothing better to think about."
"Variety is the spice of battle."
"I've fought in... what... a hundred battles, a thousand battles?  It could be a million as far as I know.  I've fought for anybody who offered a decent contract and a couple who didn't.  And the universe is not much different after all that.  I could go on fighting for another hundred years and it would still look the same."
"I'm in mourning for my life."
"Those who break faith with the Unity shall go down into darkness."

Natasha Kerensky

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Last one... there is something to be said for TT’s burn-it-all-down approach, so this is an “incendiary” nova that also uses lighter, faster, aggressive mechs but cripples opponents’ heat scales before going after armor and crits.  The Falcons are a good Clan for this with massed standard SRM loadouts on several fast, jumpy omnis.  The mechs all want to get within 3 hexes for optimal to-hit numbers on their infernos and standard SRMs.  They’re carrying fire-resistant Elementals (Fire), another Falcon design that can mount anti-mech attacks even while their targets and hexes are on fire.

Falcon Nova Incendiary

Summoner G, 2452 BV2, 5/8/5, 182, ER PPC x1, ER Lar x1, SRM-4 x6, iHvy Sm x1
     Elemental (Fire, AP Gauss) x5, 425 BV2
Black Lanner D, 1809 BV2, 7/11(14), 153, Pul Med x2, SRM-6 x2, ER Sm x2, MG x4, Fl x1
     Elemental (Fire, AP Gauss) x5, 425 BV2
Hierofalcon B, 1737 BV2, 6/9/8, 144, ER Med x1, SRM-6 x6, ER Sm x2
     Elemental (Fire, AP Gauss) x5, 425 BV2
Arctic Wolf II B, 1678 BV2, 7/11/7, 124, Pul Lar x1, SRM-4 x4, Pul Sm x1
     Elemental (Fire, AP Gauss) x5, 425 BV2
Fire Falcon C, 1004 BV2, 8/12, 76, Pul Med x1, SRM-6 x2, ER Sm x1, Pul Sm x, MG x4
     Elemental (Fire, AP Gauss) x5, 425 BV2

Total:  10,805 BV2

Again, you got an anchor in the Summoner, a couple jumpy flankers in the Heirofalcon and Arctic Wolf, and a couple speed demons in the Black Lanner and Fire Falcon.  While closing, this nova can throw an ER PPC, an ER Large, and a Pulse Large.  Once the speed demons and jumpers have gotten within running distance of 3 hexes from their opponents — maybe even in position for rear attacks — the trap is sprung.  The nova rushes in, releases the Elementals (Fire), and unleashes 100 SRMs.  That’s enough to max out the external heat on every enemy mech with infernos and still have standard SRMs left over for damage.  Or to just throw a little over 100 points of potential damage and 50 potential crit rolls without infernos.   Elementals (Fire) close for leg attacks once their SRMs (they add another 50 SRMs one time) are expended or swarm attacks if an enemy mech goes down.  Your speed demons and jumpy flankers can use their extreme mobility to disengage if hit hard or caught in crossfire, or they can press the attack as needed, even trading opponents to keep their modifiers up.  The Summoner is like a sweep unit following up to rapidly put down opponents that the other mechs and Elementals are having trouble with.  They all have decent heat management, but the thin armor on the Arctic Wolf and Fire Falcon make this nova more vulnerable to damage than the other novas.  But if your opponent is always on fire and firing less as a result, it may not matter much.

Salamanders can substitute for Elementals (Fire) to bring BV costs down:

Salamander BA x5, 245 BV2

There’s also other Summoner, Flamberge, and Mad Dog/Vulture configurations with massed standard SRMs that can substitute for the Summoner G if you prefer them:

Flamberge A, 2575 BV2, 4/6/5, 216, TC, ER PPC x1, Pul Lar x1, SRM-6 x4
Summoner Q, 2479 BV2, 5/8/5, 182, ER PPC x1, Pul Lar x1, iHvy Med x1, SRM-4 x6, iHvy Sm x1
Mad Dog A, 1923 BV2, 5/8, 163, ER PPC x1, LB-5, SRM-6 x6
Vulture Mk III A, 1880 BV2, 5/8, 182, Ultra-5 x2, Pul Med x2, SRM-6 x4
Vulture Mk IV Prime, 2110 BV2, 5/8, 201(241), ER PPC x1, LB-5 x1, SRM-6 x4, ER Pul Sm x2

Hope these novas help.  Good luck!
"Ah, yes.  The belle dame sans merci.  The sweet young thing who will blast your nuts off.  The kitten with a whip.  That mystique?"
"Slavish adherence to formal ritual is a sign that one has nothing better to think about."
"Variety is the spice of battle."
"I've fought in... what... a hundred battles, a thousand battles?  It could be a million as far as I know.  I've fought for anybody who offered a decent contract and a couple who didn't.  And the universe is not much different after all that.  I could go on fighting for another hundred years and it would still look the same."
"I'm in mourning for my life."
"Those who break faith with the Unity shall go down into darkness."

Tyler Jorgensson

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Thanks for the suggestions I will look into them all. The game itself has taken a backseat for the moment …we’ve been playing a bit of MWO (and I hate myself…. But it’s nice to drop with friends instead of solo :)

Jellico

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What is our preferred Ursus and why do we like them? Eg. I like the original as a cheap mid range beat stick faster units like Arcas can use as anvils.

MoneyLovinOgre4Hire

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I've always liked the original Ursus best.  Cheap, durable, and reliable.  Never been too impressed by the Ursus 2 or Ursus II.
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Kerfuffin(925)

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I like the Ursus II (I almost wrote 2 like a Surat). Can work as the little guy among a fast/JJ equipped assault star and also along with the 5/8/(5) heavies due to the boosted jump. 4/6/6 is a lot more likely to survive than 4/6 at 50 tons when clan tech is on the table.
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truetanker

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I add an Ursus II to my CHH "Scout" Star, a twin Arcas, I and II, and a pair of E grade Hellbringers.

TT
Khan, Clan Iron Dolphin
Azeroth Pocketverse
That is, if true tanker doesn't beat me to it. He makes truly evil units.Col.Hengist on 31 May 2013
TT, we know you are the master of nasty  O0 ~ Fletch on 22 June 2013
If I'm attacking you, conventional wisom says to bring 3x your force.  I want extra insurance, so I'll bring 4 for every 1 of what you have :D ~ Tai Dai Cultist on 21 April 2016
Me: Would you rather fight my Epithymía Thanátou from the Whispers of Blake?
Nav_Alpha: That THING... that is horrid
~ Nav_Alpha on 10 October 2016

Kerfuffin(925)

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We have access to the Wulfen now?

I think that’s relatively new
NCKestrel’s new favorite.

MoneyLovinOgre4Hire

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Out of universe, maybe, but according to the MUL it's been available to the Dominion since its debut.
Warning: this post may contain sarcasm.

"I think I've just had another near-Rincewind experience," Death, The Color of Magic

"When in doubt, C4." Jamie Hyneman

Jellico

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The Wulfen has been on the Dominion RAT in FM:3145 in 2013.

 

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