Author Topic: ilClan speculations and ideas 20 years in ?  (Read 11556 times)

Fire Scorpion IIC

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Re: ilClan speculations and ideas 20 years in ?
« Reply #240 on: 08 February 2024, 15:58:13 »
Besides that the Wolves showed up, destroyed their nation, murdered their beloved leader in cold blood, intentionally murder civilians, invited the Falcons - known mass murderers, acted exactly like the boogeymen that centuries of indoctrination said they would be, promised to turn Terra into the opposite of republic ideals, and (I’m assuming) tried to institute a caste system on Terra?

It’s like if Japan defeated the USA in WW2, shot Truman months after the surrender, and then promised to invade England.

It’s more a question of why would Terra have any reason to like Alaric?


Add that destroyed nation to a big list of their nations that got destroyed without them getting too peeved over it

Their beloved leader died of old age as far as Terrans are aware

Falcons showed up on their own as far as Terrans are aware

Republic ideals went down the moment wall went up, probably way earlier depending on how pedantic you want to go

Now with shooting part being over it's time for Terran population to go back to their default lemming setting under which they functioned throughout their existence post-Amaris War

Any other behavior would be massive OOC moment for Terrans and an epic Deus ex Machina from writers

As for Wolves killing civilians welcome to warfare plus these are the same civilians who were perfectly fine with those nice Wobbles running the show while planets far and wide were being exterminated by that same ComStar sect so I doubt they have any right to complain about some long overdue karmic retribution (and one that went pretty damn easy on them all things considered)

Planet switched flags as is tradition in Battletech, time to move on as is tradition in Battletech


« Last Edit: 08 February 2024, 16:02:53 by Fire Scorpion IIC »

Church14

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Re: ilClan speculations and ideas 20 years in ?
« Reply #241 on: 08 February 2024, 18:47:40 »

Add that destroyed nation to a big list of their nations that got destroyed without them getting too peeved over it

Their beloved leader died of old age as far as Terrans are aware

Falcons showed up on their own as far as Terrans are aware

Republic ideals went down the moment wall went up, probably way earlier depending on how pedantic you want to go

Now with shooting part being over it's time for Terran population to go back to their default lemming setting under which they functioned throughout their existence post-Amaris War

Any other behavior would be massive OOC moment for Terrans and an epic Deus ex Machina from writers

As for Wolves killing civilians welcome to warfare plus these are the same civilians who were perfectly fine with those nice Wobbles running the show while planets far and wide were being exterminated by that same ComStar sect so I doubt they have any right to complain about some long overdue karmic retribution (and one that went pretty damn easy on them all things considered)

Planet switched flags as is tradition in Battletech, time to move on as is tradition in Battletech
Everyone forgets Terran resistance to Amaris was significant.

Big list? Comstar was an outgrowth of the Hegemony and WoB an outgrowth of Comstar. The only really mess cities up level violent takeovers of Terra were Amaris (who was a brutal dictator who faced massive resistance during his reign), Stone (who immediately did what he could to improve life on Terra for civilians), and now Alaric. Wolves have been nothing but brutal, savage rulers in the sphere. There’s going to be huge culture shock for the first time in centuries, with justified comparisons to Amaris. I don’t see the caste system and immediate, massive drop in quality of life and life expectancy going over well. Yes, if clans rule as clans, those will come.

There were rumors in ilclan already about stone being murdered. There are security feeds, coroners reports. Can Wolves keep it under wraps? Maaaybe. But they’ll never shut down the belief that Alaric either murdered stone or had him murdered. Given Alaric has never shown any real skill towards managing his public image as he’s never had to, CGL can take this plot line either way.

There’s between zero, and also zero chance, that every person aware that the Falcons were invited stays silent. That secret will get out and spread.

I’ll need you to cite anything, literally anything, demonstrating RotS ideals disappeared when the wall went up. Otherwise, just no.

There’s civilians dying, like the massive mess up that was Cairo during the jihad. Then there’s intentionally targeting civilians specifically to send a message to other civilians. Alaric had civilians murdered as an act of state sponsored terrorism and made it clear that the planet knew that. Wildly different than collateral, accidental deaths.

Terrans have every reason to hate the wolves, and none to like them.

Normally I would say that planetary resistance is a joke in battletech, but Shattered Fortress gave us civilian resistances that disabled RCT sized forces on far smaller planets. Obviously, that was in favor of the wolves because it was Shattered Fortress, but the precedent stands. Given the tiny, tiny tiny number of wolves on Terra relative to the population, an actual organized resistance could cripple the touman of CGL so chose.

Do I actually think Terran resistance will matter? No. I think there will be some half assed lines in ilKEO and then Terra falls in line because Wolves badly, badly need massive plot armor to succeed for a while.

But a Terran resistance isn’t out of character given the closest Terran experience to Alaric is Amaris. Is Amaris an extreme example? So far yes, but it’s also our only reasonable Terran experience to compare to
« Last Edit: 08 February 2024, 18:56:08 by Church14 »

Fire Scorpion IIC

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Re: ilClan speculations and ideas 20 years in ?
« Reply #242 on: 08 February 2024, 21:03:20 »

I know that Alaric apparently being the big bogeyman of the franchise is the current fad among the segment of fandom and it's indeed entertainingly quaint but comparing him to Amaris when those two aren't even in the same metaphorical star system is just no

Metallgewitter

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Re: ilClan speculations and ideas 20 years in ?
« Reply #243 on: 09 February 2024, 03:34:31 »
I know that Alaric apparently being the big bogeyman of the franchise is the current fad among the segment of fandom and it's indeed entertainingly quaint but comparing him to Amaris when those two aren't even in the same metaphorical star system is just no

There are some similarities in terms of management
- Abandoned their home realm to conquer Terra
- betrayed their erstwhile Allies after getting what they want
- unleashing barbaric "allies" against their opponents (Yes in this case I would say the Mongols were Allies at that point)

Of copurse it is a huge difference in worming your way into an existing realm or simply toppling it in one go but imho there are some similarities.

Also are you all forgetting the end of IlClan trial? The Wolf watch reported about spreading rumors that contain
1. Stone was murdered by Alaric
2. The Falcons were invited by the Wolves
3. Wolves only won because the RAF concentrated their best forces upon defeating the barbarians ehm Falcons
4. Wolves were basically invited into the fortress

While the Watch leader categorically denied any of that there are some truths within. The conclusion was that Tucker was spreading all those rumors with the help of Republic Ghosts and that they should make it a high priority to apprehend him. I expect this to be at least mentioned in IKEO

Church14

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Re: ilClan speculations and ideas 20 years in ?
« Reply #244 on: 09 February 2024, 07:56:10 »
I know that Alaric apparently being the big bogeyman of the franchise is the current fad among the segment of fandom and it's indeed entertainingly quaint but comparing him to Amaris when those two aren't even in the same metaphorical star system is just no

I did note it wasn’t a good comparison. It’s just that on a sliding scale between Amaris and Stone, Alaric sits closer to Amaris.

Both Amaris and Alaric:
 - Spent their lifetimes plotting to take Terra without an actual good plan to rule after
 - Both had dreams of running the star league after taking over Terra.
 - Both are responsible for the collapse of the Hegemony or its equivalent due to their greed.
 - Both did so as a culmination of cultural grievances. Amaris because of what the SLDF actually did to his home. Alaric because of what the inner sphere did to the star league. Which, only happened because Alaric’s ancestors abandoned it.
 - abandoned their home nation when the time came.
 - Murdered the rulers of the previous Terran nation in cold blood.
 - Immediately after coming to power, violently ended any public disagreement with their rule. On this point, Amaris made it state policy, Alaric’s example is so far an isolated moment of on screen murder in ilclan.
 - Amaris recruited a bunch of divisions from Terra, many of which were effectively conscripts doing so so their families didn’t suffer. Alaric did similar, just in the Empire.
 - Once in power, immediately found that their Star League had no support of any great house.
 - Absolutely willing to murder civilians as state policy to suppress opposition

Some of these are ones where if Amaris’ level of awful was a ten, Alaric is at a 3 to 5, but there are a lot of similar notes. I still don’t think it’s a great comparison, but some portion of Terrans would absolutely, in universe, be drawing those comparisons.

EDIT: and Stone was by no means a good man. This is a sliding scale from a bastard with admirable goals, to comically evil
« Last Edit: 09 February 2024, 08:06:06 by Church14 »