Author Topic: Rules for field guns?  (Read 1834 times)

Greatclub

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Rules for field guns?
« on: 20 June 2018, 13:31:12 »
A guy I play with has a fondness for field guns, like the German '88. Unfortunately, he uses homebrew scenario rules for them, and I'm suspecting he severely underpoints them.

Could somebody point me at the canon rules for these things? Infantry with field guns? Towed vehicles with heavy weapons? Something in TacOps? I'm pretty familiar with the battlemech side, but this is terra incognito for me.

Mendrugo

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Re: Rules for field guns?
« Reply #1 on: 20 June 2018, 13:41:11 »
Tactical Operations, p. 311
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Empyrus

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Re: Rules for field guns?
« Reply #2 on: 20 June 2018, 13:42:04 »
Page 311 in Tactical Operations for Field Guns and Field Artillery.

TRO3085 and its supplement have ready-made infantry with field guns, those may be off interest as examples.

Tai Dai Cultist

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Re: Rules for field guns?
« Reply #3 on: 20 June 2018, 13:48:10 »
If you have/use MegaMek, it has a fairly comprehensive list of possible field gun platoons already BV-calculated.

Colt Ward

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Re: Rules for field guns?
« Reply #4 on: 20 June 2018, 14:43:55 »
For vehicle towed guns, you should look at the trailers . . . some very interesting ones to play around with and it discusses how they get moving.
Colt Ward
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pheonixstorm

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Re: Rules for field guns?
« Reply #5 on: 20 June 2018, 17:58:20 »
The best thing about infantry field guns is....

THEY DONT JAM. Rapid Fire rules, UAC, RAC.. it doesn't jam and doesn't explode. Plus you can use whatever alternate ammo type you want with the standard AC. Try that with a towed gun from a vee.

The worst thing... limited to 1 ton of ammo per gun.

Motorized platoons work best, no movement (or terrain) restrictions iirc.

Greatclub

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Re: Rules for field guns?
« Reply #6 on: 22 June 2018, 05:57:48 »
OK, thanks. And looking at the AC-10 squad, these are disturbingly tough unless you get in range of your anti-infantry guns.

You did bring anti-infantry guns, right?

Worst part is that he usually specifies 3048 tech, so I won't be able to sick Salamander BA on them.

mbear

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Re: Rules for field guns?
« Reply #7 on: 22 June 2018, 06:23:57 »
Worst part is that he usually specifies 3048 tech, so I won't be able to sick Salamander BA on them.

Jump SRM infantry with Infernos might be a good substitute.
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Re: Rules for field guns?
« Reply #8 on: 22 June 2018, 08:31:41 »
You wanna silence a nest of field guns fast? Karnov (Gunship). Oodles of machine guns in multiple directions, insanely fast, and BV so low it's almost cheaper than some of those gun platoons. Make high-speed dashes that end each turn almost directly over the gun batteries(the 'almost' is very important - NEVER end movement directly above any of them), then lay waste to multiple platoons at once.

The infantry are faced with three bad options: ignore you as they keep firing the guns(and die), silence the guns for a bit to shoot at you with their normal weapons(likely at pretty bad numbers), or waste time turning the big guns around to shoot you, after which you'll likely be long gone.

Come to think of it, if you're the player using field guns, it might be wise to give them some kind of AA escort.
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marcussmythe

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Re: Rules for field guns?
« Reply #9 on: 22 June 2018, 10:35:15 »
If you use artillery, its always a classc answer to infantry problems.

Retry

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Re: Rules for field guns?
« Reply #10 on: 22 June 2018, 12:57:25 »
You wanna silence a nest of field guns fast? Karnov (Gunship). Oodles of machine guns in multiple directions, insanely fast, and BV so low it's almost cheaper than some of those gun platoons. Make high-speed dashes that end each turn almost directly over the gun batteries(the 'almost' is very important - NEVER end movement directly above any of them), then lay waste to multiple platoons at once.

The infantry are faced with three bad options: ignore you as they keep firing the guns(and die), silence the guns for a bit to shoot at you with their normal weapons(likely at pretty bad numbers), or waste time turning the big guns around to shoot you, after which you'll likely be long gone.

Come to think of it, if you're the player using field guns, it might be wise to give them some kind of AA escort.
Karnovs, yuck.  Low payload, poor armor, and way, way over-engined.  Looks pretty though.  You can do the same thing with 2 extra tons at 25 tons or just 1 extra ton at 21 tons, but with a lower BV and C-Bill cost.  Overall bad design.

I wouldn't recommend the Karnov Gunship.  Lots of MGs and it's arranged like a porcupine, but is that really a good thing?  Unless you're facing an entire battalion of infantry you're quite unlikely to get more than 2 arcs worth of MGs on targets at one time, and if you are you're probably in danger of a platoon getting in the same hex as you and taking a good shot on you.  If you're firing on multiple targets you're also taking secondary target modifiers so chances are you miss on several rolls.  Infantry that do connect on a VTOL tend to drop 'em like a bad joke, so I'm not so sure that VTOLs for infantry hunting is that great of an idea.

If you still want to use a VTOL for that, alternatively I'd take a flight or 2 of Ferrets to a Karnov.  Ferrets are even faster than Karnovs, far cheaper in both C-Bills and BV, and have a single MG each (no porcupine setup but you can split the Ferrets to strike several targets further apart, and no secondary target modifiers).  4 standard Ferrets are just a hair more expensive in BV than 1 Karnov Gunship, 2 "wild weasels" are slightly less.  While a standard Ferret won't survive a stray hit, honestly, a Karnov won't survive much more anyways, and the Wild Weasels at least are nearly as durable as Karnovs.

ANS Kamas P81

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Re: Rules for field guns?
« Reply #11 on: 22 June 2018, 19:21:01 »
I wouldn't recommend the Karnov Gunship.  Lots of MGs and it's arranged like a porcupine, but is that really a good thing?  Unless you're facing an entire battalion of infantry you're quite unlikely to get more than 2 arcs worth of MGs on targets at one time
But that also gives you forgiveness in your maneuver and you don't have to hit a specific exact hex - you can make whatever approach works best, and still put guns on the target.  No blind spots means your attack run has a lot more flexibility.
and if you are you're probably in danger of a platoon getting in the same hex as you and taking a good shot on you.
Move the Karnov after the infantry moves.  If you lose initiative that bad, move the Karnov away into a hiding position, and then wait to win initiative.
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Retry

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Re: Rules for field guns?
« Reply #12 on: 22 June 2018, 19:42:01 »
But that also gives you forgiveness in your maneuver and you don't have to hit a specific exact hex - you can make whatever approach works best, and still put guns on the target.  No blind spots means your attack run has a lot more flexibility.Move the Karnov after the infantry moves.  If you lose initiative that bad, move the Karnov away into a hiding position, and then wait to win initiative.
On the note of initiative, several Ferrets is a better set of initiative sinks than a single Karnov.

pheonixstorm

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Re: Rules for field guns?
« Reply #13 on: 22 June 2018, 20:15:45 »
Either way you look at it, grouping platoons like that is bad tactics anyway. Might as well use a CF to drop some cluster bombs on them and be done with it. At least then you can likely avoid getting your mechs shot at. Though I would rather use artillery anyway. No risk to other units and you might pick up some collateral damage along the way ;)

Greatclub

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Re: Rules for field guns?
« Reply #14 on: 23 June 2018, 19:03:58 »
He loves those rules. I am less enamored

I'm adding a couple urbanmechs and a longbow missile pod sprue to my next order. Lets see how he likes real artillery rounds on his squishies, launched from the Arrow IV trashcan.
« Last Edit: 23 June 2018, 19:24:45 by Greatclub »

Colt Ward

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Re: Rules for field guns?
« Reply #15 on: 24 June 2018, 12:36:06 »
You can also mount RL pods now on the exterior of VTOLs . . . putting a bunch of RL10s into infantry does not do nice things to them . . .
Colt Ward
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