Clan Blood Spirit: Get Off Our Lawn

[Metallgewitter]

Didn't the Crusaders clamor for invasion after the first reports from the Dragoons came in? I thought they only kept still because the Wolves convinced them to have the Dragoons work for every house at least once before they could make a final decision. Funny enough the Gray Death Legion found the Helm memory Core only near the end of the Dragoon's mission. And I think this information was never revealed to the Clans

[Mendrugo]

IntelSer kept spying through the early 3040s, and brought back word of the War of 3039.  Crusaders kept putting forward votes for invasion, but kept losing Trials of Refusal to the Wardens.

[tassa_kay]

IntelSer kept spying through the early 3040s, and brought back word of the War of 3039.

Source for this? Every source seems to indicate that Intelser was more or less defunct after the Dragoon Compromise.

[Mendrugo]

Source for this? Every source seems to indicate that Intelser was more or less defunct after the Dragoon Compromise.

The Clans: Warriors of Kerensky p. 17 describes the debates between the Wardens and Crusaders, and that the Fourth Succession War and emergence of the FedCom Alliance was used as an argument that the invasion had to happen before the Steiner-Davions reunited the Inner Sphere.  Ulric calmed that down when the FedCom offensive ran out of gas in 3030.  Then the War of 3039 happened, and there was another panic until follow-on reports showed that the Combine effectively halted the FedCom advance. 

The Dragoons stopped reporting in 3020.  So the Clans having intel on the 4SW and War of 3039 implies that there was a non-Dragoon intelligence conduit still existing as late as the early 3040s.  Why disband IntelSer only to rebuild something else?  Plus, how were the Dragoons sending their reports back?  And, given the canon times for Jaime, Natasha, and Cranston going back to the Clan Homeworlds and then getting back to the Inner Sphere, there had to have been a command circuit running all the way from the Inner Sphere to the Kerensky Cluster.  Who's manning that?  My answer is IntelSer.

Now, IntelSer was gone by 3049 (the reason why is written but as yet unpublished), and was then replaced by a revived Watch, but there had to have been IntelSer missions ongoing through at least 3040 for the Clans to know about the War of 3039.

[Stormlion1]

Don't forget every once in a while a jumpship from the Inner Sphere or the Periphery would get captured and the crews interrogated. News could have been gotten that way.

[CJC070]

They have sent the occasionally people as scouts even during the Wolf Dragoons compromise.  Spotlight On: Thermo Police has a character (Kotori Nostra) whose free birth parents saw the Outworlds Alliance and assumed the worst.  Who knows how many similar individuals there are.

[tassa_kay]

I think this entire topic needs to go to another thread. Blood Spirits would be the absolute last Clan to be involved in any of this anyway.

[Stormlion1]

I think this entire topic needs to go to another thread. Blood Spirits would be the absolute last Clan to be involved in any of this anyway.

Not sure. The Blood Spirits are Crusaders and would have a interest. Before the Burrock Absorbtion they would have had a small chance in a attempted invasion especially if it was a 'all hands' effort.

[tassa_kay]

Not sure. The Blood Spirits are Crusaders and would have a interest. Before the Burrock Absorbtion they would have had a small chance in a attempted invasion especially if it was a 'all hands' effort.

The Blood Spirits are also isolationists. They've never been linked to any of the intelligence-gathering efforts against the Inner Sphere and barely put up an effort to join the invasion. Hence why this topic needs to go to another thread.

[Maelwys]

That might have been an interesting What if or alt history. Blood Spirits develop a highly effective intel service to ensure their isolation.

[truetanker]

Wolf Dragoons had Clan tech Warships, which meant they had an HPG onboard, they probably seeded several dead systems with the HPG Relay satellites. Also, it wouldn't be hard to have the few LF-equipped Clan transports ready at every other system, stationed for the sole purpose to double jump to the next system station.

It took one year of constant jumping 1 system at a time, so a 6-month double jump there with HPG relays communicating along the way, shouldn't be really a problem.

TT

[alex blood spirit]

question did the Spirit's  make any advances in warship designs or weapons improvement

[tassa_kay]

The Spirits did develop the Clantech version of the AMS, but beyond that (and of course their contributions to ProtoMech technology), nope. The Spirits were not especially technologically innovative or even in a position to be due to their scarcity of resources and apparent lack of willingness to engage with the other Clans.

[Metallgewitter]

The one thing I know of Blood Spirit contribiutions is the Protomech pilot phenotype they perfected right before the Wars of Reaving. Plus the Arcadia Dropship the first carrier ship specifically for Protomechs. Though I think the Ravens gave them a helping hand in that design.

[tassa_kay]

Plus the Arcadia Dropship the first carrier ship specifically for Protomechs. Though I think the Ravens gave them a helping hand in that design.

Not even a helping hand; the Ravens straight up designed and built it for them entirely. The Spirits never produced the Arcadia themselves AFAIK.

[Stormlion1]

Not even a helping hand; the Ravens straight up designed and built it for them entirely. The Spirits never produced the Arcadia themselves AFAIK.

 

Well they probably paid for it. Which is what starts the whole process.

[tassa_kay]

Well they probably paid for it. Which is what starts the whole process.

Well, yes, that wasn't in dispute. In this case, they shared their ProtoMech research and pilot training protocols. But I was answering the question regarding the Spirits' technological development/ship designing. In the case of the Arcadia, they didn't actually build or even design the ship themselves, so I don't consider that to be something the Spirits should be credited with. Same situation as the Horses' HH-1 facility; they requested a mobile shipyard from the Ravens but didn't actually do any work on it themselves, just provided a list of things they wanted it to do.

[Stormlion1]

Understandable Tassa. Each Clan has its specialitys they are good on or focus on. The Spirits was taking the Protomech concept to its natural and honestly extreme conclusion. Sadly it was not enough to save them though by definition a Protomech Galaxy should have had thousands of dedicated warriors in them.

[Metallgewitter]

I would say the society took it to the most extreme with it's four legged Protos which needed special drugs for the pilots to actually be able to use them and the Super Heavy Protomech. Though who knows maybe the Spirits might have come to the same result if the Reaving wars had not happen.

Another point, the Crimson Hawk: it started as a simple light Mech with a hefty punch but the Spirits lacked the resources to finish it. The Sharks "stole" it by trial and developed it fully

[truetanker]

Ultra Lights have been around, what even is more fun is now we have the all-mighty half ton (P)AL all the way up towards the 200-ton range.

Now what is easier, a 10-ton SH-Proto or UL-Mech? That's the question...

TT

[Wolf72]

easier? by my hand (ala on paper) an UL mech is much easier to design.  in BTU, I'm not quite sure which would be easier to produce as a manufacturer.

[truetanker]

Cause, SIZE, does matter...

Technically, an UL Mech is 2 Levels, while SH Proto's are 1.

TT

[Stormlion1]

That is a lot of Protomech pilots that need to be trained as well as secondary staffing like Techs and Astechs. I wonder if the Blood Spirits went out and gave another chance to failed Aerospace pilots or just dedicated whole sibkos to the program with a greater chance of passing. A single point is five Proto's after all.

[tassa_kay]

The Spirits developed the ProtoMechWarrior phenotype, too, so I assume that they had more than enough pilots to go around.

[Stormlion1]

The Spirits developed the ProtoMechWarrior phenotype, too, so I assume that they had more than enough pilots to go around.

It's a time-frame issue. When the Proto's were first adopted by the Blood Spirits there was no dedicated phenotype and the aerospace phenotype was considered the way to go. But even after trials very few will pass and they will be dedicated to the aerospace arm.

So would those that fail test down instead as Techs into the Protomech Program in a second test? And of course they can't test as Protomech Pilots without the EI already implanted. Which means before they can test as Protomech Pilots they would need EI implanted.

[Gaiiten]

It's a time-frame issue. When the Proto's were first adopted by the Blood Spirits there was no dedicated phenotype and the aerospace phenotype was considered the way to go. But even after trials very few will pass and they will be dedicated to the aerospace arm.

So would those that fail test down instead as Techs into the Protomech Program in a second test? And of course they can't test as Protomech Pilots without the EI already implanted. Which means before they can test as Protomech Pilots they would need EI implanted.

That would quite be expensive, especially for the Spirits, would that not be?

[truetanker]

I think EI treatment was for those that passed the test. Everyone else that failed the Aero test would have been given the Proto test as part of the Aero test, weeding out the failures as well.

Like your SATs in HS. Failed it meant your college app was most likely denied, but you could still graduate to become a fry cook. But those that pass-fail, with a meh score, could still goto a community college and still apply. But failing that, there is always the fry cook position available.

In other words, you're taking the Aero test and the Proto test, in simulation. Passing the Proto would allow you the EI treatment to compensate for the Protomech's drawbacks, ie: the chemical treatments.

If you pass, congrats.

If not, well the Tech Caste program is ready to except their newest member, here's your hydro-spanner and there's the door, quiaff?

TT

[tassa_kay]

I don't know if I agree. A ProtoMech pilot isn't going to be able to pilot a Proto to be able to test in one without the EI implants. And ProtoMech technology itself is considered cheap enough in-universe that the Spirits were able to get mileage out of them, so I don't see it as being a big deal for them to do. Especially once they got their phenotype going, which I would think means they're probably getting them used to EI implants well before they're due to test out since they're being set up from the get-go to be ProtoMech pilots, as opposed to being set up to become aerospace pilots and ending up in a ProtoMech if they failed. There wasn't that much time between when the Spirits got ProtoMechs (at some point post-3060) and when they had their ProtoMech phenotype (sometime during or before 3067).

[truetanker]

I meant that as when you got tested first, certain trait scores follow upped to "coach" them as Protos.

Like, anyone can be a pilot, but some can't grasp gravity, but instead of turning them away, let's see how well they handle large scale Mecha first? Like we know the clans don't waste things, so if your not good enough for one program, there are others that they can try in.

Not good with Hurdles, try running, or shotput, it is still Track and Field.

TT

[Stormlion1]

The logistics of the early years of the Blood Spirits adoption of the Protomechs would make for a great story. Besides the construction and deployment of the Proto's it would have both required training, medical enhancement, supply, movement of personal from other duties to supporting the Protomech Program. And that's not even bringing up the entire issue of the warriors we have already discussed. It's actually kind of fascinating.