Quirks on AS cards?

[DarkJaguar]

Any of you folks "in the know" think official quirks will make it onto the Alpha Strike cards for the upcoming release?

[Alexander Knight]

My completely non-official opinion?

Ahahahahahahahhahahahaha --- no

[Xochi]

I at least hope Variable Targeting and Anti Aircraft Targeting computers will.

[Weirdo]

I'm mostly unofficial as well*, but also think it highly unlikely because in addition to an extremely large amount of data entry work(it's all volunteer work in people's spare time, remember), it's a major layout project. You'd have to completely redesign the AS card to find room where they could be printed legibly, especially difficult for units with lots of quirks, or particularly verbose ones.

My preference would be to have quirks listed in the MUL entry so that players can see them when they look up a unit, and jot them down when building a force.

*Technically I'm on the MUL team, but my involvement consists of chiming in on internal discussions on occasion. Certainly no authority.

[nckestrel]

My preference would be to have quirks listed in the MUL entry so that players can see them when they look up a unit, and jot them down when building a force.

For most quirks, that would be fine.  Variable-Range Targeting is more complicated.  It requires re-calculating the PV (and not just modifying the existing PV, but actually redoing the entire PV calculation). Similar to adding a targeting computer or C3.
Of course, maybe that just means the rule for how VRT affects BV would need to change, but we'd pretty much have to make it cost the same as a full skill upgrade (both for assuming it's effective use and to not have another separate system to modifying PV).

[DarkJaguar]

For most quirks, that would be fine.  Variable-Range Targeting is more complicated.  It requires re-calculating the PV (and not just modifying the existing PV, but actually redoing the entire PV calculation).

Doesn't VRT just add X per point of short range damage or something like that?  I don't have my book handy.

[Weirdo]

As such, we would need either two cards and BV values for every such unit(one set for people playing with quirks, and one for people playing without), or a check box where you would turn quirks on or off, and the whole page would alter accordingly.

The first one would require the MUL team to manually check the math on every such unit and input the new card as well...and if you know what's good for you, I'd stand outside of arms reach of the main programmer when suggesting the second.

[Xochi]

As such, we would need either two cards and BV values for every such unit(one set for people playing with quirks, and one for people playing without), or a check box where you would turn quirks on or off, and the whole page would alter accordingly.

The first one would require the MUL team to manually check the math on every such unit and input the new card as well...and if you know what's good for you, I'd stand outside of arms reach of the main programmer when suggesting the second.

The Core Rulebook includes the special abilities VRT and AAT. If those are only given by quirks, why are they even in the targeting section?

[DarkJaguar]

As such, we would need either two cards and BV values for every such unit(one set for people playing with quirks, and one for people playing without), or a check box where you would turn quirks on or off, and the whole page would alter accordingly.

The first one would require the MUL team to manually check the math on every such unit and input the new card as well...and if you know what's good for you, I'd stand outside of arms reach of the main programmer when suggesting the second.

The first option would be more consistent with the current implementation anyway (squad sizes have multiple cards).

I understand it would be a bit of an undertaking, but perhaps we could turn it into a community effort?  Say a semi-public google sheet that people enter in units and their quirks?  This could be easily verified and exported as a CSV for inclusion into the existing database?  Or even format the google sheet in such a way as to be directly pasteable?

[Weirdo]

And reduce the MUL to the accuracy of a wiki? I think my insides just clenched a little.

[Weirdo]

The Core Rulebook includes the special abilities VRT and AAT. If those are only given by quirks, why are they even in the targeting section?

That is a very good question, for which I have no answer.

[DarkJaguar]

And reduce the MUL to the accuracy of a wiki? I think my insides just clenched a little.

Only if the data is allowed to be input raw.  But a list of raw data presented in a useable and easily verifiable format would be useful, yes?

Having a list of units and their quirks, along with the source book of said quirk would allow one or two people to sort the units alphabetically and by source, then open up a TRO, go down the list, and move on.

[nckestrel]

Doesn't VRT just add X per point of short range damage or something like that?  I don't have my book handy.

No, it's a multiplier, that only applies to the offensive points.

[nckestrel]

The Core Rulebook includes the special abilities VRT and AAT. If those are only given by quirks, why are they even in the targeting section?

Because we tried very hard to include everything we could think of. We were trying very hard not to require an AS Tac Ops, AS Str Ops, AS In...etc. So many things were included just to try and be complete and have an AS rule for "everything".

[Xochi]

Because we tried very hard to include everything we could think of. We were trying very hard not to require an AS Tac Ops, AS Str Ops, AS In...etc. So many things were included just to try and be complete and have an AS rule for "everything".

Just a thought, but since they are given through quirks, maybe those two specific targeting specials should be in the companion not the core book? Then again if we are getting a new book it wouldn't matter haha.

[Weirdo]

No, it's a multiplier, that only applies to the offensive points.

At this point, the only saving grace is that the number of units with these quirks is relatively tiny in the grand scheme of things.

...it is tiny, right? Right?

[Scotty]

At this point, the only saving grace is that the number of units with these quirks is relatively tiny in the grand scheme of things.

...it is tiny, right? Right?

As far as I'm aware, there are two.  The bad news is one of them is a new mark Vulture, and fairly common.

That said, I'd personally like to pitch that whole section of the rulebook out the window (along with cybernetic augmentation).  AS isn't the kitchen-sink version in the first place, not everything has to be playable.

[DarkJaguar]

As far as I'm aware, there are two.  The bad news is one of them is a new mark Vulture, and fairly common.

That said, I'd personally like to pitch that whole section of the rulebook out the window (along with cybernetic augmentation).  AS isn't the kitchen-sink version in the first place, not everything has to be playable.

Yeah, if quirks aren't going to be handled more 'officially', I would have to agree.  As it is, in order to use them, it takes an awful lot of work by an individual player, and none of the tools to complete this work are provided (An automated PV calc would be pretty nice.  Just saying) by official channels.

[Papabees]

You can still create custom cards on the MUL can't you? Just make one up with the quirks you want.

[Xochi]

You can still create custom cards on the MUL can't you? Just make one up with the quirks you want.

That doesn't work if you can't adjust the PV properly.

[DarkJaguar]

You can still create custom cards on the MUL can't you? Just make one up with the quirks you want.

That still requires looking up the TRO entry for every unit you and your opponent wishes to use, then recalculating any cards that have the quirks.  If the database had all of this information it would be a one stop shop official source, versus every alpha strike player out there who wants to use them figuring it out on their own.  Also, the companion really doesn't give the rules for adjusting PV based on quirks, excepting VRT and AAT as far as I can find.

TL;DR I think it would be better to either fully support quirks, or just remove them altogether.