Author Topic: random thought about flamers.  (Read 2501 times)

marauder648

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random thought about flamers.
« on: 04 September 2019, 13:40:47 »
Would a Battlemech flamer actually produce any flame? 
Quote
the standard Flamer taps into a BattleMech's reactor to produce heat in the form of a plasma release

Because iwthout the release of plasma, and rather just tapping into the heat produced, it would be more like a heat gun, there would be no indication of it, just a sudden surge in heat.
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Re: random thought about flamers.
« Reply #1 on: 04 September 2019, 13:50:38 »
Would a Battlemech flamer actually produce any flame? 
Because iwthout the release of plasma, and rather just tapping into the heat produced, it would be more like a heat gun, there would be no indication of it, just a sudden surge in heat.
Battlemech flamers are hot enough to melt hundreds of kilos of armor.  Flamers also do not require an atmosphere to function, which would seem to indicate that they're not merely glorified heat exchanges that give some of the fusion engine's heat to air as part of a "heat gun".  Even if it were a glorified heat exchanger, since the output mass is hot enough to quickly shear off armor, it's easily going to be hot enough to visually see (think red-hot steel fresh from a Blacksmith's furnace).

Daryk

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Re: random thought about flamers.
« Reply #2 on: 04 September 2019, 18:40:02 »
I'm confused by the question... the quoted rule actually asserts a plasma release, so what do you mean by "without the release of plasma"?

marauder648

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Re: random thought about flamers.
« Reply #3 on: 05 September 2019, 04:18:37 »
I'm confused by the question... the quoted rule actually asserts a plasma release, so what do you mean by "without the release of plasma"?

I'm probably thinking too literally. But to get plasma from the core of a mech's reactor through the mech to the flamer would be HELLA dangerous and require some seriously rugged cabling :p To say its impractical is a bit of an understatement as you're trying to fit basically the stuff that makes up the surface of a star through a straw. So instead of actually releaving and venting the plasma as a controlled jet, it would probably use the heat of it and funnel that without running the stuff through your mech. this way there wouldnt' be any big FWOOOF of flame or anything, just a huge amount of heat.
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Daryk

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Re: random thought about flamers.
« Reply #4 on: 05 September 2019, 04:22:18 »
Plasma is actually not that hard to move around... you just need magnetic fields.

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Re: random thought about flamers.
« Reply #5 on: 05 September 2019, 06:26:57 »
Plasma is actually not that hard to move around... you just need magnetic fields.

And those magnets would explain why mech flamers are so heavy.

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marauder648

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Re: random thought about flamers.
« Reply #6 on: 05 September 2019, 06:38:53 »
And those magnets would explain why mech flamers are so heavy.

Aye! But I think a heat gun effect would honestly be more scary, because unless you've got Thermal vision stuff active, you don't see it. Its just a wall of heat well in excess of 2000c that washes over part of your squad, all but vaporising the poor sods caught in it. There might well be a 'flame' but it would be round the muzzle, and more akin to a fighters afterburner.

A heatgun effect would basically be this - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aEJQpwZ0pp0&fbclid=IwAR07t2PYB7GAJ6Vi1Jsf3Y8fdYgHWfJT8zYXGx7cW3HM2Wp4dy-xyaa6K40  just a LOT faster and hotter.

A heavy flamer is a more traditional version of the flamethrower, it has a fuel source and propels it that way, but that would also be nasty. First we're instinctively afraid of fire, and second it still burns HELLA hot, god knows what they use as a fuel for it but nasty stuff. And its harder to avoid because this burning stuff its spraying splashes everywhere. And its effects are also probably worse. You could probably hide from a 'heat gun' type flamer if you had some solid enough cover to get behind. And it probably only fires for a really short time. A heavy flamer's gel is going to stick to what it hits, and keep on burning, they could use gellied liquid oxygen and magnesium or some other nasty compound mixes. A flame gun is going to char what it hits even if exposed for a heartbeat. A heavy flamer would be more like that scene from Starship troopers where that soldier gets her arm caught by a tanker bug's fire.
« Last Edit: 05 September 2019, 06:40:59 by marauder648 »
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Re: random thought about flamers.
« Reply #7 on: 05 September 2019, 12:41:07 »
Aye! But I think a heat gun effect would honestly be more scary, because unless you've got Thermal vision stuff active, you don't see it. Its just a wall of heat well in excess of 2000c that washes over part of your squad, all but vaporising the poor sods caught in it. There might well be a 'flame' but it would be round the muzzle, and more akin to a fighters afterburner.
Again, no.  A "wall of heat well in excess of 2000*C" would emit significant amounts of radiation in the visible spectrum and would thus easily be visible to the naked eye.

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Re: random thought about flamers.
« Reply #8 on: 07 September 2019, 11:18:54 »
at 2000 C, flamers would be catastrophic close-quarters weapons. that's roughly double the temp of magma and we know what happens when you dump a mech in magma.

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Re: random thought about flamers.
« Reply #9 on: 08 September 2019, 07:44:33 »
Maybe they call it a flamer not because it produces a jet of flame but because it sets things on fire. Though the squirt of reactor plasma would be hot enough to elevate the temperature of a column of nearby air to glowing as well.

As to flamers working in vacuum, there's no reason they couldn't carry some extra gas to pass through a heat exchanger when working in space. Jump jets are already fluffed as having tanks for spare reaction mass when operating in low-pressure environments.
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Re: random thought about flamers.
« Reply #10 on: 09 September 2019, 08:53:42 »
Would a Battlemech flamer actually produce any flame? 
Because iwthout the release of plasma, and rather just tapping into the heat produced, it would be more like a heat gun, there would be no indication of it, just a sudden surge in heat.

Makes me wonder if this is how they optionally generate heat on targets which track it (Mechs).  The Plasma would be required for actually starting fires.

But, the mental imagery has me thinking 'Bunsen Burner' more than 'burning water hose'.
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Re: random thought about flamers.
« Reply #11 on: 14 September 2019, 13:12:40 »
Makes me wonder if this is how they optionally generate heat on targets which track it (Mechs).  The Plasma would be required for actually starting fires.

But, the mental imagery has me thinking 'Bunsen Burner' more than 'burning water hose'.

The Bunsen Burner style might be appropriate.

Narrow Flamer beam = blowtorch through armor
Wide Flamer beam = increasing overall heat to enemy Mech

But if you really want to increase heat, then flame weapons should do an amount of heat proportional to the target's heat sinks.  Nullifying half of a target's 10 heat standard sinks is not that big of a deal compared to nullifying half of a target's 20 double heat sinks.