Author Topic: Who killed Morgan?  (Read 30112 times)

AeroJock

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Who killed Morgan?
« on: 18 April 2011, 13:16:10 »
I apologise in advance for this, as it's probably been asked eleventy billion times before, but search function found nothing. I've just returned after a long hiatus and probably have missed TONS of fluff. So, without further ado....

Did we ever find out who killed Morgan Hasek-Davion, and if so who?

Sorry!

blackjack

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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #1 on: 18 April 2011, 13:20:16 »
Dont quote me but I thought he died during the wiping out of Smoke Jaguar.
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AeroJock

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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #2 on: 18 April 2011, 13:22:23 »
Dont quote me but I thought he died during the wiping out of Smoke Jaguar.

He actually died en route, assassinated, but during the novel arc his killers were never revealed.
I was wondering if it ever got explained later?

Frabby

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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #3 on: 18 April 2011, 13:39:18 »
Nope. A couple of theories abound, but ultimately, neither the perpetrator nor the motive behind his assassination were revealed.
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GreyJaeger

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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #4 on: 18 April 2011, 13:43:40 »
Not certain what the theories are, as it has been a long time since I read the novels or the sourcebooks, but my money is on either Katherine Steiner-Davion or the Word of Blake. Katherine would of had it done to kick out support from under Victor. WoB would of done it, well, because it fulfilled "The Master's Plan".

Just my two cents.
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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #5 on: 18 April 2011, 13:48:16 »
Not certain what the theories are, as it has been a long time since I read the novels or the sourcebooks, but my money is on either Katherine Steiner-Davion or the Word of Blake. Katherine would of had it done to kick out support from under Victor. WoB would of done it, well, because it fulfilled "The Master's Plan".

Just my two cents.

If Katherine was going to do it, after its mission is complete. She does have a vested interest in getting the Clans off her back, and taking out the unit leader in the middle of a mission is not helping that. The motive is there but the timing is all wrong.

WoB, on the other hand? They want to see Bulldog fail because they, not anyone else, are the ones who are the chosen saviors of the Inner Sphere. Actively trying to undermine the unit's cohesion and introducing instability is going to help that.


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Hawkeye Jim

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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #6 on: 18 April 2011, 14:03:19 »
WoB would be more inclined to put suicide commandoes on board several ships with orders to blow them up. They seemed to like doing nasty things in a large way.

AeroJock

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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #7 on: 18 April 2011, 14:14:28 »
Fair enough, it'll remain "one of those" mysteries then. I lean towards WoB myself, although it seems a bit more subtle and surgical then they normally went for (see aforementioned suicide bombs). But if they wanted Bulldog to fail without it being obviously sabotaged, so that they could sweep in and save the IS...yeah, that fits for me.

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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #8 on: 18 April 2011, 14:20:14 »
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MoneyLovinOgre4Hire

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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #9 on: 18 April 2011, 14:55:56 »
Why would Liao want him dead?  Sun Tsu was First Lord at the time, if the mission failed it reflected on him.

Victor ruled out Kathrine primarily because "she wouldn't be that stupid" but we already knew that she was even stupider than that when it came to getting back at her brother for perceived slights.
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AeroJock

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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #10 on: 18 April 2011, 15:13:37 »
True...with Katherine it generally was "spite first, long term planning...well, never", so it's impossible to rule her out.

Wotan

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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #11 on: 18 April 2011, 15:18:10 »
I would go with George Hasek. Why ? Nobody wins more than George.  8)

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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #12 on: 18 April 2011, 15:24:13 »
I won't speak for Guardsmen, but SunTzu wouldn't have had any trouble putting it on those on who were or should have been on the mission, the SL was a means to an end for him anyway, preserving the enemies of his enemies while getting a less exp march lord, and potentially fueling a rival's civil war with the added benefit that up against the clans is one of the few places a Hasek could drop dead without the name Liao coming up seems like a bargain. In fact the more I think about it if Sun-Tzu didn't do it he was probably just pressed for time  ;)

I'd have to go with the woblies, prehaps in more of a old school C* way, for most of the reasons above, however I think the writers were more concerned with an interesting plot hook then an overarching setting storyline.
« Last Edit: 18 April 2011, 15:27:53 by Underscore »
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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #13 on: 18 April 2011, 15:25:29 »
I would go with George Hasek. Why ? Nobody wins more than George.  8)

How about Morgan's wife, and the butler? George is kinda a mama's boy.
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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #14 on: 18 April 2011, 15:31:14 »
How about Morgan's wife, and the butler? George is kinda a mama's boy.

Kym wouldn't kill Morgan, at least not in 3058. But she was prepared to do so in '28, I bet.

And it's very possible that she's the one that had George killed, although I like to think it was Yvonne.


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Underscore

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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #15 on: 18 April 2011, 15:37:40 »
You're only saying that because you're not aware of her steamy affair with the butler, Chili Rodriguez. Once she had him out of the way she planned on playing the dowager duchess through her son. It's all so obvious! If only it wasn't for those meddling toaster worshippers.
« Last Edit: 18 April 2011, 15:48:29 by Underscore »
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Stormlion1

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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #16 on: 18 April 2011, 17:31:23 »
What didn't you all know? Morgan had some outstanding gambling debts and the poisoning was the way of the 31st century Mob.  :D
My money is on Katy S-D, if Morgan had survived Serpent and returned home, her plans for her control of the FedSuns would have run into a huge problem. Morgan was exceedingly respected by the FedSuns military and without his support her bid for power was doomed.
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Fallen_Raven

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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #17 on: 18 April 2011, 17:51:37 »
Not to mention he supported Victor. And if two men with the name Davion kicked the Clans all the way to Strana-Mechty saving the Lyran Alliance, Katherine's going to look really stupid for saying that Victor never did anything for "her" people. Hell with Victor running the Smoke Jaguars out of town he had the Combine ready to eat out of his hand, most of the MRBC units loved him, Kai dedicated quite a few matches to him Solaris 7, and he was on relatively good terms with the heirs of most of the nations in the Sphere. Katherine had to do whatever she could to stop him.

P.S. If you trust a nekakami as a source they say that the assasin was the bomb threat guy, and that he was Loki.
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MoneyLovinOgre4Hire

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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #18 on: 18 April 2011, 19:02:13 »
I won't speak for Guardsmen, but SunTzu wouldn't have had any trouble putting it on those on who were or should have been on the mission, the SL was a means to an end for him anyway, preserving the enemies of his enemies while getting a less exp march lord, and potentially fueling a rival's civil war with the added benefit that up against the clans is one of the few places a Hasek could drop dead without the name Liao coming up seems like a bargain. In fact the more I think about it if Sun-Tzu didn't do it he was probably just pressed for time  ;)

I didn't mean to imply that Sun Tsu wouldn't have Morgan whacked, just that poisoning him before the mission actually started doesn't seem quite like Sun Tsu's style.  He stood to gain plenty of prestige from being the reigning First Lord when the Jaguars died, so it seems more like he'd have had any assassins he sent wait to take down Morgan after the Jaguars had been crushed, not before.
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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #19 on: 18 April 2011, 19:25:31 »
One possibility I see overlooked whenever this discussion has come up - the assassin could have been working (knowingly or unknowingly) for the Black Dragons.  While they stood to gain from the Jaguars being pushed out, they were also notorious for wanting things done their way, and such a machiavellian scheme of having an agent come in with obvious evidence that would point directly at YOU while alternative evidence provided by the background of the agent himself pointed elsewhere is a plot worthy of Ruby and the other gemstones. 

We have seen on multiple occasions that they were willing to put the whole realm at risk for the sake of ruining the image of Theodore within the Combine, as well as an inherent need to do things themselves without permission and without accepting help from outsiders.  What better way to hurt Theodore for approving such a mission without sending any real DC troops along than to ensure its failure?  And to have it also take out someone who had shamed their military during '39?  Icing on the cake.

avon1985

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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #20 on: 18 April 2011, 19:37:43 »
I thought that it was stated in the book that the killer was Loki or at least I thought that one of the Kuritan officers recognized him as a Loki operative.  That would point to Katherine if true.

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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #21 on: 18 April 2011, 19:52:12 »
WoB would be more inclined to put suicide commandoes on board several ships with orders to blow them up. They seemed to like doing nasty things in a large way.

This is usually the option that appeals to me the least. The WoB seems like a cheap alternative... especially with respect to the other major players and power-groups actively interested in causing general mayhem for the factions involved in Operation Bulldog and Task Force Serpent.
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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #22 on: 18 April 2011, 20:11:37 »
 No one ever suspects the Knights of the Inner Sphere  }:)

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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #23 on: 18 April 2011, 20:12:13 »
True...with Katherine it generally was "spite first, long term planning...well, never", so it's impossible to rule her out.

True, at that time. It wasn't until after she went to the Clans that she changed.
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Siberian-troll

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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #24 on: 18 April 2011, 20:29:15 »
Qui prodest? Ariana Winston.
The killer tried to take her in hostages on public (why?), but she has killed him. She became next commander. She never been suspected.

Fallen_Raven

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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #25 on: 18 April 2011, 21:21:26 »
Since a large portion of the book was written based off of her perspective, that would require a whole lot of schizophrenia.
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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #26 on: 18 April 2011, 22:08:23 »
I thought that it was stated in the book that the killer was Loki or at least I thought that one of the Kuritan officers recognized him as a Loki operative.  That would point to Katherine if true.

I don't recall for sure (I do recall him using some special poison only available to Combine assassins, though), but even if that was true, WoB ROM has thoroughly infiltrated every other intelligence agency. If you're going to assassinate someone, you should probably disguise yourself in as many ways as possible.


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Guardsman

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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #27 on: 18 April 2011, 22:46:12 »
Why would Liao want him dead?  Sun Tsu was First Lord at the time, if the mission failed it reflected on him.

Victor ruled out Kathrine primarily because "she wouldn't be that stupid" but we already knew that she was even stupider than that when it came to getting back at her brother for perceived slights.

I won't speak for Guardsmen, but SunTzu wouldn't have had any trouble putting it on those on who were or should have been on the mission, the SL was a means to an end for him anyway, preserving the enemies of his enemies while getting a less exp march lord, and potentially fueling a rival's civil war with the added benefit that up against the clans is one of the few places a Hasek could drop dead without the name Liao coming up seems like a bargain. In fact the more I think about it if Sun-Tzu didn't do it he was probably just pressed for time  ;)

I'd have to go with the woblies, prehaps in more of a old school C* way, for most of the reasons above, however I think the writers were more concerned with an interesting plot hook then an overarching setting storyline.

Morgan Hasek-Davion was a competent AFFS General, he was personally loyal to Hanse Davion, and the rightful leader of the Capellan March. All three are ample reasons empigj for a Chancellor to arrange his assassination. What you seem to forget though, is how little chance Task Force Serpent was given. The First Lord assigned Kingston’s Rangers, late of the Chesterton Reserves, to the mission. They were expendable and this was viewed as a suicide mission. If anyone survived, and actually returned, it would be viewed as a bonus. The Great Refusal wasn’t part of the planning stages, it was pretty much off the cuff when Victor and others joined up and sensed an opportunity.

So any failure on the part of Morgan Hasek-Davion would not be a reflection on Sun-Tzu’s leadership. In fact, by sending a Davion Commander, he deprived his greatest enemy of a strength, and showed himself to be above historical conflicts. There were other capable leaders in the Task Force, and while I do not think Sun-Tzu was behind it, I wouldn’t put it past him. He had the means, he had the motive, and he had the opportunity.

George Hasek was young and inexperienced. He also was a pale imitation of his father. With Morgan’s death, the effect on the mission was negligible, but a powerful enemy would not be returning, and his replacement was a lesser man. By killing him before the Task Force made contact with the Clans, it also robbed House Davion of any glory associated with it should they prove successful. Killing him afterwards might have created a martyr. Killing him before created only intrigue.
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MoneyLovinOgre4Hire

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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #28 on: 18 April 2011, 23:50:18 »
I'm still not convinced.  The assassination seems too hamfisted for Sun Tsu.
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Guardsman

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Re: Who killed Morgan?
« Reply #29 on: 19 April 2011, 01:27:27 »
I'm still not convinced.  The assassination seems too hamfisted for Sun Tsu.

What aspects of the operation lack precision in your view?
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