Author Topic: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II  (Read 14851 times)

Getz

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(Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« on: 11 March 2015, 12:46:48 »

Ah - the noble Jagermech!  Proud icon of the Federated Suns!  I don’t doubt that it was a matter of some concern to the officers of the AFFS that one of their most famous and recognisable heavy mechs had the all firepower of gentle summer breeze and protection of a biscuit tin.  When the opportunity came to redesign this most Davion of mechs, Kallon proudly turned out not one, but two completely reinvented Jagermechs.  I have already discussed the 65 ton Jagermech III, so now lets consider its bigger brother, the 70 ton JM7 series Jagermech.

Incidentally, for all the fact that the JM7 series should logically be called Jagermech IIs, officially that term doesn’t seem to be used.  Go figure, sometimes the Inner Sphere is weird like that - for the sake of clarity I’m going to call them Jagermech IIs anyway.

The first Jagermech II went into production in 3057 and the resulting JM7-D is armed in a manner highly reminiscent of the Rifleman - twin Ultra-5 Auto cannons and twin ER Large Lasers, one in each arm and a pair of medium pulse lasers in the torsos.  This is cooled by thirteen double heat sinks, propelled at 64 kmph by a 280 rated XL engine and protected by eleven tons of ferro-fibrous armour.  That's right, 91% coverage biased towards the front – whilst that’s not maximum protection that’s still a respectable carapace for a seventy ton mech and you can take a good number of solid knocks without having to fear being breached.  There's a ton of ammo for each Ultra-auto, but even that's padded by the heat sinks spilling out of the engine and there’s CASE protecting the pilot if not the engine.  Jagermech IIs can actually stand in line and take a beating while dishing one back out!  However it isn’t all sunshine and rainbows - the range brackets of the auto cannons and lasers don’t line up perfectly making it hard to find an optimal engagement range.  Also, although the heat sinks cover the primary weapons, once you ramp up the firing rate of the auto cannons or start moving – much less both – you will start to build up some heat.  By succession wars standards this is nothing and you can easily drop a large laser occasionally to get things back under control, but it is pity because the JM7-D works best when it can put down a continuous barrage of supporting fire.  Heat is much more of a problem if you find yourself at knife fighting range as the temptation is to exploit the large lasers lack of minimum range.  In practice you are probably better off accepting the penalty to hit with the auto cannons and firing only one of the large lasers.  Nevertheless, the JM7-D is a pretty capable fire support mech and if you keep it in your back line, sustaining a high volume of fire it can more than pull its weight. The JM7-D appears to have made its operational debut in the invasion of Cermak in 3059 (part of Operation Bulldog) where it performed respectably against the Smoke Jaguars, which is no small achievement.

Following on from this in 3062, the JM7-F pulls the arm mounted weaponry from the 7-D in favour of a pair of RAC5s.  The pulse lasers are replaced by extended range models and there's enough ammo for the rotary blenders to keep them running at full chat for a minute.  If that wasn't enough, the entire set up is augmented by a Guardian ECM suite and a Targeting computer.  Ouch.  Old timers like me will remember just how evil rotary auto cannons coupled to targeting computers were under previous rules editions and back in the day it was quite possible for a JM-7F to saw open and gut the torso location of your choice in a single turn.  These days it is merely a dangerous mid ranged brawler, although the lack of arm actuators can put you at a major disadvantage if things close to melee range.  You’ll probably want to run it on point for a lance, so the ECM suite means you can perform an additional service interdicting C3 networks or interfering with enemy targeting.

The JM7-G of 3068 is more in line with the traditional, lighter Jagermechs.  It mounts a class 2 rotary and LBX auto cannon in each arm and retains the ER mediums of the JM7-F.  Obviously you’re not going to be smacking down an Atlas in a single round with that armament, but it can crit-seek at range or fish for a golden BB like few others whilst staying icy cool all the while.  It also performs the traditional AA role better than any of the other models in the JM7 series.

The last model in the series is the JM7-C3BS, which dates from 3075.  The mech packs a grand total of four LAC2s and two snub nosed PPCs, making it the first Jagermech II to tote three guns in each arm and swinging hard for the “most dakka” award.  There is only one ER Medium laser backing this up, however, which has been moved to the centreline.  This time the conversation piece is a boosted C3 slave which is a technology that I’m personally not really sold on.  In fact, I’m not really sold on the combination of snub nosed PPCs and C3 networks at all.  I can’t really see this being used as a spotter as it’s a bit slow for that role and exploiting the snubbies huge short range isn’t going to help the rest of your lance that much.  Meanwhile, hanging back and benefiting from targeting information does nothing to mitigate the damage drop beyond 270 meters.
 
When it comes to using Jagermech IIs, both the D and the G want to hold the range open and snipe as they only have token secondary weapons.  They have enough armour to resist some heavy firepower, but the unreliability of ultra and rotary auto cannons means they don’t dish it out in quite the same quantity as some of their peers like the advanced Marauder and Warhammer variants.  As such they really benefit from working alongside something with more close-ranged crunch – something like the JM7-F.  Penetrators also spring to mind as a good partner from the AFFC armoury.  The JM7-F works best at medium range.  All Jagermechs can flip arms but the JM7-F is probably the only mech in the series where you might actually want to exploit that ability on a regular basis – few back stabbers will want to risk two short ranged RAC5s at full chatter and the very threat of that can keep the enemy off your tail if you plunge into the fray.

There is no magic trick to fighting Jagermech IIs - they are all relatively conventional heavies that just need to be beaten down until you can get at their soft innards.  The main thing is to know if you're fighting a JM7-F or one of the other variants as you'll want to close with the most of them, but rushing into the loving embrace of a pair of tar-comp augmented RAC5s isn't terribly smart.
« Last Edit: 11 March 2015, 18:12:22 by Getz »

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Kidd

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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #1 on: 11 March 2015, 13:42:21 »
(Snipped, with apologies)

The JM7-F is probably one of the best dual RAC carriers out there.
« Last Edit: 11 March 2015, 22:30:02 by Kidd »

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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #2 on: 11 March 2015, 14:01:29 »
I'd swap the snubbies for twin LPPCs and it seems to fit the vision for the C3BS. Stay at range and use that BC3. The snubbies are an odd addition. Or swap one snubbie for twin Lppcs and keep one close range defence. Ac/AC lppc in each arm and the snubbie in the torso.

Either way the C3BS is an odd fish. The JIII is a nice machine.
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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #3 on: 11 March 2015, 14:09:51 »
I rather like this JagerMech JM7-F has served me well in the past but its not a real JagerMech to much armour its a proper heavy mech and one that should be respected and it should never have been called JagerMech would have been better as a new name

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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #4 on: 11 March 2015, 15:03:02 »
Thanks for the bonus article, Getz.

Jagermech III is a fun mech, specially the JM7-F, additively when i got into the Battletech's gaming side in the early 2000s i got in that "stuck in FedCom Civil War Era forever" time. So i ended up playing alot of FedCom era missions, with the
Jagermech III starring in many of them.  Rotaries were nasty, still are but not as deadly as they were in the BMR rules.
Funny thing, TRO: Project Phoenix fluff showed that the blockade created by one the opposing sides in the FedCom Civil War to the factory made the JM7-Fs was forced switch to different design because lack of Targeting computers, resulting in the reseen version of the Rifleman being put into production.
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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #5 on: 11 March 2015, 16:29:56 »
Like I said on the other thread,  I've seen the twin RAC Jager do some unsettling things in combat.  If your dice are hot, it is a terrifying monstrosity, especially using the old rules. 

When it comes to the others, I prefer the Jager 3 to the ERLL model.  And I'm not a fan of new PPCs. Except for the heavy,  because well it's a heavy PPC.

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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #6 on: 11 March 2015, 16:36:31 »
If its designated a III, call it a III, regardless of whatever we would personally prefer.

Huh? The whole point is that the 7-series carries no Roman numerals, despite being structurally (if not cosmetically) more different to the old JagerMech than the III.

In the context of Getz's dual article, calling the 7-series the "II" certainly makes a lot of sense.
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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #7 on: 11 March 2015, 18:31:29 »
When I first used the JM-7F, it was an unspeakably evil machine to my opponent.

It's why I like it.  8)
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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #8 on: 11 March 2015, 22:31:18 »
Huh? The whole point is that the 7-series carries no Roman numerals, despite being structurally (if not cosmetically) more different to the old JagerMech than the III.

In the context of Getz's dual article, calling the 7-series the "II" certainly makes a lot of sense.
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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #9 on: 12 March 2015, 00:33:28 »
The JM7 series - the Jagermech upgrades we needed, not the JagerMech IIIs we got.

(And for the record, I have also been calling them the JagerMech IIs for years ;) ).

Owing its existance to MechCommander - a game I believe those who've played it recall as fondly as the JM7 itself.  The 7-D is solid (unlike the 6-series, where you could poke holes in the armour with a tableknife), the JM7-F just downright nasty. In some regards, this is a design that would have deserved being Omnified.

And for the mini fanciers out there, the JagerMech III arms & legs, on the suitably amended torso of an Intro Box plastic Jagermech, makes a great JagerMech II mini. JIII arms are available from IWM's scrapyard, and there's surely someone who foolishly bought a JIII mini, and who now refuses to build it, you could source legs from ...

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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #10 on: 12 March 2015, 04:47:15 »
The Jagermech is an AA 'Mech, it's not supposed to move much, so the JM7-D not being able to sink it's whole heat load isn't a problem, it's supposed to hook up to a Coolant Truck. The same could probably be said for the original Rifleman

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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #11 on: 12 March 2015, 06:50:28 »
The JM7 series - the Jagermech upgrades we needed, not the JagerMech IIIs we got.

(And for the record, I have also been calling them the JagerMech IIs for years ;) ).

Owing its existance to MechCommander - a game I believe those who've played it recall as fondly as the JM7 itself.  The 7-D is solid (unlike the 6-series, where you could poke holes in the armour with a tableknife), the JM7-F just downright nasty. In some regards, this is a design that would have deserved being Omnified.

And for the mini fanciers out there, the JagerMech III arms & legs, on the suitably amended torso of an Intro Box plastic Jagermech, makes a great JagerMech II mini. JIII arms are available from IWM's scrapyard, and there's surely someone who foolishly bought a JIII mini, and who now refuses to build it, you could source legs from ...

W.
I made my JM-7F using the Rifleman Reseen arms and put on original JaegerMech, seem to work out fine.  Mashed together they were meant for one another. :)
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Getz

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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #12 on: 12 March 2015, 08:11:27 »
The Jagermech is an AA 'Mech, it's not supposed to move much, so the JM7-D not being able to sink it's whole heat load isn't a problem, it's supposed to hook up to a Coolant Truck. The same could probably be said for the original Rifleman

You know, I don't think the JM7-D is an AA mech - I think it's a Jagermech that's been rengineered to perform the direct fire support role without requiring a complete retooling of the production line.

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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #13 on: 12 March 2015, 12:03:52 »
You know, I don't think the JM7-D is an AA mech - I think it's a Jagermech that's been rengineered to perform the direct fire support role without requiring a complete retooling of the production line.

It's an ass-kicker, is what it is. Very good Mech.

...man, can you imagine the first time a Capellan Mechwarrior ran into one of these things? You know Jagermechs, you know what they can do, what they can't do, it's a Jagermech, you've been fighting them for years. Except... huh, this one just took the kind of beating that should have punched right through the other side of it and it's still not only standing there like nothing happened, but- OW, it hits back a lot harder than the old one! PANIC!!!
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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #14 on: 12 March 2015, 13:37:00 »
The 7-F is the JagerMech I would have loved as a kid. Being able to sling a half ton of lead down field at boosted accuracy makes it an awesome murder machine to back up its snipey brothers. teaming it with a 7-D gives you a lovely hi-lo punch. The only thing I'd love to do to the F would be perhaps add MASC/supercharger to bring those guns into play faster, or shock a big assault unit by running past the lumbering wall, flip the arms and mow down their back armor with extreme prejudice.

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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #15 on: 12 March 2015, 16:57:39 »
In retrospect, the Light PPC and maybe capacitors would have been better than the Snub PPCs on the Boosted Slave variant.

Oh well, it's flawed, must be a Jager.
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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #16 on: 12 March 2015, 19:07:25 »
I haven't crunched the numbers but keep thinking of a flashbulb JM7 in the same style the JM6-D4
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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #17 on: 12 March 2015, 21:27:34 »
Flashbulb and Jagermech just don't mix in my book but if you like it, go for it.

The JM7 series definitely has some of my favorite versions of the Jagermech. Lots and lots of Dakka along with lots and lots of armor. The regular Jagermech is so bad its good imo and the Jager III is a good heavy cav machine but the JM7 Jager II's are the true successors to concept of a heavy direct fire, autocannon armed Davion mech.
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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #18 on: 12 March 2015, 22:19:20 »
I love the JM7 series.  I gave a solid thrashing to a Turkina with a 7D.  Sure, the Turkey still won, but it was a Clan mech with a 25 ton advantage, and it only just won.  If I'd been against a mech with slightly less armor, like a Masakari or Gladiator, I'd have beaten it.  And using the 7F is just brutal.
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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #19 on: 16 March 2015, 23:52:38 »
The Jagermech is the finest battlearmor ever designed to be mounted on a light 'mech. the Urbanmech inside moves faster, hits further, and once the armor's gone it can pop out and drop a-

wait, that's not an Urbie in there? just looks it? well that's disappointing.
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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #20 on: 23 March 2015, 17:30:04 »
The Jagermech is the finest battlearmor ever designed to be mounted on a light 'mech. the Urbanmech inside moves faster, hits further, and once the armor's gone it can pop out and drop a-

wait, that's not an Urbie in there? just looks it? well that's disappointing.

No, Mr. Orin. That's the Imp with an Urbie in it. The JM7 is too light to carry a whole other mech in it.

Then again, if BT was like Pokemon, the Urbie would evolve into a JM6 at Level 65 and then an Imp at Level 100, with the different configs being different movesets it can forget or remember.

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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #21 on: 23 March 2015, 18:00:13 »
The Jagermech is the finest battlearmor ever designed to be mounted on a light 'mech. the Urbanmech inside moves faster, hits further, and once the armor's gone it can pop out and drop a-

wait, that's not an Urbie in there? just looks it? well that's disappointing.
??? Huh?
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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #22 on: 24 March 2015, 11:17:17 »
It's an ass-kicker, is what it is. Very good Mech.

...man, can you imagine the first time a Capellan Mechwarrior ran into one of these things? You know Jagermechs, you know what they can do, what they can't do, it's a Jagermech, you've been fighting them for years. Except... huh, this one just took the kind of beating that should have punched right through the other side of it and it's still not only standing there like nothing happened, but- OW, it hits back a lot harder than the old one! PANIC!!!

You forget--the Capellans nuked the factory that produced it in the opening years of the Jihad.  >:D  So the panic only lasted a few years.

cheers,

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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #23 on: 24 March 2015, 16:30:37 »
You forget--the Capellans nuked the factory that produced it in the opening years of the Jihad.  >:D  So the panic only lasted a few years.

cheers,

Gabe

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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #24 on: 25 March 2015, 21:58:21 »
The Jagermech is the finest battlearmor ever designed to be mounted on a light 'mech. the Urbanmech inside moves faster, hits further, and once the armor's gone it can pop out and drop a-

wait, that's not an Urbie in there? just looks it? well that's disappointing.
??? Huh?

it's a fandom joke about how a jeagermech's torso looks like the body of an Urbanmech.

« Last Edit: 25 March 2015, 22:01:46 by glitterboy2098 »

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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #25 on: 25 March 2015, 22:01:36 »
@glitterboy2098 -  :D :D :D :D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #26 on: 25 March 2015, 22:08:23 »
Eh, I see more resemblance (in the shoulders & across where the neck should be) to the Thug or Dragon/Grand Dragon than I do to an Urbanmech, but whatever floats your boat.
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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #27 on: 25 March 2015, 23:38:51 »
@glitterboy2098 -  :D :D :D :D ;D ;D ;D ;D

I do hope the "armour" is one of the 70-tonners...remember that in their standard 3025 configs, the Urbie and Jager have the same number of armour points  >:D

cheers,

Gabe
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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #28 on: 26 March 2015, 10:43:49 »
I used to follow that cartoon. I haven't seen it in a long time. Are they still doing it?
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Re: (Bonus) Mech of the Week: JM7-* Jagermech II
« Reply #29 on: 26 March 2015, 11:13:31 »
I used to follow that cartoon. I haven't seen it in a long time. Are they still doing it?

The comic is up to #71, so i think their still making it. You got love the guy doing it, technically only current active Battletech themed webcomic around.
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