Author Topic: Alpha Strike Mech of the Moment: TLN-** Talon  (Read 4696 times)

whistler

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Alpha Strike Mech of the Moment: TLN-** Talon
« on: 27 July 2015, 14:51:17 »
Hey there fellas! 

Today we're going to be looking at the Talon, an excellent 35-ton quick-strike battlemech. 

First introduced by the SLDF back in 2670, the TLN-5W was a welcome addition to light mech units in need of long-range firepower.  Armed with an ER PPC and powered by a 280XL engine, the Talon could not only deliver a solid punch at extreme ranges but also keep up with the SLDF's most mobile elements.  Back in the day garnered quite the reputation, and Talons were famous for being deployed with the lighter Mongoose in high speed hunter-killer squads.  But even a mech as fast as the Talon couldn't outrun the destruction of the Succession Wars.  The Blackstone factory was nuked in the early 2800s, and before long the few remaining Talons were scrapped for parts.  An unceremonious end to say the least.  But, thanks to the technological renaissance of the 3050s, the Talon was given a new lease on life.  The factory on Inarcs was rebuilt and soon fresh mechs were marching off the lines to face the Clan juggernaut.  In addition to serving the Lyran state, Talons were sold to the Davion half of the FedCom, the Kuritans, and a number of affiliated merc units.

Let's take a look at the primary model found in both the SLDF and modern armies, the Talon-5W.  The -5W is, essentially, a faster Wolfhound.  Its primary weapon is an ER PPC instead of an ER Large Laser.  It loses some Medium Lasers, but in exchange gains a serious speed boost.  I think both are wise trades.  The Peeper's ten-point pop is deadly against light mechs and nothing for a medium or heavy mech to sneeze at.  The extra range shouldn't be underestimated either.  Taking the max range from 19 hexes to 23 means that careful pilots are no longer at the mercy of LRMs, or even LB 5/10-Xs.  With 11 DHSs it should come as no surprise that this mech is an alpha baby, and therefore pretty simple to use.  The extra speed afforded by the XL Engine is a substantial improvement, even if the mech is a bit more fragile.  Light mechs don't last too long anyway, even those with maxed armor like the Talon, so giving the machine as much of an evasive bonus as possible is the priority in my book.   As with any light mech I'd love for the Talon to have jump jets, but it has enough overland speed to maneuver effectively most of the time.

Now of course the real question: how does all this translate into Alpha Strike?  That's why you're all here, right?  After all we've seen plenty of crap mechs gain new purpose thanks to the conversion process, while some of our favorites suffer under the Alpha Strike ruleset.  Where does the Talon-5W come down?



When I'm looking at any light or medium mech's AS card the first thing I check is the TMM, so let's start there.  Thanks to that big engine the Talon gets a TMM of 3, which is pretty solid in the modern era, as well as a 16"/8 hex movement profile.  Four points of armor is as good as a light mech can get with standard armors.  Two structure might seem somewhat paltry, but here's the thing.  With the way the conversion rules work, a standard engine on a 35-ton mech would get you 3 structure.  So for the -5W the conversion of the XL Engine is actually quite favorable.  As I said before, sacrificing a point of structure to bump your non-variable TMM from 2 to 3 is a trade I'd make any day.  The weapons conversion is hardly awe-inspiring, I admit.  A 2/2/1 bracket isn't particularly weak but it's not exactly strong either.  Its not much of a surprise when you consider that the Talon can just barely force a PSR when you hit with all three of its guns.  The mech does get the ENE special... if you somehow manage to survive a hit that breaches your armor at least you won't go up in flames thanks to an ammo explosion.  I suppose that's worth something.

So the -5W has some things going for it, but without some big juicy numbers in the damage brackets it doesn't seem like much, right?  Well, much like with the CBT version of this mech you need to judge the Talon more on what can be done with it rather than just the raw numbers.  And one of the most important numbers is the one I haven't touched on yet: PV.  The -5W only costs 23 points to field.  Thats pretty damn cheap when you consider what it can do, folks.  The -5W can shoot out to long range and scoot at high speed, maintaining a high defensive mod without having to rely on jumping.  While it might not have tide-turning firepower on its own (which is pretty tough for a light mech anyway) it is cheap, allowing you to field them in droves.  For less than 100 points you can run a lance of long-range harassers that can reinforce weak points along the line or just go flank the enemy and keep him honest.  That is a solid investment in my book.

Lets briefly compare the Talon to some of its contemporaries:   
Mongoose-86 (22) [3/18", 3/1, 2/2/1, ENE, PRB, RCN]
Wolfhound-2X (25) [3/16", 4/2, 2/2/2, ENE, RFA]
Wolfhound-3S/Night Hawk-2Q (24) [2/12", 4/2, 3/3/1, ENE]
Night Hawk-2S (26) [2/12", 4/2, 2/2/1, ECM, ENE, PRB, RCN]
Spector-ST (27) [3/18", 4/2, 2/2/1, ECM, ENE, STL]
Cicada-3F (25) [3/16"j, 4/2, 2/2/1, ENE]
Panther-10K2 (23) [1/8"j, 3/3, 3/3/1, CASE, SRM1/1]

I think you guys will be able to figure out my shorthand here... seems kind of silly to post the full unit cards.  Anyway!  The Mongoose, the Talon's older sister, really only has one variant that has long range damage, and that's the -86.  A single point less PV for two specials and a bit less A/S.  A worthwhile tradeoff in my book.  Pretty easy to see why these guys were paired together.  The others are treated more as 'Talon alternatives'.  The Panther-10K2 reaches the 3-point damage platue but gives up alot to get there.  Same general durability, but faaaar slower and easier to hit, even with the jump jets.  The Cicada-3F is a very good option, being essentially the same mech as the Talon but with jump jets.  Are the jets and heavier chassis worth a few extra PV?  That's between you and your PV budget.  The Spector-ST is in a similar vein.  While it costs 27 points it does carry stealth armor.  Very handy for a long range harasser.  The Wolfhound/Nighthawk bumps your damage up and your TMM down by 1 each.  They only cost a point more than the -5W, so this comes down to play style / personal experience.  Then we have the Wolfhound-2X.  This is a tough choice.  2 extra PV for 2 long-range damage.  Again, it comes down to how you plan to use it.

My opinion?  I love the -5W.  Fast, capable, tough, and low-cost.  To me it's a perfect example of a light striker / skirmisher.  Since they're cheap enough to field in conjunction with heavier / more expensive mechs, I'm more concerned with their effect on the battle than I am with their raw damage output.  If I run them my opponent is stuck with a tough decision.  Does he try to whittle down my heavy / assault mechs at range, taking the easy shots that he can get?  Or does he try to swat the fast buggers circling around at long range?  If he focuses on the big boys the Talons will be tearing through his backfield in no time, sniping all the way in.  If he goes for the tough shots on the lighter mechs, he lets the big boys waddle into optimum range.  And since the Talon has 4 points of armor he's going to need to hit twice to kill / crit one.  If he tries to use the same strategy on me, I just send out my Talons and let them do what they were made to do: seek and destroy.  No matter how you use them Talons are very useful units.

Since variety is the spice of our gaming lives, let's take a look at the Talon's two other variants.  While there is technically the extinct -5V as well, its card is the exact same as the -5W and therefore will be skipped.  First up is the -5Z which comes to us courtesy of TRO:3058U. 



Truth be told I hate the CBT stats for the -5Z.  The engine is a downgraded Light, while the weapons are traded for... a pair of ER Large Lasers?  With only 10 DHS?  What the hell is this monstrosity?  But thanks to the (sometimes) magic of the Alpha Strike conversion, the -5Z actually comes out ahead.  The engine swap might take a bit off the mech's speed but thankfully it still retains its TMM:3.  Armor and structure remain unchanged (for the same reason the XL engine only removes a point of structure the Light doesn't add any), though the damage output has been bumped up a bit.  Now you're sitting at 2s across the board.  Not bad at all when you factor in the -5Z's new C3S special.  That right folks, we've got ourselves a nice little C3 sniper here.  For 2 points of long-range, C3-guided damage 25 PV is a steal, especially when you consider it maintains the TMM:3.  Not having ECM is a shame but considering it's a sniper rather than a spotter that shouldn't be a deal breaker.

Now tell me, what do you get when load the Talon's empty frame with advanced construction materials and dump all the weight savings into the weapons array?  Pain.  What you get is pain... very fast pain.  I simply adore the Heavy PPC, and seeing one on a Talon in TRO:3085's Old is the New New section was an unexpected delight.  In CBT the extra power in that ten-ton, headcapping lightening-cannon comes at the expense of range... but who cares when your 35-ton light mech takes out a 100-ton Pillager with one shot, right?  With Alpha Strike's fixed brackets we get all the benefits of the HPPC's increased firepower without loss of range.  It all translates to an across the board firepower increase for the Talon.



Holy shit, now that's a striker!  For an Inner Sphere light mech, let alone one with a TMM of 3, the -6W has got some bite.  At 27 PV this Talon is the most expensive yet, but you really do get what you pay for.  Compare it to, say, the Centurion-D5.  The Centurion has the same speed profile but is only a 3/3/0 in the damage department.  While it gains an extra point of armor it's also got a point value of 31.  You'll be hard pressed to find something that can match the -6W's numbers.  The Cicada-3P comes close, but for the same price i'd like to have the 3 short-range damage and two extra inches of movement the Talon provides.

Overall, the Talon is a great unit that translates pretty damn well to Alpha Strike.  It's fast, deadly, and affordable.  Although the variants are limited to the FedCom states, the Combine, affiliated mercs, and (eventually) the Republic, the base model is available to all.  If you need a cheap and capable flanker, the -5W is a great choice.  If you need a swift C3 sniper, the -5Z is an excellent option.  And if you need a whole lot of whopass in a small, fast package, the -6W is definitely for you.  Give'em a try O0
« Last Edit: 27 July 2015, 16:26:50 by whistler »
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nckestrel

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Re: Alpha Strike Mech of the Moment: TLN-** Talon
« Reply #1 on: 27 July 2015, 14:57:06 »
Nice idea on the comparisons to other units.
Alpha Strike Introduction resources
Left of Center blog - Tukayyid Expanded Random Unit Tables, Nashira Campaign for A Game of Armored Combat, TP 3039 Vega Supplemental Record Sheets

Nahuris

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Re: Alpha Strike Mech of the Moment: TLN-** Talon
« Reply #2 on: 27 July 2015, 16:20:27 »
I'll admit, I haven't played Alpha Strike, yet... but I have been reading these to get a handle on things......
The Talon is one of my favorite mechs in the game. I am a light and low medium guy, on the best of days .... and to see how this translates over, especially with reading the other articles and learning how things work... yeah, I think this might just get me to push a bit harder in my group, to try Alpha Strike

Nahuris
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UnLimiTeD

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Re: Alpha Strike Mech of the Moment: TLN-** Talon
« Reply #3 on: 27 July 2015, 16:25:15 »
And another unexpected take on these articles.
Cleverly done.
Also a nice unit.
I guess it is pretty close to the optimum here.
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iamfanboy

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Re: Alpha Strike Mech of the Moment: TLN-** Talon
« Reply #4 on: 27 July 2015, 22:15:30 »
One of the... normalities of Alpha Strike is that a lot of the high-light/low-medium BattleMechs, especially in the Striker category, have the following stats in common: TMM +3, Armor 4, Structure 2. So the Talon hits the right check boxes, and with one additional check above some of its competitors because it, at least, has a variant which deals 3 damage at a range longer than Short.

But what sticks with me when looking at the Talon is the idea that finally the Star League engineers were figuring out how to design a good light. I just have this visual image of Kermit the Frog in a labcoat saying, "Kermit the Frog here. It took us three hundred years, but now we know what makes a 'Mech design good." *waves its arms wildly* "Yaaaaaay!"

The fact that it can keep up with a lot of Clan designs like the Incubus and Shadow Cat says how well it does its job.

Auren

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Re: Alpha Strike Mech of the Moment: TLN-** Talon
« Reply #5 on: 28 July 2015, 00:21:05 »
The Draconis Combine finding out the Star League can make a good light probably had something closer to this reaction


whistler

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Re: Alpha Strike Mech of the Moment: TLN-** Talon
« Reply #6 on: 28 July 2015, 00:42:05 »
thanks guys :D  i'm glad you're enjoying the article.

considering that i hadn't written a MotW before i was a little worried about how it might turn out.  i've always felt that a good MotW article is equal parts stat / fluff recap and player experience / opinion... if my reasons for fielding a mech go beyond the raw stats then they should be included in the article.  since force selection is extremely important, often dictating the player's core strategy, it's just as important to cover how a unit fits into your game plan as how it will perform.  when i put a force together i spend a lot of time cruising the MUL.  i often end up with a group of similar units, and i pull what i want based on my own personal experience and strategy.  comparing the Talon to other mechs as i would in that situation seemed like a pretty natural step to take.

One of the... normalities of Alpha Strike is that a lot of the high-light/low-medium BattleMechs, especially in the Striker category, have the following stats in common: TMM +3, Armor 4, Structure 2. So the Talon hits the right check boxes, and with one additional check above some of its competitors because it, at least, has a variant which deals 3 damage at a range longer than Short.

But what sticks with me when looking at the Talon is the idea that finally the Star League engineers were figuring out how to design a good light. I just have this visual image of Kermit the Frog in a labcoat saying, "Kermit the Frog here. It took us three hundred years, but now we know what makes a 'Mech design good." *waves its arms wildly* "Yaaaaaay!"

indeed.  i think when it comes right down to it light mech design is far more focused than that of heavy and assault mechs.  after all you've only got so much tonnage to work with.  upping the speed increases both the longevity and utility of light mechs, and with the low upper-limit on armor/structure 30-something ton mechs are either going to have 2 or 3 points regardless of the engine. 

i do agree that a good high-threat light mech was a long time coming for the Star League.  their light mech roster was... lackluster, to say the least.
« Last Edit: 28 July 2015, 01:13:21 by whistler »
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Savage Coyote

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Re: Alpha Strike Mech of the Moment: TLN-** Talon
« Reply #7 on: 28 July 2015, 09:18:05 »
My biggest Alpha Strike disappointment in general was the hit that THN's took for 'mechs like this.  When I play with a Talon or Phantom, it's very rare that they don't have a +4 to hit.  While it involves a lot of circular movement (i.e. always hitting the turns to get that +10 hexes moved) it's doable.  In AS you get a blanket +3 while the enemy lost all movement penalties, making them easier to hit.  I guess this is compensated by the fixed range bands to a degree, but I remember being said when some of my favorite speed demons were too slow to get up to their "normal" modifier band.

All said and done, the Talon and other 'mechs mentioned in the article are some of the best in-class and give you some of the best milage.  I'd also toss the Havoc in the list, though it's really an improved Jenner :D

 

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