Author Topic: Anyone ever notice this about Succession Wars era Capellan "mechs?  (Read 1685 times)

Dayton3

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I  noticed the following just by comparing the Vindicator, Snake, and Thunder (two mediums and a heavy).

1) They  each have a primary weapon mounted in either the right arm or right torso.
2) They each have their secondary missile weapons mounted in their left torsos
3) They have medium lasers mounted as backup weapons to the primary.

In triguing isn't it.

Ghaz

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Re: Anyone ever notice this about Succession Wars era Capellan "mechs?
« Reply #1 on: 21 September 2023, 20:36:34 »
The Snake is fluffed as a modified Vindicator, so there’s nothing unusual or ‘intriguing’ about the weapon layouts being similar.

SteelRaven

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Re: Anyone ever notice this about Succession Wars era Capellan "mechs?
« Reply #2 on: 21 September 2023, 20:45:05 »
The Snake and Thunder came after the 4SW so I'm not sure if they would count as SW mechs.

CapCon did love the Victor as much as the Vindicator, the Thunder is more or less a scaled down Victor.
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Dayton3

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Re: Anyone ever notice this about Succession Wars era Capellan "mechs?
« Reply #3 on: 21 September 2023, 21:31:00 »
The Snake and Thunder came after the 4SW so I'm not sure if they would count as SW mechs.

CapCon did love the Victor as much as the Vindicator, the Thunder is more or less a scaled down Victor.

good point

Psycho

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Re: Anyone ever notice this about Succession Wars era Capellan "mechs?
« Reply #4 on: 21 September 2023, 21:39:22 »
I'd say it's a pretty common arrangement. Main guns tend to be right arm, secondary position would be the torso. Most people are right handed, making it a natural choice if not mounting paired main guns. Spreading out the weapons load means you don't lose everything if the right side gets hit hard, and medium lasers are the go-to secondary weapon across the board.

Some other examples (of the not Capellan-centric variety)
Clint - doesn't have missiles, but main gun RA, secondary MLs.
P-Hawk - same.
Centurion - AC10 RA, LRM10 LT, 2 MLs.
T-Bolt - LL RA, LRM15 RT (an anomaly, the SRM is in the left), 3 MLs.
Orion - AC10 RT, both missile racks on the left, 2 MLs.
Victor - AC20 RA, SRM4 LT, 2 MLs.
Battlemaster - PPC RA, SRM6 LT, 6 MLs.
Cyclops - AC20 RT, LRM10 LT, 2 MLs.
Atlas - AC20 RT, LRM20 LT, 4 MLs.

There are only so many ways for things to be laid out, it shouldn't be a surprise to see patterns form across designs.

S.gage

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Re: Anyone ever notice this about Succession Wars era Capellan "mechs?
« Reply #5 on: 21 September 2023, 21:42:09 »
I  noticed the following just by comparing the Vindicator, Snake, and Thunder (two mediums and a heavy).

1) They  each have a primary weapon mounted in either the right arm or right torso.
2) They each have their secondary missile weapons mounted in their left torsos
3) They have medium lasers mounted as backup weapons to the primary.

In triguing isn't it.

I was noticing this trend, too, among some of their 'Mechs, so long as you make your criteria more general:

1) primary weapon is arm mounted
2) secondary weapon is the opposite arm or opposite torso

The Jinggau, Thunderbolt, Huron Warrior, Lightning, Firebee, Cataphract, Raven, and Koschei all fit this pattern, too. However, there are many outliers, the Lao Hu, Duan Gung, etc. Without looking, these might be general trends for all BattleMechs.
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Dayton3

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Re: Anyone ever notice this about Succession Wars era Capellan "mechs?
« Reply #6 on: 21 September 2023, 21:57:54 »
I'd say it's a pretty common arrangement. Main guns tend to be right arm, secondary position would be the torso. Most people are right handed, making it a natural choice if not mounting paired main guns. Spreading out the weapons load means you don't lose everything if the right side gets hit hard, and medium lasers are the go-to secondary weapon across the board.

Some other examples (of the not Capellan-centric variety)
Clint - doesn't have missiles, but main gun RA, secondary MLs.
P-Hawk - same.
Centurion - AC10 RA, LRM10 LT, 2 MLs.
T-Bolt - LL RA, LRM15 RT (an anomaly, the SRM is in the left), 3 MLs.
Orion - AC10 RT, both missile racks on the left, 2 MLs.
Victor - AC20 RA, SRM4 LT, 2 MLs.
Battlemaster - PPC RA, SRM6 LT, 6 MLs.
Cyclops - AC20 RT, LRM10 LT, 2 MLs.
Atlas - AC20 RT, LRM20 LT, 4 MLs.

There are only so many ways for things to be laid out, it shouldn't be a surprise to see patterns form across designs.

good analysis

17thRecon

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Re: Anyone ever notice this about Succession Wars era Capellan "mechs?
« Reply #7 on: 22 September 2023, 02:13:14 »
I  noticed the following just by comparing the Vindicator, Snake, and Thunder (two mediums and a heavy).

1) They  each have a primary weapon mounted in either the right arm or right torso.
2) They each have their secondary missile weapons mounted in their left torsos
3) They have medium lasers mounted as backup weapons to the primary.

In triguing isn't it.

The Snake has no medium lasers.

S2pidiT

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Re: Anyone ever notice this about Succession Wars era Capellan "mechs?
« Reply #8 on: 22 September 2023, 09:39:37 »
CapCon did love the Victor as much as the Vindicator, the Thunder is more or less a scaled down Victor.
CapCon may love Victor the 'Mech, but they don't love Victor the man... :cheesy:

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Re: Anyone ever notice this about Succession Wars era Capellan "mechs?
« Reply #9 on: 22 September 2023, 09:43:39 »
CapCon may love Victor the 'Mech, but they don't love Victor the man... :cheesy:

Depends which Victor.  Victor Liao was pretty badass back in the day, lopping off the Terran Ambassador’s head with his katana as his signal that Liao was joining the Outer Reaches Rebellion.
"We have made of New Avalon a towering funeral pyre and wiped the Davion scourge from the universe.  Tikonov, Chesterton and Andurien are ours once more, and the cheers of the Capellan people nearly drown out the gnashing of our foes' teeth as they throw down their weapons in despair.  Now I am made First Lord of the Star League, and all shall bow down to me and pay homa...oooooo! Shiny thing!" - Maximillian Liao, "My Triumph", audio dictation, 3030.  Unpublished.

Minemech

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Re: Anyone ever notice this about Succession Wars era Capellan "mechs?
« Reply #10 on: 22 September 2023, 09:43:42 »
 You want to split weapon systems between sides if possible. Having 1 free arm gives you the proposition of a punching attack at close range if you do not want to risk a kick going awry. Placing a primary weapon in an arm gives you greater field of fire, though many designs opt against it, preferring to box like the Grasshopper or Ostsol.

 The Snake was a very interesting example, because its autocannon gives it precious versatility, whilst its outmoded SSRM 2s previously gave it infernos to clean the clocks of BA.

Sir Chaos

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Re: Anyone ever notice this about Succession Wars era Capellan "mechs?
« Reply #11 on: 22 September 2023, 11:04:58 »
I'd say it's a pretty common arrangement. Main guns tend to be right arm, secondary position would be the torso. Most people are right handed, making it a natural choice if not mounting paired main guns. Spreading out the weapons load means you don't lose everything if the right side gets hit hard, and medium lasers are the go-to secondary weapon across the board.

Some other examples (of the not Capellan-centric variety)
Clint - doesn't have missiles, but main gun RA, secondary MLs.
P-Hawk - same.
Centurion - AC10 RA, LRM10 LT, 2 MLs.
T-Bolt - LL RA, LRM15 RT (an anomaly, the SRM is in the left), 3 MLs.
Orion - AC10 RT, both missile racks on the left, 2 MLs.
Victor - AC20 RA, SRM4 LT, 2 MLs.
Battlemaster - PPC RA, SRM6 LT, 6 MLs.
Cyclops - AC20 RT, LRM10 LT, 2 MLs.
Atlas - AC20 RT, LRM20 LT, 4 MLs.

There are only so many ways for things to be laid out, it shouldn't be a surprise to see patterns form across designs.

Yeah.

Frankly it would probably be easier and shorter to list the designs that aren´t either symmetrical or right-leaning. The Nightsky, but only if you count the LPL, not the hatchet, as the main gun. And that´s it, off the top of my head.
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Daryk

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Re: Anyone ever notice this about Succession Wars era Capellan "mechs?
« Reply #12 on: 22 September 2023, 14:08:45 »
*snip*
 The Snake was a very interesting example, because its autocannon gives it precious versatility, whilst its outmoded SSRM 2s previously gave it infernos to clean the clocks of BA.
There was a time Streak launchers could use Infernos? ???

Minemech

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Re: Anyone ever notice this about Succession Wars era Capellan "mechs?
« Reply #13 on: 22 September 2023, 14:20:30 »
There was a time Streak launchers could use Infernos? ???
Streak SRM 2s exclusively (Though that was more than 2 decades ago, so I may be mixing it up with simply SRM 2s).

 Edit: just checked, I am in the right. SSRM2s were inferno compatible.
« Last Edit: 22 September 2023, 14:25:47 by Minemech »

Daryk

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Re: Anyone ever notice this about Succession Wars era Capellan "mechs?
« Reply #14 on: 22 September 2023, 15:08:53 »
Thanks... I obviously forgot about that!

BrianDavion

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Re: Anyone ever notice this about Succession Wars era Capellan "mechs?
« Reply #15 on: 22 September 2023, 23:54:11 »
Streak SRM 2s exclusively (Though that was more than 2 decades ago, so I may be mixing it up with simply SRM 2s).

 Edit: just checked, I am in the right. SSRM2s were inferno compatible.

it was both, SRM 2s of both types where the only type that could use infernos
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Elmoth

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Re: Anyone ever notice this about Succession Wars era Capellan "mechs?
« Reply #16 on: 23 September 2023, 00:10:24 »
Main weapkn right, secondary weapon left is a fairly standard layout. I do not see this as very capellan, really. A wolverine, thunderbolt or battlemaster (to cite 3 examples from the top of my head) are also designed like that...

GRUD

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Re: Anyone ever notice this about Succession Wars era Capellan "mechs?
« Reply #17 on: 23 September 2023, 09:55:34 »
Some other examples (of the not Capellan-centric variety)
T-Bolt - LL RA, LRM15 RT (an anomaly, the SRM is in the left), 3 MLs.

The T-Bolt was first Produced by House Liao, so there's that.
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ErikModi

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Re: Anyone ever notice this about Succession Wars era Capellan "mechs?
« Reply #18 on: 23 September 2023, 10:16:33 »
and medium lasers are the go-to secondary weapon across the board.

This.  The TV Tropes page for BattleTech note the medium laser is, simply put, perfectly balanced.  1 ton, 1 crit, good range - damage - heat, cheap and plentiful for campaign play.  There are hardly any 'Mechs who don't have a medium laser, of some variety, somewhere in their loadout.

Minemech

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Re: Anyone ever notice this about Succession Wars era Capellan "mechs?
« Reply #19 on: 23 September 2023, 11:07:19 »
 Under older rules, that crit space was crucial.

Sigil

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Re: Anyone ever notice this about Succession Wars era Capellan "mechs?
« Reply #20 on: 24 September 2023, 03:54:24 »
Everybody knows that left-handed pilots simply swap the arms, so it's more like the *default* is the main gun in the right hand... :grin:

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Re: Anyone ever notice this about Succession Wars era Capellan "mechs?
« Reply #21 on: 25 September 2023, 18:04:54 »
CapCon may love Victor the 'Mech, but they don't love Victor the man... :cheesy:

Why not? He's gotta be in the top 5 for rulers whose reigns benefitted the Capellan Confederation. He cast the deciding vote to make Sun-Tzu the First Lord and then gave him Tikonov! Just straight handed it over.


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Minemech

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Re: Anyone ever notice this about Succession Wars era Capellan "mechs?
« Reply #22 on: 25 September 2023, 18:41:34 »
 
Why not? He's gotta be in the top 5 for rulers whose reigns benefitted the Capellan Confederation. He cast the deciding vote to make Sun-Tzu the First Lord and then gave him Tikonov! Just straight handed it over.
They were simply awestruck by his strategic genius, his tactical prowess and political acumen, recognizing it as something that rightfully belonged at the helm of the Federated Commonwealth (Suns).

 Yeah, Victor jokes are out of vogue, but at my most polemical I would not wish another Victor on the Suns. Then to be followed by Harrison and Caleb, ouch.