BattleTech - The Board Game of Armored Combat
BattleTech Player Boards => Fan Articles => Topic started by: Moonsword on 24 June 2011, 11:49:21
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CLARKSON: I went on the Internet this week and I found this...
MODS: >:/!
CLARKSON: ...what are you on about? I can't post that here?
MODS: [legal]
CLARKSON: Fine, fine, I also found this...
Mech of the Week Top Gear: Turkina
At some point, it dawned on the Jade Falcons that they had no native assault OmniMechs. Sure, they had some Dire Wolves, some Kingfishers, even some Warhawks that they had scraped off the battlefield with a spatula and put back together with crazy glue and duct tape, but nothing that was really theirs. Nothing that the Khan could strap into and be proud to be a Jade Falcon, a clearly superior warrior of a clearly superior Clan. Besides, have you ever tried to get smoke jaguar or ghost bear stink out of leather 'Mech interiors? It's a real pain. Clearly something had to be done. Around about the time of Tukayyid, something certainly was when the Turkina marched to war for its first battle honors, just in time to be thrown into a grinder cranked by flying monkeys in white robes. That was probably good timing since this is the same point when the Lyran love of assault 'Mechs was changing from a tactical preference into the sort of parody Johnathan Swift was known for. Just to make things worse, most of them either come with at least one Gauss rifle or have one in the optional accessories package. For a while, the Falcons held it close to the vest, but combat losses and trade saw it spread out a bit. Exactly who the Jaguars had to kill to get a few is unclear. We also don't know who Marthe threw a chair at when she found out the Nova Cats' false visions of their peaceful, happy, fun-loving future in the Inner Sphere apparently included driving her new favorite assault 'Mech after the Star League took them away from those same Jaguars. Since then, a few Coyotes have been spotted driving them around, some Cloud Cobra cloisters have apparently adopted a few as mobile pulpits to creeds involving heavy metal and the sort of firepower sufficient to conquer small countries and the Fire Mandrills have found some fondness for something that doesn't knuckle-walk. There was some complaining about the Turkinas built by Olivetti Weapons on Sudeten not measuring up to the standards of Ironhold's Complex Beta but as far as our extensive scientific testing (okay, randomly faffing around with one of the Sudeten-built 'Mechs) could determine, there's no real practical difference. Apparently, it's just the Falcon trueborns being stuck-up. Visually, though, it's certainly imposing. Just take a look at the different models available (http://www.masterunitlist.info/Unit/3332). Or these beauty shots (http://camospecs.com/MiniList.asp?Action=Detail&ID=88) from CamoSpecs (http://camospecs.com/MiniList.asp?Action=Detail&ID=548).
This isn't some undersized yapping terrier of an assault 'Mech. Though it's still a tad more svelte than a Dire Wolf, the Turkina weighs in at an impressive 95 tons. With a zero to sixty time of exactly never unless you drop it from a sufficient height, this one won't be setting any speed records with only a 285-rated extralight engine, topping out at 52 kph in a level straightaway. Just to keep things interesting, the Falcons also invested six tons in fixed jump jets, a decision that had some logistical benefits from reports and is similar to their thinking with the Night Gyr. Today, some people rag on them a bit for that one with the hip new thing being these fancy improved jump jets, but back in the day, kids, that wasn't a factor, although it does get in the way of your podspace a bit. Also attached to the engine are no less than 15 freezers, keeping you nice and chilly and also occupying a third of the available space in each side torso. As useful as they are, flexibility might have been better served with four more tons of pod space that you could put freezers in. Wrapped around this shell is 18 tons of standard composite plate. The rear will stop hits equivalent to a class 10 autocannon but the real joy is, as ever, on the front. Everywhere passes the double Gauss test a lot of people prefer for assaults, the center will actually stop three of them without penetration, and the legs can withstand a Demolisher's fury. All of this leaves a lot of space in the arms open even though the crits are a bit tight and 42 tons for weapons and equipment. That's... not great compared to the Dire Wolf's 50.5 tons of pod space but what defines an OmniMech in practice isn't just the pod space but how it's used. On that count, the Turkina scores very, very well.
The Prime configuration gets things going in fine style. A pair of heat sinks were added to help with the air conditioning. The torsos mount LRM 15s sharing a three ton magazine. The right arm has a pair of Clan particle cannons, the fun six ton ones that can each blow a cockpit off at nearly 700 meters or turn certain lights into metallic doughnuts at the same range. On the left arm are a pair class 5 LB-X autocannons fed by two tons of ammunition. They're not weapons with the best reputation in the world but they do a few things going for them here. First, the buckshot is useful for finding where the other weapons have punched armor out or inflicting a few chance hits here and there. My favorite's the gyro TAC, personally. Second, the flak capabilities make catching VTOLs, WiGEs, and aerospace units easier and turn the Fensalir into a flying target. Third, the low heat means they can basically be used any time you've got a decent shot and feel like using the ammo. That sort of thing adds up with the other weapons tearing into someone. You might want to carry two tons of cluster rounds but otherwise, this is basically a turn-key operation.
Mounting no energy weapons whatsoever and generating just enough heat to need a mere 7 freezers to cool the weapons off, the Turkina A is the most fun you'll ever have making your logistics people cry in despair. The weaponry is simple and resembles the Prime slightly. Two Gauss rifles and two LRM 20s comprise the sum total of your armament, each weapon with two tons of ammunition. After two minutes, you'd better have the enemy mostly beaten and forty seconds after that, your Gauss rifles are going to be clicking on empty bins but in that time, the enemy is going to hate you. It's basically immune to incendiary tactics, too, and in hot environments, the Turkina A only notices the sort of temperature extremes that make infantry burst into flames on contact. For some reason (James: I think you mean sanity), it's only really seen with the Falcons themselves.
The B swings to the other extreme, a pure laser boat to make an Awesome green with envy. Each arm has two large lasers - ER models in the right and pulse lasers in the left. Each side torso has an ERML. The center torso and head both feature a medium pulse laser. Alone, the large lasers don't even manage to max the total of 25 double heat sinks technicians piled onto the chassis and in the sort of move that suggests sadism, they added a targeting computer. The computer is out in the right arm with the ERLLs so it's relatively easy to eliminate but there's literally no way to fit it into the side torso.
Turkina Cs start off strong with two large pulse lasers and the mix of a Streak SRM 6, two MPLs, an LB 20-X, and an even pair each of machine guns, flamers, and A-pods makes it clear this is an urban hunter, a role reinforced with the addition of an active probe. Another two heat sinks were added to help a bit with the heat load. The arms are completely reversible and the fact that the large pulse lasers and the LB 20-X are located to the right and left respectively makes backstabbing a dubious proposition. The main problem with the Turkina C is that some technician somewhere (or possibly some Stig taking a break from authorial pursuits) thought it would be just fine and dandy to stick a load of Streak ammo in the center torso. Those of you pointing out the armor thickness might have a point if it weren't for the rest of the explosive surprises lurking across the torso locations and the fact that since it was built by proper Clan technicians, this whole ammo explosion thing we surat Spheroids have to deal with is less of a problem. So the main effect here is to guarantee that at some point, some freak hit is going to turn it from 95 tons of unobtanium armor and horrifically violent attitude problems into an unsalvageable mess. It's like driving a Pinto. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but sooner or later your Streak bin is going to go up like an alcohol-soaked pinata. Until then, though, it's got the firepower to be at least notional along longer distances and will be a terror in close range operations.
The Turkina D is a missile boat extraordinaire. No less than four of the largest advanced tactical missile launchers designed by the Coyotes were mounted, two in each arm, and a staggering ten tons of ammunition is actually running a smidge short for some purposes considering it's not quite enough for a full ton of each ammo type for all the launchers. Probably to comfort the pilot, technicians also installed an extended-range medium laser in the head and center torso mounts and two more heat sinks keep things cool when firing off all the missile racks at once. You'll have to play your ammo load like a pianist; personally, I'd opt for four tons each of high explosive and extended-range but longer ranged engagements may have different requirements.
With new weapons coming online in the Jihad, the Jade Falcons decided to mount one of them on their prized assault 'Mech. This is another one of those pure ammo specials like the A configuration but without the perverse oversinking. Like the C, though, the Turkina E is a brutal short range killer with some pretensions to long range support. The main gun is one of the Horses' massive new hyper-assault Gauss rifles but like everyone else, we just call them HAGs around the studio. They installed the very largest one in the right arm and supported it with no less than a half-dozen 6-tube Streak SRM launchers. Four tons of ammo goes to each type of weapon, even shorter on Gauss ammo in some ways considering that it's your only long range weapon, but inside a dozen hexes, the carnage that results is indescribable. Kind of like Hammond's taste in cars.
For the Star Adders, their new heavy lasers are evidently just the greatest thing ever and should be hung on anything and everything with nary a care in the world, or maybe just given to those nice Dark Caste fellows they invited in for a spot of tea and Blood Spirit bashing. The Falcons actually took a look at what the lasers are good at (godawful heavy hits), not good at (hitting things at a distance), and how they're used when they sat down to design the Turkina H. They're not the main armament. That honor goes to the Ultra/10 in each torso, fed by two tons of ammo each for a reasonable endurance. Two MPLs were added in for some accurate short-range power for those times when the Hellions decide to go zipping around and need a reminder about why lights should step lightly around assault 'Mechs. The arms mount three HMLs, two in the left and one on the right. Those of you keeping track of your tonnages at home might have noticed we're a little short here. The six tons of targeting computer should soothe your troubled soul. To top things off, they piled on another five heat sinks, able to handle an Ultra-mode alpha strike with a minor jump in heat you won't even notice thanks to the excellent air conditioning.
The last two configurations are a bit... different. Configuration "U" is part of a wave of alternate environment specialists that's emerged lately. Since a Turkina is unable to mount underwater maneuvering units thanks to the design of the jump jet assembly, the other possibility is to create the abomination called a SpaceMech. The whole concept is a bad idea most of the time for reasons I shan't go into here but as far as it goes, the Turkina is capable of getting the job done. Vacuum operations are very bad for 'Mechs given the way they tend to breach relatively quickly but the Falcons addressed the problem with HarJel installations in the torso and arms. Two liquid storage tanks were added for additional endurance on the jump jets, a very good idea indeed. For whatever reason, a mix of an ATM 9 and two LRM 15s was chosen with two tons of ammo supplied for each type of launcher. Conserving ammo on the LRMs is a very good idea considering that they and the ATMs are the only things that fire accurately past 180 meters. What else is on there? Five tons of extended-range small lasers, every bit as powerful as the Spheroid medium that's still the workhorse of our battlefield and tied into a targeting computer. During (hopefully limited) engagements in open space, the lasers will generate a lot of chances to try and tag fighters silly enough to get into range with the Turkina though the accuracy's nothing to write home about even with the lasers. 'Mech sensors and targeting packages just aren't designed for that environment. Finally, the legs mount talons which provide a hint as to what the real thinking here apparently was: engaging in short range against targets on asteroids or other vacuum facilities.
The other experimental model is a very different animal. The Turkina X uses three pieces of non-standard hardware: talons, Artemis V, and CASE II. The talons just make kicks and the infamous "Death From Above" stunt nastier, something that's rather scary to contemplate on a 95 ton 'Mech, but the Artemis V fire control system is basically a targeting computer for long- and short-range missiles while CASE II dramatically mitigates the internal damage from ammunition explosions. The two Artemis V modules are tied into LRM 20s with three tons of ammunition each, one launcher and its ammo in each arm, with CASE II to handle any ammunition explosions. The side torsos have three medium pulse lasers each and another two double heat sinks were installed. Finally, ECM was added, providing either defensive enhancements or the ability to interfere with someone's attempts to jam the advanced fire control suites. While it's more able to fight at range than some configurations, the X's real power is up close where it can bring a powerful storm of accurate fire down on someone's head.
We could just run it around the track but where's the fun in that? So instead we're taking you here to the top secret Top Gear MechWorks 83 miles north-northwest of downtown Las Vegas and to evaluate the Turkina's performance, we're turning one loose in the hands of our tame bondsman. Some say he is the forbidden love child of Natasha Kerensky and Aiden Pryde and that he only knows two things about zellbrigen, both of them wrong. All we know is, he's called the Stig.
We'd show the footage but we, er, lost it. And the Stig, well... not much of a radio show there. We do have some handy tips for you if you're planning to drive one, though! Really, you need to find an effective range and do your best with your admittedly limited speed to stay there. Several configurations are all-arounders - the Prime, the B, and the D all come to mind - that can fight competently at pretty much any range. Others really need to barrel into short range as best they can. Watch your heat load, too. Running a little hot is one thing, as is the occasional need to just hammer someone flat with all your weapons at once. Not being able to do something you need to do when you need to do it because you've been sloppy is another. Juggle your weapons carefully - a Prime probably wants to lead with the the ER PPCs at all times then mix and match the missiles and cannons while an H needs to decide on the use of the Ultras based on the targeting numbers. It's kind of an art, really.
But suppose you're not driving one of these monsters. Instead, you've got to stop a Turkina in its tracks. Well, the first step is to pay up your insurance. After that, bring lots of big, scary weapons. Most things with 'Gauss' in the name are a good start. Got some little ones to exploit any holes in the armor? Bring those too. And be prepared to be there for a bit unless you've got just a whole pile of them. The armor's pretty bleeding solid. If you're dueling, I hope you're in another assault, a big, powerful one. Otherwise, bury it in fire, preferably after getting rid of ankle biters like the Cougar and Fire Falcon that may be nipping at you so you can focus on the problem. Stealth armor and C3 may be useful to you. If it doesn't have pulse lasers, Streaks, or other things that are simply murder at short range, consider charging it to pump it full of SRMs and hope you get a few freak hits. Or if you're not feeling nice, pour on the artillery fire. Jump-mobile or not, Turkinas aren't exactly fast.
Is it easy to park?
If you can find a parking space large enough, sure. It's got external cameras, it's got good steering, it's got jump jets to get around those awkward obstacles like small buildings. And if you can't find one large enough, well, it's got two giant metal feet for stomping sedans flat. Next question.
Will it run cool?
If you don't pull the trigger, sure. Otherwise, it's obviously going to depend on the weapons you're firing... unless you're in an A configuration. Our test facility is fairly toasty sometimes but the A configuration wasn't fazed at all. The Sahara didn't even register. Death Valley? Not a thing. Surface of the moon at high noon? No problem for this 'Mech! So we decided to reach for the most extreme temperatures in a terrestrial environment in the entire system. A hot enough environment the camera drones caught on fire during descent. A place hot enough that for decades, all we had were images from the very toughest probes the Soviets could devise that melted almost immediately. Surely Venus would faze it!
Anyway, James pulled the triggers and, well, nothing much happened. The heat gauge shot higher than it ever had, sure, but didn't even cross the threshold of 'positive load'. It did a bit at full speed and certainly was noticeable while jumping but nothing too bad, really. Old-time Marauders get much worse firing their particle cannons. So yes, a Turkina A will certainly run cool.
But how does it fly?
To quote a certain movie, "That wasn't flying, that was falling with style." They don't fly.
Is it green?
It's a Jade Falcon 'Mech, isn't it? They paint everything green.
Is it practical for driving around town?
Like most every mass-produced BattleMech, it's got a fusion engine, so your mileage is good, but it's really not that fast so your commute's going to be a bit longer than usual. Having a 95 ton combat unit stomping around is a bit of wear and tear on the roads, too. On the plus side, no one's going to cut you off in traffic and the rozzers are probably going to be too scared to even think about ticketing you.
Can I afford it?
You know what they say, if you have to ask... Anyway, the answer's probably no. They aren't manufactured or even really kept in stock by the Diamond Sharks, so just ordering it out of your SharkMart catalog's not an option, let alone going down to an outlet center and driving one off the lot the way you can with a Mad Cat II. You have to go to the Falcon Occupation Zone and find one, then arrange a Trial of Possession or steal it or maybe start a small war and salvage it... really, it's a bloody pain in the backside any way you go about it. We had a devil of a time just arranging to borrow one for the show. It's a lovely ride but whatever else you want to say about the Jade Falcons, they really aren't a customer-focused vendor.
What if I have to defeat a rampaging company of UrbanMechs?
This is the scenario: Our contender, the Turkina, against a veritable horde of locusts UrbanMechs, the most noble of all BattleMechs. Their sleek lines and steady movement are complemented by the majestic power of their autocannons. Can the mightiest of Jade Falcon OmniMechs defeat not one, not two, but twelve of these titans of armored warfare?
Well, my opinion is yes, if you're not a complete duffer and therefore blunder into the Urbie's own environment like a loon. The UrbanMech has many things. It has classic lines rivaled only by the products of Industrial Automaton and the Imp. It has durability for its size. It has a reasonable punch at a decent range. It even has an incredible strength of character. What it doesn't have is speed. When you're getting rings run around you by a 'Mech more than three times the tonnage that also has a longer weapons range and superior technology, it usually doesn't end well. And one problem with the Top Gear MechWorks is that the terrain is generally fairly flat and certainly there's no cities around but our own test facilities. The home office gets testy if we shoot those up.
Testing it... well, again, we lost all the footage, but it went about how you'd expect. Slowly but surely, the Turkina's weapons picked one off at long range and then another. But if the Stig had just blundered on in there, the Urbies would have generated enough fire to make things much more interesting.
And on that bombshell, we're calling it a night.
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Four Stars on this review. ;D
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I'm reading this 3 times, one in each of their voices.
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Insta-classic [notworthy]
How the hell is one meant to add anything to a review like that?!
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I've never laughed so hard at a MotW article before...
Seriously though, I'd put the Turkey in the top 5 Clan assault omni's.
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A few notes: The Venus thing is quite correct according to the rules and current real world average Venusian temperatures. They max the external heat input automatically and the Turkina A is so ridiculously oversinked it barely even notices. I really did sim out the Urbie engagement, too. As for the location of the Top Gear MechWorks, I borrowed the direction reference from Wikipedia. A quick Google search should amuse a few of you.
Four Stars on this review. ;D
I was hoping people would enjoy it! It was a lot of fun to write. My thanks to Chanman and ItsTehPope for helping me refine it a bit.
I'm reading this 3 times, one in each of their voices.
It's really intended to be Clarkson aside from that interjection by May. The last part is in the style of his hilarious review of the Ford Fiesta (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7e7R3y-qwZ0) and I stole a few of the questions from it directly.
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Great Stuff.
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It's really intended to be Clarkson aside from that interjection by May. The last part is in the style of his hilarious review of the Ford Fiesta (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7e7R3y-qwZ0) and I stole a few of the questions from it directly.
I figured, I just enjoy the interplay and the banter of the three far more than any one of them by themselves.
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Well on the plus side, the new series starts tomorrow.
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I applaud the fact that you were able to make me reconsider some of my long-held, and vaguely negative, opinions on this 'Mech, Moonsword.
Well done.
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A fantastic review of one of my favourite mechs. Well done in both style and presentation, as well as content. I applaud you for that much.
Looking over it, I've never really had an issue with the Turkina's fixed Jump Jets. Most of its configurations get good milage out of them. A lot of them (Prime, A, B) are either designed for long-range attacks and, as such, jumping to a favourable position and sniping is a good plan. C is an urban combat confiuration where, again, jumping is useful. Besides, I really can't see how any of its confugrations could be singificantly improved by having six more tons of equipment in there. Likewise, I'm not bothered by the fixed heat sinks either; again, most of its configs benefit from them and really couldn't get much more from the weight.
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Looking over it, I've never really had an issue with the Turkina's fixed Jump Jets. Most of its configurations get good milage out of them. A lot of them (Prime, A, B) are either designed for long-range attacks and, as such, jumping to a favourable position and sniping is a good plan. C is an urban combat confiuration where, again, jumping is useful. Besides, I really can't see how any of its confugrations could be singificantly improved by having six more tons of equipment in there. Likewise, I'm not bothered by the fixed heat sinks either; again, most of its configs benefit from them and really couldn't get much more from the weight.
My position always has been "Those 6 tons help get the remaining 89 tons where it needs to be."
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Looking over it, I've never really had an issue with the Turkina's fixed Jump Jets. Most of its configurations get good milage out of them. A lot of them (Prime, A, B) are either designed for long-range attacks and, as such, jumping to a favourable position and sniping is a good plan. C is an urban combat confiuration where, again, jumping is useful. Besides, I really can't see how any of its confugrations could be singificantly improved by having six more tons of equipment in there. Likewise, I'm not bothered by the fixed heat sinks either; again, most of its configs benefit from them and really couldn't get much more from the weight.
The fixed heat sinks annoy me more on an abstract level than a practical one although the crits can be inconvenient sometimes. The only variant that doesn't use them aggressively is the A which gets some other, less frequent benefits from that as I tried to point out.
I mainly tossed the remark about the jump jets in because it's there, because people have made complaints about the Night Gyr's occasionally, and because context matters a lot on how bothered I get over some design decisions. At the time, given Falcon tendencies with jump jets and the lack of any reason other than pure flexibility, it was an interesting factional quirk without the consequences it has sometimes now. Personally, I didn't use them that often in my own testing, but occasionally, they came into play when I needed to move somewhere in tight quarters. They're handy. And given the crit packing and careful heat balance on a lot of those configurations, there's really not as much of an argument as there might be that you could do something else with the tonnage.
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I have not played one or against one, but it is a beast of a turkey.
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That's got to be the best MoTW I've read all following MoTW articles should be done like this!!
Excellent Mech even for one produced by the Turkey Clan.
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Interesting but ugly Mech. Mostly sensible configs. Good anchor for the Kitfoxes, Hellbringers, and Summoners to advance around. It being a Falcon design means its great fun to kill.
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I think the Dire Wolf still holds the top spot for Clan assualt mechs, and I think it always will, for any number of reasons. But, amoung omnis, the Turkina is the clear second in a reasonably close race.
I love the D, which it should be noted has the highest potental damage of any mech in the game. I once managed to get the jump on an Adder at short range and nearly vaporize it in a single salvo. Its a mech that likes to play at the extreems, with nice advantages at super max range where the ER rounds can play and nothing else can, and in very close where the HEs rule the world. But, against normal types of weapons, its just ok in the middle ranges, and generaly needs to focus on closing into HE range. The jets are very nice for that.
The H is one of the better H veriants, mainly because its heavy lasers are more of an after thought, but its still got the TC for them (and the UACs) anyway.
The C is a crazy in fighter. Its like the Dire Wolf S (as good a complement as you can pay an infighting clan assualt) but more well rounded, with two large pulse lasers (and when has that ever been bad) and fewer mediums (well, that's pretty much the only time, right there).
I like to play at range, so the fact that the Turk has so many great ranged fighters in the Prime, A and B has always made me apprecate it quite nicely. The B is the 'best' from a numbers stand point, since it has that TC and the LPLs, but the Prime mixes hole punching and crit seeking very well with one of the best applications of the LB-X 5 of any mech, and the A has a bit of a charm to it that I like quite nicely.
The new ones, I'm not as sure on. The E seems very solid, as does the X. And the U... it is what it is.
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Gotta be honest, I would take a Turkina over a Dire Wolf. Well, if those were my two choices, otherwise I'll grab an Executioner.
Still the Turkina is a beast. My bud's preferred ride for good reason.
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I have been a recent convert to the Turkina. I suppose I was one of those people that was "Why not just take a Dire Wolf" and it worked, pretty hard not to be content with the Dire Wolf but after playing around with the Turkina I have been convinced its just as viable and that the Jump Jets weren't a big waste as I original thought. It doesn't do "Stand and Deliver" quite as well as the Dire Wolf but then again anything less than Ortillery could be found wanting against one of them. Reluctantly (Lies) I have come to prefer the Turkina and its config's over the Dire Wolves.
It might not be as ruthless as the Dire Wolf but to think that might imply that it makes it less of an Assault Mech, 6 tons for the JJ not withstanding, is not a healthy way to play and when my games play on anything less than reasonably flat terrain, I bring my Turkina's over Dire Wolves every time.
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Although I prefer the Dire Wolf's base chassis, I think the canon configurations of the Turkina are more to my preference. Which one I chose would be decided by whether or not custom configurations were allowed.
Cheers,
LCC
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Stats aside, there's one reason why I'd pick the Turkina over the Diashi any day - personality. The Turkina has it; I can't say what it is exactly, but it has it. Maybe it's the broad toro, the more aggressively bird-like legs, the crazy gun arms or the "Falcon mech turned up to eleven" of it all, but yes, its personality, and lots of it.
The Diashi... doesn't. It's big, yes, its got lots of guns and it kills things dead, and muchkins fap off to it, but, well, it's boring.
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Since it seems no one ran the Wikipedia search and mentioned the results, I'll let you guys in on the joke: The Top Gear MechWorks is Area 51.
Stats aside, there's one reason why I'd pick the Turkina over the Diashi any day - personality. The Turkina has it; I can't say what it is exactly, but it has it. Maybe it's the broad toro, the more aggressively bird-like legs, the crazy gun arms or the "Falcon mech turned up to eleven" of it all, but yes, its personality, and lots of it.
The Diashi... doesn't. It's big, yes, its got lots of guns and it kills things dead, and muchkins fap off to it, but, well, it's boring.
I agree. I'm not sure exactly what it is other than, well, being a Falcon 'Mech, but the Turkina's definitely got some style and class going for it. I'm not really sure how, it's more a thing of attitude than pure looks. The visual design is imposing, it's big, even a little menacing with the large guns, but it's very... round. Not really to good effect in my opinion, either. It doesn't have that sheer aura of menace the Atlas projects. (The true Atlas, not that thing in your avatar that looks like a shot of Cthulhu's salad days with the R'lyeh Unmentionables.) That said, we're still clear of Jade Falcon's new medium in the same book, the RoboChicken, so I think we're doing okay.
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Always liked the Turkina myself. I never liked the artwork so I redid it for Mechwarrior 4.
EVENTUALLY, this should be in MW4, though it may be a while as Jeho's busy replacing his house after a fire.
There are multiple visibly different variants including missile heavy, direct fire heavy, and electronics (command) heavy. IF Jeho puts them all in it will be 4 or so mechs in the game, but it would be fun I think.
The Turkina is probably my favorite clan assault (pre 3085), though I did make a lot of changes in my version...
(http://img696.imageshack.us/img696/581/turkinaprimelw6.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/696/turkinaprimelw6.jpg/)
Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)
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Well, if you're going to redesign them visually (and wouldn't be as bothered by the Turkina as I am by what happened to some of the others), at least make the new design look good. That certainly meets that requirement with room to spare! That said, why are there only 11 tubes in the missile housings? They're identical but there's no combination of identical missile launchers that adds up to 11.
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I agree. I'm not sure exactly what it is other than, well, being a Falcon 'Mech, but the Turkina's definitely got some style and class going for it. I'm not really sure how, it's more a thing of attitude than pure looks. The visual design is imposing, it's big, even a little menacing with the large guns, but it's very... round. Not really to good effect in my opinion, either. It doesn't have that sheer aura of menace the Atlas projects. (The true Atlas, not that thing in your avatar that looks like a shot of Cthulhu's salad days with the R'lyeh Unmentionables.) That said, we're still clear of Jade Falcon's new medium in the same book, the RoboChicken, so I think we're doing okay.
I dunno, after a Lyran or does a tour on the Clan Front I would say that "Menacing" feeling he believes he extrudes while piloting his Atlas would disappear faster than ball of cocaine at one of Charlie Sheen parties when he starts having to fight Turkina's.
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That's got to be the best MoTW I've read all following MoTW articles should be done like this!!
Excellent Mech even for one produced by the Turkey Clan.
This +1
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You mean the Jade Turkeys actually made a decent design? :D
Edit: Also, verybad, your art suggestion reminds me of the Stalker.
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I think there's no qustion the Turk is the style assualt (of the hyper optomum assualts, anyway. The Gargoyle and Executioner are the style assualts over all, of course). The fixed jets give it something the Dire Wolf and Savage Coyote and Blood Asp and Hauptman and what ever can't match. The fact that most of the veriants are tuned for long range and run pretty well for heat makes it more of the finess mech, as opposed to the other over gunned monstrosities that many other assualt omnis run to. Dosen't make it the better mech, though, and I stand by the old king as being the objectvely more powerful, optomized slow assualt mech. There's something to be said for boring sometimes.
But I think the Turk, for that reason, gets a lot of field time. You can take it and get a mech that's able to smash all but a dozen or so of the very best top end assualts with relitive ease, and yet still feel good about it. I use the mech all the time, and I love it to death. And, in the right terrain, it will leave the ground bound Dire Wolves and Blood Asps and Savage Coyotes and Haputmen and what not begging for mercy (though its worth noting that all thouse mechs have a few pretty good jumping veriants, many of which are quite good, so its not an insurmountable advantage).
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I got to use a Turkina D on Saturday in a grinder event (pull a random mech and skills based on weight class, 4/5 for assaults, all the way down to 1/2 for lights). I racked up 4 kills with it (most on standard ammo) before I got tired of it and parked it next to a dying mech to absorb the enemy's fire and get a new mech. Now it sure helped that I usually hit with over half the missiles.
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Excellent review, but I still can't bring myself to like the Turkina. While the jump jets don't make it as slow as the Dire Wolf, it still feels too slow to me. I'll take a Warhawk any day of the week.
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While I don't doubt that that's true for you Eric, I also expect you'd take a Summoner over either. Which one can't help but think makes you a little off :D
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Excellent review, but I still can't bring myself to like the Turkina. While the jump jets don't make it as slow as the Dire Wolf, it still feels too slow to me. I'll take a Warhawk any day of the week.
Warhawk? Is that even very common amongst the Falcons? (Am I misremembering again? I thought I remembered you mentioning you were a Falcon player.)
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Warhawk? Is that even very common amongst the Falcons? (Am I misremembering again? I thought I remembered you mentioning you were a Falcon player.)
He is. It doesn't seem to be too common among them from what I know but they do have some of them.
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Warhawk? Is that even very common amongst the Falcons? (Am I misremembering again? I thought I remembered you mentioning you were a Falcon player.)
No, it isn't very common, but it is very uncommon that I use Assault 'Mechs anyway. If it doesn't move at least 5/8 then I'm usually not interested in it and that usually limits my options to Heavies and to the Gargoyle (which I have three of) for the upper end.
While I don't doubt that that's true for you Eric, I also expect you'd take a Summoner over either. Which one can't help but think makes you a little off :D
Very true. On taking the Summoner and on being a little off. :))
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Why are you not busy playing with your Thunderbolt IIC?
;D
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Why are you not busy playing with your Thunderbolt IIC?
;D
'Cause I don't have TRO: Prototypes? I'll get it when it comes out in .dtf since I prefer TROs that I'm going to actually use somewhat often in that format.
Then I'll be sure to use it and I'll buy a couple of the minis when IWM makes 'em!
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Hmm...a star containing a T-bolt IIC, Battlemaster C, an unpopular IS-built Turkina, and some other random stuff. I think we might have a surprisingly scary star here...
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What do you do if you're caught overnight in a Castle Brian being chased by baddies in a corvette (presumably Vincent class)?
And what 'Mech is the Porsche 911 of the 'Mech world? I already figured the Urbie is either a Morris Marina or Dacia Sandero.
Also, needs more pianos falling on Urbies.
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What do you do if you're caught overnight in a Castle Brian being chased by baddies in a corvette (presumably Vincent class)?
And what 'Mech is the Porsche 911 of the 'Mech world? I already figured the Urbie is either a Morris Marina or Dacia Sandero.
Also, needs more pianos falling on Urbies.
Nah, the Urbie is the Austin Allegro. I reserve my pianos for the Dasher II.
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Hmm...a star containing a T-bolt IIC, Battlemaster C, an unpopular IS-built Turkina, and some other random stuff. I think we might have a surprisingly scary star here...
Maybe a Jupiter and an Onager? The Falcons have a lot of good second-line stuff. Well, the Onager isn't exactly good, but it's probably a good fit here.
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You mean the Jade Turkeys actually made a decent design? :D
Sure. Bane 4, Battlemaster IIC, Cougar, Night Gyr, Jupiter, Locust IIC, Black Lanner, Fire Falcon (SOME versions), Summoner...
...oh, and the Turkina too. ;)
Maybe a Jupiter and an Onager? The Falcons have a lot of good second-line stuff. Well, the Onager isn't exactly good, but it's probably a good fit here.
Give it a try sometime- I was a little iffy on it at first, but if you start thinking of it as an urban warfare machine like a second-line version of the Turkina C, it really starts to shine. In open terrain, yeah, it's pretty much depantsed.
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I noticed you left the Flamberge off of that list.
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I noticed you left the Flamberge off of that list.
It wans't really intended to be a full comprehensive list... I'm still trying to get '85 into my head, so yes, I did forget it and the Onager. Apologies.
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I noticed you left the Flamberge off of that list.
Heresy!
;)
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I also noticed the Couger on the list... ::)
The Falcons do have plenty of good mechs, both from their slow phase in the late 50s and their old and new fast phases. Though like any faction with plenty of designs, they've got their share of stinkers.
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I also noticed the Couger on the list... ::)
I decided not to go there. At least he left the Hellbringer off of it. I think around here pretty much all of us know why he left the original Bane off of it.
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On a list of mechs designed by the Falcons, does the Hellbringer belong? For some reason I though the Horses designed that one.
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They did. I was making a crack about the fact that he's a fan of it.
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Heresy!
;)
[Grunts]He-Re-Tic! He-Re-Tic![/Grunts]
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At least with a Hellbringer you can pair it with a Turkina B, then when someone moans about you bringing the Turk B you can just say "Well look, I've got a bloody Hellbringer too".
(Personally I'm fond of the Hellbringer but no need to argue about the mech's virtues here ;) )
Hmm...a star containing a T-bolt IIC, Battlemaster C, an unpopular IS-built Turkina, and some other random stuff. I think we might have a surprisingly scary star here...
Toss in one of the better Royal SL mechs and a Canis 2, that's a cool off-beat Falcon star with all factional mechs.
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A Canis 2?
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Yep, milspecs fluffed it as a Jade Falcon variant. It's listed as Falcons (and Diamond Shark) on the MUL as well now. There probably aren't many of them about, it seemed to be a refit and I doubt the Falcons had many original Canises in the first place.
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To be fair, I'm a huge Cougar fan- as long as you don't treat it like a light Mech, it ends up being a pretty good ass-kicker in duels. It has limitations- it won't take a Mad Dog in a fight, and it won't win a race against a Mist Lynx. But in a duel, it's a light Mech that can dish out like a heavy. That's freaking gold, to me. Especially the D config.
But that's for another article (hint! HINT!)
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I'll put it on the list right after the Spider, then.
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To be fair, I'm a huge Cougar fan- as long as you don't treat it like a light Mech, it ends up being a pretty good ass-kicker in duels. It has limitations- it won't take a Mad Dog in a fight, and it won't win a race against a Mist Lynx. But in a duel, it's a light Mech that can dish out like a heavy. That's freaking gold, to me. Especially the D config.
But that's for another article (hint! HINT!)
So you're saying you want to get back into article writing?
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So you're saying you want to get back into article writing?
I'll be happy to cede the claim to it.
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Come on Helbie, you know you want to... :-*
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MotW was never mine anyway- I subbed in when CWD was busy, and that was it. After I got bumped out of the way on VotW, I never really wanted to do it anymore. Besides, I'd rather people with something interesting to say get to do these. Mine are pretty painful to go back and read again several years later, and despite that I'm just not sure that I'd be able to do any better these days.
This is something best left to the professionals. I won't try it at home. ;)
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Well, at least don't be a stranger. Without guys like you to forge the trail, I wouldn't be here to subject people to my hack writing.
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MotW was never mine anyway- I subbed in when CWD was busy, and that was it. After I got bumped out of the way on VotW, I never really wanted to do it anymore. Besides, I'd rather people with something interesting to say get to do these. Mine are pretty painful to go back and read again several years later, and despite that I'm just not sure that I'd be able to do any better these days.
anybody know how old CWD's doing these days? It's been years since he visited these parts.
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anybody know how old CWD's doing these days? It's been years since he visited these parts.
Last I heard he was doing pretty well actually, but that was a good year and a half ago at least. He's left Battletech in the rear-view mirror and seemed pretty content with it- not a choice I'm interested in making, but I respect it from him and wish him the best of luck in whatever he does these days. Really great person to talk to, gaming or not.
Well, at least don't be a stranger. Without guys like you to forge the trail, I wouldn't be here to subject people to my hack writing.
Hell, I still catch up on every MotW and VotW posted (fighters and such, not so much, but I only have so much time in the day). I just lurk here mostly because I don't want to overtake someone else's analysis. Most of you guys writing these do a damned good job at it, frankly, far better than I ever did.
Except Elwant, his stuff sucks. Poseur. ;)
Nah, if you guys ever need a week off and need a stand-in let me know, but otherwise I'm pretty content to sit back and enjoy reading other people's analysis- and of course, politely disagree with damned near everything they say. 8)
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Right, so in the Jade Hellbringer School of Hovercraft, slow is good. Would this have anything to do with you being the owner and operator of Jade Hellbringer Hovercraft Repair, Ltd.?
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Right, so in the Jade Hellbringer School of Hovercraft, slow is good. Would this have anything to do with you being the owner and operator of Jade Hellbringer Hovercraft Repair, Ltd.?
My lawyers have asked me not to comment on any such matters. All I can tell your loyal viewers is that RIGHT NOW, your viewers are eligible to come in for INCREDIBLE DEALS! Buy ONE 3039-vintage Pegasus hovertank, get the second HALF-OFF! And by that we mean half off the price AND half of the tank missing... yeah, I know, but if you buy TWO you'd get TWO half-tanks FREE, and you... well, MIGHT assemble it into one semi-working tank, so YEAH! COME ON DOWN- we will NOT be undersold!
*supplies are limited, first 100 buyers. Employees of JadeHellbringer Hovercraft Ltd., their families, and any Manei Domini are not eligible for this special offer. All vehicles are sold as-is, repairs do cost extra. Spokesman is a paid professional actor, camera was an old cell phone camera, the Frogurt is cursed, and there may be a badger living in my desk.
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Let this turkey be...REHEATED!
I'm playing a scenario this weekend that will feature a Turkina of some flavor or another, so logically I came here for a refresher course. Aside from the usual wealth of information, I noticed there was very little said about the Turkina U. This makes sense, given how few mechs-in-spaaaace games most people will play, to say nothing of how poorly mechs perform compared to...well, any true spacecraft.
That being said, within the limited expressions of SpaceMechs, the Turkey U is good. REAL good.
Acknowledging the fact that SpaceMechs are almost helpless in open vacuum, they come into their own as giant boarding marines, landing on the hull of a(hopefully immobile) spacecraft and threatening grievous harm to the hull. In this role, the Turkina is surprisingly optimized. First, fuel tanks give you decent endurance before your movement becomes solely the realm of calculus. Ideally your DropShip will kick you out right on top of your objective, but having insurance(and a larger threat envelope) is always a good idea. Once you've achieved rendezvous, the talons make things easier to latch on, essential if your target is moving, and making landings on stationary targets downright easy. Once on board, the Turkina becomes downright vicious. The missile racks are primarily to defend you from any counterboarding mechs(or other ground units) that venture out to repel you. Their range gives you full command over the single mapsheet that most hull fights will take place on, and their cluster-hitting nature matters far more than raw damage, triggering hull breaches that can quickly disable an enemy mech(and you have harjel to foil their attempts at the same). Once the outside is yours, it's time to turn your attention to the enemy at your feet.
Mechs aren't exactly suited to the task of rampaging through narrow passageways, so what does a giant robot pilot turned impromptu marine do to his target? The answer is deceptively simple.
Option 1: Shoot it.
Option 2: Shoot it.
Option 1 is simple. Look down and pull the trigger, with the express purpose of turning your little island in the cosmos into a rapidly expanding cloud of confetti. There's a whole lot of good news here, and the only bad news is merely bad by comparison. Good: Your guns auto-hit and all cluster weapons do max damage. Good: you can throw in a physical attack into that salvo while you're at it, even though aero combat lacks a physical phase. REALLY good: Go look at the Turkey U's record sheet. As a spoiler, I'll go ahead and tell you that a short round of addition reveals a maximum potential damage of One Hundred Thirty-Four points, ask for some paltry overheating you can easily handle. Even better: Go dig through 3057r, and take note of the things that kind of damage will threshold(120 capital armor or less). More spoilers, things that fall into that category include every DropShip, JumpShip, and Station in that book, and the bow armor of a Cameron-class battlecruiser. If you're not seeing a way to get declared a ristar in one fight, you're not Falconing Hard Enough. "Bad" news: You still have to roll locations for each gun, so even though all the damage that hits one facing gets combined into a single slug, you're still going to see that huge chunk of damage split among a handful of hit locations. Still enough to break the threshold on just about any non-WarShip unit in '57r, though. Heck, you can probably outright destroy most space stations in disturbingly short order.
Option 2 is subtly different. Instead of just shredding armor and structure, you can make what is essentially an aimed shot at a single critical hit slot that can be legally hit from the side you're standing on. Bad news: You actually have to make to-hit rolls and such this time, so max damage is not assured. Good news: There are no modifiers at all, so almost (http://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=12) any Clan pilot in existence should have no trouble getting his shots on target. After that, you just need to make the usual crit roll. Weird news: Regardless of how you roll, this attack doesn't inflict any armor damage to the target. No idea how that works, but it does make this attack useful for trying to capture a target intact. Just keep going for crew crits, and eventually you'll have spaced all the crew, but the ship/station is ready for your own use.
It looks weird at first glance, but if you analyze it closely, the Space Turkina is actually a min-maxed monster.
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Looks at the original article..... there is nothing on the Turkina Z. :'(
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Looks at the original article..... there is nothing on the Turkina Z. :'(
TLDR for that thing.
UNCLEAN! UNCLEAN! UNCLEAN!
What happens after the Turkina Z has gone away to menace another world.
(https://media.giphy.com/media/l41lS58PwG8Q4Npqo/giphy.gif)
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Looks at the original article..... there is nothing on the Turkina Z. :'(
For those that don't know, the Turkina Z is a Society modified version of the D. The ATM racks are upgraded with iATM racks, although instead of mounting them all in the arms, one goes in each arm and side torso. The ER Medium Lasers are traded for a Light TAG and a Nova CEWS. It still only has 10 tons of ammo, but the iATMs make sure each missile is put to good use.
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As a longtime Lyran fan, I've got plenty of experience fighting these things, and also a little experience using them too.
Good mech, though I really wish the Prime had a single LB-10X with some secondary weapons, a TC or extra heatsinks instead of the pair of 5s.
Worst performance I've ever seen one give was against me when I was running a Hauptmann F against a Turkina X. For some reason, the Turkey pilot decided to stay back and plink at me instead of closing the range. First off, this allowed me to get partial cover against him, and second of all I had an Angel ECM that shut down his Artemis, so I ended up having better long range firepower than he did. If he'd rushed me, he could have brought his MPLs and possibly even his talons to bear, but at long range two LRM 20s really doesn't beat an HPPC and an iHGR.
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Alpha Strike Fanboy Sez:
If you want your friends to hate you, you should bring the Turkina E (http://www.masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/3330/turkina-e) to your gaming table.
I'm not absolutely sure it has the highest Medium damage rating of any ground unit barring a grounded DropShip, but I know that it's stronger than any of the units I'VE looked at - the more expensive ones are generally there because of a lot of armor rather than raw firepower. Medium's the most important range, as it's what much of the game will be fought at - yes, two variants of the Turkina exceed 10 damage at Short range, but you MIGHT get one or two shots off at that range compared to four or more at Medium.
Sadly, while it has good durability at A9/S5 the kind of firepower it puts out will attract a LOT more attention than it can stand. For budget options there's the Prime or A for all your long range Sniper needs, but why settle for less? There's no kill like overkill! The Turk-E stretches the limits of what a ground unit can do, and for that it must be admired.
From a long distance away.
The Turk-Z is also the second most expensive (non-aerospace) unit at a whopping 89 points - with first going to the Osteon U - and dayum, is it a testament to the idea that quality IS quality, accept no substitutes.
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The Turk-Z is also the second most expensive (non-aerospace) unit at a whopping 89 points - with first going to the Osteon U - and dayum, is it a testament to the idea that quality IS quality, accept no substitutes.
The rest of this post is spot on, but I feel the need to make a correction here. The Turkina Z is the third most expensive non-Aero unit. It's the second most expensive 'Mech, to be sure, which is still a pretty nice title to claim. However, the Gulltoppr OmniMonitor A (http://www.masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/6607/gulltoppr-omnimonitor-a) weighs in as the most expensive unit that has an Alpha Strike cost on the entire MUL.
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The rest of this post is spot on, but I feel the need to make a correction here. The Turkina Z is the third most expensive non-Aero unit. It's the second most expensive 'Mech, to be sure, which is still a pretty nice title to claim. However, the Gulltoppr OmniMonitor A (http://www.masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/6607/gulltoppr-omnimonitor-a) weighs in as the most expensive unit that has an Alpha Strike cost on the entire MUL.
*clicks*
*recoils in fear* AAAAHHH!
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The rest of this post is spot on, but I feel the need to make a correction here. The Turkina Z is the third most expensive non-Aero unit. It's the second most expensive 'Mech, to be sure, which is still a pretty nice title to claim. However, the Gulltoppr OmniMonitor A (http://www.masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/6607/gulltoppr-omnimonitor-a) weighs in as the most expensive unit that has an Alpha Strike cost on the entire MUL.
Well, if they would get around to the MUSE: Ironhorse, everyone would move down a peg. ;D
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Well, if they would get around to the MUSE: Ironhorse, everyone would move down a peg. ;D
MUSE: Ironhorse?
Edit: I looked it up, yeah, wow....
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Well, it's most certainly a turkey, so it kinda fits the topic.
Still, "most expensive" isn't necessarily a testament for quality.
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Alpha Strike Fanboy Sez:
If you want your friends to hate you, you should bring the Turkina E (http://www.masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/3330/turkina-e) to your gaming table.
I was messing with a tweaked E in Mega Mek that dropped the HAG for a PPC, and a couple more SSRM 6's. After 3 days of various 1 v 1s, including marathons where the second opponent would drop after turn 3, etc, the only mech I couldn't cripple in 3 turns or less was a Dire Wolf Widowmaker.
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The Turkina Z and Osteon Prime are in an interesting competition in society forces
Turkina, mounting 4 iATM-12 and a light tag.
Pros
More manoeuvrable
Bigger launchers
Better sink array means much better sustained firepower
Cons
Less ammo. fifty shots for four launchers.
Dear Ghu, is this thing expensive
Ostion Prime
Pros
One of the toughest things in the game. Just doesn't want to die, despite looking like it should
thirteen tons of streak ammo. Not gonna run dry
Cons
Can't jump, slow
mere iATM-9 instead of -12s. Sooo weak. 8p
tends to overheat if lucky. Don't load ATM infernos unless you're willing to forgo chances to get lucky.
Both can do the long range bombardment role, the turkey better but not as long. Who is better surviving as a C3 spotter depends on the map, but unless it has woods to hide in, the Turkey will fall first.
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The Turkina Z and Osteon Prime are in an interesting competition in society forces
Turkina, mounting 4 iATM-12 and a light tag.
Pros
More manoeuvrable
Bigger launchers
Better sink array means much better sustained firepower
Cons
Less ammo. fifty shots for four launchers.
Dear Ghu, is this thing expensive
Ostion Prime
Pros
One of the toughest things in the game. Just doesn't want to die, despite looking like it should
thirteen tons of streak ammo. Not gonna run dry
Cons
Can't jump, slow
mere iATM-9 instead of -12s. Sooo weak. 8p
tends to overheat if lucky. Don't load ATM infernos unless you're willing to forgo chances to get lucky.
Both can do the long range bombardment role, the turkey better but not as long. Who is better surviving as a C3 spotter depends on the map, but unless it has woods to hide in, the Turkey will fall first.
If someone is using a unit that moves 3/5 or 3/5/3 as their spotter, their either doing something wrong or a Lyran.
On the other hand, getting the most out of that horrifically brutal iATM HE ammo does require getting to 9 hexes or less, so a bad initiative roll or two could find your big slow missile boat the recipient of 6 kicks in one turn...
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Man, even I don't roll that badly.
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Man, even I don't roll that badly.
"CHALLENGE ACCEPTED." - The Universe
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Man, even I don't roll that badly.
While the average Turk pilot doesn't have much to fear from the kicks of 6 Firemoths, every turn spent face down in the dirt is a turn you aren't making other mechs go away. That and those pilot injury checks add up.
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In that situation, I'd be more concerned that I'm facing that kind of guy who brings six Dashers to the board just in case his opponent might bring an assault mech and no pulse lasers or AE. That's a very oddly specific set of circumstances to plan for, and that's coming from the guy who will ALWAYS put the blame on the player who is defeated by the wacko strategy he didn't bring a counter for, instead of the player that brought said strategy.
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Just put the Turkina Z in a tunnel, just after a turn.... >:D
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In that situation, I'd be more concerned that I'm facing that kind of guy who brings six Dashers to the board just in case his opponent might bring an assault mech and no pulse lasers or AE. That's a very oddly specific set of circumstances to plan for, and that's coming from the guy who will ALWAYS put the blame on the player who is defeated by the wacko strategy he didn't bring a counter for, instead of the player that brought said strategy.
I think it's still on the player, for that one, because if you're A) unable to stand up in your Turkina, B) unable to wipe at least two of those smug pricks off the board the turn they run up to you, and C) unable to do anything similar in any follow up turn, you suck.
Fire Moths in that arrangement can move a maximum of six hexes and maintain that no-movement-for-you tunnel, because each one has to move in sequence, and when one moves, the only hex it can end in is its own. It takes 11 MP in the most charitable case to get back to where it started, so you only get one revolution, for a +2 modifier. A Turkina that can't paste a pair of Dashers when it's hitting on Skill + 3 + (maybe) minimum range at worst is a Turkina that deserves its humiliating fate.
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While the average Turk pilot doesn't have much to fear from the kicks of 6 Firemoths, every turn spent face down in the dirt is a turn you aren't making other mechs go away. That and those pilot injury checks add up.
Have you played against many Fire Moth H? Five or six of them will cheerfully fry any assault mech I can think of, half of the time before they get a chance to kick.
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I see someone bringing Dasher Hs, plural, and I start plunking down river maps.
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I see someone bringing Dasher Hs, plural, and I start plunking down river maps.
Or at least bringing a couple of bottles of decent wine and crackers, if we're going to have that kind of cheese supply on-hand.
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Ah, the Clan version of the light swarm advocated by whoever that Drac is I cannot remember. Use a swarm of Locust IIC 4 against something like a Rifleman IIC for giggles.
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Ah, the Clan version of the light swarm advocated by whoever that Drac is I cannot remember. Use a swarm of Locust IIC 4 against something like a Rifleman IIC for giggles.
Mercer Ravannion.
and i think he would have loved Protomechs and clan lights like the Dasher.
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Sorry for the Threadomancy, but the latest versions of the Turkey are interesting, not sure about the PAC-8's vs the LB-5's or the Streak LRM's on the T but the E is terrifying as its the physical embodiment of being a Sandblaster with its HAG-40 and 6 x Streak SRM-6s.
The M's a weird rifleman with paired LB-2 and 5s and an ER large on each arm oh..and LRM-5's for...I guess smoke?
And I realised one thing that irks me about the Prime Turkina.
That the arms are paired cannons, I think asthetically it would be better to have an ER PPC and a LB-5 in each arm, but that's just me.
Also the new art for this 'Mech is AMAZING.
(https://cfw.sarna.net/wiki/images/8/82/Turkina_RGilClan_v16.png?timestamp=20210724200232)
A vast improvement over the original (but then again its TRO3058 and anything's going to be better than a vast majority of the art in that).
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Ain't that the truth.
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Sorry for the Threadomancy, but the latest versions of the Turkey are interesting, not sure about the PAC-8's vs the LB-5's or the Streak LRM's on the T but the E is terrifying as its the physical embodiment of being a Sandblaster with its HAG-40 and 6 x Streak SRM-6s.
The M's a weird rifleman with paired LB-2 and 5s and an ER large on each arm oh..and LRM-5's for...I guess smoke?
And I realised one thing that irks me about the Prime Turkina.
That the arms are paired cannons, I think asthetically it would be better to have an ER PPC and a LB-5 in each arm, but that's just me.
Also the new art for this 'Mech is AMAZING.
(https://cfw.sarna.net/wiki/images/8/82/Turkina_RGilClan_v16.png?timestamp=20210724200232)
A vast improvement over the original (but then again its TRO3058 and anything's going to be better than a vast majority of the art in that).
Thirded. The new Turkina art is so good, i'm considering getting the Clan Star that has one and painting a Jade Falcon star mostly because it looks so good I want to have one. Absolutely smashing new art and miniature on the Turkina.
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Star Colonel Daphne Vickers of the Warden Wolves piloted a isorla Turkina after the Refusal War.
A Turkina does not need to be green. But yeah, that art work is great.
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Turkinas may be an iconic Falcon machine, but they've never been exclusive to that Clan, even as early as the Clan Invasion era. It looks like they were never shy about trading the things away, and between that and battle losses, Turkinas actually proliferated quite widely.
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Lol, considering how many were reported to be on Port Arthur . . . you can say the Davion Brigade of Guards has one. C'mon, the Feddies would get warm fuzzies from that Turkey toting ACs.
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Turkinas may be an iconic Falcon machine, but they've never been exclusive to that Clan, even as early as the Clan Invasion era. It looks like they were never shy about trading the things away, and between that and battle losses, Turkinas actually proliferated quite widely.
The mercantile of nature of the Falcons is often overlooked, especially when the Sharks/Foxes are around.
"Ahhh, a Clan Wolf welp. It is my life's goal to defeat, embarrass and crush you, to grind your clan beneath the talons of the Jade Falcon! We will sacrifice almost anything to meet this goal and finally end this rivalry that has existed for centuries! Oh hey, and do you want to buy any Chalchiuhtotolins?"
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Yeah, I have one for my Coyotes because... I can?
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Yeah, I have one for my Coyotes because... I can?
Like this one? It's a post-WoR Coyotes and the warrior has genetic ties to Jennifer Winson. The configuration is a custom one based off the D config. By using smaller racks (9s vs 12s) the lasers can go up in size. Part of the reason I went this way was I didn't have any 12-size racks in my spare parts bins, but I had 4x spare 9-racks from a pair of Baliuses (Baliusii?).
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Like this one? It's a post-WoR Coyotes and the warrior has genetic ties to Jennifer Winson. The configuration is a custom one based off the D config. By using smaller racks (9s vs 12s) the lasers can go up in size. Part of the reason I went this way was I didn't have any 12-size racks in my spare parts bins, but I had 4x spare 9-racks from a pair of Baliuses (Baliusii?).
Yes sir! I probably won't mod anything out (I'm doing a Savage Coyote B and J in "future" but after that I'm iffy) but I have one Turkina for my Delta Galaxy force. I figure it isn't super common compared to the Savage Coyote, Dire Wolf, Warhawk, and Gargoyles in the assault weight, but I'll have at least one of them! Also have a Fire Falcon, Nova Cat, Grendel, Cauldron-Born, and Black Lanner for the same reasons
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Ironhold had a production line, didn't it?
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Sorry for the Threadomancy, but the latest versions of the Turkey are interesting, not sure about the PAC-8's vs the LB-5's or the Streak LRM's on the T but the E is terrifying as its the physical embodiment of being a Sandblaster with its HAG-40 and 6 x Streak SRM-6s.
The M's a weird rifleman with paired LB-2 and 5s and an ER large on each arm oh..and LRM-5's for...I guess smoke?
And I realised one thing that irks me about the Prime Turkina.
That the arms are paired cannons, I think asthetically it would be better to have an ER PPC and a LB-5 in each arm, but that's just me.
Also the new art for this 'Mech is AMAZING.
(https://cfw.sarna.net/wiki/images/8/82/Turkina_RGilClan_v16.png?timestamp=20210724200232)
A vast improvement over the original (but then again its TRO3058 and anything's going to be better than a vast majority of the art in that).
Looks and sounds a bit like logistics hell. With the birds killing the protomech program not just dead, but Raid dead... those Prac-8's are going to be a pain to resupply and repair in the field. The HAG-40 and 6xSSRM6 machine is just asking to get the supply lines cut. And the LBX2/5 LRM5 machine... erghh...since B'tech seems to load missiles in en bloc clips (i.e. LRM5 ammo different from LRM20, despite LRMs being LRMs), has three different types of ammo to manage, with two of them being very uncommon.
Terrible logistics hurts, you can see that from days gone by right up to today. What may seem "short" can be very, very long in hostile country. The more material that has to be moved by logistics folks, and the more variety of materials, the more difficult it becomes. And, if you don't properly prepare for the logistics mess, i.e. by preventing the natives from destroying transportation infrastructure, for example, the bigger the issue. Pure ammo dependent versions are helpless without a logistic train, and some of the others require bringing ammo along that doesn't fit with a lot of other units.
Why is it that these newer designs get stranger and stranger, and don't really take into account the lessons that should have been learned during the initial invasion?
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Because Clanners rarely learn lessons, as they already believe themselves at the peak of capability? "Might makes right", and the allocation of leadership to the most aggressive fighters and not the best planners, means this is baked in.
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just because the protomech program was cancelled does not mean that technologies related to it got cancelled, like PAC's. given they proliferate on mechs well beyond the numbers that the few protomechs alone could have used, it is clear that the clans put them into general production.
and lets face it, the issues of supplying a bewildering array of ammunition types to troops in the field is one that the IS and clans solved long ago, given their very non-uniform unit compositions. it probably helps that their forces are two or three orders of magnitude smaller than real world units with similar strategic involvement.
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Even Clans who never had a protomech program use PACs, so they're obviously not difficult to come by or not being produced. And then the fact that they're omnimechs means that it's not exactly difficult to swap the PACs out for something else if there are supply chain problems.
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I really like the new Turkina art. It's still hard for me to take one over a Dire Wolf configuration with jump jets :) But then again I think Jade Falcon was building the Turkina because they had trouble getting enough Dire Wolf chassis anyway.
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That and most Clans seem to have a bias for home-built chassis. And the Falcons most likely dislike anything with "Wolf" in the name.
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Neg, we love piloting Dire Wolves and Timber Wolves taken in glorious combat!
(See also how many Banshees the Mariks use ;) )
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The Banshees used in Marik space are mostly old Star League leftovers. And the Mad Cat didn't start to gain serious popularity in the Falcon ranks until after Aiden Pryde.
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That and most Clans seem to have a bias for home-built chassis. And the Falcons most likely dislike anything with "Wolf" in the name.
The Smoke Jaguars never renamed the Dire Wolf when they were building them :)
Neg, we love piloting Dire Wolves and Timber Wolves taken in glorious combat!
(See also how many Banshees the Mariks use ;) )
So much this!
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Ironhold had a production line, didn't it?
Yep, Ironhold & Sudeten as of TRO3058U.
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Which means that it ought to be a common mech among the remaining homeworld Clans.
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Which means that it ought to be a common mech among the remaining homeworld Clans.
Except for the part where Ironhold got levelled during the Reaving wars and then abandoned as untenable, sure.
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(See also how many Banshees the Mariks use ;) )
The Banshees used in Marik space are mostly old Star League leftovers.
Very much this. Mariks deploy the best Banshee, and have one of the only post-SL variants worthy of the name. No scion of the Eagle worth their salt would ever stoop to piloting an Aweshopper.
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Please, we both know it's because the FWL doesn't have enough PPCs to perform the conversion.
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Please, we both know it's because the FWL doesn't have enough PPCs to perform the conversion.
The Free Worlds League gives Banshees double duty, some are used in place of Hunchbacks, others in place of 4F Ostsols.
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Please, we both know it's because the FWL doesn't have enough PPCs to perform the conversion.
The FWL converts their Banshees to have 2 PPCs, but doesn't have enough PPCs to convert them into an Aweshopper that has 2 PPCs? ???
I just assume it's because they have class, unlike the Steiners.
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The FWL converts their Banshees to have 2 PPCs, but doesn't have enough PPCs to convert them into an Aweshopper that has 2 PPCs? ???
Yes, exactly. Because they used up all their PPCs converting their Banshees to the 3M and now they have none left over.
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Yes, exactly. Because they used up all their PPCs converting their Banshees to the 3M and now they have none left over.
"We ran out of PPCs so now you're Awesome has LRMs."
".... Wut?"
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Yes, exactly. Because they used up all their PPCs converting their Banshees to the 3M and now they have none left over.
(http://68.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m650qwKne51r7cs8z.gif)
So...uhh...how bout them TurkeyBots?
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"We ran out of PPCs so now you're Awesome has LRMs."
".... Wut?"
That needs to be in a short story.
Now as Weirdo said...
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Never particularly liked Turkina despite having been a Jade Falcon fan (and a Nova Cat one, another Turkina user). Art being the primary issue, one that the new art does nothing to change because the base design is still a saucer with legs, and its parts don't look like modular or shared with other OmniMechs, original 16 or otherwise.
This is a bit odd as i like the original King Crab (i don't like the new one at all) and it can be seen as a saucer with legs. Perhaps the Turkina needs a King Crab-like configuration and a variant miniature to match, might change my mind about the 'Mech.
Stats-wise, it is good but doesn't really feel particularly interesting. Points for no stupid flaws. Don't care for 3/5/x speed bracket in Clan designs though, prefer more ground speed, the Dire Wolf being the sole exception on the account of being one of the original 16.
I don't mind fixed jump jets, because assault IJJs weigh far too much and aren't really a good alternative so nothing's lost there. And for a slow assault they're certainly useful, though i prefer staying on ground whenever possible. Fixed heat sinks are a bit more annoying but given that most configurations make good use of them and Clan energy weapons are powerful and plentiful, it ain't too bad. At least they aren't weirdly placed like the Dire Wolf's leg heat sink...
Overall good configurations, varied without duplication mostly. Even the odd oversinked A makes sense as a super cool-running configuration for deserts or other situations where external heat is likely a threat.
I find the new T configuration a bit dubious though, not enough PAC ammo for extra ammo options, and i don't think the loss of range is worth few extra points of damage. The Streaks are powerful but not necessarily the best use of mass here. But it ain't terrible either, just feels a bit meh compared to the Prime.
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... and its parts don't look like modular or shared with other OmniMechs, original 16 or otherwise.
but that's been a problem for most Clan Omni's post TRO: 3050.
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Never particularly liked Turkina despite having been a Jade Falcon fan (and a Nova Cat one, another Turkina user). Art being the primary issue, one that the new art does nothing to change because the base design is still a saucer with legs, and its parts don't look like modular or shared with other OmniMechs, original 16 or otherwise.
This is a bit odd as i like the original King Crab (i don't like the new one at all) and it can be seen as a saucer with legs. Perhaps the Turkina needs a King Crab-like configuration and a variant miniature to match, might change my mind about the 'Mech.
Well the Turkina A (2x Gauss, 2x LRM20) is pretty similar to the KGC-000b (2x Gauss, LRM 15, LL) and the KGC-0001 (2x Gauss, LRM15, LPL). Or were you thinking the double-20-class cannons?
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but that's been a problem for most Clan Omni's post TRO: 3050.
Yes, yes it has been and still is. Don't like that. Fortunately newer art does generally unify style so these issues aren't as glaring, but i still wish for far more "common building blocks".
Well the Turkina A (2x Gauss, 2x LRM20) is pretty similar to the KGC-000b (2x Gauss, LRM 15, LL) and the KGC-0001 (2x Gauss, LRM15, LPL). Or were you thinking the double-20-class cannons?
Double-20s would be wonderful, not exactly common combination anywhere, but double-Gausses are good*. One problem with the A is that i don't particularly like the missile launchers visually on the Turkina, they maybe one reason i don't particularly like the Turkina's design, the King Crab has flatter and cleaner looks.
And there's no Turkina A miniature.
...Turns out the original Turkina miniature has official C variant? Huh, like that better looking than Prime.
*As long as one ignores the fact that Clan ERPPCs are nearly always better. Especially here because the Turkina's heat capacity is not used up.
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Yes, yes it has been and still is. Don't like that. Fortunately newer art does generally unify style so these issues aren't as glaring, but i still wish for far more "common building blocks".
Most modular/plug&play stuff does not change complete housings . . . it is about the internal space & mounting brackets, and then they have a custom face plate at times to seal of the housing. Omni-tech being 'take the right arm off a Timber Wolf and put it on a Summoner' was not what Omni was about, rather 'take the ERPPC from the Timber Wolf's arm and the mounting bracket (pod), and install it in the Summoner's arm housing. Plug in the power & coolant universal connector/coupling, update the gyro, and go."
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Considering that OmniMechs mount equipment in pods, i think housings (ie pods) should share far more similarities than they do right now. The original 16 do that more than others, especially IWM's resculpts.
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Except that is not what the pods are . . . the pods are the universal mounting system- its like the rails hard drives and other hardware that get put into a CPU. It is not a 'pod' like you get the PPC on the end of the Marauder's arm. All the 'pod' is, is a housing that sets around the equipment or weapon's unique mounting and converts it to a standard system while taking unique ammo, coolant, and power feeds; converting those to a standardized system. It is why it takes time to put a weapon or equipment in a pod- or to remove it safely from a pod.
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And standardized pods would look identical where possible, including external housing. Mad Cat missile pods, Loki missile pod, Mad Cat and Loki arm pods that house PPCs or lasers being perfect examples. Obviously not all things can be done like that, and there must be pods that fit within a 'Mech's torso which presumably would be little more than a frame and interfaces, but many weapons are evidently externally located (no comment how BT's armor magically manifests over them...).
Why are the Turkina's missile pods not like the Mad Cat's? Other OmniMechs do use such pods, such as Loki A or H (based on IWM models), not just the Mad Cat.
Wouldn't be a visual improvement probably but would make more sense as OmniMechs are.
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Because the pods are all the stuff inside the armor shell with one surface that is variable b/c it is what seals up the opening for firing. So, really a Timber Wolf A's 3 MPLs on one side and Streaks on the other should both still be sitting in the same type boxes as the LRMs on the Prime/C & the SSRMs on the D.
Because if you take the arm off a Timber Wolf and put it on a Summoner or better yet a Nova . . . well, the armor & structure are made up of different materials and have different values.
The Timber Wolf A that looks like-
(https://th.bing.com/th/id/R.4f22e61ee676680aa51eead8e72a6ef5?rik=1iUMzAWUdTZ4yg&pid=ImgRaw&r=0&sres=1&sresct=1)
Is artistic license that does not reflect how the tech is described in rules or fiction.
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Because the pods are all the stuff inside the armor shell with one surface that is variable b/c it is what seals up the opening for firing.
This part doesn't make much sense to me, as there are weapons that obviously cannot fit certain places and locations in some 'Mechs, and there are weapons like Arrow IV that most likely need to be split across two locations, a Vulture V cannot cram an AIV in its right torso bay alone, not stats-wise, probably not physically.
And fiction/fluff actually describes OmniMechs looking radically different depending on the configuration. The Vulture C was noted as being thought a different OmniMech at first by Spheroids on the account of its torso bays being very different from Vulture Prime, per description of TRO3050 (original) (though that one implies the Gauss rifles are in torso and ammo in arms, while the record sheet has always placed the guns in arms). Incidentally TRO3050U describes the Vulture's torso bays "being practically modules themselves", implying some configurations omit or alter them radically.
Were pods purely internal, these descriptions makes no sense whatsoever.
I can grant that miniatures are effectively artistic license... but even official art does depict things different. The WoB Celestials have three pieces of art each, one for Invictus, Dominus and Infernus configurations. These all have differences that alter the outline of the 'Mech rather than fitting everything within Prime/Invictus-shape.
Then there are melee weapons, that are magically protected by armor but surely aren't fit within existing housings.
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Marketing man, marketing... It's uncouth to show up at the local game store with last edition's minis :P You can't tell who's with it and who ain't without changes to the design periodically :)
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The WoB Celestials have three pieces of art each, one for Invictus, Dominus and Infernus configurations. These all have differences that alter the outline of the 'Mech rather than fitting everything within Prime/Invictus-shape.
The Turkina was first made in RL way before that was a thing. While IWM is making multipul version of each omni when they can, this is a aesthetic argument and this usually leads no where.
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There's a Turkina C mini.
It's kind of ugly and lacking in details.
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I always thought that was a bash :(
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With regards to the Turkinas LRM launchers, I'd assume they were different ones from the Mad Cat type because the Mad Cat's are very tall launchers, perhaps with the Turkina they were trying to reduce the 'Mechs profile or something as a design?
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the turkina's launchers are also LRM 15s to the timby's 20s
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Because the pods are all the stuff inside the armor shell with one surface that is variable b/c it is what seals up the opening for firing.
That's how I remember it when I first read about it in the mid 90s. Omni technology was just a universal mounting system and weapons and equipment were designed to mount directly to it.
I always pictured something like an energized peg board that held equipment in place and delivered power while also making convenient hand holds for battle armor.
The whole omni-pod thing feels like a new, almost incorrect, interpretation because the whole point of omnis was that they were mission configurable and easy to make custom loadouts. You can't do that if you're replacing entire body segments with standardized weapon configurations, that aren't mass balanced either.
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You can't do that if you're replacing entire body segments with standardized weapon configurations, that aren't mass balanced either.
Expect part of the OmniMagic has always been that the OmniMech gyro can configure itself on the fly for this. Though as someone noted once, normal gyros have no problems with a 'Mech losing a side torso and an arm after maybe falling once...
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Expect part of the OmniMagic has always been that the OmniMech gyro can configure itself on the fly for this. Though as someone noted once, normal gyros have no problems with a 'Mech losing a side torso and an arm after maybe falling once...
The gyro isn't the problem. The problem is that one left torso has X tons of equipment and the other has Y. They wouldn't be interchangeable, thus defeating the purpose of omni tech. This just reinforces that the omni pod system has nothing to do with actual body parts and is likely just a commonly used bundle of equipment that can, theoretically, be mounted into any omnimech.
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Because the pods are all the stuff inside the armor shell with one surface that is variable b/c it is what seals up the opening for firing. So, really a Timber Wolf A's 3 MPLs on one side and Streaks on the other should both still be sitting in the same type boxes as the LRMs on the Prime/C & the SSRMs on the D.
Because if you take the arm off a Timber Wolf and put it on a Summoner or better yet a Nova . . . well, the armor & structure are made up of different materials and have different values.
The Timber Wolf A that looks like-
(https://th.bing.com/th/id/R.4f22e61ee676680aa51eead8e72a6ef5?rik=1iUMzAWUdTZ4yg&pid=ImgRaw&r=0&sres=1&sresct=1)
Is artistic license that does not reflect how the tech is described in rules or fiction.
Although Lewis' OmniMech configurations are considered canon as far as I know and look similar?
(https://bg.battletech.com/wp-content/gallery/omni-images/MadCatALeft.png)
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This could be one of those cases where the different manufacturers of Clan omni weapons matter. Brand A is a square-shaped box LRM launcher (Timber Wolf), while Brand B is more of a flattened rectangle (Turkina/Mad Dog), and Brand C is a round drum shape (Summoner/Crossbow). All are still omni-pod weapons and if they were the same size all could be interchangeable, just providing different looks.
Oh and now I just had a mental image of a Timber Wolf with Summoner/Crossbow racks instead of square ones. Mad Cat turned into Mickey Mouse
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Wasn't the Bane based on the King Crab? So a bane 3 with its double ultra 20s is, what you should look for if you want double 20s. Or just take a hunchback IIC ;)
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Great review, and agreed!
In order I still think the three best Assaults are the Dire Wolf, Turkina, and Stone Rhino (for some reason no one loves the Stone Rhino).
I wonder how widely available the Turkina was outside of Jade Falcon in 3052?
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In 3052? The introduction date is 3052, so not much, I'd expect.
But MUL has Clan Invasion era availability limited to Jade Falcons, Nova Cats, and Smoke Jaguars, so that is indicative at least.
And I love the Stone Rhino. At least from the mini side. Looks good at any angle, and the mods are fun. The new sculpt fixes the only problem with the Unseen - it's in motion!
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Great review, and agreed!
In order I still think the three best Assaults are the Dire Wolf, Turkina, and Stone Rhino (for some reason no one loves the Stone Rhino).
I wonder how widely available the Turkina was outside of Jade Falcon in 3052?
The Iron Cheetah or my Blood Asp would want a word or two with you;)
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In 3052? The introduction date is 3052, so not much, I'd expect.
But MUL has Clan Invasion era availability limited to Jade Falcons, Nova Cats, and Smoke Jaguars, so that is indicative at least.
And I love the Stone Rhino. At least from the mini side. Looks good at any angle, and the mods are fun. The new sculpt fixes the only problem with the Unseen - it's in motion!
Yeah, I thought that the Nova Cat touman included them in 3052, even though I _think_ the Turkina didn't make it's first appearance until Tukayyid (which admittedly was only in May), but that may not be accurate.
Yeah, the new sculpts for the Stone Rhino are amazing! My Alpha galaxy keshik is mostly Dires, Turkinas, and Rhinos. >:D
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While we should probably share Stone Rhino stories elsewhere, I will ask - is anyone considering removing the missile packs from the KS Turkina mini? I'd love to hear how you plan to do it. Got to get more Turkina configs on the table!
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Yeah, I thought that the Nova Cat touman included them in 3052, even though I _think_ the Turkina didn't make it's first appearance until Tukayyid (which admittedly was only in May), but that may not be accurate.
I want to say you are correct. The third book of the Blood of Kerensky trilogy is the first mention of a Turkina I can remember. IIRC the pilot held his ground and eventually died. The Jade Falcon character who's perspective the passage is written from notes that they were firing relentlessly up until their mech went up.
While we should probably share Stone Rhino stories elsewhere, I will ask - is anyone considering removing the missile packs from the KS Turkina mini? I'd love to hear how you plan to do it. Got to get more Turkina configs on the table!
I had not planned on it but if I did, it would involve a Dremel, A healthy amount of sanding/filing, and some wood filler to smooth it out.
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It would be interesting to see a Turkina use the launchers of a Mad Dog placed horizontal like wings but that is bashing beyond my skill set. I for one and happy with the current look.
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But MUL has Clan Invasion era availability limited to Jade Falcons, Nova Cats, and Smoke Jaguars, so that is indicative at least.
Warden Wolves should at least have it, perhaps the Crusaders too.
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Looks and sounds a bit like logistics hell. With the birds killing the protomech program not just dead, but Raid dead... those Prac-8's are going to be a pain to resupply and repair in the field. The HAG-40 and 6xSSRM6 machine is just asking to get the supply lines cut. And the LBX2/5 LRM5 machine... erghh...since B'tech seems to load missiles in en bloc clips (i.e. LRM5 ammo different from LRM20, despite LRMs being LRMs), has three different types of ammo to manage, with two of them being very uncommon.
Terrible logistics hurts, you can see that from days gone by right up to today. What may seem "short" can be very, very long in hostile country. The more material that has to be moved by logistics folks, and the more variety of materials, the more difficult it becomes. And, if you don't properly prepare for the logistics mess, i.e. by preventing the natives from destroying transportation infrastructure, for example, the bigger the issue. Pure ammo dependent versions are helpless without a logistic train, and some of the others require bringing ammo along that doesn't fit with a lot of other units.
Why is it that these newer designs get stranger and stranger, and don't really take into account the lessons that should have been learned during the initial invasion?
I'm pretty sure the Ts are just meant to visually mimic the Primes, for people who want to play WYSIWYG. Not much reason to dig farther in that that.
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The Iron Cheetah or my Blood Asp would want a word or two with you;)
Damn straight, the Iron Cheetah is nuts...
I'm planning on taking a Turkina M out for a match soon (largely because it's cheap) and wondered if anyone had any experience with it. The firepower is obviously quite anaemic for a 95 ton clan assault mech, but it's got great range and I will be playing it in a large enough game that it will be rolling alongside a couple of Dire Wolves who can deliver the big hits.
I'm thinking it can provide AA cover and long ranged crit seeking for the star whilst still being a big, scary, difficult to kill chassis.
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the M seems designed to turn the map into a parking lot for a vehicle company. I don't specifically recall using it, but it has a lot of the things I like (batteries of small LBX weapons, ERLLs, being a Nova Cat 'Mech), so I must've used it sometime, I just have no memory of it. It's not well-armed, but I guess it can critseek (though 2 cERLLs aren't exactly something to sneeze at) from long range while hoping for a golden BB to torch ammo or a pilot. That's my .002 C-Bills, at least.
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the M seems designed to turn the map into a parking lot for a vehicle company. I don't specifically recall using it, but it has a lot of the things I like (batteries of small LBX weapons, ERLLs, being a Nova Cat 'Mech), so I must've used it sometime, I just have no memory of it. It's not well-armed, but I guess it can critseek (though 2 cERLLs aren't exactly something to sneeze at) from long range while hoping for a golden BB to torch ammo or a pilot. That's my .002 C-Bills, at least.
Or you use the . . . damn, I always get the rule name mixed up . . . whatever rule where you can call upper/lower or left/right, take a TH penalty and then sandblast away. Some opponents, blow the armor off the legs and then pelting them is sufficient while others you can put the pilot through a blender. Of course, small LBX shine more when you are working as a team and someone else already blew open holes in the armor- go for that open side torso with a IS XL or 1/3 slots are ammo . . . or a gauss rifle is present.
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Or it’s designed for anti aircraft use. Between ASF and the increasing use of VTOLs, that’s a role the Falcons need a lot more these days than they used to.
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It could also shepherd lighter 'mechs, using its range and assault status to goad enemies into trying to shred its rather thick armor--basically acting as a distraction Carnifex so that the lighter 'mechs can get into range, find a good angle, and stay un-shot as long as possible. Honestly, the Turkina M is a schoolyard bully: it does mean things to vehicles, VTOLs, and aerospace, never likes to get in a fair fight, and shouts, "Even if I don't have much firepower, I'm still a 95-ton Clan Omni, neeeeerrrd!"
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What a great article overall.
Regarding Turkina production in the Clan Homeworlds, I re-reviewed all references to Ironhold in both the War of Reaving and the WoR Supplement. While it is true that Ironhold falls under the category of Clan worlds not listed on pages 248-249 and are considered "untenable and abandoned", there's no specific mentions that Ironhold's environment or all of its production sites were damaged or destroyed.
The Turkina was produced at Complex Beta on Ironhold and, unlike other OmniMechs made on Ironhold, is not mentioned as a "discarded tool of war" on page 17 of the Supplement. The Black Lanner, Cougar, Fire Falcon, Hellbringer, and Night Gyr are all specifically named as mechs that were being "phased out" of production due to destruction of facilities or component availability. But the Turkina is specifically not mentioned despite its only production site being on Ironhold.
It is very plausible that either the Turkina is being manufactured on another planet or there's still some limited production going on at Ironhold Complex Beta.
The Society was using this facility by 3072 to make the Turkina before they were wiped out by Coyote forces in 3077. That's where we get the Turkina Z. I'd like to think that the Homeworld Clans still use the Turkina Z, as they've accepted iATM technology and even the Septicemia into their Taumans.
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The Homeworld Clans conquer the Inner Sphere in 3200 by spamming Turkina and Savage Coyote Z configurations with all iATM loadouts, possibly with liberal use of the inferno missiles :evil:
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I just got a Turkina miniature today with the Clan Heavy Battle Star force pack. Admittedly I got the force pack mainly because of the Kingfisher and Ebon Jaguar :D But the sculpt is gorgeous, a huge upgrade from the past! The front torso profile reminds me a lot of a Galaxy-class star ship from Star Trek.
"Beam me up, Jiyi!"