Author Topic: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4  (Read 221329 times)

zulf

  • Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 119
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #930 on: 04 May 2018, 22:58:01 »
right its got to be a breach of contract if you loose the thing I'm supposed to be protecting right?  lol

Random

  • Master Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 329
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #931 on: 05 May 2018, 02:23:53 »
All depends on the terms of the contract I expect.

It may be a garrison contract but are you garrisoning the whole planet or just part of it.
Is you employer the State (FWL, CC, FC.....) or are employed buy some functionary or organization in the name of the State so that they can fulfill there obligations to the state.
Under what terms did the planet change hands.

In general term I would say that in the unit has successfully fulfilled their contract up until that point (positive contract rating) then the contract ends and the unit moves on.

If the planet changed hands due to something that is outside the scope of their contract (and most mercenaries don't take part in diplomatic level talks) then I would say that it's not a breach.   

Kovax

  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 2421
  • Taking over the Universe one mapsheet at a time
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #932 on: 10 May 2018, 11:04:00 »
right its got to be a breach of contract if you loose the thing I'm supposed to be protecting right?  lol
If the thing you're protecting is destroyed or forcibly taken by the enemy, it may legally be considered due to your failure.  If it's handed over to the enemy in a larger political settlement, you protected it up until it was no longer in the possession of your employer, and you had no control over its change of ownership.  Contract no longer valid, and if successful up until that point, you can just cancel the remainder of the contract.  If the contract has been unsuccessful up to that point, then depending on the item in question and your role in defending it, you may held be partially or even fully responsible for it being handed over (your employer probably wouldn't have handed it over it you/they were winning), in which case it's a loss.

Iceweb

  • Warrant Officer
  • *
  • Posts: 769
  • Lyran Engineer
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #933 on: 10 May 2018, 19:06:46 »
If the property was turned over for political reasons and you weren't hired to fight against the people it's being turned over too, it is not inconceivable that your garrison contract is effectively bought out by the new owner. 

Like if you were hired to guard against a third party, say pirates, the new owner might be happy to keep you in place before assigning their own units. 

In this case however, maybe you didn't get the orders and are still defending the planet against the invaders who have tried to claim the planet?

Le_Petit_Lapin

  • Recruit
  • *
  • Posts: 3
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #934 on: 12 May 2018, 13:11:27 »
Is there a certain amount of posts you need to have on this forum before you can view the attachment of the first post?  ???

Just looking for the rules for reinforcements in an AtB game.

Rince Wind

  • Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 170
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #935 on: 12 May 2018, 13:14:16 »
The AtB rules are in the mekhq download anyway. /docs/atbstuff I think.

Le_Petit_Lapin

  • Recruit
  • *
  • Posts: 3
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #936 on: 12 May 2018, 13:27:25 »
The AtB rules are in the mekhq download anyway. /docs/atbstuff I think.

ah, ok, cheers!

Lazar Ghofiri

  • Recruit
  • *
  • Posts: 3
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #937 on: 27 June 2018, 18:52:19 »
So far so good with the Against the Bot campaign, but I have a few questions:

- For Cadre Duty, I get three allied mechs under my control. I've seen some people claim that you should reduce the size of your own lance to three mechs while on this mission, so you don't exceed the 6 unit cap.

Is that correct?

- I am accumulating a lot of bonus civilian units, like small APCs and flatbeds, etc. as well as a lot of cheap foot infantry from the personnel market. All these units seem weak and have very low BV values. In a tabletop game they'd be good support units.

Is there any effective way to use them within the standard ATB rules? They don't seem capable of standing alone or worth a slot in a lance, but in a BV matched game they might be ok. ATB has slot limits though.

I'm aware of the special, manually rolled rules for bonuses from having an infantry in your TO&E, but I am more wondering how to use these low value units in general games. I can't even bring them in as reinforcements, unless I put them in my TO&E and give them "fight" or "scout" orders.

I don't want to add too much micromanagement / manual rolling or house rules and I don't want to "cheat"; would it be easier for me to just sell everything that can't justify a slot in a 4 unit lance, and just focus on mechs and powerful AFVs in 3-4 unit lances?

Schugger

  • Master Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 267
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #938 on: 28 June 2018, 02:40:58 »
So far so good with the Against the Bot campaign, but I have a few questions:

- For Cadre Duty, I get three allied mechs under my control. I've seen some people claim that you should reduce the size of your own lance to three mechs while on this mission, so you don't exceed the 6 unit cap. 

Is that correct?

Yep. So you could bring only a max of three Units in the Lance for yourself.
But basically: your campaign = your rules
I personally do just add one 'Mech to my Lance on cadre duties, hire the personal, add it to my TOE and treat those MechWarriors and their 'Mechs as part of my unit. So they gain some experience and develope. You need to get attached to those guys, don't you? I delete the 'mechs and MechWarriors when the contract is over.

Quote
- I am accumulating a lot of bonus civilian units, like small APCs and flatbeds, etc. as well as a lot of cheap foot infantry from the personnel market. All these units seem weak and have very low BV values. In a tabletop game they'd be good support units.

Is there any effective way to use them within the standard ATB rules? They don't seem capable of standing alone or worth a slot in a lance, but in a BV matched game they might be ok. ATB has slot limits though.

I'm aware of the special, manually rolled rules for bonuses from having an infantry in your TO&E, but I am more wondering how to use these low value units in general games. I can't even bring them in as reinforcements, unless I put them in my TO&E and give them "fight" or "scout" orders.

I don't want to add too much micromanagement / manual rolling or house rules and I don't want to "cheat"; would it be easier for me to just sell everything that can't justify a slot in a 4 unit lance, and just focus on mechs and powerful AFVs in 3-4 unit lances?

If you have the AtB rules box checked in your MHQ campaign options one infantry platoon counts as much as a 'Mech regarding lance size limits and for your Commander's command rating when it comes to retirement/defection at the end of a contract. The AtB rules have a line that you can put your infantry on defend orders and can use them in any battle where your lance is deployed as defender, so these obviously wouldn't count against your lance size limit (and lance weight as well). To avoid much micromanagement, create a force in your TOE, add your infantry to it and when you have a defender battle just deploy them. You still have to manage their deployment in the MM lobby as they are treated as reinforcements and will enter the game very late otherwise.
I also highly recommend using a mechanized infantry unit as medevac so you can potentially rescue a killed MechWarrior.

As I stated above, your campaign=your rules. It isn't really cheating if you want to throw in some infantry to spice up your MegaMek battles. It adds to the flavour and diversity and you can really come up with some nice scenarios where you have the infantry deployed in the center map and the 'Mechs come in as a rescue, guns blazing and stuff. Besides - we all love those little buggers and there is nothing more glorious in BT as conventional infantry flatening a big stompy robot - oh yeah! ;)
"Shit!"
"What?"
"Clanners!"
"No!"
"Yep."
"Shit!"

vagabond820

  • Private
  • *
  • Posts: 37
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #939 on: 01 July 2018, 11:38:28 »
My searches have been unproductive, so its time to ask:  how much of the rules document has been automated by Ralgith and the MekHQ team?

How much of what remains requires physical intervention?

Secondary, has anyone considered making a PDF rulebook for AtB?  Something that isn't just a look at the Mechanics of the rules but also the why and how?  Cause the spreadsheet reads more like a tech document than how to play.  Especially when it comes to understanding which rules have been automated or not.

NickAragua

  • Master Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 368
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #940 on: 01 July 2018, 21:13:35 »
The main meat of it - contract and scenario generation has been implemented in MekHQ. Also, the retirement/defection system.

The house and pirate rules are not implemented, and neither are the various support rules, such as infantry or determining if a lance can reinforce.

The next revision of AtB guts the scenario generation system pretty thoroughly - I've got some prototype rules posted for feedback here (https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php?topic=61882.0), and other folks have been working on a revision of the rest of the rules.

As for writing fluff, well, the preferred approach appears to be to let the player define their own fluff, as it's difficult to procedurally generate good fluff (as shown in the recent HBS:BattleTech, e.g. Restoration lending tanks to the Directorate, and the tanks are actually assault mechs).

Battleclad

  • Warrant Officer
  • *
  • Posts: 413
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #941 on: 02 July 2018, 02:05:53 »
As for writing fluff, well, the preferred approach appears to be to let the player define their own fluff, as it's difficult to procedurally generate good fluff (as shown in the recent HBS:BattleTech, e.g. Restoration lending tanks to the Directorate, and the tanks are actually assault mechs).

That's just poor coding, the game could check for the unit type via a tag or unit type check. It simply doesn't, another step is to simply remove the mention to the exact type of unit.

vagabond820

  • Private
  • *
  • Posts: 37
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #942 on: 02 July 2018, 14:01:00 »
The main meat of it - contract and scenario generation has been implemented in MekHQ. Also, the retirement/defection system.

The house and pirate rules are not implemented, and neither are the various support rules, such as infantry or determining if a lance can reinforce.

The next revision of AtB guts the scenario generation system pretty thoroughly - I've got some prototype rules posted for feedback here (https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php?topic=61882.0), and other folks have been working on a revision of the rest of the rules.

As for writing fluff, well, the preferred approach appears to be to let the player define their own fluff, as it's difficult to procedurally generate good fluff (as shown in the recent HBS:BattleTech, e.g. Restoration lending tanks to the Directorate, and the tanks are actually assault mechs).

THANK YOU.

BairdEC

  • Master Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 239
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #943 on: 02 July 2018, 19:19:47 »
Dunno if this would be AtB or MekHQ, but would it be possible to track mobility kills on the opfor for XP purposes?

Schugger

  • Master Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 267
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #944 on: 03 July 2018, 03:57:39 »
Dunno if this would be AtB or MekHQ, but would it be possible to track mobility kills on the opfor for XP purposes?

I guess it's difficult as damage usually come from different sources before a 'Mech becomes immobile.
If the enemy ejects you get to assign the the kill manually in the post battle procedure.
"Shit!"
"What?"
"Clanners!"
"No!"
"Yep."
"Shit!"

BairdEC

  • Master Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 239
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #945 on: 03 July 2018, 09:14:58 »
That's what I have been doing, but when there are a dozen mobility kills it get hard to remember who disabled what without writing it down.

Rince Wind

  • Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 170
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #946 on: 03 July 2018, 11:45:31 »
If I get a kill like that I usually write it down. Otherwise I'd forget who killed what as well.

Schugger

  • Master Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 267
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #947 on: 04 July 2018, 06:09:32 »
I have an open excel sheet on my second monitor to write stuff like that down.
Yep, it's a bit of paperwork. I usually have to look back in the round reports to find out who did the most damage, decapacitated the legs of a 'Mech when the 'MechWarrior ejects. Really cumbersome if that MechWarrior has taken a nap (i.e. Koed) for several rounds.
For picking up enemy MechWarriors and manually assign kills I just need to copy & paste in MechHQ.
"Shit!"
"What?"
"Clanners!"
"No!"
"Yep."
"Shit!"

Lazar Ghofiri

  • Recruit
  • *
  • Posts: 3
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #948 on: 05 July 2018, 17:56:02 »
Thanks for the help earlier.

What do you do guys do with the primitive mechs that keep getting awarded from civilian rescue missions?

It seems like it's better to have a smaller, high quality unit, and that it's quite expensive to refit them. Also it seems that the game won't let you customize them that much, I can't install normal armor for example.

Should they just be sold off?

JagdFlanker

  • Recruit
  • *
  • Posts: 4
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #949 on: 05 July 2018, 18:51:13 »
Thanks for the help earlier.

What do you do guys do with the primitive mechs that keep getting awarded from civilian rescue missions?

It seems like it's better to have a smaller, high quality unit, and that it's quite expensive to refit them. Also it seems that the game won't let you customize them that much, I can't install normal armor for example.

Should they just be sold off?

you can definitely sell them for the cash, but i'v been doing full refits on them and upgrading them to the latest tech no problem so interesting you'v been having issues with that

i use them as backups for my main lance just in case i lose a mech and have to wait to salvage or buy a suitable replacement

Lazar Ghofiri

  • Recruit
  • *
  • Posts: 3
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #950 on: 05 July 2018, 18:58:31 »
you can definitely sell them for the cash, but i'v been doing full refits on them and upgrading them to the latest tech no problem so interesting you'v been having issues with that

I can refit them with an existing refit package, if one exists. Shadowhawk SHD-1r has no refit package in 3049. This refit package usually seems to turn them non-primitive.

But if I try to customize them in the Meklab built into MekHQ, customization is very limited, I can't turn them non-primitive, the base type is greyed out, and primitive mechs can't be refitted with normal armor

Schugger

  • Master Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 267
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #951 on: 06 July 2018, 01:49:47 »
I never bothered much with primitives.
If you have some spare maintainance time on an elite mechtech, it might be worth it to keep this things for a few maintainance cycles in your hangar to bump the quality up, then mothball it and wait for a good roll on the mercenary market.
If you are not deployed in contract, have an elite mechtech and A rating you get any 'Mech to F quality in three or four maintainance cycles.
For refitting you could do it in the mechlab maybe and generate a new template. Even if it works, it will take a long time, require factory and so I doubt it's worth the money compared to just increasing the value and sell it on the market with a bonus. Unless you want to keep it for story reasons ;)
"Shit!"
"What?"
"Clanners!"
"No!"
"Yep."
"Shit!"

Rince Wind

  • Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 170
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #952 on: 06 July 2018, 03:34:42 »
Is the market for selling implemented now?

Schugger

  • Master Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 267
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #953 on: 06 July 2018, 07:00:29 »
Not to my knowledge. Still got to do this manually which is a bit tedious if you want to sell lot off stuff.
"Shit!"
"What?"
"Clanners!"
"No!"
"Yep."
"Shit!"

BubbleLord

  • Recruit
  • *
  • Posts: 7
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #954 on: 07 July 2018, 15:28:10 »
So I'm aware that the Noble and Pirate playstyle rules aren't officially supported or anything within MekHQ, but has anyone been able to "ad-hoc" run one through it? I've played AtB for a long while now, but figured I'd make this account the other day specifically to ask; I'm hoping to spruce up my MekHQ experience up a bit from the more monotonous Merc group I've had running (they're just now entering the Fourth Succession War, nearly 4 years in-game down the road). Initially I had been tempted to try a Noble run (even made the art for the TO&E forces T_T) but realized there had been some issues since I couldn't get it to handle mission rolls and general generation purposes I've come to rely on MekHQ's AtB ruleset to do.

If not, then I guess it's back to the mercenary life and to hope that we could see proper implementation in the future. Hope to be more active here, too; maybe throw out an AAB or Campaign log for a new one in the future. Seems like there's a lot less of that type of thing hovering around these days.

Battleclad

  • Warrant Officer
  • *
  • Posts: 413
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #955 on: 08 July 2018, 04:27:16 »
You can kind of use the rules as is, just pick a theme. For example for a Davion noble house you'd only use Davion contracts to determine where the deploy to (and use GM generate if you don't roll any viable ones), payments and etc would remain the same. Just no retirement roles.

Schugger

  • Master Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 267
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #956 on: 09 July 2018, 06:27:51 »
I would still roll for retirement as even house unit soldiers can become unfit for service by aging, but not for defection.
"Shit!"
"What?"
"Clanners!"
"No!"
"Yep."
"Shit!"

BubbleLord

  • Recruit
  • *
  • Posts: 7
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #957 on: 09 July 2018, 11:08:14 »
Mind you I wasn't talking about a House UNIT, but rather a noble serving one of the houses :P

But I do suppose that lines up a bit with what I was considering. The generation of battles, to me, is the part that makes it sore. But that does confirm that some of my ideas might work (use a generated contract, but maybe edit it as needed) to better get everything working within MekHQ. The less paperwork the better these days @_@ probably one of the reasons I'm pretty content running my mercenaries on AtB.

Strategiusz

  • Recruit
  • *
  • Posts: 15
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #958 on: 26 August 2018, 14:34:18 »
From the .xls file, Battle sheet: "Reinforcements do not count for victory/defeat conditions."

Does it mean killing enemy reinforcements doesn't count?

Shin Ji

  • Warrant Officer
  • *
  • Posts: 408
Re: Campaign Rules: Against the Bot Thread #4
« Reply #959 on: 26 August 2018, 14:37:11 »
THat is correct.

 

Register