'Mech of the Week: LHU-* Lao Hu

[misterpants]

I really really want to like the classic Lao Hu so much more than I do, but I have lost so many to ammo explosions over the years that at this point I kind of find the lack of CASE nigh-unforgivable.

For campaigns or single matches?

[Looter]

I really really want to like the classic Lao Hu so much more than I do, but I have lost so many to ammo explosions over the years that at this point I kind of find the lack of CASE nigh-unforgivable.

I don't think you are playing them right.  I cannot recall ever losing one to an ammo explosion.   Side torso knocked out but not an ammo explosion. Not that in pick up games it would matter even if it did or didn't have CASE. Thing is dead anyway

[Iron Mongoose]

I won't lie, since I generally play only one off type games I don't often notice the lack of CASE.  But, on a mech described as one of the most popular new mechs of the CCAF and the pride and joy of their modern army, plus a mech designed by someone who's actually going to be piloting it, you'd think they'd have fit it on.  I don't quite know where they'd find the tonnage, but still, I guess a mark against the young lady.

[Empyrus]

Presumably Lao Hus were given to MechWarriors thought to be good enough not to need CASE.
Seriously a big sin in the design in my eyes. I try to cram CASE or CASE II to my custom designs nearly always, only if they have little ammo and crit packed is lack of CASE somewhat acceptable.
Personally i'd be OK trading some armor for CASE.

[Kojak]

For campaigns or single matches?

I play pretty much exclusively in campaigns, so with the Lao Hu carrying around six tons of ammo and no CASE, that ammo explosion is simply a matter of time. At which point I might as well have just taken 19 million C-bills and set it on fire.

[Looter]

To be honest the only one I have played in a campaign was the stealth model which has the distinction of having the most bitching from players with clan mech losing duals to it.  They started to go full on rule Nazi on it so I eventually changed it to a custom pillager just so they could hit it every once in a while.

I can see the standard being an issue without CASE but the master version being even more so which is one reason I think I have avoided it for the most part.  Still as a liao player I accept death for the chancellor!   :D

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

To be honest the only one I have played in a campaign was the stealth model which has the distinction of having the most bitching from players with clan mech losing duals to it.  They started to go full on rule Nazi on it so I eventually changed it to a custom pillager just so they could hit it every once in a while.

What the hell were they doing, sitting back at max range, refusing to advance?

[Caedis Animus]

I would've kept using it. If they want to rules lawyer, let them; It's their own fault for failing to prepare accordingly.

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

No kidding.  Most Clan mechs in that BV range should have no issues closing range and blowing the stuffing out of it.

[CrazyGrasshopper]

I have to admit that I like Capellan 'Mechs. As it was mentioned, they usually are quite solid designs. Not like they do not have any drawbacks, like the lack of CASE on this 'Mech, but I can't remember any ones that are completely bad ideas. (Also, I could not understand MRMs on Shen Yi.)

The -3B C3 Master would be appropriate in post-Jihad augmented lances: Lao Hu with C3 Master, Yao Lien as a spotter, 2 vees to snipe from afar (do Capellans have anything appropriate, I can't remember? GR or LGR C3 Slave vehicles, for example?), and another 2 'Mechs can dive into ECM without concerns.

P.S. I checked, they have access to Main Gauche after Jihad, but those things are a bit slow and light on punch to go through the pain of establishing a C3 network. But light on BV.

EDIT: They do have LB-10X Zhukovs, but that's not exactly what is needed.

[Looter]

No kidding.  Most Clan mechs in that BV range should have no issues closing range and blowing the stuffing out of it.

No the two fighting it were 3/5 clan assualts..  it walked backwards and their terrible clan pilots (3/4) at a run were unable to land shots.  It was amusing for me. Had a guy in a Sagittare do something similar once and his plan was to run it into a  patch of heavy woods and stop once his PPC was critted out and then complain when a longer ranged light shot him to pieces just out of range because he wouldn't move.  Last game I ever played with him.

[SD501st]

No the two fighting it were 3/5 clan assualts..  it walked backwards and their terrible clan pilots (3/4) at a run were unable to land shots.  It was amusing for me. Had a guy in a Sagittare do something similar once and his plan was to run it into a  patch of heavy woods and stop once his PPC was critted out and then complain when a longer ranged light shot him to pieces just out of range because he wouldn't move.  Last game I ever played with him.

The hell? What in the name of Kerensky were they thinking, bringing 3/5 Assaults for duel?! Did they not have any of the staple 5/8 cavalry Mechs, or at least a 4/6 assault or heavy/pocket assault available? Were these assaults Omnimechs? If so, did they at least bring a suitable configuration for fighting a fast stealth Mech with such a slowpoke?

And am I understanding this right... they were fighting your Lao Hu with BOTH of their Mechs?! The way you wrote it makes it sound like that is the case. If so, then I don't even know what to say anymore...

So many questions...  :o

[sadlerbw]

You know, I don't think I've ever actually played with or against a Lao Hu. I don't play Capellan all that often, but I do frequently use them as OpFor. I should have accidentally run into one by now, but somehow I've managed to miss it...must be the stealth armor!

Anyway, it looks like a solid design, and I'm honestly not sure I really WANT to go up against one! I'll never argue with a 20-class autocannon, and in this case it seems like the stealth armor is usable and not just on there 'because Capellan'. The C3M version seems odd. The Cappies don't use C3 all that much, so other than giving them a domestically produced Master, it doesn't seem all that great. Still, I think I'll have to work up a FedSuns vs. Confederation fight in MegaMek tonight and see how this little beastie does.

EDIT: Out of curiousity, I wondered over to the MUL, and the only Capellan Mechs with a C3 Master are this Lao Hu variant, the Sunder SD1-OB, and the Yu Huang Y-H9GC. If you add in the IS General list, you get a couple Cyclops, a couple Avatars, and a Gunslinger. There are a couple Vehicles with C3M's, but that is a pretty small list as well, with only three of them being strictly Capellan. So, I guess this would have been probably the first Xin Sheng C3M unit, which makes a little more sense as an expression of the whole 'we need to show we can do it all and make it Capellan, even if we don't really need it' mentality.

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

No the two fighting it were 3/5 clan assualts..  it walked backwards and their terrible clan pilots (3/4) at a run were unable to land shots.  It was amusing for me. Had a guy in a Sagittare do something similar once and his plan was to run it into a  patch of heavy woods and stop once his PPC was critted out and then complain when a longer ranged light shot him to pieces just out of range because he wouldn't move.  Last game I ever played with him.

They chose to fight exclusively on wide-open maps?

Seriously, someone needs to introduce those guys to the Black Hawk Prime, the Ryoken B, the Stooping Hawk F...

[Iron Mongoose]

Honestly, the right 3/5 assault should still light up a Lao Hu. You've got to really work the numbers very aggressivmore to keep TNs low, but even with half the accuracy, you've got both vastly more power and more armor, unless you pick a really appalling mech. And that's if you didn't take a TC, pulse lasers, or anything great like that.

I think the point is more that a good player will tend to beat a poor one. The Lao Hu is good, but it's hardly invincible.

[marauder648]

I like the Lao Hu, but honestly I kinda prefer the Thundererererere more.  Mainly because its a more 'straight forwards' design.  The LB-20 on the Hu is nice but its main armament seems to be its ER large and LRM allowing it to hurt at range whilst the LB-20 comes into play once you've worn the foe down, or serves as a very scary deterrent. 

With the Thunderer its just a case of Insert Mech A into Mech B's face.  Pull trigger.

But a great article and a nice long run of Cappie mechs too! :D

[CrazyGrasshopper]

I like the Lao Hu, but honestly I kinda prefer the Thundererererere more.  Mainly because its a more 'straight forwards' design.  The LB-20 on the Hu is nice but its main armament seems to be its ER large and LRM allowing it to hurt at range whilst the LB-20 comes into play once you've worn the foe down, or serves as a very scary deterrent. 

Eh... I'm tempted to fire cluster LB-20X rounds even at long range if there are decent chances of critting something. And comparing LRM medium range and LB-20X long range, I would say, they equally matter. Though, it could be better off with an ER PPC, LRM-10 and one more heat sink. And CASE, but there would not be free weight for it.

[Looter]

They chose to fight exclusively on wide-open maps?

Seriously, someone needs to introduce those guys to the Black Hawk Prime, the Ryoken B, the Stooping Hawk F...

No the lighter guys were being eaten by the other guys on the field.  And the way it averaged out the clanners needed 12's at long range which is where I  kept them until I  Headshot the omen, then the Highlander IIC tried jumping at me.  Yeah falling didn't help him but I still owned the range and eventually legged him.   Fun times.  Haven't thought of that game in a while.  The captured archangel my teammate fought that Jupiter with was pretty cool too.

Oh and the game was a 12 on 10 and the clanners fought hard and got smoked.

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

That's decidedly different.  Your first post made it sound like you were fighting one-on-one duels.

[mbear]

It occurs, while taking a break from torturing Capellan fans, that if anyone would love the 3B it would be Kurita. A C3 master computer on a fast, hard-hitting frame to be used alongside units like captured Clan gear, Black Hawk-KUs, etc.? Yes please. It feels like a wasted unit on the Capellans, who don't have a whole lot of options for building a network to go with it.

What about all the Sha Yu omnis they have? Isn't there a C3 equipped config?

And the Kuritans already have the Tai-sho and the Naginata, as well as their omni configs.

[Looter]

That's decidedly different.  Your first post made it sound like you were fighting one-on-one duels.

They were duals the omen challenged me then I shot the Highlander and he challenged me too since I had added myself to the combat and he had taken out the mad cat (I think or the mkII).

[Arkansas Warrior]

What about all the Sha Yu omnis they have? Isn't there a C3 equipped config?

And the Kuritans already have the Tai-sho and the Naginata, as well as their omni configs.

What Sha Yu omnis?

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

They were duals the omen challenged me then I shot the Highlander and he challenged me too since I had added myself to the combat and he had taken out the mad cat (I think or the mkII).

Not the same thing.  You were still on a large map with multiple units on each side, not a small map with a single mech each.

[CrazyGrasshopper]

What Sha Yu omnis?

I think. he meant Men Shen. But there are no canon C3 configurations.

As a side note, as C3 Master carrier, LHU-3B is among decent ones. It could be more nimble to reliably get out of the ECM range.

[mbear]

What Sha Yu omnis?

I think. he meant Men Shen. But there are no canon C3 configurations.

Yeah, I confused the Men Shen with the Sha Yu.

[Wrangler]

Yeah, I confused the Men Shen with the Sha Yu.

Don't worry the names kind of sound same.  Don't Men Shen it!

[sadlerbw]

Don't worry the names kind of sound same.  Don't Men Shen it!

Ooo! OOOOOOO! That was a bad one!...and I liked it.

[Luciora]

Sha, yu.

Don't worry the names kind of sound same.  Don't Men Shen it!

[UnLimiTeD]

Totally sig'd that. No, not the pun.

[Caedis Animus]

No the lighter guys were being eaten by the other guys on the field.  And the way it averaged out the clanners needed 12's at long range which is where I  kept them until I  Headshot the omen, then the Highlander IIC tried jumping at me.  Yeah falling didn't help him but I still owned the range and eventually legged him.   Fun times.  Haven't thought of that game in a while.  The captured archangel my teammate fought that Jupiter with was pretty cool too.

Oh and the game was a 12 on 10 and the clanners fought hard and got smoked.

Still, that doesn't do much for them being crappy opponents. They should've gone full munchkin tech if they were that adamant (Pulse+TC), or artillery.

Hell, bring in a few Jade Hawks or something and outbrawl the damn Lao Hu, if you are that desperate. It's not that hard, considering it's faster, stronger, and more agile, even if it lacks the headcapper capability.

Edit: Whoops, too used to mwomerc.com's censor feature.