Author Topic: VotW - Small Support Vehicles (Read 13536 times)

Daryk · « **Reply #60 on:** 09 July 2022, 16:05:48 »

Quote from: Weirdo on 09 July 2022, 15:55:10

Article restored. The next time any post even twitches in the direction of non-canon designs or rules, it will be disappeared forever. People put a lot of work into these articles, it's time everyone else learned that disrespect has consequences.

Thank you, sir! :thumbsup:

I hope newer folks will read the rules before doing anything that might trip that trigger in the future...

Liam's Ghost · « **Reply #61 on:** 09 July 2022, 16:24:07 »

I just now realized that I never said how much I enjoyed the article.

So great article, by the way.

Empyrus · « **Reply #62 on:** 09 July 2022, 16:54:37 »

Quote from: Weirdo on 09 July 2022, 15:57:41

I'm very confused. SSVs *are* integrated into the game, as are their larger cousins.

They aren't very visible. Figure most folks are barely aware they exists, of their rules, and so on. They feel like extra rules easily, not like native part of the game. Not to mention their lack of visibility in fiction.

(I didn't know of the ones in Time of War as i don't have that. And i do forget others from other books.)

SteelRaven · « **Reply #63 on:** 09 July 2022, 18:39:17 »

Because the universe is centered around Battlemechs that can take shrug off a tank round to the center mass. The demand for details on utility vehicle vs Battlemechs and other larger units is very niche. I wasn't even aware we had this many until this article and it was almost wrecked because some people can't help taking this as a opportunity to talking about how their should be a rule for everything 4 wheel vehicle, bicycle and/or pogo stick.

RifleMech · « **Reply #64 on:** 09 July 2022, 19:28:15 »

Small Support Vehicles don't have to be utility oriented though. They can be designed for combat. Their capabilities are just far more limited than that of a Combat Vehicle.

Empyrus · « **Reply #65 on:** 09 July 2022, 19:47:42 »

The Monocycle seems like a purpose-built combat unit for sure. I remember its art made my laugh (and think it cool) in TRO Irregulars but i didn't pay more attention to it.
Think i need to try it some day.

pokefan548 · « **Reply #66 on:** 10 July 2022, 11:00:46 »

Quote from: SteelRaven on 09 July 2022, 18:39:17

Because the universe is centered around Battlemechs that can take shrug off a tank round to the center mass. The demand for details on utility vehicle vs Battlemechs and other larger units is very niche. I wasn't even aware we had this many until this article and it was almost wrecked because some people can't help taking this as a opportunity to talking about how their should be a rule for everything 4 wheel vehicle, bicycle and/or pogo stick.

I mean, mechanical jump boosters are kind of like pogo sticks... though I guess those are more like 'Mech powered anti-gravity shoes: Moon Shoes.

Colt Ward · « **Reply #67 on:** 14 July 2022, 16:06:49 »

Going back to the Hoverbike (SL) . . . it is listed as having 15 shots . . . is that per Support Laser or total?

Weirdo · « **Reply #68 on:** 14 July 2022, 16:45:44 »

May want to ask in the Rules Forum to make sure, but my reading is that if the ammo is up there in the weapon stats, it's per weapon.

Either that or the Minigun Cycle (SRM) has two SRM salvos for four launchers...

pokefan548 · « **Reply #69 on:** 14 July 2022, 16:49:26 »

Quote from: Weirdo on 14 July 2022, 16:45:44

May want to ask in the Rules Forum to make sure, but my reading is that if the ammo is up there in the weapon stats, it's per weapon.

That would be the case, yeah. Small weapon ammos in Classic are weird like that.

Weirdo · « **Reply #70 on:** 14 July 2022, 16:51:01 »

Probably because all Small weapons get their first clip for free. You only pay for ammo mass if you include more on top of that.

Empyrus · « **Reply #71 on:** 14 July 2022, 17:01:06 »

Seems that some of these have... optimistic amounts of ammo, at least on tabletop scale. Probably different for the RPG?

pokefan548 · « **Reply #72 on:** 14 July 2022, 17:16:19 »

Quote from: Empyrus on 14 July 2022, 17:01:06

Seems that some of these have... optimistic amounts of ammo, at least on tabletop scale. Probably different for the RPG?

Yeah, small/medium weapons scale a bit better in the AToW (for the most part). Imagine small/medium weapons mounted on vehicles in Classic like you would on an actual Humvee or what have you; able to draw from vehicle-carried ammo reserves that would be... inconvenient for an infantryman to try and lug on long marches.

Colt Ward · « **Reply #73 on:** 14 July 2022, 23:42:31 »

. . . Hoverbike got behind a Catapult C5A . . . both Support Lasers hit . . . bam! a shot to the head.

It was pretty useful this game, no woods for the battlefield but having a cruise of 12 let it be a excellent spotter- move far enough to have a high TMM while keeping the range open.

Weirdo · « **Reply #74 on:** 15 July 2022, 09:21:36 »

Yes, good... Now strike him down, and your journey to the Support Side will be complete!

Colt Ward · « **Reply #75 on:** 15 July 2022, 09:27:41 »

We did a fight among buildings, so having that speed even just cruising let me get a LOS on mechs who were hiding from my Archer. I had left my -4M2 sheet so I had to use a -5CS . . . and one of the four LRM15s managed to hit on the spotting attempt, had ammo to burn on needing 11s.

The hoverbike got shot at by two different players, and since it lived both missed lol. One person asked 'So it is a type of Savannah Master?' I told him not quite, it makes the Savannah Master look well armored.

Daryk · « **Reply #76 on:** 15 July 2022, 09:31:15 »

Kind of a little brother to the Savannah... 8)

Weirdo · « **Reply #77 on:** 15 July 2022, 09:36:15 »

Yeah the ultra-high speed of the Hoverbike(and any other fast SSV) makes it surprisingly useful in urban combat. You need ABSOLUTE throttle discipline though, because any skid is pretty much guaranteed to kill you.

If you're willing to risk your friendship with the other players, remember that they're still full-size vehicles as far as stacking and enemy-held hex rules are concerned. Now get out there and stop traffic! >:D

Colt Ward · « **Reply #78 on:** 15 July 2022, 09:40:11 »

Oh, the backshot on the Catapult was to keep it from backing up too. The 10k game turned into a 4 person FFA with 2 returning players who saw our table at the Con, had one player start counting out walking his Mercury around my BA. Let him know that was no longer the case with BA/Inf, he could walk through them to get directly behind my Archer.

It was honestly received pretty well, laughter when I said it was armed with popguns. More laughter when I said the lasers had ammo and did 1pt of damage.

Weirdo · « **Reply #79 on:** 15 July 2022, 10:00:05 »

And if anyone complains about the ammo count for energy weapons, point out that no matter how many Mauser IICs or ER Heavy Support Lasers you cram into something, you'll never have to spend a single gram of mass on heat sinks or power amplifiers. :)

Colt Ward · « **Reply #80 on:** 15 July 2022, 10:06:36 »

One player linked the idea to Chem Lasers, but it was still amusement at the plinking eggshell running around mechs.

Weirdo · « **Reply #81 on:** 15 July 2022, 10:08:33 »

And if players are laughing then they're having fun, and the SSVs made that game a success. :thumbsup:

Gorgon · « **Reply #82 on:** 12 August 2022, 02:59:20 »

I just yesterday discovered the SSV minis from IWM and wondered if they were usable besides a stand-in for mechanized infantry. Well, now I have to wonder no more!

Thank you, Weirdo :thumbsup:

Wolf72 · « **Reply #83 on:** 16 October 2022, 20:14:06 »

apologies for the thread necro (only 2 months or so!) ...

I started reading thru this from a link in ... oh wait, Wierdo's link! in Ground combat ... 20+ minutes ago. Where the heck did the time go. Just killed my other geek related goals for the night!

anyway, that was an awesome read!

What is the best way to transport these in a SC/DS? I would imagine as cargo, it takes what 1min per ton?

Weirdo · « **Reply #84 on:** 16 October 2022, 20:34:35 »

If you really want them to roll out the moment the bay ramp touches down(and those times exist) you'll want them in actual cubicles(and before anyone asks, it's still one vee per cubicle even though they're wee), but in any situation other than that, go ahead and stick them in cargo. You can use mechs or heavier vehicles for your scouting needs right after landing, and while those are drawing ablative attention, you can unpack and send out your hoverbike and motorcycle quietly to go do some real scouting. :thumbsup:

Daryk · « **Reply #85 on:** 17 October 2022, 03:08:21 »

If they're being used as Mechanized Infantry, wouldn't a bay of that type allow immediate deployment? ???

RifleMech · « **Reply #86 on:** 17 October 2022, 03:23:05 »

Quote from: Daryk on 17 October 2022, 03:08:21

If they're being used as Mechanized Infantry, wouldn't a bay of that type allow immediate deployment? ???

Yes, but then they're operating under Infantry rules, so their vehicle stats would no longer apply. I'd be okay with small vehicles operating out of Infantry Bays but legally, those units either Infantry or vehicles. It's something I would love to see fixed, even if only as an optional advanced rule.

Weirdo · « **Reply #87 on:** 17 October 2022, 09:42:48 »

Quote from: RifleMech on 17 October 2022, 03:23:05

Yes, but then they're operating under Infantry rules, so their vehicle stats would no longer apply.

This cannot be repeated enough. Mechinf do not ever use SSVs. They use *part of mechinf*. SSVs and *part of mechinf* may be the same thing in-universe, but we're not in the universe, we're gamers playing a game, and the rules of that game require us to treat them as two different radically different things. Emphasis is on "require" - this distinction is not optional.

Welshman · « **Reply #88 on:** 17 October 2022, 11:51:27 »

Quote from: RifleMech on 17 October 2022, 03:23:05

Yes, but then they're operating under Infantry rules, so their vehicle stats would no longer apply. I'd be okay with small vehicles operating out of Infantry Bays but legally, those units either Infantry or vehicles. It's something I would love to see fixed, even if only as an optional advanced rule.

Well, I guess technically you could deploy and then disband the Mech Infantry to create a Foot Infantry and some small bees. That would be under house rules though as I'm pretty sure we never wrote rules for that.

idea weenie · « **Reply #89 on:** 17 October 2022, 11:58:26 »

Quote from: Welshman on 17 October 2022, 11:51:27

Well, I guess technically you could deploy and then disband the Mech Infantry to create a Foot Infantry and some small bees. That would be under house rules though as I'm pretty sure we never wrote rules for that.

This would only apply to VTOL or flying beast-mounted infantry though ;D