Question about Com Guards & Blake Militia formations from the old Field Manual

[theagent]

OK, so I have a question that I've always wondered about but I don't know has ever been answered.

The Com Guards & Blakist Militia were true "combined arms" units, where they actually integrated 'Mech & non-'Mech assets under a single command at the Level IV level.  They referred to them as "Divisions", but you could also say they were "Double Regiments", as a pure 'Mech/armor Level IV would have had 216 units in it (the typical regiment having 108).  FM:Comstar, p. 8.

Except...they didn't have pure 'Mech forces.  Instead, they used the Greek alphabet to reflect the relative ratio of 'Mech to non-'Mech assets in a Level IV (ibid., p. 9), with  Level IV-Alpha having the highest number (164 'Mechs [essentially a Regiment reinforced by a Battalion & maybe 2 more Companies], 4 vehicles [1 regular Lance], & 9 infantry platoons [1 standard Battalion]) & a Level IV-Omega having the least (15 'Mechs [slightly reinforced Company], 54 vehicles [essentially 1.5 Battalions], & 108 infantry platoons [4 Regiments]).  But, as you may have noticed, I omitted the ASF portion.

Now, the Com Guards & Wobbies were pretty much standardized:  39 ASF per Level IV (pretty strong ASF contingent, to be fair).  But, even though it specifically states that each ASF made up a single Level I (just like vehicles & 'Mechs), it also says they followed standard military doctrine & deployed ASF in pairs.  Granted, it's been a while since I tutored my wife in her college calculus courses -- & even longer since I took it myself -- but I'm pretty sure that elementary-level math says that a pair is TWO, meaning that to deploy your ASFs in pairs you need an even number...& 39 is not an even number.

Was this ever addressed anywhere in an errata?  I went through all 9 pages of the Errata section here & didn't see anything.  I'm assuming that it's more likely that it was supposed to be 36 ASF per Level IV (which would either allow for the Level IV to deploy them as a single Level III/36 units, or split them up into 6 Level IIs of 6 units each as needed on the battlefield), but I don't know for sure if that's true or not.

[AlphaMirage]

I could also have been a divisional error as they might have been organized at the Level V initially for 39*6 = 234 ASF per Level V (and what a whopper of a sortie that would be) and thus it ends up being an average of 39 per Level IV with only half at 38 and the others with 40. Might be down to the deployment of the individual troop transports (5 Overlords, 4 Unions, or some other mix) vs a dedicated fighter carrier like a Titan or Vengeance that might be deployed as an independent Air Group

[nckestrel]

All of the numbers are approximations, including the 39.  Note that the always have 39.
It can't just be a 36, then the total count for the Division would be only 213.  But the average is 39.

Battle of Tukayyid lists Level IVs as generally having six Level IIs of aerospace. But this is also an approximation (it doesn't list number of mixed types, so again its just given a general range). 

[Alan Grant]

I've usually just adjusted that 39 to an even number, whether up or down. Pulling 1 from a different category as desired. I agree it's weird.

I had a friend who also treated the extra 3 (beyond 36) as part of a weird hybrid Level II that leaned heavily into being a weird half VTOL, half ASF mix capable of inserting or recovering ground troops, including rescuing downed flight crews. The ASFs weren't there to fight other fighters (a separate pure ASF Level II usually came along for that), they were just pure aerial recon of LZs and ground support so that the VTOLs could do their job and get troops in and out. So they operated solo or as a defensive trio with a focus on ground strikes, strafing, spotting for fire support etc. It certainly broke with ASF doctrine but he was happy with it.

I once knew someone else who plugged the extra fighter in as a pure aerial recon platform as part of a Level II of other assets. Not intended for combat, just for spotting/recon. I think it might have even been a Boomerang spotter plane and not actually an ASF. The other assets in the Level II might have been artillery vehicles.

I had another friend who figured that 1 ASF rarely served with the Division, that it was actually assigned to a Com Guard jumpship on detached duty. As we have often seen in fluff with some jumpships that have small craft bays that can carry some small craft or ASFs.

I'm not aware of any good canon/writer explanation. It's just strange.

[Precentor Scorpio]

Regarding the aerospace fighters I had thread where I ultimately thought there were three recon fighters who would perform solo missions made the most sense.  If you with to stay with the "39" count.

Personally, I removed the aerospace assets from my combat Lvl III's and assign them to a support Lvl III (ComGuard / WOB Militia deployment) or remove them entirely when I deploy my ROM - Paramilitary force.

So for the ComGuard and WOB militia I will have 36 aerospace assets assigned to my Lvl - IV.  But they would be assigned to the 5th and 6th Lvl III of the division.  The first three Lvl III's would have between 18 and 24 mechs with vehicle and infantry support.  The 4th Lvl IV is where the bulk of the infantry would be assigned.

This way the "number of units is relatively accurate" but for cheap fiction purposes I don't have to assign infantry units to protect my aerospace units and weaken my combat unit even further.

As they say, its your unit.

(I think at one point, two aerospace units were to be assigned to every battlemech company but at some point they did away with formation and simply attached those six fighters at the battalion level.)

[phoenixalpha]

Maybe 39 is 2x6 plus unit commander = 13 x 3? So you would have 5 pairs of 2 and 1 unit of 3 with the commander?

or... 19x2  plus unit commander so you have 18 pairs of 2 plus 1 unit of 3 with the commander?

or.... the unit commander is nominally a pilot but never actually takes to combat?

[idea weenie]

6x6 formation with 3 hangar queens or new people?  Or 3 extra ASF for when a MD wants to have fun.

[Hellraiser]

39 ASF per Level IV (pretty strong ASF contingent, to be fair).  But, even though it specifically states that each ASF made up a single Level I (just like vehicles & 'Mechs), it also says they followed standard military doctrine & deployed ASF in pairs.


I'm assuming that it's more likely that it was supposed to be 36 ASF per Level IV (which would either allow for the Level IV to deploy them as a single Level III/36 units, or split them up into 6 Level IIs of 6 units each as needed on the battlefield), but I don't know for sure if that's true or not.

I love how often this question comes up, lol.

I originally assumed it had to be a typo & it was supposed to be 36 but the other 3 columns all come out to total 177 which comes to 39 remaining for ASF.
Now this could have been a typo earlier in the project & someone just adjusted the other #s but who knows.

In my own TO&E I would just add 1 to each of the other 3 columns & use 36, but, then someone of the forums pointed out that # every division will not match those perfect Greek-Alpha designations & that the #s at the Division level could be "Averages".

So Option #2 then is to think of them as something like 36 for every OTHER division & 42 for it's counterpart giving you an average of 39.

Another thing to consider is there were not supposed to be any "PURE" Level-3's.
FM:CS states that all L-3's  (Battalions) were Combined arms, but, even there we have a few Scenario Books that do show a few on some TO&Es.
So instead we should again assume that Pure L3's were just "Rare".
Also, every L3 was noted to have ASF support, so that would be a minimum of 2 ASF for every L3, since they are always at least deployed in pairs of wingmen.

Finally when it comes to L-2 formations (Demi-Companies) of 6 units, PURE was "Common" while Mixed was "Un-Common or Not-Rare".

Again, for my own personal fluffed TO&E's, I like to start out each L-3 with 4 Pure Units, 1 each from Mech, ASF, Vees, & Infantry.
Then I had the last 2 as added Pure, or Mixed units as needed.  If I went with less than those base 4 "Pure" units it was normally by Vees getting mixed w/ Infantry.

I generally like to keep the ASF grouped into Pure L2 formations, but, if you have some odd #s then pairs assigned to HQ or Recon L2's seems to be the most logical place to put them outside of Pure ASF L2.

[ThePW]

OK, so I have a question that I've always wondered about but I don't know has ever been answered.

The Com Guards & Blakist Militia were true "combined arms" units, where they actually integrated 'Mech & non-'Mech assets under a single command at the Level IV level.  They referred to them as "Divisions", but you could also say they were "Double Regiments", as a pure 'Mech/armor Level IV would have had 216 units in it (the typical regiment having 108).  FM:Comstar, p. 8.

Except...they didn't have pure 'Mech forces.  Instead, they used the Greek alphabet to reflect the relative ratio of 'Mech to non-'Mech assets in a Level IV (ibid., p. 9), with  Level IV-Alpha having the highest number (164 'Mechs [essentially a Regiment reinforced by a Battalion & maybe 2 more Companies], 4 vehicles [1 regular Lance], & 9 infantry platoons [1 standard Battalion]) & a Level IV-Omega having the least (15 'Mechs [slightly reinforced Company], 54 vehicles [essentially 1.5 Battalions], & 108 infantry platoons [4 Regiments]).  But, as you may have noticed, I omitted the ASF portion.

Now, the Com Guards & Wobbies were pretty much standardized:  39 ASF per Level IV (pretty strong ASF contingent, to be fair).  But, even though it specifically states that each ASF made up a single Level I (just like vehicles & 'Mechs), it also says they followed standard military doctrine & deployed ASF in pairs.  Granted, it's been a while since I tutored my wife in her college calculus courses -- & even longer since I took it myself -- but I'm pretty sure that elementary-level math says that a pair is TWO, meaning that to deploy your ASFs in pairs you need an even number...& 39 is not an even number.

Was this ever addressed anywhere in an errata?  I went through all 9 pages of the Errata section here & didn't see anything.  I'm assuming that it's more likely that it was supposed to be 36 ASF per Level IV (which would either allow for the Level IV to deploy them as a single Level III/36 units, or split them up into 6 Level IIs of 6 units each as needed on the battlefield), but I don't know for sure if that's true or not.

Many eons ago (at least since I retired from the Navy, over a decade ago) I came across this excel spread sheet designed to run a Merc company. In the time since it evolved into a mess only i could see fit to use. One of those aspects is a section i crafted to show me, via selection tab, of changing a WoB formation (whether it's a Level-II, Level-III or Level-IV) to reflect the % and raw numbers of Mechs, Tanks, Infantry and Aero in each potential formation. You are right about the Aero #'s NOT changing.

Now others said good opinions (from special recon triple or 'Including Hangar queens' or even elements of Command). Here's another idea: Shuttles? Smaller, non decript Aerospace units?

I doubt TPTB will dabble with this (there's not need since the Big Bad Word is not existent until they suddenly ARE, again) so I think it's the realm of GM's choice.