The really mystifying thing is of course the designation-the Atlas is 10 years old, and you comission a new mech with the same tonnage and engine but a different profile and designation? :D Well, okay I guess, you are the boss.
Seeing them use the Vlar 300 isn't really notable. The SLDF used that engine in a variety of heavy and assault designs, including the Champion, Orion, Marauder, Black Knight, Ostroc, and Ostsol. It was their 300-rated fusion plant.
As far as the Atlas II, the original Atlas was a deliberately unsophisticated design probably intended as a garrison unit or to be used in besieging fixed defenses at a time when the Houses were getting increasingly fractious. The Atlas II is aimed at introducing a design doing a different job - it's more of a midrange beatstick and makes a good crit-seeker complement to the existing Pillager - on top of a proven chassis that was already in mass production and still shares a number of key components with its parent. Take a close look at the design. The underlying chassis and engine are identical aside from the modifications to support a better cooling system and the CASE.
i find it interesting the clans never did an Atlas IIC, or even an Atlas II-C.. given the way the Clans revered it as the mech of their founder. after all, they did an Orion IIC due to the importance of the Orion to their founder's father.
i find it interesting the clans never did an Atlas IIC,They did, it was called the Kodiak :D
The Atlas II is not a very powerful mech. It is odd to have it as one of the best assault units in the SLDF. The Pillager was almost 100 years old, and there were prototypes of the Thunder Hawk and Devastator. Even the Nightstar (a prototype, too) would have eaten it alive.
It has 4 long range weapons but only one that can deal 10 points of damage. The weapons are somewhat lackluster, the twin ER Large are good weapons but not the most efficient.
Unfortunately, no Atlas has ever lived up to Kerensky's charge to build "a 'Mech as powerful as possible, as impenetrable as possible, and as ugly and foreboding as conceivable, so that fear itself will be our ally." With ranged firepower that a Star League-era Rifleman could approximate (especially when heat constraints are considered), no killer AC/20 or Gauss or PPC boomstick(s), and no augmentation (ECM, CLPS, etc.) to the standard 19 tons of armor that comes with most 100-tonners, the Atlas II continues to disappoint. Modestly effective, but hardly the ultimate mech or command unit.
Maybe someday there will be an "Atlas III" with dual Gauss, an ER PPC (or snubbie), an LRM-20, ECM, and maybe a command console variant someday. That's somewhat duplicative of the Devastator/Pillager/T-Hawk trio, but it would come close to living up to the Atlas's original billing.
Well, given the tech limitations of the time, the Atlas and Atlas II certainly fulfill two of the design requirements. Nineteen tons of Standard armor (and seventeen tons of FF) is certainly just short of the maximum possible armor you could apply to a Battlemech, and apparently set the gold standard for all subsequent 100-tonners since.
Also, they're both ugly as sin
and most Mechwarriors are gonna crap their pants if they find themselves at point blank range with one of these beasts, which makes them excellent city fighters. That "bubble of death" isn't looking so laughable when the terrain itself is preventing you from getting outside that range, eh? >:D
Well, given the tech limitations of the time, the Atlas and Atlas II certainly fulfill two of the design requirements. Nineteen tons of Standard armor (and seventeen tons of FF) is certainly just short of the maximum possible armor you could apply to a Battlemech, and apparently set the gold standard for all subsequent 100-tonners since.
I have had mixed feelings on the Atlas II. I wasn't in love with it, since it looked like mix of Vadar and Soundwave from the Transformers.
It has reasonable weapons, however you do run into the problem of better designs being used in the same time period. Pillager, being only production Gauss packing Assault Mech that could scare pants off other enemy pilots. (Wait, Mechwarriors don't wear pants...scary.) Emperor was around with two LB-X 10s and large Lasers as well.
Oh about that vadar appearance. As seen earlier on Battletech the forums...
(http://www.myrnnyx.com/mechs/20-444.jpg)
Everyone seems to hates the Atlas... and loves the Charger... #P
simple, they were trying too hard. it's big and heavy and screams "i'm coming to shoot you!" so loudly it's hard to take it seriously as a result.Maybe that was the point. While everyone is looking at the Atlas they're not looking at the lance of medium 'Mechs about to appear in their rear arc.
Maybe that was the point. While everyone is looking at the Atlas they're not looking at the lance of medium 'Mechs about to appear in their rear arc.
Everyone seems to hates the Atlas... and loves the Charger... #P
The torso... it comes off looking like an oversize windup toy robot. that's wearing a girdle.
Seriously though, I love me some Atlas as well. I don't care if it's outranged by the Pillager, Awesome, or Devastator. The first TRO I got (and the TROs were my first major exposure to the universe after the card game) was the TRO 3025 Revised, and the Atlas on the front cover was the Mech that made me go, "HOLY ____!" (Yes, even as an eight year old I knew that word). And the TRO description of it picking up and tossing light Mechs made it all the more impressive. Are there Mechs I like better? Yes. Are there Assault Mechs I like better? You betcha. But that doesn't make the Atlas not cool, and definitely a symbol of prestige. Hell, it seems like the Atlas is pretty much comes with the rank insignia as soon as you become some kind of General equivalent.
Points taken, but are you talking about the AS7-D, or the Atlas II?
cheers,
Gabe
My goodness, that's darn near quote worthy.
Points taken, but are you talking about the AS7-D, or the Atlas II?
cheers,
Gabe
Frankly, I'm not entirely sure what exactly the problem is that fans of the former would have with the latter. That it lacks the big phallic boomstick? Sheesh. ::)
By contrast, the II may not really be faster, but it can seriously start to reach out and touch enemies with more than just its limited supply of LRMs at literally twice the range of its cousin. It'll run hot doing so, yes, probably necessitating switching one ERLL out of and then back into the firing cycle on alternate turns, but that's still a capability the 7-D doesn't even have.
The problem isn't that the Atlas II compares poorly to the AS7-D, which it doesn't. It's that it compares poorly to other heavy assault 'Mechs the SLDF had access to (Devastator, Thunder Hawk, Nightstar etc.) and doesn't seem so frightening. (And it was supposed to have been a Royal-exclusive model.) I think that at the very least, it's the command 'Mech in a company made up of those monsters.
It's true that by the time a target closes to a range where the AS7-D can finally bring its AC/20 into play, the Atlas II will have worked it over with its LRMs, ERLLs and LB-10X. But that still seems like a weak work-over compared to what the aforementioned 'Mechs can do.
cheers,
Gabe
As far as I can see on short notice, the Devastator wasn't available -- the MUL places the intro date of the oldest variant into 3036, and that's the AC/10-armed 1D model. So that's one down right there.
Even if it wasn't for that, though, you're basically comparing dedicated anti-'Mech specialists (Nightstar, Thunder Hawk) to a more general-purpose machine (Atlas II) right in said specialists' area of expertise (that is, against 'Mech opposition only), so naturally enough said comparison comes pre-loaded right out of the gate. And don't try to tell me that the Gauss rifle isn't primarily a dedicated anti-'Mech weapon -- pretty much the first thing anyone on this site will have to say about it is that it can take a 'Mech's head off in a single shot from 22 hexes away, not that it can remove almost a ton of standard plate from a tank at the same distance, after all...
I suppose I meant the Pillager, but was the PLG-3Z model available to the Star League? The dual AC/20 one was...
I forgot about the Pillager 1Z model. Twin A/C 20s, pair of medium lasers, srm 4 and rear firing medium. Still respectable amount of firepower with 10 rounds of fire per gun. This must been a terror on the battlefield. You have keep it range just try not get mutilated. 9.4 mil is not that bad for something like this.
It must not been wide production, or Atlas and II won't have became favorites I would think.
The point here is that the PLG-3Z, a 'Mech with one of the most complete weapons packages in the Inner Sphere, was available to the SLDF from the tailend of the Reunification War onwards. It kind of makes even the AS7-D look redundant.
cheers,
Gabe
Well, the 3Z does sport an expensive XL engine (C-bill-wise, if the Star League had used C-bills yet, you could get two AS7-Ds for one PLG-3Z and have change for a light 'Mech left over) and I'd disagree on the "complete weapons package" -- all you've got on it is straightforward direct fire with no mission flexibility whatsoever, just point-and-shoot anti-armor stuff. So the Atlas certainly does make sense to me...if perhaps more as a 100-ton trooper to help (imposingly) fill the ranks than as any sort of "ultimate 'Mech".
i doubt it was ever intended to be an "ultimate 'mech"....more of a last-gasp attempt at ensuring the league's continued strength by having a (comparatively) cheap assault 'mech capable of winning battles through sheer brute force and durability.
Attacking places that must be defended . . .
I'm surprised the Atlas II comes off as Darth Vader or even goofy-looking.
The moment I saw it, the only thing on my mind was "Terminator comes to BattleTech". It looks so much like the T-600 with underarm Gatling gun John Connor and Marcus fought in Terminator Salvation. And pretty much any Terminator that shows up in the "future preview" openings of Terminator movies.
I still think the Terminator looking one is the Atlas III.And which atlas inspired that one ;)
I'm surprised the Atlas II comes off as Darth Vader or even goofy-looking.
The King Crab doesn't fit the command role well. It's over specialized in blowing big holes in things.Not KGC-000, but KGC-010.
The Cyclops is a great command lance Mech, it's not a good commander's Mech. Look to Brian Cameron as a great example of a Cyclops pilot in a command lance.Fluff says that:
The Royal Beemer is a good Command Mech. However the Atlas offers the additional protection the additional 15 tons grants.I agree. But honestly, I would take the Royal BattleMaster. My MWO experiences show me that having a dedicated command 'Mech can be very useful.
KGC-010- Yes, and just because it was designed to be a command make doesn't make me think it is a good one.
Cyclops- Commanders don't coordinate entire brigades. They lead. Their Operations/Comms officer does the coordinating. Again, Brian Cameron shows how a Cyclops is used to its fullest.
Inserted an update to deal with the Founder's variant.Where is that variant from?
Where is that variant from?OTP: Widowmaker Absorption
Do we have any cannon images of nicks mech the one with the guass? Did it retain the hand or was it rifle only like the highlander?
I remember reading somewhere that the Atlas II's designer was going for something halfway between the classic Atlas and the MW:AoD Atlas (which would eventually become the Atlas III).
Only AoD didn't existed when TRO: 3075 was published in 2008.
I really never rated the Atlas II - there are mechs that are faster, have the same if not similar armament (ok not the same armour) at 3/4 of the weight - Toyama for one. I just never rated it. It felt like a downgrade, swapping out the AC20 of the original Atlas or the Gauss of the 3050 Atlas for an LB10X. The Atlas II was just imho... meh. The SLDF book mentioned an Atlas II so it had to be created but they could've made it so much better.
Sure it did, released in 2005.
Atlas II was initially designed to be exactly the AoD Atlas and the MechAssault visuals were only used late in the production.
The LB-10X is one of the best guns in the game . . . I think the SRM is sort of the headscratcher when you have a critseeker like the LBX since they perform most of the same roles.
I really never rated the Atlas II - there are mechs that are faster, have the same if not similar armament (ok not the same armour) at 3/4 of the weight - Toyama for one. I just never rated it. It felt like a downgrade, swapping out the AC20 of the original Atlas or the Gauss of the 3050 Atlas for an LB10X. The Atlas II was just imho... meh. The SLDF book mentioned an Atlas II so it had to be created but they could've made it so much better.Yeah, the Atlas II doesn't produce the same level of viseral dread you get from AC/20 wrapped in a Firemoth worth of armor. On the other hand, it can affect a lot more of the battlefield, for a longer period of time. As comparing with with the AS7-K. Heat sinks.
Yeah, the Atlas II doesn't produce the same level of viseral dread you get from AC/20 wrapped in a Firemoth worth of armor. On the other hand, it can affect a lot more of the battlefield, for a longer period of time. As comparing with with the AS7-K. Heat sinks.
I really never rated the Atlas II - there are mechs that are faster, have the same if not similar armament (ok not the same armour) at 3/4 of the weight - Toyama for one. I just never rated it. It felt like a downgrade, swapping out the AC20 of the original Atlas or the Gauss of the 3050 Atlas for an LB10X. The Atlas II was just imho... meh. The SLDF book mentioned an Atlas II so it had to be created but they could've made it so much better.
Yeah, the Atlas II doesn't produce the same level of viseral dread you get from AC/20 wrapped in a Firemoth worth of armor. On the other hand, it can affect a lot more of the battlefield, for a longer period of time. As comparing with with the AS7-K. Heat sinks.
And standard SRM ammo inflicts 2 points of damage instead of 1, which might be a benefit.Yep, Ferro-Lamuar can defeat the LB-X and the SRM has a better weight-to-damage ratio.
It is just me, or is the Atlas 4 and 5 going to end up with Light Autocannons and then down to machine guns? I thought it was supposed to be scarier the later the model number, not more anemic?
The Atlas III is an ideal commanders ride though. Remeber those are streak LRMs so if you hit you are inflicting a PSR at upwards of 20 hexes. The RAC is a vehicle and Battle armor killer at PPC range with a deep ammo bin. Most importantly those shields allow you to totally cover the torso and weapons not yet in play. Short version, the mech screams “Pay attention to me! Cause I will be here a while!”
And then there is the more combat oriented HAG version... *shudders*
The Atlas III is an ideal commanders ride though. Remeber those are streak LRMs so if you hit you are inflicting a PSR at upwards of 20 hexes. The RAC is a vehicle and Battle armor killer at PPC range with a deep ammo bin. Most importantly those shields allow you to totally cover the torso and weapons not yet in play. Short version, the mech screams “Pay attention to me! Cause I will be here a while!”JPArbiter is right, the III needs a major rethink before you take one into battle.
And then there is the more combat oriented HAG version... *shudders*
Personally, I'm unimpressed. The stock Atlas II didn't really have enough heatsinks as it was. Losing three just makes things that much harder on it.
On the other hand, its a piece of standard tech while everything else that could be advanced (except the Grif's SRMs, and I LIKE regular for skirmishers) was the more advanced models- ERLLs, Gauss Rifle, ERPPCs, etc.
Yeah, though the way it's presented makes it seem more like it's a factory configuration (though the real reason behind it is because the LB10-X wasn't available in the game until the Heavy Metal expansion was released).True but they could have just swapped the LB10 for the stock 10. But even with only 11 DHS, you can maintain a pattern of 2 ER large + run, 1 ER large + LRM 20 + run, 2 ER large + run, until you can bring the target inside 6 hexes. Then switch over to AC/20, mplas, and SRM 6 until the target no longer offends you. I can see someone making the argument that this is more effective than the AS7-D-H. I probably wouldn't agree with them, but I can see the argument. Given my druthers, I'll take an AS7-RS over a stock -D, 7 times out of ten. There are some days when you know you can get in close and you just want to make very large holes in things. And until the HGR comes around, nothing tops the AC/20.
I think the S3 also has ERLL in the Arms from the Jihad era but has a 400 XL IIRC.Nope, that has Gauss, 2xPPC, LRM-15.
Nope, that has Gauss, 2xPPC, LRM-15.
You're thinking of... K2, i think.
Ah yes, that is the one. I was thinking S because its manufactured by Defiance, but uses the K in the naming which I always found odd.Apparently Defiance developed K2 from Combine's Atlas-K, rather than using their own S-series as the base.
The 3075 art is currently the final canonical word on the Atlas II's appearance. By all indication, the Atlas II is essentially a new mech that shares a lineage with the Atlas, not merely a variant of it. Same goes for the Wolverine II.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the one in TRO: Succession Wars is the original image from the first edition of TRO: 3025.The Atlas AS7-D poster above is the new art from the Kickstarter. Same weapon placement as the original illustrated by Loose for TRO: 3025 so there is no conflict in fluff text with the hip mounted LRM.
By all indication, the Atlas II is essentially a new mech that shares a lineage with the Atlas, not merely a variant of it. Same goes for the Wolverine II.
Thanks. Does the TRO: What visual differences does the 3075 fluff article on the Atlas II mention? (I'm assuming there's some canonical fluff for the Atlas II as my copy of TRO: Succession Wars (the only TRO I own) includes a piece for every entry. On a side note, TRO: Succession wars also includes a different image of the AS-7D than the one you posted. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the one in TRO: Succession Wars is the original image from the first edition of TRO: 3025.It doesn't so much describe the differences as give you a picture. The one Weirdo posted above, in fact. The description focuses on the weapons and whatnot, though there is a passing reference to "the stylistic alterations in the Battlemech's appearance".
Man, the mini for the Atlas II really has a Dracula Collar thing going on, huh.
I wonder why the Star League didn't just go the usual "Royal" route with the Atlas like they did with the Highlander, Griffin, Black Knight etc. Seems like that would be easier, more cost-effective, and timelier than producing a "new" version (i.e. the Atlas II).
What's screwy to me in terms of HBS Battletech is that apparently, according to the artbook, they were at least designing a custom appearance for the Atlas II model in-game. Of all the things to not get retroactively added, that and the alternative designs for the Shadowhawk (Beyond the Umbra) were most disappointing.
That said, I'm convinced it was a one-off custom. The Griffin 2N in the game, as well as the Highlander, are both modified from stock; The latter doesn't mount Artemis IV and the former doesn't mount a GECM suite. While I'm aware neither were in the game at inception, I'm going to choose to believe the SLDF base was housing battlemechs under refit and repair that got left missing kit in exchange for other things.
I like that idea. It would account for the inconsistencies. Maybe Castle Nautilus housed mechs undergoing in various stages of undergoing the conversion from base models to Royal variants.
I wonder why the Star League didn't just go the usual "Royal" route with the Atlas like they did with the Highlander, Griffin, Black Knight etc. Seems like that would be easier, more cost-effective, and timelier than producing a "new" version (i.e. the Atlas II).The Rifleman II agains 20 tons, so it’s not like the Atlas II is the most radical departure.
Or possibly Royal models under repair after supplies from the Hegemony were cut-off by the coup - they still had stocks of various advanced techs, but were short on electronics, etc.
How the mechs show up in HBS cannot be taken as a indicator . . . the game did not have ECM when it trotted out a Griffin 2N- otherwise it closely matched up with what we get for table top stats. Same with the Highlander IIRC, Artemis still is not a ingame feature.
How the mechs show up in HBS cannot be taken as a indicator . . . the game did not have ECM when it trotted out a Griffin 2N- otherwise it closely matched up with what we get for table top stats. Same with the Highlander IIRC, Artemis still is not a ingame feature.I guess I forgot to point out that I knew that, it's just my way of rationalizing why they were missing. It's not something I meant to portray as an objective truth, just my headcanon so that it didn't irritate me when i spent several million C-Bills to restore the ECM on my Griffin.
still want to see a zombie version ;D
It doesn't so much describe the differences as give you a picture. The one Weirdo posted above, in fact. The description focuses on the weapons and whatnot, though there is a passing reference to "the stylistic alterations in the Battlemech's appearance".
The Atlas was introduced about a decade before the coup. With the Atlas II being a year before the coup...
Honestly, my suggestion for it is actually quite simple: It was the competing prototype/design for the Atlas II.
AKA Porsche Tiger vs Henschel Tiger.
Works for me!
And, like most trial versions, several examples were constructed (there are several Atlases in the interior Nautilus Castle game cut scenes).
Hey Question.
Something isn't adding up for me & I don't see where it was mentioned above.
How/Where does the tonnage for the Command Console & AC20 come from?
By my math that is 6 tons to account for & based what I'm reading above nothing was removed.
t has been said before and is probably off topic but... the standard Atlas just projects an aura of terror that none of the others do. Maybe just maybe the "Jason with a Minigun" as described by Kotetsu, the Atlas III.The III looks horrifying, but it's only a RAC 2. The D2's HAG is similarly lacking the heavy gun I typically associate with "Atlas."
The III looks horrifying, but it's only a RAC 2. The D2's HAG is similarly lacking the heavy gun I typically associate with "Atlas."
If your looking for a brawler, the original is defiantly the better option.Kind of a shame the Atlas II never really got a 'brawler' configuration aside from the heat pig that is the HT. But when you can roll in with an Elite Lance of the things, I guess you don't need silly things like 'specialization'.
True, but the RAC-2 is for the command variant, so the shields could give more protection. Regarding the HAG... I could understand the notion of "lacking a heavy/knockdown gun" if this was a class 20 HAG, but it's a class 30 and linked to a TC to boot!All good points. I hadn't realized that a HAG 30 guaranteed a PSR if it connects under 8 hexes. Good to know. My issue is that if I'm spraying another assault mech with Streak 20 and HAG 30, I'm sanding a lot of armor off. But if he's shooting back with a pair of PPCs and a Streak 20, I'm not liking my odds. My attacks are going to wear down all of his armor, fairly evenly. His attacks are going to take bigger chunks out of fewer locations. Then the sanding action of his LRMS, and eventually medium lasers and SRMs are more likely to breach. I can use the shields to mitigate some of that but if my right torso starts looking thin, I can guard it with the right shield, but then I give up my long range weapons. I now I have to stop thinking of Atlas III as a beatstick I can throw at the other team and treat it like a strategic asset. But it's and Atlas!!! It was born to wade in and jack stuff up!
Compared to a Clan LB 20X AC, you get a massive range advantage, better accuracy across the board except for 1 hex distance, and become the nightmare of anything with tracks, wheels, hover propulsion and especially anything that dares to fly in your presence. Everything that's not a Mech will drop bricks from it's exhaust ports at the sight of that gun. For Mech targets at and under 8 hex distance, it's also a guaranteed knockdown roll just like a class 20 AC slug(and unlike the LB 20X cluster round). The HAG 30 does more damage on average than the class 20 slug, and MUCH more than the cluster round... sure we don't use a class 20 AC cluster round for the damage, but you still get on average 5/4 clusters with the HAG 30 up to 8/24 hexes. As additional bonus, it synergizes with the Streak 20 by virtue of throwing so many 5 pointers out to long range that most Mech's without Ferro-Lamellor armor will have one or multiple open locations before they even have the time to close the range.
Okay sorry, I started rambling a bit there. Point is, there are veeery few people that would complain about a HAG 30 not being a "heavy" enough gun. :))
All good points. I hadn't realized that a HAG 30 guaranteed a PSR if it connects under 8 hexes. Good to know.
I don't think the Atlas IIs were put in caches. I think they were kept in service for as long as possible because they represented the cutting edge of mech development until actual Clantech was deployed. As such, they saw the most combat, and also bore the brunt of the action when the first IICs and other Clan machines started stomping out.
Some might have been upgraded, I doubt it'd be the exact same config as Nikky the Nut. The ones that weren't (and many that were) didn't get cached - they died in battle.
Huh? If it misses with half the clusters, it still cannot cause a PSR. And it is just as likely to hit or miss with the clusters at less than 8 hexes as it is 20+ hexes afaik.
I don't think the Atlas IIs were put in caches. I think they were kept in service for as long as possible because they represented the cutting edge of mech development until actual Clantech was deployed. As such, they saw the most combat, and also bore the brunt of the action when the first IICs and other Clan machines started stomping out.
Some might have been upgraded, I doubt it'd be the exact same config as Nikky the Nut. The ones that weren't (and many that were) didn't get cached - they died in battle.
I'll note, there is actually an amusing tidbit from the old Jade Falcon Phonebook [I know, I know]
One of the Falcons, I think a Star Captain or Star Colonel is listed as having an Atlas II as a mount. I think its one of the second line units.
Huh? If it misses with half the clusters, it still cannot cause a PSR. And it is just as likely to hit or miss with the clusters at less than 8 hexes as it is 20+ hexes afaik.Right, sorry that was misleading... I should have said "on average" instead of "guaranteed". :-[
Amaris was pretty much the only enemy the SLDF didn't plan to fight. The expected enemies were pirates, Periphery rebels, and House units - reasonable worst-case scenario has them about as upgraded as a Regular Army unit, and said Regular Army would often be able to call on Royal forces for backup.
What's the source on those numbers? I imagine a lot of folks would be very interested in some kind of codification of the rate of tech spread for this era.
Assuming I'm reading the above correctly...Sorry i was using my phone at the time. Great Houses (aka the Star League Member States), they had some Star League technology just about the time the Civil War broke out. Thus why i come back to would the base model Atlas, the AS7-D survive in such a battlefield. The Atlas II is more technology up to snuff with the Royals.
Available to whom?
Sorry, I was using my phone at the time. The Great Houses(aka the Star League Member States) had some Star League technology just about the time the Civil War broke out. Thus why I come back to the question: Would the base model Atlas, the AS7-D survive in such a battlefield? The Atlas II is more technologically up to snuff with the Royals.
Sorry i was using my phone at the time. Great Houses (aka the Star League Member States), they had some Star League technology just about the time the Civil War broke out. Thus why i come back to would the base model Atlas, the AS7-D survive in such a battlefield. The Atlas II is more technology up to snuff with the Royals.
But we all seem to have lost sight of the most important point: This thread isn't about the Atlas at all, it's about the Atlas II.
If I am facing 1200 tons of a geek god I know I am smacking the unit with artillery and bombs, not frontal combat.
The Atlas II is not a very powerful mech. It is odd to have it as one of the best assault units in the SLDF. The Pillager was almost 100 years old, and there were prototypes of the Thunder Hawk and Devastator. Even the Nightstar (a prototype, too) would have eaten it alive.
It has 4 long range weapons but only one that can deal 10 points of damage. The weapons are somewhat lackluster, the twin ER Large are good weapons but not the most efficient. Compare it with the Awesome 8Q, a common unit 20 tons lighter, and you can see that something is amiss. It is better than the original Atlas (which was clearly not the best assault mech, even the non-royal Highlander was better) but it is not the "king of the Battlefield".
Oddly enough is a good complement to the Pillager. Moonsword is right about it. However, the doctrine behind SLDF was against mixing units and I don't think that mixed Atlas II/Pillager units were what the designer was thinking about. The Highlander would have been a better complement due to its jump jets, armor and weapons.
Finally, the mini is horrid and it needs a lot of loving from a jeweller's saw in order to make it look better.
http://www.camospecs.com/MiniList.asp?Action=Detail&ID=1200
Just took a look at the HT again, and it really looks more like an SLDF upgrade kit for the original atlas to me.
Save weight with FF and DHS, upgrade all the lasers. Done.
Sure, it has an H in the name, and the weapons suite makes it look like a halfway step between an Atlas and an Atlas II, and maybe it was, but it's still closer, to me, to an actual Atlas.
And, in comparison, it really isn't so bad.
Makes the most sense considering it came about so they could reuse the standard Atlas model.
(Well, that and the lack of rear-facing defenses.)
And really, who needs those once you've stuck those big guns in the arms?
No one wants to face Twin ERLL, ERPPC, LB10X, or GR when they are in a speedy little no-armor backstabber
Speaking for myself, I rather like the idea of a pair of rear-facing MPLs to give some pause to that speedy little no-armor backstabber who happens to get around the Atlas (II) in the heat of battle. That way, the big guns in the arms can continue to be pointed at things like, you know, other assault Mechs.I agree, in principle, but I would rather have those 4 tons given over to something I'll use more often, rather than just a deterrent. Either forward, as they are now, or more armor, heat sinks, ammo, etc. Putting the "rear arc" lasers into a turret has some appeal. Downgrading the SRM6 to SRM4 frees the space and tonnage, and you can even throw that SRM4 into the turret too.
cheers,
Gabe
When you read fiction they are all and great, but then in real gaming they are not so effective unless you PLAN to be flankedIt doesn't really matter if you plan to be flanked or not. No plan survives first contact with the enemy. :)
I never understood why we had to get away from the cannon/RT & missiles/LT look of the 7D.
That's probably because there's no modern variants of the mech.
That's probably because there's no modern variants of the mech.
Technically the Stone model is a modern variant.You have a point. The fluff from TRO:3075 had said Defiance kept the Mech in production after the Blakist kicked off production and were kicked out of the Mountain.
But who knows maybe we will get something from Defiance in the 3100's in some future product.
For those who have modified their atlas ii to the Nicholas kerensky version which Gauss arm do you use?
The official stats for Nick K's Atlas II is in Operational Turning Points: Widowmaker Absorption. Turns out he used a AS7-D-H that was later upgraded with Clan Tech so no Gauss as many of us guessed prior to TP:WA
Why was there a myth of him having a Gauss Rifle?
For the AS7-D-H2? you would just need to free up the LB-X and Large Laser vs the whole arm. I know fan bashes exsist but they are far and few between I can't find any info on what parts the use for the PPC and Gauss. Personally, I would go with the Gauss from the Reseen Battlemaster and a PPC from a Mad II to keep it constant with other assaults. You can also use Omni parts from IWM if you want it to look more Clan. I'm sure the mini section of the forum has more ideas.
The RS is actually fluffed as an attempt at mimicking the 7D-H using Low-Tech.Where's this actually noted?
...and feels very Star Leagueish to me.
It is fluffed as the pinnacle of SLDF Atlas models.That comment was because some of the Star League upgrades/'Mechs don't feel like Star League. Okay, that may sound weird but bunch of Royals are made with modern understanding of the game and throwing away the haphazard way many earlier 'Mechs were designed. Simply put, they're too fine!
That comment was because some of the Star League upgrades/'Mechs don't feel like Star League. Okay, that may sound weird but bunch of Royals are made with modern understanding of the game and throwing away the haphazard way many earlier 'Mechs were designed. Simply put, they're too fine!
That said, after poorly slept night, i'm feeling like i should've said "doesn't feel Star League really but i like it all the same, in as much as i can due to my generally mixed feelings".
I am not a fan of its looks as well. It lacks the foreboding appearance of the original. It just looks kinda goofy.
I always felt that way too. Has any one seen the new atlas ii model it looks a lot better but I have not seen it next too other models
Few picks I have seen of the new mini by itself look great.
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Same! It finally has the bulkiness I feel the unit warranted
It was Nicholas's ride.I don't think it was originally, it wasn't detailed. It was straight up Atlas (no C or IICs around yet.) but i may been misreembering. Atlas II fluff was retrocon of sorts, the Atlas II was around but nothing about it or it's stats in the original books.
I really don't see any way to interpret the name "Atlas II AS7-D-H (Kerensky)" as being anything other than the personal ride of a Kerensky, and OTP: Widowmaker Absorption is very clear in putting Nutty Nicky in that mech.My problem is that it uses CLAN DHS and FF, which I'm pretty sure debuted after he died.
My problem is that it uses CLAN DHS and FF, which I'm pretty sure debuted after he died.
We don't talk about the other one. Besides, that one doesn't even have a mini.