Author Topic: BattleTech: Clan Invasion Kickstarter Discussion, Vol. 2 (Read 115959 times)

RogueK · « **Reply #210 on:** 23 July 2019, 18:11:25 »

Quote from: PyreLight on 23 July 2019, 18:06:46

The rewards explicitly say "custom mechwarrior art", and not "a chance of custom mechwarrior art". It's super misleading and frankly I have no idea why they changed their minds so many days after.

The answer for that is easy: They probably grossly underestimated how many people were going to sign up for the artwork. 319 people and counting BTW.

Now you can argue they should have put that in limits within what they could manage. I don't know enough of behind the scenes (And it CAN be read that you are guaranteed to see both used. Just not at the same time in the same work), or kickstarter running in general, to know the rationale for why they didn't

PyreLight · « **Reply #211 on:** 23 July 2019, 18:14:46 »

Quote from: RogueK on 23 July 2019, 18:11:25

The answer for that is easy: They probably grossly underestimated how many people were going to sign up for the artwork. 319 people and counting BTW.

Now you can argue they should have put that in limits within what they could manage. I don't know enough of behind the scenes (And it CAN be read that you are guaranteed to see both used. Just not at the same time in the same work), or kickstarter running in general, to know the rationale for why they didn't

If they make such a drastic change to what is promised in their rewards for several hundreds of backers a week later, then they should probably 1) revise their FAQ so that one answer does not contradict the other, 2) send out an update e-mail to everyone to notify them about the change 3) use spell check before posting their new revision, 4) contact Kickstarter and ask if they can get the reward description changed to avoid confusion

Maingunnery · « **Reply #212 on:** 23 July 2019, 18:19:04 »

I would recommend to set limits on number of Galaxy Commanders and up, and then make a lot of pilot cards.

RogueK · « **Reply #213 on:** 23 July 2019, 18:22:45 »

Quote from: PyreLight on 23 July 2019, 18:14:46

If they make such a drastic change to what is promised in their rewards for several hundreds of backers a week later, then they should probably 1) revise their FAQ so that one answer does not contradict the other, 2) send out an update e-mail to everyone to notify them about the change 3) use spell check before posting their new revision.

That'd really fall under "How" they should do the change. Which I will not try to claim is the best handled as that FAQ is worded in a way that makes it unclear what they are saying (Will they randomly use one or the other, but not obligated to use both? Will they always use both but not neccessarily in same place? I have no clue)

There's been a fair bit of confused communication regarding details where even staff members have given seemingly contradictory answers.

It makes me worry. I want this kickstarter to go well, I've heard the horror stories about the shadowrun sprawl ops kickstarter, and poor communication was very much one of the issues listed.

I hope this is just temporary confusion that will be ironed out now that things slow down, rather than a sign of things to come.

kinwolf · « **Reply #214 on:** 23 July 2019, 18:31:27 »

Quote from: RogueK on 23 July 2019, 18:22:45

<snip>

It makes me worry. I want this kickstarter to go well, I've heard the horror stories about the shadowrun sprawl ops kickstarter, and poor communication was very much one of the issues listed.

I hope this is just temporary confusion that will be ironed out now that things slow down, rather than a sign of things to come.

Well, I'll say that communication from the higher-up sure seems to be rare. (Cubby is doing a fantastic job with the limited info he has)

Cache · « **Reply #215 on:** 23 July 2019, 18:32:54 »

Quote from: Maingunnery on 23 July 2019, 18:19:04

I would recommend to set limits on number of Galaxy Commanders and up, and then make a lot of pilot cards.

Well, a free PDF "photo album" of new canon characters is a way out as well.

PyreLight · « **Reply #216 on:** 23 July 2019, 18:37:54 »

Quote from: RogueK on 23 July 2019, 18:22:45

That'd really fall under "How" they should do the change. Which I will not try to claim is the best handled as that FAQ is worded in a way that makes it unclear what they are saying (Will they randomly use one or the other, but not obligated to use both? Will they always use both but not neccessarily in same place? I have no clue)

There's been a fair bit of confused communication regarding details where even staff members have given seemingly contradictory answers.

It makes me worry. I want this kickstarter to go well, I've heard the horror stories about the shadowrun sprawl ops kickstarter, and poor communication was very much one of the issues listed.

I hope this is just temporary confusion that will be ironed out now that things slow down, rather than a sign of things to come.

Regardless, this sudden change of rewards is super underwhelming and ultimately misleading. If this is a sign of things we can expect, it makes me worried about the future execution of the Kickstarter and the promises.

They should have cleared this up before the Kickstarter began and the rewards were set in stone. Now hundreds of backers are going to either lower their pledge or get extremely upset when they find out the change - something of which still contradicts another answer in the FAQ.

Quote from: Cache on 23 July 2019, 18:32:54

Well, a free PDF "photo album" of new canon characters is a way out as well.

Yeah that would suck immensely. Giving 90 dollars for your image and name to be copy pasted into a throw-away PDF? That's going to be a no.

DarkSpade · « **Reply #217 on:** 23 July 2019, 18:38:16 »

Quote from: Cache on 23 July 2019, 18:32:54

Well, a free PDF "photo album" of new canon characters is a way out as well.

And really lame. I , and I'm sure others, would really like something physical.

Sartris · « **Reply #218 on:** 23 July 2019, 18:44:59 »

But is my math right? $80 for a maybe?

Maingunnery · « **Reply #219 on:** 23 July 2019, 18:51:48 »

Quote from: Cache on 23 July 2019, 18:32:54

Well, a free PDF "photo album" of new canon characters is a way out as well.

Maybe the only solution for people with just names.
How knows how many backers this project gets....

Ogra_Chief · « **Reply #220 on:** 23 July 2019, 18:57:12 »

Quote

Yeah that would suck immensely. Giving 90 dollars for your image and name to be copy pasted into a throw-away PDF? That's going to be a no.

Then maybe, "no," and you won't be disappointed. The focus of the KS was the expansion and the minis. You can always downgrade your pledge to something you're 'happy with,' and just pay for your character separately.

If you have $90 to throw at game, clearly it isn't that big of a deal to spend that money. Should be a fun experience, right?

It appears TPTB are still figuring out a lot of logistics and answers may take a while before definitives are given. Just saying.

Daryk · « **Reply #221 on:** 23 July 2019, 19:05:21 »

Even more glad I only pledged at $1 right now...

Sartris · « **Reply #222 on:** 23 July 2019, 19:10:53 »

Quote from: Ogra_Chief on 23 July 2019, 18:57:12

Then maybe, "no," and you won't be disappointed. The focus of the KS was the expansion and the minis. You can always downgrade your pledge to something you're 'happy with,' and just pay for your character separately.

If you have $90 to throw at game, clearly it isn't that big of a deal to spend that money. Should be a fun experience, right?

It appears TPTB are still figuring out a lot of logistics and answers may take a while before definitives are given. Just saying.

Yup. Downgrading the pledge and getting more of those minis vs a chance at something more substantial chiseled into canon. They were clearly not expecting this overall response. The first several dozen stretch goals were 5k apart and got blown away on day 1. I completely sympathize with their situation. I just wanted to make sure I was understanding the realty of it before I decided. No one has to commit this second.

kinwolf · « **Reply #223 on:** 23 July 2019, 19:11:54 »

Quote from: Daryk on 23 July 2019, 19:05:21

Even more glad I only pledged at $1 right now...

No reason to be glad or sad, until the KS is over, anyone can change their pledge at will. And usually, even afterwards, in the pledge manager, they ask you to confirm everything and you still can make changes(maybe not lower the amount though, not sure about that)

PyreLight · « **Reply #224 on:** 23 July 2019, 19:13:40 »

Quote from: Ogra_Chief on 23 July 2019, 18:57:12

Then maybe, "no," and you won't be disappointed. The focus of the KS was the expansion and the minis. You can always downgrade your pledge to something you're 'happy with,' and just pay for your character separately.

If you have $90 to throw at game, clearly it isn't that big of a deal to spend that money. Should be a fun experience, right?

It appears TPTB are still figuring out a lot of logistics and answers may take a while before definitives are given. Just saying.

The art is not for me, but for someone else close to me. And no, we don't have 90 dollars lying around. And yes, I'll just downgrade my pledge, it's no problem. That doesn't mean I can't criticize how this has been handled.

If "TPTB are still figuring out a lot of logistics and answers", maybe they should've done that before committing to a promise that supposedly cannot be changed in the KS system and that will mislead a ton of people unless they happen to look up the FAQ topic that states "if you have a custom character but not custom art can you be a pilot card?" in which it somehow also says that custom art is not guaranteed.

I mean, people actually have to go click on a question that does not even pertain to their pledge level in order to find out about this change in reward. This new change also contradicts a previous FAQ topic about the custom art. It's simply not handled very well and the spelling errors and opaque language hidden away in an unrelated FAQ topic affirm this.

kinwolf · « **Reply #225 on:** 23 July 2019, 19:20:48 »

I didn't pledge at the art level, but for having many commissions done over the years, one thing that is an unknown right now and which would be important to me is "who" is doing the art piece, and if I get the original sketch or not. If you don't agree with the artist style, that 80-90$ could turn out to have a sour taste.

RomulusDC · « **Reply #226 on:** 23 July 2019, 19:28:31 »

A reasonable explanation has been offered by Mr Scroggins.

Sartris · « **Reply #227 on:** 23 July 2019, 19:43:49 »

Ok Anthony weighed in over on the KS comments

Quote

You'll get both, but no guarantee at the same time. With the immense number of people backing for canon characters and art they need absolutely every option available to sink these into. There are plenty of examples where I character could be shown but not mentioned, say in a battle/scene shot with no extensive caption.

Makes more sense. Should probably add that to the faq

RomulusDC · « **Reply #228 on:** 23 July 2019, 19:50:43 »

Never mind. Bandwidth issues.

DarkSpade · « **Reply #229 on:** 23 July 2019, 19:58:26 »

Quote from: Sartris on 23 July 2019, 19:43:49

Ok Anthony weighed in over on the KS comments

Makes more sense. Should probably add that to the faq

I do appreciate his feedback, but doesn't he just freelance for Catalyst? He probably does know more than we do, but he's not actually Catalyst.

SteveRestless · « **Reply #230 on:** 23 July 2019, 19:59:46 »

Any word yet, whether we'll be able to get multiples of the core mechs (other than buying them as add-ons)?

Sartris · « **Reply #231 on:** 23 July 2019, 20:00:11 »

He’s the art director

Ogra_Chief · « **Reply #232 on:** 23 July 2019, 20:03:48 »

Quote

If "TPTB are still figuring out a lot of logistics and answers", maybe they should've done that before committing to a promise that supposedly cannot be changed in the KS system and that will mislead a ton of people unless they happen to look up the FAQ topic that states "if you have a custom character but not custom art can you be a pilot card?" in which it somehow also says that custom art is not guaranteed.

Why can't it be they tried to do something cool and didn't know they were going to be tidalwaved instead of, 'they overpromised' or 'mislead'?

It's not like BT is IP'ing words from the English language, because they rolling in 'Benji's'.

PyreLight · « **Reply #233 on:** 23 July 2019, 20:06:36 »

Quote from: Sartris on 23 July 2019, 19:43:49

Ok Anthony weighed in over on the KS comments

Makes more sense. Should probably add that to the faq

They probably should re-write the confusing FAQ, this comment or clarification will get buried in the comments sections.

RomulusDC · « **Reply #234 on:** 23 July 2019, 20:08:58 »

Hey Catalyst, do you need more artists? Check my Avatar for a sample.

Charlie 6 · « **Reply #235 on:** 23 July 2019, 20:48:13 »

Adrian,

Will the $40 Inner Sphere Retaliation come with the Alpha Strike cards? If not, would those specific Alpha Strike cards be available as an add-on?

Two Guns Blazing · « **Reply #236 on:** 23 July 2019, 20:58:55 »

Quote from: Colt Ward on 23 July 2019, 10:37:23

I would also like to suggest for a post 1 mil goal, release the Clan Invasion Box mechs as a Heavy Nova with Elementals as a Add-On.

Excellent suggestion mate, that would be a seriously sweet stretch goal!!!

CGL, could you very kindly put this suggestion into action, thanks :)

DarkSpade · « **Reply #237 on:** 23 July 2019, 21:06:46 »

Quote from: Sartris on 23 July 2019, 20:00:11

He’s the art director

Learn something new every day. :thumbsup:

Colt Ward · « **Reply #238 on:** 23 July 2019, 22:58:44 »

Folks have to remember there are a set number of actual CGL employees, a bunch of folks on contract who do things as it works around their IRL schedule, and then the volunteers . . . we have 8 pages of discussion here, 20-30 in the locked topic, and something like 3500 comments in the kickstarter general, couple hundred on the two pick star/lance update, the poll about mechs, and who knows how many comments on FB/Twitter. I mean, they literally could not keep up with us the first day and that was letting a lot of automation handle counting money.

Oh yeah, you want to also remember they are packing up and heading to GenCon to meet a lot of folks.

I really think they were blown away- just look at the funded amount which was to fund the production for the initial product & swag since IMO a lot of the prep work had been done. We did it in 7 minutes and by the end of 24 hours had unlocked I think over half the stretch goals.

I do agree the FAQs should be clear and answer for most folks 3-5 days before the end of the Kickstarter- I mean you always have 'those guys' looking for edge cases. And considering how much Cubby has been answering and Adrian dropped in to answer some, I think they will take care of it.

RomulusDC · « **Reply #239 on:** 23 July 2019, 23:28:11 »

I’m sure it seemed like a good idea to put Gen Con in the middle of this three months ago when they were planning this. I imagine it’s probably a giant, if extremely profitable, headache to deal with both now.