Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race

[Jester Motley]

So, I did a thing cause I needed to do a thing.

I made a Turn sheet so I could both track my various turns, but to also (cause I'm lazy) populate previous information to each new turn, without my having to do it by hand.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1xXZ_929xGs6VZKh6vTAhKTlovQn97g7qqFn7_ULEj2I/edit?usp=sharing

Feel free to make a copy and put your stuff in. 
To use it, (after filling in your own stuff)
select the Template Sheet tab, right click "duplicate", change the name to "Turn X" where x is the new turn, and there is a space between Turn and the number.
Open the new turn, change the Current Turn field (B2) to the new turn, and the spreadsheet should populate based on the past turn.  (This chains, so each turn will be effected by the turn prior.)
A White Cell is user-editable.  A shaded cell is a calculated Cell, and shouldn't be changed by hand.

If anyone has a suggestion on something to add, or do something differently, let me know.

I've found this really useful this turn, in trying to find the right balance for building the right balance of ships.  The "Fleet Needs" was also helpful to let me know how many more fighters I needed to buy this round to fill out my carriers.

Anyway, hopefully this helps someone else.

[Smegish]

Who are we still waiting on? Is it just Maid Marian?

[marcussmythe]

Marian Hegemony
Federated Suns
Hindu Collective (maybe merge them early to lower GM workload?)
Terran Hegemony

[Alsadius]

The UHC is almost zero workload, because they don't do much. The Hegemony is mostly waiting to decide if they want to make use of their new PPCs(which will require non-canon designs, but for a point-defence station that might be a good idea since canon has a serious lack there), but otherwise I have their turn mostly figured out. I've also got most of the research of what happened in canon done. My goal right now is to finish it by the end of the week, but we'll see how that goes.

FYI, blame Kiviar for any delays - he kidnapped me this weekend :P

[marcussmythe]

The UHC is almost zero workload, because they don't do much. The Hegemony is mostly waiting to decide if they want to make use of their new PPCs(which will require non-canon designs, but for a point-defence station that might be a good idea since canon has a serious lack there), but otherwise I have their turn mostly figured out. I've also got most of the research of what happened in canon done. My goal right now is to finish it by the end of the week, but we'll see how that goes.

FYI, blame Kiviar for any delays - he kidnapped me this weekend :P

Concert?  SCA Event?  Gaming Convention?

[Alsadius]

Concert?  SCA Event?  Gaming Convention?

Nah, just a few of us hanging out at his place.

[Kiviar]

Nah, just a few of us hanging out at his place.

Also watching one man drink 10% less than a lethal dose of Coke.

I'm still finding cans in weird places.

[marcussmythe]

Well, the Hegemony got NAVAL PPCs... I dont think ‘Standard Scale’ PPCs come along for a while, yet...  so arent they still looking at AC5s and Machine Guns, like the rest of us...

[Alsadius]

Well, the Hegemony got NAVAL PPCs... I dont think ‘Standard Scale’ PPCs come along for a while, yet...  so arent they still looking at AC5s and Machine Guns, like the rest of us...

I just realized I said "point defence station" above, which is not at all what I meant. Standard defensive stations. NPPCs for that purpose are somewhat silly - NL-55s are better in basically every way on a station, and the cost difference is kind of extreme with the x5 multiplier - but it seems like a very Terran thing to do.

[marcussmythe]

I just realized I said "point defence station" above, which is not at all what I meant. Standard defensive stations. NPPCs for that purpose are somewhat silly - NL-55s are better in basically every way on a station, and the cost difference is kind of extreme with the x5 multiplier - but it seems like a very Terran thing to do.

AHHHHH!  Okay.

Yess  masses of HNPPCs (much more expensive per blam than NLs or MNPPCs) seem very terran.

[truetanker]

Ok.. I'm very sorry for this very late write.

Been sick, lost internet and a full week work. Then there is GenCon coming next Wed. So on top of this, I haven't the internet monies... doomed to the Public Library and it's screwy hours! I'll try to post as often as I can... may take some time doing so in between.

End Budget turn 3: 12 Billion and 870 Million

Now I'll write my responses to the questions and posts I see...

2374: Yeah.... I can work this in.

Note that this offer is only open to the realms immediately bordering the Hegemony - the Marians, ...are not able to take advantage of this proposal at the current time. (Sorry Truetanker) Boo! Hiss!

MH: $12B, as increased tax revenue from Lothario makes up for the loss of loot. Cha..ching!

Would you like to know more?
---

  Hey now, that's my line... but I can share!

Who are we still waiting on? Is it just Maid Marian?

Ha. Ha.  :P Very funny... you. Just wait for turn 5! I got something in mind for you, personally.

OK done with response time. Now for Action!

Budget for Turn 4
Previous ending:  12 Billion and 870 Million
Taxes:                  12 Billion                         
Total:                   24 Billion and 870 Million

Debt:                      3 Billion ( 2 for Trojan loan and 1 for Yard credit )
Yard build,             5 Billion ( Class-1, ( Alphard #2 )
Build Yard#1:         4.532 Billion ( 2 Scapha I with full kit )
Build Yard#2:         4.162 Billion ( 1 Scapha I, 1 Scapha II with full kit )
Recruitment Drive:   .250 Million ( RD )
Retirement Funding:.250 Million ( RF )
Donations :              .500 Million for Periphery Aid Package, helping the homeless in the Lothian League.
Training Exercise:    .500 Million ( TE )

Ending Balance : 4 Billion and 41 Million

Story arc:


Marian Action News Network ( MANN )
Vatnajökull, Lothario
Marian Hegemony Embassy

MANN Reporter in a parka reporting ~ " It's been a few years since the Legios of Marian Hegemony came and conquered the Lothian League. Conquered may be a strong word as you can see... " pointing to some red writing on the wall of a building. " Non Victoria! Victory, No!, Such strong words for a little bit of fame. But what is victory? And at what cost, the Imperator declined to comment. In other news the new arrival of the Alphard was seen as more of a political move than not, only time will tell. Departing Lothario, Vi left with two of the Scahpa I's she came with along with a Trojan. Pride of Lothario still berths over the capital. This is Marian Action News Network on Lothario reporting. " Camera fades to the MANN news logo, then black.

I might as well add names to these fleets.

First Fleet:
Alphard is a Scapha II, leadship Alphard Task Force
Spica is a Scapha I, Spike
Ignis is a Scapha I, Fire
Bellator is a Scapha I, Warrior *
Trojan is a Trojan, loanship from DCA and Scout for ATF

Second Fleet:
Vi Unitatis Thru is a Scapha II, leadship of Vi Task Force
Letum is a Scapha I, Death
Rana is a Scapha I, Frog
Pompeii is a Trojan, loanship from DCA and Scout for VTF

Lothario Fleet:
Pride of Lothario is a Scapha I
Frozen Myst is a civilian jumpship

TT

MODIFY: OOpsie.. apparently an over jealous clerk tried to Embezzle the Treasury out of some money, fixed now and added something else. *

Training Exercise means just that, Combat training; ship to ship, ship to shore, recon in force, landings, Orbit artillery, defender and attacker modes, Relief Aid and Hide and Seeker.

[Alsadius]

The Terran Hegemony feels moderately confident about their naval posture, but wishes to ensure that their fleet will not need to be tied down in fixed defensive positions. As such, they have developed the Ancile defensive station. Intended as a defensive cover for shipyards, orbital industry, and other such fixed installations, the Ancile includes several design innovations. The most obvious of these is the primary offensive battery, six gigantic new energy weapons that are based on cutting-edge Terran weapons research. Less obvious, but more appreciated by Terran fighter crews, is that the Ancile was designed as a "pit stop" for planetary defence fighters, allowing them to re-fuel and re-arm, or even conduct some repairs if they are too badly damaged to safely re-enter the planetary atmosphere. While the fighter bays are typically kept empty, they have the ability to turn over nearly a full regiment of fighters at once, and generous fuel and weapon storage allow them to keep large forces in the fight for extended periods.

Code: [Select]

Class/Model/Name: Ancile
Tech: Inner Sphere
Ship Cost: $506,865,025.00
Magazine Cost: $10,590,000.00
BV2: 21,391

Mass: 120,000
K-F Drive System: None
Power Plant: Station-Keeping Drive
Armor Type: Standard
Armament:
6 Naval PPC Heavy
24 Capital Launcher AR-10
36 AC 5
48 Machine Gun (IS)

Class/Model/Name: Ancile
Mass: 120,000

Equipment: Mass
Drive: 1,440
Controls: 120
Structural Integrity: 1 1,200
Total Heat Sinks: 1866 Single 1,768
Fuel & Fuel Pumps: 7500 points 1,530
Fire Control Computers: 0
Armor: 360 pts Standard 450
Fore: 60
Fore-Left/Right: 60/60
Aft-Left/Right: 60/60
Aft: 60

Grav Decks:
Medium: 2 200
Escape Pods: 29 203

Crew And Passengers:
20 Officers in 2nd Class Quarters 140
49 Crew in Steerage Quarters 245
44 Gunners and Others in Steerage Quarters 220
88 Bay Personnel in Steerage Quarters 440
48 Bay Personnel (fighter pilots, assumed to not be permanently stationed) 0

# Weapons Loc Heat Damage Range Mass
6 Naval PPC Heavy Nose 1350 900 (90-C) Extreme-C 18,000
6 Capital Launcher AR-10 FR 120 240 (24-C) Extreme-C 1,500
6 Capital Launcher AR-10 FL 120 240 (24-C) Extreme-C 1,500
6 Capital Launcher AR-10 AR 120 240 (24-C) Extreme-C 1,500
6 Capital Launcher AR-10 AL 120 240 (24-C) Extreme-C 1,500
6 AC 5 Nose 6 30 (3-C) Medium 48
6 AC 5 Aft 6 30 (3-C) Medium 48
6 AC 5 FR 6 30 (3-C) Medium 48
6 AC 5 FL 6 30 (3-C) Medium 48
6 AC 5 AR 6 30 (3-C) Medium 48
6 AC 5 AL 6 30 (3-C) Medium 48
8 Machine Gun (IS) Nose 16 (1.6-C) Short-PDS 4
8 Machine Gun (IS) Aft 16 (1.6-C) Short-PDS 4
8 Machine Gun (IS) FR 16 (1.6-C) Short-PDS 4
8 Machine Gun (IS) FL 16 (1.6-C) Short-PDS 4
8 Machine Gun (IS) AR 16 (1.6-C) Short-PDS 4
8 Machine Gun (IS) AL 16 (1.6-C) Short-PDS 4

Ammo Rounds Mass
Capital Launcher Barracuda Ammo 240 7,200.00
Capital Launcher Killer Whale Ammo 240 12,000.00
Capital Launcher White Shark Ammo 240 9,600.00
AC 5 Ammo 2160 108.00
Machine Gun (IS) Ammo 4800 24.00

Bays
Cargo Bay (Aft, 2 doors): 40,000 tons standard cargo, 10,000 tons liquid cargo(=9,100 tons fuel stored)
Hangar Bay (Aft, 8 doors): 48 fighter, 8 small craft
The Hegemony has earmarked 10 Anciles each for the minor yards of Thorin, Terra Firma, New Earth, Yorii, and Graham IV. Twenty are being built at the larger Keid yards, and fully fifty are planned for the defence of Terra itself. As well, substantial numbers of fighters are being purchased to bolster the defenses of these planets. This has placed a substantial pinch on fleet unit construction, and far fewer new hulls will be purchased in the 2380s than in decades prior, along with a moderate cut to the research budget. However, the defences are expected to free up those units that do get built for more offensive operations if needed, and this trade-off is acceptable to Terran planners.

BUDGET: $765B
Maintenance(@100%): $196.069B

Shipyard upgrades: $110B (Keid 5>6, Terra 11>22, Thorin 2>3, Terra Firma 2>3)

4x Black Lion: $28.172B
4x Bonaventure: $20.144B
4x Cruiser: $30.092B
4x Lola: $26.528B
6x Quixote: $70.596B
4x Essex: $23.932B
4x Monsoon: $58.224B
4x Aegis: $42.752B

Ancile R&D: $507m
120x Ancile: $60.84B

120x DropShip: $36B
900x small craft: $9B
9600x fighter: $48B

Research: $4.144B

[Smegish]

Could release a Block II Monsoon with the canon NPPCs reinstalled

[Alsadius]

Could release a Block II Monsoon with the canon NPPCs reinstalled

I could, but that'll probably wait until there's another upgrade to do alongside it(armor, etc.). We're getting to the point where the TH went defensive-minded - Brian Cameron of Castle Brian fame takes over in 2382, and in canon he invents the Castle Brian in 2391. However, I couldn't find any station designs they used for centuries yet, so this seems like a reasonable thing to do instead.

[marcussmythe]

Moderately confident?  One shudders to consider what the Hegemony would need to feel ‘comfortable’.

[Starfox1701]

Moderately confident?  One shudders to consider what the Hegemony would need to feel ‘comfortable’.

Full conquest of the inner sphere probably.

[truetanker]

Full conquest of the inner sphere probably.

I'll defend my borders with Piracy if I have to!

TT

[Alsadius]

I'll admit that writing the TH turns is a bit of a challenge. I don't have a good sense of their motivations, so I basically treat them like the modern USN - they want enough ships to beat everyone else all at once and still be able to support a couple mid-sized invasions by the Army afterwards. That's reasonable, right?

---

I'll defend my borders with Piracy if I have to!

In a discussion of the THN coming after you, there's one question that needs to be asked - "What borders?"  >:D

---

The UHC has decided to invest some funds in increasing shipyard capacity, as well as buying a few light units for increased mobility and system defence.

BUDGET: $23B
Maintenance (@150%): $7.586B
Shipyard upgrade (Panpour 1>2): $10B
2x JumpShip: $1B
6x DropShip: $1.8B
300x fighter: $1.5B
Research: $1.114B

Also, this isn't a military ship, and the UHC navy doesn't run any of these, but I thought you might be amused by the civilian designs that the juicy level 3 yard at Panpour is churning out.

Code: [Select]

Class/Model/Name: Maal
Tech: Inner Sphere
Ship Cost: $7,475,050,004.00
Magazine Cost: $0.00
BV2: 200

Mass: 750,000
K-F Drive System: Compact
Power Plant: Maneuvering Drive
Safe Thrust: 2
Maximum Thrust: 3
Armor Type: Standard
Armament:
None

Class/Model/Name: Maal
Mass: 750,000

Equipment: Mass
Drive: 90,000
Thrust
Safe: 2
Maximum: 3
Controls: 1,875
K-F Hyperdrive: Compact (16 Integrity) 339,375
Jump Sail: (5 Integrity) 68
Structural Integrity: 5 3,750
Total Heat Sinks: 469 Single
Fuel & Fuel Pumps: 13500 points 5,508
Fire Control Computers: 0
Armor: 6 pts Standard 0
Fore: 1
Fore-Left/Right: 1/1
Aft-Left/Right: 1/1
Aft: 1

Dropship Capacity: 1 1,000
Grav Decks:
Small: 3 150
Medium: 0
Large: 0
Escape Pods: 60 420
Life Boats: 60 420

Crew And Passengers:
33 Officers in 1st Class Quarters 330
162 Crew in 2nd Class Quarters 1,134
0 Gunners and Others in 2nd Class Quarters 0
60 Bay Personnel in 2nd Class Quarters 4200
50 1st Class Passengers 500
200 2nd Class Passengers 1,400
250 Steerage Passengers 1,250

Number Equipment and Bays Mass Doors
300,000 Cargo, Standard 300,000 10
12 Bay Small Craft 2,400 6

[Starfox1701]

I'll admit that writing the TH turns is a bit of a challenge. I don't have a good sense of their motivations, so I basically treat them like the modern USN - they want enough ships to beat everyone else all at once and still be able to support a couple mid-sized invasions by the Army afterwards. That's reasonable, right?

---

In a discussion of the THN coming after you, there's one question that needs to be asked - "What borders?"  >:D

---

The UHC has decided to invest some funds in increasing shipyard capacity, as well as buying a few light units for increased mobility and system defence.

BUDGET: $23B
Maintenance (@150%): $7.586B
Shipyard upgrade (Panpour 1>2): $10B
2x JumpShip: $1B
6x DropShip: $1.8B
300x fighter: $1.5B
Research: $1.114B

Also, this isn't a military ship, and the UHC navy doesn't run any of these, but I thought you might be amused by the civilian designs that the juicy level 3 yard at Panpour is churning out.

Code: [Select]

Class/Model/Name: Maal
Tech: Inner Sphere
Ship Cost: $7,475,050,004.00
Magazine Cost: $0.00
BV2: 200

Mass: 750,000
K-F Drive System: Compact
Power Plant: Maneuvering Drive
Safe Thrust: 2
Maximum Thrust: 3
Armor Type: Standard
Armament:
None

Class/Model/Name: Maal
Mass: 750,000

Equipment: Mass
Drive: 90,000
Thrust
Safe: 2
Maximum: 3
Controls: 1,875
K-F Hyperdrive: Compact (16 Integrity) 339,375
Jump Sail: (5 Integrity) 68
Structural Integrity: 5 3,750
Total Heat Sinks: 469 Single
Fuel & Fuel Pumps: 13500 points 5,508
Fire Control Computers: 0
Armor: 6 pts Standard 0
Fore: 1
Fore-Left/Right: 1/1
Aft-Left/Right: 1/1
Aft: 1

Dropship Capacity: 1 1,000
Grav Decks:
Small: 3 150
Medium: 0
Large: 0
Escape Pods: 60 420
Life Boats: 60 420

Crew And Passengers:
33 Officers in 1st Class Quarters 330
162 Crew in 2nd Class Quarters 1,134
0 Gunners and Others in 2nd Class Quarters 0
60 Bay Personnel in 2nd Class Quarters 4200
50 1st Class Passengers 500
200 2nd Class Passengers 1,400
250 Steerage Passengers 1,250

Number Equipment and Bays Mass Doors
300,000 Cargo, Standard 300,000 10
12 Bay Small Craft 2,400 6

My impression from the limited source books is that the TH is that because they where hemed in they needed resources and were looking to keep everyone too scared to seriously mess with them.

[Smegish]

Think they've done a fairly good job of that

[Alsadius]

Think they've done a fairly good job of that

Heh, indeed.

---

FYI, it's looking like I'll probably get the next turn posted this weekend. I'll either post it or give an updated ETA this Saturday afternoon.

[marcussmythe]

Thanks.  Ill be looking forward to it.

[DOC_Agren]

UHC navy doesn't run any of these, but I thought you might be amused by the civilian designs that the juicy level 3 yard at Panpour is churning out.

okay know I'm just a lurker, but isn't that a lvl 2 yard?

and the Maal has no Anti-meteor weapons just incase it happens to be at the wrong place wrong time?

Moderately confident?  One shudders to consider what the Hegemony would need to feel ‘comfortable’.

When it can do as in Canon, I kills it with my Battleships  :thumbsup:

I'll defend my borders with Piracy if I have to!

TT

Well if there is anyone who going to make the Hegemony have to planetcracking to solve the border issue, I will vote for TT >:D

[Alsadius]

okay know I'm just a lurker, but isn't that a lvl 2 yard?

Nope, level 3.

and the Maal has no Anti-meteor weapons just incase it happens to be at the wrong place wrong time?

Most civilian BT ships don't. Sensors and engines are usually better for that, and any piece of debris too big to hit is probably too big to blow up with an AC/5.

When it can do as in Canon, I kills it with my Battleships  :thumbsup:

Ah, so that's the THN doctrine. NPPCs are anti-fighter weapons as long as you have enough of them. Right?  ::)

Well if there is anyone who going to make the Hegemony have to planetcracking to solve the border issue, I will vote for TT >:D

You do have a point...


EDIT: Truetanker, I see no maintenance costs in that budget you posted. I treat your recruitment/training/etc. spending as being maintenance for gameplay purposes(since crew costs are what a big chunk of the maintenance budget is for), so you're not just letting your ships rot, but you may want to keep an eye on what sort of maintenance ratio that'd imply.

[truetanker]

As I'm just a Periphry realm, if it ain't broke, why fix it? But will keep in mind the maintenance thing in the future! Thought I did run something along those lines....  To late to add .500 M as maintenance? I got like 4 something billion budget wise this turn.

Thanks for the vote of confidence, Doc!

TT

[Alsadius]

As I'm just a Periphry realm, if it ain't broke, why fix it? But will keep in mind the maintenance thing in the future! Thought I did run something along those lines....  To late to add .500 M as maintenance? I got like 4 something billion budget wise this turn.

You can edit your turn until the turn is resolved, but I'll ask that you try to keep it minor once every player's turn is in. Right now Kiviar still hasn't posted his, so I'm still only outlining the turn instead of writing it up in full. A maintenance change right now isn't a problem.

That said, I will ask that you use percentages(not dollars) for your maintenance when possible. There's a big difference between decent maintenance on your fleet versus decent maintenance on the Terran fleet.

[Smegish]

*Pokes Kiviar with the Cattleprod of Awakening™*

Get on with it Feddie!  ;D

[Kiviar]

*Pokes Kiviar with the Cattleprod of Awakening™*

Get on with it Feddie!  ;D

Alsadius is just using me as a scapegoat, he has had my turn since about 2 hours after the last turn's resolution.

[Kiviar]

Federated Suns Turn 4 2381-2390

The 2380s were a lean time for the Federated Suns Navy. The Nation's economy had been nearly crippled by the disastrous reign of Eiten Davion and few on New Avalon wanted to risk what little influence they had with the new president defending an organization which had, apart from two notable actions, spent the last ten years sitting on their hands. Because of this, all proposed procurement was unceremoniously canceled, and only the most critical programs were allowed to continue.

Despite the cutbacks, the new president did show considerable support to the Navy. In 2382 he appointed Admiral Michael Hasek to the Navy Board. While this was an obvious political move to appease the anti-spinward worlds in the wake of the Covington incident, the admiral actually proved to be a very effective administrator. With the President's support he enacted a series of reforms which gutted the Navy of much of the parasitic bloat which had grown during Eiten's reign.

This wad not austerity for austerity's sake however. With tensions between the Capellan Confederation, and, much more worryingly, the Terran Hegemony quickly rising, both the President and Admiralty knew that for the Federation to maintain its edge against its neighbors, significant investments to the Federation's infrastructure were imperative.

Turn

Administration
Budget - 98
Upkeep - 16.4

R&D
None

Construction

Shipyards
Layover 2 - 10

Ships
1x Crucis - 11.7
1x Galahad - 10.8
5x Robinson - 39.9

Stations
2x Northumberland-station - 2
10x Barghest-station - 0.7

Misc
5x Lt Dropship - 1.5
25x Sm Craft - 0.25
760x Fighter - 3.8

Research & Other
Research - 40 - 0.04
Fleet repairs - 2
Prize + 1

[DOC_Agren]

okay know I'm just a lurker, but isn't that a lvl 2 yard?

Nope, level 3.

My Bad :(

and the Maal has no Anti-meteor weapons just incase it happens to be at the wrong place wrong time?

Most civilian BT ships don't. Sensors and engines are usually better for that, and any piece of debris too big to hit is probably too big to blow up with an AC/5.

Well, I will give you that but even the Invader has LL or PPC for that role, and given they are making a nice passenger liner thought it might like protection of Anti-meteor weapons just incase

When it can do as in Canon, I kills it with my Battleships  :thumbsup:

Ah, so that's the THN doctrine. NPPCs are anti-fighter weapons as long as you have enough of them. Right?  ::)

:thumbsup: >:D :brew:

Well if there is anyone who going to make the Hegemony have to planetcracking to solve the border issue, I will vote for TT >:D

You do have a point...

Thanks for the vote of confidence, Doc!

TT

See I knew you all see my point :thumbsup: