Different matt (matte?) varnishes

[Cull]

I have a "hero" lance for a Classic/AToW campaign starting Saturday. Each player runs one BattleMech, and the minis will be seeing a lot of tabletop action. I've read about varnishes and have some in the inventory, but in a year of painting and playing I haven't used them. The two I have currently are Vallejo and Army Painter, both matts. Vallejo bottle says to apply with an airbrush, but I brush on everything, even primer. See below details and attached pic of the lance in question for potentially relevant information.

My question is, can anyone with experience using either Vallejo and/or AP matt varnish recommend one over the other? Follow up, are there any mistakes to avoid when brushing on? Some of the most comprehensive internet advice I've found (thin with a ton of water before applying, dab with a loaded brush instead of literally brushing) is ten years old and I imagine formulas may have changed in that time. Over all I'm happy with how the lance has turned out and I think my players are going to flip when they see their starter 'Mechs for the first time, so I don't want to take unnecessary risks chasing perfection. Any and all suggestions are welcome.

- primer Vallejo black, brushed on
- base coated AP olive drab acrylic, two layers
- all over wash of AP military shade
- dry brush of AP olive drab mixed with AP matt white, both acrylic
- detail work in AP deep grey acrylic
- cockpit glass AP carmine dragon speed paint over AP shining silver acrylic
- hex bases in AP skeleton bone acrylic

[Daryk]

Sorry I can't help you with the varnish, but those look GOOD! :)

[jairb]

Are you planning to brush or airbrush?

For airbrush I really like the AMMO of Mig Jimenez varnishes.  I've used their Gloss, Satin, Matt and Ultra Matt.

For brush on, you could likely use almost any acrylic varnish.  Vallejo work fine as do less expensive brands like Liquitex.

[Cull]

Thanks Daryk!

For brush on, you could likely use almost any acrylic varnish.  Vallejo work fine as do less expensive brands like Liquitex.

Brushing on, so good to hear this. I've been told that a lot of matt varnishes are less "matt" than advertised, but if that's the price of admission, oh well.

[Lorcan Nagle]

I use Vallejo matt but it's getting hard to find over here so I'm switching to AK, which is at least as good and is gettable at retail in my city.

[worktroll]

Humbrol Acrylic Matt is my go-to. Reliable, doesn't need minutes of shaking, and provides a very matt finish. But can be hard to get.

Citadel's Munitorium varnish is slightly semi-matt, but also very reliable. Sometimes semi-matt works better, otherwise the mini gets a light coat of Humbrol on top to go full matt.

[ISD]

I have been relying on Vallejo's matt, but got a fresh bottle of AK's ultra matt just to try it out. That one worked just nicely on a 1:35 PzIVf2

[Cull]

Well, Saturday's game had to be postponed due to a last-minute scheduling problem, so now I have another six weeks to figure out how I want to seal these guys up. This weekend I may use the Wasp as a test model for either Vallejo or AP and report back.

[House Davie Merc]

I use Vallejo Acrylic Gloss Varnish Spray over the paint job.
Then I add any water slide decals.
Then I respray with Vallejo Acrylic Matt Varnish spray.

The only time I ever brush on varnish is for something specific
such as covering a large decal or when I want to add gloss over
the top of something I want shiny. ( Such as a window)

If you don't want to or can't use the rattle cans then I would highly
suggest using distilled water to thin it with.
Tap water commonly has contaminants and additives that you don't
want in your Varnish or paint.

[MarauderD]

Ok.  My preferred flat clear rattle can brand is no longer for sale at the local hardware store.  I have two finished minis ready to be “de glossed.”  I have two options. 

1.  I have a can of testors dullcote which I’ve tried to use once and there was too much particulate white matter in the result.  (I need to shake for 4 minutes to not have this happen, or so I've read.)

2. Vallejo acrylic Matt varnish that I would have to brush on. 

Suggestions?  I'm open to either, but don't want to ruin the FWLM Griffin and Hunchback I just finished.....

[worktroll]

I'd consider the brush on. If you're only doing two, the labour isn't that extensive.

Yes, I do 36 or so at a go, and a can is definitely a time-saver there.

Alternatively, cash up & try Citadel Munitorium sealer - it's slightly satin, but very reliable.

Just a note re the Dullcote - I had similar experiences. Yes, it needs massive shaking, and it's also seeming more sensitive to warmth & humidity. I found I got frosting if the relative humidity was high; so if you're in Nevada or Arizona, try the dullcote ;)

[House Davie Merc]

Just a note re the Dullcote - I had similar experiences. Yes, it needs massive shaking, and it's also seeming more sensitive to warmth & humidity. I found I got frosting if the relative humidity was high; so if you're in Nevada or Arizona, try the dullcote ;)

Furry minis are a negative learning experience, but a lesson you learn from the first time!

[worktroll]

The other thing I've found is, that another coat under optimal conditions (warm & dry) makes the frosting go away.

[MarauderD]

The other thing I've found is, that another coat under optimal conditions (warm & dry) makes the frosting go away.

I’m in Northern California, supposed to be 84 degrees and 35% humidity at lunchtime.  I’ll give the dullcote a shot and report back with pics this weekend.

[greywolf79]

I’d go with Vallejo since it’s easier to control with a brush. Waiting for the pics Marauder, my cousin is from N Cali and he uses only Vallejo.

[MarauderD]

Ok, here is a pic:


On the left, we have a Treb and Wolverine that I used Testor's Dullcote last weekend.  Warmed up can for 5 minutes in warm water, and shook for 4 minutes before using.  Weather was very dry:  80 degrees Fahrenheit and 30% humidity.  Used a thin coat, but noticed some continued sheen.  Did a second very thin coat the next day.

On the right, we have a Griffin and Hunchback that I still need to base.  I used the last bit of my Krylon Fusion Flat Clear Sealer on it.  Shook can for about 30 seconds, and did two thin coats, spaced only 2 minutes apart.

At least to the naked eye, and in the pics, the Krylon Fusion is just as matt as the Dullcote.  Also WAY easier and less stressful to use.  Like most people, I have 0 desire to ruin a mini with the frosted effect. 

Since I'm now out of the Krylon Fusion and almost out of the Dullcote, I'll be trying brush on matt sealer for the next batch that'll probably get done in December at this rate.   

[Teejay75]

I live in Alabama, with notorious humidity levels. I've used Testor's dullcote in the past on 40K models and have had problems with frosting. I've never had used the Vallejo so I can't speak to that. Since I've gotten into Battletech, I've used Army Painter matt varnish exclusively and it's been great. I've not heated the cans or any other special preparations. Just walked outside into the sauna that is my yard and shook the can for about 10-15 seconds. I've yet to have any frosting issues. It tends to dry quickly too.