Fortifications, trenches and other static defenses

[grimlock1]

Which is why I and other artillery folks have talked about fire patterns & FDCs which are HQs for their fire.  Its also why density of fires is part of proper artillery doctrine.  Give me a platoon of veteran gunners and there will not be easy holes in a 8 hex triangle, with more tubes I can expand the blocked area.

You're right about needing multiple batteries. Battletech always seems to err low on the side of scale.  1 or 2 tubes of anything just isn't decisive.

But I was actually arguing from the opposite side.  You can exploit the safe zones in your own artillery scatter to operate closer to the beaten zone.

[Tangoforone]

I made that error in my force composition.  I have a couple Marksman Tanks (literally two) and I should probably have tripled that for it to be effective. 

[Colt Ward]

You're right about needing multiple batteries. Battletech always seems to err low on the side of scale.  1 or 2 tubes of anything just isn't decisive.

But I was actually arguing from the opposite side.  You can exploit the safe zones in your own artillery scatter to operate closer to the beaten zone.

Well, its more that I would like a supporting veh- like a APC- with 4t or 6t of ComGear to give multiple tubes the ability to 'pattern' fire rather than the +1 Init or whatever.  So I have 3 Thumpers, I put them in a triangle with a single hex from each impact point so the center hex gets splash damage from all 3 shots.  The center hex would be the center of fire . . . and since the FDC makes sure all the guns are at the same azimuth, bearing & charge when they fire.  Roll once for TH, roll once for scatter, and that is where the rounds come down together.

[Daryk]

I'm thinking that six being the right number of tubes in the real world just might be reflected in the rules (probably by accident, but possibly on purpose).

[grimlock1]

Well, its more that I would like a supporting veh- like a APC- with 4t or 6t of ComGear to give multiple tubes the ability to 'pattern' fire rather than the +1 Init or whatever.  So I have 3 Thumpers, I put them in a triangle with a single hex from each impact point so the center hex gets splash damage from all 3 shots.  The center hex would be the center of fire . . . and since the FDC makes sure all the guns are at the same azimuth, bearing & charge when they fire.  Roll once for TH, roll once for scatter, and that is where the rounds come down together.

You can do that?  Cool!

[dgorsman]

I don't think that's in Tac Ops, last I saw something like that was in the Tactical Handbook. It has a few artillery goodies like walking fire.

[Colt Ward]

No, no such rule exists afaik.  What I said was it SHOULD like the init bonus.  Its a whole unit used to coordinate fire, which is what it does and has been a principle for the last couple hundred years (depending on force).  Its gone from making sure the guns all have the same T&E (traverse & elevation) & powder weight to in modern times knowing what the condition of the air you are firing through is so the proper settings can be selected.

And 6 'guns' is not the real world 'right number' . . . a whole long string of variables exist for what is 'right' and in fact the trend since . . . the 70s?  has been to decrease the number of guns in firing platoons & batteries.

[Daryk]

Anybody have a Charlie 6 spotlight handy to shine into the sky?  ::)

[Colt Ward]

Well, we were both artillery . . . and I can tell you its happened- my unit was 8 inchers- not sure how many tubes they had per platoon but they changed out to MLRS before the Gulf War and they had 3x3 for that . . . it was determined 9 'guns' was overkill, after the Gulf War they dropped to 2x3.

[Daryk]

So... 2x3 = 6?  ???

[Cannonshop]

The chance of blue-on-blue creates a confluence that can be exploited by either side. Either you trust in Fortuna, and drop the arty in close to your forces and push the other fellow around, or you play it safe and stay out of scatter range of the your target hexes. Then the opponent has to ask themselves, "Do I want to try running through the rain drops?"  In which case, an aggressive opponent can seize the initiative, lower case 'i,' not capital 'I,' and sprint across the field.

On the other hand, there are safe spots in the artillery scatter pattern. Look at TO pg 183, for the radius diagram.  It's not the scatter diagram but it's good enough.  Say Hex X is the target, as long as you aren't firing cruise missiles or HE Long Toms, hexes 0908, 1308, 0902, and 1302 are safe from friendly fire. As you expand to a 6 hex radius, these safe zones widen out. Even if are using HE Long Tom, by the time you are 2 hexes away, it's only 5 damage.   So it's possible to time you movement and your firings so that your units are either totally safe, or not in danger of taking an Arrow IV to the back of the head.

With TacOps scatter rules, 'close' is "on the same map".  (heh, you can even theoretically land your artillery behind the artillery guns firing it-at range!)  BMR rules had about a 12 hex radius of 'danger close', Tacops' stacking scatter rolls makes the whole map useless to your own side if you're bombarding it *(You're actually MORE likely to hit your own forces, and also far more likely to hit something of zero value, than the enemy, or the enemy's positions.)

[Colt Ward]

Cannonshop, that has not been the case for artillery scatter for years, it got errata'd

[Col Toda]

6 Artillary seams decisive at that number about 10 percent of misses accidentally hit a target on scatter ..
 Put a recon camera on every unit you can afford to . That might provide a spotter w/o eating targeting shooting penaties . Worth looking up as it is available in All Eras .

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

c3 does not require LoS so you can do all kinds of evil things with it

That was errated years ago.  C3 systems do require LOS now.

[Colt Ward]

It got changed back

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

When did that happen?

[Colt Ward]

Was it with BMM?  I know it raised a lot of questions . . . and hey!  The Beagle (C3i) become valuable again!