TW Skill Modifier to ATOW

[Zyllos]

Maybe I am mathematically ignorant, but why on pg 202 for "Converting Skill Modifiers" does the ATOW book say:

To adapt any relevant Action modifiers from Total Warfare to A Time of War, simply subtract the Total Warfare modifier from the Action Check roll, rather than adding it to the target number.

Would it not be best to just say "Add all skill modifiers in TW to the TN for ATOW."?

If my TN value was 8, with a skill of 0 for Gunnery/Mech with 0/0 for Link skills, my range was Medium, would it not be best to just add the TW modifier of +2 for Medium range to your TN value of your ATOW character for a roll of 2d6 + 0 / TN:10? Is this not exactly the same as 2d6 - 2 / TN:8?

[Maelwys]

I'm not sure if the numbers work out the same (a quick check indicates an average roll would have the same margin of success/failure, but I'm not sure if it applies at all points, especially when it comes to things like Natural Aptitude), but there's a much simpler answer.

And that's because ATOW works on a fixed TN system. Its core mechanic is that you don't change the target number. The TN is always fixed, and its always the roll itself that is modified, whether you're making a Skill Roll or an Attribute check.

So to keep the core mechanic, rather than changing it up for certain situations, when it comes to TW modifiers, you subtract them from the roll, to keep the same mechanic across the RPG.

There is an instance when the Target Number itself is modified, and that's the phenotype bonus for Clan characters, but even that's just changing the base TN forever, rather than modifying it each roll (a matter of semantics I know, but there you have it, and it keeps the core of "fixed TN")

[Zyllos]

I'm not sure if the numbers work out the same (a quick check indicates an average roll would have the same margin of success/failure, but I'm not sure if it applies at all points, especially when it comes to things like Natural Aptitude), but there's a much simpler answer.

And that's because ATOW works on a fixed TN system. Its core mechanic is that you don't change the target number. The TN is always fixed, and its always the roll itself that is modified, whether you're making a Skill Roll or an Attribute check.

So to keep the core mechanic, rather than changing it up for certain situations, when it comes to TW modifiers, you subtract them from the roll, to keep the same mechanic across the RPG.

There is an instance when the Target Number itself is modified, and that's the phenotype bonus for Clan characters, but even that's just changing the base TN forever, rather than modifying it each roll (a matter of semantics I know, but there you have it, and it keeps the core of "fixed TN")

Ok, I will keep that in mind.

I did some checks of just modifying the TN in Excel to see if the numbers worked out but I did not go into details with Traits, like Natural Aptitude, like you said.

The reason why I ask is because it feels odd to have to flip the sign (multiply by -1) on all values in TW before adding it to the ATOW skill roll.

Maybe a better question to ask, is all TW modifiers the same across ATOW for the same action? Long Range is a -6 modifier to rolls in ATOW, which is the same for TW for Long Range, a +6 modifier to Ballistic Skill? Of course, this is something I can look myself.

Thanks for the info.

[Maelwys]

The reason why I ask is because it feels odd to have to flip the sign (multiply by -1) on all values in TW before adding it to the ATOW skill roll.

Technically you're not. You're just subtracting the modifier from the skill roll. So you either wind up subtracting a positive (which reduces the roll) or you're subtracting a negative (which winds up increasing the roll).

You get the same result as flipping the sign/multiplying by -1, its just...semantics again :)

Maybe a better question to ask, is all TW modifiers the same across ATOW for the same action? Long Range is a -6 modifier to rolls in ATOW, which is the same for TW for Long Range, a +6 modifier to Ballistic Skill? Of course, this is something I can look myself.

Thanks for the info.

I believe all the modifies are the same. I know they are for ranges (+0/+2/+4/+6) and (-0/-2/-4/-6). The only difference is that ATOW has a point-blank option that TW doesn't have in the basic rules.