'Mech of the Week: LI-O Vandal

[Diplominator]

LI-O Vandal
65-ton Inner Sphere OmniMech
Source: Technical Readout: 3145 Capellan Confederation

"Beep boop. Kill all FedSuns. Beep boop."

This week's subject is the LI-O Vandal, the Capellan Confederation's new heavy cavalry OmniMech. The Vandal is a dedicated pack hunter crammed with powerful electronics, including Boosted C3. The Boosted C3 is of particular interest because the Capellans don't use it anywhere but the Vandal (with a few possible exceptions I'll get to later), so if you see one, there's probably at least three more.

What's the base chassis like?

The basic Vandal chassis is pretty solid. It's 65 tons, so on the lower end of heavy, with a 325 XL engine to move it at 5/8 and a supercharger in the left torso to give it short bursts of additional speed. Potentially very short, if you roll badly, so be careful with it. On the other hand, don't forget it's there. Those two extra MP can be essential for getting to a specific range not just for one Vandal, but a whole lance or company.

Defensively, the Vandal has some good parts and bad parts. It features a torso-mounted cockpit, so it won't die to random head hits. For my part, I don't think the piloting penalty is worth it, especially since it still dies to side torso destruction, but they probably went with the plans they had. More on that later, too. The armor is an even 200 points of standard plate, within a ton of the maximum, arranged fairly intelligently. The arms are the only front locations with less than twenty points, the precious center torso can take a pair of 15-point hits without going internal, and the rear armor is a bit thicker than usual. It's still not great, but it's helpful for the close-ranged brawls that Vandals are likely to initiate, where it's hard to avoid giving something a shot at your rear.

Finally, there's some fixed CASE II in the right torso. In principle, I don't like fixing equipment that doesn't have to be fixed, but I'm pretty okay with them saying, hey, how about we don't EVER have a situation where an ammo explosion takes out the side torso, and by extension the whole 'Mech? Why don't we try that? All the configurations end up using it, anyway.

Configurations, you say?

Yup, three of them. After the torso-mounted cockpit, supercharger, and CASE II, it's got 26.5 tons to work with, which is usable but not spectacular. Unfortunately, a lot of the tonnage gets squandered with some really questionable choices.

The basic LI-O Vandal mounts a RAC-5 and an ER small laser in the right arm, a large VSP laser in the left arm, and a Boosted C3 slave and an Angel ECM suite in the head. The RAC only has two tons of ammo, so you're limited to three- or four-round bursts if you want to make it last for at least ten turns of firing. That's about as much as I like to risk using, anyway, so it's not a huge deal. What is a huge deal is the VSP, which is I think about the worst weapon to use with C3, since the Vandal can't fit a Heavy Gauss Rifle. See, the VSP's whole deal is that it does a lot more damage and is much more accurate if you're close. C3's whole deal is pretending to be close without actually being close, but the VSP can tell the difference. Using over a third of the pod space on a gun that doesn't work with one of your chassis' main distinguishing characteristics is not a recipe for success. I really kinda like the idea of VSPs on a heavy cav design, since it wouldn't have trouble getting close and the accuracy boost means you can run and gun with no problems, but it's like putting some really great barbecue sauce on a tin of Altoids. Not all good things are good together.

The LI-OA is quite a bit better. First off, it jumps. Only four hexes, but the additional maneuverability is handy for the weakest link in the C3 net. It's got the Boosted C3 Master, which means there's pretty much going to be be at least one of them in any Vandal lance. That goes in the right arm, which makes it more vulnerable but also gives a wider field of fire for the integral TAG. The Capellans have all sorts of uses for TAG, so I'm prepared to forgive the vulnerability. There's also a Laser AMS in the left arm, probably either an attempt to keep the C3 safer (except, y'know, that's not how the missile hit rules work, but don't tell the Capellans) or for the better field of fire when using the LAMS in last-ditch-direct-fire-offensive-weapon mode. The right torso houses an SRM-4 and a ton of ammo, which is a useful enough crit-seeker, especially with C3 support. The left arm has the best part: a heavy PPC with a capacitor. This thing is about as good a choice as the VSPL on the primary configuration is bad. The C3 Master should be towards the back anyway, so this gives it all the reason in the world to hide for a turn, charge up, wait for its lancemates to give it a great shot, then supercharger out and smack something with a 20-point hit. I don't think you can ask for much more from a maneuverable C3 Master.

The LI-OB...it's weird. Maybe not in a bad way, but not really in a particularly good way, either. The head has the same electronics as the primary configuration: a Boosted slave and Angel ECM. The right arm has an ER flamer, which is nice for killing infantry and the added range makes for more opportunities for the C3 to help. It's also got a medium vibroblade, which is a pretty big investment at five tons, but one I'm okay with. It does ten points of damage when activated, and the Capellans' main foes in the Federated Suns have started using laser-reflective armor on a few designs. Laser-reflective armor will counter a lot of a Vandal lance's bag of tricks, but risking doubled damage from a medium vibroblade on a very fast heavy is probably a pretty unattractive prospect to most FedSuns MechWarriors. Except, of course, Gunsmith pilots, since I'm pretty sure they are recruited exclusively from the emotionally disturbed, the criminally insane, and the NAIS Cadres. Moving on, there's an MML-5 in the right torso with three (!) tons of ammo. One for LRMs, one for SRMs, and one for your choice of cruel and unusual specialty ammo. There's always something to shoot at when you have Thunder-Augmented! The left arm has TAG, which is good, and a snub-nosed PPC, which is not as good. Traditionally, SNPPCs are actually pretty nice on C3 spotters, but that's because they can be in short range for their teammate's LRMs and gauss rifles and what have you while staying outside an ECM bubble. Well, that MML-5 is the longest-ranged gun on any Vandal, Boosted C3 is immune to most ECM, and the Angel suite can ECCM other Angels. On top of that, the SNPPC loses damage with actual, not effective range, just like the VSPL. It's less offensive since it doesn't have an accuracy bonus to lose, and the LI-OB should be right next to stuff anyway, but still. Not ideal. The left torso has a targeting computer for the SNPPC. Probably not a great use of tonnage but the accuracy is nice when you're running all the time. Last, there's a mine dispenser in the right torso, using the last half ton for the ability to place a couple ten-point minefields. I don't see that being a real game-changer, but, what the heck, it's half a ton.

Those sure are some weird configurations...

Remind you of a Celestial, a little bit?

Whoa, hey...

Now, I'll admit I didn't come up with this on my own. I talked to the designer of the stats, the one and only Jal Phoenix, who told me that it was supposed to be based on Celestial plans. Now, this isn't necessarily official, since the fluff doesn't say anything about it, but the art looks pretty Celestial, there's a pretty glaring lack of a heavy cavalry design in the Celestials that did get made, and the fluff doesn't contradict the idea at all. It just says "based on long-abandoned schematics". It doesn't say who abandoned them. Besides, the Capellans did it before with the Yao Lien.

Think about it, though. All the goofiest stuff makes complete sense. The torso-mounted cockpit. The VSPL. The melee weapon. That's all standard-issue Blakist crazy. The configurations don't use the C3 to the fullest potential because it originally had C3i and all it needed to do was be a spotter. That's why all three configurations are close-to-medium range.

So, how do I use it?

Well, right off the bat, I should say that I think the answer is "you don't". From the first time I looked at it and really paid attention, the Vandal looked to me like the sort of thing you fight against. It's the high-level enemy that has some annoying tricks and strengths but can ultimately be overcome. To the brave Player Characters of the Federated Suns, it is the hobgoblin to the Gùn's goblin. I could be way off base, but that's how it felt to me.

However, that's a totally unsatisfying answer, especially if you're the Capellans. I'm sure eventually we'll get some more configs for it (in-universe, it is a really new design, so it's not all that surprising that only three configurations exist), and when we do there will be plenty of options open to it and it will be a perfectly wonderful heavy OmniMech. Until then, I do have some tips and tricks.

First of all, there's the question of how many you want to use, and with what. I really can't advise using any less than a full lance. The Boosted C3 isn't used to the fullest potential, but the Vandal uses a lot of tonnage on it, so it'd be a shame to ignore it completely. So, you need an LI-OA and some combination of three LI-Os and LI-OBs. I'd recommend two and one, respectively. That gives a usable blend of range, firepower, TAG, and melee damage. If you use a whole company, I'd use two lances like that and a 2 LI-OA/ 2 LI-OB company command lance so the whole company has four of each configuration.

Next, you'll definitely want something to take advantage of all the TAG. The Capellans have all kinds of 'Mechs and vehicles that can use Semi-Guided LRMs or Arrow IV. Grab some of those. Capellans often augment lances with some hovertanks, so Arrow IV Regulators or Stygians with SG LRMs would not be amiss.

There's one last point on what to use with Vandals: remember how I said there were exceptions to "Capellans don't use Boosted C3 except on the Vandal" and that I'd get to them later? Later is now. As far as I can tell, there are three 'Mechs with Boosted C3 definitely available to the Capellans, and one that's potentially available. There's the Strider M, which carries two Boosted C3 Masters. That's not so useful because the Vandal with the Master is the one that's actually good, and because two Boosted C3 Masters is all the Strider M carries. More useful are the Sunders F and G, both brimming with Clan tech and Boosted C3 Slaves. These I could actually see using with Vandals, which could benefit from the range of the F or the raw firepower of the G. They're even OmniMechs, so they can swap pods and everything. That's actually probably pretty close to how the WoB intended the proto-Vandal to be used anyway. The last possibility is the the LGB-14C2 Longbow. It's from 3145 NTNU, so we don't have MUL availabilities yet, but StarCorps built the original LGB-14C in the Capellan Confederation. On St. Ives. Where they also build the Vandal. So, y'know, I'd say the odds are pretty good that the Capellans have access to the LGB-14C2. It's a nice 'Mech, too. Six MML-9s and the heat sinks to fire four of them.

Now, as for using the Vandal in a fight, the main advice is to combine fire as much as possible. The C3 helps with that a lot; even separated a bit all the 'Mechs in a lance or company are gonna have similar odds to hit a given target. Vandals have accurate but largely unimpressive firepower, so go after whatever will die the fastest and try to degrade the enemy as quickly as possible. Vandals have an advantage over a lot of pack hunters in that they don't care if an opponent stands still. That messes with a lot of them, since they have to accept a lower defensive movement modifier to stay with their target, or pick a different target, but Vandals just need one thing sticking with the target, so the rest can mill about wherever gets them shot the least as long as they remain in line of sight of the target.

If you've got indirect fire support, TAG everything you can; even a few Arrow IV tubes in the area will greatly increase a Vandal lance's firepower. Also, the Vandal has a pretty cool advantage in that its C3 is basically impossible to jam if you are paying any attention at all. It can't be jammed it at all without Angel, and every Vandal lance has two or three units that can use Angel ECCM right back. It would probably take two or three Angel ECMs all in the same spot to bring the network down without killing the Master. Even then, so what? It's not like they use it all that effectively, anyway, right?

I'm a brave Player Character of the Federated Suns, how do I blow it up?

That's gonna take a little doing, but it'll be reasonably straightforward. They're gonna be fast, so you're gonna want to have some good pilots, some accuracy bonuses (VSPLs would actually be a decent choice in fighting them), or just don't move around too much.  Don't do the last one if they have stuff to TAG for, and recognize that you probably won't get them to stop moving or shooting you, which is kind of unfair.

None of the Vandals run all that hot, but they also don't carry much more than the base ten heat sinks, so if you can smack them with infernos or plasma weapons, fifteen heat is a huge amount of their total dissipation. This will reduce their firepower, and it's good way to slow them down a little so you can smack them with something nasty.

Don't even try to use C3 against them; it'll probably be dead tonnage against that much Angel.

Don't try to use laser-reflective armor against them. It's tempting because of how well it blocks the lasers and PPCs, but the LI-OBs will cut you to ribbons and then feed you the ribbons.

Do try to outrange them if you've got the speed to stay at range. None of the Vandals have especially impressive range. The Vulpes will give Vandals fits because it badly outranges them and it's just as fast. Of course, play the "I have speed and Clan ER large lasers, neener neener" game too long and you may find yourself without a lot of friends. Or spleens.

Sounds good. I'll go do those things.

Yeah, get on that, before you lose the entire Capellan March.


That concludes this week's MotW! Feel free to discuss the Vandal, how weird the configs are, how you used it just fine anyway, how much sense it would make if it was originally a Celestial design, how some obscure bit of canon I overlooked proves that it's not and that fun is a lie, that sort of thing. Maybe don't discuss how custom configurations would make it better, because, A) duh, B) I think that sort of thing is discouraged in Fan Articles anyway, and C) duh.

[Grey]

Yeah, when I first read about this one I thought it was just plain weird, then I wondered if it was the kind of weird that works.

Aside from the A the weapons that don't gain any benefit from the C3 make a strange sense in that they'll encourage the pilots to close to get the most out of them, making it a heavy point 'Mech in the network. And the A may be an attempt to make a C3 command unit configured in such a way to discourage active participation in combat, that is the weapons are present only for defensive purposes. I guess I'm rambling a bit here trying to make sense of it.

The Celestial link is somewhat obvious in hindsight, and also makes the odd configurations. So does the idea that this is the Capellans trying to be innovative with warfare, which has worked well for them since the 3060s, by maybe going a step too far?

[Maelwys]

I don't mind the Large VSP that much. I just assumed the Prime wasn't supposed to stay at range. It was more of a short/medium range Brawler, dancing in the short and medium range brackets of the VSP, rather than relying on the C3 system. They're the spotter.

Of course, that's probably the issue with all the Vandal variants. They seem all geared towards that short and medium range bracket ,rather than having something dedicated to long range that could make use of the weapon.

As for the Celestial link, it wouldn't be the first time the Capellans used a Blakist design, but it seems pretty unlikely they were going to get a Celestial design...maybe its a Blakist design from the same place as the Yao Lien? It seems unlikely that they would JUST produce the Eidolon at the Quantico base. Excess parts and "Whatever we can get" could explain the Vandal as well.

[UnLimiTeD]

A very nice high tech mech. Electronics abound, eclectic weapon choices...
Really, the only thing it lacks is a dedicated long range config so you can pick one of each for a lance.
If they would actually be spotting for something, instead of primarily themselves, even the VSPL would be a perfectly serviceable choice.
Great Article, btw.

[GreekFire]

Awesome article, dude. 10/10.

I'm not a fan of the torso-mounted cockpit...at all. At least, not for the current configurations. I can get behind a heavy cavalry unit with an XL engine, but the t-m cockpit makes the Vandal just a bit too vulnerable to crippling PSRs. Especially since it has to brawl with both of its non-master configurations.

Something that I noticed before (but that isn't really all that relevant now that the celestial link is out in the open) is how it has certain similarities with the Men Shen. They're both EW platforms, and the Vandal has roughly the same amount of podspace available to it after you account for all of the extra electronic gizmos it tacks onto every config. They both have speed-boosting technology (MASC vs Supercharger), but the Vandal trades a bit of speed for more armor and survivability (integrated CASE II vs no CASE in any Men Shen configs). It's a bit of a stretch, but the Vandal-O could be considered an upgrade for the Men Shen C and the Vandal-OA a take on the Men Shen D. And in that context, the Vandal might make a good command platform for Men Shen hunters (although you lose out on the BC3).

One way or another, its BV is way too high for what you get, and that's without accounting for its BC3 BV increase or a piloting skill to counteract the T-M cockpit. I really dislike it.

[Scotty]

I really like the Vandal, with the caveat that it should be mandatory to immediately realize that the A config is the only one that should be staying at range.  This may seem counter intuitive, but even just changing medium range to short range can be a massive force multiplier, and having what is effectively three spotters for one master means that your spotters will last significantly longer and keep the Master from being rather pointless for much longer.  It's also very handy to allow the B config to swap between missile munitions to get the best possible modifier.  Under nine hexes, let loose with (effectively) point blank SRM fire.  Outside nine hexes, let loose with (effectively) short range LRM fire.  The distance from your target, not the distance the spotter is from the target, determines in large part your tactics in a way that we really only see in other Vandal configs.

I might need a refresher on how C3 works.  Doesn't it make the range modifier the same as if the unit were firing from the spotter's distance?  If that's true, then why the heck is a Snub-nose PPC considered good for that?  It has a long short range, which makes the spotter more dangerous, but staying at 9 hexes doesn't automatically make all your friends' LRMs short range - they'd still be medium.  You may as well mount an ER PPC for the 7 hex short range and gain immunity to damage drop off.

[GreekFire]

I might need a refresher on how C3 works.  Doesn't it make the range modifier the same as if the unit were firing from the spotter's distance?  If that's true, then why the heck is a Snub-nose PPC considered good for that?  It has a long short range, which makes the spotter more dangerous, but staying at 9 hexes doesn't automatically make all your friends' LRMs short range - they'd still be medium.  You may as well mount an ER PPC for the 7 hex short range and gain immunity to damage drop off.

Right. But the ERPPC is not a brawling weapon, while the SNPPC is. It's kind of like saying "why bother with a medium pulse laser when you can just get a LPPC and get a gain a bunch more range". I mean, if you're using ERPPCs you might as well just hang back and not spot for a c3 link.

The other thing the SNPPC works well at is avoiding counter-fire, not just the ECM bubble. If you're spotting at 9 hexes, sure, your allies might be at medium range - but your target will also be at medium range if it targets you. It lets your lance-mates avoid the 2 points of long-range targeting modifiers, and keep your spotter alive that much longer while reliably dealing damage.

[Scotty]

The difference between a brawling weapon and a not brawling weapon is the range you're at the turn you fire it.  With an ER, you trade a small bit of short range (that only helps you, not your teammates), can still stay out of ECM, and have a much more reliable attack when your target is not in short range.  For a traditional C3 spotter, this would not be a problem because they're generally pretty speedy.  The Vandal is fast for its weight, not in general or with any reliability.  Seven hexes is still medium range for a huge number of weapons out there, and still manages the critical threshold of being in long range for the ubiquitous 3/6/9 close range weapons.

The other thing the SNPPC works well at is avoiding counter-fire, not just the ECM bubble. If you're spotting at 9 hexes, sure, your allies might be at medium range - but your target will also be at medium range if it targets you. It lets your lance-mates avoid the 2 points of long-range targeting modifiers, and keep your spotter alive that much longer while reliably dealing damage.

You get literally the exact same thing with an ER PPC.  The difference is you trade two hexes of your short range (not your teammates' who are generally firing at the same TNs between 7 and 9 hexes regardless) in exchange for the ability to do damage at all outside of 15 hexes, and the ability to deal full damage to targets outside of 9 hexes.

Don't get me wrong, the SN PPC is still a great weapon for what it does.  I just question the SN PPC as the golden standard of C3 spotter weapons, because having a huge short range like that isn't really beneficial to your C3 group, only to the spotter.  Which is almost entirely the opposite thing a spotter is typically going for.

[GreekFire]

The difference between a brawling weapon and a not brawling weapon is the range you're at the turn you fire it.  With an ER, you trade a small bit of short range (that only helps you, not your teammates), can still stay out of ECM, and have a much more reliable attack when your target is not in short range.  For a traditional C3 spotter, this would not be a problem because they're generally pretty speedy.  The Vandal is fast for its weight, not in general or with any reliability.  Seven hexes is still medium range for a huge number of weapons out there, and still manages the critical threshold of being in long range for the ubiquitous 3/6/9 close range weapons.

The issue I have is the additional range of the ERPPC costs 5 heat and 1 ton...all for something that you don't need on a traditional spotting platform.
I'm also talking about the weapon in general, since your original post mentioned the SNPPC in general. Whether or not it's a good choice for the Vandal is another story.

You get literally the exact same thing with an ER PPC.  The difference is you trade two hexes of your short range (not your teammates' who are generally firing at the same TNs between 7 and 9 hexes regardless) in exchange for the ability to do damage at all outside of 15 hexes, and the ability to deal full damage to targets outside of 9 hexes.

Yes, that's exactly right. The SNPPC is a good spotter weapon - because you get a longer short range for the spotting platform. The long range issue isn't a big deal for me, since I don't expect my spotters to be active at 15+ hexes away from any targets.

Don't get me wrong, the SN PPC is still a great weapon for what it does.  I just question the SN PPC as the golden standard of C3 spotter weapons, because having a huge short range like that isn't really beneficial to your C3 group, only to the spotter.  Which is almost entirely the opposite thing a spotter is typically going for.

If your opponent has a ton of Gauss Rifles, ERPPCs and the like (short range 7 weapons are a dime a dozen), then staying out at slightly farther ranges will be beneficial for your c3 network as a whole. Spotters are usually fragile, keeping them alive is a valuable part of getting the best out of c3. Having a higher chance of dealing damage at those slightly farther ranges is nothing but advantageous.

[THUD]

Great looking mech, messed up configurations.  I really don't get some of these new toy mechs.  Kinda reminds me of the old C3m Lau Hu, all dressed up with few friends to play with.

[Orin J.]

man, the designer went overboard on detailing all the paneling on that thing.... anyways, there's something about the Vandal i just don't like. maybe it's the relationship to the celestials shining through in the Vandal's design- the wide anguler torso, the slightly offset elbow joints, the head that looks like it was culled from a bargin-store robot toy. just doesn't speak to me.

ironically, the loadouts kind of feel like the Capellans planned these out to defeat the Capellans.

[bed123456]

I picture a lance of these as the weapon a Capellan commander unleashes to totally mess up a c3 enabled mech company or two. They are supposed to all just get in amongst the enemy mechs and use their angel ecm to break connections left and right. Their own c3 boosted platforms can ignore most end counter measures and I think is meant to let their partners better protect each other is a close range melee rather than ensuring that you are spotting for one mech to drop the hammer on the others. Topping it all off your c3 master is lobbing guided arrow iv when at all possible.

They sweep in do massive damage maybe target and kill all the opposing c3master mechs and then book it out of the battle field

[Prince of Darkness]

man, the designer went overboard on detailing all the paneling on that thing.... anyways, there's something about the Vandal i just don't like. maybe it's the relationship to the celestials shining through in the Vandal's design- the wide anguler torso, the slightly offset elbow joints, the head that looks like it was culled from a bargin-store robot toy. just doesn't speak to me.

ironically, the loadouts kind of feel like the Capellans planned these out to defeat the Capellans.

Yeah, I also think that if it was cleaned up heavily and it's cockpit was much more obvious it would look good.

[Colt Ward]

Yeah, the Cappies need a heavily MML'd config to make the most of the spotters & C3.  As said I think the Snub makes sense for being a ton lighter, longer short range and IIRC . . . no min?  Really, I would like to see a B without the melee weapon . . . sorry, but I never want my spotters in melee range- they get enough attention without letting someone else punch or God forbid kick at me.  Kicking especially, since not being able to run generally makes for a dead spotter.

Question this raises IMO is which Gen 1 or later Omnis available to the Cappies would you like to see with a BC3 config?

[cold1]

I'm too heavily a clan player to be much help here probably.

But I'll chime in anyway...
I don't get it.  I mean I understand C3 and its family of tech.  But what's the logic for this one?  It's like they're all the mid range brawler for the network.  Except, they're likely the entire network.

I actually think every confit is pretty on its own but they need long range support in the network or they don't really maximize their abilities.  It's the Dark Age, how about a master with 2 Clan ERLL's?

[Empyrus]

I actually think every confit is pretty on its own but they need long range support in the network or they don't really maximize their abilities.  It's the Dark Age, how about a master with 2 Clan ERLL's?

A Liao mech, they probably don't have quite enough Clan tech for that to be a standard configuration.

EDIT Wait, have the Cappies ever been that big fans of C3 anyway?

And RAC. VSP. Torso-mounted cockpit. Not very Liaoish mech, IMO.

[Wrangler]

Well, i like the design. The configurations are unique, I'd properly be incline to use them as lance.  I forgot about Long Bow 14C2, that helps quite a bit when you need have a buddy with longer reach.

I do look for couple more configurations to the Vandal, since it i think it needs grow in capacities little more since it's virtually on its own.  Longbow is bit slow keep up.

Thanks for the great article, Diplominator!