Author Topic: Can The FedSuns Save Itself In the iLClan Era?  (Read 32453 times)

Caesar Steiner for Archon

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Re: Can The FedSuns Save Itself In the iLClan Era?
« Reply #420 on: 05 September 2023, 16:23:32 »
MI4 and MI6 could do some damage. They are quite used to and good at destabilizing worlds, at least they were in the 31st century.

Maybe against other opponents IF the DC didn't share any intelligence. But the Combine had five years to go through every nook and cranny of MIIO's central headquarters. The entire network in DC space is compromise and will need to be rebuilt from square one.


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VensersRevenge

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Re: Can The FedSuns Save Itself In the iLClan Era?
« Reply #421 on: 05 September 2023, 16:49:25 »
Because destroying sensitive information isn't the first thing MIIO would do.
...Is this just fantasy?
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tassa_kay

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Re: Can The FedSuns Save Itself In the iLClan Era?
« Reply #422 on: 05 September 2023, 17:12:21 »
Maybe against other opponents IF the DC didn't share any intelligence. But the Combine had five years to go through every nook and cranny of MIIO's central headquarters. The entire network in DC space is compromise and will need to be rebuilt from square one.

Because destroying sensitive information isn't the first thing MIIO would do.

A little from Column B, but a lot from Column A. CSfA definitely called this one right.

Per Dominions Divided, page 121:

"The ISF stripped every MIIO facility it found of everything but office furniture, taking centuries of files (those not proactively destroyed by Suns personnel before the world fell) in one of the greatest intelligence windfalls in human history and eagerly coerced every MIIO agent that it could find on-planet to help with decoding and unlocking that treasure trove."

"The damage to MIIO's operations across the Inner Sphere is incalcuable, as spy networks and operations everywhere were unmasked by the ISF."
« Last Edit: 05 September 2023, 17:18:00 by tassa_kay »
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MoneyLovinOgre4Hire

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Re: Can The FedSuns Save Itself In the iLClan Era?
« Reply #423 on: 05 September 2023, 17:19:46 »
Given that New Avalon had been occupied in the Jihad by the Blakists, you'd think that MIIO would have had better plans in place to evacuate or destroy all sensitive information in the event of imminent invasion.
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VensersRevenge

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Re: Can The FedSuns Save Itself In the iLClan Era?
« Reply #424 on: 05 September 2023, 17:26:44 »
I forgot the perils of assuming FedSuns competence in the Dark Ages
...Is this just fantasy?
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tassa_kay

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Re: Can The FedSuns Save Itself In the iLClan Era?
« Reply #425 on: 05 September 2023, 17:43:53 »
To be fair, every faction in the game is competent until Plot demands that they not be. The FedSuns is not special in that regard. :laugh:
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Caesar Steiner for Archon

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Re: Can The FedSuns Save Itself In the iLClan Era?
« Reply #426 on: 05 September 2023, 18:07:09 »
Given that New Avalon had been occupied in the Jihad by the Blakists, you'd think that MIIO would have had better plans in place to evacuate or destroy all sensitive information in the event of imminent invasion.

Maybe they did and the ISF anticipated these plans and managed to stop them. Just having a plan isn't enough, you need to carry it out.


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BrianDavion

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Re: Can The FedSuns Save Itself In the iLClan Era?
« Reply #427 on: 05 September 2023, 23:26:38 »
Honestly the DC needs some SERIOUS karmic retribution for New Avalon. here's hoping the bears deliver it
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MoneyLovinOgre4Hire

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Re: Can The FedSuns Save Itself In the iLClan Era?
« Reply #428 on: 05 September 2023, 23:47:11 »
After Dominions Divided, I'm skeptical of the Bears' ability to deliver pizza.  The coming Dominion-Combine War looks suspiciously like the Bears are going to be kicked squarely in the family jewels.
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BrianDavion

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Re: Can The FedSuns Save Itself In the iLClan Era?
« Reply #429 on: 06 September 2023, 04:21:28 »
I mean they couldn't have chosen a more obvious way to say "the war is going to go pear shaped" then "a short victorious war" unless the Prince declared that the bears would "be home by christmas"
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Colt Ward

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Re: Can The FedSuns Save Itself In the iLClan Era?
« Reply #430 on: 06 September 2023, 09:35:02 »
I forgot the perils of assuming FedSuns competence in the Dark Ages

It is not that per se.

Intelligence operations work one way and safeguarding the operation while it goes off is pretty linear.

Analyzing intelligence- and counter-intelligence- is NOT a straight line.  Best description I can think of is that you had three blindfolded people a giant box of assorted puzzle pieces and tell them to build the blue picture from the pieces of 4 puzzles.  They cannot see the pieces, cannot see a picture of what it looks like put together, and can only discuss it with their fellows.  MIIO could destroy all the direct data but then you get the incidentals . . . Agent X's medical file shows they had the New Samarkand Flu in 3138 and had to be hospitalized for complications on Robinson.  A shipping manifest from New Avalon to Robinson in 3137 for some special Q-built gear.  Huh, what "weird" happened on New Samarkand in 3137-3138.  Oh, Luthien Armor Works senior engineer for particle accelerator designs drove his car off a cliff while skiing at a mountain resort but the investigation shows the vehicle was operating correctly and autopsy showed no foreign substances . . .

Methods & capabilities, a operator has no idea what single piece of information a investigator or analyst would need to put together the puzzle they are working on.  Knowing how MIIO managed and executed operations in the past can give clues to how they will operate in the future as well as sealing security breaches.  Consider this, a code is often times considered 'broken' when they can read 55-60% of the message which is USUALLY based on articles in the sentence, words like 'the' 'a' 'and' 'with' and other what could be considered filler.  Heck even bank records if they can identify MIIO accounts- and you can start with payrolls.  If they had the time & analysists, looking for/at places that show a ABSENCE of data- sats are routed so they are never overhead a certain place, flight plans all go around a area, city street & private security cameras never cover the entrance to X building, etc.

Intelligence analysis is always about pattern recognition and abstract thinking.  Most spy flicks totally skip over that part, Tom Clancy was the only one I know who- in his books- covered the guys in basements with thick glasses pouring over reams of paper, looking at reference books, and cross-checking other data to fill in wholes.

Then you get into all the un-authorized information that the ISF could have scooped ups . . . some agent's private memoirs recording things that were NEVER supposed to be written down.  Some government flack's insurance locked in a bank safe deposit box- which might also be a good source for blackmail on various civil service employees (Mr. Rednose, we found these interesting photos of you and this underage female in a safe deposit box.  I am pretty sure your fellow citizens might . . . question . . . your tastes if these ever became public.  We can ensure they do not as long as you . . . - bluntly this means Julian's gov't using folks on New Avalon could have a LOT of intelligence leaks.) think Statham's Bank Job movie- the illegal diary of a training officer at MIIO's equivalent of The Farm, copies of expense reports, souvenirs & photos of current & retired MIIO employees, and the long list of foibles human cogs have fallen for in intelligence operations.

No matter what MIIO did, there would be tons of information that COULD provide actionable intelligence.

MIIO literally could not clean up the whole world of data that the ISF could use.  The difficulty will be sifting through the 99% of pointless information for the single piece that will unlock the puzzle.
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monbvol

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Re: Can The FedSuns Save Itself In the iLClan Era?
« Reply #431 on: 06 September 2023, 10:02:42 »
And even then we have plenty of examples of competent agencies in the real world not always being as thorough as they should when it comes to destroying sensitive material in such emergency situations.

Geg

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Re: Can The FedSuns Save Itself In the iLClan Era?
« Reply #432 on: 06 September 2023, 11:59:57 »
Because destroying sensitive information isn't the first thing MIIO would do.

The Dracs hadn't taken New Avalon once after centuries of fighting.   Putting a plan in place, and practicing it before Caleb got iced was probably a low priority, and afterwards, unpatriotic.

Sure the Blakists pulled it off, but they had access to toys the Dracs lacked...  and Besides, VSD was watching their back keeping the Republic from ever being overtly hostile to against the FedSubs.

MoneyLovinOgre4Hire

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Re: Can The FedSuns Save Itself In the iLClan Era?
« Reply #433 on: 06 September 2023, 23:58:12 »
Oh come on, SAFE is better at contingency planning than that.
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Minemech

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Re: Can The FedSuns Save Itself In the iLClan Era?
« Reply #434 on: 07 September 2023, 06:51:22 »
Oh come on, SAFE is better at contingency planning than that.
SAFE was not so much stupid as more talented at deep analysis. While it had a history of some great exploits, not to the level of other agencies. Furthermore, it did not appear to have an MI5 equivalent. The principal reason that SAFE faltered in the Jihad was that Thomas Marik had so appendaged SAFE to ROM that it could not act as a proper CI agency. SAFE and military intelligence should have kept the fleet clean otherwise. The fact that the marines aboard those ships did nothing remains a point of contention.

 

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