BattleTech - The Board Game of Armored Combat
BattleTech Game Systems => General BattleTech Discussion => Topic started by: Mechwarriorfreak on 31 August 2011, 14:20:11
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This man never checks his personal messages does he? I sent him two at different times and I haven't gotten a response back from either. Is he some sort of an important individual or something?
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This man never checks his personal messages does he? I sent him two at different times and I haven't gotten a response back from either. Is he some sort of an important individual or something?
He's the Line Developer for Battletech.
I.e, he's head of Battletech development for Cataclyst. Above Herbie you have Randall Bills, who is the Line developer for all of Cataclyst (Leviathans, Shadowrun and Battletech etc.). Above Randall you have TOPPS, I believe, the owners.
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;D
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He's the Line Developer for Battletech.
I.e, he's head of Battletech development for Cataclyst. Randall Bills is the Line developer for all of Cataclyst (Leviathans, Shadowrun and Battletech). Above Randall you have TOPPS, I believe, the owners.
Oh. :-[ I see. So like, if I wanted a story or a mech to become canon, I'd have to go through him?
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;D
So no, not that important right Cap? :)
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More the guy who runs the kennel.
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;D
LOL sorry I didn't know......
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More the guy who runs the kennel.
Whoa. See I thought he was just another global moderator or something. I had no clue THAT was what he did....
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Oh. :-[ Like the Top Dog of top dogs?
Yup.
Those "Yellow Stars" you were arguing with earlier (They used to be stars. Their Avatars are Yellow Battlemasters) are the authors who write the books.
Red Battlemaster (such as JadeHellbringer) are moderators.
The Orange ones are 'Commandos' (responsible for demonstrating Battletech at stores and conventions) and purple are webmasters (as I recall). That's DeathShadow and Roosterboy.
I think that's all. Gideon is green, not sure what his is. Something important anyway (Shadowrun maybe?).
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Oh. :-[ I see. So like, if I wanted a story or a mech to become canon, I'd have to go through him?
Or you could just shout it at the rocks. Pretty much going to be the same answer. I think if he took every suggestion to make a 'Mech cannon, the next book would be out in 3050.
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LOL sorry I didn't know......
No blood, no foul. Y'all who are without sin, etc. We are easily amused.
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I heard that Herb's cat is actually between Herb and Randall in the chain-of-command.
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Oh. :-[ I see. So like, if I wanted a story or a mech to become canon, I'd have to go through him?
You can try. But we generally don't solicit material from the fanbase. On occasion, we do seek opinions through polls (http://www.classicbattletech.com/forums/index.php/board,84.0.html) but we do not take requests for units, personalities, designs, or other material.
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Or you could just shout it at the rocks. Pretty much going to be the same answer. I think if he took every suggestion to make a 'Mech cannon, the next book would be out in 3050.
I see. I'm starting to come to the conclusion that this man's time is EXTREMELY precious. Thanks for the heads up!
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Gideon is green, not sure what his is.
CGL staff.
There's also blue for Admins and white for Developers.
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LOL sorry I didn't know......
Just be glad you weren't nuked. It's happened before... #P :o :o
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You can try. But we don't generally don't solicit material from the fanbase. On occasion, we do seek opinions through polls (http://www.classicbattletech.com/forums/index.php/board,84.0.html) but we do not take requests for units, personalities, designs, or other material.
Okay well for example. How did the Timber Wolf mech come into you guys' office? I didn't drop from the sky. SOMEBODY had to be responsible for that mech's creation.
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Okay well for example. How did the Timber Wolf mech come into you guys' office? I didn't drop from the sky. SOMEBODY had to be responsible for that mech's creation.
Someone working for FASA at the time. CGL employees and freelancers will come up with the new material.
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Okay well for example. How did the Timber Wolf mech come into you guys' office? I didn't drop from the sky. SOMEBODY had to be responsible for that mech's creation.
Just an FYI, if you have a question you'd like an official answer to, you need to post it here (http://www.classicbattletech.com/forums/index.php/board,34.0.html) for the Developers or here (http://www.classicbattletech.com/forums/index.php/board,41.0.html) for a writer.
This one I'll do as a freebie: it was designed by developers back in the FASA days around 1990. Well before Herb and my time with BattleTech.
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They have developers in house. Overworked, underpaid and well-loved.
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Timber Wolf was a) FASA-era, and b) an in-house design. Catalyst does not solicit individual designs and/or fluff from the fanbase. They have writers for that.
Oh wow, triple post before I finished. :P
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I used my MASC to post that one. ;)
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TSM here. Running a little hot today.
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Someone working for FASA at the time. CGL employees and freelancers will come up with the new material.
Actually, Virtual World Entertainment. Steve Venters did that one, and several of the others.
Paul
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CGL staff.
There's also blue for Admins and white for Developers.
Thanks Rooster. So I got the Web admin right? Was never quite sure on you to be honest. I know you maintained that amazing online repository and often check continuity... errata... catching all those small holes.
Oh wow, triple post before I finished. :P
No kidding. All the stars...er...battlemasters have descended upon us. Run!
Oh. :-[ I see. So like, if I wanted a story or a mech to become canon, I'd have to go through him?
Pretty much. The so-called 'canonization' is, I believe, frowned upon by Herb. FASA used to do it quite a bit, to the point they were everywhere, so he used the 'Jihad' arc as an opportunity to 'clean house' (I believe was how he put it). It still happens- the writers, from what I've gathered, try to sneak things into their works. A nod to their friends, or a private joke. He doesn't catch them all the time.
Other than that, it's special circumstances. A Con game occurred where a Hell's Horses tank took out a binary of Wolf 'mechs...which I admit...is pretty epic. It got a reference.
The people that do make it in are people that:
a) Contribute to the game and the community. Playtesters and factcheckers for example (there's a waiting list) and need to sign contracts called Non Discloser Agreements that promise they won't divulge any sensitive information (upcoming work etc.)
b) The contribution is done to help people out. They are not seeking any sort of reward or recognition for it. These people due it to be nice, and out of love for the game.
c) Again, are not looking for anything in return. Especially canonization
Wombat, for example, is usually found in the Mechwarrior's Hall. She's become sort of a mascot for the forums. Makes avatars for people, helps them out. Posts...ungodly amount usually. She built up 30k posts on the old forums over a few years. Albatross was always willing to help people connect and get into the game- ran a website and was a really great guy. He passed away suddenly, and he's missed. So...the yellows on here were nice enough to write in a reference to him as a tribute and thank you.
In the end, that's all the canonization is. A way to say 'thank you' to the people that go above and beyond and earnestly help out the game and people in general...for no pay, or acknowledgement.
Or spite. TanekaFury used to be around here (haven't seen him of late, sadly). He was a Smoke Jaguar fan, and ended up in the books as a Nova Cat ;D
That's another thing: Canonization isn't all that it's cracked up to be. I doubt I'll ever see a 'Sid' or a 'Phad' in the books. Probably a good thing too- he'd likely be a Wolf (in Exile) (Ugh) that rants and dies in some embarrassing session. :-\
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Actually, Virtual World Entertainment. Steve Venters did that one, and several of the others.
Paul
The ones that did the Virtual Pod game?
How is that still 'in house' then? And the Timber wolf was described in detail in Blood of Kerensky which dates back to...'89? '90?
Or am I thinking of the wrong company?
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IIRC the pods date back to 88 or 89. I remember hearing about them in college and it was that time period. I was always hoping to try one out but never got the chance. :'(
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Just be glad you weren't nuked. It's happened before... #P :o :o
Thats very funny. All I was doing was asking a simple question. Which I doubt is gonna be the reason for me getting "nuked". 8)
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The ones that did the Virtual Pod game?
How is that still 'in house' then? And the Timber wolf was described in detail in Blood of Kerensky which dates back to...'89? '90?
Or am I thinking of the wrong company?
Because while the dude worked for the pod company, the art was bought and owned by FASA. So it's squarely part of the BT IP.
FASA licensed BT to the pod company.
Paul
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Thats very funny. All I was doing was asking a simple question. Which I doubt is gonna be the reason for me getting "nuked". 8)
He's referring to the perception that Mr. Beas fixed a lot of what was wonky with the WizKids-era description of the Jihad with large quantities of nuclear devices.
It's something of a running joke here.
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Because while the dude worked for the pod company, the art was bought and owned by FASA. So it's squarely part of the BT IP.
FASA licensed BT to the pod company.
Paul
Ah okay, thanks Paul.
I thought something similar was done with the artwork in 3055 (Stone Rhino, Raijin etc.). That's probably where I got confused.
No wonder all the 3050 Omnimechs use the same parts. Cool.
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Just an FYI, if you have a question you'd like an official answer to, you need to post it here (http://www.classicbattletech.com/forums/index.php/board,34.0.html) for the Developers or here (http://www.classicbattletech.com/forums/index.php/board,41.0.html) for a writer.
This one I'll do as a freebie: it was designed by developers back in the FASA days around 1990. Well before Herb and my time with BattleTech.
So the Developers do the mechs, and the writers do the stories. Is that correct?
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I thought something similar was done with the artwork in 3055 (Stone Rhino, Raijin etc.). That's probably where I got confused.
Nope, if FASA owned those, they wouldn't be Unseen.
No wonder all the 3050 Omnimechs use the same parts. Cool.
Yeah, actually, the notion of OmniMechs started with that game because they wanted a plausible reason to explain the umpteen different user configurations that would be possible in the Pods.
(While some characteristics never change)
Paul
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Oh. :-[ I see. So like, if I wanted a story or a mech to become canon, I'd have to go through him?
You'd go through the BattleCorps website, which has a process for submitting fiction. They're always looking for authors.
So the Developers do the mechs, and the writers do the stories. Is that correct?
Not at all correct.
The few developers lay out the plan for the game. They produce an outline for books, be they fiction, rules, or filled with 'Mechs. Then they assign writing to (drum roll) writers. Then they crack whips over writers to make sure writing is delivered on time and up to spec.
Writers fill in the blanks assigned by developers.
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You can try. But we generally don't solicit material from the fanbase. On occasion, we do seek opinions through polls (http://www.classicbattletech.com/forums/index.php/board,84.0.html) but we do not take requests for units, personalities, designs, or other material.
Actually, I thought I'd heard two or three "items" for BT had been canceled 'cause someone had a similar idea and broadcasted it on the forums before the internal version saw light of day.
It's ironic that Teh Mothership forum of BT is the worst place to be that enthusiastic about the game, but thinking out loud here has sunk ships …
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Oh. :-[ I see. So like, if I wanted a story or a mech to become canon, I'd have to go through him?
Trying to give a straight, honest and helpful answer:
Like most people working with intellectual properties, CGL and its employees have to protect themselves from outside input. That's because otherwise they risk being sued for stealing intellectual property (ideas, designs, whatever) that somebody submitted when in truth there may be a huge pile of fan submissions that they never actually bothered to look through.
If you, as a fan, want to contribute something to the actual canon of the BT universe then your chances are slim. Best bet is to subscribe to BattleCorps and submit material for (possible) publication. But the BattleCorps rules essentially say you can't submit new designs - you explicitly have to tell your stories/scenarios/unit digests/etc. with the plethora of BattleTech that already exists. Also, BC Editor Jason Schmetzer is a nice guy but I'm told he knows a million ways to say "no" if a fan submission isn't up to his high standards...
If you've got a good story to tell then BattleCorps may be your way to make it Canon.
Otherwise, it's pretty much hopeless.
Oh, and if you have ever published your idea anywhere in the public domain then it's flat out for Canon.
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The Orange ones are 'Commandos' (responsible for demonstrating Battletech at stores and conventions)
More like brown or earth color. :-\
They actually renamed us Demo Team Agents, but the "Commando" name still sticks
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More like brown or earth color. :-\
They actually renamed us Demo Team Agents, but the "Commando" name still sticks
Your star used to be orange! And it's an...orangish brown...so...
I still think of it as orange :)
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Not at all correct.
The few developers lay out the plan for the game. They produce an outline for books, be they fiction, rules, or filled with 'Mechs. Then they assign writing to (drum roll) writers. Then they crack whips over writers to make sure writing is delivered on time and up to spec.
Writers fill in the blanks assigned by developers.
Hmmmm. So if I "have a dream" I want to give it to the developers eh?
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Hmmmm. So if I "have a dream" I want to give it to the developers eh?
Don't call us, we'll call you.
Unsolicited submissions = rejected.
Paul
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More like brown or earth color. :-\
They actually renamed us Demo Team Agents, but the "Commando" name still sticks
There is no other reason for anyone to refer to me as a "Commando". :P
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Don't call us, we'll call you.
Unsolicited submissions = rejected.
Paul
Call me. ace605@yahoo.com
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Chutzpah.
But who am I to complain? I tried making fun of HABeas2, and look where it's gotten me. Nowhere. :P
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Hmmmm. So if I "have a dream" I want to give it to the developers eh?
Paul is mostly on target. BattleCorps is the primary venue for unsolicited offerings, and it takes almost exclusively stories. Not 'Mechs, not rules, just fiction.
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Paul is mostly on target. BattleCorps is the primary venue for unsolicited offerings, and it takes almost exclusively stories. Not 'Mechs, not rules, just fiction.
So I send my designs to BattleCorps. They like it, and recommend it to some middleman with the BattleTech canon stuff, who gives it to his superior who decides that it becomes a canon design?
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So I send my designs fiction to BattleCorps. They like it, and recommend it to some middleman with the BattleTech canon stuff, who gives it to his superior who decides that it becomes a canon design short story?
Fixed.
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Fixed.
I was meaning mechs btw.
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It's a process. You write stories. They tell you no. You fix your stories. They tell you no again.
Frankly, that's as far as I've gotten, but I'm a bad writer. :P
I'm told then you fix your story some more, and they take it. Repeat process.
EVENTUALLY they ask you to do a design, or a sourcebook blurb, or whatnot.
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It's a process. You write stories. They tell you no. You fix your stories. They tell you no again.
Frankly, that's as far as I've gotten, but I'm a bad writer. :P
I'm told then you fix your story some more, and they take it. Repeat process.
EVENTUALLY they ask you to do a design, or a sourcebook blurb, or whatnot.
So I have to give them a story before I can give them a mech design?
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Thanks Rooster. So I got the Web admin right? Was never quite sure on you to be honest.
Pretty much, yeah. Deathshadow maintains the hardcore technical aspects of keeping this site and the forums running, while I tend to handle content updates with the occasional technical diversion for quick fixes or changes.
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So I have to give them a story before I can give them a mech design?
They come to you. That's all there is to it.
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They come to you. That's all there is to it.
Yeah I know that part. I'm wondering if they come to me asking me to write a story before asking me to create a mech design? For example: Did the person who created the Hellstar have to write a story before he earned that privilege?
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So I have to give them a story before I can give them a mech design?
BattleCorps is the primary venue for unsolicited offerings, and it takes almost exclusively stories. Not 'Mechs, not rules, just fiction.
(emphasis added)
In other words, there is no venue or desire for unsolicited designs. Become a writer (through the various methods of doing so) and then maybe you can submit your designs. Though, as Herb has said in several recent BattleChats, he's doing all of the design work lately to head off conflicts between writers and artists.
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(emphasis added)
In other words, there is no venue or desire for unsolicited designs. Become a writer (through the various methods of doing so) and then maybe you can submit your designs. Though, as Herb has said in several recent BattleChats, he's doing all of the design work lately to head off conflicts between writers and artists.
So where does that leave me as far as options are concerned. Write a fictitious story and post it on BattleCorps?
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So where does that leave me as far as options are concerned. Write a fictitious story and post it on BattleCorps?
As previously stated, yes.
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So where does that leave me as far as options are concerned. Write a fictitious story and post it on BattleCorps?
There's also the fan fiction area of this very website, of course.
Chutzpah.
But who am I to complain? I tried making fun of HABeas2, and look where it's gotten me. Nowhere. :P
You didn't follow the chain of command. You have to be a pain in the ass to lower-level folks like Paul first. You can't just go straight to el capitan and start poking at him! :D
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As fans of the universe, we'd all love to contribute to it in some small way. Despite that desire, the door is closed for the majority of us. Herb and company have been pretty clear about the process. If you have to ask, you're probably not going to get asked. Sucks, but that's the way it goes.
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I'm getting this strange feeling that one of the best ways of killing the chances of an idea making it in canon is to actually post it here and discuss it in multiple forums.
Kinda takes the fun out of posting in fan designs. Now I might never see a dedicated air-droppable WiGE IFV/tank in canon. :-\
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I'm getting this strange feeling that one of the best ways of killing the chances of an idea making it in canon is to actually post it here and discuss it in multiple forums.
Kinda takes the fun out of posting in fan designs. Now I might never see a dedicated air-droppable WiGE IFV/tank in canon. :-\
Good news! The devs don't read the design forums
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So where does that leave me as far as options are concerned. Write a fictitious story and post it on BattleCorps?
Well, you could submit a story to BattleCorps, yes, but be aware that probably still won't get you anywhere near having one of your designs published. As I mentioned, Herb (the HABeas2 of this thread's title) is now doing the design work himself so the writers and artists don't have to.
So if you do submit stuff to BC, it should be because you have stories you want to tell, not because you have a killer awesome 'Mech design you want to see in print. Doing so with that goal will, I'm afraid, more likely end in heartbreak than not.
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Well, you could submit a story to BattleCorps, yes, but be aware that probably still won't get you anywhere near having one of your designs published. As I mentioned, Herb (the HABeas2 of this thread's title) is now doing the design work himself so the writers and artists don't have to.
So if you do submit stuff to BC, it should be because you have stories you want to tell, not because you have a killer awesome 'Mech design you want to see in print. Doing so with that goal will, I'm afraid, more likely end in heartbreak than not.
Let me guess. Herb won't take any designs from anyone else will he? Even if they'd like to help him in doing so?
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Bingo, son.
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Good news! The devs don't read the design forums
I'm not just talking about the actual design; sometimes the concept is something new and pretty much unknown prior to discussion and it gets mentioned and discussed in other threads. For example, in canon, all WiGEs are basically transport types with light armour and armament: I designed what basically amounts to an MBT WiGE, with heavy armour, turret and even integral infantry support, designed to be dropped from high altitude directly into combat without additional equipment or the need to ready and "unpack"... using the rules as published. This got discussed in several other threads, not just the design forum.
Another one would be the "Let's build a colony" article in the fan articles forum; I'm just getting my mind wrapped around the idea that NOTHING in that article may make it in canon beyond the absolute basics.
That's kinda depressing.
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Bingo, son.
:'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( #P
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Bingo, son.
I sure hope that Mr. Herb will realize someday that there's someone out there who'd love to help him with designing mechs. And he'll be kind and gracious enough to grant me that privilege. SOMEDAY..........
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I'm gonna step in for Herb and say "Yeah I know. Not interested."
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I'm gonna step in for Herb and say "Yeah I know. Not interested."
WHY?????? My designs a freakin awesome! I'm not saying that to say that Herbs designs are bad, I'm just saying that I've got something to prove. But if he's not interested, he's not interested.
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Stranger things have happened. Like....um....hmmmmm. Marisa Tomei beat Miranda Richardson, Joan Plowright, Vanessa Redgrave and Judy Davis for Best Supporting Actress in 1993 for My Cousin Vinnie. So there you go.
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WHY?????? My designs a freakin awesome!
Well, that would be why. Look through everything in the game, and understand this.
It's not about awesome designs.
Having the ultimate 'Mech is pointless and stupid.
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Well, that would be why. Look through everything in the game, and understand this.
It's not about awesome designs.
Having the ultimate 'Mech is pointless and stupid.
Thats true though. There's always gotta be competition and fighting. No room for peace right?
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Would be cool to have a design contest with the prize being the unit immortalized in canon in the next TRO. hint-hint ::)
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Thats true though. There's always gotta be competition and fighting. No room for peace right?
That doesn't have anything to do with the 'Mech designs.
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WHY?????? My designs a freakin awesome!
There are a number of reasons, including but not limited to:
1. Unsolicited work can quickly become a legal minefield.
2. Lots of fans want to pitch in, why should you get the nod over anyone else?
3. "Freakin awesome" designs are not necessarily the best ones for the universe, where game balance and storyline are important considerations.
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1. Unsolicited work can quickly become a legal minefield.
See also: Rule 8 and Battletechnology...
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There is one thing I think you should do, Mechwarriorfreak. Keep being a fan, don't get bored, look for some real-life tabletop gatherings in the Challenges and Gatherings forum, and who knows what'll happen?
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Thats true though. There's always gotta be competition and fighting. No room for peace right?
As my local group likes to laugh, "This ain't Tickletech. Start shooting."
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Would be cool to have a design contest with the prize being the unit immortalized in canon in the next TRO. hint-hint ::)
You mean like the Unique 'Mechs contest BattleCorps held several years ago? Or its follow-up, the ill-fated Unique Fighters contest? Those didn't work out so well and I can't really see TPTB wanting to open another can of worms like that again. But, then again, you never know.
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You mean like the Unique 'Mechs contest BattleCorps held several years ago? Or its follow-up, the ill-fated Unique Fighters contest? Those didn't work out so well and I can't really see TPTB wanting to open another can of worms like that again. But, then again, you never know.
If it didn't work out because no one was interested in it, thats no longer an issue now. hint-hint ::)
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You mean like the Unique 'Mechs contest BattleCorps held several years ago? Or its follow-up, the ill-fated Unique Fighters contest? Those didn't work out so well and I can't really see TPTB wanting to open another can of worms like that again. But, then again, you never know.
BattleCorps members had a chance to do something along those lines for TRO 3085. Given how much trash the staff had to sort through, as well as Herb shutting the doors on writer designs, that'll probably never happen again.
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Two people isn't a contest. And there's still the point that this game is not simply a game but a business, and bound by laws that apply to intellectual properties. Sure you created it and it's cool, but previous-ownership, licensing, and contracts all come into play and can cost a lot more money than it's worth. How many people actually bought Unique Mechs anyway?
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BattleCorps members had a chance to do something along those lines for TRO 3085. Given how much trash the staff had to sort through, as well as Herb shutting the doors on writer designs, that'll probably never happen again.
Can't some of us approach his superiors with the idea of developing a TEAM of people who can approve of the designs? Herb could lead it, but the load of work could be shared.
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So where does that leave me as far as options are concerned. Write a fictitious story and post it on BattleCorps?
Battlecorps members have been occasionally given the chance to submit some custom variants of existing designs but nothing from scratch IIRC. There have been past projects like Unique Mechs & Unique Fighters but the first I was able to submit some for was the Old is the New New section of 3085, none of my entries were chosen, although 2 were close enough that I'm claiming partial credit and I like to pretend my Prowler entry helped it push it's way into the Supplemental. For the record I still maintain that a tank named the Prowler should have a stealth armor variant, I think the same about most vees but that's beside the point! ;) :D
It was a fun opportunity but it's impossible to say when or even if they'll do something along even those limited lines again.
If it didn't work out because no one was interested in it, thats no longer an issue now. hint-hint ::)
The end results for all the projects mentioned were fun to see even if progress was slow on the Uniques, it's just hard to set aside manpower for projects that aren't money makers though. The Battletech universe is a big place though and it's well established that the TRO's don't cover every small volume manufacturer so if you want something in your game, put it in your game and have fun!
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You're assuming Herb has a boss. (Technically correct, but not insofar as BattleTech)
Second, approval is Herb's job no matter what - whether 10 people sort and submit to him or not, it still comes down to him. Besides, the point is that there won't be writer-submitted designs without specific "design this to fit this art or this need" as determined by the line developer.
You might as well call it HerbTech. And remember that whatever works for you, knock yourself out and play - but what happens in your world stays in your world; it won't become canon even if it's so awesome it invented sliced bread. A shame...but BT is fun that way.
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Can't some of us approach his superiors with the idea of developing a TEAM of people who can approve of the designs? Herb could lead it, but the load of work could be shared.
The short version: No.
The long version: Nope.
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You mean like the Unique 'Mechs contest BattleCorps held several years ago? Or its follow-up, the ill-fated Unique Fighters contest? Those didn't work out so well and I can't really see TPTB wanting to open another can of worms like that again. But, then again, you never know.
If it is Battlecorps-only it is not really open; only those who pay for their membership have the opportunity of participating and the rest of us won't even hear about it because "what happens in battlecorps stays in battlecorps".
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There's also the fan fiction area of this very website, of course.
You didn't follow the chain of command. You have to be a pain in the ass to lower-level folks like Paul first. You can't just go straight to el capitan and start poking at him! :D
Don't do it. I poked Ben enough and ended up wearing a Pens jersey...
I won't even go into what happened with Hellbie. *shudder*
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You're assuming Herb has a boss. (Technically correct, but not insofar as BattleTech)
Second, approval is Herb's job no matter what - whether 10 people sort and submit to him or not, it still comes down to him. Besides, the point is that there won't be writer-submitted designs without specific "design this to fit this art or this need" as determined by the line developer.
You might as well call it HerbTech. And remember that whatever works for you, knock yourself out and play - but what happens in your world stays in your world; it won't become canon even if it's so awesome it invented sliced bread. A shame...but BT is fun that way.
True. And on a second thought, it wouldn't be cool if that privilege would have been granted to everyone, because then what you made wouldn't be significant anymore. Probably a better idea just to stick to my world, as thats what makes it special. MY WORLD baby!!!!! OOH-RAH
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Don't do it. I poked Ben enough and ended up wearing a Pens jersey...
Don't knock what Brian said, it is after all how Ben got started. Now he's my boss. =)
Paul
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Don't do it. I poked Ben enough and ended up wearing a Pens jersey...
I won't even go into what happened with Hellbie. *shudder*
Hellbie is da man, man! ;D
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True. And on a second thought, it wouldn't be cool if that privilege would have been granted to everyone, because then what you made wouldn't be significant anymore. Probably a better idea just to stick to my world, as thats what makes it special. MY WORLD baby!!!!! OOH-RAH
And there is a whole board here on Fan Designs. http://www.classicbattletech.com/forums/index.php/board,16.0.html
Go to town!
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If it is Battlecorps-only it is not really open; only those who pay for their membership have the opportunity of participating
That is true. But if that contest was difficult to manage, what makes you think an open contest with many more times the number of participants would be a good idea?
and the rest of us won't even hear about it because "what happens in battlecorps stays in battlecorps".
Unless you read the announcement that was posted here when it was released or happen to see it listed on the BattleShop while perusing for other goodies to buy.
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Don't do it. I poked Ben enough and ended up wearing a Pens jersey...
I won't even go into what happened with Hellbie. *shudder*
I still have the photo of you in the Bruins jersey and viking helmet at Historicon on my phone. I WILL post it if need be. ;)
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I still have the photo of you in the Bruins jersey and viking helmet at Historicon on my phone. I WILL post it if need be. ;)
Please tell me he was wearing anything else.
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Please tell me he was wearing anything else.
Having seen the picture in question, I can assure you, he was wearing pants.
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Please tell me he was wearing anything else.
He was also wearing a smile.
Having seen the picture in question, I can assure you, he was wearing pants.
... Fine, and pants. Party pooper.
Paul
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Stranger things have happened. Like....um....hmmmmm. Marisa Tomei beat Miranda Richardson, Joan Plowright, Vanessa Redgrave and Judy Davis for Best Supporting Actress in 1993 for My Cousin Vinnie. So there you go.
hey she did a good job and looked much hotter than the rest did :-)
granted she was a newyawk italian playing a newyawk italian, not a huge stretch
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He was also wearing a smile.
... Fine, and pants. Party pooper.
Paul
Slade =/ Apollyon
(doesn't drink enough Fresca and Coconut Rum)
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hey she did a good job and looked much hotter than the rest did :-)
granted she was a newyawk italian playing a newyawk italian, not a huge stretch
I find it kind of funny that we're talking about celebrity chicks in the 90s under a HABeas2 topic. ;D
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He was also wearing a smile.
Paul
Of course I was smiling. My son kneecapped Redshirt, cored Hellbie and teamed up with Julie to savage the Crabs Jan was driving all while slinging dice in a Yahtzee cup.
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Of course I was smiling. My son kneecapped Redshirt, cored Hellbie and teamed up with Julie to savage the Crabs Jan was driving all while slinging dice in a Yahtzee cup.
It was a pretty good day, even if the players kept 1-turn-killing the big beasties... =)
Paul
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I find it kind of funny that we're talking about celebrity chicks in the 90s under a HABeas2 topic. ;D
Thread drift on these boards knows no bounds.
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Every time Herb posts with his HABeas2 username, I think of habeas corpus, Latin for "you may have the body", and I wonder who Herb just killed.
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Every time Herb posts with his HABeas2 username, I think of habeas corpus, Latin for "you may have the body", and I wonder who Herb just killed.
Habeas1 of course.
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Every time Herb posts with his HABeas2 username, I think of habeas corpus, Latin for "you may have the body", and I wonder who Herb just killed.
When I hear habeas corpus, I think of releasing someone from unlawful imprisonment. Maybe one can file a writ of habeas corpus with Herb's cat.
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I will add though sometimes there is close enough canonization that happens by most likely accident or coincidence.
I've seen a few things that were close to various items I've posted to the boards before the great crash crop up in a few books here and there and like I said I am willing to accept it as either entirely coincidental or a completely accidental honor.
Then there are other ways you can contribute to the universe and have fun. My skills with Excel have helped a few people with character generation for A Time of War and landed me a GM spot for the Fan Councils.
So while I or anything I've designed will probably never be formally canonized or have anything of mine become an official product I am still rather happy with the knowledge that I still have helped people have fun and will likely continue to do so for a long time.
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To emphasize what roosterboy said about trying to get your own designs published:
...if you do submit stuff to BC, it should be because you have stories you want to tell, not because you have a killer awesome 'Mech design you want to see in print. Doing so with that goal will, I'm afraid, more likely end in heartbreak than not.
Here's an example of my experience:
I had a piece published on BattleCorps not long ago where the story needed a piece of hardware that didn't exist, and I couldn't use an existing canon design (Those of you who have read the story know why 8)). So I had to drum up something that satisfied what the story required, and I purposely did not min-max anything: I just picked a weight, some random equipment, and that was pretty much it. The STORY came first, and the hardware was made simply to fill in a necessary gap. I didn't playtest the design, and honestly, I didn't even really want to run the actual construction numbers, but I felt I should solely for the purpose of remaining true to the game rules while writing the story. Furthermore, the stats I came up with aren't published in any official context like, for example, the TRO-style write-up for the Dragonfire aerospace fighter chassis featured in Jason Schmetzer's story "The Spider Dances."
When it comes down to it, I am first and foremost a storyteller, not a unit designer.
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Can't some of us approach his superiors with the idea of developing a TEAM of people who can approve of the designs? Herb could lead it, but the load of work could be shared.
Keep some perspective: up until...geez, the middle of these short little XTROs...technical readouts were filled out by such committees of writers. The developers (primarily Herb) gave an outline like:
20-ton Davion 'Mech
30-ton Clan 'Mech
40-ton Kuritan tank
50-ton Steiner 'Mech
etc.
Basically, the table of contents was drafted and then the developer(s) said, "Send me your solicitations!" to the writer pool.
Then writers sent in short synopses on how they'd make cool 'Mechs out of the list provided.
Then the developers would say, "Okay. Joel, your idea for the 20-ton Davion 'Mech was coolest, so you get it. Nick, your solicitation for the 30-ton Clan 'Mech was awesomest, so you write it. Mike, your idea for the 40-ton Kuritan 'Mech was coolest, you write it."
The individual assignments would be written and sent back to the developer (by which I mean the poor bastard assistant developers who then had no time to edit, fix, and review the writings before having to make them look presentable by 3 weeks in the past) so they could be reviewed by fact checkers for continuity and conformance with rules.
Then the book would be published.
However, something invisible to me - and I was assistant developer on a couple of TRO:Upgrades - was that there was apparently conflict between artists and writers. Artists took a long time to draw things, while writing came in quickly, and maybe reading differently than the artists had been told to draw to. I did see some fallout in the errata forums: "But, oh great Herb, why does the Mechajuggernaut have 3 gun barrels on its left wrist when the stats clearly show it only has 2 medium lasers there?" Errata'ing artwork is nigh impossible.
So, recently, Herb has taken to providing all stats in advance to make artists happy. This worked out quite well in TRO:Prototypes, since he was basing things on previously published XTROs and just needed to publish slight tweaks. Mind you, writers still write: Herb offered writing slots as described above, and writers filled in the blanks. For example, I wrote XTRO:Marik front to back in the old school style - Herb offered the whole XTRO and I got it with my solicitation. In TRO:Prototypes, new style, I wrote the text accompanying the majority of the XTRO:Marik designs that re-appeared (tweaked by Herb) there.
Herb's new system just handles stats, and those are almost unimportant matters. I mean, virtually every combination of 'Mech weapons and stats have been tried on internet forums and ye olde newsgroups like rec.games.mecha. What brings units alive is the fluff supplied by the writers. If you're concerned about awesome stats, you're missing what captures readers' eyes.
BattleCorps, which is in the business of moving fiction, just puts more emphasis on the fluff: submitting kewl mecha is missing the point. Do that here, on the public fan forums.
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When I hear habeas corpus, I think of releasing someone from unlawful imprisonment. Maybe one can file a writ of habeas corpus with Herb's cat.
Yeah, I can see Herb allowing a happy moment of freedom like that, but only after a catgirl has died, an angel loses its wings, a much beloved character is whacked, a beautiful planet is nuked, and a favourite faction has been repeated kicked in the crotch.
To keep the fiction interesting, every silver lining must have a cloud - a city-devestating thermo-nuclear mushroom cloud of catastrophic death.
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Oh. :-[ I see. So like, if I wanted a story or a mech to become canon, I'd have to go through him?
Your best bet if you want a story to become canon is to write a good, character-oriented short story set in the BattleTech universe and submit it—after putting it in proper manuscript format and proofreading*—to Battlecorps.com. This page (http://www.battlecorps.com/BC2/static.php?page=14) should be very helpful.
The worst they can do is say no.
Aside from short-story fiction, BattleCorps also publishes scenarios and unit/ship profiles, so that's another creative avenue to explore, if you're interested.
*This whole part is necessary to prevent our esteemed (and very busy) Managing Editor from having a conniption.
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Habeas1 of course.
Herb's grandpa died of natural causes as I recall.
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Herb's grandpa died of natural causes as I recall.
...and the name skipped to the Herb we all know and fear?
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...and the name skipped to the Herb we all know and fear?
Hey! I thought he was a nice man! ???
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He once was, then he started working in this place. ;D
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Herb's got the heart of a small child. He keeps it in a jar, on his desk, for his cats to play with ;)
(Btw, that's a joke. The internet meme that Herb is basically our very own Dark Lord and Lord of Nukes has been enthusiastically embraced here)
W.
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He's like a nuke missile; awe inspiring at times, cool, sometimes mentioned in hushed whispers, but never ever press a button because it will hurt. ;D
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Herb's got the heart of a small child. He keeps it in a jar, on his desk, for his cats to play with ;)
(Btw, that's a joke. The internet meme that Herb is basically our very own Dark Lord and Lord of Nukes has been enthusiastically embraced here)
W.
My wife sees him as a gentle man in his mid 30s who is nothing more than Mr. Cat, feline prophet
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Hey! I thought he was a nice man! ???
Herb is a fellow fan and there for a friend to Mechwarriors everywhere but sense he was at the helm during the Jihad, he's also the guy technically responsible nuking a good number of planets and killing off some of your favorite characters. The Black Thorns? Yeah, I guess I killed those guy, sorry }:)
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Personally, I think with the upcoming change to TROs of "One per Year", they could do a GenCon tournement,
with the requirement of designs being made on the spot, with a series of requirements(Like, for example
"IS 75 Tonner, 5/8 with MASC, and mounting an Class 10 Autocannon") that the winner of the tournement
would get their design canonized. But with the lack of an up-to-date HMPro(the Official 'Mech design program),
I am sure they wouldn't be able to pull off the logistics of it
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WHY?????? My designs a freakin awesome! I'm not saying that to say that Herbs designs are bad, I'm just saying that I've got something to prove. But if he's not interested, he's not interested.
I'm going to venture a wild guess here, because most of us go through this stage in one way or another, some stay there, some depart it to one degree or another... But, I'm guessing that you're seeing how a lot of the canon designs are sub-optimal in this way or that, and maybe starting from scratch, or maybe starting with an existing mech and tweaking it, you want to see them done better, more effective. more PPCs and Medium Lasers.
But, If you stop and think, the game's rules have been around for quite some time, and haven't changed THAT much. But we're still seeing designs that have some odd things about them that make them less than their "full potential." But, that they've been around so long, and that we're still seeing designs along those lines, doesn't that say to you that these choices are intentional? That they want the canon mechs this way?
Don't get me wrong, some mechs beg for a change, and theres some designs that I just can't use some of the canon configs for (Gargoyle Prime, Certain Linebackers, I'm looking at you) and some that I like making a bit of a change for personal preference, but there's no need to get them into the official books just to use them. Plenty of us are willing to play with reasonable customs.
Me, I wouldn't want to be part of the official "powers that be" around here. I don't want to be constrained by the limitations they find themselves under. I doubt you'd want to be either.
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Herb is a fellow fan and there for a friend to Mechwarriors everywhere but sense he was at the helm during the Jihad, he's also the guy technically responsible nuking a good number of planets and killing off some of your favorite characters. The Black Thorns? Yeah, I guess I killed those guy, sorry }:)
Herb didn't do in the Thorns, that was a organizational oversight. have to nuke enough planets in a short time frame and eventually you'll get one with something nice by accident.
or you could blame caffine maybe. although thinking the well being of the inner sphere depends on CGL's staff being relaxed and well rested frightens me.....
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although thinking the well being of the inner sphere depends on CGL's staff being relaxed and well rested frightens me.....
Relax! The well-being of the inner sphere depends on CGL's staff being overworked, under considerable time pressure, and being taunted by specially selected members of the fanbase. For special occasions, we get overseas manufacturers involved to ensure the stress levels never have a chance to drop!
W ;)
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But, If you stop and think, the game's rules have been around for quite some time, and haven't changed THAT much. But we're still seeing designs that have some odd things about them that make them less than their "full potential." But, that they've been around so long, and that we're still seeing designs along those lines, doesn't that say to you that these choices are intentional? That they want the canon mechs this way?
Personally, I'm in the "oh yawn, not another 'Mech" camp when it comes to new TROs. The uniqueness and character of individual designs has been diluted too much for my taste already by the plethora of designs churned out in the past 20 years, most of which never really have an impact on the game. Who needs yet another new 'Mech anyways, and a min-maxed optimized one (in the autor's opinion anyways) at that?
:P
Plus, the very concept of OmniMech makes the whole point moot. Just take a suitable existing chassis and mount what suits your fancy. It's canonically legal.
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Personally, I think with the upcoming change to TROs of "One per Year", they could do a GenCon tournement,
with the requirement of designs being made on the spot, with a series of requirements(Like, for example
"IS 75 Tonner, 5/8 with MASC, and mounting an Class 10 Autocannon") that the winner of the tournement
would get their design canonized. But with the lack of an up-to-date HMPro(the Official 'Mech design program),
I am sure they wouldn't be able to pull off the logistics of it
Even with HMP6, I would hate to be the one responsible for that tourney. It would be a nightmare to plan and a terror to execute effectively.
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<snip> have to nuke enough planets in a short time frame and eventually you'll get one with something nice by accident.
<snip>
Please, may I use this in my sig???
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Please, may I use this in my sig???
[Rommel, loosely]'Tis better to ask forgiveness then permission[/Rommel, loosely]
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[Rommel, loosely]'Tis better to ask forgiveness then permission[/Rommel, loosely]
Quite true, but I can at least say I asked ;D
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Can't some of us approach his superiors with the idea of developing a TEAM of people who can approve of the designs? Herb could lead it, but the load of work could be shared.
Ok...hold on a minute.
I've been following this thread for a bit. I have a question...and I mean absolutely no disrespect or ill intention with my post. Are you actually asking if it would be proper to jump the 'chain of command' OVER the line developer of the game so you can get your personal customs published? For real?
Serious question. Have you read ANY of the other forums?
Your enthusiasm is commendable, but you may want to lurk for a while before posting anything more. There are numerous threads about the rules of the board, submissions, Herb's role, everyone else's roles, etc.
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Regarding submitting stories to BattleCorps: A warning!
There is an aesthetic that the people in charge have publicly stated they adhere to. So, some stories, no matter how good or how invested you might be in their creation, will never be canon. And, then there's that hidden writers bible that us fans don't have access to which might conflict with something you have happen in one of your submissions.
Yeah. I've had both happen to me. BattleCorps and officiality or canonicity is very restricting. I've found I have less fun writing something for submission, though the process helps me fine-tune some of my stuff.
In the end, I find it more worthwhile to post stuff here for all to see for free. Anything I post here is just one more option for other players to add to their games. If they use it, great. If they don't, they obviously have a reason. But, it's there, in the name of fun.
That's why this is a game. So, if you think it's fun, ultimately, try it here. If you want to torture yourself over the BattleCorps submission process, I do recommend it for the feedback, if anything else. However, it's really a thin bottleneck, and chances of acceptance is actually pretty slim.
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And, then there's that hidden writers bible that us fans don't have access to
No there isn't.
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And, then there's that hidden writers bible that us fans don't have access to which might conflict with something you have happen in one of your submissions.
Do you mean this hidden writers bible http://www.battlecorps.com/BC2/static.php?page=5 (http://www.battlecorps.com/BC2/static.php?page=5) that you can get to by clicking on the contact us tag on the bottom of the main battlecorps page?
Wasp
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[Rommel, loosely]'Tis better to ask forgiveness then permission[/Rommel, loosely]
Rommel?
Wasn't that Admiral Hopper?
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[Rommel, loosely]'Tis better to ask forgiveness then permission[/Rommel, loosely]
If that was Rommel, you might want to keep in mind that in order to ask forgivness, he had to swallow a pill. Then, he was forgiven and in return, given a state funeral. Talk about a tough Surkairede.
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Regarding submitting stories to BattleCorps: A warning!
There is an aesthetic that the people in charge have publicly stated they adhere to. So, some stories, no matter how good or how invested you might be in their creation, will never be canon. And, then there's that hidden writers bible that us fans don't have access to which might conflict with something you have happen in one of your submissions.
Yeah. I've had both happen to me. BattleCorps and officiality or canonicity is very restricting. I've found I have less fun writing something for submission, though the process helps me fine-tune some of my stuff.
In the end, I find it more worthwhile to post stuff here for all to see for free. Anything I post here is just one more option for other players to add to their games. If they use it, great. If they don't, they obviously have a reason. But, it's there, in the name of fun.
That's why this is a game. So, if you think it's fun, ultimately, try it here. If you want to torture yourself over the BattleCorps submission process, I do recommend it for the feedback, if anything else. However, it's really a thin bottleneck, and chances of acceptance is actually pretty slim.
If you can tell a good character-oriented story, adhere to the style guide, use metric, and don't use magic/supernatural stuff/non-existent technology, then writing for BC isn't that restricting.
Canonicity is pretty easy to nail down if you're paying attention. Things to keep in mind are:
1) Do a bit of research before you write your story, and you shouldn't run into any glaring problems (but if you do, the fact checkers are very helpful)
2) Write in a previously unexplored area of history. The Age of War, the first three Succession Wars, and the Clans post-KLONDIKE are just a quick example of large areas of undiscovered country just waiting to be mined.
3) Don't use established characters as protagonists. This is a quick way to continuity errors.
4) Don't go completely out into left field.
5) Don't burrow into one of the universe's big mysteries. Things like these are likely secrets that Herb & Co. already have plotted out.
If you can write a story based on all of this, then you shouldn't run into any problems.
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Regarding submitting stories to BattleCorps: A warning!
There is an aesthetic that the people in charge have publicly stated they adhere to. So, some stories, no matter how good or how invested you might be in their creation, will never be canon. And, then there's that hidden writers bible that us fans don't have access to which might conflict with something you have happen in one of your submissions.
Yeah. I've had both happen to me. BattleCorps and officiality or canonicity is very restricting. I've found I have less fun writing something for submission, though the process helps me fine-tune some of my stuff.
In the end, I find it more worthwhile to post stuff here for all to see for free. Anything I post here is just one more option for other players to add to their games. If they use it, great. If they don't, they obviously have a reason. But, it's there, in the name of fun.
That's why this is a game. So, if you think it's fun, ultimately, try it here. If you want to torture yourself over the BattleCorps submission process, I do recommend it for the feedback, if anything else. However, it's really a thin bottleneck, and chances of acceptance is actually pretty slim.
It may be restricting in some ways, yes. But it has to fit in with events at that point of time. I don't know what your stories about or why they were rejected, but you're not the only one to get rejected -- I've had several stories rejected over the years, and the Last story of the Proliferation Cycle took so long to complete, becuse the original story died in continuity and couldn't be rewritten to make it fit.
I have no assurance that any story I submit will be accepted by Jason S. But I do my research, and I do everything I can to fit the story into the Battletech universe seamlessly.
My suggestions:
* Small scope story -- forget trying to paint a huge story. For one, there isn't enough space for such a story (You have 5,000 - 8,000 words). For another, there's only room for two or three main characters, and maybe twice as many supporting characters. The characters need to have some character development. Concentrate on a Lance, not a Battalion or regiment.
* Use established units and 'Mechs -- Forget trying to plop your own unit into the Battletech universe right off the bat. When I have used units that weren't ad-hoc or not part of a military, I have used established units. Show you can work with the units already part of the universe before adding one of your own. Just be aware that some units are not useable for one reason or another.
And that goes for units like 'Mechs and vehicles. Don't load up the story with custom varients. There are twelve or so Warhammer varients out there. Depending on the era the story is in, chose one that is already canon. Every 'Mech and Vehicles I have written in a story has been out of a TRO. I may write a story that has a custom varient in it sometime in the future, but customs are the exception, not the rule.
* Don't try for a major change in the Universe. Whatever happens, the events in the story can't make major changes in the Battletech universe. The Main Character can win the fight, but not the war.
* Know the Universe. If you are setting a story in 3025 Free Worlds Leagure, you have to know the major players, the history, the current situation that are in place at this time. There is no way a Hellstar will appear in a 3025 story set in the Free Worlds League. You have to know the rank system if your writing about a house unit, the background of the state (As an example, Combine officers carry swords -- Katana and Wazshi (Sp) -- and have the mindset of a Samuari)
* Make sure the BC guidelines are followed. While it sounds like a no-brainer, if the format is sloppy, it distracts from the story. As with knowing the Universe, you have to show that you know that 'Mech names are italizied, that there's a Backwards ' in 'Mech, and that you follow the format. If the story is missing the formatting, then it's going to lose a lot of points.
* Tell a good story. That means action and conflict. Battletech is Space Opera with a grittiness. That means people die and things go boom.
Now, I have no idea how your stories are, or why they were rejected. Jason S. is the man who decides that. All I know is that he doesn't reject stories becuase he has a glut of them. All I can say is keep trying!
Craig
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My first six stories to BattleCorps were rejected. At my best I was running about 50/50 acceptance/rejection. The market has strict standards, no question. But stories have to fit established canon if they're going to play fair with the readers. BattleTech <i>is</i> a game; and it works only when everyone respects the rules.
And there is no secret sourcebook. There's just 20+ years of sourcebooks, which means a lot of stuff to keep track of. BUT it also means an almost endless source of story ideas. Just keep joechummer's advice in mind, and look for something small and interesting to hang your story on.
My stories that were successful took small events from the various history books and expanded on them.
In 3034 the Killer Bees invoked their "no suicide missions" clause to break a contract, leaving Canopus units to face overwhelming Capellan forces on Andarmax. From that one-paragraph I wrote "Commitment."
In 3039 the Silver Hawk Irregulars made a smash-and-grab raid against the Lyrans on Alioth, expecting to find a supply depot. Instead they had to make do with the year's sun guava harvest. "Blitzernte" came out of that.
"Pitcairn Star" had it's origin in two sentences from the Outworlds Alliance section of the Periphery sourcebook.
"What I Remember Most" sprang from one of three versions of what triggered the civilian riot on Santiago that led to the Reunification War.
"Godt Bytte" connected a few dots that existed separately in sourcebook articles about the Jarn Folk, the Hansa, and the Oberon Confederation in the late 2900s.
I can think of only two published stories that took place during major events in the BattleTech universe. "Rock in a Hard Place" and "A Line in the Dust" were both written from the perspective of bit players who didn't have access to the whole picture.
However -- and this is important -- the majority of my <i>rejected</i> stories didn't make the grade because they violated canon. There is so much written about the central characters that it's almost impossible not to foul out when putting your own spin on one of them.
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It's Kevin! Awesome!
Whatever he says, pay attention. If it doesn't immediately make sense, don't worry. It will. Soon. Pesky wisdom.
Paul
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Whatever he says, pay attention. If it doesn't immediately make sense, don't worry. It will. Soon.
Our own pet Vorlon!
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So far, everything I have submitted to Battlecorps has been published, with one currently under review. I attribute this to my choosing to not write about central characters or events. I create my own, research the relevant places and times, and write. It's easier to avoid conflicting with canon when you're not writing about someone else's characters or trying to carve your events into the established canon. Come up with a good character, give him something interesting to do, and pretend like you're coloring - stay between the lines! It doesn't matter how good your writing is if you can't keep out from underfoot of the established story. Write small, write personal, and do your homework.
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Write small, write personal, and do your homework.
Couldn't have put it more succinctly myself.
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What's the current wait time? I submitted a story at the end of June.
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You can try. But we generally don't solicit material from the fanbase. On occasion, we do seek opinions through polls (http://www.classicbattletech.com/forums/index.php/board,84.0.html) but we do not take requests for units, personalities, designs, or other material.
I just got this terrible feeling that XTRO: Hogarth may have been pushed. >:(
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What's the current wait time? I submitted a story at the end of June.
It's usually about 3 weeks on average to hear back (although once, I got a positive reply within a week of submitting). However, due to the surprise copyediting of Historical: Reunification War, Wars of Reaving, and TRO: Prototypes right smack dab in the middle of convention season, Jason got understandably swamped. But he will get back to you.
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Mechwarriorfreak,
Another aspect of the game that you may very well consider (and has already been mentioned), is to post your design to the Fan Designs thread of this forum. Although it may not be "canon" it will be appreciated by fans and may very well become "fanon". Many good designs are added by fans to other Alternative Universes, or are included in fan published compilations.
I know that there are many players who frequent these other forums and consider adding these other designs to their own games. After all many wise men have said, "whatever works for your game".
So if your intent is to get a design used by other players, these forums are a valid route to that end. If instead you seek fame for having created an awesome design, again these forums are a valid route to that end as well. However if you want to have your name listed as a writer or contributor to one of the official sourcebooks, you have a long road ahead of you.
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Whatever he says, pay attention. If it doesn't immediately make sense, don't worry. It will. Soon. Pesky wisdom.
(http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd484/hmp_goose/Too%20Many%20Smilies/yin.gif)
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It's usually about 3 weeks on average to hear back (although once, I got a positive reply within a week of submitting). However, due to the surprise copyediting of Historical: Reunification War, Wars of Reaving, and TRO: Prototypes right smack dab in the middle of convention season, Jason got understandably swamped. But he will get back to you.
Thanks. O0
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Mechwarriorfreak,
Another aspect of the game that you may very well consider (and has already been mentioned), is to post your design to the Fan Designs thread of this forum. Although it may not be "canon" it will be appreciated by fans and may very well become "fanon". Many good designs are added by fans to other Alternative Universes, or are included in fan published compilations.
I know that there are many players who frequent these other forums and consider adding these other designs to their own games. After all many wise men have said, "whatever works for your game".
So if your intent is to get a design used by other players, these forums are a valid route to that end. If instead you seek fame for having created an awesome design, again these forums are a valid route to that end as well. However if you want to have your name listed as a writer or contributor to one of the official sourcebooks, you have a long road ahead of you.
Heck, until the Jihad, I have had my own 'Mech factory. I am making its fall part of the current campaign for my group,
and part of the Jihad itself. My designs for it are not optimized, though the fluff is that they get licenses for limited runs of their own factory-grade modifications, and licenses for small production runs. That is one thing I always like about the universe, so try to work in: Nothing lasts forever...
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No there isn't.
It's a bit hard to believe you when you call yourself the Precentor of Lies ;).
That said I can see why you might not need a writer's bible. Assembling a single book out of everything published would probably kill one of you when you tried to pick it up...
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That said I can see why you might not need a writer's bible. Assembling a single book out of everything published would probably kill one of you when you tried to pick it up...
Cue Kindle ad..
Person1: "I bound all my BattleTech books in to this one, giant book. UMPHHHH!" *dumps giant book out of wheelbarrow, obscuring view of Person1*
Person2: "I carry thousands of books on my Kindle.." *shows off the slender Kindle from various angles*
Person1: *stepping out from behind giant book* "wow, can i see that?"
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And after Person1 gets themself a Kindle, cue Person3(me) stepping onscreen to say, "SOOooooo.... Can I have all those books you're not using anymore???" O:-)
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And after Person1 gets themself a Kindle, cue Person3(me) stepping onscreen to say, "SOOooooo.... Can I have all those books you're not using anymore???" O:-)
(4th person) I paint miniatures, got anything for THAT, genius? ;D
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(4th person) I paint miniatures, got anything for THAT, genius? ;D
Armorcast? :D
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Sorry I've been away from the computer for several days. Whats the tangent that we've gone down as of right now? ;)
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Sorry I've been away from the computer for several days. Whats the tangent that we've gone down as of right now? ;)
Don't question it, just roll with it. Thread drift is as unstoppable of a force as time and the wind. Attempting to steer a thread on-course is like herding cats. Just let the flow carry you. ;)
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Don't question it, just roll with it. Thread drift is as unstoppable of a force as time and the wind. Attempting to steer a thread on-course is like herding cats. Just let the flow carry you. ;)
And here, the winds of thread drift blow about 450 mph
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And here, the winds of thread drift blow about 450 mph
lol Whats that supposed to mean? Whats on everybody's mind these days? :-\
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lol Whats that supposed to mean? Whats on everybody's mind these days? :-\
Today it's the monkey on your back, tomorrow it's everyone else's.
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Today it's the monkey on your back, tomorrow it's everyone else's.
???
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If you think this is bad, stay out of the Mechwarrior Hall.
'Tis a silly place. [wildandcrazy]
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If you think this is bad, stay out of the Mechwarrior Hall.
'Tis a silly place. [wildandcrazy]
I'm not thinking anything. Thats the point.... LOL
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lol Whats that supposed to mean? Whats on everybody's mind these days? :-\
The metaphor isn't very deep. Thread tangents occur very quickly and without warning around here. If you leave a thread unattended for a few days, don't be surprised to see that they've ranged far, far afield.
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I'm not thinking anything. Thats the point.... LOL
NOW you're ready for The Hall. Thinking is... well, not FROWNED upon there, but it certainly is optional.
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NOW you're ready for The Hall. Thinking is... well, not FROWNED upon there, but it certainly is optional.
???What in the world is going on? LOL
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???What in the world is going on? LOL
Something special... magical. Glad you were here to share the moment with us.
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???What in the world is going on? LOL
OK, ok. Head to the main forum page, scroll down to the bottom, and the last board you'll see is the Mechwarrior Hall. Head in, look around, get a feel for the place, and one of two things will happen. A) You'll be pouring bleach in your ear to try to forget what you saw, or B) you'll join in the madness.
I suppose there's no reason not to go with C) All of the above. ;)
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OK, ok. Head to the main forum page, scroll down to the bottom, and the last board you'll see is the Mechwarrior Hall. Head in, look around, get a feel for the place, and one of two things will happen. A) You'll be pouring bleach in your ear to try to forget what you saw, or B) you'll join in the madness.
I suppose there's no reason not to go with C) All of the above. ;)
Okay. I saw several threads opening with stuff like "Doors open boys" or "And away we go". And then people just start saying whatever about whatever thats really random and it just doesn't make sense to me. lol So I'm just gonna go with option A: FORGET ABOUT IT LOL ;D
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Okay. I saw several threads opening with stuff like "Doors open boys" or "And away we go". And then people just start saying whatever about whatever thats really random and it just doesn't make sense to me. lol So I'm just gonna go with option A: FORGET ABOUT IT LOL ;D
Hey! the Hall is fun! It is not as random as it seems. You ever watch that old show on TLC called "Connections" where
the physcist hosting it would start with rubbing coins on rocks from the Mediteranean and some how end up with
getting man to the moon? That is how the Hall works...
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Hey! the Hall is fun! It is not as random as it seems. You ever watch that old show on TLC called "Connections" where
the physcist hosting it would start with rubbing coins on rocks from the Mediteranean and some how end up with
getting man to the moon? That is how the Hall works...
God I miss that show. :'(
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It's a bit hard to believe you when you call yourself the Precentor of Lies ;).
Nah, Herb blessed me with that title.
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Don't question it, just roll with it. Thread drift is as unstoppable of a force as time and the wind. Attempting to steer a thread on-course is like herding cats. Just let the flow carry you. ;)
This thread has a course? ???
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In Soviet Russia Herb's cats herd you!
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This thread has a course
FTFY!
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[copper]
Back somewhere towards the Topic please.
/ [copper]
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FTFY!
;D
On topic... can't think of anything that hasn't been said already.
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[copper]
Back somewhere towards the Topic please.
/ [copper]
What was the topic again? ???
Craig
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What was the topic again? ???
Craig
The topic was about Herb and why he doesn't want to share design creation with fans or staff or whatever.
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I'd content there's nothing new under the sun as far as mech designs. Herb's just being a responsible line developer making sure what sees the light of day as canon maintains a modicum of sanity or at least makes sense in universe. And then he ensures there's a nuke dropped on the manufacturing facility.
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I'd content there's nothing new under the sun as far as mech designs. Herb's just being a responsible line developer making sure what sees the light of day as canon maintains a modicum of sanity or at least makes sense in universe. And then he ensures there's a nuke dropped on the manufacturing facility.
Which I don't understand. No offense.
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Which I don't understand. No offense.
To put it succinctly. Herb is the line developer. The 'center of the universe' in terms of Battletech.
You are not.
Any questions?
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Exxon isn't interested in your ideas about refining gasoline, Apple doesn't care about your concept for the iPhone 6 and The Powers That Be do not want your unsolicited mechs for BT.
But,...remember that BT is YOUR game, and, within the confines of your gaming circle, you get to do whatever. you. want.
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Which I don't understand. No offense.
Because people complain about how certain mechs suck, and when the authors own up to it, they get derision. If you value your faction, you don't deride the developer :P
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If you value your faction, you don't deride the developer :P
Or irritate him in the vain hope that he kills Caleb Davion out of spite. It won't work, but that never stops us from trying.
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The topic was about Herb and why he doesn't want to share design creation with fans or staff or whatever.
It's legal issues. Mostly.
There are a number of issues. The largest is, as others have said, require lawyers. When Battletech was first created, the owners licensed artwork from a Japanese company (one of the ones that dealt with Macross). A different company later then licensed the rights to distribute Macross in the U.S as Robotech. Lawsuits, finger pointing, lots of money spent later, several designs in the game are known as 'Unseen' because Cataclyst no longer has the rights to use the images they licensed.
Accepting submissions from fans (like you) that try to offer designs can cause a similar problem. You might sign away rights to the design to have it submitted...but that doesn't mean that someone else they accept a design with who did the same might not turn around a few years from now and cause them headaches. Maybe that person will use their design (which got published) in their own fanworks, or submit it to another company for example.
There's other reasons though, too. There's already enough bickering between fans about 'author fiat'. Look at the Hellstar- 4 ER PPCs... You let someone send you a design through a Private Message, or an e-mail and they start picking them... "How come Faction X gets this awesome design and Faction Y got this crappy design?" While neither design would be crappy per se...just different uses.
That brings up the way designs are made. The fact that you want to make an awesome assault 'mech is good. Very good- the writers are doing their job. The way the designs are made...they're meant to be 'alright'. They're meant to be 'good', but not great or 'awesome'. In other words, the designs people like Herb design are meant to make sense within the fiction (Davion trying out some Light ACs on one of their favorite chassis for example) but not be optimized.
The idea behind this is that you, as a player, will have plenty of ways to improve it in the game. For example, if you're playing a Davion and get that 'mech in a campaign, you can say "Those machine guns aren't doing anything for me. So I'll take those off...that let's me add more armour" Or drop some lasers for jumpjets...or whatever.
If they designed (or took your awesome design), there wouldn't be much reason for players to modify or tinker with the design. And, as most fans want to submit optimized designs, fan designs aren't that healthy for the game when it comes to mass produced units. Unique 'mechs such as the Bounty Hunter's Marauder II C are meant to be 'awesome' by the way...but players normally wouldn't get it for their own characters. Therefor you get say, a Direwolf, then get to design your own configuration with what the GM has given you- much healthier.
Finally, they're trying to flush out the choices- especially with Clan 'mechs. Omnimechs are hot swappable, so their configuration doesn't matter that much. You'll note that the Nova Cat and Timber Wolf are both 75 tons...yet one has a larger engine than the other. There's little point in designing another 75 ton Clan Omnimech that goes ~86Kph or ~64Kph simply because you already have those 'mechs in the Timber Wolf and Nova Cat.
In fact, if the Timber Wolf and Nova Cat had the same engine and internals, just changing a bit of armour allocation and you could quite literally load the Nova Cat out with the Timber Wolf config.
That makes the different 'mechs pointless. What's the point of new 'mechs? Why take an Atlas over an Annihilator if changing an atlas variant to an annihilator variant was just as easy as changing one atlas variant to another Atlas variant?
So the writers (Well Herb) will look at it and then say "Faction X has no 95 ton 'mech that goes only 32Kph" or "Faction Y doesn't have a 65 ton non-Omnimech that goes 86Kph and has jumpjets" and they work from there.
Finally, they don't have a lot of time on their hands- many of them (as I recall) work a 'real' job in addition to writting. Herb, when he was one step down (Assistant Line Developer) was, in fact, working at Home Depot I believe.
Their time is valuable enough already- from what I understand, the contests to design a 'mech (where it was a competition and most of the details already flushed out- making the legal issues less so than otherwise) was a real headache for them.
That, combined with all the other reasons, is enough for them to do it in house.
I'm sure they have other reasons too....those are just some of the ones I remember reading about from them on here at one point or another.
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Exxon isn't interested in your ideas about refining gasoline, Apple doesn't care about your concept for the iPhone 6 and The Powers That Be do not want your unsolicited mechs for BT.
Best short version I've read. Explains that user ideas are not necessarily in line with the direction of the product. 'Good' is often only in the eyes of the beholder.
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Best short version I've read. Explains that user ideas are not necessarily in line with the direction of the product. 'Good' is often only in the eyes of the beholder.
Thats cuz they don't give us a direction. If they wanted a missile boat that could run fast I'd make a 97.2 km/h 65 ton mech with a couple of LRMs and SRMs. But no, they don't give a hoot about the ideas we give. So we just have to be satisfied with the fan created stuff. [tickedoff]
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Thats cuz they don't give us a direction. If they wanted a missile boat that could run fast I'd make a 97.2 km/h 65 ton mech with a couple of LRMs and SRMs. But no, they don't give a hoot about the ideas we give. So we just have to be satisfied with the fan created stuff. [tickedoff]
Did you not see my post above?
Or others?
They don't want designs for a number of reasons. Mainly because they don't want to be sued or get another fans upset.
Taking your design is a bad idea for them, no matter how good you are at making 'mechs.
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Thats cuz they don't give us a direction. If they wanted a missile boat that could run fast I'd make a 97.2 km/h 65 ton mech with a couple of LRMs and SRMs. But no, they don't give a hoot about the ideas we give. So we just have to be satisfied with the fan created stuff. [tickedoff]
We've explained *multiple* times and reasons why they do not accept fan solicited designs, all of them extremely valid. Until you manage to work your way into the inner circle, its not going to happen. That is all there is to it.
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Thats cuz they don't give us a direction. If they wanted a missile boat that could run fast I'd make a 97.2 km/h 65 ton mech with a couple of LRMs and SRMs. But no, they don't give a hoot about the ideas we give. So we just have to be satisfied with the fan created stuff. [tickedoff]
Mainly because your (and mine, and his, and hers, and ours) ideas suck. People tend to make mechs that win. TPTB can't do that for everyone (nor would they want to) so making that WTFPWN design is not good for business.
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I bet they'd take my fiction. It's great reading for those nights when you need help going to sleep. Read a page and a half and you're out.
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Thats cuz they don't give us a direction. If they wanted a missile boat that could run fast I'd make a 97.2 km/h 65 ton mech with a couple of LRMs and SRMs. But no, they don't give a hoot about the ideas we give. So we just have to be satisfied with the fan created stuff. [tickedoff]
You know...it's just easier to put you on 'ignore'. This thread has reached it's logical conclusion.
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I bet they'd take my fiction. It's great reading for those nights when you need help going to sleep. Read a page and a half and you're out.
Cisco study guides are drier than Arizona during wildfire season. Those can drop you in a page. Beat that! ;D
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Thats cuz they don't give us a direction. If they wanted a missile boat that could run fast I'd make a 97.2 km/h 65 ton mech with a couple of LRMs and SRMs. But no, they don't give a hoot about the ideas we give. So we just have to be satisfied with the fan created stuff. [tickedoff]
Yes, yes we do. Or you can use an entire giant book full of construction rules that they have provided to make your own. We are not without means. If you want to whine because your idea isn't canon, get in line.
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Thats cuz they don't give us a direction. If they wanted a missile boat that could run fast I'd make a 97.2 km/h 65 ton mech with a couple of LRMs and SRMs. But no, they don't give a hoot about the ideas we give. So we just have to be satisfied with the fan created stuff. [tickedoff]
And that's a problem... why?
It's not about what THEY want, it's about what YOU want. You have the tools to make whatever you want already. Go make it, and play it.
They design units, factions, stories, and worlds (in different eras no less) that we can all share in common. Beyond that, how you fill up the big, empty universe is up to you, and how you want to play YOUR game. There's more than enough units already in the stock game, for us to have in common - it's actually rather overwhelming to new people, in a way. I have 14 (14!) TRO's in my bookshelf, and that is *still* an incomplete unit set.
Just to get through the stock game content, if you were want to play every unit already in publication in 4x4 skirmishes, you're looking at a LOT of table time to get through them all.
My point is, I don't think there's a pressing need for dumping time and energy in to even MORE units when there are bigger fish to fry filling in the big empty spots in the universe (Interstellar Operations, SLDF era storylines, dark ages, etc / etc)
But, that's not to say you can't embellish your own game as much as you want - in fact, that's kind of the POINT of the whole thing. :)
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You know...it's just easier to put you on 'ignore'. This thread has reached it's logical conclusion.
Or you could, you know, just not post in it anymore instead of making snide comments.
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I bet they'd take my fiction. It's great reading for those nights when you need help going to sleep. Read a page and a half and you're out.
I agree! LOL ;D
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Snide is subjective.
How 'bout the thread be closed since anything that could be said has already been said three times, by my count. I think maybe more.
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Snide is subjective.
How 'bout the thread be closed since anything that could be said has already been said three times, by my count. I think maybe more.
Thats up to the Global Moderators to decide that. ;) Keep in mind, you weren't the one who started the topic pal.
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Boys.
Rule #1
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We've explained *multiple* times and reasons why they do not accept fan solicited designs, all of them extremely valid. Until you manage to work your way into the inner circle, its not going to happen. That is all there is to it.
Put another way:
A guy sued for ownership of the IP because he used large portions(uncredited) of the original Eridani Light Horse entry, and tagged some
stuff in at the end, and the website here several incarnations ago(when it was nothing more then a FAN site) accidentally put it up(they
thought they had found the original Eridani Light Horse info, and missed the differences).
What makes TPTB think that any OTHER fan would not do the same thing? It is just safer to say "No, we will do our own stuff."
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as much as i'd like it, it's all too obvious that to invite fan designs is too much trouble and too much work for too little results for the odds to be anything close to likely.
still, i keep the favorite designs to myself just in case.....
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running a company is hard. please cut the man a break. thank you.
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Hello,
Put another way:
A guy sued for ownership of the IP because he used large portions(uncredited) of the original Eridani Light Horse entry, and tagged some
stuff in at the end, and the website here several incarnations ago(when it was nothing more then a FAN site) accidentally put it up(they
thought they had found the original Eridani Light Horse info, and missed the differences).
This, and other examples that have both happened and have nearly happened, are why we do not accept off-the-street concepts, ideas, and designs, and why any such proposals to us are left (or even deleted) unread in these forums and elsewhere. Every time I have relaxed that rule and even discussed an outside idea solicited to me with someone who is not among my stable of freelancers, I have been burned. And this game line is too established and too important to me to burn for what amounts to fan service.
If you wish direct discourse with me, do so in the Ask the Developers board. If you attempt to solicit ideas to me via private means (such as forum Private Messages and e-mail), consider silence a typical answer. This is for my protection and yours as well.
Thank you,
- Herbert Beas
BattleTech
Catalyst Game Labs
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Wow. Herb came down from Mount Sinai with stone written tablets for you. You ought to feel privledged now.
BTW, I don't always agree with Herb (and I have said so to his face, once), but I also do not go out of my way to tick him off, either. Now might be a good time for a mod to lock this. Suggestion only.
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I have to tend to agree. This thread has run its course.