Clan Invasion Kickstarter Discussion 5, Green Eyeshade Edition

[Crackerb0x]

Have we seen that Orion art before?  With that said, I like it a lot b/c it DOES look like the primitive with some very clear differences.

I think the MAD II definitely looks better than the Phoenix version . . . have we seen a Marauder IIC at all?

The Orion art is actually pretty old in the scheme of this. The cockpit keeps getting revised - or at least that's what comments made on Scroggins' Patreon seem to imply whenever the Orion comes up.

Mad IIC art has also been seen on Patreon, but not publicly yet, to my knowledge.

[Empyrus]

The Orion's looking pretty good. Really like the more flattened top, compared to the old Orion.

Looks closer to how i imagine/remember Orion. Weirdly, Mechwarrior 4's MekPak Orion IIC has strongly influenced how i remember the Orion. The MekPak Orion IIC had sorta exaggerated chest, leading to overall rather flat top part.
That said, the Primitive Orion might be influencing this too...

A pity the Direct Fire Lance contains Marauder II, have no use for it...

[RoundTop]

From update #91
"We should have also fixed the problem with the free story we were giving out! You should see it rolling out in the next day or so because sending it to 13000 people seems to bog down the system ha ha."

It seems like There are so many of us we keep breaking things :P

So have people received this yet? I've still not got it.

[NeonKnight]

Nope.

[Colt Ward]

Yeah, I was going to ask again . . but still missing the 2 Founding novels as well, 1st overdue by 6 months.

[Ghaz]

The Orion art is actually pretty old in the scheme of this. The cockpit keeps getting revised - or at least that's what comments made on Scroggins' Patreon seem to imply whenever the Orion comes up.

Mad IIC art has also been seen on Patreon, but not publicly yet, to my knowledge.

Yeah, that Orion was one of the twitter retweet awards during the Kickstarter campaign.

https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php?topic=66543.msg1553024#msg1553024

[carlisimo]

Have we seen that Orion art before?  With that said, I like it a lot b/c it DOES look like the primitive with some very clear differences.

I think the MAD II definitely looks better than the Phoenix version . . . have we seen a Marauder IIC at all?

The Marauder IIC has been previewed in Anthony Scroggins’ Patreon.  It looks sleek (very tapered), whereas he designed the Marauder II as a hillbilly attempt to do the same thing because that’s what the Inner Sphere was like at the time.

I like this Marauder II, but it’s so factionally restricted that I might as well tear the legs off and use it as a shuttle of some sort.

As Crackerb0x said, the Orion’s changed since this sketch was done and it sounds like it’s going to change again.  One of the powers that be wants it to look more old school.  Scroggins revised the cockpit to have a central pillar - imagine IWM’s ON1-M but with sharp angles instead of curves.  He said the same power-that-be still isn’t happy.  I hope he isn’t forced to go to a more vertical cockpit like bay windows on the side of a house. 

[Colt Ward]

Early on the Marauder II is restricted . . . 3050 and on it spreads out with more mercs getting them thus some are salvaged to other factions.  The -4S was the first in the 3060s with eased sale restrictions- no Blakists (or symps), no Trinity power, and not to those fighting the AMC in the Chaos March.  Out in the Periphery, the Marian Hegemony somehow get enough of the 4 series to refit into a standard model to make their 4H.  During the Jihad the plans spread about until the Kuritans, Davions, Blakists and Mariks (experimental) produce MAD IIs.  In 3134ish Irian is producing a version as well, the -6S which would appear to be a updated -4S . . . it became a prime point of contention as the Republic fell apart.

[Empyrus]

As Crackerb0x said, the Orion’s changed since this sketch was done and it sounds like it’s going to change again.  One of the powers that be wants it to look more old school.  Scroggins revised the cockpit to have a central pillar - imagine IWM’s ON1-M but with sharp angles instead of curves.  He said the same power-that-be still isn’t happy.  I hope he isn’t forced to go to a more vertical cockpit like bay windows on the side of a house.

I hope not, the current one looks good...

[truetanker]

I'd field thirty-six jump capable MADs in a unit and call them Barbra's ...

If I had the coin...

TT

[Colt Ward]

For all its boxy, I actually liked MW3's Orion boxy representation but that is nearly 20 year old graphics?  Might be they are looking for a closer blend between the old Orion art, prim Orion and 3050s Orions.

[Bedwyr]

Now THAT is an Atlas.

He's a thicc boi. I like it, especially as it inherited the yawning waist armor of the original that look so imposing.

Remind me, the fluff is that the waist missile rack runs a set of four tubes front-to-back in a ripple fire (which gets the design aligned with the original art) and the new design is going to stick with that?

[Empyrus]

He's a thicc boi. I like it, especially as it inherited the yawning waist armor of the original that look so imposing.

Remind me, the fluff is that the waist missile rack runs a set of four tubes front-to-back in a ripple fire (which gets the design aligned with the original art) and the new design is going to stick with that?

Five tubes but yeah, fires rapidly four times.
Originally thought it silly but nowadays i think it is a cool quirk, even if i do prefer the later K and S series Atlas with chest-mounted LRM racks.

[RogueK]

I generally like the Marauder II, except for the cockpit. It feels too exposed overall. Rest of the mech looks awesome.

And yes I am fully aware that that cockpit style is closely related to the various Project Phoenix takes, but I don't really like them there either.

[Cache]

I generally like the Marauder II, except for the cockpit. It feels too exposed overall.

Looks like the Supernova with the cockpit pushed forward. I don't like the broad shoulders and pushed-forward waist, nor do I like the more exposed cockpit (compared to the nuSeen Marauder). I wish it was a literally upsized nuSeen Marauder.

[Colt Ward]

The frame cage maybe but it all depended on where you thought the cockpit was, lol.  Me, its the 4 toed feet . . .

[RazorclawXLS]

I like all the mechs in the new lance, except the Orion. The proportions are wrong, it's too lanky for an Orion, in my opinion. The legs are too big for the torso it is given, and the torso looks like a kid made it out of non-matching Lego bricks it had at it's disposal.

Orion is called a mini Atlas, not because it looks like an Atlas, but because of the weaponry and imposing looks. The image presented is not imposing to me. It looks like a mash of components from different mechs.

The 3d models on Thingiverse, based on the MWO Orion, look more imposing and more Orion to me.

All of this is completely subjective on my part, so take as it is.

[glitterboy2098]

i like that the Marauder II looks like a bulked up Marauder.. since that fits the fluf well, where that was literally what it was.
honestly i like this approach better than the unseen version, where it is basically a marauder with some winglets added, and the extra 25tons had no visual effect. i also like it over the reseen versions where the standard marauder's stick thin limbs and body made the hulking bulk of the Marauder II seem extreme. the Classic's art finds a good medium while still looking like the reseen models evolved from them.

[Asgo]

personally, given the previews I am quite happy that I picked this lance as one of my duplicates.  :)

In general, the previews showed a nice consistent style in the designs so far, which is nice for 2 reasons:
a) well, consistency is always good - but even more so for machine designs
b) it provides enough assurance for me that the rest of the redesigns won't be a disappointment.

of course I have the advantage, that I don't have many love or hate relationships with previous designs to want the redesigns be closer or farer from the old ones, which gives me the freedom to appreciate them 'as is'. ;)

[DarkSpade]

Starting to really prefer HBS's Orion.

[shivanwurm]

Anthony Scroggins put the final render of the Clan Support Star up on his patreon. Go check it out, his KS art updates are well worth the money.

[Cache]

a) well, consistency is always good - but even more so for machine designs

I disagree with this. There are BattleMechs designed centuries apart and in completely separated cultures. There shouldn't consistency in design between Inner Sphere and Clan machines or Star League and 3rd Succession War designs. TRO:2750 had consistency in design for that era: The golden age of the Star League. The designs had a 1950's vibe to them. Most notable are the fins on most of them. This transferred to the "lost" Star League designs introduced in the Wolf's Dragoons sourcebook. It made that era of designs unique, and a consistency across the entire line would lose this. You used to be able to tell a Clan OmniMech from an Inner Sphere BattleMech even if you had no idea what they were. From what I've seen of the redesigns, the flavor is being lost.

[SteelRaven]

I don't want to get into a argument over BT aesthetics but it's clear they want to acknowledge some of the phoenix design elements such as a wide shoulders. It makes sense for the Mad II to have the same bulk as, say, the King Crab being the same mass.

Also, unpopular opinion, I thought the original Marauder II design as seen in the Wolf's Dragoons book was a little lazy. It was a Mad with some wings slapped on it. It it wasn't for the text stating it was also bigger, you could easily assume it was just a Mad-3R with a mech equivalent of a spoiler slapped on.

[Bedwyr]

I'm cool with pulling in more of those Phoenix design elements, myself. It does differentiate the II from the original a bit better and I thought it made the better Marauder in the Phoenix series.

[Daryk]

The original MAD II had a bigger autocannon too (and it was pointed right at you), so I thought it was more than just wings...

[Liam's Ghost]

and the torso looks like a kid made it out of non-matching Lego bricks it had at it's disposal.

I'm not going to tell you your preferences are wrong or anything, but I kinda feel like the Orion always looked like it was made from mismatched parts.

[Colt Ward]

I'm not going to tell you your preferences are wrong or anything, but I kinda feel like the Orion always looked like it was made from mismatched parts.

Lol, its kind of hinted at that it is blocky and squared off, since its described as a refiter dream.

[Cache]

Also, unpopular opinion, I thought the original Marauder II design as seen in the Wolf's Dragoons book was a little lazy. It was a Mad with some wings slapped on it. It it wasn't for the text stating it was also bigger, you could easily assume it was just a Mad-3R with a mech equivalent of a spoiler slapped on.

It is literally a Marauder with a reinforced chassis--not a redesign. The whole point was to cut out most of the design process in order to speed up development.

[SteelRaven]

It is literally a Marauder with a reinforced chassis--not a redesign.

Yes and why it seemed like a xerox to me when I first saw it in TRO: 3050 and even more so when I found the original art from the Wolf Dragoons book.

This is why I don't like talking BT aesthetics, everyone has their own taste and I don't want to dunk on anyone persons preference but with so many pro-unseen on this forum, I though it was important to say some of us appreciate a squeal mech actually distinctive. It still screams Marauder but it doesn't look like someone just 3D printed a larger Mad-3R and that matters when you are trying to get knew players to the table.   

[Lorcan Nagle]

The original MAD II had a bigger autocannon too (and it was pointed right at you), so I thought it was more than just wings...

To be fair, the original Marauder II had a fake autocannon on the back and a large laser in a chin turret instead.