Author Topic: Design Challenge - Ground Attack Marvel  (Read 2136 times)

Black_Knyght

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Design Challenge - Ground Attack Marvel
« on: 08 October 2018, 14:05:27 »
Here's a unique kind of design challenge:

Using either the Shilone, Slayer, or Chippewa as a basis, the challenge here is to create a 3075 era variant optimized to be an absolute marvel at ground attacks and a nightmare beast for all mud-slogging mechs everywhere!
« Last Edit: 09 October 2018, 12:16:59 by Black_Knyght »

Simon Landmine

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Re: Design Challenge - Ground Attack Marvel
« Reply #1 on: 09 October 2018, 08:53:11 »
I always loved the artwork for the Shilone and the Chippewa.
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Sharpnel

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Re: Design Challenge - Ground Attack Marvel
« Reply #2 on: 09 October 2018, 09:35:13 »
Here are my versions of a Shilone,

Code: [Select]
Shilone SL-17GA
Base Tech Level: Standard (IS)
Level            Era   
-----------------------
Experimental      -   
Advanced      3060-3061
Standard        3062+ 
Tech Rating: E/X-X-E-D

Weight: 65 tons
BV: 1,982
Cost: 10,260,778 C-bills
Source: Custom

Movement: 7/11
Engine: 325 XL
Heat Sinks: 20 [40]
Fuel Points: 400 (5.0 tons)

Structural Integrity: 7
Armor: 241 (Ferro-Aluminum)
            Armor 
-------------------
Nose           86 
Left Wing      50 
Right Wing     50 
Aft            55 

Weapons              Loc  Heat 
--------------------------------
ER PPC               NOS   15   
ER Large Laser       RWG   12   
ER Large Laser       LWG   12   
Anti-Missile System  AFT    1   
ER Medium Laser      NOS    5   
ER Medium Laser      NOS    5   

Ammo                           Loc  Shots 
-------------------------------------------
Anti-Missile System Ammo [IS]  AFT     12 
Anti-Missile System Ammo [IS]  AFT     12 


the Slayer

Code: [Select]
Slayer SL-15GA
Base Tech Level: Standard (IS)
Level            Era   
-----------------------
Experimental      -   
Advanced      3060-3061
Standard        3062+ 
Tech Rating: E/X-X-E-D

Weight: 80 tons
BV: 2,069
Cost: 13,386,893 C-bills
Source: Custom

Movement: 6/9
Engine: 320 XL
Heat Sinks: 22
Fuel Points: 800 (8.0 tons)

Structural Integrity: 8
Armor: 295 (Ferro-Aluminum)
            Armor 
-------------------
Nose          105 
Left Wing      65 
Right Wing     65 
Aft            60 

Weapons              Loc  Heat 
--------------------------------
ER PPC               NOS   15   
ER PPC               RWG   15   
ER Medium Laser      LWG    5   
ER Medium Laser      RWG    5   
ER Medium Laser      NOS    5   
ER PPC               LWG   15   
ER Medium Laser      NOS    5   
Anti-Missile System  AFT    1   

Ammo                           Loc  Shots 
-------------------------------------------
Anti-Missile System Ammo [IS]  AFT     12 
Anti-Missile System Ammo [IS]  AFT     12 


Equipment             Loc 
---------------------------
ECM Suite (Guardian)  AFT 


and the Chippewa

Code: [Select]
Chippewa CHP-W7 GA
Base Tech Level: Standard (IS)
Level          Era
-------------------
Experimental    - 
Advanced        - 
Standard      3070+
Tech Rating: E/X-X-E-D

Weight: 90 tons
BV: 2,438
Cost: 16,978,195 C-bills
Source: Custom

Movement: 6/9
Engine: 360 XL
Heat Sinks: 22 [44] *2 damaged)*
Fuel Points: 400/480 (6.0 tons)

Structural Integrity: 9
Armor: 331 (Ferro-Aluminum)
            Armor 
-------------------
Nose          116 
Left Wing      70 
Right Wing     70 
Aft            75 

Weapons              Loc  Heat 
--------------------------------
ER PPC               RWG   15   
ER PPC               LWG   15   
ER Large Laser       RWG   12   
ER Large Laser       LWG   12   
ER Medium Laser      NOS    5   
ER Medium Laser      NOS    5   
Anti-Missile System  AFT    1   
Streak SRM 4         NOS    3   

Ammo                           Loc  Shots 
-------------------------------------------
Anti-Missile System Ammo [IS]  AFT     12 
Streak SRM 4 Ammo              NOS     25 
Streak SRM 4 Ammo              NOS     25 


Equipment             Loc 
---------------------------
ECM Suite (Guardian)  AFT 

« Last Edit: 09 October 2018, 17:44:27 by Sharpnel »
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Liam's Ghost

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Re: Design Challenge - Ground Attack Marvel
« Reply #3 on: 09 October 2018, 10:54:53 »
Went with the Slayer. Boosted acceleration to allow the fighter to carry a heavy bomb load and retain some maneuverability. Concentrated on generating heavy firepower in a ground attack, with range being a secondary concern.


Slayer SL-15 GA
Base Tech Level: Standard (IS)
Level          Era
-------------------
Experimental    - 
Advanced        - 
Standard      3075+
Tech Rating: E/X-X-E-D

Weight: 80 tons
BV: 2,115
Cost: 14,877,287 C-bills

Movement: 7/11
Engine: 400 XL
Heat Sinks: 17 [34]
Fuel Points: 800 (10.0 tons)

Structural Integrity: 8
Armor: 287 (Heavy Ferro-Aluminum)
            Armor 
-------------------
Nose          100 
Left Wing      68 
Right Wing     68 
Aft            51 

Weapons          Loc  Heat 
----------------------------
Rotary AC/5      NOS    1   
ER Medium Laser  RWG    5   
ER Medium Laser  RWG    5   
ER Medium Laser  LWG    5   
ER Medium Laser  RWG    5   
ER Medium Laser  LWG    5   
ER Medium Laser  LWG    5   

Ammo              Loc  Shots 
------------------------------
Rotary AC/5 Ammo  NOS     20 
Rotary AC/5 Ammo  NOS     20 
Rotary AC/5 Ammo  NOS     20 
Good news is the lab boys say the symptoms of asbestos poisoning show an immediate latency of 44.6 years. So if you're thirty or over you're laughing. Worst case scenario you miss out on a few rounds of canasta, plus you've forwarded the cause of science by three centuries. I punch those numbers into my calculator, it makes a happy face.

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Hellraiser

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Re: Design Challenge - Ground Attack Marvel
« Reply #4 on: 10 October 2018, 01:03:50 »
Slayer-15D (D-Grade)

Remove AC10 + Ammo
Add 2x ERPPC
Upgrade SHS to DHS
Upgrade ML to ERML
Upgrade Armor to HFFA


A pretty direct upgrade to all parts, doubles long range firepower & increasing all weapon ranges, finally 24% more armor makes it a brick.
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Wereling

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Re: Design Challenge - Ground Attack Marvel
« Reply #5 on: 10 October 2018, 13:48:53 »
I have no idea what I'm doing, but strafing with a 20-point hit to a single location sounds fun

Code: [Select]
Slayer SL-EX-H Base Tech Level: Experimental (IS)
Level
Era
Experimental
-
Advanced
3145+
Standard
-
Tech Rating: E/X-X-X-D 
Weight: 80 tons BV: 2,519
Cost: 15,450,587 C-bills 
Movement: 7/11
Engine: 400 XL Heat Sinks: 11 [22]
Fuel Points: 0/400 (5.0 tons) 
Structural Integrity: 8
Armor: 465 (Ferro-Aluminum)

Armor

Nose
140

Left Wing
116

Right Wing
116

Aft
93

 
Weapons
Loc
Heat

Heavy PPC
NOS
15

ER Medium Laser
LWG
5

ER Medium Laser
RWG
5

ER Medium Laser
LWG
5

ER Medium Laser
RWG
5

ER Medium Laser
AFT
5

ER Medium Laser
AFT
5

 
Equipment
Loc

PPC Capacitor
NOS

ECM Suite (Guardian)
AFT


Atarlost

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Re: Design Challenge - Ground Attack Marvel
« Reply #6 on: 10 October 2018, 17:55:52 »
There's really only one way to do this:  Arrow IVs.  A single ton of ammo for an internal Arrow IV launcher would count as 25 points of bombs so internal is pretty clearly the way to go. 

So you take a CHP-W8 Chippewa and strip everything for Arrow IV launchers and ammo.  And a bit of fuel because we can afford to loiter a bit seeing as we don't need to get within LB-2X range of our targets. 
Code: [Select]
Chippewa CHP-W8A4
Base Tech Level: Advanced (IS)
Level          Era
-------------------
Experimental   3068
Advanced      3068+
Standard        - 
Tech Rating: E/X-X-E-D

Weight: 90 tons
BV: 2,069
Cost: 13,310,710 C-bills
Source: TRO 3039 - Jihad

Movement: 5/8
Engine: 270 XL
Heat Sinks: 15 [30] *9 damaged)*
Fuel Points: 400/560 (7.0 tons)

Structural Integrity: 9
Armor: 168 (Heavy Ferro-Aluminum)
            Armor 
-------------------
Nose           60 
Left Wing      33 
Right Wing     33 
Aft            42 

Weapons   Loc  Heat 
---------------------
Arrow IV  NOS   10   
Arrow IV  NOS   10   
Arrow IV  NOS   10   

Ammo           Loc  Shots 
---------------------------
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 


glitterboy2098

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Re: Design Challenge - Ground Attack Marvel
« Reply #7 on: 10 October 2018, 18:20:09 »
There's really only one way to do this:  Arrow IVs.  A single ton of ammo for an internal Arrow IV launcher would count as 25 points of bombs so internal is pretty clearly the way to go. 

So you take a CHP-W8 Chippewa and strip everything for Arrow IV launchers and ammo.  And a bit of fuel because we can afford to loiter a bit seeing as we don't need to get within LB-2X range of our targets. 
Code: [Select]
Chippewa CHP-W8A4
Base Tech Level: Advanced (IS)
Level          Era
-------------------
Experimental   3068
Advanced      3068+
Standard        - 
Tech Rating: E/X-X-E-D

Weight: 90 tons
BV: 2,069
Cost: 13,310,710 C-bills
Source: TRO 3039 - Jihad

Movement: 5/8
Engine: 270 XL
Heat Sinks: 15 [30] *9 damaged)*
Fuel Points: 400/560 (7.0 tons)

Structural Integrity: 9
Armor: 168 (Heavy Ferro-Aluminum)
            Armor 
-------------------
Nose           60 
Left Wing      33 
Right Wing     33 
Aft            42 

Weapons   Loc  Heat 
---------------------
Arrow IV  NOS   10   
Arrow IV  NOS   10   
Arrow IV  NOS   10   

Ammo           Loc  Shots 
---------------------------
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 
Arrow IV Ammo  NOS      5 

the problem being that to use artillery weapons, the fighter has to LAND. they cannot be used in air. so external and internal bomb slots are your only way to employ Arrow-IV's for ground attack.


Liam's Ghost

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Re: Design Challenge - Ground Attack Marvel
« Reply #8 on: 10 October 2018, 18:35:55 »
the problem being that to use artillery weapons, the fighter has to LAND. they cannot be used in air. so external and internal bomb slots are your only way to employ Arrow-IV's for ground attack.

Arrow IV launchers are an exception if they're mounted on aerofighters, and only aerofighters. I think they take an additional penalty to hit, but you can still use the launcher while in the air.
Good news is the lab boys say the symptoms of asbestos poisoning show an immediate latency of 44.6 years. So if you're thirty or over you're laughing. Worst case scenario you miss out on a few rounds of canasta, plus you've forwarded the cause of science by three centuries. I punch those numbers into my calculator, it makes a happy face.

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Atarlost

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Re: Design Challenge - Ground Attack Marvel
« Reply #9 on: 11 October 2018, 01:53:03 »
Arrow IV launchers are an exception if they're mounted on aerofighters, and only aerofighters. I think they take an additional penalty to hit, but you can still use the launcher while in the air.

The rules in TacOps don't say anything about aerofighters.  They say aerospace units.  They also talk about the atmospheric boundary as something that the firing unit could be on either side of. 

Liam's Ghost

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Re: Design Challenge - Ground Attack Marvel
« Reply #10 on: 11 October 2018, 01:59:51 »
The rules in TacOps don't say anything about aerofighters.  They say aerospace units.  They also talk about the atmospheric boundary as something that the firing unit could be on either side of.

I stand corrected.
Good news is the lab boys say the symptoms of asbestos poisoning show an immediate latency of 44.6 years. So if you're thirty or over you're laughing. Worst case scenario you miss out on a few rounds of canasta, plus you've forwarded the cause of science by three centuries. I punch those numbers into my calculator, it makes a happy face.

(indirect accessory to the) Slayer of Monitors!

Ruger

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Re: Design Challenge - Ground Attack Marvel
« Reply #11 on: 11 October 2018, 20:48:07 »
I have no idea what I'm doing, but strafing with a 20-point hit to a single location sounds fun

Personally, I favor two 20 point hits to single locations (hopefully to the same one):

Code: [Select]
SL-15X Upgrade Slayer
Mass: 80 tons
Engine: 320XL - 11.5 tons
Safe Thrust: 6
Max Thrust: 9
Heat Sinks: 20(40) - 10 tons
Fuel: 10 tons
Cockpit: 3 tons
Armor: 264 (reflective) - 16.5 tons
Front: 92
Wings: 60/60
Aft: 52
Weapons:
2 Heavy PPC's with Capacitors - Nose - 22 tons
2 ER Medium Lasers - RW - 2 tons
2 ER Medium Lasers - LW - 2 tons
1 ER Medium Laser - Aft - 1 ton
Angel ECM Suite - Aft - 2 tons

Can't carry as many bombs, but I think the second heavy PPC and capacitor make up for it...

Ruger
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UnLimiTeD

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Re: Design Challenge - Ground Attack Marvel
« Reply #12 on: 12 October 2018, 04:40:32 »
Wasn't the slayer fluffed somewhere as being a complete turd in atmosphere?
Anyways, it's too early for FL armour, so everyone will more or less pick HFA.

I already did a Slayer in the update Mania Design Challenge, which would probably work for Ground strikes (who is suicidal enough to strafe?) by replacing reflective armour with HFA.
In short:
XL engine for tonnage, ER the lasers, double the heatsinks, replace AC 10 with LTC. In space, it's good against reflective armour, on the ground, it allows you to hit more targets.

I pretty much agree with Aterlosts approach on the Chip:
Range can be useful if you don't have armour, and flying artillery is something we need more off anyways. Though I would have gone with two launchers + token self defense weaponry - and even more fuel.

To contribute at least a little:
Code: [Select]
Shilone SL-17S1 Ground Strike Craft
Base Tech Level: Standard (IS)
Level            Era   
-----------------------
Experimental  3066-3067
Advanced        3068+ 
Tech Rating: E/X-X-E-D

Weight: 65 tons
BV: 2,039
Cost: 10,928,445 C-bills

Movement: 7/11
Engine: 325 XL
Heat Sinks: 14 [28] *6 damaged)*
Fuel Points: 400/560 (7.0 tons)

Structural Integrity: 7
Armor: 228 (Heavy Ferro-Aluminum)
            Armor 
-------------------
Nose           71 
Left Wing      55 
Right Wing     55 
Aft            47 

Weapons              Loc  Heat 
--------------------------------
ER Medium Laser      LWG    5   
ER Medium Laser      RWG    5   
Streak SRM 4         NOS    3
Plasma Rifle         NOS   10   
Streak SRM 4         NOS    3 
Streak SRM 4         AFT    3   
Anti-Missile System  NOS    1   
Anti-Missile System  AFT    1     
Anti-Missile System  LWG    1   
Anti-Missile System  RWG    1   

Ammo                           Loc  Shots 
-------------------------------------------
Streak SRM 4 Ammo              NOS     25 
Plasma Rifle Ammo              NOS     10 
Plasma Rifle Ammo              NOS     10 
Anti-Missile System Ammo [IS]  NOS     12 

Equipment                Loc 
------------------------------
CASE                     NOS 
Targeting Computer [IS]  NOS 
ECM Suite (Guardian)     AFT 
Recon Camera             NOS 
I went for a bit of utility over raw damage here.
Extra speed and fuel allows it to be a bomb truck, with a plasma rifle to inconvenience whatever it hits, and a TC to reliably do so.
As groundstrikes don't require high range, I replaced the Shilones LRM with extra SRM launchers, streaks to be exact; A recon camera provides extra options for allied ground troops.
On the defense, ECM and several AMS systems provide sufficient cover for a strike or two - the Ammo on this one is low, but it's not expected to turn often.
A switch to HFA allowed me to place 11 points on every facing, which proofed the design against medium lasers and missile clusters and just cleared the 8 pt threshold on the nose.

« Last Edit: 12 October 2018, 05:14:52 by UnLimiTeD »
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Ruger

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Re: Design Challenge - Ground Attack Marvel
« Reply #13 on: 12 October 2018, 05:07:51 »
Wasn't the slayer fluffed somewhere as being a complete turd in atmosphere?

Don't recall that, and away from my TRO right now...sure you're not thinking of the Sholagar and the Thrush? Their circular wings are said to cause problems on atmospheric re-entry...

Ruger
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UnLimiTeD

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Re: Design Challenge - Ground Attack Marvel
« Reply #14 on: 12 October 2018, 05:15:45 »
Well, not sure, I seem to remember that was mentioned in some article were quirks were mentioned, with someone expressing puzzlement because it looks aerodynamic.
Not that that couldn't be fixed in a design specifically *cough* built for ground strikes.  ^-^
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Wereling

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Re: Design Challenge - Ground Attack Marvel
« Reply #15 on: 12 October 2018, 09:49:49 »
Personally, I favor two 20 point hits to single locations (hopefully to the same one):

See, now THAT's the way to think! Also I like yours because you can fire one every turn if you stagger the capacitors.

UnLimiTeD

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Re: Design Challenge - Ground Attack Marvel
« Reply #16 on: 12 October 2018, 10:34:36 »
Wouldn't the most average damage to one location be a single strong hit and a lot of scattershot? Very likely that some of that also hits the same spot.
Savannah Masters are the Pringles of Battletech.
Ooo! OOOOOOO! That was a bad one!...and I liked it.

 

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